Football Manager 2017 Release Date and Pre Purchase Details Announced

[themadsheep2001]

This isn't aimed at you Asherware, but your (very constructive) points raise a personal bugbear of mine.

In feedback, you often hear people say "this can be improved" which is good, but never what they are looking for. I really hope the FM17 feedback this year is more constructive in that regard, rather than the circular this broken/not broken wheeel, because that is essentially the heart of what SI are looking for.

[themadsheep2001]

2 minutes ago, grade said:

Last game pre-order was Assassin's Creed Unity and it was problematic the way it was. I gave up after the first few days and it was a year later that I picked up the game again. never again. I prefer to wait for the period of the release, before buying a game.

It may sound that I might be impatient. What i'm impatient about is the game is to release in month. The beta at the latest will be released in two weeks and the promotion ends in a week (it ends in the 14th, right?). What do we know now? A teaser trailer, that shows very little. You need to watch frame by frame to see any differences in the screenshots. A Match preview that is 9 minutes long, with no sound (here some music or a commentary of the devs commenting the changes of match preview). The video by itself after the first few minutes becomes boring (it does, seriously).

There is nothing to get exited about FM17. To be fair makes me wonder, if some features that SI want to implement in this versions is working at all. To be this quiet for me is worrisome (my wild imagination begins to wonder all sort of things). I may be seriously wrong about this, but that is why I think is important marketing strategy of future versions should avoid this strategy.

There is no shadowy hand here. Their build up is aimed towards the beta and main release. Info is out mid october, so very soon. That builids straight into beta and launch

[Asherware]

2 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

In what way would you take any of those to the next level in one sweep?

Genuine question, as it's not as easy as people think. How can you implement something that might takes years into a yearly iteration without taking gradual steps?

What would you rip out and replace, and how and why?

Well, I'm not a game programmer just an avid fan that loves his footy management sim and wants it to be the best it can be. I do understand that just saying "make it better!" is far from helpful but I do believe that there could be different approaches to existing systems that would improve the game. I've never been a fan of the star rating system, for example. I am sure there must be a better way to rank the player database for the player to make it feel more organic. Training has been an after thought with little depth forever now and there HAS to be a better approach to it. What the exact minutia of how these features would work would take a lot more than me racking my brains to come up with but I believe that there is a next level you can take a lot of these systems that have just had bells and whistles tacked on over the years. Training and media for me is a good example of systems that I am SURE could be torn out and replaced from the ground up with something far more engaging and impressive than what we have now but I concede that I am not the one making the game so how difficult all this is I don't know. I do know that Football Manager is wildly popular and outsells itself every single year though. The studio rakes in a lot of paper and so I don't think it's that bad to expect some bigger changes every year than what we have seen the last 3 or so.

[Asherware]

6 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

This isn't aimed at you Asherware, but your (very constructive) points raise a personal bugbear of mine.

In feedback, you often hear people say "this can be improved" which is good, but never what they are looking for. I really hope the FM17 feedback this year is more constructive in that regard, rather than the circular this broken/not broken wheeel, because that is essentially the heart of what SI are looking for.

It's good to hear and I know that SI take a lot of care and interest in the community and do listen (new to posting on the forum but lurked for years) so at the very least you've given me some incentive to have a proper think and post something more constructive in the future for those parts of the game I still think are lacking. It is a lot easier said than done coming up with innovative and fun features for sure. I'm a dreamer though!

[themadsheep2001]

3 minutes ago, Asherware said:

It's good to hear and I know that SI take a lot of care and interest in the community and do listen (new to posting on the forum but lurked for years) so at the very least you've given me some incentive to have a proper think and post something more constructive in the future for those parts of the game I still think are lacking. It is a lot easier said than done coming up with innovative and fun features for sure. I'm a dreamer though!

For what it's worth, all the mods play the game heavily, and we all have our own ideas on areas where we think jumps could hopefully be taken *looks at the tactics creator interface*

[Cougar2010]

9 minutes ago, Asherware said:

Well, I'm not a game programmer just an avid fan that loves his footy management sim and wants it to be the best it can be. I do understand that just saying "make it better!" is far from helpful but I do believe that there could be different approaches to existing systems that would improve the game. I've never been a fan of the star rating system, for example. I am sure there must be a better way to rank the player database for the player to make it feel more organic. Training has been an after thought with little depth forever now and there HAS to be a better approach to it. What the exact minutia of how these features would work would take a lot more than me racking my brains to come up with but I believe that there is a next level you can take a lot of these systems that have just had bells and whistles tacked on over the years. Training and media for me is a good example of systems that I am SURE could be torn out and replaced from the ground up with something far more engaging and impressive than what we have now but I concede that I am not the one making the game so how difficult all this is I don't know. I do know that Football Manager is wildly popular and outsells itself every single year though. The studio rakes in a lot of paper and so I don't think it's that bad to expect some bigger changes every year than what we have seen the last 3 or so.

Training is arguably the area that has changed the most over the last 20 years.

SI have tried many variations of it in that time and what we have now is probably one of the best ways for it to function.

Many years ago SI tried in depth training, result was it was unpopular with the fanbase with most users simply setting it up when they joined the club and never touched it again.

Other ways have been OP & exploited by users leading to super players.

Its a case of trying to balance it to suit different playstyles while still making it useful, non-exploitive and with a semblance of realism.

[themadsheep2001]

Grade, you not liking something does not mean its the worst. It's this kind of sweeping statement (in contrast to asherware's points) that has no use or place in any kind of constructive discussion.

How do you make the graphics both less computer intensive and better looking? That's impossible.

The graphics are also only the beginning of what motion capturing can do, it is going to take time, and several iterations. They are actually already doing what you want them to, funnily enough

[grade]

If they are doing, then great. Not saying they should do it now. take the time they need.

Not liking something, is my opinion and I do not force anyone to follow it or obey it. It is simple statement what I think is good or not.

As for graphics being less computer intensive, is quite possible. Because the advancements in graphics was not new hardware, but also how you implement the software of the graphics and how to better use the resources of those new hardware, but also having APIs that help you in that process.

[themadsheep2001]

3 minutes ago, grade said:

If they are doing, then great. Not saying they should do it now. take the time they need.

Not liking something, is my opinion and I do not force anyone to follow it or obey it. It is simple statement what I think is good or not.

As for graphics being less computer intensive, is quite possible. Because the advancements in graphics was not new hardware, but also how you implement the software of the graphics and how to better use the resources of those new hardware, but also having APIs that help you in that process.

The hardware being on consumers computers, FM gamers typically being at the lower end of the power scale (the majority of FM gamers don't even use 64bit).

Much harder to optimise use of older hardware, through software only, which is why minimum specs rise each year throughout the industry

[eriktous]

4 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

the majority of FM gamers don't even use 64bit

You're kidding, right? That really amazes me.

[themadsheep2001]

2 minutes ago, eriktous said:

You're kidding, right? That really amazes me.

I'm deadly serious. I'll caveat this by saying this was from 5 or so months back, as that was the last time it was raised. But FM gamers are not on the same spectrum as your average PC gamer

[KUBI]

And there are still a lot of FM gamers who do not watch matches in 3-D, they still prefer 2-D or even commentary, so the game has to be designed for low, mid and high specs computers, which makes it not easy. 

[Asherware]

As far as the 3D match engine goes....it definitely does need some improvement. It looks pretty damn poor at the moment. Of course people play FM on low powered machines so they have to cater to that audience that doesn't have a beast PC but maybe having 3D classic (the current engine) and a totally new 3D engine for higher end PC's is an option. I went and had a look at PES 06 and FIFA 06 on youtube to remind myself of what it looked like back then. A decade back and I think most would agree that it looks way superior (especially in movement) than what we have in 2016 and even the low end laptops could run something like that with ease. FIFA and PES are not really that intensive anyway but I digress. Would love to see more flair in the match engine as well. I want to FEEL the difference in atmosphere on a CL final night compared to playing West Brom away, etc. We need trophy celebrations, dusts ups on the field, proper collision detection (aware how hard this is as previously mentioned but how much would it add, bettet crowds (think flags and flares on balmy continental Champions League nights). The game is so complex as it is and an incredible achievement when you think about it but what Football Manager lacks on match day is the FEEL of football and the excitement that goes with it. You can do a lot of that in your own head (and there is nothing wrong with that) but I think it's time to make match days more exciting than they are. 

 

 

 

[themadsheep2001]

Asherware, agree that more needs to be done with the match day feel. But it's going to be a gradual process I suspect. I doubt they could support and build two different sets of 3D animation. Remember that the AI between PES/FIFA and SI is very different. But agree the time is coming (i'd argue they are already pushing towards that). 

[tiago_wakabayashi]

On 03/10/2016 at 15:32, Cougar2010 said:

You tube link:

 

0:51 i haven't never like that unnecessary heading show.

Finally led adboards. I think it amazing. The problem I use adboard pack and they are static like the new model, i dunno if the new version will support them. But I would like to see the fanbase creating new ones to the new model.

I see it is more fluid, the movements.

4:10 I loved the BEHIND GOAL LOW CAM, it remembers the player cam of FIFA's Career Mode for GK.

4:50 Don't you think the GK very quiet to whose should be preparing yourself to a save? Where's the goalkeeping base to do the save? I mean, he kept in stand up like if his team weren't being attacked.

6:01 nice play

6:30 nice play, what a goal and it seems i see a new celebration

7:34 note the player near the GK when this catch the ball on the air: what's that little red thing on his head? 

 

On 03/10/2016 at 17:23, DP said:

I totally get the fact it will not be perfect. I just want as many known niggles and bugs ironed out as possible. 

The fact it's impossible for a goalkeeper to be sent off, for example, really bothers me. It's something that's a fairly regular part of football that cannot happen in the best manager game around. I know there are reasons why it isn't there but constant focus and improvement is enough for me. Would be nice if things happened faster but you can't have it all I guess. 

I don't understand it. In former versions the GK was sent off and he suffered fouls. Now he don't commit neither suffers fouls.

On 03/10/2016 at 17:40, stevemc said:

Animated LED ad board hoardings are a nice addition. Hopefully they can be edited but if not, then the static ones can be reused.

I hope it be editable and offers support to the old model too

On 04/10/2016 at 00:05, rooneyviet said:

anyone notices from the new video, 0:55 to 1:00, the passing in the middle is super weird?

 

When the midfielder pass the ball, why many players choose to header it? it's pretty weird, not just 1, but 2-3 players at the same time.

i hated when I see that old issue happening, tsc tsc

On 04/10/2016 at 04:41, amadeo said:

I would want a "manager's camera angle". From the actual sideline!

we want it!

[herne79]

@Asherware I know you've been responding to questions and making some constructive comments.  If you really want to get some ideas down and perhaps generate even more discussion, head over to the Feature Requests forum and get cracking in there.  Suggestions might get a little lost in this thread.  https://community.sigames.com/forum/353-football-manager-feature-requests/

[Asherware]

1 minute ago, herne79 said:

@Asherware I know you've been responding to questions and making some constructive comments.  If you really want to get some ideas down and perhaps generate even more discussion, head over to the Feature Requests forum and get cracking in there.  Suggestions might get a little lost in this thread.  https://community.sigames.com/forum/353-football-manager-feature-requests/

Thanks for the heads up. Now I've finally taken the plunge of joining the forum I feel I should definitely try and stick my oar in with some constructive ideas if i can!

[themadsheep2001]

Just now, Asherware said:

Thanks for the heads up. Now I've finally taken the plunge of joining the forum I feel I should definitely try and stick my oar in with some constructive ideas if i can!

Look forward to having a good read of your ideas. Hoping for the rest of the FM17 feedback to be this constructive

[talhak]

14 minutes ago, Asherware said:

I think it's time to make match days more exciting than they are.

That's true as some of us also have been saying it. So I said I'd like to hear the match sound in the 3D ME footage video.

- For the 32 bit - 64 bit issue, I think it is really necessary to provide builds through the client's system architecture as most software do in order to gain the advantages of 64 bit architecture. Surely, a data driven game such as FM, it will have a great effect on the game performance.

- I am aware there are still lots of players who watch matches in 2D but I really wonder its percentage. Any fact about it?

[Lord Rowell]

1 hour ago, themadsheep2001 said:

I'm deadly serious. I'll caveat this by saying this was from 5 or so months back, as that was the last time it was raised. But FM gamers are not on the same spectrum as your average PC gamer

@eriktous

I'm sure this is correct.

Without having data to hand, I suspect the demographic in terms of age re. FM players is different from most of the games market. We are I suspect, older. When I saw a thread here recently asking how old people were, the median age looked to be in late 30's, early 40's.

That demographic (of which I'm one) is less interested in high performance graphics, and, unless needed for work, we only upgrade when we need to as we use mainstream applications. Also a lot of playtime likely on tablets etc.

[themadsheep2001]

6 minutes ago, Lord Rowell said:

@eriktous

I'm sure this is correct.

Without having data to hand, I suspect the demographic in terms of age re. FM players is different from most of the games market. We are I suspect, older. When I saw a thread here recently asking how old people were, the median age looked to be in late 30's, early 40's.

That demographic (of which I'm one) is less interested in high performance graphics, and, unless needed for work, we only upgrade when we need to as we use mainstream applications. Also a lot of playtime likely on tablets etc.

Very much so.

Anecdotally, when you look at the "I need a computer for FM" threads, the budgets and requirements are very low spec compared to your average gamer.

The broad spectrum of appeal of FM is potentially also one of it's limitations. Double edged sword.

[forameuss]

And 64 bit probably won't make a massive amount of difference in the grand scheme of things anyway.  Processing will always be the bottleneck.

[talhak]

1 minute ago, forameuss said:

And 64 bit probably won't make a massive amount of difference in the grand scheme of things anyway.  Processing will always be the bottleneck.

Why not? Or better why not to benefit from the hardware resource we have already had!

[Neil Brock]

Must say as well reading through some of these posts, anyone who thinks an area can be improved, please do take the time to raise it on our features request part of the forum which can be found here - https://community.sigames.com/forum/353-football-manager-feature-requests/

Don't lose heart if no-one replies immediately. As you can imagine we're quite busy at the moment but I assure you each and every feature/improvement listed there will get looked at and reviewed before any version after FM17. 

If you don't like training for whatever reason, that's entirely up to you. If you can think you can improve it, use the features forum and hopefully make the game better for everyone! Thanks. 

[forameuss]

Just now, talhak said:

Why not? Or better why not to benefit from the hardware resource we have already had!

Because it's a processing heavy game.  SI could spend the large portion of their development time eking out tiny gains in making use of 64-bit, but it probably wouldn't increase performance in the same way that playing on a better processor will be.

The attitude often seems that 64-bit is going to be twice as good as 32-bit.  Nowhere near true.  64 bit allows you to address and make use of far more memory, but that's not going to help you process results, transfers, and general movements of the database.

It's all about balancing what's nice by what's necessary.  As themadsheep already said, people would be surprised at the systems people run the game on.  Just as many people come into the laptop thread asking for something on a budget of £300 as they do with huge budgets.  The beauty of the game is that you can play on low-to-middling systems.  Why would they spend considerable effort on something that would only bring small benefit to the minority?  Much better spending time optimising the processing, as they did for FM16, to make it faster for everyone, regardless of system.

[talhak]

1 minute ago, forameuss said:

Because it's a processing heavy game.  SI could spend the large portion of their development time eking out tiny gains in making use of 64-bit, but it probably wouldn't increase performance in the same way that playing on a better processor will be.

The attitude often seems that 64-bit is going to be twice as good as 32-bit.  Nowhere near true.  64 bit allows you to address and make use of far more memory, but that's not going to help you process results, transfers, and general movements of the database.

It's all about balancing what's nice by what's necessary.  As themadsheep already said, people would be surprised at the systems people run the game on.  Just as many people come into the laptop thread asking for something on a budget of £300 as they do with huge budgets.  The beauty of the game is that you can play on low-to-middling systems.  Why would they spend considerable effort on something that would only bring small benefit to the minority?  Much better spending time optimising the processing, as they did for FM16, to make it faster for everyone, regardless of system.

Minority? I am not sure. Many people care about game's performance while processing data (loading lots of leagues, huge player database, etc). Also there are lots of people who are big fan of 3D & care a lot about it (I am also one of them). Just look the highlights uploaded on YouTube & streams on Twitch, there are lots of smooth 1080p videos which requires a great graphics card.

 

I'm very well aware of the difference between 32 & 64 bit architecture mate, as I am a software engineer who mingles with big data. Since I am not aware of what is going in behind (due to I haven't work at SI & not aware of FM's software architecture), I can only predict the performance improvement due to huge amount of data to transferred & processed (this is an academic topic that lots of scientists have been discussing it for year but I agree that there is 30% speed improvement for compute-intensive software). Lots of new machines are also going to be 64 bit as some operating system vendors have already dropped 32 bit support. At the end of the day, there is no way to be away from IT trends. Not all smartphones FMM supports. Similarly, FMT do not support all tablets. I believe a high end & low end machine should be able to run FM but benefiting from its resources as much as possible. As what happens currently, low-end machines would run 3D with low detail & high-end ones would run with all details.

[forameuss]

1 minute ago, talhak said:

Minority? I am not sure. Many people care about game's performance while processing data (loading lots of leagues, huge player database, etc). Also there are lots of people who are big fan of 3D & care a lot about it (I am also one of them). Just look the highlights uploaded on YouTube & streams on Twitch, there are lots of smooth 1080p videos which requires a great graphics card.

 

I'm very well aware of the difference between 32 & 64 bit architecture mate, as I am a software engineer who mingles with big data. Since I am not aware of what is going in behind (due to I haven't work at SI & not aware of FM's software architecture), I can only predict the performance improvement due to huge amount of data to transferred & processed (this is an academic topic that lots of scientists have been discussing it for year but I agree that there is 30% speed improvement for compute-intensive software). Lots of new machines are also going to be 64 bit as some operating system vendors have already dropped 32 bit support. At the end of the day, there is no way to be away from IT trends. Not all smartphones FMM supports. Similarly, FMT do not support all tablets. I believe a high end & low end machine should be able to run FM but benefiting from its resources as much as possible. As what happens currently, low-end machines would run 3D with low detail & high-end ones would run with all details.

Get yer professions oot for the lads  And 32 to 64 bit improves processing right?  Because it's in the processor?

As I said, the bottleneck is always going to be there.  A 32 bit client running on an average processor isn't going to improve greatly in processing if it moves to 64 bit.  When it becomes worth their while, they'll probably phase it out.  Until then, I doubt there's much point.  If there was, they would've done it.

[talhak]

Just now, forameuss said:

Get yer professions oot for the lads  

This is not class from you @forameuss, and never my intention. You wrote that "The attitude often seems that 64-bit is going to be twice as good as 32-bit.  Nowhere near true.", so I said it. Anyway I am not here for unnecessary discussion. Have a nice day.

[forameuss]

6 minutes ago, talhak said:

This is not class from you @forameuss, and never my intention. You wrote that "The attitude often seems that 64-bit is going to be twice as good as 32-bit.  Nowhere near true.", so I said it. Anyway I am not here for unnecessary discussion. Have a nice day.

I said often.  I didn't say that was your view.  

To tie it up, it would make a difference, but people (again, not you) treat it like it's the holy grail.  I don't imagine it'll be a particularly simple task, so optimisation in processing is always going to be more worth it at this stage.  

[Tony Wright 747]

5 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

In what way would you take any of those to the next level in one sweep?

Genuine question, as it's not as easy as people think. How can you implement something that might takes years into a yearly iteration without taking gradual steps?

What would you rip out and replace, and how and why?

I don't include AI in this as that's developed on every year.

I would agree that FM does improve each year and some things cannot be improved in one year but asherware is right when he says that competition drives inovation and you can't help but wonder where FM would be if they had a decent competitor

[herne79]

12 minutes ago, Tony Wright 747 said:

I would agree that FM does improve each year and some things cannot be improved in one year but asherware is right when he says that competition drives inovation and you can't help but wonder where FM would be if they had a decent competitor

Competition can indeed help to drive innovation, and help guard against complacency.

As does a company's own desire, customer care, love of the product and, lets not forget, the profit motive.  Every business in the entire world, past, present and future, are in business for one reason only - to make money.  Any business worth it's salt doesn't necessarily need competition to innovate and thrive, simply because if they don't, people will stop buying their product and they don't make money.  And if you don't make money, you go out of business.

Can competition help?  Absolutely, but it's not necessary so long as the company involved has the desire, and I see no evidence of SI failing in that regard.

All that happens is that we, as a customer base, have higher and higher demands over and above what SI are actually capable of delivering at any one time.  SI want to deliver all (some? most?) that we want (and probably lots of other stuff that we haven't even thought of yet), and so long as SI want to do that - have the desire to do it - the game will continue to deliver, get better and innovate over many years to come.  

Further, lets not forget that we help drive the innovation simply by engaging with SI through this very forum and coming up with constructive criticism, feature requests and new ideas.  SI do listen and take note - they want to hear from us.  Scroll up half a dozen posts if anyone doesn't believe me.

Would we be better off for some competition?  Who knows.  But having competition isn't always necessary.

[Double0Seven]

Dont forget, its a damn game with 22 guys chasing a ball. Whats there to innovate every year? Were getting to a point where most major things are included and theres even slimmer versions of the game because its sometimes too 'complexed'. I doubt a lot of the average/more casual players bother to go fully in depth with things like training or micro managing players. Heck Im sure most of them dont even bother to go deep depth with tactics. Reminds me of a friend of mine who didnt know professionalism would help a player become a better player. Just looked blindly at the stars and didnt even know how the stars worked. Given he was a casual spending maybe a hour/day just spamming continue and seeing everything go fine with his club. We can add more things. but how much will it benefit the average/casual player or even attract new ones? Ive heard people say its too complexed and therefor they gave up on the full version and went playing the more simplified one. 

[CaptainSa]

2 hours ago, herne79 said:

Would we be better off for some competition?  Who knows.  But having competition isn't always necessary.

Thinking about it, I can't really think of anything introduced that seemed like it was done because SI had competition. BGS entries into the CM series were a mess and Total Club Manager/Fifa Manager were always much more gimmicky games than FM (e.g. building a girls' school so none of your academy players dropped out).

[moyesout]

This is what the Chief Data Analyst will deliver on #FM17  (so i copied)

 

 

[Shevchenko]

As long as the ME correctly transforms my tactic, I don't care about the quality of 3D, This ain't FIFA )

[Shevchenko]

2 minutes ago, moyesout said:

This is what the Chief Data Analyst will deliver on #FM17  (so i copied)

If only screenshots were in 1920*1080 for a better view... )

[roykela]

17 minutes ago, moyesout said:

This is what the Chief Data Analyst will deliver on #FM17  (so i copied)

 

 

 

I do like the look of that. Been wanting a more visual report in the news box for a while now.
Happy to see that.

[OlukitzFudgey]

28 minutes ago, moyesout said:

This is what the Chief Data Analyst will deliver on #FM17  (so i copied)

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GoCvuu0dlQ 

Hopefully, the Chief Data Analyst will also provide information on every individual player that participates in the match regardless of whether he is the best or worst player (e.g. requesting such a report from the Chief Data Analyst). This would be a great way to form opinions on the way players perform in various different tactics. The visual representation in the news screen is a big thumbs up from me.  

[moyesout]

for those that may not have seen this-15 min review with commentary.

I do like the visuals on display.

[grade]

This video sums up my reaction to the Match preview and all of the marketing strategy of FM17. You are free to disagree with me.

[Dagenham_Dave]

I turned that video off as soon as he says there isn't much difference between this and the 3d graphics in FM11. 

 

[KUBI]

 

 

[Dagenham_Dave]

It's the internet generation and the way they're absorbed in their overwhelming sense of entitlement. 

[MichaelBrown]

11 hours ago, KUBI said:

And there are still a lot of FM gamers who do not watch matches in 3-D, they still prefer 2-D or even commentary, so the game has to be designed for low, mid and high specs computers, which makes it not easy. 

To be fair, I know 6/7 people who play FM (who I'm friends with), and 5 of them play in 2D - they hate 3D if I'm honest. It's probably nostalgia, but they prefer the dots. 

I like that SI offer the option tbh, even if it makes it more difficult to program/whatever. 

PS, Im not an expert in computing 

 

[KUBI]

I remember the community was unsure about 2-D, a lot of them wanted to stay on commentary. 

[jimbo22]

19 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

I turned that video off as soon as he says there isn't much difference between this and the 3d graphics in FM11. 

 

Graphically it looks much better but the animation is still slightly flawed (the skating is still there that has been there since the ME appeared). Although when I play it I dont play with the 3D engine. Its the little things like the skating that annoyed me so I feel boog using 2D.

[sufcdan]

anyone know when the pre purchase discount ends for existing customers on steam?

[johnhughthom]

On 17/08/2016 at 15:00, Neil Brock said:

This pre-purchase offer is available until 11.59 GMT on Friday 14th October so be sure to get the deal wrapped-up well in advance - Pre-Purchase Now
 

Just over a week left.

[Svenc]

13 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Asherware, agree that more needs to be done with the match day feel. But it's going to be a gradual process I suspect. I doubt they could support and build two different sets of 3D animation. Remember that the AI between PES/FIFA and SI is very different. But agree the time is coming (i'd argue they are already pushing towards that). 

I hope they're not ever going down that fully TV kind of feel personally. Call me purist, but one of the appeals of FM to me is that it represents an alternate reality of football that is without at least some of the overblown and annoying things that go alongside to it: the way that even friendly matches are build-up as if it were a world cup final (and world cup finals being build and exploited and jazzed up as if they were second coming incarnate or the ridiculous showdown of a ridiculous Michael Bay movie), the match fixing, the corruption, etc. It's just a nice and simple sport, isn't it? Where they are definitely a tad purist is the way in which actually big occasions are handled, like, cup wins. But I think everybody knows that after most of the highlight settings actually skip what little confetti fanfare there is.

Aside of that, feedback of players is fine, but the thing is everybody's got an opinion about football -- and most of them are actually wrong, which includes journalists and punditry alike, more often than not. SI have the data and analyst connections, they have professionals and former ones to connect to, scouts, players, managers, keeper coaches -- I'd much rather want them to listen to their take as the guy who thinks that OMG WHY IS EVERY ONE ON ONE ON THE KEEPER MISSED WHEN MESSI CONVERTS LIKe 9 out of 10 in real football, well you get the drift. This actually includes me too... I can state opinions, but the actually development, I'd much rather get to see some actually professionals involved. There's been Ray Houghton historically checking stuff, class guy, but how much can Ray Houghton, a former midfielder/forward, tell you about how a fully professional goal keeper is trained ins and out to behave in a certain situation, for instance? Not that SI aren't doing that, mind, i.e. Mile's taking a look around Watford FC and Wimbledon . But whilst FM is the most realistic football game on the market, warts and all, at the core it's largely developed itself by enthusiastic fans themselves, isn't it?

 

[Powermonger]

1 hour ago, MichaelBrown said:

To be fair, I know 6/7 people who play FM (who I'm friends with), and 5 of them play in 2D - they hate 3D if I'm honest. It's probably nostalgia, but they prefer the dots. 

I like that SI offer the option tbh, even if it makes it more difficult to program/whatever. 

PS, Im not an expert in computing 

 

I play exclusively in 2D as well (classic view) because I enjoy the simplicity of it and because it ties back to tactical board analysis and tactical presentations you see either online or in football coaching books.

 

1 hour ago, KUBI said:

I remember the community was unsure about 2-D, a lot of them wanted to stay on commentary. 

I remember those days but 2D was the best inclusion ever in FM (go the ladybirds!). I remember the push for 3D back in the day, some of us were advocating a more Sensible Soccer style, but I know Miles and SI at the time were not in favour of putting in a 3D match engine.