Bigpole Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 22 minutes ago, CM said: Never pre-ordered the game before, just wanted to clarify, does beta version only allow us to load certain amount of leagues or can we play with full database? All these years a beta version was with all leagues, players etc. But there are bugs and probably some errors in database so you can continue your career when the full game is out but I believe most people here are treating beta career as an period to 'test the game' and see what's what. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CM Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, Bigpole said: All these years a beta version was with all leagues, players etc. But there are bugs and probably some errors in database so you can continue your career when the full game is out but I believe most people here are treating beta career as an period to 'test the game' and see what's what. Oh, cool that. Guess I confused beta with demo version. Cheers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpole Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Just now, CM said: Oh, cool that. Guess I confused beta with demo version. Cheers. You can always wait till the beta is out and follow feedback topic to see if it's worth it. Or test the demo when the game is out. Or watch some youtuber playing the beta. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
talhak Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 36 minutes ago, CM said: Never pre-ordered the game before, just wanted to clarify, does beta version only allow us to load certain amount of leagues or can we play with full database? For the last years, the Betas were quite stable & well-polished thanks to the exhaustive testing. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernest166 Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 When more news of the FM21 will arrive? Wasn't it said that more information will be given at the beginning of October? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigcwwe Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 I don't think they said specifically when the news drop would be for new features etc but we're four weeks away from the beta releasing so I'd imagine it'll be before the end of the month. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davehanson Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 30 minutes ago, craigcwwe said: I don't think they said specifically when the news drop would be for new features etc but we're four weeks away from the beta releasing so I'd imagine it'll be before the end of the month. Yeah, they did. Features and licencing updates will be revealed from early October: Look here and scroll down https://www.footballmanager.com/games/football-manager-2021 I asked the other day if this had been pushed back as they haven't revealed anything yet but never got a response. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
autohoratio Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 11 minutes ago, davehanson said: Yeah, they did. Features and licencing updates will be revealed from early October: Look here and scroll down https://www.footballmanager.com/games/football-manager-2021 I asked the other day if this had been pushed back as they haven't revealed anything yet but never got a response. I suppose "from" early October is being used liberally in that it was only an earliest possible reveal date - and we're still in the first half of the month too. Don't suppose you could indulge us @Neil Brock? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigcwwe Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 14 minutes ago, davehanson said: Yeah, they did. Features and licencing updates will be revealed from early October: Look here and scroll down https://www.footballmanager.com/games/football-manager-2021 I asked the other day if this had been pushed back as they haven't revealed anything yet but never got a response. I stand corrected. Hopefully we get the big news drop next week then as they've missed the early October part already. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshMourinho Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 All of you wondering about COVID, I'm fairly sure Miles has already tweeted saying it won't be in the game as FM is meant to be an escape from reality! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andu1 Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 Yeah i also remembered the early October part to release the new features but hopefully from next week the info starts pouring in. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 22 hours ago, craigcwwe said: I stand corrected. Hopefully we get the big news drop next week then as they've missed the early October part already. I mean, I would classify early October as before the middle of October, but yeah splitting hairs. Bit frustrating they want pre-orders before they've even announced features. Hopefully they build upon the match engine rather than build a new one from scratch again Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 4 minutes ago, ChelseaFan said: I mean, I would classify early October as before the middle of October, but yeah splitting hairs. Bit frustrating they want pre-orders before they've even announced features. Hopefully they build upon the match engine rather than build a new one from scratch again Really don't get this argument. They are maximising their window, especially given the impact of covid, especially since there are people who will pre order regardless, but there is absolutely nothing stopping you from waiting till features coming out and then pre ordering, you're not missing out by waiting 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Just now, themadsheep2001 said: Really don't get this argument. They are maximising their window, especially given the impact of covid, especially since there are people who will pre order regardless, but there is absolutely nothing stopping you from waiting till features coming out and then pre ordering, you're not missing out by waiting If you're going to do pre-orders, at least release some information about the game first. Not too much to ask? Of course, I intend to wait. I rarely ever pre-order nowadays. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, ChelseaFan said: If you're going to do pre-orders, at least release some information about the game first. Not too much to ask? Of course, I intend to wait. I rarely ever pre-order nowadays. Some people don't need the information, as for them its their purchase regardless, that's the point I already made. So actually their approach maximises orders while catering to everyone who buys at different points because the preorder bonuses like the beta arent time gated. So I can't see how its frustrating for you given there is no negative impact for you, or actually anyone 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said: Some people don't need the information, as for them its their purchase regardless, that's the point I already made. So actually their approach maximises orders while catering to everyone who buys at different points because the preorder bonuses like the beta arent time gated Not arguing it's a bad marketing move. I'm arguing it's scummy. Relying on trust from previous games, rather than giving their punters a reason to trust them on their latest. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 1 minute ago, ChelseaFan said: Not arguing it's a bad marketing move. I'm arguing it's scummy. Relying on trust from previous games, rather than giving their punters a reason to trust them on their latest. It's not relying on trust, because you arent forced to pre-order without getting information. And there is no negative impact for said waiting. You can literally wait, get a reason, and pre order without losing out. There isn't a negative point involved for anyone purchasing. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Just now, themadsheep2001 said: It's not relying on trust, because you arent forced to pre-order without getting information. And there is no negative impact for said waiting. You can literally wait, get a reason, and pre order without losing out. There isn't a negative point involved for anyone purchasing. This would be true, if they released features at the same time as announcing pre-order. By releasing pre-orders without announcing anything about the game, is asking people to buy blind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 (edited) He comes up with this every year. Here's one I found from a few years ago. I believe the features were released at this time, but that word again. Trust. Cringe. Edited October 11, 2020 by ChelseaFan context 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, ChelseaFan said: This would be true, if they released features at the same time as announcing pre-order. By releasing pre-orders without announcing anything about the game, is asking people to buy blind. It would be a negative influence and scummy if you gated that bonus, but its not gated. So the choice is entirely on the consumer. Whether you choose now or later, they get the bonus. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davehanson Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 14 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said: Really don't get this argument. They are maximising their window, especially given the impact of covid, especially since there are people who will pre order regardless, but there is absolutely nothing stopping you from waiting till features coming out and then pre ordering, you're not missing out by waiting On that rational then, why would you not announce the new features or what the FM21 does differently to FM20 as soon as you can? By this point you would assume that the game is broadly finished and features have been locked so why not start announcing some to maximise their pre-orders? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Just now, themadsheep2001 said: It would be a negative influence and scummy if you gated that bonus, but its not gated. So the choice is entirely on the consumer. Whether you choose now or later, they get the bonus. Yes, but they're still benefiting from buying without disclosing information about the game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 2 minutes ago, ChelseaFan said: Don't understand why you quoted something from 3 years ago, which they did gate and was rightly panned as a bad move Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 1 minute ago, ChelseaFan said: Yes, but they're still benefiting from buying without disclosing information about the game. But there is no pressure put on the consumer here. Its entirely their choice. Where it gets scummy is when pre order bonuses are set in way, you're compromising that choice Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Just now, themadsheep2001 said: But there is no pressure put on the consumer here. Its entirely their choice. Where it gets scummy is when pre order bonuses are set in way, you're compromising that choice Do you know what would be better? Giving the decision maker a reason to pre-order. Let's just agree to disagree Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshMourinho Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 46 minutes ago, ChelseaFan said: Do you know what would be better? Giving the decision maker a reason to pre-order. Let's just agree to disagree Right but those who are pre-ordering now are going to pre order it regardless. The decision maker will have plenty of reason to pre order in the following weeks as there's still over a month until release date. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
saiyaman Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 3 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said: But there is no pressure put on the consumer here. Its entirely their choice. Where it gets scummy is when pre order bonuses are set in way, you're compromising that choice To be fair, going by that logic there IS a pre order bonus. Whether you think it's a "bonus" is where things are more obscure ;) Pre-Purchase Football Manager 2021 SPECIAL PROMOTION! Offer ends 24 November Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Just now, saiyaman said: To be fair, going by that logic there IS a pre order bonus. Whether you think it's a "bonus" is where things are more obscure Pre-Purchase Football Manager 2021 SPECIAL PROMOTION! Offer ends 24 November I think you're misunderstanding my point. The only time there is an issue is when that bonus is gated and times out before information comes out. Which it doesn't 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
saiyaman Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Just now, themadsheep2001 said: I think you're misunderstanding my point. The only time there is an issue is when that bonus is gated and times out before information comes out. Which it doesn't They do push it pretty close when it comes to revealing information but yes they do have a window where they give you the time to decide. I do not have a problem with their way of revealing information. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 2 minutes ago, saiyaman said: They do push it pretty close when it comes to revealing information but yes they do have a window where they give you the time to decide. I do not have a problem with their way of revealing information. Yeah the minute you start gating it and taking away that window, for me is when pre orders are problematic Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikopol Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 What a strange discussion. The game has been announced so pre-orders are open. If somebody feels that having the choice of pre-ordering without knowing any new features is unpleasant, that's his/her thing. Why would others, who know anyway that they want the updated database and whatever comes with it, be deprived of the possibility to pre-order is beyond me. I really hope that we get an announcement tomorrow, really can't wait this year. I also have an unreasonable expectation for some huge game-changing feature being in it this time Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Nikopol said: What a strange discussion. The game has been announced so pre-orders are open. If somebody feels that having the choice of pre-ordering without knowing any new features is unpleasant, that's his/her thing. Why would others, who know anyway that they want the updated database and whatever comes with it, be deprived of the possibility to pre-order is beyond me. I really hope that we get an announcement tomorrow, really can't wait this year. I also have an unreasonable expectation for some huge game-changing feature being in it this time Because you're in essence handing an interest free loan to Sports Interactive. The last few years, the game has been released in a poor state, often requiring a few weeks of patches to become playable. Just look at all the early bug reports from RELEASE (not beta) in the last few years. You're also pre-ordering in a year where there's a lot of unknowns. How much of a toll has COVID made on the production of the game? It's not all about money. It's about keeping game companies accountable and not giving them money / support without knowing what you're getting. SI aren't the worst. They're generally OK, and if I will probably pre-order once the features are out. Doing it before a feature reveal just seems really silly to me. They could announce tomorrow an updated roster, a social media overhaul, and a new UI. For some people, that's just not enough. Edited October 11, 2020 by ChelseaFan 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grade Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 For me the thing about pre-orders, is I need to know what I'm buying. So for me it is quite easy, no announced features, no pre-order. Even if that means loosing whatever discount SI is offering. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
janrzm Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Sigh........ Some are happy to pre-order, some like to wait, nobody is twisting anyone's arm. Do what you are comfortable with. Personally, I want to see the new features even at the risk of losing the small discount. For the first time ever, I wasn't even going to buy the game this year until the last patch. Now, I think I will unless the ME is poorly received in the Beta. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Just now, janrzm said: Sigh........ Some are happy to pre-order, some like to wait, nobody is twisting anyone's arm. Do what you are comfortable with. Personally, I want to see the new features even at the risk of losing the small discount. For the first time ever, I wasn't even going to buy the game this year until the last patch. Now, I think I will unless the ME is poorly received in the Beta. Precisely, there's no offer tricking you here to go early without seeing it all. Personally I'm in no rush as usual. Can't play it till the beta at earliest anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
99 Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 People are just anxious for news, it's human nature. Ofcourse, it's exactly the same to pre-order right now, pre-order when the news arrive, or pre-order on the day Beta is launched. It's exactly the same, this is not a physical product that may be sold out if I wait too long. No advantages, no disadvantages. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yonko Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 Personally, I'm not ordering/pre-ordering until they announce some features. The price or discounts don't matter to me. The game features and info is what's important to me the most. I'm specifically looking forward to ME, Tactics and Training info, if any. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domathon Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 On 10/10/2020 at 13:16, Ernest166 said: When more news of the FM21 will arrive? Wasn't it said that more information will be given at the beginning of October? news is well overdue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameuss Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 1 hour ago, Domathon said: news is well overdue. Why? You have a release date, and I'm sure you'll find out more well before that. Even if you don't, what is that really affecting? Pre-order now, pre-order a day before release, what does it really matter? When they're ready to talk about what's in the game, they will. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grade Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 16 minutes ago, forameuss said: Why? You have a release date, and I'm sure you'll find out more well before that. Even if you don't, what is that really affecting? Pre-order now, pre-order a day before release, what does it really matter? When they're ready to talk about what's in the game, they will. That is given and i agree with you they will talk about the game when they are ready. Covid-19 isn't helping, made the world turn upside down and made several things delayed and somethings postponed to next year. I'm glad, as many people here are, that SI is releasing a new FM updated game this year. But... I don't agree with this kind of marketing strategy of announcing a new game and the date release, without any new features. It makes me think why or what are SI hiding this game? SI isn't to blame, but other game production studios are, studios who have done this kind of strategy and made this kind of strategy to have a sort of bad reputation on itself. No I'm not talking about EA, since they at this point, really don't bother anymore of hiding their shady practices. I completely avoid games like that, and makes me kind of sad, seeing that SI is doing this kinda of marketing. But I'm not outraged, because my gameplay is quite simple, for future FM releases or any other game. Show me your game and convince me to pre-order or not. Empty promises and hollow new features (this is the best game ever produced) is not really a way to convince me. But I also agree that SI made a series of games so good (not the latest games, but again my opinion), that several people would gladly pre-order without knowing nothing about the game, because they know it will be a good game and spent hundreds or thousands of hours in it. I get it. To those people I say go for it. They trust SI blindly, they get the discount as a reward. I too trust SI of making a good game, despite not agree with several stuff within the game and my FMT Editor battle. But I don't trust anyone blindly, maybe that is my nature. For me SI needs to prove their trust every year that still do a quality product or not. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiLLu12258 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 (edited) vor 8 Minuten schrieb grade: That is given and i agree with you they will talk about the game when they are ready. Covid-19 isn't helping, made the world turn upside down and made several things delayed and somethings postponed to next year. I'm glad, as many people here are, that SI is releasing a new FM updated game this year. But... I don't agree with this kind of marketing strategy of announcing a new game and the date release, without any new features. It makes me think why or what are SI hiding this game? SI isn't to blame, but other game production studios are, studios who have done this kind of strategy and made this kind of strategy to have a sort of bad reputation on itself. No I'm not talking about EA, since they at this point, really don't bother anymore of hiding their shady practices. I completely avoid games like that, and makes me kind of sad, seeing that SI is doing this kinda of marketing. But I'm not outraged, because my gameplay is quite simple, for future FM releases or any other game. Show me your game and convince me to pre-order or not. Empty promises and hollow new features (this is the best game ever produced) is not really a way to convince me. But I also agree that SI made a series of games so good (not the latest games, but again my opinion), that several people would gladly pre-order without knowing nothing about the game, because they know it will be a good game and spent hundreds or thousands of hours in it. I get it. To those people I say go for it. They trust SI blindly, they get the discount as a reward. I too trust SI of making a good game, despite not agree with several stuff within the game and my FMT Editor battle. But I don't trust anyone blindly, maybe that is my nature. For me SI needs to prove their trust every year that still do a quality product or not. i think SI is taking this strategy to the max. 1 month before release and we know nearly nothing. I dont think there is a other game where this is normal. I mean why? They exactly know what will be in the game since months. with every week going without news i still think more and more that they have not much to show. Edited October 12, 2020 by KiLLu12258 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 12 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said: Precisely, there's no offer tricking you here to go early without seeing it all. Personally I'm in no rush as usual. Can't play it till the beta at earliest anyway. You're missing the point. I know you're not missing out on anything. The fact that they've opened pre-orders without disclosing information about the game is enough. It's lazy. They're benefitting from sales without informing the consumer what they're getting. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameuss Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 Just now, ChelseaFan said: You're missing the point. I know you're not missing out on anything. The fact that they've opened pre-orders without disclosing information about the game is enough. It's lazy. They're benefitting from sales without informing the consumer what they're getting. If someone is voluntarily giving them that sale without knowing anything, then it's either no issue because said customer is happy with that, or it's literally their own fault. No-one is forcing anyone to pre-order. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasonen Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, ChelseaFan said: The fact that they've opened pre-orders without disclosing information about the game is enough. It's lazy. They're benefitting from sales without informing the consumer what they're getting. Or maybe they just wanted to give info for users when game is coming out to ease users mind in middle of Corona. Knowing features will come out later. Just a thought like always tough. Edited October 12, 2020 by Pasonen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChelseaFan Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 (edited) 29 minutes ago, forameuss said: If someone is voluntarily giving them that sale without knowing anything, then it's either no issue because said customer is happy with that, or it's literally their own fault. No-one is forcing anyone to pre-order. Bad practice imo. Good for the company obviously Edited October 12, 2020 by ChelseaFan 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 39 minutes ago, ChelseaFan said: You're missing the point. I know you're not missing out on anything. The fact that they've opened pre-orders without disclosing information about the game is enough. It's lazy. They're benefitting from sales without informing the consumer what they're getting. I'm not missing the point. You've already said agree to disagree so not sure what else to say to you at this point Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 38 minutes ago, forameuss said: If someone is voluntarily giving them that sale without knowing anything, then it's either no issue because said customer is happy with that, or it's literally their own fault. No-one is forcing anyone to pre-order. I think you'd have to factor in any carrot dangling and how it's done but I agree with you. In this case since there's no loss in waiting it's an entirely open consumer choice without any "unfair' nudging towards a decision. Frankly the people buying now are people who would buy it no matter what, or those who've chosen to back SI in covid times (there's been a few doing that). And pre-orders tend to be easily refunded (depending on retailer) so even then they can still change their minds 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
karanhsingh Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 I don't think there is anything wrong. I run a music festival and we always release early bird tickets after just announcing a date & venue - nothing else not a single artist on the bill. That all comes later. The first set of tickets is essentially supposed to be the loyalists for whom positive past experiences are enough reasons for a purchase. It is absolutely normal business practice. What makes sense is to reward the super early buyers somehow - through discounts, or special benefits, etc. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roykela Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 14 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said: I think you'd have to factor in any carrot dangling and how it's done but I agree with you. In this case since there's no loss in waiting it's an entirely open consumer choice without any "unfair' nudging towards a decision. Frankly the people buying now are people who would buy it no matter what, or those who've chosen to back SI in covid times (there's been a few doing that). And pre-orders tend to be easily refunded (depending on retailer) so even then they can still change their minds People like me. I've purchased the pre-order due to two simple factors: 1. I'll buy it anyway. 2. I decided to buy it now so i have one less thing to think about when it comes to budgeting and planning for christmas and stuff. Especially during covid-19 when income is less than normal. What do i lose on it? Nothing. What do i gain? Another year with FM with all the fun and frustration it brings. If, for some reason, i wasn't to be happy with the product; well, that would be the case regardless of when and how i bought it. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consiglieri Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 Why havnt we hear anything about the new FM21 yet? I have two ideas why.Either its because of a BIG change that they are laying the last hands on, so they can show us. Or sadly and more realistisk its because there is not mush new to rapport back.A new 3D engine is about time. Time is running from the 3d engine anno 2020. But of course I will be the first one playing the game anyway,. Keep up the good work Guys!!!!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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