themadsheep2001 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I'd play Barkley much deeper than AMC' date=' his ability on the ball and his ball carrying would be a key part of our counter attacking play. Also I think his decision making in and around the penalty area isn't up to scratch yet.[/quote']His decision making isn't up to scratch full stop, which is why you wouldn't want him having a brain fart 35 yards from your own goal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coulthard's Jaw Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Well ideally Wilshere by some miracle is fit so we don't have to use Barkley that much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skybluedave Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 What's Wilshere's ETA? im just not even considering him at the moment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coulthard's Jaw Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 He should be playing again by Christmas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 He should be playing again by Christmas. So March then... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Dan Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 His decision making isn't up to scratch full stop, which is why you wouldn't want him having a brain fart 35 yards from your own goal. This is the correct opinion. He doesn't have the head to play MC at a high international level (yet, one hopes). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coulthard's Jaw Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 So March then... I wasn't over exaggerating when I talked about miracles ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hom3r Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 He does it so rarely though and more often than not flatters to deceive by beating 5 men then doing something terrible with it. I think he has absurd talent but I think he could do with being dropped with the aim of sending the message to him to work on those parts of his game. Though given our general shortage of good CMs it is pretty easy to justify his inclusion He can do and I wouldn't trust starting him against a top team in the Euros but if we are struggling against a 4th seed (likely) I think he is a useful player to bring on who has the ability to create a bit of magic. I think you are being a bit harsh on him regardless it's not like other young players going don't have similar flaws and probably don't maximise their ability either (Wilshere, Sterling, Ox). A player like him is probably going to be more useful to take than a 8th defender or 4th winger. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Dan Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I don't think anyone's questioning he has potential. And most will agree he should go, me amongst them. The question is whether he can play as an MC. Not for me, not yet, not in tournament international football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJ234 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 He can do and I wouldn't trust starting him against a top team in the Euros but if we are struggling against a 4th seed (likely) I think he is a useful player to bring on who has the ability to create a bit of magic. I think you are being a bit harsh on him regardless it's not like other young players going don't have similar flaws and probably don't maximise their ability either (Wilshere, Sterling, Ox). A player like him is probably going to be more useful to take than a 8th defender or 4th winger. I think he has bigger issues than them. For instance Sterling whilst he may not be able to finish that well his tactical understanding is very good. He knows how to move and where to move and he generally makes good decisions. Wilshere has similar tendencies as Barkley but those only tend to be apparent when he hasn't had a run of games. If he gets a run of games he not only stops running into players but his excellent vision is fully utilised. Chamberlain is fair enough but I would say about him is that his tactical flexibility is very good Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJJ Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Is it just me who finds Wilshere incredibly overrated? People view him as next Gazza or Hoddle but I just can't see it to be honest. For one he has glass ankles and spends most of his time on the treatment table and the other thing is he isn't consistent at all. When he is good, he is great but he isn't consistent enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
arenaross Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I agree actually... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJ234 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Not sure injuries make him overrated as a player they just mean you can't ever really rely on him. His consistency issues have tended to flow from the injuries Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIR17 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I think Carrick's time with England should be coming to an end. He's not the player he was anymore and having both Carrick and Henderson starting together also strikes me as very negative and kind of pointless, they're too similar. I'm not sure Wilshere is good or creative enough to counteract that in a midfield 3 either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptista_8 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Wilshere is a great player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Dan Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Depends on your definition of great. I would say he's our best midfielder and well suited to international football. But he's nowhere near the names used above. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptista_8 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Names used above? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coulthard's Jaw Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Don't think anyone has mentioned Wilshere being the next Gazza or Hoddle for a good 4/5 years to be fair If we're going to play a quite defensive, counter attacking game (which I suspect is what Roy will go for), Wilshere is one of the few Englishmen who can play the CM role in the required fashion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Dan Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 People moved on to throwing the same names at Barkley instead. Lazy journalism and punditry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I think Carrick's time with England should be coming to an end. He's not the player he was anymore and having both Carrick and Henderson starting together also strikes me as very negative and kind of pointless, they're too similar. I'm not sure Wilshere is good or creative enough to counteract that in a midfield 3 either. They are really not similar. One is a holding mid and the other is more box to box for start. Also selecting both doesn't mean you have to play them at the same time. We only have 2 holding mids in Dier aned Carrick, given their respective standings in their careers, no brainer that we should take both. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptista_8 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Henderson is such a limited player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pearcey_90 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Don't think Carricks performance against Spain has helped his cause (granted not the only poor player that game). But you want him there to break play and keep the ball, did neither as Spain just dictated proceedings without ever getting out 3rd gear. A side that since World Cup have struggled badly against any half decent opposition. He really does seem to me like his legs have falling off a cliff edge this season. I'd actually put Barry ahead of him right now if you want the experienced been there done it CDM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bliss Seeker Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 You also gotta remember he will be 35 years old only 3 weeks after the Euros. I think he might just miss out. He's going to have to bring something really special to the table to warrant his selection. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 You also gotta remember he will be 35 years old only 3 weeks after the Euros.I think he might just miss out. He's going to have to bring something really special to the table to warrant his selection. If w had another DM in-between Carrick and Dier, i'd leave Carrick behind, but we are really lacking there. Can't go with just one of them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weezer Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 How come Mark Noble never gets mentioned in these central midfield discussions? Granted he's not the most exciting name in the world but he's consistent and I'd put him ahead of players like Carrick, Delph and Shelvey. Even Henderson imho. Not saying he should definitely be in the squad but if the names above are getting considered he should definitely be in contention. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 How come Mark Noble never gets mentioned in these central midfield discussions? Granted he's not the most exciting name in the world but he's consistent and I'd put him ahead of players like Carrick, Delph and Shelvey. Even Henderson imho.Not saying he should definitely be in the squad but if the names above are getting considered he should definitely be in contention. Because Mark Noble realistically will not be getting near the squad, rightly or wrongly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggins Top Boys Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 If w had another DM in-between Carrick and Dier, i'd leave Carrick behind, but we are really lacking there. Can't go with just one of them. If Wilshire is fit he will be considered the 2nd DM. We all know he isn't one as such but he didn't do a bad job when woy played him deep in the diamond, it was clearly a plan from the management to mould him into England's DM Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weezer Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Because Mark Noble realistically will not be getting near the squad, rightly or wrongly. If we're talking about Fabien Delph he should at least be in the discussion. Even if, like I said, he shouldn't necessarily be in the squad. Considering some of the dirge that has been called up in recent times I just find it odd he's never been in contention. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bliss Seeker Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 How come Mark Noble never gets mentioned in these central midfield discussions? Granted he's not the most exciting name in the world but he's consistent and I'd put him ahead of players like Carrick, Delph and Shelvey. Even Henderson imho.Not saying he should definitely be in the squad but if the names above are getting considered he should definitely be in contention. He's not been playing that well this season. Certainly not well enough to warrant a call up at the moment. Although yea, can't believe he hasn't even got 1 cap, whereas Roy's been handing out caps like hot muffins for the past few seasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTG Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Hart Clyne Smalling Stones Shaw (if fit) Dier Alli Barkley Sterling Walcott Kane let's do it, why not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG17 Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 As lovely as that looks Henderson and Rooney will both be starting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJG123 Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 I know Rooney and Henderson will start but I'd love to see this: Hart Clyne Smalling Stones Shaw/Baines/Whoever is fit Dier Alli Barkley Sterling Kane Vardy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJ234 Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Why do people want to play Barkley? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weezer Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Yeah, if anyone's being left out of these line ups for Henderson or Milner Barkley's the one I'd be least sorry to lose. He's still too braindead to be of any use in the later stages of a major tournament. Never looks up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartwork Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 I know Rooney and Henderson will start but I'd love to see this:Hart Clyne Smalling Stones Shaw/Baines/Whoever is fit Dier Alli Barkley Sterling Kane Vardy The way things are going we'll probably end up with Cameron Borthwick-Jackson at LB. At least in goal we can be fairly confident regardless of who out of the inevitable main three of Hart, Butland and Forster play Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJ234 Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Yeah, if anyone's being left out of these line ups for Henderson or Milner Barkley's the one I'd be least sorry to lose. He's still too braindead to be of any use in the later stages of a major tournament. Never looks up. Yeah I just don't get the desire to have him in there for the reasons you say. Also I think we should be cautious about how we line up with Dier at DM as he isn't that good on the ball and he needs people near him who can make up for that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adhikapp Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Somehow Cahill is more likely to start for England than Stones. He's not even starting for Chelsea now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Riccardo Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 ahhh yes, every two years brings me so much joy watching england and their fans flail about out of the major competitions! If you guys put together a likeable squad on the field for once, I won't laugh so much when you get knocked out. I'd like to see this squad tbh, Forster (yes he's a giant and hasn't put a foot wrong in an England shirt, albeit a few games..) Baines Stones Cahill Clyne Sterling Henderson Wilshire Oxe Kane Vardy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pearcey_90 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 OX and Baines at this moment would be lucky to make it on the plane let alone start. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBrown Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 That must be a troll squad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReggaeBwoy Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 OX and Baines at this moment would be lucky to make it on the plane let alone start. Chamberlain has not had a good season but he will make the squad. Baines probably will too. He is ahead of Gibbs, Rose and Bertrand I think and Shaw is not going to make it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptista_8 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I wonder if Glen Johnson will be making his way back into the squad as back-up RB with his performances this season. I'd much rather have players with ability on the ball in the middle like Alli, than the limited Milner and Henderson, I guess one of them would be ok but defo not both. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pearcey_90 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Baines had his chance at WC14 and was very poor. Looked out of his depth, and his club form since then hasn't been as good as prior to the World Cup If Woy didn't take Ashley Cole to the World Cup then he shouldn't take Baines to the Euros. As the other options have a great chance of going to next World Cup whilst Baines doesn't. Johnson I will be surprised to see go, just like any other RB outside Clyne. Can see Woy taking just the one with Smalling/Jones as RB cover /o\ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptista_8 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Tbf if he's picking on this season's form, Johnson should go ahead of Clyne. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBrown Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 We should be looking forward though, not backward. Johnson is 31, he's incredible average and he won't be around for the next WC. If we were going to take four full backs, it should be Clyne and Kyle Walker (who I dont particularly like, we just don't have other options) and Shaw/Bertrand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIR17 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Tbf if he's picking on this season's form, Johnson should go ahead of Clyne. If he was picking on this season's form, Danny Simpson would be first choice right back though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptista_8 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 We should be looking forward though, not backward. Johnson is 31, he's incredible average and he won't be around for the next WC. If we were going to take four full backs, it should be Clyne and Kyle Walker (who I dont particularly like, we just don't have other options) and Shaw/Bertrand. Johnson is better than Walker though and always has been, so WTH would you take Walker? We didn't take Ashley Cole to the last WC and we should have done. Age doesn't matter as long as the ability is still there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
arenaross Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Doesn't matter if he won't be at the next WC. You pick players to give you the best chance in that tournament. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBrown Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Johnson is better than Walker though and always has been, so WTH would you take Walker?We didn't take Ashley Cole to the last WC and we should have done. Age doesn't matter as long as the ability is still there. Ashley Cole is/was a lot better though. There's very little difference between Johnson and Walker who are both bog-standard players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pearcey_90 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I think Clyne has been pretty good this season, one of few Liverpools that's been consistently better then poor. Wouldn't say Johnson has been better, but would agree with argument if Clyne was to get injured then he could be next in line as there's nothing between him and Walker who seem like the only other options for RB atm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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