Vynal Seven Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 hour ago, GunmaN1905 said: You almost sh*thoused your way to the trophy, but football doesn't reward sh*thousery. We lost to Italy last night, who now have 2 European Championships and 4 World Cups. Football definitely rewards ****housery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Citizen Sandman Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Agreed. Bellingham might be young but he's special and again I believe foden could play cm. **** me xavi was the best player in the world at one point (briefly!) Let's have someone gorgeous there for once. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enigmatic Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 20 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said: And? Compare English and Italian benches. Other than Locatelli, Bastoni and the keepers I don't think a single Italian makes the English squad. Southgate had options, didn't use them. Seems like shithousery, or standard tournament play in tight games can prosper. Italy are masters of it, they'd never scored three goals in a Euros before this year despite being finalists three times. Don't see what the benches have to do with it; we used our bench and switched formation and it didn't exactly cut Italy open. Rashford and Sancho are great but Italy didn't have all that midfield possession because we didn't use aggressive wingers to defend a lead. I don't think a single English centre mid makes the Italian starting lineup, and that (and Italy's attackers coming deep and narrow) is where the domination-on-paper came from. Edited July 12, 2021 by enigmatic Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigcwwe Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 12 minutes ago, Baptista_8 said: The problem with England is central midfield. We had no one to run with the ball and pass consistently through the lines. We all cried out for him to try Mount deeper with either Grealish or Foden in the 8, or even play Bellingham as a box-to-boxer, but he didn't experiment in that area at all. See this is surely going to be an ongoing issue? Is Southgate brave enough to go 433 and play two 8s in a KO game at a tournament against another top nation or are we again going to play a back five and cede possession and barely get a counter going? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 32 minutes ago, HOORAY HENRIK said: ARREST THAT MAN I actually saw Carol Codwalloder? who i normally really like retweet a tweet which said what Chiellini did was racist. Sorry just checked can see she's deleting it dint know who was originally Edited July 12, 2021 by Christmas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reggiana Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 37 minutes ago, Vynal Seven said: We lost to Italy last night, who now have 2 European Championships and 4 World Cups. Football definitely rewards ****housery. Maybe it just rewards Italy being quite good at football? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vynal Seven Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, Reggiana said: Maybe it just rewards Italy being quite good at football? Yeah, quite good at football and grand masters at ****housery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yuko Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Just now, Vynal Seven said: Yeah, quite good at football and grand masters at ****housery. The salt is strong with this one Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reggiana Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Just now, Vynal Seven said: Yeah, quite good at football and grand masters at ****housery. I think they do a lot more of it when they're not such a good side though, for example in 70 and 82 they were a very good watch, played in a couple of the best games of all time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vynal Seven Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Just now, Yuko said: The salt is strong with this one Ha you couldn’t be wider of the mark. I don’t begrudge Italy at all, but gunman trying to suggest football doesn’t reward ****housery it’s just nonsense. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vynal Seven Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, Reggiana said: I think they do a lot more of it when they're not such a good side though, for example in 70 and 82 they were a very good watch, played in a couple of the best games of all time. Absolutely, I’m not having a dig at Italy. The point was that ****housery is a part of football and historically there isn’t really anyone better at it than the Italians. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, Vynal Seven said: Ha you couldn’t be wider of the mark. I don’t begrudge Italy at all, but gunman trying to suggest football doesn’t reward ****housery it’s just nonsense. This. That was the only point being made before it got twisted into people apparently hating Greece or something Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestbrother Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 3 minutes ago, Vynal Seven said: Ha you couldn’t be wider of the mark. I don’t begrudge Italy at all, but gunman trying to suggest football doesn’t reward ****housery it’s just nonsense. It didnt reward England last night... so maybe it dosent all the time Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
InigoPatinkin Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 43 minutes ago, craigcwwe said: See this is surely going to be an ongoing issue? Is Southgate brave enough to go 433 and play two 8s in a KO game at a tournament against another top nation or are we again going to play a back five and cede possession and barely get a counter going? Given it's gotten us to a semi-final and a final, probably yes, unless an obvious solution presents itself. International football is absolutely the worst place to try and play open, flowing football. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vynal Seven Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, bestbrother said: It didnt reward England last night... so maybe it dosent all the time Well, I don’t think there was really any of it last night anyway. England dropped too deep and conceded too much control of the game to Italy after the first half an hour but I wouldn’t really call that ****housery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunmaN1905 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Apparently there's nothing inbetween not making a single shot for 90 minutes and going full 1982 Brazil. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Vynal Seven Posted July 12, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said: Apparently there's nothing inbetween not making a single shot for 90 minutes and going full 1982 Brazil. From the guy who thinks you either win or “bottle it”. Edited July 12, 2021 by Vynal Seven 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Federico Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 2 ore fa, GunmaN1905 ha scritto: Put a proper coach in Southgate's place and England wins this in regulation 9 out of 10 times. This tournament has proven that coaches do make a difference. Bah. Even Capello could do only that much with a wonderteam. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
XuluBak Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 5 hours ago, VamPook said: Not sure why everyone is saying Southgate will learn from this Literally the same pragmatic tactics from game 1 this tournament. Read every match thread and you have the same comments and complaints. The same criticisms were made before and throughout. He manages to not lose. His preference for and/or against certain players is baffling to say the least. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 7 minutes ago, Vynal Seven said: From the guy who thinks you either win or “bottle it”. Have to say, that is an attitude I see far more often. What match was that? Italy-Spain, I think, where basically all the players were called 's**t' because, I guess, people weren't entertained enough. Fair enough, during the match. The time for subtleties is after the match. But c'mon. In reality, not one player on the whole tournament is or was 's**t'. Every single one earns a very nice wage playing professionally. It's all relative to the level they are playing at and some are better than others, is all. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallen Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 13 minutes ago, InigoPatinkin said: Given it's gotten us to a semi-final and a final, probably yes, unless an obvious solution presents itself. International football is absolutely the worst place to try and play open, flowing football. I agree with this, but playing two 8s (let’s say Foden and Mount ahead of Phillips/Rice for example) =/= open flowing football. Not necessarily, anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
XuluBak Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 6 hours ago, Rob1981 said: It’s not about tearing at them all game whilever it’s level, it’s about keeping it at 0-0 and then putting yourself in a position to win in the last 20-25 minutes. Played the Germany game like this and it worked to perfection. When you spend an hour sitting on a 1-0 lead it’s really really hard to then get any forward momentum back once you concede the equaliser. Tends to happen when the other team can't finish. They had two breakaways and a couple other premium chances despite your extremely defensive setup. Rice was fortunate to not be sent off breaking up another. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enigmatic Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 18 minutes ago, Vynal Seven said: From the guy who thinks you either win or “bottle it”. And that we had a 90% chance of beating an Italian side unbeaten in 30 games At some point it's probably worth giving Italy credit... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunmaN1905 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 By the end of the week, you guys will be trying to convince me that England's achievement of getting to the final while playing all games on Wembley is a beautiful underdog story about a team going against all odds. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob1981 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 2 hours ago, GunmaN1905 said: This tournament has proven that coaches do make a difference. Can't argue with this. I mean look how badly England have done before now, even when they've had a crop of brilliant players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadAss88 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 4 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said: By the end of the week, you guys will be trying to convince me that England's achievement of getting to the final while playing all games on Wembley is a beautiful underdog story about a team going against all odds. While defeating Croatia, Czech Republic, Germany and Ukraine and drawing against Scotland and Denmark to get there! What a performance! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
InigoPatinkin Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 13 minutes ago, Smallen said: I agree with this, but playing two 8s (let’s say Foden and Mount ahead of Phillips/Rice for example) =/= open flowing football. Not necessarily, anyway. No, but that's kind of the point I suppose. Foden and Mount probably would make the midfield more fluid but any midfield 3 with those two in would be absolutely and ruthlessly picked apart by any team good at transitions. I don't think any half decent national team plays with 2 8's for this reason. You need two deep midfielder players and England just don't have any of those that are all that good at passing out from the back. If they did they'd be straight in the team. England would be much better off trying to play to their strengths, we've got several very good attacking midfielders who can play in the half spaces well. Use the solid midfield 2 to allow them to link up inside and let the fullbacks provide the width. If another Carrick comes along any time soon then you can adjust things, but we've got a defensively stable base with two progressive defenders and a whole battery of fullbacks who are proficient going forward. It's probably our biggest asset. Playing a slightly negative midfield two to keep that solidity and then tinkering with the attackers seems to me a much more likely to succeed strategy than playing players who aren't really proper midfielders in midfield end stopping the back line doing what they've been doing. Probably all the more important if TAA is back being a defacto playmaker from the wide areas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Albrighton Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Did good coaches making a difference need to be proved to anyone that's actually watched football though or for that matter any sport. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skybluedave Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 7 minutes ago, BadAss88 said: While defeating Croatia, Czech Republic, Germany and Ukraine and drawing against Scotland and Denmark to get there! What a performance! Must have missed the draw with Denmark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadAss88 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, skybluedave said: Must have missed the draw with Denmark 1-1 after 90 minutes.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enigmatic Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 6 minutes ago, Marc Albrighton said: Did good coaches making a difference need to be proved to anyone that's actually watched football though or for that matter any sport. Might need proving to the guy in this thread who insists that two coaches who inherited absolute messes of teams and ended up in the final are useless and cowardly... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skybluedave Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, BadAss88 said: 1-1 after 90 minutes.. What? By the logic Italy drew with Austria. And Spain And England... so do we share the trophy? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enigmatic Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, BadAss88 said: 1-1 after 90 minutes.. Well if you want to play that sort of childish game, quite happy to agree that Italy drew with us and share the trophy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadAss88 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I was just mentioning it because it wasn't that big of a performance to get to the final for England..They had an easy group and were only able to score 2 goals, encountered a troubled Germany and then Ukraine and Denmark were they needed a light penalty to win the game, while playing 6 of the 7 games at home, they even played there best game away from Wembley.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
InigoPatinkin Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, BadAss88 said: I was just mentioning it because it wasn't that big of a performance to get to the final for England..They had an easy group and were only able to score 2 goals, encountered a troubled Germany and then Ukraine and Denmark were they needed a light penalty to win the game, while playing 6 of the 7 games at home, they even played there best game away from Wembley.. So what you're saying is England were unfairly disadvantaged by having to play under the pressure of having all their games at home? I knew we were robbed. Bet the Italians rigged the draw too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadAss88 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 No I'm saying that they didn't play well during the entire tournament but were lucky with the draw and home advantage. They could've played way more attacking and attractive football with the players they had, but decided not too.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
InigoPatinkin Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, BadAss88 said: No I'm saying that they didn't play well during the entire tournament but were lucky with the draw and home advantage. No need to try and explain yourself further, I read what you said! We played our best game away and we were forced to play the rest of the games at home! You're right, we were robbed. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 You say home advantage, but England were much better when they didn't play at home. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Albrighton Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 23 minutes ago, enigmatic said: Might need proving to the guy in this thread who insists that two coaches who inherited absolute messes of teams and ended up in the final are useless and cowardly... Yea well i don't know why anyone really humours the guy honestly, he's either a very good troll or just pretty dense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius1998 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I said it at the time too that England got away from Wembley and suddenly started playing at their full potential. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tikka Mezzala Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 England's route to success is pretty clear as far as I can see: appoint Tony Pulis. Demand to play games on Tuesday evenings (especially in the winter), and move home games from Wembley to the Bet365 Stadium. We all know "continental" players canny handle such conditions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1985 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, Tikka Mezzala said: England's route to success is pretty clear as far as I can see: appoint Tony Pulis. Demand to play games on Tuesday evenings (especially in the winter), and move home games from Wembley to the Bet365 Stadium. We all know "continental" players canny handle such conditions. Don’t have any more upvotes but yes. All games must be on a cold Tuesday night in Stoke. Appoint Pulis and we can’t go wrong 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enigmatic Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, BadAss88 said: I was just mentioning it because it wasn't that big of a performance to get to the final for England..They had an easy group and were only able to score 2 goals, encountered a troubled Germany and then Ukraine and Denmark were they needed a light penalty to win the game, while playing 6 of the 7 games at home, they even played there best game away from Wembley.. It was a completely normal performance against completely normal opponents to get to the final, something we haven't actually done before. On the other side of the draw Italy cruised past much weaker opponents in the group stage, then needed extra time against the mighty Austria, just about avoided throwing away a two goal lead against Belgium minus two of their best players and won a shootout after parking the bus against Spain. Did that make them the best team in the tournament? Yes, actually For comparison purposes, in 2008 Peak Spain also beat Germany and ended up in a shootout with Italy. Their other opponents were Russia, Sweden and Greece, and they needed very late goals to beat the last two. In Euro 96 Germany also drew with Italy, narrowly beat Croatia and the Czech Republic, and I'm delighted our match against them now counts as a draw. And those are the similar ones, obviously Portugal had both weaker opponents and worse results, but the achievement still counts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enigmatic Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 4 minutes ago, Tikka Mezzala said: England's route to success is pretty clear as far as I can see: appoint Tony Pulis. Demand to play games on Tuesday evenings (especially in the winter), and move home games from Wembley to the Bet365 Stadium. We all know "continental" players canny handle such conditions. This is just a cunning plan to make the conditions ideally suited for Scotland to win, isn't it? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eenie Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, enigmatic said: This is just a cunning plan to make the conditions ideally suited for Scotland to win, isn't it? Nah, we play best at Wembley. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titchuk Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I agree that England played pretty weak opponents on the way to the semi in 2018 but I'm not really having it for this year! I know neither are what they once were, but we still beat two of the last four World Cup finalists. That Danish side is pretty good, the Czechs are underrated (knocked out an exciting Dutch side) and of course we didn't really lose to Italy. I know we don't think of this current Italian side as a vintage Italian side right now, but I wonder whether we will in a few years time. Chiellini, Bonucci, Verratti, Donnarumma are probably some of the best players in their positions in world football at the moment. And there's a bunch of others who, depending on what they achieve in coming years, could end up being highly regarded. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tikka Mezzala Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 15 minutes ago, enigmatic said: This is just a cunning plan to make the conditions ideally suited for Scotland to win, isn't it? None of this tippy tappy Spanishy stuff. No more Grealish hair bands and Phillips man buns. Back to the best of British! Blood, guts, and pitches like the wetlands of Brazil. If the ball bounces, it ain't fit to play! ****! I'm becoming @bestbrother! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astafjevs Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Enigmatic Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1985 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 36 minutes ago, Tikka Mezzala said: ****! I'm becoming @bestbrother! One of us one of us 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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