*Official* Football Manager 2023 Feedback Thread

[Choi seung won]

34 minutes ago, Neil Brock said:

We don't have items like that in game for purely cosmetic purposes. We have traits because that's what they are in the ME.

If you have any examples where you think they aren't working or being as effective as they should be (and bear in mind tactical instructions are the overall framework of how your players will play), feel free to raise via our Bug Tracker ideally with pkm's showing it on a consistent basis.

Jut because a player has a certain trait doesn't mean they will look to do that every single time they have the ball. 

Thanks. 

As you said, it's hard to report as a bug because traits don't appear every time a player has the ball.

However, when I observe the full game, I asked this question because most of the players always use similar defensive movements, shooting patterns, and cross patterns.

It seems that the trait is difficult to implement properly in the match engine.

Thanks for the reply.

[ChippyLowe]

15 hours ago, prot651 said:

So basically you just pointed out what everyone else have posted numerous times . Over the top balls will get fixed.  It was the same in FM21 release . IF/IW play fine in my game . We all know out international management. So much negatively.  Focus on the good points and cheer yourself up a bit 

The good points? I'll just go and play FM22 instead, there aren't any improvements in this edition over that one.

Strength in numbers when calling out issues is the only way anything will be fixed. If you need proof of this, just go and look at the U turn that Frontier have just made on F1 Manager 22 following community uproar.

If you can even admit that there is an issue in FM23 that you saw in FM21, surely you can see the issue here?! 'We all know about international management' - What does this even mean? We know it's pointless and we should happily ACCEPT that? 

I have no idea what you get out of just combing the feedback thread to disagree with people, but this thread is literally here for people to offer their thoughts on the game. My thoughts on this game are not positive and I do not see myself pre-ordering next year's game, which would be a first for me since FM11, that is the extent of my displeasure with this game.

[gunnerfan]

Some things I would like to see addressed that I haven't seen mentioned (and if they have and I've missed them, my apologies}:

1. Scouting reports on opposing teams should be more than just the formation and style they play. At the very least, they should note which players have been particularly dangerous and what tactics have worked best against the team. Some of this information comes in other forms, such as suggested OIs, but IRL it would all be part of the buildup to the match.

2. AM's lineup suggestions should take into consideration fatigue levels, injury risk, and promises of playing time or position/role made to the player. 

3. The button to see the in-game data and suggestions should be available in the basic skin. IRL, a manager would ask his AM or one of the coaches.

4. If the media are going to pump out fake stories about my club being interested in a player, I should be able to respond to the writer without having to be asked.

5. Many comments have been made about the lack of quality stadium graphics, but I'd like to mention something else: sounds during a match. Crowd noise is fine, but after a while, it's little more than white noise. I recall years ago, there were a few loops of crowd singing. I really miss that, because that lends far more flavor. And how about some disapproving whistles when the home team has a goal disallowed or a penalty called against?

 

[TheArsenal63]

5 hours ago, prot651 said:

Please provide proof about over the top balls in every series.  I can remember only one and it was fixed . I think by jow SI development team know about over the top balls , international management.  They are not that stupid and banging on about the same old things that have been posted 1000s of times is not helping . 

Just as a counter to this, you are 100% in your right to bang on about the same things 1000 times in this thread. The more the merrier, I enjoy reading other people's posts and I welcome their thoughts. This is what the feedback thread is about.

Don't let people make you hesitant to post here just because of a fear of being told off. I'm sure the developers and mods welcome all posts and comments as long as they are respectable. SI have said countless times that the feedback and bug reporting is invaluable to them, so keep em' coming folks.

[kertiek]

i was hoping to see a change in player development, i find that if u can set the tactic for reserves/youth teams in your own club, why their head coaches still make the player to train in roles that dont exist in the tactic? .. if the tactic has a full back support, why the 18s head coach insist on training most of non-nonsense fullbacks defend? ... the same idea explained more detailed is in the post bellow 2 years ago.

why the training should be similar to the tactic played? if the first team loses all the players playing at DL for example, i should be able to bring a reserve/youth that has been playinng the whole season the same tactic as the first squad, but what do i find when i look at the alternatives in reserves/youth/? .. they been training a role that is not used in the tactic the play every weekend and their position/role familiarity is awkward. if they train in the role they are playing in every competitive match ( since they are using the tactic of the main squad) their familiarity would end up being fluid that would also be inclined to provide better results/development as a consecuence, not only in my club, but on every club, with this we would end up seing better development overall the leagues only if the reservers/youth teams play with the main squad tactic.  and for every headcoach that uses another tactic in reserves/youth they should be able to set the individual roles as they see fit for their own tactic, but not in the case when they are asked to use the main squad tactic.

 

 

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by kertiek

[Jaye]

I might be missing something, but the logic behind player interactions seems very odd.

Here's the hierarchy at my club. One of the team leaders is against another player getting a new contract because he doesn't think he deserves it. 

The team leaders want a meeting because of the unhappiness. I tell them the player doesn't deserve a new contract. This is the response:

Horta doesn't think the player deserves a new contract, yet here he's "disappointed" by my answer. Matheus asks me a question yet NONE of my options actually answer it. Instead, I can:

1) End the conversation.
2) End the conversation.
3) Cave in.
4) Accuse the players of being unprofessional.
5) Tell the players to eff off.
6) Tell the players to eff off.
7) Tell the players to eff off.

By this point, the damage is already done. If I end the conversation, the players are upset. If do options 4 through 7, the players get angrier. So, my only chance at a positive outcome - to prevent outright squad mutiny - is to give a player a new contract most players in the team don't think deserves a new contract! Said player is also out for 9 months because he's done his ACL, but I can't use that as a reason.

I reload and play it tough, saying I won't give in to the demands of one player. They respond saying I can't claim it's for the good of the club when players are unhappy and that it's not "good enough". So I reload and say the atmosphere at the club is good and I don't want them to ruin it. They tell me the atmosphere isn't good (which is a complete lie, according to the squad dynamics page) and I'm just trying to cover up the fact I've dealt with this poorly. No matter what route I go down, I get the same seven responses.

This simply isn't a conversation. There's no compromise or bargaining. The only positive outcome is to agree with the players, which begs the question: what even is the point of this system existing?

I'll just say it: this system is not fit for the purpose. It's not realistic, it's not fun to engage with, the chats are far too binary to add any depth to the game, it's skewed too far in favour of the players, and unlike press conferences and squad meetings, I'm forced to interact with it.

Edited November 13, 2022 by Jaye

[Marko1989]

I am not saying that the game is bad, but I simply think that is not worth of my money, even it is not a same game it feels like I am playing the same game when I start it.

Default skin in last 3 years is the same. They just add some rounded corners or remove them and that is all. Tactics screen is exactly the same for 3 years. 3D Graphics/Animations are a little bit better, but the game is ugly honestly. Lighting is very poor, the game is still stuck in early 2000s in that department. They ruined 2D years ago.

I really don't care about new features, they don't change anything in a way how I play, I just think that the next FM I will buy will be the one where whole game gets a complete overhaul, from UI, Skins, Graphics etc. There is more than enough tools for management in the game, I just want immediately when I install the game that it looks like I am playing completely fresh new version.

One thing that helped games feel fresh before for example, even it is unrealistic ( but the complete game is unrealistic, and it should be like that, it is a game ) is that they were changing player attributes constantly. I remember for example Raul in one FM had 15 finishing, in next he had 20. It was like they were changing their attributes according on how  good their previous season was. Look at Del Piero in two different FM's, he had better dribbling when older for example, this was the thing for most of the players, they were changing them and that made the game fresh because you were waiting too see how good or bad will some player be in new FM. Now some players can be exactly the same for 3-5 versions.

Edited November 13, 2022 by Marko1989

[anagain]

5 hours ago, ChippyLowe said:

The good points? I'll just go and play FM22 instead, there aren't any improvements in this edition over that one.

Strength in numbers when calling out issues is the only way anything will be fixed. If you need proof of this, just go and look at the U turn that Frontier have just made on F1 Manager 22 following community uproar.

If you can even admit that there is an issue in FM23 that you saw in FM21, surely you can see the issue here?! 'We all know about international management' - What does this even mean? We know it's pointless and we should happily ACCEPT that? 

I have no idea what you get out of just combing the feedback thread to disagree with people, but this thread is literally here for people to offer their thoughts on the game. My thoughts on this game are not positive and I do not see myself pre-ordering next year's game, which would be a first for me since FM11, that is the extent of my displeasure with this game.

It's not just strength in numbers that gets changes made. Constructive criticism helps too, and thats not always seen here, in my opinion. I'm not saying that people shouldn't have opinions because I agree with a some of them. The angst with which people feedback is something I don't always agree with.

Remember, too, that the feedback on this forum is just a small percentage of the overall feedback. FM23 is sitting at Very Positive on Steam after 2,762 reviews. A lot of people just play the game and rarely, if ever, post here.

I've been here a long time and I personally don't believe I have seen quite as much feedback from members of the development team.

I think Neil Brock's comments on match engine changes are very pertitnent to this conversation, and that that is something that results in a lot of angst, often with little understanding of how changes to the match engine work.

I haven't followed F1 Manager because I watched a little on YT and didn't think much of it. I don't know the change they made but consider that Frontier are undeniably a much bigger company than SI. They release more games and publish too. You'll never get the graphics of that game in FM, for certain.

Graphics: Let's be honest here and say that the graphics in FM are not up to date. Personally, it doesn't matter to me how the players look as I play for the depth of simulation. I would love to see changes to stadiums and the backgrounds though. I would also love to see better newgen faces and don't see why SI can't add something like the real faces add ons that have been made.

But, and here's a big caveat for me. FM is never going to be FIFA. SI are never going to be able to bring this game up to levels of that ilk and I ask myself if people would be happy with smaller improvements, or would they still say FM is dated?

Features: I agree that the features in FM23 probably have not been quite as strong as previous years but I still believe the price is worth it for this game. Let's be honest and say that FM is the same game every year anyway. It's the average person's way to be a football manager and shrug shoulders with football's elite, all be it from the comfort of their home. You still get that in FM23. The value for money that FM gives you is still there.

International Football is not something I do much of but I agree with points that I have seen made. I also can't help but agree the year of a winter world cup would have been an ideal time for an International football update.

Set Pieces do need a change but what can SI really do? If there was a great idea out there then I'm sure they could have made it happen. I doubt you'll ever be able to design intricate little set pieces because it would further overpower the user in relation to the UI.

The UI and other often asked fixes: Now here is my particular bugbear. I think the UI needs work and I think there are little things that need big improvement. I would be happy if SI spent the next edition of FM just making promises work and making the social mechanics of FM as good as they can be. Add in a major sweep of the UI and there would be an edition I would happily part £40 for.

But would the userbase here? You could easily say the strength of this year's match engine has saved face a little.

People clearly speak passionately when it comes to FM but I wonder if all really weigh up the bigger picture. How many say price changes are not good but fail to take in to account the pocket pinching much of the world is facing with inflation and recession? That affects SI too.

SI care. I know they do. FM is still a good game and £40 for hundreds of hours is a steal.

Feedback is valuable but constructive feedback is more valuable than anything. Weigh up the bigger picture. The ME is surely better than FM21, and I don't think sweeping statements like that first comparison are constructive.

I just think people could calm down. Have a cup of tea and just enjoy the game for the wonderful fun it is each year. Accept small issues and don't fixate on what you see written. As I have aid before, the more you fixate the more you'll see that thing that annoys you in the game. I don't believe there's anything game breaking in FM23  

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by anagain

[TheArsenal63]

6 minutes ago, anagain said:

It's not just strength in numbers that gets changes made. Constructive criticism helps too, and thats not always seen here, in my opinion. I'm not saying that people shouldn't have opinions because I agree with a some of them. The angst with which people feedback is something I don't always agree with.

Remember, too, that the feedback on this forum is just a small percentage of the overall feedback. FM23 is sitting at Very Positive on Steam after 2,762 reviews. A lot of people just play the game and rarely, if ever, post here.

I've been here a long time and I personally don't believe I have seen quite as much feedback from members of the development team.

I think Neil Brock's comments on match engine changes are very pertitnent to this conversation, and that that is something that results in a lot of angst, often with little understanding of how changes to the match engine work.

I haven't followed F1 Manager because I watched a little on YT and didn't think much of it. I don't know the change they made but consider that Frontier are undeniably a much bigger company than SI. They release more games and publish too. You'll never get the graphics of that game in FM, for certain.

Graphics: Let's be honest here and say that the graphics in FM are not up to date. Personally, it doesn't matter to me how the players look as I play for the depth of simulation. I would love to see changes to stadiums and the backgrounds though. I would also love to see better newgen faces and don't see why SI can't add something like the real faces add ons that have been made.

But, and here's a big caveat for me. FM is never going to be FIFA. SI are never going to be able to bring this game up to levels of that ilk and I ask myself if people would be happy with smaller improvements, or would they still say FM is dated?

Features: I agree that the features in FM23 probably have not been quite as strong as previous years but I still believe the price is worth it for this game. Let's be honest and say that FM is the same game every year anyway. It's the average person's way to be a football manager and shrug shoulders with football's elite, all be it from the comfort of their home. You still get that in FM23. The value for money that FM gives you is still there.

International Football is not something I do much of but I agree with points that I have seen made. I also can't help but agree the year of a winter world cup would have been an ideal time for an International football update.

Set Pieces do need a change but what can SI really do? If there was a great idea out there then I'm sure they could have made it happen. I doubt you'll ever be able to design intricate little set pieces because it would further overpower the user in relation to the UI.

The UI and other often asked fixes: Now here is my particular bugbear. I think the UI needs work and I think there are little things that need big improvement. I would be happy if SI spent the next edition of FM just making promises work and making the social mechanics of FM as good as they can be. Add in a major sweep of the UI and there would be an edition I would happily part £40 for.

But would the userbase here? You could easily say the strength of this year's match engine has saved face a little.

People clearly speak passionately when it comes to FM but I wonder if all really weigh up the bigger picture. How many say price changes are not good but fail to take in to account the pocket pinching much of the world is facing with inflation and recession? That affects SI too.

SI care. I know they do. FM is still a good game and £40 for hundreds of hours is a steal.

Feedback is valuable but constructive feedback is more valuable than anything. Weigh up the bigger picture. The ME is surely better than FM21, and I don't think sweeping statements like that first comparison are constructive.

I just think people could calm down. Have a cup of tea and just enjoy the game for the wonderful fun it is each year. Accept small issues and don't fixate on what you see written.  

 

First , people can't enjoy something they have a problem with, just telling them that does not help.

Small number of users reporting issues with the ME has been the exact reason that SI have been able to create quality ME changes year after year. They tell you that themselves and is why this thread as well as the bug tracker exists.

If SI was to just look at steam ratings for how good their ME is, do you realise how disastrous that would be for them? The last thing they want is to discourage the small community of people who help them iron out the issues so they can create a quality product. The ME is their biggest selling point, it's the secrete sauce, it's why FIFA Manager gave up even trying to compete, it's the reason they still exist and every time they make it better, it distances themselves from any potential competitors who want to join the market.

This is why beta exists, 99.99% of users are not on this forum, they will not report technical issues or even gameplay issues, they don't care enough to so they go and play something else. At some point, maybe months, maybe years , that 99% of users will get fed up with the accumulation of bugs and decline in ME quality and leave.

Every game needs a core group of people who report these things because other gamers do not care enough to do it. By discouraging it and telling people not to take it seriously, you would be actively hindering the progress the game has made and it's actually really bad for SI.

I've seen many games, especially MMOs since I played alot of them back then, who took the same position you propose. You wanna know what happened? Those users who care so much stopped caring and moved on, then a competitor came along and offered the casual crowd something better and they also moved on. What made the game unique and what differentiated them from other products was watered down because the company failed to understand what their USP was and discouraged loyal fans who understood that it was the wrong direction.

It's so common and has happened to companies so many times that I'm surprised you would advocate for people not to take the game so seriously. It's precisely the reason why people keep coming back, you have an invested group of people and usually the death of a game is when that crowd abandons it.

The core group of users who care about the game is the canary in the coal mine, if they see a problem and you continue to ignore it, then eventually it will affect the wider user base, it just takes longer (possibly years). Many companies make this mistake and they eventually go out of business or a competitor arrives who does it better because the standards have fallen.

That's why I am so surprised at so many people on this thread who are determined to tell people to either shut up or calm down, it's like you want the game you like so much to eventually fail. That's what will happen when you chase or discourage these users away.

[anagain]

2 minutes ago, TheArsenal63 said:

First , people can't enjoy something they have a problem with, just telling them that does not help.

The core group of users who care about the game is the canary in the coal mine, if they see a problem and you continue to ignore it, then eventually it will affect the wider user base, it just takes longer (possibly years). Many companies make this mistake and they eventually go out of business or a competitor arrives who does it better because the standards have fallen.

That's why I am so surprised at so many people on this thread who are determined to tell people to either shut up or calm down, it's like you want the game you like so much to eventually fail. That's what will happen when you chase or discourage these users away.

Did you really even read what I wrote? I am not telling people to shut up. I said feedback is important, but saying 'this is crap', as many seem to do, is not going to cut it when it comes to providing constructive feedback.

You act like the only people that care about this game are the ones providing angry feedback. I doubt SI are going out of business any time soon but they do have to deal with the pressures of modern Britain.

I care immensely about this game and I want the best game possible. I thought that was clear from my post and my many posts about UI issues and strange social events in game.

There are a number of things in FM I am not happy with, and ones I have spoken about more than a few times. In game lists that default back to the top of the list, removal of logs of player conversations, lack of impact/information about weather in game, very poor promises mechanic in game that just doesn't work, strange behaviours of players in many situations around player unhappiness over game time. 

I still enjoy the game...possibly more in the last couple of years than I have since the first few years I played it.

As I said, we could see more from SI, but I also think the user base could look a little wider when getting upset.

[stevemc]

This is small but it's doing my head in, how do I remove the ring off my avatar's right hand?!

I've selected a left hand ring (wedding finger) but for some reason there's two on the right hand too!

EDIT: now I've selected NONE and there's a ring on both hands on the picture - is this bugged, or some of the worst UI we've ever witnessed? 

Edited November 13, 2022 by stevemc

[anagain]

7 minutes ago, stevemc said:

This is small but it's doing my head in, how do I remove the ring off my avatar's right hand?!

I've selected a left hand ring (wedding finger) but for some reason there's two on the right hand too!

It can be a but of a task to do. The interface and the way SI have done the adding of rings or earrings is a bit counter-intuitive.

Forgive me if I am a little out, I don't have the game in front of me. You have to click on the no ring option and then the finger the ring is on.

It can take a bit of fiddling. 😁

[stevemc]

1 minute ago, anagain said:

It can be a but of a task to do. The interface and the way SI have done the adding of rings or earrings is a bit counter-intuitive.

Forgive me if I am a little out, I don't have the game in front of me. You have to click on the no ring option and then the finger the ring is on.

It can take a bit of fiddling. 😁

Yeah you've explained it well there
Jesus, what a graft that was, that just isn't right, it should just give the option of "NONE" within the hand/finger section for both left & right:

[anagain]

5 minutes ago, stevemc said:

Yeah you've explained it well there
Jesus, what a graft that was, that just isn't right, it should just give the option of "NONE" within the hand/finger section for both left & right:

Yep, it is a bit of an odd way. SI should have looked at MMOs or rpgs for inspiration there. Hopefully it will get altered. 

[kerrdavidson95]

Has the player development bug been fixed yet? Or was that not officially a bug?

[Daz2205]

6 minutes ago, kerrdavidson95 said:

Has the player development bug been fixed yet? Or was that not officially a bug?

That was patched during Beta if I recall

[Wavelberry]

Deselecting jewellery is stupid and egregious and has no business being as difficult as it is. No jewellery should be the default. Seems silly.

[alian62]

6 hours ago, TheArsenal63 said:

Just as a counter to this, you are 100% in your right to bang on about the same things 1000 times in this thread. The more the merrier, I enjoy reading other people's posts and I welcome their thoughts. This is what the feedback thread is about.

Don't let people make you hesitant to post here just because of a fear of being told off. I'm sure the developers and mods welcome all posts and comments as long as they are respectable. SI have said countless times that the feedback and bug reporting is invaluable to them, so keep em' coming folks.

Just to re-counter the counter . SI are well aware now of the issue . Anything new,  go for it but we know what's wrong. 

Im not telling anyone off . Lolol 

[FrazT]

OK guys- lets just leave it all here and let others add their feedback.

[SeaCarrot]

The real question is why does it exist in the first place. The ONLY time you see it is on the main menu screen. Whats the point??

[kertiek]

23 minutes ago, SeaCarrot said:

The real question is why does it exist in the first place. The ONLY time you see it is on the main menu screen. Whats the point??

probably the headcoach timeline included pictures of the manager in specific points .. for example when winning the league with a picture of the squad + the manager and there u could see the vanity stuff that currently u can only see in the main menu screen.

 

why is not implemented yet? maybe didnt make it or another stuff took higher priority and got delayed for a future iteration

[footyking33]

Anyone run into the "0 results" thing when manually assigning scouts? I can never get any results unless I delegate scouting.

[gunnerfan]

8 hours ago, Jaye said:

I might be missing something, but the logic behind player interactions seems very odd.

Here's the hierarchy at my club. One of the team leaders is against another player getting a new contract because he doesn't think he deserves it. 

The team leaders want a meeting because of the unhappiness. I tell them the player doesn't deserve a new contract. This is the response:

Horta doesn't think the player deserves a new contract, yet here he's "disappointed" by my answer. Matheus asks me a question yet NONE of my options actually answer it. Instead, I can:

1) End the conversation.
2) End the conversation.
3) Cave in.
4) Accuse the players of being unprofessional.
5) Tell the players to eff off.
6) Tell the players to eff off.
7) Tell the players to eff off.

By this point, the damage is already done. If I end the conversation, the players are upset. If do options 4 through 7, the players get angrier. So, my only chance at a positive outcome - to prevent outright squad mutiny - is to give a player a new contract most players in the team don't think deserves a new contract! Said player is also out for 9 months because he's done his ACL, but I can't use that as a reason.

I reload and play it tough, saying I won't give in to the demands of one player. They respond saying I can't claim it's for the good of the club when players are unhappy and that it's not "good enough". So I reload and say the atmosphere at the club is good and I don't want them to ruin it. They tell me the atmosphere isn't good (which is a complete lie, according to the squad dynamics page) and I'm just trying to cover up the fact I've dealt with this poorly. No matter what route I go down, I get the same seven responses.

This simply isn't a conversation. There's no compromise or bargaining. The only positive outcome is to agree with the players, which begs the question: what even is the point of this system existing?

I'll just say it: this system is not fit for the purpose. It's not realistic, it's not fun to engage with, the chats are far too binary to add any depth to the game, it's skewed too far in favour of the players, and unlike press conferences and squad meetings, I'm forced to interact with it.

TBH, my solution would be to end conversation and then use the in-game editor to "end all unhappiness" for the affected players. I refuse to let this kind of nonsense ruin my enjoyment of the game.

 

[SC00P0NE]

1 hour ago, footyking33 said:

Anyone run into the "0 results" thing when manually assigning scouts? I can never get any results unless I delegate scouting.

I have this issue, too, albeit you can still see their results here: scouting -> Players -> Scouted Players

Quote

As you see, my scouts did scout 1155 players, but just as it is happening to you, they constantly send me inbox messages reporting that they can't find any players.. So what I do is, I just go to "scouted players" and look through their findings myself..

[BrightLad5]

Has there been any communication on when the ME, and specifically defenders, will be fixed? 

[janrzm]

I’m not sure if it’s been mentioned but @Neil Brockwas on the Football Manager Show on The Athletic this week. He mentioned the ME among other things and improvements are being worked on but as we know it’s a delicate balancing act. As always its well worth a listen and personally I really enjoy these interactions with SI staff, it’s a great way of communicating with the user base.

You can listen to the podcast where-ever you get your pods. 
 

https://theathletic.com/podcast/237-the-football-manager-show-by-the-athletic/?episode=74

Edited November 14, 2022 by janrzm

[FrazT]

1 hour ago, BrightLad5 said:

Has there been any communication on when the ME, and specifically defenders, will be fixed? 

No there has been no definite date set although a Decemeber update has been the norm in previous years- it will, however depend on the testing phase.

[Jonthedon26]

15 hours ago, Marko1989 said:

I am not saying that the game is bad, but I simply think that is not worth of my money, even it is not a same game it feels like I am playing the same game when I start it.

Default skin in last 3 years is the same. They just add some rounded corners or remove them and that is all. Tactics screen is exactly the same for 3 years. 3D Graphics/Animations are a little bit better, but the game is ugly honestly. Lighting is very poor, the game is still stuck in early 2000s in that department. They ruined 2D years ago.

I really don't care about new features, they don't change anything in a way how I play, I just think that the next FM I will buy will be the one where whole game gets a complete overhaul, from UI, Skins, Graphics etc. There is more than enough tools for management in the game, I just want immediately when I install the game that it looks like I am playing completely fresh new version.

One thing that helped games feel fresh before for example, even it is unrealistic ( but the complete game is unrealistic, and it should be like that, it is a game ) is that they were changing player attributes constantly. I remember for example Raul in one FM had 15 finishing, in next he had 20. It was like they were changing their attributes according on how  good their previous season was. Look at Del Piero in two different FM's, he had better dribbling when older for example, this was the thing for most of the players, they were changing them and that made the game fresh because you were waiting too see how good or bad will some player be in new FM. Now some players can be exactly the same for 3-5 versions.

I agree completely with this. I don't think the same skin/UI helps SI at all with people saying this is basically the same as last years (and FM21). It also doesn't help that the skin is pretty damn horrible (in my opinion of course). I am sure, if memory serves me right, the skin used to be different for each new version back in the day, or at least every other version. Feels like we have had this same skin for the last 5 years now. 

[potbellypigs]

I've only just got round to playing some games this weekend and I've started with Crewe, so maybe this is lower league based opinions, but some of the stuff just doesn't make sense. For example, before the start of the match I have people who are injured for like 3 months 'hurt' or 'offended' about the team shape or mentality. The assistant auto picking stupid teams. My most in form player after about 15 games is a 3 star player and whilst fully fit my assistant doesn't even think he should be on the bench. I set my scouts to look for a loan in any position, yet they come back with absolutely nothing. Not one player. The recommendation to change mentality to cautious in what seems like every game despite the scenario being something like my team in the play-offs and playing a team at home who are 22nd. Maybe you could argue most of that is actually real and football is a game of opinions, but hey.

I'm happy with the game overall though and hopefully I'll have the time to get some good saves going again this year.

[Jonthedon26]

9 hours ago, footyking33 said:

Anyone run into the "0 results" thing when manually assigning scouts? I can never get any results unless I delegate scouting.

Yep, all the time. No matter what criteria I set, I always end up with 0-4 results. I keep questioning if I am doing something wrong as no matter how broad or narrow I set my parameters I hardly get any hits. 

[brawla123]

Never received so many yellow and red cards in an FM game till this year, this is getting frustrating 

[BrightLad5]

29 minutes ago, Jonthedon26 said:

I agree completely with this. I don't think the same skin/UI helps SI at all with people saying this is basically the same as last years (and FM21). It also doesn't help that the skin is pretty damn horrible (in my opinion of course). I am sure, if memory serves me right, the skin used to be different for each new version back in the day, or at least every other version. Feels like we have had this same skin for the last 5 years now. 

If I recall, even going back to the CM days, there was a dark and light version? Been a long time. I remember when they just made a suitable font difference and went from quite a big thin font to a more bolder smaller font... even that was nice.

I do strongly agree that a freshen up of the default skin is in need. I hope their justification for not updating the skin (or providing alt variations) in 3 years isn't: "there's modders out there that make skins so why should we bother to provide multiple or new skins?" If that is the case, then that is a mentality problem at SI which is a lot bigger of an issue than just being 'new skin' related... Im sure this isn't the reason though 

[keeper tom]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Feel like I’ve definitely made the right decision to stick with FM 22 until there are some major updates for the ME in FM 23. I hope this gets sorted for the rest of you ASAP as it’s not been a pretty viewing on YouTube so far. 

With all the posts on Twitter regarding new records being smashed left right and centre (regarding downloads and games played etc) I assumed people were having a great time. Appears to be the opposite.

Edited November 14, 2022 by keeper tom

[Choi seung won]

The dribbling and movement issues of the inside forward and inverted wingers will definitely be fixed in the next update, right? Right, developers?

[GOODNAME]

20 minutes ago, csw4228 said:

The dribbling and movement issues of the inside forward and inverted wingers will definitely be fixed in the next update, right? Right, developers?

I have a post about this with a lot of exampls you can add more

 

 

[Neil Brock]

1 hour ago, keeper tom said:

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Feel like I’ve definitely made the right decision to stick with FM 22 until there are some major updates for the ME in FM 23. I hope this gets sorted for the rest of you ASAP as it’s not been a pretty viewing on YouTube so far. 

With all the posts on Twitter regarding new records being smashed left right and centre (regarding downloads and games played etc) I assumed people were having a great time. Appears to be the opposite.

Would always lean towards you making up your own mind. The demo is available with six months of in-game time on Epic, Steam and Microsoft Store. - so if you want to try it for yourself that's the best way to do so. 

[XaW]

1 hour ago, keeper tom said:

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Feel like I’ve definitely made the right decision to stick with FM 22 until there are some major updates for the ME in FM 23. I hope this gets sorted for the rest of you ASAP as it’s not been a pretty viewing on YouTube so far. 

With all the posts on Twitter regarding new records being smashed left right and centre (regarding downloads and games played etc) I assumed people were having a great time. Appears to be the opposite.

I'd say try the demo, after all people can like different things. Looking at the Steam reviews, they are very positive while others have been negative. So what one considers an issue, others won't notice at all. Decide for yourself, and do what you think it right for you.

[keeper tom]

49 minutes ago, Neil Brock said:

Would always lean towards you making up your own mind. The demo is available with six months of in-game time on Epic, Steam and Microsoft Store. - so if you want to try it for yourself that's the best way to do so. 

Thanks for letting me know as I completely forgot the demo is available to download. I’ll make sure to give it a go. 
 

Apologies if my comment comes across extremely negative regarding this years game. Purely judging it from what I have seen online as I enjoy watching watching a lot of the content on YouTube. @Neil Brock

[el_manayer]

On 12/11/2022 at 14:18, mikelfc8 said:

In terms of communication, this is absolutely the right way to go in my opinion. Much appreciated.

Please consider offering similar statements on some of the historic issues that seem to have been ignored or neglected over multiple releases -

• set pieces
• international management
• stadium variation, suitability and design
• the step backwards in match graphics after FM17
• newgen faces
• squad screen custom view columns
• the functionality of the DoF

Amongst others.

If SI could manage to clarify their intentions regarding these issues it may go a long way to assuage the notion that players who are very loyal to this game are shouting into the abyss, and it may well help to bolster the enormous amount of goodwill that I'm sure the vast proportion of the player base harbours towards the game and the team behind it.

Thanks again

Since you were obviously ignored, I'll take the liberty of answering myself. Because I think part of the players (or users here) have a very naive perception about what a company is and do. So, let's first base my argumentation into some indisputable truths:

- SI is a company, and like every other company, the main goal is to make money and grow. Remember, if you lose 10 hardcore loyal players but get 100 new ones with the new product, it is a grown and a success. It would obviously prefer not to lose those 10, but still, grown and success.

- FM23 is not an individual product, but part of a saga that needs to be maintained. Thus, the end goal is to be a step forward within the saga itself.

- Although any FM is not a different product than its predecessor, you need to sell it. That means, you need to introduce new stuff, that you can announce and that you can use to attract players to each iteration. But, you also need to plan ahead for the next year. And the year after that. And so on. You will also need novelties in those years, changes that can be sold and that create the desire to get the new game in the player base.

If we think about all that above, you can answer your question pretty easily on why all these stuff have not being touched in this iteration. It is not that SI does not know about them, obviously they do, you play the game for half a season, and you notice most of the stuff people complain here about often and, sometimes, year after year. It is not done because they studied it and concluded that it is not the right thing to do from a commercial point of view. Reasons are varied:

- Resources optimization. Remember that we need novelties and shiny things to promote the game. Remember also that, even if the game is released yearly, part of the forces are divided updating the current game for about 6 months.

- Tuning a little bit a broken module does not sell. Instead, leaving the module broken as it is if it can not be completely overhauled it does, because when the overhaul happens the difference is huge and can be announced as a big thing. Thus, it would be extremely easy to do small touches and slightly alleviate the experience the players have with the broken modules, but it is not done because it is not convenient. Not because SI is not aware of them, but because they decided the best thing to do, from the company perspective, it is not to touch it. That's why we haven't got simple things that would enrich the experience, like a list to sort players for set pieces, or a decrease in the likelihood of broken interaction with players happening.

- Roadmap. I don't doubt, sooner or later, all those broken things are going to be overhauled. SI would decide when it is convenient and realistic to do so, based on manpower and commercial strategy.

We can maybe agree or not with the commercial decisions that are taken, but nothing is done at random. So that's why, when you ask about those things, you get no answer: because the answer is not nice nor popular. SI knows better than anyone the problems with the game, SI decides what needs to be solved each year and what they can realistically do, SI build a roadmap based on expected sales and SI do not make small changes that mean nothing to the end goal of keep selling the saga for more years to come. And that's why you have all those tweets of self-congratulation and success, but silence when talking about the broken stuff that are ignored year after year. Not because of lack of knowledge, but because of commercial decisions.

And this is not a critic, or a claim that we, as players, are nothing to the company, or anything like that. It is just a realistic look at this thread, the success of the game and the critics that we see year after year that appear to be ignored. I myself have been critic with the game before, and I thought I was not going to buy FM23 but, ultimately, I tried the demo and got the full game. And I honestly don't regret it. Because there is little doubt that the game is very good and the ME feels very good. That's why all those positive steam reviews and all those numbers that SI proudly announces. The saga advance at one step each year, which always feel smaller than the step before, and the little things that make the game annoying to most of us, are still there and will stay there, at least, until FM24. All decisions are taken from a commercial point of view, and it is extremely naive to think otherwise. If you buy the game year after year, you need either to accept the company vision about the game, or come here and get prepared to be ignored if you complain about anything that is not related with this year's iteration.

Edited November 14, 2022 by el_manayer
Spelling

[footyking33]

5 hours ago, Jonthedon26 said:

Yep, all the time. No matter what criteria I set, I always end up with 0-4 results. I keep questioning if I am doing something wrong as no matter how broad or narrow I set my parameters I hardly get any hits. 

It really takes me out of the immersiveness of the game. I also can't go back to 22 (to be fair I don't really want to have to) because the Job Center there is glitched for me no matter how many times I reinstall of pick a different club.

[sc91]

3 hours ago, keeper tom said:

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Feel like I’ve definitely made the right decision to stick with FM 22 until there are some major updates for the ME in FM 23. I hope this gets sorted for the rest of you ASAP as it’s not been a pretty viewing on YouTube so far. 

With all the posts on Twitter regarding new records being smashed left right and centre (regarding downloads and games played etc) I assumed people were having a great time. Appears to be the opposite.

If you buy through Steam they can be very kind with regards to the refund.

[mikelfc8]

1 hour ago, el_manayer said:

Since you were obviously ignored, I'll take the liberty of answering myself. Because I think part of the players (or users here) have a very naive perception about what a company is and do. So, let's first base my argumentation into some indisputable truths:

- SI is a company, and like every other company, the main goal is to make money and grow. Remember, if you lose 10 hardcore loyal players but get 100 new ones with the new product, it is a grown and a success. It would obviously prefer not to lose those 10, but still, grown and success.

- FM23 is not an individual product, but part of a saga that needs to be maintained. Thus, the end goal is to be a step forward within the saga itself.

- Although any FM is not a different product than its predecessor, you need to sell it. That means, you need to introduce new stuff, that you can announce and that you can use to attract players to each iteration. But, you also need to plan ahead for the next year. And the year after that. And so on. You will also need novelties in those years, changes that can be sold and that create the desire to get the new game in the player base.

If we think about all that above, you can answer your question pretty easily on why all these stuff have not being touched in this iteration. It is not that SI does not know about them, obviously they do, you play the game for half a season, and you notice most of the stuff people complain here about often and, sometimes, year after year. It is not done because they studied it and concluded that it is not the right thing to do from a commercial point of view. Reasons are varied:

- Resources optimization. Remember that we need novelties and shiny things to promote the game. Remember also that, even if the game is released yearly, part of the forces are divided updating the current game for about 6 months.

- Tuning a little bit a broken module does not sell. Instead, leaving the module broken as it is if it can not be completely overhauled it does, because when the overhaul happens the difference is huge and can be announced as a big thing. Thus, it would be extremely easy to do small touches and slightly alleviate the experience the players have with the broken modules, but it is not done because it is not convenient. Not because SI is not aware of them, but because they decided the best thing to do, from the company perspective, it is not to touch it. That's why we haven't got simple things that would enrich the experience, like a list to sort players for set pieces, or a decrease in the likelihood of broken interaction with players happening.

- Roadmap. I don't doubt, sooner or later, all those broken things are going to be overhauled. SI would decide when it is convenient and realistic to do so, based on manpower and commercial strategy.

We can maybe agree or not with the commercial decisions that are taken, but nothing is done at random. So that's why, when you ask about those things, you get no answer: because the answer is not nice nor popular. SI knows better than anyone the problems with the game, SI decides what needs to be solved each year and what they can realistically do, SI build a roadmap based on expected sales and SI do not make small changes that mean nothing to the end goal of keep selling the saga for more years to come. And that's why you have all those tweets of self-congratulation and success, but silence when talking about the broken stuff that are ignored year after year. Not because of lack of knowledge, but because of commercial decisions.

And this is not a critic, or a claim that we, as players, are nothing to the company, or anything like that. It is just a realistic look at this thread, the success of the game and the critics that we see year after year that appear to be ignored. I myself have been critic with the game before, and I thought I was not going to buy FM23 but, ultimately, I tried the demo and got the full game. And I honestly don't regret it. Because there is little doubt that the game is very good and the ME feels very good. That's why all those positive steam reviews and all those numbers that SI proudly announces. The saga advance at one step each year, which always feel smaller than the step before, and the little things that make the game annoying to most of us, are still there and will stay there, at least, until FM24. All decisions are taken from a commercial point of view, and it is extremely naive to think otherwise. If you buy the game year after year, you need either to accept the company vision about the game, or come here and get prepared to be ignored if you complain about anything that is not related with this year's iteration.

You may very well be correct, and I have always considered this scenario to be a possibility.

The significant factor is that speculation such as this will be rife until SI makes an effort to clarify their strategies.

The fact that my post (and many others like it) garnered no official acknowledgement suggests, however, that clarification and communication is not likely to be forthcoming around these issues, and that leaves me somewhat saddened.

The silence, for me at least, is the main issue.

[Choi seung won]

2 hours ago, el_manayer said:

Since you were obviously ignored, I'll take the liberty of answering myself. Because I think part of the players (or users here) have a very naive perception about what a company is and do. So, let's first base my argumentation into some indisputable truths:

- SI is a company, and like every other company, the main goal is to make money and grow. Remember, if you lose 10 hardcore loyal players but get 100 new ones with the new product, it is a grown and a success. It would obviously prefer not to lose those 10, but still, grown and success.

- FM23 is not an individual product, but part of a saga that needs to be maintained. Thus, the end goal is to be a step forward within the saga itself.

- Although any FM is not a different product than its predecessor, you need to sell it. That means, you need to introduce new stuff, that you can announce and that you can use to attract players to each iteration. But, you also need to plan ahead for the next year. And the year after that. And so on. You will also need novelties in those years, changes that can be sold and that create the desire to get the new game in the player base.

If we think about all that above, you can answer your question pretty easily on why all these stuff have not being touched in this iteration. It is not that SI does not know about them, obviously they do, you play the game for half a season, and you notice most of the stuff people complain here about often and, sometimes, year after year. It is not done because they studied it and concluded that it is not the right thing to do from a commercial point of view. Reasons are varied:

- Resources optimization. Remember that we need novelties and shiny things to promote the game. Remember also that, even if the game is released yearly, part of the forces are divided updating the current game for about 6 months.

- Tuning a little bit a broken module does not sell. Instead, leaving the module broken as it is if it can not be completely overhauled it does, because when the overhaul happens the difference is huge and can be announced as a big thing. Thus, it would be extremely easy to do small touches and slightly alleviate the experience the players have with the broken modules, but it is not done because it is not convenient. Not because SI is not aware of them, but because they decided the best thing to do, from the company perspective, it is not to touch it. That's why we haven't got simple things that would enrich the experience, like a list to sort players for set pieces, or a decrease in the likelihood of broken interaction with players happening.

- Roadmap. I don't doubt, sooner or later, all those broken things are going to be overhauled. SI would decide when it is convenient and realistic to do so, based on manpower and commercial strategy.

We can maybe agree or not with the commercial decisions that are taken, but nothing is done at random. So that's why, when you ask about those things, you get no answer: because the answer is not nice nor popular. SI knows better than anyone the problems with the game, SI decides what needs to be solved each year and what they can realistically do, SI build a roadmap based on expected sales and SI do not make small changes that mean nothing to the end goal of keep selling the saga for more years to come. And that's why you have all those tweets of self-congratulation and success, but silence when talking about the broken stuff that are ignored year after year. Not because of lack of knowledge, but because of commercial decisions.

And this is not a critic, or a claim that we, as players, are nothing to the company, or anything like that. It is just a realistic look at this thread, the success of the game and the critics that we see year after year that appear to be ignored. I myself have been critic with the game before, and I thought I was not going to buy FM23 but, ultimately, I tried the demo and got the full game. And I honestly don't regret it. Because there is little doubt that the game is very good and the ME feels very good. That's why all those positive steam reviews and all those numbers that SI proudly announces. The saga advance at one step each year, which always feel smaller than the step before, and the little things that make the game annoying to most of us, are still there and will stay there, at least, until FM24. All decisions are taken from a commercial point of view, and it is extremely naive to think otherwise. If you buy the game year after year, you need either to accept the company vision about the game, or come here and get prepared to be ignored if you complain about anything that is not related with this year's iteration.

I agree with your argument. si deserves to be blamed.

They are deliberately silent about what users are desperately asking for.

Stadium improvement, national team improvement, set piece improvement, etc.

[BrightLad5]

3 hours ago, XaW said:

I'd say try the demo, after all people can like different things. Looking at the Steam reviews, they are very positive while others have been negative. So what one considers an issue, others won't notice at all. Decide for yourself, and do what you think it right for you.

Definitely try the demo. As XaW says, one persons issue may not be an issue for you. Just for the record, I would probably still rate this game high. If you had no prior knowledge of any other FM title, and reviewed it as a stand along game... its good, really good. The majourity of the negativity has been about the pretty big match engine defending bugs which always exist in Beta in some shape of form. The negativity, from my PoV has mainly come from:

1) No patch notes from beta to Full

2) Match Engine not getting patched from Beta to Full

3) The "new" features are minimal at best

4) Outside of the Match, the game looks is almost identical to FM22

5) No graphical update in decade of annual releases

6) SI being extremely defensive/secretive and hiding behind the "value for money" excuse for lack of innovation in FM23

None of these reasons (apart from graphics maybe) are directly criticising FM23 as a stand alone game. The negativity for me is more of an accumulation of the above, and other issues, which are more directly related to and aimed at SI as a company as opposed to FM23 as a game.

[Pearomaniac]

The thing that could add a bit extra to Press Conferences is being able to arrange a conference by yourself.

For example, you wanna switch clubs, arrange a conference and explain yourself about that. You have been linked with another club or player, arrange a conference and deny or confirm it. Your team is in bad form and the press cant get off your back, arrange press conference.

Do SOMETHING because its the most repetitive, most boring part of the game that has not been changed for year, and NO, i do not want to send my ASSMAN to answer the questions because i want to interact with the press, just not with a bunch of parrots saying same things over and over again.

[greenz81]

1 hour ago, mikelfc8 said:

You may very well be correct, and I have always considered this scenario to be a possibility.

The significant factor is that speculation such as this will be rife until SI makes an effort to clarify their strategies.

The fact that my post (and many others like it) garnered no official acknowledgement suggests, however, that clarification and communication is not likely to be forthcoming around these issues, and that leaves me somewhat saddened.

The silence, for me at least, is the main issue.

I think SI need to come out and be honest. Clarify the bugs. Clarify that this IS ‘gameplay’ and this IS ‘bugs’.

I admit it is difficult to clarify, to the end-user, but SI hold the cards and know the truth.

I suspect, and hate to think this is true, but a ‘House of Cards’ has been built. 
 

The game engine, I assume, has been built by many programmers over the years, come and gone. And it is in such a state, that it should be ‘rebuilt’. 
 

this is the state it’s in. I suspect SI will inform us after March, that they will delay the game for another year, as they are rebuilding it

my theory anyway

 

 

[John Joe O'toole]

1 hour ago, Pearomaniac said:

The thing that could add a bit extra to Press Conferences is being able to arrange a conference by yourself.

For example, you wanna switch clubs, arrange a conference and explain yourself about that. You have been linked with another club or player, arrange a conference and deny or confirm it. Your team is in bad form and the press cant get off your back, arrange press conference.

Do SOMETHING because its the most repetitive, most boring part of the game that has not been changed for year, and NO, i do not want to send my ASSMAN to answer the questions because i want to interact with the press, just not with a bunch of parrots saying same things over and over again.

It's soul destroying - it really needs to go I think.

[janrzm]

On 13/11/2022 at 02:18, mikelfc8 said:

In terms of communication, this is absolutely the right way to go in my opinion. Much appreciated.

Please consider offering similar statements on some of the historic issues that seem to have been ignored or neglected over multiple releases -

• set pieces
• international management
• stadium variation, suitability and design
• the step backwards in match graphics after FM17
• newgen faces
• squad screen custom view columns
• the functionality of the DoF

Amongst others.

If SI could manage to clarify their intentions regarding these issues it may go a long way to assuage the notion that players who are very loyal to this game are shouting into the abyss, and it may well help to bolster the enormous amount of goodwill that I'm sure the vast proportion of the player base harbours towards the game and the team behind it.

Thanks again

This desperately needs an "official" acknowledgment from SI and I'd urge them to do so. Clear the air, put us in the picture, please. You can't say we encourage people to post their thoughts and feedback here and then selectively decide what you are happy to answer. Sometimes the silence on here is deafening. 

[Pearomaniac]

1 hour ago, John Joe O'toole said:

It's soul destroying - it really needs to go I think.

I literally think it would be better to go away than to keep it as it is right now.

[zindrinho]

40 minutes ago, janrzm said:

This desperately needs an "official" acknowledgment from SI and I'd urge them to do so. Clear the air, put us in the picture, please. You can't say we encourage people to post their thoughts and feedback here and then selectively decide what you are happy to answer. Sometimes the silence on here is deafening. 

What more do you want them to say? Its getting kinda ridiculous how many times the staff here has urged people to describe the problem, and that its hard to reply to a "fix the set piece bug" when you dont explain what the problem is. Just look at the last couple of pages here, its like ground hog day.