Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread

[Novem9]

12 минут назад, Keyzer Soze сказал:

i don't remember the last FM version where it took so long for SI to deliver a update to fix ME issues

fm19, waited update from December for March, not solved fully imo

[Keyzer Soze]

1 minute ago, saiyaman said:

I'm sorry I don't agree with your post at all.

In case you haven't noticed, I haven't asked them for a time. Just a hint of whether they are planning to change their update process to release one before the major patch.

I have never subscribed to the "unplayable" part but you cannot undermine the money which people are putting into SI just because you have a different opinion. You aren't paying out of your pocket for their copies. They have every right to call it "unplayable" or "broken" as long as Mods allow them.

I know you didn't asked for a time date. But you are asking if they will release a patch before march uptade. How can they know that? I'm sure they would want to release it today if itwas possible.

They are testing the ME, untill they are happy with the outcome, they will keep testing it. It could be that they will only be happy in late february...  or early march (in time for the major update), or you could get major update and later on another ME uptade. Who knows? At this point, perhaps even SI don't know, because it all depends how the testing goes.

I really don't understand why is so difficult to understand why they don't give a time date.

[saiyaman]

4 minutes ago, Keyzer Soze said:

I know you didn't asked for a time date. But you are asking if they will release a patch before march uptade. How can they know that? I'm sure they would want to release it today if itwas possible.

They are testing the ME, untill they are happy with the outcome, they will keep testing it. It could be that they will only be happy in late february...  or early march (in time for the major update), or you could get major update and later on another ME uptade. Who knows? At this point, perhaps even SI don't know, because it all depends how the testing goes.

I really don't understand why is so difficult to understand why they don't give a time date.

If anyone knows whether they  want to release a update before march, it's SI. What do you mean how can they know that? It's their software. They know what they're going to do. They don't have an obligation to share anything but we can request them and see if they consider.

Why is it so difficult for you to understand that I never talked about "time date". Where is this coming from?

 

Edited February 4, 2020 by saiyaman

[Keyzer Soze]

1 minute ago, Novem9 said:

fm19, waited update from December for March, not solved fully imo

I've played FM19 since release day, and to be honest never think it had big issued that weren't fixed. A bit to much overpower in central play, and long shots, but apart from that, no big issues.

The same, imo, with this ME (i've not tested the beta ME that they released). Apart from the amount of ccc that are created with long through balls from the defenders, i don't see anything that leads me to stay that i can't play the game.

But this is something that it's always subjective. Some people think that the ME is good, others think that is unplayable.

[renato.]

Em 24/01/2020 em 16:50, wattzy disse:

My first chance playing tonight since the beta was released. So far all I'm seeing is goals from wide set pieces, or from defenders heading the ball straight to a striker in the box. Literally have no hope that this match engine will ever be anything but one to look back on in horror.

This. Will try to report as I did to do my part and I wanna wait for the last update in a few days as a fan full of hope. But I'm already thinking about what old FM version will be my "new" game until FM21.

[Keyzer Soze]

Just now, saiyaman said:

If anyone knows whether want to release a update before march, it's SI. What do you mean how can they know that? It's their software. They know what they're going to do. They don't have an obligation to share anything but we can request them and see if they consider.

Why is it so difficult for you to understand that I never talked about "time date". Where is this coming from?

 

Are you serious? Or joking....

When you ask someone "will you deliver a ME fixe before the major march uptade?" isn't that trying to define a time date?

[Novem9]

Только что, Keyzer Soze сказал:

Are you serious? Or joking....

When you ask someone "will you deliver a ME fixe before the major march uptade?" isn't that trying to define a time date?

NO.

Its about will they release ME ASAP or will wait for transfer update even if ME patch already done.

[saiyaman]

Just now, Keyzer Soze said:

Are you serious? Or joking....

When you ask someone "will you deliver a ME fixe before the major march uptade?" isn't that trying to define a time date?

That's not on me. I haven't set the "time date" as March. That's SI following their software lifecycle.

I'm asking if they plan to release an update before their last patch. If SI wants they can change their final patch to be April or February or December. It's their wish.

So no I'm not defining this "time date". I'm asking if they plan to adjust their lifecycle.

[Keyzer Soze]

Just now, Novem9 said:

NO.

Its about will they release ME ASAP or will wait for transfer update even if ME patch already done.

Oh, no....

They will keep it for themselves, and have a laugh of all the forum users that complain about the game. 

Of course they will release it as soon it's done.

[andu1]

Tbh the winter update is not that far anyway. If we managed to survive with this ME for almost 3 months i don't see why we cant hold one for just one more.

[HUNT3R]

Neil has already made the stance clear. No more public beta updates and no news (yet), like when there will be one, about updates. We need to be patient until SI is in a position to reveal more.

[Novem9]

3 минуты назад, Keyzer Soze сказал:

Oh, no....

They will keep it for themselves, and have a laugh of all the forum users that complain about the game. 

Of course they will release it as soon it's done.

You just never hear about technical requirements (techical project I mean) or how software is developing right?
Your sarcasm is so inappropriate there that I am almost ashamed of you

Edited February 4, 2020 by Novem9

[saiyaman]

Just now, HUNT3R said:

Neil has already made the stance clear. No more public beta updates and no news (yet) about updates. We need to be patient until SI is in a position to reveal more.

To be fair I wasn't asking about the public beta.

Just whether they're planning to give an update before the usual major update. Like I said to another poster, if it takes SI more time to fix issues I do not mind at all. In fact if they want to push their major update further down the road and take their time I have absolutely no issues.

Just want a confirmation if they want to go with the major update or give us something before.

[HUNT3R]

1 minute ago, saiyaman said:

To be fair I wasn't asking about the public beta.

Just whether they're planning to give an update before the usual major update. Like I said to another poster, if it takes SI more time to fix issues I do not mind at all. In fact if they want to push their major update further down the road and take their time I have absolutely no issues.

Just want a confirmation if they want to go with the major update or give us something before.

That was in the second part of my sentence. They're not in a position to give us more news about updates. We know there will be a .3 update, but that's it for now.

[saiyaman]

Just now, HUNT3R said:

That was in the second part of my sentence. They're not in a position to give us more news about updates. We know there will be a .3 update, but that's it for now.

I agree which is why I'm requesting SI to give us information not about the patch itself but whether they even plan on releasing something before the major patch.

I'm requesting not demanding. It's purely up to SI to decide whether whatever I ask is worth their time.

[Keyzer Soze]

10 minutes ago, Novem9 said:

You just never hear about technical requirements (techical project I mean) or how software is developing right?
Your sarcasm is so inappropriate there that I am almost ashamed of you

Sorry about the sarcasm. You were right. It was inappropriate. 

But i really don't understand why anyone would think that SI would delay the release of the new ME, if they were already happy with it.

But you were right, i don't understand anything about software developing. But for a pure commercial perspective,it would be a terrible choice.

Edited February 4, 2020 by Keyzer Soze

[Novem9]

Только что, Keyzer Soze сказал:

Sorry about the sarcasm. It was inappropriate.

But i really don't understand why anyone would think that SI would delay the release of the new ME, if they were already happy with it.

But you were right, i don't understand anything about software developing. But for a pure commercial perspective,it would be a terrible choice.

OK let's be a friendship and productive  this is just how it works. I can't say for ALL companies for sure. It could be in way when developer wait for release all cases in one big patch without separate releases. Its simpler, more stable, etc.
You said that you dont have a big issues with current ME. So this ME patch has a status of update, no hotfix. If hotfix for sure it will be release asap, but update is not because they know about big patch 20.3

This is a very simplified description from me, but that's why it was question not about dates, but about a complete patch ME+Other Things+Transfers or ME patch ASAP if it will be an opportunity.
For next messages (if they will) lets go DM and avoid moderators anger  

[Keyzer Soze]

6 minutes ago, Novem9 said:

OK let's be a friendship and productive  this is just how it works. I can't say for ALL companies for sure. It could be in way when developer wait for release all cases in one big patch without separate releases. Its simpler, more stable, etc.
You said that you dont have a big issues with current ME. So this ME patch has a status of update, no hotfix. If hotfix for sure it will be release asap, but update is not because they know about big patch 20.3

This is a very simplified description from me, but that's why it was question not about dates, but about a complete patch ME+Other Things+Transfers or ME patch ASAP if it will be an opportunity.
For next messages (if they will) lets go DM and avoid moderators anger  

I think, but i could be wrong, since FM go on steam that changed the way they release their updates.

Untill then, when the updates were downloads files that SI would upload in their website, you would usually get 3 uptades per game.

But with steam, and i remember SI staff saying that at the time, one of the advanges were that they could release, quickly, hotfixes, and not delay as much as they would before.

The thing with the ME, as the mods already said sometimes, it that it's different to fix a issue with the ME when compare with fixing something let's say in some league rule. In one case (the league rule issue) is something objetive and usually without side effects, with the ME it's the opposite. And thats why it usually takes long.... and they cannot say when they'll get it right.... or even if they get it right.

[Sanel]

26 minutes ago, Keyzer Soze said:

But for a pure commercial perspective,it would be a terrible choice.

Releasing FM20 in a bad state after FM19 is also a terrible choice, it's actually so terrible that I won't pre-order FM 21. 

[grade]

4 hours ago, prot651 said:

Isnt this the reason they release the Touch versions as well . less involved ….. If Touch had an editor it would be all over for the full game

I don't see that happening, as SI stated before why there is not editor.

Also, unfortunately, many people that play full FM, think that FMT is dumb down version, so I think is unlikely that adding an editor to FMT, will all over for the full game.

Even if it happens, it only shows, that perhaps SI had focus on the wrong stuff and they would adapt to the new reality.

[dangngo6]

Just see how terrible warcraft 3 reforge is. All gaming company are now doing the same thing, Ea, bethesda, activison blizzard, 2k...all they care is money and they put zero effort in develop their game. Year after year its getting worse. Nba 2k20, fifa 20, madden 20, wwe 20 all are garbage . Im smelling something like that in SI now with this year release. I dont want my favorite series become an unplayable piece of crap. Please make up your mind and do right thing SI

[diLLa88]

Playing FM16 for a bit today was a breath of fresh air compared to FM20. It's a 100% more enjoyable without all the fancy pointless additions and a decently functioning ME.

 

[craigcwwe]

5 minutes ago, diLLa88 said:

Playing FM16 for a bit today was a breath of fresh air compared to FM20. It's a 100% more enjoyable without all the fancy pointless additions and a decently functioning ME.

 

What's old is new again.  

Edited February 4, 2020 by craigcwwe

[Nick_CB]

17 minutos atrás, diLLa88 disse:

Hoje, tocar um pouco de FM16 foi uma lufada de ar fresco em comparação com o FM20. É 100% mais agradável sem todas as adições inúteis extravagantes e um ME decentemente funcionando.

 

FM16 was as bad as the 19 and 20

[omar778]

still think 1vs1 with the beta version is still bad my team is getting the equal amount of shots on target sometimes more and my players are still missing.

this is really frustrating nothing wrong with losing, but not like this. 

[Marko1989]

48 minutes ago, diLLa88 said:

Playing FM16 for a bit today was a breath of fresh air compared to FM20. It's a 100% more enjoyable without all the fancy pointless additions and a decently functioning ME.

 

I went back to FM 2015. 

I'm enjoying in it much more than newer versions.

I've started creating wonderkids in editor from newer versions  into FM 2015 so I can play it longer because for me FM is on completely wrong path, they are implementing some features nobody wants, and they are not improving match engine which is worse every year.

[Travis Bickle]

13 hours ago, Jimmious7 said:

 

• Morale is EXTREMELY important. So much that with a good team atmosphere, my team plays exactly how I'd wish but with 2-3 grumpy players causing issues the team can really collapse. You start seeing them doing weird stuff, random mistakes, not covering space so well etc etc. I did the mistake to transfer in  a lot of players in my second season and that caused issues in the background as some were playing less than they expected etc... That seriously spiraled out of control. We were losing almost no matter what.

 

It's been like this on FM for at least two years now, maybe one or two more. 

Felt like years ago, maybe FM12 and before, what was most important was signing the best players. If you had good players in every position, you were guaranteed the win regardless of your tactics. I remember trying all kinds of tactics without thinking much, 3-4-3's, 4-2-2-2 Brazilian Box etc and just knowing I could win because my players were good. 

After that, it felt like tactics took over. You could have a grumpy squad, less than adequate players but if you got your tactics right and were helped with one or two ME exploits, you could win everything. Especially around FM15-16, I've achieved heights with rubbish players just on the basis I found the right tactical combination and maybe an exploit or two and that was it. 

However, I definitely feel in the last couple of editions, morale is what matters more than anything. Bad players and mediocre tactics can be overcome if you keep everyone happy. The issue there is, morale is so random. I've made this point here at least three or four times. Especially if you have a low-rep journeyman manager like me, your players will lose trust in you for absolutely no reason, even if you are winning every game. Even still, players get upset over the stupidest things even as an experienced manager with attributes. 

In this regard I wish SI would tone down the impact of morale by 20% or so, and maybe make interactions with your players more consistent. Feels like a lottery when a player comes to me with a concern (not playing enough, wanting a new contract) as to how they will react depending on what I click. 

I really wish the quality of players mattered a lot more. Just feels like morale and tactics have way more power over the actual attributes of your players. 

[Nick_CB]

39 minutos atrás, Marko1989 disse:

Voltei à FM 2015. 

Estou gostando muito mais do que versões mais recentes.

Comecei a criar wonderkids no editor a partir de versões mais recentes para o FM 2015, para que eu possa reproduzi-lo por mais tempo, porque para mim o FM está no caminho completamente errado, eles estão implementando alguns recursos que ninguém quer e não estão melhorando o mecanismo de correspondência que é pior a cada ano .

Exactly, they make changes that the community doesn't give a damn about

[LG2694]

Has anyone else noticed how broken finishing seems to be? I've become so frustrated with finishing on this game that I've started playing at Barcelona to properly check if it's finishing or just part of playing using less talented players. Suarez and Griezmann are missing every single one on one, Messi's shots always seem to be hit at a snail's pace straight at the keeper. It's not as though my tactics don't create chances or my players are being forced to take bad shots, I really don't understand what's wrong this year

[JordanMilly]

1 hour ago, Nick_CB said:

Exactly, they make changes that the community doesn't give a damn about

Which features are you talking about? I ask because there haven't, for me personally (and I imagine a lot of other people, given a lot of people posting in this thread have indicated they think the game is great, outside of the ME), been features that have been entirely useless or that I've thought were a waste of time added in the last couple of FM releases.

I'd also suggest not using broad stroke statements that implies the whole community agrees with what you want FM to be - everyone who plays the game has their own individual opinion about what features are good or bad, and whether changes are good or not.

[Welshace]

Known issue... being looked at for upcoming update.. check every other thread on the forums for more info

[JordanMilly]

14 minutes ago, LG2694 said:

Has anyone else noticed how broken finishing seems to be? I've become so frustrated with finishing on this game that I've started playing at Barcelona to properly check if it's finishing or just part of playing using less talented players. Suarez and Griezmann are missing every single one on one, Messi's shots always seem to be hit at a snail's pace straight at the keeper. It's not as though my tactics don't create chances or my players are being forced to take bad shots, I really don't understand what's wrong this year

Given people have already discussed issues with finishing at great length in the Feedback thread, I've moved your post to that thread, @LG2694.

SI have already acknowledged the finishing issues, and are working on it. If you haven't already, I'd try the public beta patch, see if things work better for you, and if you have any issues with finishing still, please report them in the beta bug forum.

 

[LG2694]

Thanks

[Nick_CB]

42 minutos atrás, JordanMillward_1 disse:

Sobre quais recursos você está falando? Eu pergunto porque não tenho, para mim pessoalmente (e imagino que muitas outras pessoas, dado que muitas pessoas postando neste tópico indicaram que acham que o jogo é ótimo, fora do ME), houve recursos que foram totalmente inútil ou que eu pensei que era uma perda de tempo adicionada nos últimos lançamentos da FM.

Eu também sugeriria não usar declarações gerais de acidente vascular cerebral, o que implica que toda a comunidade concorda com o que você quer que o FM seja - todos que jogam o jogo têm sua própria opinião individual sobre quais recursos são bons ou ruins e se as mudanças são boas ou não.

In a video for example, Miles presented the staff's advice to indicate players their best positions and roles, the way he presented it was like an extraordinary change. 

The news for FM19 was incredible, I was really fascinated. In my opinion it was a big leap from FM18-FM19 and if SI focused only on ME for FM20 most would be satisfied

[Sanel]

2 hours ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

Which features are you talking about? I ask because there haven't, for me personally (and I imagine a lot of other people, given a lot of people posting in this thread have indicated they think the game is great, outside of the ME), been features that have been entirely useless or that I've thought were a waste of time added in the last couple of FM releases.

I'd also suggest not using broad stroke statements that implies the whole community agrees with what you want FM to be - everyone who plays the game has their own individual opinion about what features are good or bad, and whether changes are good or not.

Don't suggest not using broad stroke statement if you do the same. 
 
Quick reality check, 80% of the people who play FM nowadays are all om the same boat. There are thousands of people here that represent and speak for the majority of the community. 
 
People want a good game with simplicity, not features that try sell the game for the 20% minority.

[Rashidi]

41 minutes ago, Sanel said:

Quick reality check, 80% of the people who play FM nowadays are all om the same boat. There are thousands of people here that represent and speak for the majority of the community

Since you threw up an arbitrary percentage, I will share with you some numbers, at any point in time there are like 60000 people playing the game worldwide, I guess there are more but I am just rounding these down based on the numbers that have been posted on SI's twitter account, I think its a lot higher, but hell lets just round everything down.

Now lets take a look at this thread, which has 157 pages of comments not sure how many unique comments there are, and I am sure I can find out if I ask the right person, but lets just take a look at the total number of people who have made 5 comments or more and assume they are all saying something negative about the game. That is a very unrealistic assumption but lets just put that number out for the fun of it. I do enjoy this kind of banter. The number of unique users who have posted more than 5 comments are 284. 

Assuming only a mere 5% of the total number of people playing the game actually bother coming to the forums...that gives us 3000 people. 

Therefore we would need 2400 of them to post here to qualify as the 80% majority that are in the same boat. I hope you can see why your 80% isn't the majority of the game. Meanwhile let's get back on topic, yes... the mods like  me welcome both negative and positive comments. Negative comments imho are more valuable truth be told, cos it can only make the game better. 

[Ges]

It look like a loot of work has been done and there is so many positives in this match engine , there is times I love how the players react to different situations.

But with the one ones there is still big issue and I hope it's not just a personal opinion but a fact. 

With all the positives  the game will always will feel incomplete when you have cavani or lewandowski and they can't score one ones. Everytime almost they are one one I know it won't be a goal.

You can even add graphics from ps5 to the game or the best features in the world but with this issue the game will always be incomplete.

It shouldn't have took so long for the particular issue to be still going on. I had only 3 months free to sit and play some FM , but soon my free time is over and have to work so that was the FM for me this year.... 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Ges

[ferrarinseb]

In terms of duration How long a training session effect the Team Performances on pitch. Do different modules have different durations for their effect? 

[frukox]

I have had this game since the middle of December and I didn’t like how the match engine played out the matches due to mentioned reasons throughout the forum but surely it can be said that the public beta version is better than the previous ME. However, there are still prevalent issues I see:

1) The defensive mechanics ( whether you use high-press or middle-press, teams don’t defend space properly and intelligently, especially wide players ). Secondly, dribblings are still OP perhaps because of again poor defending mechanics.

2) Goals from set-pieces, defensive mistakes resulting in penalties and long shots from the edge of the box seem to be more common sources of goals.

3) I think finishing ratio of shots including headers is still lower than it should be.

4) Opposition teams mostly play on lower mentalities. Even top teams play on standard or at most positive at the start. So, middle-press and high-press tactics looks like the way to go. Opposition AI should be strengthened.

The ME is playable but isn’t pleasant to watch. I don’t agree with harsh comments here. As long you get the tactics right( mentality, roles/duties, team/player instructions with efficient training schedules) you’ll still rule this game. I watch key highlights btw.

Edited February 5, 2020 by frukox

[baris28]

Rashidi, I don't think this feedback thread is empty. It is good SI has this thread. 'Disconnected highlights' according to tactic and 'it is not bug but trend' was the best I read in this thread and I agree with. Of course many enjoying the game without posting in this thread. Good for them.

[Sanel]

3 hours ago, Rashidi said:

Since you threw up an arbitrary percentage, I will share with you some numbers, at any point in time there are like 60000 people playing the game worldwide, I guess there are more but I am just rounding these down based on the numbers that have been posted on SI's twitter account, I think its a lot higher, but hell lets just round everything down.

I don't understand why people and even Miles keep bringing up stats, if explained this a couple of times over the course of the last 2-3 years here. You are being the fanboy now who's defending criticism with stats 'Look! 60k players are playing the game, that's more than ever. The game can't be bad!'. People who do business but don't care about improving their product say this too. 

SI is doing PR to cater the game to new players. 

SI is releasing additional features which seem interesting at first glance (but are not useful to useless to experienced players).

SI didn't do any or less PR in the past which is why you see a increase in active players. 

A significant amount of those 60k players are people who don't enjoy the game but still play it anyways because they play nothing else, then come to this feedback topic to post their frustrations.

New players don't know how good and enjoyable older FM's are, they think that this is the standard. If I would play the game for the first time or FM 19 was my first one I would think this too. 

Standards where much higher before and this is why people want to see improvement. I've wrote countless posts about braindead improvements that everyone wants to see.

[Rashidi]

20 minutes ago, Sanel said:

I don't understand why people and even Miles keep bringing up stats, if explained this a couple of times over the course of the last 2-3 years here. You are being the fanboy now who's defending criticism with stats 'Look! 60k players are playing the game, that's more than ever. The game can't be bad!'. People who do business but don't care about improving their product say this too. 

SI is doing PR to cater the game to new players. 

SI is releasing additional features which seem interesting at first glance (but are not useful to useless to experienced players).

SI didn't do any or less PR in the past which is why you see a increase in active players. 

A significant amount of those 60k players are people who don't enjoy the game but still play it anyways because they play nothing else, then come to this feedback topic to post their frustrations.

New players don't know how good and enjoyable older FM's are, they think that this is the standard. If I would play the game for the first time or FM 19 was my first one I would think this too. 

Standards where much higher before and this is why people want to see improvement. I've wrote countless posts about braindead improvements that everyone wants to see.

I am sorry so its ok for you to say 80% and "all" and use totally imaginary numbers to make it sound like you have a valid argument, but its not ok for others to use stats and numbers. And then you have the audacity to  go around calling people "fanboys" because some people disagree with you. I rest my case. Thanks for making my point for me.  And no where in that reply did I once say whether the game was good or bad. All I did was point out the illogical nature of your post, but feel free to disagree with me, I differ to your knowledge of the masses, because apparently you know what the significant amount of the player base are saying. 

I never once suggested the game cannot do with improvements, fyi.

[Bry]

26 minutes ago, Sanel said:

I don't understand why people and even Miles keep bringing up stats,

Yep. I agree. I don’t know why people keep bringing up... Wait, hold on...

4 hours ago, Sanel said:

Quick reality check, 80% of the people who play FM nowadays are all om the same boat. There are thousands of people here that represent and speak for the majority of the community. 

Woah there. 80%? Where did that stat come from? There are a lot of people here, yes, but they represent themselves.  I’m a part of this community and no-one speaks for me apart from myself. I don’t know where this notion of ‘speaking for the majority’ comes from.

Edited February 5, 2020 by Bry

[Sanel]

1 minute ago, Rashidi said:

I am sorry so its ok for you to say 80% and "all" and use totally imaginary numbers to make it sound like you have a valid argument, but its not ok for others to use stats and numbers. And then you have the audacity to  go around calling people "fanboys" because some people disagree with you. I rest my case. Thanks for making my point for me.

Keep ignoring the rest of the post brother.

You make FM content right? Well to be honest if you are a 'content creator' and don't want to acknowledge serious issues about the game because whatever reason I might call you a fanboy.

You want REAL feedback? I'd advise SI to hire a good business analist to see how many of those 60k are returning people for FM 21, because if my theory is right there would be a significant decline in players. If the game is just as bad as the previous two versions I expect around 30k live players which would be a negative milestone. 

[Tyburn]

5 minutes ago, Sanel said:

Keep ignoring the rest of the post brother.

You make FM content right? Well to be honest if you are a 'content creator' and don't want to acknowledge serious issues about the game because whatever reason I might call you a fanboy.

You want REAL feedback? I'd advise SI to hire a good business analist to see how many of those 60k are returning people for FM 21, because if my theory is right there would be a significant decline in players. If the game is just as bad as the previous two versions I expect around 30k live players which would be a negative milestone. 

The majority of players don’t use this forum. Only the fanboys. And mainly the fanboys that feel entitled.

[Tiger666]

7 minutes ago, sidslayer said:

The majority of players don’t use this forum. Only the fanboys. And mainly the fanboys that feel entitled.

I'd appreciate not being labelled a fanboy thanks.

[Tyburn]

Just now, Tiger666 said:

I'd appreciate not being labelled a fanboy thanks.

Ok. A lover of FM?

[Jibby123]

Following this thread can get you in to a spiral of negativity and probably the vast majority of players don't see the negatives as bad as some do here and don't post here.

I am enjoying this version, but feedback such as this gets drowned out here. There's only so many times you can shout you enjoy the version. 

Is it perfect? No, not to me, but it's more than good enough. There can always be improvements and maybe SI could have done better this version on release (annual releases aren't that groundbreaking).

I am using a tactic loosely based on Mr U Rosler's (find it in the tactics forum here) which suits how I like my teams to play and I'm not really seeing the ME problems as bad as some might be.

[Glen_Runciter]

12 minutes ago, Jibby123 said:

Following this thread can get you in to a spiral of negativity and probably the vast majority of players don't see the negatives as bad as some do here and don't post here.

I am enjoying this version, but feedback such as this gets drowned out here. There's only so many times you can shout you enjoy the version. 

Is it perfect? No, not to me, but it's more than good enough. There can always be improvements and maybe SI could have done better this version on release (annual releases aren't that groundbreaking).

I am using a tactic loosely based on Mr U Rosler's (find it in the tactics forum here) which suits how I like my teams to play and I'm not really seeing the ME problems as bad as some might be.

Now, see, this is the weird thing about it.

• With the demo, I wasn't experiencing the "missed chances" issue. With the full game (same game version), in the same league, at a different team, with slightly better players, I do.
• Neither with the demo, nor with the full game do I experience the "long balls over the top" issue, but a lot of the others do. Enough of them for me to believe that it's not always because of overly aggressive tactics.
• Neither with the demo, nor with the full game do I experience the "missed penalties" issue, but a lot of people do.
• I do experience most of the often mentioned other issues though.

I suppose the real problem could be with failing to make things work realistically  at all levels of world football, instead of a generic "THE ME IS BROKEN, HURR-DURR" issue.

I think there are –  broadly speaking – two kinds of FM players:

• The ones who tinker with everything, who invest a lot of time into managing every minutae detail, and when you do that, you don't expect "more than good enough", because that's not enough of a payout. You expect every detail to have an (at least) slightly meaningful effect, just how it should work in complex strategy games.
• And the ones who use other people's tactics. If what you put in wasn't entirely your work, you will be satisfied with getting back less.

[themadsheep2001]

Enough of the sniping please, or people may end up getting their own cards.