englandmanager Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 The majority of people that are saying bye, is not ao much to with steam its do with that to play the game WE HAVE TO install steam and it can't be un-installed it can be un-installed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nottingham Forest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I want a hard-copy of the game, ALWAYS, I don't use digital downloads I buy the disc...and then I'm going to be FORCED to install a piece of software that is invasive, intrusive, using resources unnecessarily, that I'm never going to use for anything else, its effin scandalous! I'm proper not happy! I always buy the copy of the game too, but I load it up through Steam. I've never had any problems with Steam and I've always had the keep me signed in thing as well. Although I understand the reasons from a developer POV I personally think its a huge mistake from a consumer POV and will create a lot of unhappy customers.Personally I have Steam installed with a few games played through it including FM10 & 11 but I was leaning towards not using Steam for FM12. Twice this last year I have been left unable to play FM11 due to loss of internet connection - I usually play in "online" mode and although Steam has an "offline" mode the way it works seems to have changed. You used to be able just to select offline mode when an internet connection wasn't available but now you have to log in online to set the offline mode which is impossible when your connection is being worked on by BT leaving you unable to play any Steam registered games. The only workaround would leave me having to put Steam in offline mode permanently just in case I don't have a connection when I get home on a night. Keep yourself signed in(ticked). So when you turn your computer/laptop on it'll log you in. If on some days you don't have an internet connection it'll ask you to retry to connect or to start in offline mode. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigfacemonkeyman Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 it can be un-installed And still play the game? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnolan13 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 it can be un-installed it can be uninstalled but not if you want to play the game Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Themer Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 it can be un-installed Not if you want to continue playing FM it can't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Welsh Lad Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Half the time you won't even know Steam is there, really. I don't have a problem with Steam and it's good imo. I guess I'll do exactly the same as I did last year by installing it and then having to insert the activation code, like you did for FM10. My Steam account is always logged in so when I turn my laptop on and it's set up in automatically signs me in as I have the automatically sign me in thing ticked. If I don't have internet connection, it'll say Steam has failed to sign in or something. Retry or start in offline mode. If I know I don't have an internet connection then I'll click start in offline mode and I'm good to go.So, if you're able to get an internet connection for the day the game comes out you could install it and you should be fine. Thanks for the reply. I was just curious because I have the interent at home so I can register and that. But when I go to visit family I transfer my saved game onto my laptop and play on the train. Would have been a depressing if I couldn't do that anymore. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
englandmanager Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 And still play the game? oh sorry i thought you meant the game can't be unistalled once on steam my mistake Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
santy001 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I'm afraid you're horribly naive if you believe activation through steam is a solution at all. It may well prevent illegal versions being available before the retail game this year though but within 48 hours of release anyone who wants it illegally would have it. I'm not trying to provoke a reaction here, this is merely the way it is. Anyone whos into gaming and goes through websites talking about them will see the links and explanations littered around websites. Steam has become one of the easiest platforms to break through games on, unfortunately all this will serve to do is irritate more people than it helps. To actually stand a chance of thwarting piracy you'll need something new, steam is at best a 2 day delay, DRM protection usually ends up with keygens and no-cd .exe's. The current technology is very much outdated. Whilst not entirely efficient it would stump most users if you had a little bit of code that connected to something online with SI to check its genuine - if it fails this check then corrupt the save files. Not many games use this at all never mind to corrupt a save, but just a ping of certain data every 10 hours or so of play (of course those offline would still be able to get around it unless they reconnected) but it would be far less intrusive and would actually cause most piraters to give up. It could even be at random intervals, there would be nothing more frustrating to someone pirating the game if after they just get promoted or something their game pings the server, is found to be a false copy and they lose their save games as well as the FM.exe going down. Still I'll do my part and when I see FM torrents linked around I will provide them to Sega/SI to deal with, I genuinely expect to see it available illegally before legally again though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauly1616 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Complete waste of time. I don't understand this "making it harder to pirate argument". All games eventually get cracked, and for the "consumer" they always end up in the same place. It makes it no more difficult for people who already know how to pirate it, does it make it any more difficult for the people that crack it? I doubt it. Counter Strike had this format and was cracked was it not? If you want less people to steal the game, the only thing you genuinely have control over is not releasing versions like that disgraceful "offside" version. You all know what I'm talking about. So people don't feel ripped off when the buy it. anyway, good luck to you! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Yankee Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 stop talking rubbish, mine is set to offline mode and has not needed to be reconnected once and i turn my computer off every night! Maybe because you are connected to internet, smartass. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazaru5 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 You don't fix an illegal act by one of your own... Microsoft were told by the European courts that forcing Windows users to install IE was illegal... isn't forcing us to install Steam to play FM the same thing? I think it is, I wonder if the Euro courts are busy? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnolan13 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 it'll be interesting to see the sales and Pirate downloads for FM12 compared to FM11.would you change back to the old ways if it had had a detrimental affect on sales or would you see how it went over a few games? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elgreenio Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Steam is amazing, until i'm forced to use it and have it sit in offline mode eating up my battery Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurf Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Yeh this isn't going to stop the game being pirated. And there's no way a quarter of the people that pirate it will buy it - that's fantasy, in my limited experience. Every piece of software on the planet is pirated. All we can do is do our part to prevent the piracy. And if Sega and SI think Steam will help, them I'm on board. After all I think that if even 1% - not 25% as mentioned in the opening post - of people that are currently pirating bought the game it will significantly increase the sales. This in turn allows Sega and SI to do more in terms of developing the game. Plus put another storey on the CEOs house. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Welsh Lad Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Keep yourself signed in(ticked). So when you turn your computer/laptop on it'll log you in. If on some days you don't have an internet connection it'll ask you to retry to connect or to start in offline mode. Sorry Nottingham for this after you trying to put my mind at ease. But leaving yourself signed in on anything to do with the internet wether it be your bank, facebook or email can lead to potential hacking and identity theft. I am dead set against ticking anything to leave me signed in or rememebr me options. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dune297 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 You don't fix an illegal act by one of your own... Microsoft were told by the European courts that forcing Windows users to install IE was illegal... isn't forcing us to install Steam to play FM the same thing? I think it is, I wonder if the Euro courts are busy? Because the hundreds of Steamworks games are illegal. Totally! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nottingham Forest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Thanks for the reply. I was just curious because I have the interent at home so I can register and that. But when I go to visit family I transfer my saved game onto my laptop and play on the train. Would have been a depressing if I couldn't do that anymore. There's a way round that, possibly. If you're at uni and don't have a connection, could you quickly use the library internet and upload it to Gamefront(I think) and then save in your games before. I also believe you can have the same Steam account on two laptops computers as well. Maybe someone can confirm this or not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cemendur88 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 You don't fix an illegal act by one of your own... Microsoft were told by the European courts that forcing Windows users to install IE was illegal... isn't forcing us to install Steam to play FM the same thing? I think it is, I wonder if the Euro courts are busy? Loads of games are Steam only, none of them have to be taken to court about it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Steam uses hardly any resources to run. And calling your computer a "rig" suggests that your computer can certainly run this game anyway without any difficulties.. I never said it was a rescource hog, I have a problem with being forced to purchase (even free stuff is a retail transaction) 3rd party products to play a game when that product shoudl work fine without them I will be looking into the latest reports on Steam to fully assess the concerns about this product but as yet it isn't being installed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmi88 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 The majority of people that are saying bye, is not ao much to with steam its do with that to play the game WE HAVE TO install steam and it can't be un-installed why would you uninstall it? It's tiny in size, and is just a little icon bottom right, even in offline mode, edit: plus steam have steam guard now, informs you when you have signed into steam on another computer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_G_32201 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 What about the people who buy the game and don't have the internet? I used to always buy back before i had the internet full time and i would be very annoyed if i bought it and couldnt play it and then couldnt return it because i "opened it" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazaru5 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Because the hundreds of Steamworks games are illegal. Totally! You don't get it, if you want to install Steam and play hundreds of games that's you problem, I don't see why I should be forced to install it just so that I can play the ONLY game that I play... hear me? I play ONE GAME, FM! No other! Why should I have to have Steam? I don't want it as I have zero need for it, none, nil, nada, nowt! Get it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nottingham Forest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Sorry Nottingham for this after you trying to put my mind at ease. But leaving yourself signed in on anything to do with the internet wether it be your bank, facebook or email can lead to potential hacking and identity theft. I am dead set against ticking anything to leave me signed in or rememebr me options. How, if only you use your laptop then how is it a problem? If your family use the computer as well, I'm sure they won't nick your identity. I don't have anything else signed in either. I'm quite fussy about these sort of things too. Do you have a PS3 at all? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dune297 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 What about the people who buy the game and don't have the internet? I used to always buy back before i had the internet full time and i would be very annoyed if i bought it and couldnt play it and then couldnt return it because i "opened it" Get internet access the day of the release and set Steam to offline mode after you finish installing it. Simple as that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vlobben Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 This is a one-time only activation which requires you to sign up for a Steam account (which is free) and to install the Steam client and once it has been done the game can be played offline by turning on Steam's Offline mode. With those two simple steps done there are no more hoops to jump through or steps to take.[/Quote]I personally don't mind as i'm using Steam already, but having to run a 3rd party program that feels incredibly slow (probably due to slow synch with the login servers) and with an offline mode that is unreliable at best.. I feel this is a step back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dune297 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 You don't get it, if you want to install Steam and play hundreds of games that's you problem, I don't see why I should be forced to install it just so that I can play the ONLY game that I play... hear me? I play ONE GAME, FM! No other! Why should I have to have Steam? I don't want it as I have zero need for it, none, nil, nada, nowt! Get it? No I don't get it because frankly, Steam isn't going to do anything to you or your computer. It's a great service no matter how many games you own. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_G_32201 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Get internet access the day of the release and set Steam to offline mode after you finish installing it. Simple as that. It will not work for people who have no access to the net. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asdpoo Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 A quick tip on battling piracy: Price your game fairly! At the moment at Steam it is: €30 for Americans €35 for Britons €50 for the rest of Europe and I won't even mention the Russians, because it will cause a riot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wakers Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Can someone frome Sega/Si please explain how this doesn't annoy someone who does not already use Steam? Steam can have its own issues which can be intensely frustrating. Do they honestly believe the games that require Steam are not cracked pretty immediately? I don't see the point in this at all. The opening line is about "not punishing people who buy the game", yet for those who don't use Steam or don't want to (I'm not in this group, although it's not my favourite application by any means), this is exactly what it does. Combat piracy? Not one bit. Annoy a section of the userbase? Absolutely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar2010 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 You don't need to be online to go into offline mode if you had your password saved before going offline. I do and it used to work but something has changed recently and now Steam closes if it can't find a connection. It doesn't give me an option to use "offline" mode. I presumed it was a feature but if you can suggest something that might be wrong I would be grateful. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dune297 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 It will not work for people who have no access to the net. An internet cafe, university, friend's house? Thousands of possibilities unless you live in a rural community. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Because the hundreds of Steamworks games are illegal. Totally! The difference is the user as elected to installed the 3rd party software, in this instance we are being forced to install the software which is where SEGA may have stepped into leagally uncertain waters, not my area of expertise but that is waht the fella was trying to point out. No I don't get it because frankly, Steam isn't going to do anything to you or your computer. It's a great service no matter how many games you own. Still not getting it are you, it's not about how good or bad Steam is it's about being FORCED to install another companies software to play FM, like Lazaru the only PC game that I play is FM so being able to buy & install thousands of games via Steam is of absolutley no importance to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Welsh Lad Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 How, if only you use your laptop then how is it a problem? If your family use the computer as well, I'm sure they won't nick your identity. I don't have anything else signed in either. I'm quite fussy about these sort of things too. Do you have a PS3 at all? Only a pc and only this game Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzie MUFC Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I use Steam for some games, but one thing I don't like is when something happens to the Steam servers, it makes the game inaccessible, and by that time, you can't switch to offline mode. I spent a week not being able to play FM10 at one point, and decided I wouldn't use it to install my FM games with again. Uninstalled, and reinstalled with disc only. Obviously this won't be possible now. Sure, you can always switch to offline mode in the first place, but that makes the rest of Steam pointless, including the community and achievements. And as someone previously mentioned, it's not a piracy prevention measure. Guessing it's more of a monkey-making partnership between Steam and SEGA. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazaru5 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 No I don't get it because frankly, Steam isn't going to do anything to you or your computer. It's a great service no matter how many games you own. So a data-mine that uses system resources unnecessarily and (no doubt) secretly records all sorts of my PC/Gaming/Browsing habits and sends it back to Steam/Sega (just like the info on the blog threads is being sent back to Sega). Do you know everything that your computer is doing? I try to, and I can tell you for nothing that I do not install Steam like software for any purpose, none! I value my personal privacy and security too much, thanks though but I'll pass... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wakers Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 No I don't get it because frankly, Steam isn't going to do anything to you or your computer. It's a great service no matter how many games you own. It's a great service when it works. Steam is by no means a fully stable platform for some people. Steam's offline mode is..well poor at best. The bottom line is - asking a user to install a third party program to play a game that they've bought is poor. All it does is annoy the user and it does absolutely nothing against piracy. The anti-piracy rhetoric is just that - there would be no difference if the game were just put on a DVD without any copy protection with regards to it being cracked by pirates and published on torrent sites. A bit of honesty would be good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
djvandyke Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I wonder how much Steam are paying you for this grubby little deal? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_G_32201 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 An internet cafe, university, friend's house? Thousands of possibilities unless you live in a rural community. It's not about me, its about the people who are like i used to be. No access to the internet anywhere yet still like to play the game. I disagree with the decision for these reasons and it should be changed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriss Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I never said it was a rescource hog, I have a problem with being forced to purchase (even free stuff is a retail transaction) 3rd party products to play a game when that product shoudl work fine without themI will be looking into the latest reports on Steam to fully assess the concerns about this product but as yet it isn't being installed. I used to be just like you, then I had to use Steam for another title I wanted, resented it like hell:D but the benefits far outweigh any negatives and I realise now that my paranoid objection was just me feeling they were out to make me do something I didn't want to;) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nottingham Forest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Only a pc and only this game Unless someone finds out your password.... Also, Carmi said they have a Steam guard thing now. So if someone was to sign into your account, then you would be notified. For all those complaining about past experiences, is it not worth attempting it for one version? Yes, if you can't play it and then can't return it, it will be annoying. SI/SEGA are just trying to what they think is best and if this works then it could stop the piracy of games. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Guessing it's more of a monkey-making partnership between Steam and SEGA. I fully support this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dune297 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 So a data-mine that uses system resources unnecessarily and (no doubt) secretly records all sorts of my PC/Gaming/Browsing habits and sends it back to Steam/Sega (just like the info on the blog threads is being sent back to Sega). Do you know everything that your computer is doing? I try to, and I can tell you for nothing that I do not install Steam like software for any purpose, none! I value my personal privacy and security too much, thanks though but I'll pass... It uses at most 200k of resources. What do you have, a 5 year old computer with a gig of ram or something? Steam does not secretly record information. If you want something that does do that try EA's origin, it's right in the TOS. Steam asks you if you want it to take certain information like your computer specs and what not so you can contribute to things like these. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriss Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 The difference is the user as elected to installed the 3rd party software, in this instance we are being forced to install the software which is where SEGA may have stepped into leagally uncertain waters, not my area of expertise but that is waht the fella was trying to point out.Still not getting it are you, it's not about how good or bad Steam is it's about being FORCED to install another companies software to play FM, like Lazaru the only PC game that I play is FM so being able to buy & install thousands of games via Steam is of absolutley no importance to me. Nothing illegal about it provided you're told in advance of the Steam requirement. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicmastermind124 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 What about digital downloads (non-steam)? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
milnerpoint Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 The difference is the user as elected to installed the 3rd party software, in this instance we are being forced to install the software which is where SEGA may have stepped into leagally uncertain waters, not my area of expertise but that is waht the fella was trying to point out I dont think there are any possible legal implications, they are not forcing you to now switch to steam for any of their products you currently own, they have made it perfectly clear if you want to play their new game you need to activate it through a free third party, if you dont want to use steam you dont buy their product. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I used to be just like you, then I had to use Steam for another title I wanted, resented it like hell:D but the benefits far outweigh any negatives and I realise now that my paranoid objection was just me feeling they were out to make me do something I didn't want to;) It's the only thing me & Ollie have in common. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wakers Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Also, Steam security is not the greatest. The biggest problem I have with STEAM is their abysmal customer support facilities. No phone, arbritary solutions (one size fits all) and, god forbid your account gets hacked, it can be pretty impossible to get it back - so all the money people have spent on games in their library has pretty much gone to waste. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazaru5 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I dont think there are any possible legal implications, they are not forcing you to now switch to steam for any of their products you currently own, they have made it perfectly clear if you want to play their new game you need to activate it through a free third party, if you dont want to use steam you dont buy their product. Exactly! And I won't Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
djvandyke Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 By preventing people who do not wish to install steam from activating a genuine copy you are promoting piracy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
telV7 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I don't want this. I don't want nor need Steam... not good Sega, not good at all I want a hard-copy of the game, ALWAYS, I don't use digital downloads I buy the disc...and then I'm going to be FORCED to install a piece of software that is invasive, intrusive, using resources unnecessarily, that I'm never going to use for anything else, its effin scandalous! I'm proper not happy! Achievments do not enhance my gaming experience, I don't care to automatic downloads as I'm quite capable of doing this myself & using torrents has always given me good download speeds because I'm not a leech.I'm sorry to say that unless I can be convinced that Steam has changed it will not be getting anywhere near my rig, I installed it when it was first used for FM activation & I removed it after 3 days because it was an intrusive, data mining annoyance that I had no trust or confidence in. My feelings are pretty much the same with those above. I don't like the idea of being made to use a programme that I will have absolutely no use for at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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