Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread

[baris28]

In my game Rumanian striker Andone scoring 7.8 ratings in training for a couple of weeks -fully match fit- missing 1 vs 1 doesn't seem right to me. Overall goals scored from long shots, set pieces etc still seems to be problem from what I see.

Edited November 27, 2019 by baris28

[RobertPage]

Its time for FM to open up to modding. Let players use old match engines. Let the modding community create their own. For me personally there have been 2 match engines in this decade where i've felt like i can enjoy the game whilst setting up the teams to play however i want them to play. I said it last year and i feel the same way again this year. Excluding the match engine, the game is fantastic, but everything you do comes down to those few minutes where the match engine is left to do its job. Its failing horribly again. Give me Fm12 Match Engine. I'll take the inbalances back then for the general quality anyday

[CaptainPlanet]

25 minutes ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

11 of those goals are from open play.

Scored by the striker? Not an IF or a CM

[HUNT3R]

22 minutes ago, Sanel said:

You are right about a lot of things, don't get me wrong, but you forget that the line 'we've added new animations' is annual PR talk from the company you are working for, can be found in this article: https://www.footballmanager.com/feature/fm20-match-engine-improvements or this one https://www.footballmanager.com/news/football-manager-2019-match-engine-improvements. I quote:

FM20:

FM19:

Friendly reminder that we are all customers and by this PR talk you are trying to sell me the game. Whether its true or not (we've added new animations) I don't see it. A new player won't notice it obviously but an experienced player will. This is the reason why I emphasize how much hours I've spent into the game. I feel being fooled. 

Are you saying you're not experienced? Quite a few of the new animations are immediately noticeable. Goalkeepers mainly, but also bringing the ball down.

[Sanel]

15 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

Are you saying you're not experienced? Quite a few of the new animations are immediately noticeable. Goalkeepers mainly, but also bringing the ball down.

'a few'

Quote

It's not, strictly, speaking part of the match engine, but we have added and replaced more than 500 animations this year, changed the speed in which animations are played and improved the blending – all of which combine to make the on field action noticeably smoother.

?

[HUNT3R]

6 minutes ago, Sanel said:

'a few'

?

Notice I said immediately noticeable.

[karabas15]

1 hour ago, RobertPage said:

Its time for FM to open up to modding. Let players use old match engines. Let the modding community create their own. For me personally there have been 2 match engines in this decade where i've felt like i can enjoy the game whilst setting up the teams to play however i want them to play. I said it last year and i feel the same way again this year. Excluding the match engine, the game is fantastic, but everything you do comes down to those few minutes where the match engine is left to do its job. Its failing horribly again. Give me Fm12 Match Engine. I'll take the inbalances back then for the general quality anyday

This! I'm sure folks in the community will have the match engine up to par in a matter of a few weeks instead of us having to whine and complain to devs about it for months. 

[enricoix]

Personally I find this ME much better than the vanilla 2019 version. Here are my two small observations :

- When any of my player (mainly striker) or opposition is one-on-one with the goalie, I keep it cool cause I know that the scoring possibility is nigh on impossible...

- Too many absurd angle shots (instead of passing/crossing)

also erm...not sure what your opinion is but the game seems (again) way less challenging (didn't want to use the *cough* easy terminology)

 

 

[KlaaZ]

1 hour ago, RobertPage said:

Its time for FM to open up to modding. Let players use old match engines. Let the modding community create their own. For me personally there have been 2 match engines in this decade where i've felt like i can enjoy the game whilst setting up the teams to play however i want them to play. I said it last year and i feel the same way again this year. Excluding the match engine, the game is fantastic, but everything you do comes down to those few minutes where the match engine is left to do its job. Its failing horribly again. Give me Fm12 Match Engine. I'll take the inbalances back then for the general quality anyday

Why would they throw their ME, which no other gaming company comes even close to, wide open? That would probably be the worst business decision one could make.

[Dagenham_Dave]

1 hour ago, RobertPage said:

 Let the modding community create their own.

This is the single most absurd thing I have read on the internet today. And I still have a Twitter account, so that really is some going.

[penza]

10 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

This is the single most absurd thing I have read on the internet today. And I still have a Twitter account, so that really is some going.

I have said this so many times, thus the reason why I stopped playing since fm18, but not like the chap said, in terms of modding but allow the players to play whichever database they want, literally the only option now is to wait someone to upload the cracked version to play 'whichever ME version' we want which is insane... (including BETA)

[Svenc]

I'd be really interested though -- and scared at the same time -- in what modders of this would come up with if the engine were actually moddeable. I have the suspicious though that most of it would have much less to do with Football than SI's take. I'd love to see the WestHamGaz (shout to @Trent71 )take on it all. Every time a Team has more shots on a spreadsheet come the end of a match -- of whichever Kind -- it will win the match. Defensive and counter attacking Football will basically be erased from memory, as would every result against an actual run of play.  

However, some tweaks could actually be made to the Fifa 3d Action fueling Fifa Manager in the past. Presumable a couple guys got to improve the game that way (or at least make it more "entertaining/thrilling" to watch, but from my experience that was not much of a surprise. Given the ME's reported complexity though, I doubt it would just be moddeable just like that. That complexity seems a burden as to SI's own staff also though. Not only does it reportedly take weeks for a new member to get into it all. IIRC MIles had compared it to a plate of Spaghetti in the past; put your fork to use and pull on a few Spaghetti here and you may end up having the entire plate handed to you. '

Picking up from that, a more worthwile Approach was streamlining both the tactical Input possible as well as making the ME following suit. The ME as well as the tactical experience may progress at a more stable pace and rate. Reason being, it must be much easier to balance for a large, but finite amount of Options as opposed to be "infinite" ones. In particular that everybody still gets to invent their own spin on a "Possession" tactic say, which makes say, balancing Possession Systems against counter Systems etc. harder than it probably could be. It also makes it harder to Code AI that makes the Right picks, in particular the Kind of dynamic AI FM has, as it changes Things based upon Opposition, scoreline, time left on the Clock, etc.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Svenc

[Dagenham_Dave]

3 minutes ago, penza said:

but allow the players to play whichever database they want, 

It's got nothing to do with 'databases'.  But really, what would the benefit to SI be to allow players to use older match engines, when, you know, you can just go back and play the older game. Imagine the amount of work involved in that for absolutely no gain but to satisfy lazy, entitled gamers who can't be bothered to learn the newest game. 

I think I'll write to EA tomorrow and ask that for FIFA next year, they can give me the chance to play the FIFA10 match engine because I could win on that one. How do you reckon I'll get on with that? 

[penza]

Just now, Dagenham_Dave said:

It's got nothing to do with 'databases'.  But really, what would the benefit to SI be to allow players to use older match engines, when, you know, you can just go back and play the older game. Imagine the amount of work involved in that for absolutely no gain but to satisfy lazy, entitled gamers who can't be bothered to learn the newest game. 

I think I'll write to EA tomorrow and ask that for FIFA next year, they can give me the chance to play the FIFA10 match engine because I could win on that one. How do you reckon I'll get on with that? 

lazy and entitled? good to know that you feel that way, love how you feel the need to put someone down right away! I just came back to post this, now I remember why I stopped coming here. thanks!

[Dagenham_Dave]

1 minute ago, penza said:

lazy and entitled? 

It's the curse of the 21st century gaming fraternity, I'm afraid. 

It's the internet that largely to blame, but that's for a whole different conversation.

No offence was meant to yourself. 

[rdbayly]

39 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

This is the single most absurd thing I have read on the internet today. And I still have a Twitter account, so that really is some going.

I knew you'd love that one.

[Guest]

Like others I find the animations this year to be very disappointing.

What I do not understand is the extent to which the animations reflect what is going on ‘under the hood’ (the ‘match-engine’ I guess).

Does the match-engine somehow decide, for example, an 'attack + miss' and then a random animation is chosen to represent this event? In which case while the winger running to the bye-line and then shooting into the post rather than crossing to the waiting forwards is frustrating, I guess it still represents the result of that segment of play – attack and miss. Or do the animations reflect what is happening in the match-engine ‘second-by-second’ so to speak. So the winger ‘actually’ runs down the pitch to shoot when level with the post?

 

While waiting for improvements I have for the first time been playing pes ‘master league’ mode. While the football management aspects are an insignificant shadow of FM, the graphics make the FM match-day experience laughable in comparison. I actually like watching the pes games, which feel far more ‘real’ and exciting. If only pes would graft FM into ‘master league’ mode, or vice versa of course.  Been playing FM for so long (since it was text only) I had not appreciated how dated it actually is.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Guest

[CFuller]

Suggesting that SI should make their match engine moddable is a bit like asking Coca-Cola to reveal their special formula so anyone else can make their own versions. It's never going to happen.

Anyway, I'm almost at the end of the six-month demo (managing Birmingham in the Championship) and have already seen a healthy variety of goals including (but not limited to):

• Finishes from long balls over the top
• Low shots past the keeper from wide
• Close-range finishes from passes inside the box
• Solo efforts where a player dribbles from their own half to score
• One-on-ones
• Long-range shots
• Free-kicks
• Penalties (I've seen far more SCORED than missed)
• Headers from set-pieces
• Headers from crosses
• Follow-up finishes from blocks/goalkeeper saves
• Defensive clangers ()

And that's just off the top of my head. I'm certainly not seeing the same few goals time after time.

I have seen quite a few of those long-rangers, but they're nowhere near as frequent as some here try to make out. It's also worth pointing out that long-range goals aren't just reserved for the elite. They are scored every week at every level of football - even in the semi-pro leagues, and even by players who have low Long Shots attributes on FM.

I do have a gripe with long-shot goals, but it's not with their frequency. Some of those I've seen flew into the net ridiculously quickly, not even allowing the goalkeeper a split-second to react. In other words, I'm finding some long shots to be overpowered - in the literal sense.  (I'll obviously post examples of these on the bugs forum if I notice more of them when I next play tomorrow.)

Edited November 27, 2019 by CFuller

[Nicke9000]

Good lord. Hoping for an update soon on the match engine. Just seen  5-6 penalties and 4-5 red cards in 3 matches.

[baris28]

16 dakika önce, Svenc said:

However, some tweaks could actually be made to the Fifa 3d Action fueling Fifa Manager in the past. Presumable a couple guys got to improve the game that way (or at least make it more "entertaining/thrilling" to watch, but from my experience that was not much of a surprise. Given the ME's reported complexity though, I doubt it would just be moddeable just like that. That complexity seems a burden as to SI's own staff also though. 

As a primary wargaming fan German and his allies have 518 weapon files in Gary Grigsby's War İn the East war game for battle results. It has been in tuned and patched from 2010. Surely football is more complicated but.. hope to see more improvements. 

[Jean0987654321]

What in the blue hell is going on with the patch? Fullbacks acting like Robben and my strikers (Greenwood, Leao, James, Rashford and Martial) are wasting chances left and right. Only Scott McTominay has some finishing skills here in this patch

[djchapsticks]

Pretty shoddy that this has been an ongoing issue for a week and a half now with no official confirmation that they are even looking at the glaring issues.

According to some on here, people are 'whinging' about it but the fact of the matter is that every one of us have dropped nearly 40 quid on a game that whilst technically functional, is fundamentally broken in it's execution. No-one expects an overnight fix but it's not too much surely for the issues to be acknowledged and that the Devs are working on this?

I've owned every iteration SI have released since CM2 and the ME issues are the worst since the massive mess CM4 was at launch but at least that had the fact it was a massive leap from CM0102 in that it was going from a text to a 2D engine and folk accepted this. 

Edited November 27, 2019 by djchapsticks

[themadsheep2001]

5 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Pretty shoddy that this has been an ongoing issue for a week and a half now with no official confirmation that they are even looking at the glaring issues.

According to some on here, people are 'whinging' about it but the fact of the matter is that every one of us have dropped nearly 40 quid on a game that whilst technically functional, is fundamentally broken in it's execution. No-one expects an overnight fix but it's not too much surely for the issues to be acknowledged and that the Devs are working on this?

I've owned every iteration SI have released since CM2 and the ME issues are the worst since the massive mess CM4 was at launch but at least that had the fact it was a massive leap from CM0102 in that it was going from a text to a 2D engine and folk accepted this. 

It's been said several times they are working on various changes. There's not much point in them saying this if people are not going to actually read the threads though

[djchapsticks]

1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said:

It's been said several times they are working on various changes. There's not much point in them saying this if people are not going to actually read the threads though

What specific changes are they confirming they are working on as I've not seen anything mentioned specifically in terms of striker/winger issues, 1 on 1s and the ongoing penalties awarded problems? As far as I've read, they believe the last hotfix resolved the penalty issue when it clearly didn't, given I'm still seeing 3-4 penalties regularly in some games and as many as 6 in a match.

[themadsheep2001]

2 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

What specific changes are they confirming they are working on as I've not seen anything mentioned specifically in terms of striker/winger issues, 1 on 1s and the ongoing penalties awarded problems? As far as I've read, they believe the last hotfix resolved the penalty issue when it clearly didn't, given I'm still seeing 3-4 penalties regularly in some games and as many as 6 in a match.

They never mention all specific changes, since some changes will occur as a result of looking at known issues, Changes involve, but are not limited to, central play and wide player issues.

If you're still seeing the bold raise it as a bug, as not everyone was experiencing it before and seemingly even less are now

[djchapsticks]

4 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

They never mention all specific changes, since some changes will occur as a result of looking at known issues, Changes involve, but are not limited to, central play and wide player issues.

If you're still seeing the bold raise it as a bug, as not everyone was experiencing it before and seemingly even less are now

I have done. Several have done on the bugs thread. It continues to be pretty widespread and is seemingly very dependant on whether the league you are running has VAR (which the Scottish league does not).

[acmilano112000]

Everybody should look at any game analysis they can of any teams with a single striker formation (possibly any # strikers as well)... select it to display PASSES RECEIVED for the striker during the match.

This will prove to you that the ME is [insert your own word]. I'm gonna simply say bad.

You can debate later if -to you- it is "unplayable".

I gave it a last solid go by watching 2 consecutive games in full highlight and researched striker touches in a variety of AI teams, tactics, situations as well. Also tried going strikerless using AMC instead. Same deal. You just cannot get anyone to pass into where the striker should be. All roles, all tactics (tried so many) and its true with the AI as well in every team I look at.

To me, it is completely unplayable that the strikers are just decoys except for receiving throw ins.

I'm going back to FM19 which I never got into, so maybe then back to glorious FM17. Sad day.

Quick example: Here's Cavani during two entire matches for PSG in a 4-3-2-1 and AI vs AI. He played all 90 min in each. Look how many passes his teammates completed. 5 found him in one game, 2 aside from throw ins in the other game. LOL.

Try looking for yourselves at random games of yours...

Edited November 27, 2019 by acmilano112000

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

I have done. Several have done on the bugs thread. It continues to be pretty widespread and is seemingly very dependant on whether the league you are running has VAR (which the Scottish league does not).

I've just looked, in fairness you've had a response from CJ two days ago that they are still looking into the Scottish league issues post hotfix

[Mikke]

49 minutes ago, acmilano112000 said:

Everybody should look at any game analysis they can of any teams with a single striker formation (possibly any # strikers as well)... select it to display PASSES RECEIVED for the striker during the match.

This will prove to you that the ME is [insert your own word]. I'm gonna simply say bad.

You can debate later if -to you- it is "unplayable".

 

Okay, I have now looked at the analysis of every match I've played so far in my current game, which is just 4 friendlies (3 of those against higher level teams). I have two strikers, and here are the amounts of passes they've received - excluding throw-ins:

Striker #1: 18, 20, 23 and 22 passes
Striker #2: 18, 14, 20 and 14 passes

I don't have any problem with those numbers. So what is this supposed to prove to me, in your opinion?

Edited November 27, 2019 by Mikke

[isignedupfornorealreason]

3 hours ago, RobertPage said:

Its time for FM to open up to modding. Let players use old match engines. Let the modding community create their own. For me personally there have been 2 match engines in this decade where i've felt like i can enjoy the game whilst setting up the teams to play however i want them to play. I said it last year and i feel the same way again this year. Excluding the match engine, the game is fantastic, but everything you do comes down to those few minutes where the match engine is left to do its job. Its failing horribly again. Give me Fm12 Match Engine. I'll take the inbalances back then for the general quality anyday

I know people are mocking the modding suggestion, but I think it would be a surprisingly effective thing to do. Modders out there have revitalised games, and some of the dedicated ones rebalance entire games or fixed extremely buggy ones quicker and better than the development teams at times. They shouldn't be written off at all IMO. 

 

3 hours ago, CaptainPlanet said:

Scored by the striker? Not an IF or a CM

1 was scored by the central striker.

But to be fair I do count the IF as a striker, I mean, he is the inside forward and he is the main goalscorer in a 4-3-3. My central striker is a DLF/S. For what it is worth, the central striker was the top scorer at the end of last season, but not for obvious reasons. :P

[acmilano112000]

5 minutes ago, Mikke said:

Okay, I have now looked at the analysis of every match I've played so far in my current game, which is just 4 friendlies (3 of those against higher level teams). I have two strikers, and here are the amounts of passes they've received - excluding throw-ins:

Striker #1: 18, 20, 23, and 22 passes
Striker #2: 18, 14, 20 and 14 passes

I don't have any problem with those numbers.

Fair enough @Mikke. I did say that this seems to be mostly a glaring problem for single striker setups.

Did you also see where these passes were being received? It also bothered me that pretty much 95% of them were nowhere near the penalty box. Nowhere near. Have a look at some of the teams in your save who play 1 striker.

Maybe in your 2 striker tactic you don't suffer from this. But I find it very gamebreaking because today IRL most of the top teams play tactical concepts based around 1 striker. Trying to replicate any of them fails entirely because of this problem. Barca, Real, Liverpool, City, Bayern,.. etc.

Edited November 28, 2019 by acmilano112000

[CaptainPlanet]

5 minutes ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

1 was scored by the central striker.

But to be fair I do count the IF as a striker, I mean, he is the inside forward and he is the main goalscorer in a 4-3-3. My central striker is a DLF/S. For what it is worth, the central striker was the top scorer at the end of last season, but not for obvious reasons. :P

DLF/S or not, you'd expect a central striker to score more than 1 goal in open play. I'm sure he has chances, CCCs, 1on1s etc.  

That's my main gripe with the ME as it is at the moment, I can win games, I can keep clean sheets, I can score pretty well, but most goals comes from set pieces (or their ensuing scrambles), from long range midfielder shots, or from scoring rebounds. Getting strikers to score in open play is what is noticeable as a problem compared to watching real life football and from previous game engines.

[taz08manutd]

ME is a joke

- My CM's scored 4 long shots outside box, my striker missed 3 one on ones - all in one game

- Wide players will always shoot into the side netting, ALWAYS

- opposition boots the ball over the top and my defenders just watch as opposition striker gets through and scores - I dont play with a high line.

- 30 shots on goal, game finishes 1-0 or i lose so often.

Uninstalled this trash, hopefully they fix it in a few months. Either way not gettig my money again.

[kertiek]

that moment when ur team decides to play the best game of the season.
 

 

[SebastianRO]

Let's just call it what it is We all have numbers to display and "support" the theory that this ME is bad. This statement couldn't possibly more obvious. What doesn't sit well with me is that we need to "prove" this with so many numbers, and even when people do that, there is somebody that tries to "make sense" and "interpret" those numbers in order to defend the ME. All this nonsense, when in fact, all you have to do is fire up the game, go into a match - extended or full highlights and JUST WATCH. No need to even look at numbers, passes, etc. You should be able to tell that something is off with the ME in all phases of play.

 

1. Defenders. You often see 2 of them glued together chasing the opponent with the ball. In all honesty, I actually think that defenders are the least bugged, they actually react pretty well, considering.

2. Midfielders - I simply don't think there is enough / if any distinction between roles. My B2B behaves no different than the AMC with the role of an AP-A. The fault in this scenario rests entirely on the AP-A who simply isn't dribbling anyone because ... THERE IS NO CENTRAL PLAY IN FM20, as it never was one in FM19, even though most people refused to believe. I am not going to name people, but I had numerous debates with forum members over FM19 and they said that there was nothing wrong with FM19 and its central play, strikers being completly useless, etc. Now, the same people are identifying the same problems in FM20

3. Strikers do not receive enough quality balls even though they move better off the ball compared to FM19. Simply, their teamates ignore them and rather prefer a useless garbage pass wide.

There is not enough numbers in the world that can support enough these things. You can see them with the naked eye without having to pull numbers up.

The funny thing is that under all the mess that FM20's ME is, I still think it has huge potential. Potential that I have never seen in FM19 for that matter. I hope they can get their stuff together and save this edition from going down as the most dissapointing one to date.

[roykela]

32 minutes ago, SebastianRO said:

Let's just call it what it is We all have numbers to display and "support" the theory that this ME is bad. This statement couldn't possibly more obvious. What doesn't sit well with me is that we need to "prove" this with so many numbers, and even when people do that, there is somebody that tries to "make sense" and "interpret" those numbers in order to defend the ME. All this nonsense, when in fact, all you have to do is fire up the game, go into a match - extended or full highlights and JUST WATCH. No need to even look at numbers, passes, etc. You should be able to tell that something is off with the ME in all phases of play.

 

1. Defenders. You often see 2 of them glued together chasing the opponent with the ball. In all honesty, I actually think that defenders are the least bugged, they actually react pretty well, considering.

2. Midfielders - I simply don't think there is enough / if any distinction between roles. My B2B behaves no different than the AMC with the role of an AP-A. The fault in this scenario rests entirely on the AP-A who simply isn't dribbling anyone because ... THERE IS NO CENTRAL PLAY IN FM20, as it never was one in FM19, even though most people refused to believe. I am not going to name people, but I had numerous debates with forum members over FM19 and they said that there was nothing wrong with FM19 and its central play, strikers being completly useless, etc. Now, the same people are identifying the same problems in FM20

3. Strikers do not receive enough quality balls even though they move better off the ball compared to FM19. Simply, their teamates ignore them and rather prefer a useless garbage pass wide.

There is not enough numbers in the world that can support enough these things. You can see them with the naked eye without having to pull numbers up.

The funny thing is that under all the mess that FM20's ME is, I still think it has huge potential. Potential that I have never seen in FM19 for that matter. I hope they can get their stuff together and save this edition from going down as the most dissapointing one to date.

Why don't i see it in my matches? My numbers shows an intended style and the players playing that style, and still adding quite a bit of variety in their play. Having played 2 seasons now i have not seen anything out of the ordinary. I play on comprehensive highlights. I always do and i watch my matches.

1. Only time that has happened in my game is when i've told them to really go for it, closing down hard. Otherwise no, i don't have that problem.
2. I have quite a bit of central play. But my focus with my tactics are down the flanks. Had no issues with that on FM19 either. Played the same tactic there. Can't speak for other roles. I have a CMs and a DLPd central, with AFa and DLFs. They all help eachother out.
3. My AFa scored 34 goals in 55 appearances last season. He received plenty of quality balls. From my wingers, my central mids, my DLFs and a few from my defenders. How? A variety of ways.

I don't see them with the naked eye. My numbers indicate a variety of plays.

Edited November 28, 2019 by roykela

[RocheBag]

Does anyone know if the issue with wingbacks in a back 3 not closing down is fixed?

[CaptainPlanet]

55 minutes ago, roykela said:

Why don't i see it in my matches?

Maybe quality of the league?

I just duplicated and used your tactic as Liverpool and scored a total of 3 goals in 5 matches of which 2 were penalties and 1 was a long range midfielder shot. Strikers barely managed a shot on target between them.

[roykela]

15 minutes ago, CaptainPlanet said:

Maybe quality of the league?

I just duplicated and used your tactic as Liverpool and scored a total of 3 goals in 5 matches of which 2 were penalties and 1 was a long range midfielder shot. Strikers barely managed a shot on target between them.

That is not impossible.
Don't forget that the players have to get used to the tactic and style as well.
Took mine about 3-4 months before they started getting comfortable with it.

My players though (have improved during the summer break now though) are not the best ones in the league. They are pretty rubbish.
Yet they managed to keep a Premier team away from scoring by having them take crap shots all the time. Did not allow them space.
While we had a minimum of chances. Still won 2-0. We basically FM'd them.

Don't expect to use a tactic and immediately hit it off. Players need time to get used to it.
You also have to have the right players for it. That, alone can take time.

My biggest issues at the start were: Poacher or AF? CMd or DLPd? PFs or DLFs? Which full-back should be defending.
I needed to balance that while working towards the tactic and style i wanted them to play. 4-4-2 was given. I'm a 4-4-2 guy. Plain and simple.
Had to work a bit with the TIs to get them where i wanted. Didn't do any big changes. Just incremental changes. One thing at a time.
One thing i don't have to worry about yet are player traits. Most of my players have no traits. That helps me. That can have a significant impact, having the "wrong" traits and tendencies.

When i found a balance my players starting developing partnerships, while also getting familiar with the tactic and style.
Before and after was a massive difference in play.
I saw the chaos before. Stuck with it. Now, instead of trying to avoid relegation in the 3rd season i'm expected to reach playoffs for promotion. And they're playing exactly the way i want them to.

Give it time. It takes time. You will mostly see ridiculous attempts and plays when the players aren't familiar enough, overall, with the tactics.
But it seems like it's more important this year to adapt more. Especially at the beginning at a club.
 

Edited November 28, 2019 by roykela

[roykela]

As a little example in the match i'm playing now.
First friendly. I always play my friendlies this way:
First XI gets the first 45 and the subs get the 2nd half.

First XI was struggling. Couldn't get a goal. They are miles better than quite a few players starting on the bench.
Subs come on. 2-0 up rather quickly. Not finished the match yet.

Why? Could be several reasons. The goalscorers are probably 2 of my worst players. But these players are also more familiar with my style, as they've been at the club longer and have played my style.
I have strengthened the team but the ones that has come in aren't used to my style yet. And they haven't gotten used to eachother either.
That means that my first XI, for now, are playing worse than my worst players. Because my worst players know how to play my style.

The match just finished now and ended with us winning 3-0. 3rd goal was scored by another player that's not really good enough for me but has been with me longer.
Familiarity and cohesion is playing a big part here.
Had these 2 different teams played against eachother now, using my tactics, i would almost expect my subs to beat my first XI. As they know my tactics and style inside out. My first XI don't.....yet.

I expect a troublesome start of the season but will get much better as the seaon goes on. Unless i have the right blend that gel together quickly.
Time will tell.

Edited November 28, 2019 by roykela

[Seb Wassell]

11 hours ago, Soviet said:

So my club was taken over by new owner and the board signed two new players. I had nothing to do with it and couldn't cancel it in any way. "Whatever!" - I said, even though I'm doing a youth challenge. Now the board is dissapointed with me, because of the "finances involved with signing" these two players.

So the board sold my young prospect because that's something the board do. I managed to at least get a loan back until the end of season. The player is back after one day and after his first game a journalist asks me during the press conference if I would be interested in signing him permanently.

It's the small things that kill the immersion.

Could you report these two as bugs please - https://community.sigames.com/forum/726-football-manager-2020-bugs-forum/

[Bry]

1 hour ago, roykela said:

As a little example in the match i'm playing now.
First friendly. I always play my friendlies this way:
First XI gets the first 45 and the subs get the 2nd half.

First XI was struggling. Couldn't get a goal. They are miles better than quite a few players starting on the bench.
Subs come on. 2-0 up rather quickly. Not finished the match yet.

Why? Could be several reasons. The goalscorers are probably 2 of my worst players. But these players are also more familiar with my style, as they've been at the club longer and have played my style.
I have strengthened the team but the ones that has come in aren't used to my style yet. And they haven't gotten used to eachother either.
That means that my first XI, for now, are playing worse than my worst players. Because my worst players know how to play my style.

The match just finished now and ended with us winning 3-0. 3rd goal was scored by another player that's not really good enough for me but has been with me longer.
Familiarity and cohesion is playing a big part here.
Had these 2 different teams played against eachother now, using my tactics, i would almost expect my subs to beat my first XI. As they know my tactics and style inside out. My first XI don't.....yet.

I expect a troublesome start of the season but will get much better as the seaon goes on. Unless i have the right blend that gel together quickly.
Time will tell.

Yep, although probably worth acknowledging that bringing on 11 fresh players at half time is going to give your team a fitness advantage over the AI who doesn’t make such drastic changes.

I agree with you though. To assume that just plugging a tactic in will give certain results ignores so many other contributory factors.

[Svenc]

I haven't the time to do this for every match. But meanwhile it's Pretty confirmed how those "one on ones" mostly come About. It's Always in tendency one of the widish guys Breaking through, be it from a Long ball or dribble, past the last line. This makes them approaching the Goal and finishing it off from tighter angles, and they are also oft closed down and naturally approaching the Goal at pace. Would be interesting how SI view those chances. I would regard them as 1 in 5 ones at best. However, they Need to be defended better, so that they don't come About. And if they come About, naturally the Players shouldn't be quite as selfish when through and square it when it is on. 

Red dots again marked 1vs1ish situations (1st screenshot), also the comparison made to another match from before (2nd screenshot). Blue dots are meanwhile the headers and blocked shots etc. from the set piece, which is another Topic. How many of those sides have against Teams sitting Deep depends on the tactic quite a bit. Don't stretch that defense positionally and be prepared to have a turckload, and with it the SOT conversion takes a nosedive…. In General, unlike in football, as to FM don't expect a side having the majority of ist shots from actual open positioning Play, in particular against a Team sitting Deep. This has been going on for a couple Releases already though.

Edited November 28, 2019 by Svenc

[Jebedaias]

Just wanted to say that as long as everyone keeps buying it, then who cares about all these things ? Think I remember Miles said FM 19 broke the sales records, so there you have it.

[Soviet]

5 hours ago, Seb Wassell said:

Could you report these two as bugs please - https://community.sigames.com/forum/726-football-manager-2020-bugs-forum/

I would love to, but I'm way past the dates for both of those events and there's no way I can upload a 325 MB save with my crappy internet. Sorry :(.

[Double0Seven]

55 minutes ago, Jebedaias said:

Just wanted to say that as long as everyone keeps buying it, then who cares about all these things ? Think I remember Miles said FM 19 broke the sales records, so there you have it.

That's why FM desperately need a competitor. I'm sure the SI team are working hard, but a competitor would drive things even harder. 

 

[Harrymcintyre]

I do wonder if people who complain constantly about the ME simply, pick any random tactic, any random players and expect to win constantly. Unless you are man city, Liverpool or Barca then that simply ain’t gonna work.

I’ve played around at a lot of different teams and divisions. I mean the furthest I’ve got in any save since the first beta came out is about a year and a half in. 

It’s taken a lot of learning and developing to get to a point where I’m seeing my team work well together. It’s satisfying now to see my striker scoring all types of goals consistently, and my team controlling matches. I’m Ac Milan, and at the start the team cohesion is so bad for them, it was bad watching them play and I saw a lot of misses, they couldn’t see a cross to save their lives.But now after time and work on it, they are cohesive, i see a huge difference, they are finding each other on the pitch more often. My striker is where he needs to be most of the time now. I really don’t think it’s all just down to the ME. 

[isignedupfornorealreason]

8 hours ago, roykela said:

My numbers indicate a variety of plays.

Are you seriously telling me you're getting 18 overhead kicks? :P The numbers aren't matching up with what is shown on the match engine IMO, but also, the analyst categories don't seem to be correct at the moment.

[Johnny Ace]

Where do these overhead kicks come from anyway? They been in the games for years now but they always show up. I'm sure they're just volleys or something 

[Dagenham_Dave]

11 hours ago, djchapsticks said:

given I'm still seeing 3-4 penalties regularly in some games and as many as 6 in a match.

I'm playing in the Premiership in the SPFL and have gone back over the last 6 weeks of matches in the division. There's been five penalties in total in that time. Four of which have been given to Rangers, so I'm not sure how much more realistic you can get than that