Bertie BG

Football Manager 2012 Announced!

848 posts in this topic

It does have a moderate standard difficulty level - the abilty of the player.

Whats the point you're trying to make?

In Post #191 you claim ALL teams should be a challenge, this I take as meaning "relatively hard". No one wants an "easy game" but with the in game aids any player should be able to do an "Avram with Chelsea". That final paragraph with its "statement to end all debating" just leads to more disagreement. You may be wrong you know, a point worth considering!.

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There aren't any challenges. The only difference between managing Barcelona and *insert random Blue Square team here* is the time it takes for you to reach the top. Everything I do is miles ahead of anything the best AI manager in the game does, and then I'm not even that good a manager - I'd rate myself as a decent FM player. Sure, I've been playing the game since 1994, but that shouldn't account for the ease of mastering an aspect of the game.

They should really make Mourinho do absolutely everything right all the time in all aspects of the game, to the best of their programming genious's ability. Then it would be up to us to beat that. We would, given enough time and effort. Then the next iterations of the ME should take into account what we did to beat him, and we'd have to start all over again.

What you say is like Mourinho in real life complaining everything is too easy when at Chelsea. Had he gone from Porto to Porstmouth there may have been another outcome.

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The main point is though that you can out-perform the AI at team building even if you have no idea of what you're doing for the most part. Just follow the scouting advice in backroom advice and you're pretty much set.

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No matter if your 12years old or 60 years old, We all get excited at this time of the year with talk of new FM :D I really do like FM2011. I admit it needs a slight tidy up and a few tweaks to the transfer system but apart from that and with a whole new database update I'm more than happy.

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In Post #191 you claim ALL teams should be a challenge, this I take as meaning "relatively hard". No one wants an "easy game" but with the in game aids any player should be able to do an "Avram with Chelsea". That final paragraph with its "statement to end all debating" just leads to more disagreement. You may be wrong you know, a point worth considering!.

Ok point taken. I didn't mean it to come across as 'relatively hard'. My response was to someone who trotted out the generic reply "don't manage a good team". Thats the standard reply from someone who has no idea of a particular flaw in the game (i.e. poor AI team-building logic) and someone who repeats it without even thinking, or knowing what they're talking about. Its effectively a cop out, and lets SI off the hook imho so this particular flaw never gets looked at by SI when developing their next game (or so it seems). Hopefully this year will be different SI?

At the end of the day the difficulty level will always be the abilty of the user. However some crucial aspects of the game do need looking at and have done for some time. AI clubs stagnate quickly and soon get left behind because of their poor AI team building logic. Thats it in a nutshell. BiggusD's reply is spot on.

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"Manage Anywhere, Anytime – the ability to add or take away playable nations in your saved game as often as you want. Manage in that country at the start of the next season- meaning you don’t have to stay in the nations which are chosen by you to be playable at the start of your career."

Why do people want this??? Its not like its going to benefit everyone. heck like a few others im betting (i hope not but...) there might be a few potential bugs stuffing saved games with this option....

Id say they should concentrate on improving the AI, tactics,training & newgens.AND have the beta team play the crap out of it to lessen the chances of bugs on final release.

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What you say is like Mourinho in real life complaining everything is too easy when at Chelsea. Had he gone from Porto to Porstmouth there may have been another outcome.

Yes, of course. IF he did everything right with Portsmouth, it may have taken a few seasons to win everything because doing everything right doesn't necessarily mean that you win all your matches. There is this thing called player quality, and this other thing called club/league reputation, not to mention finances - that would prevent you from signing the world's best players immediately. However, if Mourinho took charge of Portsmouth instead of Chelsea back in the days, I am sure they wouldn't be bankrupt and in the Championship now. Why? Because the guy makes a real difference!

In FM11.3, the only manager making a real difference in the long term is you.

I and many others demand competition in single-player games, especially long-term ones.

The only way SI can provide this, is by ensuring that the AI:

A. Sign players that strengthens their team either immediately or in the long term, or both

B. Deploys their tactic in a way that maximizes the ability of their players

C. Develops youngsters by giving them 1st team experience, and by making sure that the club's coach and training facility setup is as good as it can get

D. Ensures that the squad is deep enough in all positions to get through a long and hard season

E. Gets rid of players that have no future at the club

F. Follows a long-term plan for world domimation, just like you (you are held back by the board's financial awareness and so should they)

G. Maximizes the outcome of player contract negotiations, to the best of their current ability

H. Handles the "morale engine" to the best of their ability - meaning that good managers shouldn't have problems motivating their team... just like with human players

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Can I have a response from SI please?

Could you explain the add/remove nations a little clearer please. You say add/remove "nations" and not leagues. What we all want is to be able to just add a few leagues, for example if you have taken a conference team to the CL and glory, could you take away the bottom leagues that you do not use anymore e.g. BSS/BSN BSP L2 L1 and championship? Similarly when you add a "nation" would you be able to select which leagues you can use from that nation or are you stuck with all of the leagues?

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Why is Watfords ground tiny and have no roof on the stands behind the goal, and Southampton's looks huge!

I like the crowd though, looks smart.

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Yes, of course. IF he did everything right with Portsmouth, it may have taken a few seasons to win everything because doing everything right doesn't necessarily mean that you win all your matches. There is this thing called player quality, and this other thing called club/league reputation, not to mention finances - that would prevent you from signing the world's best players immediately. However, if Mourinho took charge of Portsmouth instead of Chelsea back in the days, I am sure they wouldn't be bankrupt and in the Championship now. Why? Because the guy makes a real difference!

In FM11.3, the only manager making a real difference in the long term is you.

I and many others demand competition in single-player games, especially long-term ones.

The only way SI can provide this, is by ensuring that the AI:

A. Sign players that strengthens their team either immediately or in the long term, or both

B. Deploys their tactic in a way that maximizes the ability of their players

C. Develops youngsters by giving them 1st team experience, and by making sure that the club's coach and training facility setup is as good as it can get

D. Ensures that the squad is deep enough in all positions to get through a long and hard season

E. Gets rid of players that have no future at the club

F. Follows a long-term plan for world domimation, just like you (you are held back by the board's financial awareness and so should they)

G. Maximizes the outcome of player contract negotiations, to the best of their current ability

H. Handles the "morale engine" to the best of their ability - meaning that good managers shouldn't have problems motivating their team... just like with human players

A B and C would do for me. But the rest, yes they're needed too.

I can't believe we're now in the 12th incarnation of this game? and A B and C still don't work properly, or worse yet, haven't even been implemented. :( AI managers and the things they do are just so random and nonsensical its pitiful.

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Ok point taken. I didn't mean it to come across as 'relatively hard'. My response was to someone who trotted out the generic reply "don't manage a good team". Thats the standard reply from someone who has no idea of a particular flaw in the game (i.e. poor AI team-building logic) and someone who repeats it without even thinking, or knowing what they're talking about. Its effectively a cop out, and lets SI off the hook imho so this particular flaw never gets looked at by SI when developing their next game (or so it seems). Hopefully this year will be different SI?

At the end of the day the difficulty level will always be the abilty of the user. However some crucial aspects of the game do need looking at and have done for some time. AI clubs stagnate quickly and soon get left behind because of their poor AI team building logic. Thats it in a nutshell. BiggusD's reply is spot on.

I didn't say that there is not poor AI team-building logic. If you really want the game to be a challenge, then stay away from being the Chelsea's/ Man City's/ Barcelona's etc.

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I didn't say that there is not poor AI team-building logic. If you really want the game to be a challenge, then stay away from being the Chelsea's/ Man City's/ Barcelona's etc.

And the point being made is avoiding Chelsea, Man City and Barcelona is not a solution. Its just circumventing a fundamental flaw in the game. Its just delaying the inevitable for a few seasons longer. Its a cop out like I said.

If you really want the game to offer a proper challenge, play with an attribute hiding skin (but thats another story!).

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A B and C would do for me. But the rest, yes they're needed too.

I can't believe we're now in the 12th incarnation of this game? and A B and C still don't work properly, or worse yet, haven't even been implemented. :( AI managers and the things they do are just so random and nonsensical its pitiful.

Except they never seem to have a problem placing players on loan.:mad:

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i think FM07 was the last fm game close to perfrect, the match engine/ transfer system/ good long term playability and overall feel of the game was so good.

yet to see a FM game as good all round since.

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i think FM07 was the last fm game close to perfrect, the match engine/ transfer system/ good long term playability and overall feel of the game was so good.

yet to see a FM game as good all round since.

Thats because in FM07 players responded to your every instructions like robots

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The thing about FM07 was that it didn't have a big new feature that totally cocked up/unbalanced the game, so as a result it is remembered very fondly.

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oh so thats why the match engine and transfer system was good? because the players responded to every instructions like robots

i seem to remember having some unhappy players on fm07 slight concern at lack of first team football etttc

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The transfer system in FM 07 wasn't good, it was next to impossible to get rid of your unwanted players, AI had no squad building sense and it kept aging players on huge contracts in spite of their deteriorating abilities.

Also the match engine massively favoured tall players, it was preferable to play a centre back with 20/20 for jumping and heading up front rather than a proper striker with lower physical stats.

Furthermore the ability progression model allowed players to make huge jumps in attributes in a matter of months and allowed them to invariably reach their full potential at the age of 21.

Rose tinted glass and all that. There was really never a flawless, or even near flawless FM version in history, but I would say SI are moving in the right direction.

More on topic, I would be really happy if FM12 had two improvements: one, make the AI stop calling up the same players to international squads all the time (it's really dumb seeing players with 200+ caps) and make it call up players based on form rather than reputation only; two, make the AI look at performances when choosing transfer targets rather than at pure ability and reputation.

-

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Of course I'm happy, but... no speed optimizations? Like better utilization of multi-threading in day-to-day player processing? You know we are way past one core CPUs and match days (where multiple cores are really utilized) are very small part of the time the game uses to process data.

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Training training and again traing improvements to have a chance for smoe people like me to do micro management.

I hope this will be hudgly improved !!!

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We know the SI strikers can score so instead of videos of goals scored, they should perhaps put up videos of defenders making good intelligent tackles!

Tone = very much more clicking. Exciting for a while and after that it becomes a drag.

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Tone = very much more clicking. Exciting for a while and after that it becomes a drag.

I know were your coming from but if people want thinks improved like team talk/press conferences etc then this is probably only easy way to do it at moment :)

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Will Intelligent Interface solve the problem with playing the game on HD resolution laptops? In FM 2011 texts (for example player stats) were so small, that I had to decrease resolution to play the game.

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Will Intelligent Interface solve the problem with playing the game on HD resolution laptops? In FM 2011 texts (for example player stats) were so small, that I had to decrease resolution to play the game.

That's the big downside with having an HD resolution laptop :(

I'm in the same boat, I hope that one day FM will have a microsoft-like zoom function.

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Thanks SI, Miles and all the devs feel like family to me. I look forward to FM every year except this year I didn't really care about it at all... You see my wife bought me a PS3 and I was gonna buy FIFA12 until I saw how pathetic it is, bugs, issues online, a lot of leagues (including my beloved Greek) not being included... Anyway THANK YOU SI, continue the good work! look forward to the game once more.

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I wonder how far the Intelligent Interface layout can be pushed - a desktop 5760 pixels wide across 3 full HD screens could show an awful lot of information :D

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Loving the new 'manage anywhere, anytime' feature! As someone who regulary changes his mind on leagues after about a season, this has cemented my plans for one massive, long-term game next year!!! :)

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Re the AI team building. My one hope is that as a relatively unsexy and hidden change SI has chosen not to highlight it but that there has been a big revamp of AI team building and contract negotiation. The new negotiation features being the tip of the iceberg.

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Tone sounds like a pretty good addition.

Though I'm wary as in general the best route in FM is to stay calm and molly coddle all of your players and treat them like spoilt brats. No player responds better to being challenged or criticised. So I'll probably end up just sticking it on calm or neutral and ignoring it, too many extra clicks for not enough positive result.

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Will the demo and full release be available on Steam at the same time as everywhere else?

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Something Im missing Is being able to tell the board what kind of Future plans I Have besides just saying only seasonly based.( If Im playing to stay up in the league, win the league or be a mid-based team) I want to be able to say to the board "Hey, im looking to try to build up our youngster academy to try to swoop up most national players in my area and maybe in a few years time build up something stronger" And with that, having your whole team of scouts and coaches building on that. Just an idea.

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Yes, I love you!!! This upcoming release is a must-buy for me, because some of those new features will increase the fun a lot.

x) Adding new nations (and their leagues) to a currently running game is fantastic and will stretch the time I'll be able to motivate myself in a career game. I just hope that with the feature to add leagues to a game in progress we'll also be able to remove them (again), in order to speed up the process.

x) I'm equally tickled pink that you finally acknowledge high-screen resolutions. The last few years of FM have been a huge step back in that regard, because the customizability of many screens was very disappointing in FM11.

x) The expanded player-talk feature is another big plus, because there were too few options in FM11.

I have no idea how exactly you're going to implement these new features, but FM12 is a game I can't wait to play.

edit: forget about parts of what I said since I only read the email and not the starting post which contains more information and some answers to my questions.

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Manage - anywhere + any time

Been waiting for this for a long time - plus 1 from me :)

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I like the sound of the tone system. When telling a player off you can now be sure he will get the message if it is accompanied by a football boot to the head :D

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Manage Anywhere, Anytime – the ability to add or take away playable nations in your saved game as often as you want. Manage in that country at the start of the next season- meaning you don’t have to stay in the nations which are chosen by you to be playable at the start of your career.

Sounds a brilliant idea especially with people who pcs aint the greatest.

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Ok point taken. I didn't mean it to come across as 'relatively hard'. My response was to someone who trotted out the generic reply "don't manage a good team". Thats the standard reply from someone who has no idea of a particular flaw in the game (i.e. poor AI team-building logic) and someone who repeats it without even thinking, or knowing what they're talking about. Its effectively a cop out, and lets SI off the hook imho so this particular flaw never gets looked at by SI when developing their next game (or so it seems). Hopefully this year will be different SI?

At the end of the day the difficulty level will always be the abilty of the user. However some crucial aspects of the game do need looking at and have done for some time. AI clubs stagnate quickly and soon get left behind because of their poor AI team building logic. Thats it in a nutshell. BiggusD's reply is spot on.

I agree. Playing as a big club should be as much of a challenge, only a different sort of challenge. There's very little pressure as a manager of a top club. When people say 'don't manage a big club' I just roll my eyes, because managing the big clubs are alot of fun and some of us want to be in charge of who we support. We shouldn't have to do LLM just for a challenge.

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I really want to be excited about FM2012 but I just can't get there. The last two editions have become pitifully easy and I didn't see anything in the announcement to suggest FM12 will be any different.

It's a second season thing. The first season is a challenge but I all of a sudden become a footballing genius, and my players footballing gods, at the start of season two.

Any chance of anything to say 'we're working on difficulty'?

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Manage Anywhere, Anytime – the ability to add or take away playable nations in your saved game as often as you want. Manage in that country at the start of the next season- meaning you don’t have to stay in the nations which are chosen by you to be playable at the start of your career.

Sounds a brilliant idea especially with people who pcs aint the greatest.

EXACTLY! And yet some douchebags were quick to play it down, "cuz they are probably gonna be bugs". EPIC FAIL for them.

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Echoing everything. Ability to add/remove leagues sound top notch :D

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Mm, I have a question. If I have a team ie "Abba", and a young player, say "Mark" (18 years old), in a "regular game" he would probably improve his skills, but what would happen if I would add his team's championship after 2 years of game? I would have Mark with his 18 year old skills or there's a chance that they're improved? The same question it's possibile for players who are older, near the end of their careers, will they have worse skills? Or also, could they be already retired?

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To anyone at SI, has the AI team building been improved this year or the AI in general as it gets a tad easy in the future?

Realise its already been asked by a few but not paticularly politely in my opinion.

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To anyone at SI, has the AI team building been improved this year or the AI in general as it gets a tad easy in the future?

Realise its already been asked by a few but not paticularly politely in my opinion.

Asking politely doesn't work either, believe me plenty have in the past but there's never once been any comment on it. Which usually gives you your answer.

But ok then... just for the sake of keeping it an annual tradition.... I'd also like to know "Have you fixed AI team building in this years game, SI?... pretty please say its so!" :cool:

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Asking politely doesn't work either, believe me plenty have in the past but there's never once been any comment on it. Which usually gives you your answer.

But ok then... just for the sake of keeping it an annual tradition.... I'd also like to know "Have you fixed AI team building in this years game, SI?... pretty please say its so!" :cool:

they did say they wouldnt be talking about anything that wasnt mentioned. Doesnt stop people from asking though :p

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I would like to get it on Steam but there are always overpriced at the start :(

Maybe they might offer a good pre-purchase deal -(lives in hope)!!

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