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Stuart Warren

Football Manager 2014 - Update 14.2.2 - Feedback Thread

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Haha, just had one player give away three penalties in one match. After he'd conceded his 2nd one, I went to sub him, but before there was a break in play for the substitution to take place, he conceded another one! :lol:

Needless to say when he went off he had a 4.4 rating...

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How could one on one misses related to tactic at all, if it does then penalty kick misses should be related to tactic too yeah...

Hell no, it's about the stat of the striker like composure, finishing and the goalkeeper's stat like one on one.

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Because a high % of the users who have the issue use high pressure, fast, attacking tactics that encourage rush football with a shoot on sight policy which leaves a lot of their chances being from poor areas from players who are off balance or not in a good position to take the shot. They don't give their players time on the ball to take a second to pick their spot.

They also tend to have an unrealistic perception of how many chances should be scored.

I play low control drop deeper stand off 4 2 3 1 liverpool XD

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How could one on one misses related to tactic at all

Because all you are thinking about is the shot on goal, and not what's gone before it. A 1v1 chance where you only have a split second to hit it will generally be less successful than the same chance where the striker has that extra second. And the reason why the striker will have the extra time to pick his spot will be down to the build up from behind. Which is tactical. This is why you'll see good conversion rates by AI forwards when you play against them with a poorly thought out tactic. People think the game is rigged in favour of the AI when they score with their only shot on goal when you've had 30+, but it's really not that at all.

Edit - Here's an example from my last game. Just a screenshot, so you don't really see what's gone on before, but the forward has been played in by a lovely weighted ball from the AMC and although is slighly wider than he maybe would have liked, doesn't have a defender within a couple of yards of him. End result, a calm, composed finish into the back of the net. This happened right on half time, and was his first clear cut chance of the match.

B7PeHyL.jpg

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Because all you are thinking about is the shot on goal, and not what's gone before it. A 1v1 chance where you only have a split second to hit it will generally be less successful than the same chance where the striker has that extra second. And the reason why the striker will have the extra time to pick his spot will be down to the build up from behind. Which is tactical. This is why you'll see good conversion rates by AI forwards when you play against them with a poorly thought out tactic. People think the game is rigged in favour of the AI when they score with their only shot on goal when you've had 30+, but it's really not that at all.

Even with bucket loads of time , more than 90% of 1 on 1's are missed. I have 2 pacy strikers and I dont know why but some AI teams play a high line and a throughball from one of my strikers sets the other one free with atleast half the opposition half empty and he dribbles and then shoots at the goal keeper all the time , I only watch 2D now so thats how it feels and it's not like it's once chance here and there.

Just lost a game to Bayern 1-2 and I missed 4 one on ones . 3 from my advanced forward all hit the keeper and 1 from my right winger hit the post . All of those shots were taken with no defender around them and a lot of time to think and maybe take a nap and then shoot.

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Because all you are thinking about is the shot on goal, and not what's gone before it. A 1v1 chance where you only have a split second to hit it will generally be less successful than the same chance where the striker has that extra second. And the reason why the striker will have the extra time to pick his spot will be down to the build up from behind. Which is tactical. This is why you'll see good conversion rates by AI forwards when you play against them with a poorly thought out tactic. People think the game is rigged in favour of the AI when they score with their only shot on goal when you've had 30+, but it's really not that at all.

Edit - Here's an example from my last game. Just a screenshot, so you don't really see what's gone on before, but the forward has been played in by a lovely weighted ball from the AMC and although is slighly wider than he maybe would have liked, doesn't have a defender within a couple of yards of him. End result, a calm, composed finish into the back of the net. This happened right on half time, and was his first clear cut chance of the match.

B7PeHyL.jpg

Sorry Dave but this is complete rubbish. There's times my striker (Shane Long) gets played in by a through ball down the middle, running towards goal with no defender nearby because he's left them behind with his off the ball movement and is outpacing them (acceleration 18, pace 16). Despite having bags of time to move closer to goal to slot it in the corner, or even go around the keeper, he shoots from way outside the box, or when he does take it closer he shoots directly into the keepers stomach! It's inexcusable, unrealistic and nothing to do with tactics. I'm sure everyone describing their frustrations with one on ones are describing their striker on his own, one on one with the keeper with no defenders putting the striker under pressure. This is why we are all getting so frustrated!

Also, it's not just my team, the opposing AI forwards do exactly the same. I played Swansea recently and Bony (finishing 17) was clear through one on one against me and he shot from outside the box and my keeper dived and pushed it wide. I am not on here to moan about things conspiring against me as you like to think, I am here moaning about the ridiculous, unrealistic things that shouldn't happen in a football match. Whether those things go for me or against me it is frustrating to watch and ruining the game for me!

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I play low control drop deeper stand off 4 2 3 1 liverpool XD

How do you play low control?

Control is one step below attacking and still encourages direct play. What about individual roles & duties for your front four?

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Because all you are thinking about is the shot on goal, and not what's gone before it. A 1v1 chance where you only have a split second to hit it will generally be less successful than the same chance where the striker has that extra second. And the reason why the striker will have the extra time to pick his spot will be down to the build up from behind. Which is tactical. This is why you'll see good conversion rates by AI forwards when you play against them with a poorly thought out tactic. People think the game is rigged in favour of the AI when they score with their only shot on goal when you've had 30+, but it's really not that at all.

Edit - Here's an example from my last game. Just a screenshot, so you don't really see what's gone on before, but the forward has been played in by a lovely weighted ball from the AMC and although is slighly wider than he maybe would have liked, doesn't have a defender within a couple of yards of him. End result, a calm, composed finish into the back of the net. This happened right on half time, and was his first clear cut chance of the match.

B7PeHyL.jpg

One on one means the player only has the goalkeeper to beat for goal. You assumed ALL of us does not understand what a simple one on one means but yourself.

If there are defenders close enough for a challenge then it won't be called one on one. It doesn't matter how the one on one situation is built up when it

reach the point of one on one where the player only has the goalkeeper to beat and none of the defenders around is close enough for a challenge. This means

tactic is no longer relevant at this point of time but only the player's stat and ppm.

I have seen way too many times of absolutely clear one on one chance where my world class striker like Luis Suarez/Cavani/Falcao miss where they go a long through

ball from defender and then he is alone from mid field sprinting to goal keeper and shoot it straight to the goalkeeper or shooting it wide or high.

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Suarez doesnt really count, his stats are a bit low, but RVP does it, Lewendowski does it... then some random midfielder buries his when through on goal

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In the last 3 days i played the game something like 4-5 hours per day. It's becoming really frustrating. I can assume that my tactic knowledge it's not so good, but i try, and i try, and i try again and seems that nothing changes. It's not to win or to lose (i have to say, after 14.2.1 i begin to win, a Serie A with Fiorentina and one Eredivisie with Ajax) but how the things goes.

I struggle to play my idea of football, not necessarily THE winning idea but simply the mine, but in fact what i say to the players it's not what they do in the field.

Corners and free kicks have a really too far HUGE impact on the game and on the goals, independently if they goes for me or the opponents.

World class players do a lot of awful technical errors, i can understand that "also the best wrongs" but this happen really to often! And on the other side, some (maybe) decent players do the shot of a life...one week in and one week out.

I can understand that a tactic might be wrong, but really nothing convinces me that it's tactical the individual skills error that i see. Im still wondering WHY our wingers have to put the ball forward instead of stop it, i don't understand why our defenders often seems deliberately forget that their job is to stop the opponent striker. Really, i've seen tons of goals like this: the forward gets the ball, goes straight to the goal passing through the defender and then shooting...GOAL!

I can hardly believe that someone can play the game...not WINNING the game, but play in the way he like it, winning or losing but in it's way. Football it's not always like to find the winning formation, but sometimes simply see your idea on the pitch is enough. Nothing, and believe me, i tried my best, and surely i'll try again tomorrow, becasue i am everything but an opinionated person. I played over 1000 hours on the 2013 without came in this forum, so all i can ask it's to believe in my feedback. It's just my feedback, but i think that this thread is right.

How can i be constructive if also if i change everything some errrors still remains? I love this game, i really hope that im wrong, but after reading everything and trying everything i don't know what to do!

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One on one means the player only has the goalkeeper to beat for goal. You assumed ALL of us does not understand what a simple one on one means but yourself.

If there are defenders close enough for a challenge then it won't be called one on one. It doesn't matter how the one on one situation is built up when it

reach the point of one on one where the player only has the goalkeeper to beat and none of the defenders around is close enough for a challenge. This means

tactic is no longer relevant at this point of time but only the player's stat and ppm.

I have seen way too many times of absolutely clear one on one chance where my world class striker like Luis Suarez/Cavani/Falcao miss where they go a long through

ball from defender and then he is alone from mid field sprinting to goal keeper and shoot it straight to the goalkeeper or shooting it wide or high.

Well this is a sentence from mod RTHerringbone on page 37 if you could not care less to read: "There are definitely decision making issues in the final third, and these are known issues which are in the process of being reviewed and tuned.".

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For some reason, that just feels like cheating to me. Not to mention, being a Colchester fan, I feel like I'd have a tendency to overrate them in comparison to the current underrating. I could try I guess, I certainly want to get rid of that ridiculous "Runs With Ball Rarely" on Drey Wright.

If you think their attributes need to be looked at, now is definitely the time to post in the data section.

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If SI claims that released patch 14.2.2 contains important fixes, what will improve the match engine? How much can still report the error resulting from errors in the match engine? Apparently the SI does not notice that there are more important bugs to fix?

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I haven't had time to follow this thread and hence, the latest development of the game.

It seems like there are still many problems with the game, even on the latest patch.

I need your opinion - is this game worth buying?

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If SI claims that released patch 14.2.2 contains important fixes, what will improve the match engine? How much can still report the error resulting from errors in the match engine? Apparently the SI does not notice that there are more important bugs to fix?

SI recognises that there remain ME issues (just read a few official responses in the Bugs Forum to get an idea of what is being worked on).

The ME is enormously complicated; every component is interrelated. If they rushed to release a half finished update, it could be disastrous.

I would much rather they spent longer testing and tuning the product to increase the likelihood of more things being fixed correctly.

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SI recognises that there remain ME issues (just read a few official responses in the Bugs Forum to get an idea of what is being worked on).

The ME is enormously complicated; every component is interrelated. If they rushed to release a half finished update, it could be disastrous.

I would much rather they spent longer testing and tuning the product to increase the likelihood of more things being fixed correctly.

Why are not there, as was the case with previous versions of FM, SI reported that in a separate post which has now been fixed (before the release of the next).

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Why on earth has the way the positions switch between tactics been changed?

I reported this as a bug and it turns out it was an intended 'logical improvement' :confused:

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/380269-14.2-Players-move-to-wrong-positions-when-switching-tactic

Would like to also point out that saved team selections are a problem now too. They used to work fine.

But now, when I change tactics and swap players etc, I can then change back to an older tactic and use the team selection I saved back when I used it, and now the players are swapping.

Definite bug.

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How do you play low control?

Control is one step below attacking and still encourages direct play. What about individual roles & duties for your front four?

I play the 2 dm formation not 4 strikers upfront I wish i coul play 4 strikers upfront

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I haven't had time to follow this thread and hence, the latest development of the game.

It seems like there are still many problems with the game, even on the latest patch.

I need your opinion - is this game worth buying?

Get the demo and decide yourself.

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Why are not there, as was the case with previous versions of FM, SI reported that in a separate post which has now been fixed (before the release of the next).

Because they're not ready. Surely that's not too hard to understand?

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Why are not there, as was the case with previous versions of FM, SI reported that in a separate post which has now been fixed (before the release of the next).

I'm not quite sure what you mean?

They don't commit to listing what is aimed to be fixed in the next update, as that would be setting themselves up for a fall.

If they explicitly state "Plan to fix first touch" and then fail to do so, threads like these would be even more animated!

Rest assured that SI are aware of all of the outstanding ME issues and they are working extraordinarily hard to resolve them.

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I haven't had time to follow this thread and hence, the latest development of the game.

It seems like there are still many problems with the game, even on the latest patch.

I need your opinion - is this game worth buying?

Absolutely. I am in my third season, a great game that i'm enjoying a lot. There are some things that could be better but given the scope of the game, they are very minor and don't detract from my overall score : 8/10. Keep in mind that the majority of people spend their time actually playing the game rather than endlessy moaning on the forums.

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The main thing I want to see fixed is the decision making of defenders when defending corners. Head it out for another corner, head it up the field, don't head it straight to the attacker in the middle of the penalty box who has a simple shot into the net. This happens both for and against. Get that fixed, and I'll be a lot happier. It's the only thing - ME wise - that's coming close to ruining my enjoyment of the game at the moment.

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I'm not quite sure what you mean?

They don't commit to listing what is aimed to be fixed in the next update, as that would be setting themselves up for a fall.

If they explicitly state "Plan to fix first touch" and then fail to do so, threads like these would be even more animated!

Rest assured that SI are aware of all of the outstanding ME issues and they are working extraordinarily hard to resolve them.

My God, you must get sick of saying that. Good work :thup:

I'm now officially a TC convert! The latest TC on FM 14 has 'cut the umbilical cord', so to speak and is now detached from the sliders completely, in my opinion. I tried to go back to FM12 and fiddle with the sliders and didn't have a clue what I was doing! Couldn't imagine this happening even a couple of months ago. Just shows what reading Cleon's advice can do for you. Big thanks to him too for being able to relate to the TC in a way which enables any old chimp (me of course) to understand it!

It's great to be able to actually tell a player to do something and see him do it! Never really had that level of control before.

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I think he means the thread last year where PaulC listed all the changes between in-house ME versions. Not planned fixes but the ones that were already in.

Edit: this - http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/320432-Next-match-engine-update-fixes-so-far...(-updated-4th-February-)

I see, thanks for clarifying that. My memory isn't what it was, and it was always bad :)

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I also see this but very rarely and chalk it up as a boneheaded play from some players. You know, boneheaded plays do happen in real life too.

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This still does not fix errors with the editor that affect FM2014. When can we expect a fix for the bugs plaguing the editor?

I'd like to know this, too. New features of the editor, especially advanced editing and average points system, were among the main reasons I decided to buy this game. It's now over 2 months since the release and these features are still not working properly. And there haven't been any kind of editor fix in the last couple of patches. :(

The game itself has so far been quite enjoyable, though :)

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The main thing I want to see fixed is the decision making of defenders when defending corners. Head it out for another corner, head it up the field, don't head it straight to the attacker in the middle of the penalty box who has a simple shot into the net. This happens both for and against. Get that fixed, and I'll be a lot happier. It's the only thing - ME wise - that's coming close to ruining my enjoyment of the game at the moment.

Just had this happen to me twice. Corner comes over and misses everyone apart from my defender at the back post. Instead of leaving the ball to go out for a goal kick or head away, he heads straight back ACROSS his own penalty area! My centre-half then duly obliges and nods home into his own net. Towards the end of the game (which I lost 3-2 because of these ME bugs), a corner comes in and my defender gets there first at the near post. He then of course decides to flick the ball on. Into his own six-yard box. Ok. They score and win the game.

Just too many of these now. Costing me games and ruining the enjoyment. Looks like I'll be waiting for a patch to play again.

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Christ you'd think the own goal bug would be fixed by now. It's a real game breaker. Not even through pre-season and I've got crazy scores like 3-7 (five own goals) against teams like Cowdenbeath. FFS, it's ridiculous.

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I remain to be convinced on the whole 1-on-1 conversion rate thing. I've deleted my Arsenal save now, but I do think the majority of my 1-on-1s were misses. I don't get how it's tactical if a ball should break to my player and he has a clear run on goal, yet he misses. That should come down purely to ability. I think the gam would be made much more realistic if the 1 on 1 conversion rate was bumped up, and goals from other means (corners, for example, but especially mistakes from GKs and the like) brought down a notch or two. Much more realistic. Right now I do think there is an air of predictability in the game. I'm not saying my players would miss every 1-on1, but most. But then this was ameliorated later by a goal from a corner (flick on and volley in, anyone?) or from an own goal.

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Christ you'd think the own goal bug would be fixed by now. It's a real game breaker. Not even through pre-season and I've got crazy scores like 3-7 (five own goals) against teams like Cowdenbeath. FFS, it's ridiculous.

RTHerringbone has already replied on the match engine issues here - http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/378442-Football-Manager-2014-Update-14.2.2-Feedback-Thread?p=9364273&viewfull=1#post9364273

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Christ you'd think the own goal bug would be fixed by now. It's a real game breaker. Not even through pre-season and I've got crazy scores like 3-7 (five own goals) against teams like Cowdenbeath. FFS, it's ridiculous.

But when you see saves like mine, where there doesn't seem to be an own goal problem, you can see why it becomes difficult to fix. I'm not saying there isn't a problem, just that it's clearly difficult to reproduce if it doesn't happen in 100% of cases. That's probably a contributing factor into why it's not been fixed.

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Christ you'd think the own goal bug would be fixed by now. It's a real game breaker. Not even through pre-season and I've got crazy scores like 3-7 (five own goals) against teams like Cowdenbeath. FFS, it's ridiculous.

If you have a .pkm of a game with 5 own goals in, then it would be very handy if you uploaded it to the bugs forum for review.

Own Goal issues have been logged in the Bugs Forum, and if you upload that game, SI will be able to determine if the issues you saw were ridiculous "foot through the ball" own goals, or as a consequence of the heavy first touch issue.

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Christ you'd think the own goal bug would be fixed by now. It's a real game breaker. Not even through pre-season and I've got crazy scores like 3-7 (five own goals) against teams like Cowdenbeath. FFS, it's ridiculous.

Five OGs in pre-season???

I don't think I've seen five OGs in the three seasons I've played in my current save.

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In another one of my FM-related daydreams, I was thinking about how many of the issues people are noticing and logging is inextricably linked to the variety (or lack of variety) in the goals scored. If there were a greater variety of goals scored (but clearly not to an unreasonably high quantity, as goals can obviously be scored in patterns in football, whether it's a through-ball, cross, tap-in or header, or build-up leading to playing an attacker through, etc), then wouldn't people necessarily notice fewer issues (subjective), and wouldn't some of the actual ME issues be ironed out (objective)?

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Nobody doesn't want to sign for me, i play with dortmund. Its 26/27 season i have five star reputation just won treble with league, cup and champions league. Still most of the players are not interested into negotiations with me. Why??? I have 120 millions to spend but all players that i want are not interested!!! What can i do???

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Nobody doesn't want to sign for me, i play with dortmund. Its 26/27 season i have five star reputation just won treble with league, cup and champions league. Still most of the players are not interested into negotiations with me. Why??? I have 120 millions to spend but all players that i want are not interested!!! What can i do???

Is that a bug or i am doing something wrong?

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Is it the club turning down the bid, or the player refusing negotiations?

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In another one of my FM-related daydreams, I was thinking about how many of the issues people are noticing and logging is inextricably linked to the variety (or lack of variety) in the goals scored. If there were a greater variety of goals scored (but clearly not to an unreasonably high quantity, as goals can obviously be scored in patterns in football, whether it's a through-ball, cross, tap-in or header, or build-up player and playing an attacker through, etc), then wouldn't people necessarily notice fewer issues (subjective), and wouldn't some of the actual ME issues be ironed out (objective)?

The thing is, not everyone is seeing the lack of variety- I could pull up a random sampling of, say, three consecutive games from my latest save, and you'd see most- if not all- types of goal that you've mentioned. And, to a lesser extent, own goals. This is, of course, conceded as well as scored. I'm not some ardent SI defender, but this simply hasn't been an issue in the games I've played.

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Nobody doesn't want to sign for me, i play with dortmund. Its 26/27 season i have five star reputation just won treble with league, cup and champions league. Still most of the players are not interested into negotiations with me. Why??? I have 120 millions to spend but all players that i want are not interested!!! What can i do???

I'm not 100% but I think there was a bug with transfers and the German league.

I'm also not sure if its been fixed or not.

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Clubs are accepting my bids but players are not interested into entering negotiations with me. I can let my assistant to take care negotiations but then accept only if they get key player status and huge salary even the young talents what is ridiculous. its annoying. Most recent i tried to buy young 17 years old talent from Fluminense (Brasil) and club accepted my bid, but player is not interested and when i leave it to my assistant he accepts but for 140k Euros per week and key player squad status!!!

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The thing is, not everyone is seeing the lack of variety- I could pull up a random sampling of, say, three consecutive games from my latest save, and you'd see most- if not all- types of goal that you've mentioned. And, to a lesser extent, own goals. This is, of course, conceded as well as scored. I'm not some ardent SI defender, but this simply hasn't been an issue in the games I've played.

Well I was actually trying to describe a sequence of events, i.e. a through ball leading to a cross leading to a tap-in or header. Hence my use of the word pattern. But my fault for not explaining it well enough. I think the most memorable goal my team ever scored was when my RB found himself in the opposition area after a move and slotted the ball sooo nicely into the corner. That's the sort of variety I want more of.

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Well I was actually trying to describe a sequence of events, i.e. a through ball leading to a cross leading to a tap-in or header. Hence my use of the word pattern. But my fault for not explaining it well enough. I think the most memorable goal my team ever scored was when my RB found himself in the opposition area after a move and slotted the ball sooo nicely into the corner. That's the sort of variety I want more of.

I kinda agree with you to an extent.

I certainly see a lot of variety in terms of goals (more than previous versions and significantly more than say FM10 or FM11) but it does feel as if there are less "memorable" goals. Amazing long shots, diving headers onto crosses, a few good quick passes playing in a player, they happen from time to time but not as often as they perhaps should.

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I haven't had time to follow this thread and hence, the latest development of the game.

It seems like there are still many problems with the game, even on the latest patch.

I need your opinion - is this game worth buying?

Even with all it's faults and trust me, there are plenty this year, I'd say it is still very worthwhile buying it.

It can still be just as much fun as it can be frustrating and SI will obviously get it patched up to an acceptable degree like they always do....x

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getting pretty irritated at the amound of goals i concede from a player having a shot, and my keeper parries it to the other striker

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SI recognises that there remain ME issues (just read a few official responses in the Bugs Forum to get an idea of what is being worked on).

The ME is enormously complicated; every component is interrelated. If they rushed to release a half finished update, it could be disastrous.

I would much rather they spent longer testing and tuning the product to increase the likelihood of more things being fixed correctly.

They seem happy enough to release the game, maybe it would be better to have a longer public Beta test, or employ some more testers. The game has been out so long yet nowhere near a polished game. I even waited until Christmas to get the game for the first time ever. It seems I should have waited much longer.

Did my bit to get some PKM's for the testers, but the game just isn't fun..for me the ME is a game breaker currently.

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Lone strikers are a pain in the ass to make them score, do they have a decision issue? it seems eveytime he choose the wrong move -_-

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They seem happy enough to release the game, maybe it would be better to have a longer public Beta test, or employ some more testers. The game has been out so long yet nowhere near a polished game. I even waited until Christmas to get the game for the first time ever. It seems I should have waited much longer.

Did my bit to get some PKM's for the testers, but the game just isn't fun..for me the ME is a game breaker currently.

The problem is that if you extend test periods, then you shrink the initial development period. A longer public Beta after a shorter development period would raise a multitude of issues which could be ironed out with a longer period of initial development.

Similarly, if SI increased the test team, they'd need to increase the size of the development team to appraise and work on the bugs raised. That would attract costs and that would ripple through to the price we pay each year. It is a vicious circle.

You have posted very good Bug Reports, so thank you for your efforts to aid the ongoing development of the ME.

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RTHeringbone; why not make the devolpment time longer and the test time longer and release an actual polished product?

Why release it before Chrismas when year after year the game is nowhere near a finished product?

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