England - Euro 2016 Thread

[Razzler]

Wilshere over Drinkwater is laughable.

.... but we all knew it was happening

[Djstu23]

Sad but true.

[Baptista_8]

If Drinkwater played for Utd and Rashford Leicester, you know who would have been left out.

[Astafjevs]

Not just the forwards, top heavy in attacking mids too. Unbalanced.

This squad smacks of a manger who still hasn't decided how he wants to play.

I think that's unfair. Looks pretty clear to me that he wants 4-3-1-2. The original 26 screamed 4-3-1-2 - he just needs to know what his options are for switching to 4-3-3. Hence the testing of Vardy, Rashford, Sterling, Barkley etc. in wide areas.

The interesting thing for me is who he starts in an XI (assuming 4-3-1-2), because with the 'wrong' players, he would have to make two subs to switch to 4-3-3. With the 'right' ones, he won't have to make any. That's the crucial part - he has to pick players to make a 4-3-1-2 work, not players who can switch if it doesn't.

[pouncer]

Enjoyed Baptista moaning about Hodgson in at least 3 different posts since the squad was announced, we get it pal.

Squad is fine. Would rather see Townsend in over Barkley but that's a small gripe. Drinkwater is just ok, so can fully understand why he isn't in the squad. England don't have a Kante to make him look good.

Absolutely this. Roy has to pick a team that will work well together, not a squad of individuals just because they are "on form" for their clubs (something which is of exaggerated at int'l level I feel).

I feel sorry for Drinkwater, but assuming they are fit, you don't need half a brain to see that Henderson and Wilshere are far better midfielders and will bring far more to the national team itself.

Otherwise my only concern is a lack of wide options, but we'll see.

[JJ72]

If Drinkwater played for Utd and Rashford Leicester, you know who would have been left out.

Except he doesn't because we got rid of him..

[Hom3r]

Wilshere is a unique player we can't replace with any other player, Drinkwater isn't. Probably would have liked him to get into the squad but I do trust Henderson more than most so meh.

[themadsheep2001]

I think that's unfair. Looks pretty clear to me that he wants 4-3-1-2. The original 26 screamed 4-3-1-2 - he just needs to know what his options are for switching to 4-3-3. Hence the testing of Vardy, Rashford, Sterling, Barkley etc. in wide areas.

The interesting thing for me is who he starts in an XI (assuming 4-3-1-2), because with the 'wrong' players, he would have to make two subs to switch to 4-3-3. With the 'right' ones, he won't have to make any. That's the crucial part - he has to pick players to make a 4-3-1-2 work, not players who can switch if it doesn't.

A setup that relies strongly on the fitness and cohesion of the midfield 3, especially the holder. We've taken one holding mid, for a very porous defence

[Coulthard's Jaw]

I feel sorry for Drinkwater, but assuming they are fit, you don't need half a brain to see that Henderson and Wilshere are far better midfielders and will bring far more to the national team itself.

Everyone with a fully functioning brain isn't advocating Drinkwater in place of Henderson or Wilshere (both of whom have fitness issues).

[Cougar2010]

A setup that relies strongly on the fitness and cohesion of the midfield 3, especially the holder. We've taken one holding mid, for a very porous defence

This, no-one else in the squad can replace Dier in his role which means he can't get injured and he can't cover as the 4th DC.

Total madness tbh.

[Kenco]

Roy obviously sees Wilshere as the backup DM. Or Milner in an emergency.

He's done the right thing in taking 5 strikers (esp with Rooney doubling as a midfielder) though I'd have taken Defoe over Rashford. The guy has been banging them in for Sunderland, he deserved one more chance for England. Rashford should be learning his trade with the U21 squad.

[Gizzy]

Roy obviously sees Wilshere as the backup DM. Or Milner in an emergency.

Roy sees Wilshere as the starting DM

[given1legend]

Wondering if the squad numbers mean anything. Alli and Dier benched?

[Astafjevs]

Wondering if the squad numbers mean anything. Alli and Dier benched?

Of course not. It's just a number. Milner is 4, doesn't mean he's starting. You really think he is going to put those two on the bench?

[given1legend]

Of course not. It's just a number. Milner is 4, doesn't mean he's starting. You really think he is going to put those two on the bench?

He's picked 3 unfit players. No it wouldn't surprise me if he starts with:

Hart

Walker Smalling Cahill Rose

Wilshere Milner

Lallana

Rooney Kane Sterling

[Bliss Seeker]

I think the starting line up is going to be:

We should have a game, predict Englands first XI against Russia.

Hart

Clyne

Cahill

Smalling

Bertrand - 60/40 him over Rose

Dier

Wilshere

Alli

Rooney

Sterling

Kane

[Astafjevs]

Hart; Walker, Cahill, Smalling, Rose; Wilshere, Dier, Alli; Sterling; Rooney, Kane

[darren1983]

As I said earlier I'd have taken Drinkwater myself but can see Roy's thinking, Drinkwater didn't really do take his chances in the game time he got in the friendlies imo, international managers tend to stick with guys that have done it for them previously and do seem to err on the side of tried and tested (for example Spain have Pedro, France with Sissoko, Germany with Podolski etc) and sadly it was up to the players on the fringes to force their way in and Rashford was really the only one that did.

[brett.spurs]

Hart; Clyne, Cahill, Smalling, Rose; Dier, Wilshere, Alli; Sterling; Rooney, Kane

[aggressive minor]

I'd have taken Drinkwater.

[m_fenton]

As I said earlier I'd have taken Drinkwater myself but can see Roy's thinking, Drinkwater didn't really do take his chances in the game time he got in the friendlies imo, international managers tend to stick with guys that have done it for them previously and do seem to err on the side of tried and tested (for example Spain have Pedro, France with Sissoko, Germany with Podolski etc) and sadly it was up to the players on the fringes to force their way in and Rashford was really the only one that did.

Rashford has played 63 minutes of international football. If by "forced his way in" you mean "plays for Man Utd" then I'd agree with you.

[Bliss Seeker]

Rashford has played 63 minutes of international football. If by "forced his way in" you mean "plays for Man Utd" then I'd agree with you.

He did score a goal on his debut tbf

[Kenco]

Wondering if the squad numbers mean anything. Alli and Dier benched?

I don't think so. Alli wears 20 for Spurs doesn't he? Hendo and Sturridge also got their club numbers. Barkley 19 as he is meant to be the new Gazza.

[darren1983]

Rashford has played 63 minutes of international football. If by "forced his way in" you mean "plays for Man Utd" then I'd agree with you.

Not what I meant (which I'm sure you knew) but for me, Rashford did enough in his minutes to get himself in the final squad, Drinkwater didn't do enough in the time he had.

However again - I would have picked Drinkwater but can see the thinking in him not going is all. I was trying to offer a balance to all the "Drinkwater over Wilshire/Rashford/whoever" and "Roy's an idiot" posts.

[HUFC]

For those not bothered about Drinkwater being left out:

"James Sharpe ‏@TheSharpeEnd 43m43 minutes ago

England's weakness: defence.

Drinkwater: more tackles than any other English player, more ball recoveries than Kante.

Oh, and he's fit.

Nah."

[sc91]

Wilshere going. Fantastic, get to watch him aimlessly run and lose the ball for another 45 minutes.

Yet again, play for the big club, get the call.

[AJJ]

Disappointed for Drinkwater. He did well in his debut for England, got MOTM if I remember correctly. I think he should have gone as he does the simple things well and that's what you need sometimes. We have too many flair players IMO. Not enough tackling types. Barkley is very hit and miss for me. He has been dog awful for the majority of the second half of the season and he tends to do too much showboating for me. It's ok being labeled the next Gazza but Gazza pulled majority of his stuff off.

[sc91]

It's the same old crap from an England manager sadly. Barely played all season or had an absolute mare in the second half of it, play for a 'big club' however? Count yourself in my son.

[TM]

Roy obviously wanting to be Gordon Strachan

Wilshere shouldn't be anywhere near the England side but as Strachan does with the Scotland team, reptuation goes before form

[m_fenton]

Not what I meant (which I'm sure you knew) but for me, Rashford did enough in his minutes to get himself in the final squad, Drinkwater didn't do enough in the time he had.

However again - I would have picked Drinkwater but can see the thinking in him not going is all. I was trying to offer a balance to all the "Drinkwater over Wilshire/Rashford/whoever" and "Roy's an idiot" posts.

And I'm just suggesting that a player from a "lesser" side who had done the same as Rashford wouldn't be in the squad. It's the club he plays for and the reputation that comes with it that has got him a place in the squad. Hopefully he can do a job as a deep lying midfielder when Wilshere breaks down and Dier is needed in defence.

[Kenco]

How many players get injured on Thursday / before the tournament starts? My bet is 2.

[AJJ]

I am very surprised he picked Sturridge. Good player and all but he has the determination of a depressed lemming when it comes to playing through pain. I'd have picked Defoe

[YOUNGSTEVE]

Nothing ever changes. I have been watching football since the 70's & virtually every time England qualifies for finals of either the EUROS or World Cup, there is a debate about unfit stars being taken to the finals, who usually are picked, then do nothing when they get there. Better to pick players on form whatever clubs they may play for, not just Man Utd, City, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, & certainly not injury prone ones unless playing well. Funny that Drinkwater & Townsend play for none of those clubs, whilst sick notes Henderson, Sturridge & Wiltshire do.

[pouncer]

Everyone with a fully functioning brain isn't advocating Drinkwater in place of Henderson or Wilshere (both of whom have fitness issues).

We have to assume that the sole reason both are going over Drinkwater is because they are both now totally fit. If that's the case, which is the impression we're being given, then it's the correct decision.

If one or both now subsequently get injured, then it's different and the knives would justifiably be out for Hodgson.

[AJJ]

Wilshere has not been fully fit for ages has he? Last I heard he needs a medical to have a medical.

Also hasn't Henderson declared in the past month or so his Achilles is still not 100%?

[Kenco]

Wilshere has not been fully fit for ages has he? Last I heard he needs a medical to have a medical.

Also hasn't Henderson declared in the past month or so his Achilles is still not 100%?

I'd still take 95% Hendo over 100% Drinkwater.

[Tony85]

It's Ok - we have Europe's fifth best player in the squad!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36420669

I'm actually among the minority who think taking Wilshere is worth the risk. Drinkwater hasn't done enough in his appearances to warrent overtaking him but if I was to leave a midfielder out then it would have been Henderson. I'd also take Townsend. If we are losing a game then he's worth bringing on with 10 minutes to go as we at least know he isn't going to hide from taking shots.

As for the strikers - I don't think Rashford did enough to warrent a place in the squad. Yes he got a goal against Australia but his dribbling was pretty poor IMO. Most of the time he tried to take someone on he got tackled. It's ok having good movement but if he ends up out wide which might be likely then his dribbling skills will be more of a hinderence.

[aiston]

Feel sorry for Townsend, he didn't even get a chance in the friendlies, there was no point calling him up.

[craigcwwe]

Should have taken Drinkwater over Barkley. The squad is too top heavy imo and Drinkwater would have been ideal as a DM but I guess Roy see's that as Wilshere's role in the team now. With maybe Milner second choice?

[pearcey_90]

After thinking about the squad, I've come to the conclusion of why is Milner in over Drinkwater?

Milner is usually in the squad because he can play in a number of positions which is great, but do we need him for full back? Nope as we have two in each area. If we are to go 4-3-3 at times, do we want him or need him out wide? Nope, as Sterling/Lallana would be preferred there, and that's before a Rooney/Sturridge/Rashford will be put there over him. So comes down to him playing CM and for me he is **** there. When ever he played there for Man City he looked very poor against any half decent CM, and whenever I've seen him there for Liverpool he hasn't looked great either again. So for me who's better in a CM/DM role, Drinkwater or Milner, I'd say based on form it'd be Drinkwater.

[stotty1982]

Well according to the uefa barometer, Milner is the 5th best european player at the moment ?

[AJJ]

Just occurred to me. We have no set piece specialists anymore do we? On occasion Rooney pops up with a few worldies from 20-30 yards but there's no one who can proper whip a ball in

[Bliss Seeker]

Just occurred to me. We have no set piece specialists anymore do we? On occasion Rooney pops up with a few worldies from 20-30 yards but there's no one who can proper whip a ball in

haven't had a decent one in a while tbh. Not since *sob* Becks probably.

Oh how I miss that man.

[Rob1981]

People used to talk Gerrard up for his free kicks after Beckham had gone but I honestly can't remember him scoring one. At least not in a meaningful game.

[IMT]

Personally I'd have had Drinkwater over Wilshere. Drinkwater deserves it after the season he's had and has played well in the games he's had for England. Considering how shakey our defence is I'm not against him starting alongside Dier protecting the back 4 in potential tough knockout games.

This, exactly how I feel.

[afced7]

After thinking about the squad, I've come to the conclusion of why is Milner in over Drinkwater?

Be a bit harsh to drop him now, 'Cheers for helping us qualify, bugger off'. As much as I dislike Milner in the England team, I think it's a little late to start making changes like that. Hopefully Woy's replacement will just leave him out altogether when the WC qualifying starts, even though it will be much harder once he's a European Championship winner.

[ajw10]

In Leicester's side, Drinkwater plays alongside Kante. Kante is the legs, he's the one who brings the ball out from the back. Dier and Dembele have a similar partnership.

Putting Dier AND Drinkwater limits us massively. It's not about picking the best players, or the ones in form, it's about picking the right players. Wilshere is the closest thing we have to a player like Kante or Dembele in that he's very good at carrying the ball. That's why he's going.

[pearcey_90]

But the argument is if Dier get's injured suspended, then we won't have a Drinkwater to replace Dier, instead Milner/Wilshere will take that position. Not about Drinkwater playing in of the other 2 CM positions but being a back up for one of our most vulnerable positions.

[themadsheep2001]

But the argument is if Dier get's injured suspended, then we won't have a Drinkwater to replace Dier, instead Milner/Wilshere will take that position. Not about Drinkwater playing in of the other 2 CM positions but being a back up for one of our most vulnerable positions.

Exactly. We have no one to cover a vital position in Diers place. And this whole Wilshere can bring the ball out is entirely irrelevant if he isn't match fit or in form. And he's definitely not the latter. Not sure how an unready player is the right player. Especially when the argument is coming from people who (rightly) decried England taking a half fit Rooney

[sc91]

Exactly. We have no one to cover a vital position in Diers place. And this whole Wilshere can bring the ball out is entirely irrelevant if he isn't match fit or in form. And he's definitely not the latter. Not sure how an unready player is the right player. Especially when the argument is coming from people who (rightly) decried England taking a half fit Rooney

The problem with Wilshere is that although he does bring the ball out, he then carries on running with it, gets knocked off the ball with ease and then leaves a huge gap in the midfield.