Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread

[BigV]

3 hours ago, JDownie said:

The second part is true, tbf. But the first part is nonsense. It might be a harder pass to pull off technically but it doesn't mean players don't try it, which is exactly what we see in the current ME. 

I'm not advocating through balls creating great chances every single time this position arises. I just want to see my players attempting the killer pass. Right now they have a heavy, heavy tendency to spray the ball wide, almost never opting to even attempt the through ball. 

Agreed, to back this up mctominay IRL has played through balls through the middle, base that on his attributes to 10 vision (i think) he's rarely going to do it in the game. The cam players usually play alot of through balls, across ground or over/in the air. City, liverpool play these passes contantly even against super defesive teams and it works for them. Wjanldum and KDB constantly try them and what we see in the ME is somewhat rare as the play tends to be wide rather than central. 

wonder if this works any greater with pass into space not selected.

[FrazT]

a- I didnt hide it

b- the Mod request was to move on and your post clearly didnt.

[ceefax the cat]

Re the U19's being buried in the development menu unless you choose to control them

SI have this OCD tidying instinct that doesn't necessarily always make the game easier to play. Sometimes I just want to have a quick look at the reserves? You've made the game tidier I suppose, but also worse

[themadsheep2001]

Just now, FrazT said:

a- I didnt hide it

b- the Mod request was to move on and your post clearly didnt.

This, I removed it because the discussion is actually going nowhere, is adding no constructive feedback, and people had been asked to move since it was devolving into jibes from some. By all means, open up a group PM and continue it in there to your hearts content, but we're moving the thread on since its not actual feedback

[BigV]

3 hours ago, RandomGuy. said:

My luck, man.

Everyone on here saying players never attempt central through balls, very next game I play after reading, opponents do this in a vital game to go 2-1 up...

 

That 1 defender moves out of position for what reason? he's in line in the build up yet jumps out when other options aren't dangerous. Good ball but most importantly a defensive error/ defender not doing his job- could be ME related/ defenders not being "smart" like people have said or an actual fault of the player which is less likely given the scenario. IMO tho,

[FrazT]

Just now, ceefax the cat said:

Re the U19's being buried in the development menu unless you choose to control them

SI have this OCD tidying instinct that doesn't necessarily always make the game easier to play. Sometimes I just want to have a quick look at the reserves? You've made the game tidier I suppose, but also worse

I suspect that most users will not really understand why this was implemented to be honest.  It is only 1 or 2 clicks more but.......

[themadsheep2001]

2 minutes ago, FrazT said:

I suspect that most users will not really understand why this was implemented to be honest.  It is only 1 or 2 clicks more but.......

I think the reasoning was given in the pre release beta thread, something about real estate on lower resolutions. Which would make sense, but then you'd want the option to add if you have higher resolutions. I use that dev centre landing page a lot so its actually really useful for me, but equally an annoying click for others

[ceefax the cat]

It looks like making changes for changes' sake. Like putting the little chevron to pause / rewind matches on the other side of the top right button. Achieves absolutely nothing beyond slightly annoying you the first 20 or 30 times you go to click on it

[Sunstrikuuu]

5 hours ago, GunmaN1905 said:

Sterling being top scorer isn't far fetched, being top scorer with 18 goals is.
And it's been like that across the board in top leagues.

I've we look at the averages, goals per game is fine, goals distribution and how they're scored isn't.
As I said already:
Noone rounds the keeper.
Noone chips it over in 1v1s.
No through balls into the box which result in easy goals (winger passing to the middle for a tap-in) or in 1v1 goals.
No Robben style inside forward goals. I've yet to see one cut inside and then place a shot into the opposite corner.
Wingers in general seem dumbfounded on what they should do whenever they get near the box.

By far the easiest way to score goals is to have a "firing squad" surging in from midfield. Either the fullback passes back to them in front of the box or they score after a defender clears the ball.
I had Bruno Fernandes score 26 in a season and half of my midfield being in or near double digits.

In March, I see a pretty decent spread of goals scored.  Teams have played between 27 and 29 games.  Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang is top goalscorer with 23 goals in 24.  Martial is second with 18 in 26.  Pepe is third on 15 - he's Arsenal's penalty taker.  Salah, Aguero, Rashford, Kane and Firmino are all on 11-12 goals.   So there's two wide players (Salah and Pepe), four strikers (Aubameyang, Kane, Aguero and Firmino) and two players (Rashford, Martial) who can play either wide or up front. No real midfielders. Average rating has one fullback, one wide forward, one striker and two central midfielders in the top five.  Player of the Match has one striker, two wide forwards, a central midfielder and a fullback.  Most assists has an attacking central midfielder, a central midfielder, two fullbacks and four wide forwards or wingers.

In team terms in my save, the top scorers are on pace for 90 goals.  That's a bit below real life in 2018-19 and substantially below 2017-18's top scorers.  In fairness, FM has never really, IMO, gotten to grips with Pep and his teams, so I'm not surprised that teams aren't hitting the heights City did in 2017.  The second-top scorers are slightly below pace (about three and a half goals down) for 18/19 but significantly ahead of 17/18 with 85 compared to 68.  Third-top scorers are much higher than they were in either season, too.

In the Champions Cup, the top scorers are four strikers, two AMC/ST hybrids and two left wingers, one of whom is Ronaldo.  In the Euro Cup, it's an AMC, five strikers and two left wingers.  In Serie A, the top scorers are Ronaldo, six strikers and a right winger.  In Spain, it's five strikers, a left winger, a right winger and an AMC.   In Germany,  all eight of the top scorers are strikers.  France's top eight scorers are seven strikers and a right winger. 

I don't think any of that really supports the midfield firing squad theory.  The only central midfielder who's scoring lots of goals in both your experience and mine is Bruno Fernandes, who has an ideal array of stats and great PPMs, and plays for a good team in a league and continental competition that isn't particularly good.

[Dagenham_Dave]

1 hour ago, ceefax the cat said:

Re the U19's being buried in the development menu unless you choose to control them

SI have this OCD tidying instinct that doesn't necessarily always make the game easier to play. Sometimes I just want to have a quick look at the reserves? You've made the game tidier I suppose, but also worse

Jeez. all you have to do is right click on the dev centre tab. and the options are all there. It's hardly 'buried'. 

[GunmaN1905]

1 hour ago, Sunstrikuuu said:

In the Champions Cup, the top scorers are four strikers

That's one thing I forgot to mention.

For me, stikers had way better goal per game ratio in CL than in Serie A when I played with Inter.
Bloody Alexis had 9 in 6 games while playing AF role.

Imo, strikers are way more likely to score in close matchups where neither teams parks the bus, but when you're facing really defensive teams, their movement and passing tendencies towards them are pretty bad.
While in reality, most teams rely on their top striker to unlock those really defensive teams.

Idk, it's way too hard to code realistic football into a game, these are just my thoughts.

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said:

That's one thing I forgot to mention.

For me, stikers had way better goal per game ratio in CL than in Serie A when I played with Inter.
Bloody Alexis had 9 in 6 games while playing AF role.

Imo, strikers are way more likely to score in close matchups where neither teams parks the bus, but when you're facing really defensive teams, their movement and passing tendencies towards them are pretty bad.
While in reality, most teams rely on their top striker to unlock those really defensive teams.

Idk, it's way too hard to code realistic football into a game, these are just my thoughts.

Would be good to get some PKMS of this. Sounds very much like forwards are not recycling their movement. Which means they aren't an option when breaking down a static deep defence. 

[GunmaN1905]

1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Would be good to get some PKMS of this. Sounds very much like forwards are not recycling their movement. Which means they aren't an option when breaking down a static deep defence. 

I think you nailed it, that was the issue with my 4-1-3-2 (3 CMs) Inter tactics. Most teams playing catenaccio against me and strikers not doing anything useful in any role.
I've got like 10 matches saved, but that's one beta ME, so not relevant anymore.

On my Villa save I've been playing since the full release, wingers are the real issue. Will rewatch some matches tomorrow and try to find ones with best examples where wingers just have terrible decision making.
Since Villa obviously isn't a top team, strikers have plenty of space, but don't receive enough balls from the wingers. Not enough as in the passes aren't even attempted. I've tried multiple roles and instructions.

[Sunstrikuuu]

12 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said:

That's one thing I forgot to mention.

For me, stikers had way better goal per game ratio in CL than in Serie A when I played with Inter.
Bloody Alexis had 9 in 6 games while playing AF role.

Imo, strikers are way more likely to score in close matchups where neither teams parks the bus, but when you're facing really defensive teams, their movement and passing tendencies towards them are pretty bad.
While in reality, most teams rely on their top striker to unlock those really defensive teams.

Idk, it's way too hard to code realistic football into a game, these are just my thoughts.

This could very well be the case.  It's worth thinking about and watching.  I'll keep an eye out.

1 minute ago, GunmaN1905 said:

I think you nailed it, that was the issue with my 4-1-3-2 (3 CMs) Inter tactics. Most teams playing catenaccio against me and strikers not doing anything useful in any role.
I've got like 10 matches saved, but that's one beta ME, so not relevant anymore.

On my Villa save I've been playing since the full release, wingers are the real issue. Will rewatch some matches tomorrow and try to find ones with best examples where wingers just have terrible decision making.
Since Villa obviously isn't a top team, strikers have plenty of space, but don't receive enough balls from the wingers. Not enough as in the passes aren't even attempted. I've tried multiple roles and instructions.

For what it's worth, I've found inverted wingers to be much more useful than regular wingers.  I've gotten almost nothing out of wingers in a few different formations and styles. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by Sunstrikuuu

[CaptainPlanet]

Did the penalty fix apply to FMtouch as well? As I'm still having a silly amount and lots of misses.

[corn_onthecurb]

Can someone who has gone past the January window please post the finances of Real Madrid and Barca? 

They're both over £50m in the red and it seems very odd. I want to know if it's unique to my save

[FrazT]

1 hour ago, CaptainPlanet said:

Did the penalty fix apply to FMtouch as well? As I'm still having a silly amount and lots of misses.

The fix that was announced was to fix the amount of penalties being awarded, not anything to do with the success rate, which runs in line with real life stats

[WilltheWolf92]

Still to many penalties, just had 5 in one game... Before 4 and 3

Edit: just had a Game with 6 penalties lol

Edited November 22, 2019 by WilltheWolf92

[kiwityke1983]

8 hours ago, BigV said:

That 1 defender moves out of position for what reason? he's in line in the build up yet jumps out when other options aren't dangerous. Good ball but most importantly a defensive error/ defender not doing his job- could be ME related/ defenders not being "smart" like people have said or an actual fault of the player which is less likely given the scenario. IMO tho,

If you watch he loses his man due to movement from the striker, who drops off then goes in behind him. The defender follows him when he drops off but is slow to react to the striker going. So yes it's a mistake but a fairly realistic one IMO. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by kiwityke1983

[Bothan Spy]

I nearly weeped tears of joy when I saw that they had brought back 'heading' & 'crossing' for individual training.

[zachalxnder]

Is anyone experiencing an upsurge in injuries?

[Skodkim]

I have a couple of players who have a poor rating as an attacking winger, right side, while they have good rating in the left side.

 

Thing is they're right-fooded and have 20 in positional rating for both sides. Is this a bug? Seems weird to me...

 

\Skodkim

[rooneyviet]

I found this on reddit

 

Edited November 22, 2019 by rooneyviet

[FrazT]

@SeaCarrot  SI are aware of this issue and I am sure that they will welcome you adding  the .pkm of this match to the open thread.  This will have a lot more benefit than just venting in here.

[SeaCarrot]

Thanks for the swift deletion without notice. Point me to this thread that is no doubt a thousand pages long full of pkms of the obvious, i'll add mine to the list.

[Boss]

Can I just ask, were the issues that were flagged up with club vision fixed with a hot fix? I started a game in the Beta build and want to continue now the game has updated to full version but I can't remember if this fix was save game compatible or required a new save?

[Dagenham_Dave]

43 minutes ago, SeaCarrot said:

Thanks for the swift deletion without notice. Point me to this thread that is no doubt a thousand pages long full of pkms of the obvious, i'll add mine to the list.

Still images are absolutely useless to SI. But I suspect you know this already. 

[rooneyviet]

1 minute ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Still images are absolutely useless to SI. But I suspect you know this already. 

he did posted pkm in bug forum

[Dagenham_Dave]

1 minute ago, rooneyviet said:

he did posted pkm in bug forum

As he should if he feels there is a problem. I'm not sure what the point of the screenshots above are, however. 

[rooneyviet]

7 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

As he should if he feels there is a problem. I'm not sure what the point of the screenshots above are, however. 

I'm not seeing a problem, maybe he wants to discuss it?

 

[KlaaZ]

4 hours ago, kiwityke1983 said:

If you watch he loses his man due to movement from the striker, who drops off then goes in behind him. The defender follows him when he drops off but is slow to react to the striker going. So yes it's a mistake but a fairly realistic one IMO. 

Correct, and some people tend to forget that the majority, if not almost all, of the goals that are scored IRL are a result of opposition mistakes. 

[Burnley92]

3D seems to run alot smoother than 2D Classic for me. Not ideal when I prefer 2D  

 

Maybe I need a new laptop 

[SeaCarrot]

59 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

As he should if he feels there is a problem. I'm not sure what the point of the screenshots above are, however. 

Are there rules against posting screenshot examples of obvious bugs? People might like to see they aren't alone. Considering SI have no doubt been aware of this issue for weeks and done nothing about it the more awareness the better. 

[SeaCarrot]

Strange burnley, but if you are only running 2D you could try lowering graphic settings since they don't affect it much. Also last year I had stutter with Gsync enabled (go figure) but not this year. So could be anything!

[FlorianAlbert9]

2 ore fa, Bothan Spy ha scritto:

I nearly weeped tears of joy when I saw that they had brought back 'heading' & 'crossing' for individual training.

And dribbling too. 

But not contrast. Strange.

[kingjericho]

When selecting more than one player in the training screen, if I go the role/duty tab it will only change the focus to one of the selected players and not all the players who I selected. 

[Dagenham_Dave]

9 minutes ago, SeaCarrot said:

Are there rules against posting screenshot examples of obvious bugs? 

It's not obvious from a still screenshot, that's the whole point. 

[frank_olaf]

One thing I do miss about FM19 is when you were attempting to hire a coach or u23/u18 manager/assistant manager for a position that was already filled (for example I already have a u23 manager but I am offering that job to a new person) there was a clear indication that the role is already filled. It was something like "u23 assistant manager 1/1" in red text. 

In FM20 you don't get this warning, all you get is the little box in the bottom left of the screen showing how many staff you are allowed and how many are filled. You then need to hover over the 'unfilled' roles to see which are available.

[Novem9]

Wow wow wow I really didnt wait the goal 

[gechal]

10 hours ago, Sunstrikuuu said:

In March, I see a pretty decent spread of goals scored.  Teams have played between 27 and 29 games.  Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang is top goalscorer with 23 goals in 24.  Martial is second with 18 in 26.  Pepe is third on 15 - he's Arsenal's penalty taker.  Salah, Aguero, Rashford, Kane and Firmino are all on 11-12 goals.   So there's two wide players (Salah and Pepe), four strikers (Aubameyang, Kane, Aguero and Firmino) and two players (Rashford, Martial) who can play either wide or up front. No real midfielders. Average rating has one fullback, one wide forward, one striker and two central midfielders in the top five.  Player of the Match has one striker, two wide forwards, a central midfielder and a fullback.  Most assists has an attacking central midfielder, a central midfielder, two fullbacks and four wide forwards or wingers.

In team terms in my save, the top scorers are on pace for 90 goals.  That's a bit below real life in 2018-19 and substantially below 2017-18's top scorers.  In fairness, FM has never really, IMO, gotten to grips with Pep and his teams, so I'm not surprised that teams aren't hitting the heights City did in 2017.  The second-top scorers are slightly below pace (about three and a half goals down) for 18/19 but significantly ahead of 17/18 with 85 compared to 68.  Third-top scorers are much higher than they were in either season, too.

In the Champions Cup, the top scorers are four strikers, two AMC/ST hybrids and two left wingers, one of whom is Ronaldo.  In the Euro Cup, it's an AMC, five strikers and two left wingers.  In Serie A, the top scorers are Ronaldo, six strikers and a right winger.  In Spain, it's five strikers, a left winger, a right winger and an AMC.   In Germany,  all eight of the top scorers are strikers.  France's top eight scorers are seven strikers and a right winger. 

I don't think any of that really supports the midfield firing squad theory.  The only central midfielder who's scoring lots of goals in both your experience and mine is Bruno Fernandes, who has an ideal array of stats and great PPMs, and plays for a good team in a league and continental competition that isn't particularly good.

Be interesting to see what type of goals the strikers are scoring

[dannysheard]

This is not a rant as I still win the vast majority of games, but I genuinely don't believe there is any difference in the likelihood of a world class forward scoring with their proper foot as there is a half-decent midfielder/forward scoring with their weaker foot. It doesn't matter... it's about a 1 in 4 chance you score, no matter who the player is and whichever foot they use.

Not sure the distance from goal makes any difference either.

I just got Salah injured for a few games, and my thought was "but who am I going to get to miss all those one-on-one shots where he chips at the near-post it with his weaker foot straight into the keeper's hands?" Mane is pretty good at this as well, but Salah is the master.

[dannysheard]

1 minute ago, dannysheard said:

This is not a rant as I still win the vast majority of games, but I genuinely don't believe there is any difference in the likelihood of a world class forward scoring with their proper foot as there is a half-decent midfielder/forward scoring with their weaker foot. It doesn't matter... it's about a 1 in 4 chance you score, no matter who the player is and whichever foot they use.

Not sure the distance from goal makes any difference either.

I just got Salah injured for a few games, and my thought was "but who am I going to get to miss all those one-on-one shots where he chips at the near-post it with his weaker foot straight into the keeper's hands?" Mane is pretty good at this as well, but Salah is the master.

...oh, and it makes no odds if you're free on goal, or have a centre-back hanging out the back of you.

[wicksyFM]

3 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

...oh, and it makes no odds if you're free on goal, or have a centre-back hanging out the back of you.

I dunno, I would rather not have centre-back hanging out the back of me

[Boss]

1 hour ago, Boss said:

Can I just ask, were the issues that were flagged up with club vision fixed with a hot fix? I started a game in the Beta build and want to continue now the game has updated to full version but I can't remember if this fix was save game compatible or required a new save?

Anyone?

[Kingstontom88]

While shooting from ridiculous angles seems commonplace in this edition, I've managed to halt the fullbacks/wing backs from doing so by telling them to shoot less often. Had some nice moves with cutbacks to the forward who is now scoring (woohoo) - even scored one from a centrally played through ball in a tight space, which is rare in my experience.

[Cralle]

Hi,

Im wondering when/if the swedish leagues will be available for FM2020 for iOS?

Br,
Joakim

[HUNT3R]

3 minutes ago, Cralle said:

Hi,

Im wondering when/if the swedish leagues will be available for FM2020 for iOS?

Br,
Joakim

FM20 isn't on iOS. Are you asking about FMM or FMT? You are better off asking in the relevant discussion forum for those. 

[CaptainPlanet]

5 hours ago, FrazT said:

The fix that was announced was to fix the amount of penalties being awarded, not anything to do with the success rate, which runs in line with real life stats

So did it apply to FMTouch? Because I still have a high volume of penalties?

And I disagree with the success rate. I've just had 8 penalties missed in a game.

[FrazT]

2 minutes ago, CaptainPlanet said:

So did it apply to FMTouch? Because I still have a high volume of penalties?

And I disagree with the success rate. I've just had 8 penalties missed in a game.

I would assume that the fix was applied to FM Touch-check the game version as the latest one is 20.1.4

Ref penalties- the fix was applied to referees and their penalty decision making, so had no impact on the players or their abilities to score/miss penalties

[Sean JJ]

As you can see, the penalty kick success rate is too low when compared to real soccer.

Harry Kane, who has a 20 penalty kick attribute, very high rate of composition and goal determination, still misses many penalty kicks, which is really rare in a real life. I want you to seriously consider this.