*Official* Football Manager 2023 Early Access Beta Feedback Thread

[Just4Downloads]

Is this real!?!?

If so, no hope for improved stadium graphics any time soon…

[Johnny Ace]

16 minutes ago, luka_zg said:

Don't think I 've seen it mentioned but there is too many yellow cards given. also too much fouls per game. Seldom will I see the game without at least 3 or 4 bookings. Often there will be 5+ bookings. 

There does seem a lot. how it compares to RL, I don't know. Could be it's too many or it's been brought in line 

If it's a noticeable trend in your save, it may be worth reporting 

[rp1966]

14 minutes ago, Just4Downloads said:

Is this real!?!?

If so, no hope for improved stadium graphics any time soon…

Kudos for inventing the combined scarf/headrest I suppose - not sure it'll catch on any time soon.

 

(Looks like someone got the placement calculation wrong between scarf and body - should be a simple fix)

Edited October 26, 2022 by rp1966

[Jack Joyce]

5 hours ago, rp1966 said:

Just a reminder for those debating about changes in the way matches play out without the ME having been updated (I haven't played anything since the update, so don't know myself).

In FM21 beta the initial ME played consistently amazing attacking football.  A non-ME update was released and it stopped playing anything like as nicely.  At the time the reason given by SI was that prior to the change morale was not being fed into the ME match engine module - once it was taken into account players were no longer consistently playing to the best of their abilities all the time, hence the degraded performances post update.

The point of recounting that story is to remind people that the way the ME plays is not simply a function of ME code, but also data from outside the ME that is fed into the ME module as parameters for the match.  So a change in ME behaviour without an update to the ME itself is completely possible.

 

Just to clear things up:

1.  There were no Match Engine changes in the most recent update. It's not even possible for us to update the ME without changing the ME version number (which you can see via the game status screen). If we did, all your past matches would diverge which would be a major issue!
2. Having said that, what rp1966 said above is true, factors outside of the match can feed into the match in different ways. However, since the only change in the last update was to player development, I think it's very unlikely there's any difference. It's more likely that your team lost 1/2 games and lost confidence, and then you've struggled to turn it around for whatever reason.

[Pasonen]

2 minutes ago, Jack Joyce said:

Just to clear things up:

1.  There were no Match Engine changes in the most recent update. It's not even possible for us to update the ME without changing the ME version number (which you can see via the game status screen). If we did, all your past matches would diverge which would be a major issue!
2. Having said that, what rp1966 said above is true, factors outside of the match can feed into the match in different ways. However, since the only change in the last update was to player development, I think it's very unlikely there's any difference. It's more likely that your team lost 1/2 games and lost confidence, and then you've struggled to turn it around for whatever reason.

Oh come on! I was already celebrating you have ruined someone's tactic! Bring on the challenge.

[andu1]

I've noticed that the AM's in a 3-4-2-1/5-2-2-1 stay too close to each other in both possession and out possession even if you put stay wider on them.

Also noticeable on AI managers who use this formation. It's a bit underpowered because of this and i see there are many AI managers who have it set as pref formation.

 

[KamyKaze]

2 hours ago, KamyKaze said:

I have my training set up by him, but I'm changing it to have a lot of rest days in the weeks with 2 matches. That's the only way the team survived until the WC break, and they were pretty bad at the last matches.

EDIT:

on my inbox when the break started:

Just as I post this Akanji get's a 7 months injury

 

And got scared when Haaland got an injury on the only friendly after world cup pause. Thankfully only 3 days

[The 433 Man(ual)]

1 hour ago, andu1 said:

I've noticed that the AM's in a 3-4-2-1/5-2-2-1 stay too close to each other in both possession and out possession even if you put stay wider on them.

Also noticeable on AI managers who use this formation. It's a bit underpowered because of this and i see there are many AI managers who have it set as pref formation.

 

Yeah, i've posted another bug thread about this again this year. Too bad they havent fixed this yet when they already implemented wide defenders last year. 3-4-2-1 formations and variations of those are hard to get right  this year and thats really sad.

 

[HUNT3R]

3 hours ago, kiingallen said:

Must be all in my head then. It wasn’t my tactics pre update, but now it is? We’ve just turned into a bad team overnight (literally). Or the whole league have now sussed me out, despite having 2 different trained tactics which were largely successful.

I don’t want to sound like I’m just complaining here. I’m very impressed with the ME (generally). The potential this year is bigger than ever imo. 
It’s so far been much more immersive already than ever. But to slump that drastically and suddenly is very strange. 

Well that’s my feedback, post previous update. 
 

Have a good day. 

You posted a cropped screenshot that hid a possibly important bit of info - when did this turn of form happen? Usually when I see a big swing in form like that, it's when you pass the midway point of the season.

[Teep]

@kiingallen someone on discord said that after numerous reloads, he thinks the update reset the winning moral and that having a team meeting right after the update was a good way to keep the good streak. Might be what happened to you

[bluehefner]

So something that has always bugged me is how the game implements staff limits, for a number of years now Man Utd have around 30 odd scouts, but the limit set by the club is around half that, meaning if i sack anyone i can't replace them, likewise in this years game they are allowed 1 assistant manager but IRL they have 2 (Steve McClaren & Mitchell van der Gaag) so they are over the limit in game, now if one of them is a glorified coach that ETH works closer with then call either one that in the game, or give me a 2 assistant limit, either way it's wrong.

I know it's typically not normal to have two assistants, so it's not like i need that limit, but it just looks a bit silly when the board say i can 1 but they've clearly allowed 2, it's small details like this that can be immersion breaking, why not just set the limit to the minimum amount of current staff, it costs nothing just to be accurate.

Unless there's some other reason i'm overlooking.

Edited October 26, 2022 by bluehefner
Grammar

[kiingallen]

13 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

You posted a cropped screenshot that hid a possibly important bit of info - when did this turn of form happen? Usually when I see a big swing in form like that, it's when you pass the midway point of the season.

Smack bang 1st March. 
last 15 games of the season - W4-D1-L10

6 defeats in a row post update. All within the same month. 
 

How it was going…

how it ended 🥲

 

it is what it is. Couldn’t do anything to change it around.

[diddydaddydoddy]

29 minutes ago, bluehefner said:

So something that has always bugged me is how the game implements staff limits, for a number of years now Man Utd have around 30 odd scouts, but the limit set by the club is around half that, meaning if i sack anyone i can't replace them, likewise in this years game they are allowed 1 assistant manager but IRL they have 2 (Steve McClaren & Mitchell van der Gaag) so they are over the limit in game, now if one of them is a glorified coach that ETH works closer with then call either one that in the game, or give me a 2 assistant limit, either way it's wrong.

I know it's typically not normal to have two assistants, so it's not like i need that limit, but it just looks a bit silly when the board say i can 1 but they've clearly allowed 2, it's small details like this that can be immersion breaking, why not just set the limit to the minimum amount of current staff, it costs nothing just to be accurate.

Unless there's some other reason i'm overlooking.

Your post will be lost here. I know the following thread exists, please add your points there please.

 

Edited October 26, 2022 by diddydaddydoddy

[SurferJames]

This game needs a lot of work, the new engine for me makes the players act strangely. I have been playing FM since its inception and this one the defenders lose possession a lot, the goalkeeper acts very strange and gives a lot of goals away.  There doesn't feel any balance in the gameplay. It feels very off to me, and the results aren't balanced at all. 

[DarJ]

2 minutes ago, SurferJames said:

This game needs a lot of work, the new engine for me makes the players act strangely. I have been playing FM since its inception and this one the defenders lose possession a lot, the goalkeeper acts very strange and gives a lot of goals away.  There doesn't feel any balance in the gameplay. It feels very off to me, and the results aren't balanced at all. 

this is a serious question I have for people that think that players lose the ball too often. Would you have thought the same if the game has always been like this or do you think like this because you are used to how it used to be?

Sometimes I think people confuse the two

[SurferJames]

6 minutes ago, DarJ said:

this is a serious question I have for people that think that players lose the ball too often. Would you have thought the same if the game has always been like this or do you think like this because you are used to how it used to be?

Sometimes I think people confuse the two

I understand losing the ball should be a thing in football manager and happens a lot in real life however it's the manner of how it happens in the game, it just looks and feels weird, the movement is off for me. The goalkeeper makes it far too easy to concede goals and the results are extremely erratic. 

Edited October 26, 2022 by SurferJames

[zzkeg27]

On 2022. 10. 25. at 오후 9시 55분, Jack Joyce said:

Yes, AI managers have less formations available for selection through the researchers, and this is absolutely intentional.

Less formations doesn't necessarily mean less tactical diversity though, as we've greatly improved the way AI managers choose their roles and team instructions.

Bielsa has gone on record as saying there's only 10 formations in football. and any system you play is some variation of these 10 formations. We still have more than that!
 

"Tactical systems are not of extreme importance, as the positions are not fixed, and player's roles will change within match context."

I think 2DM is right even if it is 4-4-2 formation, but why use 2CM instead of 2DM?

Edited October 26, 2022 by zzkeg27

[Harrymcintyre]

I think for me, the common way to play previous FMs was one of high intensity and quite attacking to get the best results. I find that kinda play maybe puts too much pressure on defenses more now. Since I’ve changed to more patient, slower, less intense focused football style, the defenders seem to make less mistakes for me.
I love the new ME, the more and more I tinker with things. I think it’s working very well, the play feels more realistic and there feels like there’s more options on how you can approach games, and I’m hopeful to see how it is on actual release day. 

[Jack Joyce]

2 minutes ago, zzkeg27 said:

I think 2DM is right even if it is 4-4-2 formation, but why use 2CM instead of 2DM?

For the most part I agree with you, and we did add 424 (with DMs) as a selectable formation for AI managers, as well as 4222DM.

But we decided to keep 442 flat as an option since 442 is such a diverse + flexible system, that we were wary of removing that one entirely. That may change in the future but for now it remains.

[Crusho79bv]

Players still do not develop like they did in FM22, even after the small patch

You can see in the video below, these are wonderkids or kids with potential after 5 years of play

It`s from a save started from zero after the patch, the year is 2027

The physical and mental are still developing much better than technical attributes

 

 

Edited October 26, 2022 by Crusho79bv

[trevjim]

Well, for the first time ever I've refunded it on steam. It really does feel like there has been so little improvements. CL/EL license is nice but it doesn't really add anything. Squad planner. Some people might use it I guess but to me it's a conveluted mess and I just felt like it would be too time consuming to use when during the course of the seasons players come and go anyway making the planning redundant. One glance at squad depth was all I ever needed.

Manager timeline? What's the point? Seriously what a pointless "feature"

The ME was pretty poor to be honest. Improved in some ways and worse in others. Top teams are conceding so many goals. Defenders ball watching balls of the top. I know it's beta and it will probably improve but not drastically.

 

I feel really let down. All the bits that we are crying out for are still untouched (set pieces, player and press interactions, realistic ME, Graphics, AI squad building and Tactics)

I also hate the incremental facilities upgrades. Why do I have to go from poor to adequate to good to top to state of the art. Why, if I have the money and stature, can't I go and build the top standard straight away. Stadium upgrades too. Stop closing my stand for 6 months to build 200 seats just because my club rep got a small boost. Again, areas that have been well vocalised by the fans but always ignored.

 

I have played every version since CM98 and this is the first time I won't be buying. Really wanted to like it but felt like I was playing the same game with the same tedious and frusting issues and to be honest I've not been enjoying them as much for 5 or so years.

 

So many of the features of recent years I just send the ass man or request to inbox. I feel SI needs a new direction as the franchise is getting really stale.

 

I also have no issues with bugs in the beta because....beta, but the player progression bug and balls of the top issue's, seriously how did they pass testing? 

 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2022 by trevjim

[andu1]

12 minutes ago, Jack Joyce said:

For the most part I agree with you, and we did add 424 (with DMs) as a selectable formation for AI managers, as well as 4222DM.

But we decided to keep 442 flat as an option since 442 is such a diverse + flexible system, that we were wary of removing that one entirely. That may change in the future but for now it remains.

I see the AI managers are more flexible in changing pref formation when they get a new job.. I see 4-3-3, 5-2-3, 5-3-2. An improvement compared to FM 22 when they were biased to 4-2-3-1 with 2 CM's

[metal_guitarist]

20 minutes ago, trevjim said:

I also hate the incremental facilities upgrades. Why do I have to go from poor to adequate to good to top to state of the art. Why, if I have the money and stature, can't I go and build the top standard straight away. Stadium upgrades too. Stop closing my stand for 6 months to build 200 seats just because my club rep got a small boost. Again, areas that have been well vocalised by the fans but always ignored.

 

 

 

That would be a really good feature request if you haven't done so already

[GOODNAME]

Question - in the 2nd season the champions league is with new format (super league) ?

[2feet]

5 minutes ago, metal_guitarist said:

That would be a really good feature request if you haven't done so already

I think the reason is that when you upgrade training facilities it can enable better players to come to your club (some players wont come if the facilities are too low, I think?)

So when you upgrade training facilities it sort of takes you to the next level of the game. Suddenly you can get better players in your team. It's like a 'power-up'.

I think they want to slow down the pace at which your club can grow to prevent clubs magically suddenly being able to attract big name players to their small wage structure club. It would be like Huddersfield signing Ronaldo.

[trevjim]

14 minutes ago, metal_guitarist said:

That would be a really good feature request if you haven't done so already

Done it every year for about 6 years now lol

[91427]

Disappointed that you can no longer get rid of the in-game ads afaik. In 2D since you can see them all at once they essentially become flashing banner ads surrounding the pitch. I don't want this in something I paid £40 for

[zzkeg27]

1 hour ago, Jack Joyce said:

For the most part I agree with you, and we did add 424 (with DMs) as a selectable formation for AI managers, as well as 4222DM.

But we decided to keep 442 flat as an option since 442 is such a diverse + flexible system, that we were wary of removing that one entirely. That may change in the future but for now it remains.

Why do you use 2DM instead of 2CM for 523 formation as shown in the picture?

Edited October 26, 2022 by zzkeg27

[TokyoBlade]

7 minutes ago, GOODNAME said:

Question - in the 2nd season the champions league is with new format (super league) ?

Not in the second season, but from the 24/25 season (which is when it's coming into effect IRL). Threw me off when it happened because I forgot about the upcoming change in format, lol.

[albertluque]

This probably more a feature request and the example is me advertising for the job but why can't I apply for an u18/u21 job indepedent of managing the first team?!?!?!

 

Makes no sense that we can't start a career applying for u18 jobs, build up your working with youngsters attribute which is then favourable when applying for jobs where clubs want you to buy players under the age of 23 or developing their own players. A small addition that adds realism.

 

[KillYourIdols]

Before I post this, would you co sidereal this a bug or am I using it wrong?

When I set up a scout priority, there is a tab for 'Loan' however, it always gives me either existing players or players who are very much NOT available for Loan I.e First team players in same or similar Leagues. Is this right? Are the reports based on my scouts abilities? 

[Jack Joyce]

21 minutes ago, zzkeg27 said:

Why do you use 2DM instead of 2CM for 523 formation as shown in the picture?

The central midfield players in a 523 system need to act as a pivot to allow for the wingbacks to venture in to attacking areas.

e.g.:

• Neves and Moutinho
• Jorginho and Kovacic
• Hojbjerg and Bentancur

In these double pivot partnerships, you may see that one of them has more of a license to roam forward, through the use of a roaming playmaker or segundo volante role (which is by all means just a box-to-box midfielder that starts at DM). However, they are a double pivot so are fundamentally different to playing at CM. There's players who can play at CM that you wouldn't expect or want to play at the base of a 523, because of the increased defensive and positional responsibilities involved.

 

[craiigman]

Question about Man UFC.. 

 

Why is the abbreviation MUFTC? Why is the T between the F and C? I can see why MUFC cant be there, but why a random T like that?

 

[albertluque]

It would be cool if you could set midfielders to have a dual role. So if I am playing two CM's that I could set both to have both roles, so that if one goes and does one thing, the other then assumes the role left behind if that makes sense?

[albertluque]

12 minutes ago, albertluque said:

This probably more a feature request and the example is me advertising for the job but why can't I apply for an u18/u21 job indepedent of managing the first team?!?!?!

 

Makes no sense that we can't start a career applying for u18 jobs, build up your working with youngsters attribute which is then favourable when applying for jobs where clubs want you to buy players under the age of 23 or developing their own players. A small addition that adds realism.

 

Just seen Emma Hayes favourite for the Crawley job. COOL.

[Teep]

1 hour ago, Crusho79bv said:

Players still do not develop like they did in FM22, even after the small patch

You can see in the video below, these are wonderkids or kids with potential after 5 years of play

It`s from a save started from zero after the patch, the year is 2027

The physical and mental are still developing much better than technical attributes

 

 

Doctor Benjy tweeted 1h ago that he ran a test up to 2035 and that it was fixed.
Guess we'll have to wait until LeoFM gets the time to do a new full analysis to know what's what

[Slippy_]

1 hour ago, Crusho79bv said:

Players still do not develop like they did in FM22, even after the small patch

You can see in the video below, these are wonderkids or kids with potential after 5 years of play

It`s from a save started from zero after the patch, the year is 2027

The physical and mental are still developing much better than technical attributes

 

 

How do we know this was done after patch? Are you the uploader of the video? I couldnt see any indication that it was pre/after patch

[Crusho79bv]

1 hour ago, Slippy_ said:

How do we know this was done after patch? Are you the uploader of the video? I couldnt see any indication that it was pre/after patch

Yeah....I`m just doing it for the fun of it, just to be against the wave...because I`m 

....FFS

[Slippy_]

10 minutes ago, Crusho79bv said:

Yeah....I`m just doing it for the fun of it, just to be against the wave...because I`m 

....FFS

I just asked if you posted the video. If you havent posted the video how do you know if it was based on pre/post patch?

It DOES go agaisnt what other sources have said but if you have info that its still not working then please send it over to SI to investigate further.

[frog-kvfb]

1 hour ago, craiigman said:

Question about Man UFC.. 

 

Why is the abbreviation MUFTC? Why is the T between the F and C? I can see why MUFC cant be there, but why a random T like that?

 

Is it possible man utd have a copyright etc on mufc so si had to mix it up a bit due to licensing

[Crusho79bv]

1 hour ago, Slippy_ said:

I just asked if you posted the video. If you havent posted the video how do you know if it was based on pre/post patch?

It DOES go agaisnt what other sources have said but if you have info that its still not working then please send it over to SI to investigate further.

There you go mate, that`s the saved game in 2027 with all the players from the video

You can check the version of the game after you upload it

https://www.mediafire.com/file/l4ekntn0121yre8/England+2027.fm/file

[Johnny Ace]

1 hour ago, albertluque said:

It would be cool if you could set midfielders to have a dual role. So if I am playing two CM's that I could set both to have both roles, so that if one goes and does one thing, the other then assumes the role left behind if that makes sense?

Playing two DMs or CMs on Support do this, at least they did the last time I played a 4-4-2

If the one goes, the other won't and will hang back, they both won't move forward together unless safe to do so  

[dannyfc]

Also - is it fair to say mental and physical attributes should be more malleable and develop quicker than technical attributes? 

Players rarely drastically improve their technique once they've become professionals. Wenger famously mentioned 14 years as the cut-off for this. Training will sharpen those skills, but has any adult ever improved their first touch to a significant degree? Are there any examples of players lacking dribbling ability that suddenly became elite? I don't think so - all the best have already peaked by their teens in those areas. It's just consistency that improves. 

In contrast, from 16 to 21 a player can transform themselves physically through hardwork and we should expect to see big increases in strength and jumping reach. Again, it should plateau very quickly after that but should still allow some degree of change if training intensity is focused on it. Less so for pace, but maybe strength and balance can be developed into the late 20s.  

Obviously mentally a player will continue to improve throughout their career, and probably peak well into their 30s if they make it that far. 

I'm not saying there isn't a bug as clearly SI have recognised and addressed that - but equally from a realism perspective I don't think huge swings in technical ability should be expected. 

[zzkeg27]

1 hour ago, Jack Joyce said:

The central midfield players in a 523 system need to act as a pivot to allow for the wingbacks to venture in to attacking areas.

e.g.:

• Neves and Moutinho
• Jorginho and Kovacic
• Hojbjerg and Bentancur

In these double pivot partnerships, you may see that one of them has more of a license to roam forward, through the use of a roaming playmaker or segundo volante role (which is by all means just a box-to-box midfielder that starts at DM). However, they are a double pivot so are fundamentally different to playing at CM. There's players who can play at CM that you wouldn't expect or want to play at the base of a 523, because of the increased defensive and positional responsibilities involved.

 

The roles assigned to the two midfielders aren't Segundo Volante or Roaming Playmaker. Aren't both midfielders staying too far behind?

Edited October 26, 2022 by zzkeg27

[RandomGuy.]

10 hours ago, Lempicka said:

I usually find going back to basics for a few games helps. Try to pick players who have strongest moral/form, and go back to a default 4-4-2. Once you start picking up the points again - you can revert back to your own tactic.

Ive tried that, and still the same. I just get absolutely no luck and can never turn it around. 

Whole new side with great morale and the fixture list gives me Rangers away. More than match them for 70 minutes, two disallowed goals the text says is debateable, then Rangers score from 25 yards and get another through another debateable penalty. I then concede a 3rd late on. Morale demolished instantly.

And the whole cycle of a squad with no morale being unable to win a game will begin all over for me.

[Johnny Ace]

1 minute ago, zzkeg27 said:

The roles assigned to the two midfielders are not Segundo Volante or Roaming Playmaker. Aren't both midfielders staying too far behind?

If you're talking about the defaults, you can change those and so can the AI 

[kiingallen]

Striker came to me saying he would like a transfer because the club got relegated and wants to be playing at a higher level, I accepted a satisfactory bid from a team within the same league (realised after), and he joined. Not sure if this is a bug or not. 

[dieguitoch]

il y a 29 minutes, dannyfc a dit :

Also - is it fair to say mental and physical attributes should be more malleable and develop quicker than technical attributes? 

Players rarely drastically improve their technique once they've become professionals. Wenger famously mentioned 14 years as the cut-off for this. Training will sharpen those skills, but has any adult ever improved their first touch to a significant degree? Are there any examples of players lacking dribbling ability that suddenly became elite? I don't think so - all the best have already peaked by their teens in those areas. It's just consistency that improves. 

In contrast, from 16 to 21 a player can transform themselves physically through hardwork and we should expect to see big increases in strength and jumping reach. Again, it should plateau very quickly after that but should still allow some degree of change if training intensity is focused on it. Less so for pace, but maybe strength and balance can be developed into the late 20s.  

Obviously mentally a player will continue to improve throughout their career, and probably peak well into their 30s if they make it that far. 

I'm not saying there isn't a bug as clearly SI have recognised and addressed that - but equally from a realism perspective I don't think huge swings in technical ability should be expected. 

Really good point here !  It would also make the use of experienced players a lot more important !

[styluz05]

37 minutes ago, trevjim said:

Well, for the first time ever I've refunded it on steam. It really does feel like there has been so little improvements. CL/EL license is nice but it doesn't really add anything. Squad planner. Some people might use it I guess but to me it's a conveluted mess and I just felt like it would be too time consuming to use when during the course of the seasons players come and go anyway making the planning redundant. One glance at squad depth was all I ever needed.

Manager timeline? What's the point? Seriously what a pointless "feature"

The ME was pretty poor to be honest. Improved in some ways and worse in others. Top teams are conceding so many goals. Defenders ball watching balls of the top. I know it's beta and it will probably improve but not drastically.

 

I feel really let down. All the bits that we are crying out for are still untouched (set pieces, player and press interactions, realistic ME, Graphics, AI squad building and Tactics)

I also hate the incremental facilities upgrades. Why do I have to go from poor to adequate to good to top to state of the art. Why, if I have the money and stature, can't I go and build the top standard straight away. Stadium upgrades too. Stop closing my stand for 6 months to build 200 seats just because my club rep got a small boost. Again, areas that have been well vocalised by the fans but always ignored.

 

I have played every version since CM98 and this is the first time I won't be buying. Really wanted to like it but felt like I was playing the same game with the same tedious and frusting issues and to be honest I've not been enjoying them as much for 5 or so years.

 

So many of the features of recent years I just send the ass man or request to inbox. I feel SI needs a new direction as the franchise is getting really stale.

 

I also have no issues with bugs in the beta because....beta, but the player progression bug and balls of the top issue's, seriously how did they pass testing? 

 

 

 

Don't blame you, I've just done the same thing. Its basically FM22.5 with "new features" simply old features but refaced.  

[Lempicka]

Are we no longer able to praise or criticise training performance? In FM22 you could via this screen.