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Player of the tournament

Pukey

By Pukey,
in 2022 World Cup Forum

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Pukey

Pukey

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Posted

I know you probably can't say 100% but might as well have a start on the discussion while we have a few days without a game.

Feels like Mbappe vs Messi at this point, but who else has impressed you? Who else has a chance of being player of the tournament? 

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GunmaN1905

GunmaN1905

Posted
Posted (edited)

Bono, Livaković

Gvardiol, Aguerd

Amrabat, Griezmann

Mbappe, Messi, Giroud

Those would be my best players from each line.

Messi definitely wins it even if he loses in the final, I can see one of the goalkeepers or CBs getting it if Croatia or Morocco win.

Mbappe, Griezmann or Giroud win it if France beats Croatia again.

Edited by GunmaN1905
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JD nawrat

JD nawrat

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Amrabat's been the best player so far and if Morocco somehow win it should be the overall winner but then didn't Messi win it despite losing 2014? So i don't think Morocco winning it would even matter. 

It'll be Messi or Mbappé. If both fall in the SFs, it'll be Modric or (less likely) Gvardiol 

Edited by JD nawrat
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XuluBak

XuluBak

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Mbappe/Messi will probably win if their sides win. Croatia or Morocco winning would be interesting...

Probably just assume Modric, rightly or wrongly, based on "career achievement" if nothing else. 

Amrabat has been by far the biggest surprise.  He's not a younger, breakout player that people just haven't seen playing in some random league few people watch. He's an established player that's in his fourth season playing mid-table Serie A. 

Edited by XuluBak
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noikeee

noikeee

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Posted
9 minutes ago, Marc Albrighton said:

Are people just saying Messi because of who he is? Aside from like 2-3 moments i'm not sure how hes player of the tournament at all.

Because he's unblocked several matches out of nothing on his own

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Pukey

Pukey

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Messi was good against Mexico and dragged them through with a great goal, can't remember much about the Poland game except his penalty miss, but then against Australia and Netherlands he's been excellent. Nearly every decent thing Argentina have done has gone through him. 

You can think another player has been better or whatever but he's very very clearly been at the very least a contender. 

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The_jagster

The_jagster

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Messi or Mbappe for me and it depends on how they do in the next two rounds to separate them. Amrabat has obviously been very good but players that break up play need to be absolutely flawless to deserve to win imo over players that make the difference in attack.

Griezmann, Hakimi, Gvardiol and Livakovic have all stood out too and though he hasn't done anything special Modric is still so good. Part of the reason Croatia have been so hard to beat is being so good in possession and not losing it in dangerous areas (Morocco have been good at this too but are quicker to get it forward to their wingers). Giroud hasn't been so great in general play but has still contributed to many of France's goals.

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SC00P0NE

SC00P0NE

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I've watched all french games, and I am a bit mad with Mbappe, actually. I think the fact that the world expects him to be the focal point of the french team gets to him, he also lost possession and wasted chances too often. Neymar did score an important goal after a fantastic one, two but lost possession a whole lot in every single game he has been involved in.. So, to me, Mbappe and Neymar have been the two most disappointing players of the tourney thus far..

Messi, on the other hand, has been, in comparison, more noteworthy with his creative play from deeper areas. However, Livakovic and Bono were excellent in goal. Griezmann's & Gvardiol's work rate did impress me, too. Bukayo Saka showed some great dribbles in dangerous areas.

Then there was the mexican free-kick goal from Luis Chávez & Richarlison's scissor kick.

The Brazilians created the best looking chances.

Edited by SC00P0NE
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JD nawrat

JD nawrat

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1 hour ago, iamjerome said:

who decides this and when? 

 

i swear they used to announce it before the final in previous wc's which always seemed dumb to me

 

 

Don't they do it at FT of the final? Could be wrong but i thought Messi got it right before Germany lifted the trophy in 2014. Could be wrong though. 

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Barry Cartman

Barry Cartman

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30 minutes ago, Chase Failey said:

If Argentina win on Sunday could you make an argument that Messi carried them more than Maradona did in '86? Impossible to say I guess without rewatching all their games from back then. 

Can you really say that when Alvarez has 4 goals and could still win the Golden Boot?

Probably a disservice to other players aswell, Enzo Fernandez has been amazing, but he isn't a stats person like Bernado Silva, so doesn't get appreciated properly. Martinez in goal has been great at times as well 

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EnterUsernameHere

EnterUsernameHere

Posted
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2 minutes ago, Barry Cartman said:

Can you really say that when Alvarez has 4 goals and could still win the Golden Boot?

Probably a disservice to other players aswell, Enzo Fernandez has been amazing, but he isn't a stats person like Bernado Silva, so doesn't get appreciated properly. Martinez in goal has been great at times as well 

Didn't watch the 1986 World Cup so this isn't a disagreement, but Valdano got 4 goals for them as well.

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Barry Cartman

Barry Cartman

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1 minute ago, EnterUsernameHere said:

Didn't watch the 1986 World Cup so this isn't a disagreement, but Valdano got 4 goals for them as well.

I have no clue how they played in 1986, but if its the same as this side, then saying Messi carried Argentina to a World Cup would be extremely narrative pushing. Alvarez got them through against Australia, Martinez got them through against Netherlands etc 

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Chase Failey

Chase Failey

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I enjoy Messi like most people but I have to admit the constant fawning by pundits/commentators over everything he does is really starting to grate. 

Rio Ferdinand (who might be the worst offender) said his assist for Alvarez the other day 'defied physics'. It was just a reverse ball, mate. Calm down :D

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GunmaN1905

GunmaN1905

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7 minutes ago, Barry Cartman said:

I have no clue how they played in 1986, but if its the same as this side, then saying Messi carried Argentina to a World Cup would be extremely narrative pushing. Alvarez got them through against Australia, Martinez got them through against Netherlands etc 

That Argentinian team was better looking at the squad and all the reports, but Maradona single-handedly (:brock:) willed them to wins in both QF and SF.

I've criticized Messi for his poor performance in 2014 and I still stand by it. He got the best player award without doing anything in the entire knockout phase and defense being stellar.

Now he's playing the best tournament we've seen from an individual since Ronaldo in 2002.

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The_jagster

The_jagster

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It would be unfair to say Messi carried the team, defensively they've been pretty good apart from late onslaughts from the opposition. But he's had so many key parts to play in goals that other players would not have done.

Credit should also go to Scaloni for creating an environment that allows Messi to make the difference I guess.

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kopsy101

kopsy101

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I think we can safely say that this group of players couldn't have done it without him, but he also couldn't do it without them. They all work like animals for him to have absolute freedom. Every other player has been excellent, but he is the one who makes the difference. 

As @The_jagster says, credit to Scaloni. Remember he's got quality like Martinez and Dybala on the bench, but he recognises that they don't have the qualities needed.

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iamjerome

iamjerome

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messi was actually really good in 2014 too, think he was involved in 5 out of like 7 goals argentina scored :D yeah he didn't score or assist later stages but not without others letting him down

 

i remember him playing this unbelievable through ball volleying it from his own half to give di maria a 1on1 who pissed it away for one

 

but he's for sure been even better this time, but part of that is because he's had better supporting cast although let's not kid ourselves - he's still got donkeys to play with

 

de paul has been terrible at any part of the game where he's got to kick the ball :D lautaro has had enough chances set up by messi to make him a contender for the golden boot but hasn't scored a single one :D there have been entire segments of play where it sometimes seems like messi is the only technically good player

 

it's not true of course - entire defence and keeper have been good, and enzo/alvarez as others have said

 

maradona had a similarly good supporting too. they were tough ****s similarly and yeah valdano was really good. he was just coming off being la liga foreign player of the year 2nd top scorer in the league to hugo sanchez winning the title with real madrid. along with ruggeri and a couple of others who were at libertadores winners river plate etc. 

 

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