Liverpool Thread 2012/13

[Select_screen_name:]

Our problem is our midfield, easily.

You got to ask the question "would you miss any of the players if they never played for us again?"

You look at them all, and the answer tends to be no. You'd only keep Sterling because he 'could' become good. The rest are replaceable.

[LRJ]

I'd miss Lucas <3

[Fancy Gaffot]

I don't remember any good games from Shelvey since his red card against mancs. He's been average at best in midfield and horrible in attack/on the wing.

[wayne'o]

How can a team Like Stoke that is accused of beeing just a brawling style of team play Liverpool of the park with there players?.. Rodgers so called passing style of football? since the shankly era when hasn't Liverpool been about pass and move?

This will probably upset alot of people i am starting to think Rodgers isn't the man for Liverpool, he doesn't have any ideas on how to change the way is going when it's out of our grasp. Or in terms of our squad! do we just simply have a team full of over rated idiots?

[SRL88]

To be fair, we made some good chances, even when 3-1 down but just didnt take them.

[Falahk]

How can a team Like Stoke that is accused of beeing just a brawling style of team play Liverpool of the park with there players?.. Rodgers so called passing style of football? since the shankly era when hasn't Liverpool been about pass and move?

This will probably upset alot of people i am starting to think Rodgers isn't the man for Liverpool' date=' he doesn't have any ideas on how to change the way is going when it's out of our grasp. Or in terms of our squad! do we just simply have a team full of over rated idiots?[/quote'] Rodgers was always going to be a short term failure, now it remains to be seen if the board and the fans have the patience to not kneejerk about the whole thing

[SRL88]

Rodgers was always going to be a short term failure, now it remains to be seen if the board and the fans have the patience to not kneejerk about the whole thing

You mean do a Chelsea?

In general, we haven't been going forward as a club. The last few seasons have been one step forward, two steps back. Rodgers is a long term project and the owners have to back him all the way. If people start turning on him we are never going to move forward and just be stuck in the same boat all the time.

[milnerpoint]

Lol give a guy a break, he inherited an awful squad from Kenny, possibly the worst ever Liverpool squad, well for as long as i can remember. It will take a few years for him to sort out the mess Liverpool are in.

[Razzler]

That's the thing, someone has to take on this job for at the very least a couple of years, oversee some changes, can't keep chopping and changing and they've decided it's Rogers. I don't think the Liverpool owners are expecting much this season but next season will be interesting

[SRL88]

That's the thing, someone has to take on this job for at the very least a couple of years, oversee some changes, can't keep chopping and changing and they've decided it's Rogers. I don't think the Liverpool owners are expecting much this season but next season will be interesting

I think that is when people can start judging him. By the start of next season, he has had a year to implement his theories etc and get rid of and bring in who he wants. Fully making it his squad and backroom team etc. By then, I fully expect us to be in a better position as a club.

[Falahk]

Lol give a guy a break, he inherited an awful squad from Kenny, possibly the worst ever Liverpool squad, well for as long as i can remember. It will take a few years for him to sort out the mess Liverpool are in.

Kenny may have botched a whole bunch of transfers, but by the end of the day Rodgers have still preformed worse in terms of results so far and its highly unlikely that Rodgers will finish higher then 8th this year

dont be silly, we both know that's enough to get a manager sacked at the end of the season........its both pointless and idiotic to sack Rodgers at this point (SRL have outlined some of the reasons for that already), but its still the most likely outcome

[Rhino]

I wouldn't say that sacking Rodgers is the most likely outcome. I think he'll get some moderate financial support in January and Summer, with the expectation clearly set that by December 2013 we should be somewhere between 3rd and 6th, and if he doesn't achieve that then he'll be sacked. (I think 5th is a realistic ambition in that timescale)

[Divinity]

I don't remotely buy that Rodgers being sacked in the next 12 months is a likely outcome.

[milnerpoint]

Kenny may have botched a whole bunch of transfers, but by the end of the day Rodgers have still preformed worse in terms of results so far and its highly unlikely that Rodgers will finish higher then 8th this year

dont be silly, we both know that's enough to get a manager sacked at the end of the season........its both pointless and idiotic to sack Rodgers at this point (SRL have outlined some of the reasons for that already), but its still the most likely outcome

Are they any worse off than last season? Finishing 8th will be a good season when you look at the players at his disposal. One striker in the whole squad, Downing having to slot in at left back, Shelvey getting a game full stop. The club is going to pay for the failings of Kenny for a few years i think, the money that was wasted on second rate players, Suarez aside, is astounding. £35M on Carol is probably the single worst ever transfer i can remember in modern times.

Rogers will get it right, if he is given time, you have to hope the Liverpool board is brave enough to give him the time required, otherwise you guys will just get worse and worse, who is there after Rogers that would want to touch the Liverpool job? If they sack him, it would be an awful decision, up with the Carol decsion.

[jep]

Lol give a guy a break, he inherited an awful squad from Kenny, possibly the worst ever Liverpool squad, well for as long as i can remember. It will take a few years for him to sort out the mess Liverpool are in.

Nonsense. Count the number of internationals within the squad and how many are captains of their country, along with the number of good young talents in there too. In his own words Rodgers described it as a squad with "Big Quality" when he took over. He inherited a squad more than capable of reaching top 8, then nearly £20mill to invest into it to shape it into his own style of play.

The guy's record is exactly the same as Hodgsons during his 31 game campaign in charge of us:

Hodgson - P31 W13 D9 L9 F41 A33 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Recouped £2.2mill

Rodgers - P31 W13 D9 L9 F48 A40 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Spent £16.4mill

All Rodgers has done is played the media and the fans with his talk of promising this great football he will deliver as long as he is given time. A good manager doesn't need that much time to make his mark at a club, and after 6 months I expected a lot more than this.

[milnerpoint]

Nonsense. Count the number of internationals within the squad and how many are captains of their country, along with the number of good young talents in there too. In his own words Rodgers described it as a squad with "Big Quality" when he took over. He inherited a squad more than capable of reaching top 8, then nearly £20mill to invest into it to shape it into his own style of play.

The guy's record is exactly the same as Hodgsons during his 31 game campaign in charge of us:

Hodgson - P31 W13 D9 L9 F41 A33 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Recouped £2.2mill

Rodgers - P31 W13 D9 L9 F48 A40 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Spent £16.4mill

All Rodgers has done is played the media and the fans with his talk of promising this great football he will deliver as long as he is given time. A good manager doesn't need that much time to make his mark at a club, and after 6 months I expected a lot more than this.

Going on then entertain me, name the captains of the international sides. The squad is awful, it really is.

"A good manager doesnt need that much time", that completely sums up whats wrong in football now a days. How long did it take Fergie before he won something at United?

[skybluedave]

Fergies more often then not the exception not the rule

[SRL88]

All Rodgers has done is played the media and the fans with his talk of promising this great football he will deliver as long as he is given time. A good manager doesn't need that much time to make his mark at a club, and after 6 months I expected a lot more than this.

Oh dear

[SRL88]

Fergies more often then not the exception not the rule

I think this is the prime example of what the club should be aiming for. Lets not forget that Fergie went a few seasons I think it was without doing anything and look where they are. Once he got things the way he wanted them they have shone. I have said it numerous times, Rodgers could do exactly the same work over time as Fergie has at United.

[milnerpoint]

Exactly my point, he was given time, now he has built one of the biggest and most successful clubs in the world. He didnt do it overnight, it took years of building teams to get up a level, then re-building them to take the next step. It wasnt a 6 month thing. He did the same with Aberdeen, he didnt win right away, it took a few years of re-building. Anyone who thinks a manager can completely change a club in 6 months is mental.

Rogers could build a dynesty at Liverpool, but only if the board and fans are brave enough. Sack him this season and you may as well write off next season.

[Robert the Spud]

Yeah, but you can say that about most managers. What has Rodgers done to persuade you he can build a dynasty at Liverpool, given time? Swansea are possibly even stronger now without him and Allen.

Fergie had a two really great managerial records on his CV before Utd, at St.Mirren and Aberdeen. So your assertion that Rodgers could produce a similar reign of success at Liverpool based on the few poor-ish seasons SAF had at UTD is pretty much without foundation.

[milnerpoint]

Your right, he is crap, sack him now and take in another manager, give him six months, and if your not top, sack the next guy, keep it going until you get there.

[SRL88]

Thanks for stealing my thunder milner. I was going to say that .

[skybluedave]

Then you'd both be missing the point of Spud's post. he's not saying he should be sacked now.

"What has Rodgers done to persuade you he can build a dynasty at Liverpool, given time?"

It is a valid question, which you both missed

[milnerpoint]

How about he built one of the best teams in the EPL to watch on a shoestring budget? Took Swansea up to the EPL for the first ever time? Left the club in a brilliant shape so the next guy could come in and take them them forward easily without having to completely re-build having re-built the playing squad himself? Is that not enough in the short time he has been a manager? In a couple of years he transformed a mid to bottom table championship team into an EPL side that can match it with the best on their day. Pretty damn impressive if you ask me.

[iamjerome]

brendan rodgers at swansea continued good work of 2 managers before him - one being roberto martinez at wigan by the way. it's pure fantasy he changed the club around from top to bottom because even the pass it from the back football had already existed there before him. obviously he deserves credit for doing as well as he did, but let's not pretend he's some pure success story, when he like laudrup now had just built on the foundations before him. plus let's not forget he had a hodgson esque disaster at reading too before he got his shot with swansea, where he was fired after about 6 months iirc.

[milnerpoint]

Ok i give up, you guys are right, he's not the man for the job, get rid now before you get relegated. I'm sure Mourinho will fall over himself to take over your massive club.

[tomtuck01]

How about he built one of the best teams in the EPL to watch on a shoestring budget? Took Swansea up to the EPL for the first ever time? Left the club in a brilliant shape so the next guy could come in and take them them forward easily without having to completely re-build having re-built the playing squad himself? Is that not enough in the short time he has been a manager? In a couple of years he transformed a mid to bottom table championship team into an EPL side that can match it with the best on their day. Pretty damn impressive if you ask me.

He didn't build Swansea. Kenny Jackett, Roberto Martinez, and Paulo Sousa did that.

[mynameistaro]

BR needs a plan B or Liverpool will be too predictable

[Falahk]

Are they any worse off than last season? Finishing 8th will be a good season

finishing 8th will be a regression with worse cup runs and all that

One striker in the whole squad, Downing having to slot in at left back, Shelvey getting a game full stop.

like it or not, Rodgers will have to take some of the blame for that clusterf*** of a transfer window he provided during the summer, the squad need this or that player you say?....then why was no left back or striker bought for example? while £15m was spent on a midfielder who's worse then Aquaman

Rogers will get it right, if he is given time, you have to hope the Liverpool board is brave enough to give him the time required, otherwise you guys will just get worse and worse, who is there after Rogers that would want to touch the Liverpool job? If they sack him, it would be an awful decision, up with the Carol decsion.

when have I suggested otherwise?

[Muzzza]

Rodgers COULD be a very good manager, he hasn't done enough yet to prove he is yet.. He did fantastic at Swansea in a great set up which as people have said has flourished under each manager that seems to take that job. At Reading he was a complete car crash and was deservedly fired after the mess they were in.

The jury is out on him, he might be the man long term, he might have just found a sweet spot at Swansea, I think it would be stupid for Liverpool to fire him until at least the summer though.

[milnerpoint]

I assume your meaning Allen?

[VamPook]

Allen worse than Aquilani....

hehehehehehehehe

[Kopite]

I don't remotely buy that Rodgers being sacked in the next 12 months is a likely outcome.

I think he could definitely be gone by the end of December 2013. We're far too easy to beat. Our only positive last season was that we were relatively solid. That's gone, and now we're far too easy to beat. I've said it before, forget this system for now. Play 4231 in a different way, more like Rafa used to. We need to be harder to break down, the premier league this season is pretty weak and hardly anybody has a decent defensive record. If we tighten up we will move up the table.

[CaptainPlanet]

Yay, post-loss thread posting \o/

[Kopite]

Nonsense. Count the number of internationals within the squad and how many are captains of their country, along with the number of good young talents in there too. In his own words Rodgers described it as a squad with "Big Quality" when he took over. He inherited a squad more than capable of reaching top 8, then nearly £20mill to invest into it to shape it into his own style of play.

The guy's record is exactly the same as Hodgsons during his 31 game campaign in charge of us:

Hodgson - P31 W13 D9 L9 F41 A33 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Recouped £2.2mill

Rodgers - P31 W13 D9 L9 F48 A40 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Spent £16.4mill

All Rodgers has done is played the media and the fans with his talk of promising this great football he will deliver as long as he is given time. A good manager doesn't need that much time to make his mark at a club, and after 6 months I expected a lot more than this.

Great post. Finally somebody else sees where I'm coming from.

[SRL88]

Yay, post-loss thread posting \o/

Unless you're SSN who finds reason to moan in victory .

[iamjerome]

Ok i give up, you guys are right, he's not the man for the job, get rid now before you get relegated. I'm sure Mourinho will fall over himself to take over your massive club.

i'm not even a liverpool fan, i'm just trying to help give you some context about brendan rodgers achievements because clearly you don't know much about him outside of his 1 season with swansea in the PL, that's all.

[Falahk]

Allen worse than Aquilani....

hehehehehehehehe

how is that so far fetched? Aqua move the ball faster, have more vision and is better at positioning himself on the pitch....have you even watched Aquilani play on regular basis over a full season in his natural role? Aqua would clearly have been your best playmaker had he stayed

ofcorse Aqua was a failure of a transfer since you payed us twise as much as he was worth in terms of transfer fee and gave him a massive wage (again probably twise as much as he deserved), but dont let this bit cloud your judgement on his ability

[Kopite]

Aquilani is far better than Allen in my opinion. Would've loved to have seen him get a proper run in the side at some point without injuries. Ran the game against Atletico in the semi of the Europa in Rafa's last season.

[SRL88]

I really though Aquilani would have been given a chance last season under Kenny but clearly he felt Adam was the man for him.

[SCIAG]

brendan rodgers at swansea continued good work of 2 managers before him - one being roberto martinez at wigan by the way. it's pure fantasy he changed the club around from top to bottom because even the pass it from the back football had already existed there before him. obviously he deserves credit for doing as well as he did, but let's not pretend he's some pure success story, when he like laudrup now had just built on the foundations before him. plus let's not forget he had a hodgson esque disaster at reading too before he got his shot with swansea, where he was fired after about 6 months iirc.

He didn't build Swansea. Kenny Jackett, Roberto Martinez, and Paulo Sousa did that.

This is true (though "Hodgson-esque" is too kind- we went from automatic promotion contenders to relegation contenders).

What Rodgers did at Swansea was find a balance between the attacking possession football that didn't win many games (used by the likes of Roberto Martinez at Swansea and now Wigan, and Sean O'Driscoll at Doncaster) and the defensive possession football that is frankly horrible to watch and also hadn't had any success in the Championship (used by Paulo Sousa at Swansea and Rodgers himself at Reading). And for what it is worth, I think Rodgers did as much or more to "build" that side as Jackett and Sousa- he signed Sinclair and Taylor, brought Britton back, and made Allen a regular, then added Graham, Vorm and Caulker after promotion, then Sigurdsson the next January.

[SRL88]

Did Britton not leave on a free SCIAG?

[Gizzy]

The guy's record is exactly the same as Hodgsons during his 31 game campaign in charge of us:

Hodgson - P31 W13 D9 L9 F41 A33 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Recouped £2.2mill

Rodgers - P31 W13 D9 L9 F48 A40 GD+8 - Net Transfer Spend - Spent £16.4mill

Think this is a little unfair, what about each managers possession stats over the same period Or the amount of times they had their team hit the woodwork? you've left out the most important stats

[SCIAG]

Did Britton not leave on a free SCIAG?

Yeah, that's true. He'd signed for Sheffield United before Rodgers joined Swansea. Okay, fixed.

[martplfc1]

So, could be down to 13th if we lose to QPR.

We need A LOT better than Sturridge and Ince to sort this mess out. There's so much wrong with our squad it's difficult to put your finger on what we need.

[Robert the Spud]

Your right, he is crap, sack him now and take in another manager, give him six months, and if your not top, sack the next guy, keep it going until you get there.

Thanks for stealing my thunder milner. I was going to say that .

Wow, I didn't expect such a childish response Milnerpoint. You're comparing Ferguson's experience to Liverpool/Rodgers and I'm pointing out that they have no relevance to eachother. FWIW, I don't think Rodgers should be sacked at all, though I'm happy that Tottenham didn't approach him last summer.

[Kopite]

I think there is massive pressure to get a result at QPR now to be honest. We've got a very difficult January so if we head into it on the back of two defeats we could slip down the table quite quickly. I don't think there's too many who want Brendan out at the minute but the number is growing. January could make up a lot of peoples minds.

[jmr]

Think this is a little unfair, what about each managers possession stats over the same period Or the amount of times they had their team hit the woodwork? you've left out the most important stats

Exactly, just compare the smile leagues now to when Hodgson was in-charge.

When's Lucas back?

[Divinity]

The comparison to Hodgson is absurd regardless, he inherited a squad missing only one player from the team that finished 2nd in the league. Comparing Rodgers to him when Rodgers inherited a team finishing 8th, devoid of creative quality and filled with terrible purchases is just stupid looking at results alone.

Amazed jep has posted that, thought he was one of the most patient, level-headed folk in here, and his post stinks of looking at no other factors than results.