Football Manager 2024 Official Feedback Thread

[SHK-555]

Appreciate the heads up about the upcoming patch. I'm ok with them not touching the M.E even though I think goalkeepers could be tightened up and late goals could be less, but you can look at the chelsea united game to see that late comebacks do happen, it's still great and it's probably safer not to touch it in case it screws something else up. Happy with the M.E but player interaction should definitely be looked into a lot better

[Hzano123]

26 minutes ago, SHK-555 said:

Appreciate the heads up about the upcoming patch. I'm ok with them not touching the M.E even though I think goalkeepers could be tightened up and late goals could be less, but you can look at the chelsea united game to see that late comebacks do happen, it's still great and it's probably safer not to touch it in case it screws something else up. Happy with the M.E but player interaction should definitely be looked into a lot better

Agree. I hope the minor game play update they mention touch a little bit on player interactions

[SHK-555]

The one thing I don't get is if they knew they weren't touching the M.E because they were satisfied with it then why did they leave the bug tracker open and let people wast their time reporting bugs?

[forameuss]

2 hours ago, SHK-555 said:

The one thing I don't get is if they knew they weren't touching the M.E because they were satisfied with it then why did they leave the bug tracker open and let people wast their time reporting bugs?

And where exactly have they explicitly said they are "satisfied with it"?  I'd be surprised if that's ever the case.  It's almost like there's a lot more to fixing something in a complicated system than a Disneyland style "if you just wish hard enough".

[d d]

Your right there, this announcement should of come out in March, because we are already in early April, and it won't be released today. 

[LucasBR]

I guess I was wrong in my prediction, if they posted yesterday that the final data update will be coming early April my guess now it’ll arrive next week, no reason to release it after it 

[SHK-555]

1 hour ago, forameuss said:

And where exactly have they explicitly said they are "satisfied with it"?  I'd be surprised if that's ever the case.  It's almost like there's a lot more to fixing something in a complicated system than a Disneyland style "if you just wish hard enough".

''there will be no further changes to the Match Engine in this final update. With every release of Football Manager, our Match team strive to elevate the matchday experience and step closer to creating the perfect simulation of real-world football. With FM24, we're proud of the progress we've made towards that goal with the best match experience in the series to date''

[kiingallen]

11 minutes ago, SHK-555 said:

''there will be no further changes to the Match Engine in this final update. With every release of Football Manager, our Match team strive to elevate the matchday experience and step closer to creating the perfect simulation of real-world football. With FM24, we're proud of the progress we've made towards that goal with the best match experience in the series to date''

Where can I find this? 

[LucasBR]

21 minutes ago, kiingallen said:

Where can I find this? 

There’s a topic detailing this on the general discussion page

[kiingallen]

8 minutes ago, LucasBR said:

There’s a topic detailing this on the general discussion page

Thank you - found it. 

[tropicsafc]

FM has never been unplayable for me but what a major let down the last 2 editions have been.

[kiingallen]

20 minutes ago, tropicsafc said:

FM has never been unplayable for me but what a major let down the last 2 editions have been.

13 and the last 2 off the top of my head have been painful experiences for me personally 

[wazzaflow10]

18 hours ago, g1nh0 said:

Oh indeed, they will always work to a reasonable extent - and they jolly well should do. But still, it's a computer game at the end of the day and certain roles / settings will always perform better than others. You just need to look at how on tactic testing websites, how certain systems will either become more or less effective following a new patch, and how different formations may end up being stronger following an update.

This year, as long as you employ double DM-S' it's going to be hard to go wrong as a lot of the very successful tactics utilise them.

Sorry not to pile onto you here but you're going out of your way to find websites that produces tactics designed to break the match engine and then claim the game is too easy? I know you can't "unlearn" a glitch but of course the game will be easy if you're trying to break it.

[tezcatlipoca665]

8 hours ago, SHK-555 said:

The one thing I don't get is if they knew they weren't touching the M.E because they were satisfied with it then why did they leave the bug tracker open and let people wast their time reporting bugs?

For FM25. They should've been clear that they're not touching FM24's ME in the first place. I get why, and the reason is kinda obvious imo - they've ported animations and code over to FM25 at a certain cutoff date and continued working with Unity from there, making it pointless to tweak FM24's engine because they'd have to simultaneously figure out how to make those changes work with FM25 at whatever stage it was/is at so they'd be present in the new release. How many months had they been working on FM25's engine before FM24's was finalized? It's almost certainly at least over a year's worth of difference between both game engines.

But again, they should've clarified this, even if it risked making people unhappy back in November or whenever. I don't buy the 'we're happy with the match engine' reason so much as 'we're not getting tangled up making changes in the old engine and then figuring out how to implement those changes in the new engine this far into development'. The only changes made with the match engine through the patches with this edition were cosmetic - Champions League ball updated, weather effects showing, player appearance glitches, and others.

[themadsheep2001]

They did the exact same thing last year. Its less to do with Unity and a lot more to do with looking to work on the next match engine iteration. And the changes to this match engine this season havent been only been cosmetic either. 

[g1nh0]

1 hour ago, wazzaflow10 said:

Sorry not to pile onto you here but you're going out of your way to find websites that produces tactics designed to break the match engine and then claim the game is too easy? I know you can't "unlearn" a glitch but of course the game will be easy if you're trying to break it.

Incorrect. I don't use any tactics that break the engine and create all of my own - but when you're playing online and trying to manage / prevent others from using them, you have to have a degree of knowledge of what ones are proven to exploit the engine. And so when you end up viewing the list of them, you can clearly see there are many issues with game / role balancing.

[whatsupdoc]

12 minutes ago, g1nh0 said:

Incorrect. I don't use any tactics that break the engine and create all of my own - but when you're playing online and trying to manage / prevent others from using them, you have to have a degree of knowledge of what ones are proven to exploit the engine. And so when you end up viewing the list of them, you can clearly see there are many issues with game / role balancing.

Same for me. 

We've banned low crosses and focus out wide and it's nerfing most of the OP systems and making for a fun network game. 

[tezcatlipoca665]

30 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

They did the exact same thing last year. Its less to do with Unity and a lot more to do with looking to work on the next match engine iteration. And the changes to this match engine this season havent been only been cosmetic either. 

What changes were made to the match engine? The only one I can see that comes close is goalkeeper injury frequency, and that's not really anything other than reducing the chance of them occurring. I'm not counting AI manager team selection, player morale with team talks and substitution logic either - those aren't match engine changes.

Edited April 5 by tezcatlipoca665

[tezcatlipoca665]

It's also just flat-out not true. FM23 had multiple match engine fixes in its February update. Changes to how players react, defend, attack - it's all there.

[themadsheep2001]

5 minutes ago, tezcatlipoca665 said:

What changes were made to the match engine? The only one I can see that comes close is goalkeeper injury frequency, and that's not really anything other than reducing the chance of them occurring. I'm not counting AI manager team selection, player morale with team talks and substitution logic either - those aren't match engine changes.

Look at 24.2 update patch notes. They are not cosmetic 

https://community.sigames.com/forums/topic/580614-major-update-242-for-football-manager-2024-now-live/

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, tezcatlipoca665 said:

It's also just flat-out not true. FM23 had multiple match engine fixes in its February update. Changes to how players react, defend, attack - it's all there.

This also wasnt the last update either. There was a march update. And they also did say they would finish updating this ME earlier at the start of FM24. It shouldn't have been a surprise 

[tezcatlipoca665]

3 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Look at 24.2 update patch notes. They are not cosmetic 

https://community.sigames.com/forums/topic/580614-major-update-242-for-football-manager-2024-now-live/

Fair. To be honest, I forgot this was even released since it was only about 3 weeks after the official release. Everything since this has been cosmetic. I just don't understand the 'it shouldn't have been a surprise' comment considering FM23 definitely did continue to update and tweak the ME. Did SI seriously make it clear in an announcement that they were finished updating and tweaking the ME?

[wazzaflow10]

25 minutes ago, g1nh0 said:

Incorrect. I don't use any tactics that break the engine and create all of my own - but when you're playing online and trying to manage / prevent others from using them, you have to have a degree of knowledge of what ones are proven to exploit the engine. And so when you end up viewing the list of them, you can clearly see there are many issues with game / role balancing.

I don't want to get into a debate of what you do or don't do. Just pointing out that saying the game is too easy while using or having knowledge of what breaks the engine is kind of ironic. Personally I only play offline so I don't have any need to go to these testing sites that may or may not be 'testing' correctly. If I did play online and someone was incessant on creating wonky formations or using roles/tactics that didn't seem grounded in basic tactical principles or obvious attempts to break the engine I'd probably just not play with them. I'd just tell them cool, you've broken the game I guess you're "the best" and move on. If that's fun for them, congrats on copying someone else's work and getting enjoyment out of that.

I'm sure the game could be impossible if SI wanted it to be by letting the top AI managers have more creative freedom and view the details of your tactic to exploit every weakness instantly. I don't think that would be realistic but it could probably be done. There's always going to be exploits. I wouldn't call the game easy because of the presence of them.

[g1nh0]

32 minutes ago, wazzaflow10 said:

I don't want to get into a debate of what you do or don't do. Just pointing out that saying the game is too easy while using or having knowledge of what breaks the engine is kind of ironic. Personally I only play offline so I don't have any need to go to these testing sites that may or may not be 'testing' correctly. If I did play online and someone was incessant on creating wonky formations or using roles/tactics that didn't seem grounded in basic tactical principles or obvious attempts to break the engine I'd probably just not play with them. I'd just tell them cool, you've broken the game I guess you're "the best" and move on. If that's fun for them, congrats on copying someone else's work and getting enjoyment out of that.

I'm sure the game could be impossible if SI wanted it to be by letting the top AI managers have more creative freedom and view the details of your tactic to exploit every weakness instantly. I don't think that would be realistic but it could probably be done. There's always going to be exploits. I wouldn't call the game easy because of the presence of them.

I think until you've experienced online play with a large number of players, then you won't be able to appreciate any of the issues. As you've said yourself you only play offline, so it won't effect you in any way. But if you did, you would get it.

[wazzaflow10]

10 minutes ago, g1nh0 said:

I think until you've experienced online play with a large number of players, then you won't be able to appreciate any of the issues. As you've said yourself you only play offline, so it won't effect you in any way. But if you did, you would get it.

I mean i've played various competitive online games enough to know that it sucks I don't think there's anything to learn.

If the online gameplay for FM is that toxic why bother unless you're playing with people you know? The game itself isn't too easy. Its that there's no repercussions for essentially using known glitches playing online. If that's how people want to play good for them I guess. I suppose there's a sense of accomplishment when you're just copying the latest "best" tactic from a website designed to break the engine. I don't get it though. Maybe when I was 12 that would have been fun.

[g1nh0]

4 minutes ago, wazzaflow10 said:

I mean i've played various competitive online games enough to know that it sucks I don't think there's anything to learn.

If the online gameplay for FM is that toxic why bother unless you're playing with people you know? The game itself isn't too easy. Its that there's no repercussions for essentially using known glitches playing online. If that's how people want to play good for them I guess. I suppose there's a sense of accomplishment when you're just copying the latest "best" tactic from a website designed to break the engine. I don't get it though. Maybe when I was 12 that would have been fun.

Well, having played games generally in an online environment for donkey's years, it's impossible to go back to pure single play, at least for me. I find it too boring offline, and there's no sense of excitement playing solo, not for a prolonged period anyway.

I don't get it either tbh, but from experience a good 80% or so that do play on will utilise something broken. Which again, for someone that tweaks constantly during games vs different profile of sides and different scenarios / points during the game etc (which works great vs the AI), to then come up against a system designed with no footballing logic behind it which shouldn't work, but once plugged in suddenly becomes unplayable against, and then further seeing players being played completely out of position in that system that don't even suit their own strengths (such as an AM as the OP's DM-S this year) within that system, but still working fantastically well, then you know something is seriously wrong 

It's been a lot more of an issue in this year's game compared to last year's, that being the exploits / role imbalances and the not even needing players suited to play that role to play it, is one of the reason's I've been extremely disappointed with this year's game, and in comparison to last year's, has been a huge downgrade and why it's felt significantly less realistic playing this year's FM, and a lot less online friendly.

And I also know a lot of players have actually decided to even stop playing the game online this year due to this, because it ruins the enjoyment for them.

I was expecting progression and especially given online gaming is always gaining in popularity, more of an emphasis to design a game that can cater for that well. But at least on this front, it's been a step backwards this year.

Personally, I think the implementation of positional play is what has broken this year's game.

[RDF Tactics]

12 hours ago, SHK-555 said:

The one thing I don't get is if they knew they weren't touching the M.E because they were satisfied with it then why did they leave the bug tracker open and let people wast their time reporting bugs?

Was my point a couple weeks back. That sort of stuff has made me uninterested in even trying to communicate anymore. When I mean communicate, talking about using my time giving feedback, reporting stuff etc.

I've wasted hours (no exaggeration) over the months and it could've been avoided. From my part, lesson learnt. Not worth the hassle.

That's not an attempt to discourage others from reporting bugs and stuff, by the way. Just for me, my experience, this year told me a lot of things about how things work with them.

Edited April 5 by RDF Tactics

[santy001]

I'd see the point in that sentiment if they'd announced the shutters were coming down and this was the end of the FM series with the IP to be shelved. That is not the case though though. SI have always been open that the ME is one of the most sensitive areas to bug fixes because a fix to Bug A can result in Bug X, Y and Z appearing or it can even just result in a match engine that feels worse overall as it alters balance in other areas. 

At a certain point there has to be a discussion about whether the ME with the current fixes in place, and changes from the ME team, provide a superior experience to players than the existing live ME. If the answer to that is no, then the question has to be asked can that be done in time for submission for the patch. If the answer is still no that is going to determine whether the next patch gets an ME update or not. Naturally people playing the game will think of things in patch cycles but SI do have to think of it in longer time frames. SI could have dropped an updated ME under the proviso that they won't accept any bug posts on it because it isn't the basis for the ME longer term and pointed out it has a whole load of different issues... but at least it'd be different. 

I believe there was a video with Nic Madden a while back where he even outlined there were times when they would implement quicker fixes (such as making teams shots miss more often) but had moved the needle further to attempting to fix issues like excessive chance creation through changes to defensive play. If people would prefer ME updates every patch and just take that come what may then that is something people can argue for. 

[wazzaflow10]

27 minutes ago, g1nh0 said:

Well, having played games generally in an online environment for donkey's years, it's impossible to go back to pure single play, at least for me. I find it too boring offline, and there's no sense of excitement playing solo, not for a prolonged period anyway.

I don't get it either tbh, but from experience a good 80% or so that do play on will utilise something broken. Which again, for someone that tweaks constantly during games vs different profile of sides and different scenarios / points during the game etc (which works great vs the AI), to then come up against a system designed with no footballing logic behind it which shouldn't work, but once plugged in suddenly becomes unplayable against, and then further seeing players being played completely out of position in that system that don't even suit their own strengths (such as an AM as the OP's DM-S this year) within that system, but still working fantastically well, then you know something is seriously wrong 

It's been a lot more of an issue in this year's game compared to last year's, that being the exploits / role imbalances and the not even needing players suited to play that role to play it, is one of the reason's I've been extremely disappointed with this year's game, and in comparison to last year's, has been a huge downgrade and why it's felt significantly less realistic playing this year's FM, and a lot less online friendly.

And I also know a lot of players have actually decided to even stop playing the game online this year due to this, because it ruins the enjoyment for them.

I was expecting progression and especially given online gaming is always gaining in popularity, more of an emphasis to design a game that can cater for that well. But at least on this front, it's been a step backwards this year.

Personally, I think the implementation of positional play is what has broken this year's game.

See I found last year's game completely unplayable with the CB's being fatigued by halftime and away teams being nerfed so badly it was almost futile expecting anything but a draw at best unless you were a top team and even then it was a struggle to score more than 1 goal. PL teams were regularly conceding fewer than 10 goals a season at home. That's happened maybe twice in the past 15 years.

I think positional play improved the match engine. Perhaps opened up a few exploits but its hard to argue that it isn't an improvement when players recognize where each other are in space and work together. This year at least what I envision what a tactic should be doing actually happens more often than not and there's fewer wtf moments. I do think defending, particularly positioning, can be improved - if not in mechanically at least visually. My moments of frustration often happen when my central midfield disappear from what they should be doing defensively. But attacking-wise there's a been a big improvement for me compared to 23.

I disagree somewhat that their focus is the online portion of the game considering they don't seem to police how the game is played there. I have to think they're aware of the match engine exploits that occur and either can't fix it without breaking the normal part of the game or have decided that it isn't worth the time and effort to rectify these issues individually. There's simply not enough time to try out every single formation and every single combination of role/duty and determine if the formation is breaking something and put a fix in to penalize you for using it.

[wazzaflow10]

4 minutes ago, santy001 said:

(such as making player shots miss more often) but had moved the needle further to attempting to fix issues like excessive chance creation through changes to defensive play

you don't mean human player here right? the on field players in the game. Just clarifying before it turns into a "see told you SI rigged the game against us".

[santy001]

2 minutes ago, wazzaflow10 said:

you don't mean human player here right? the on field players in the game.

I do mean the actual players within the ME. Given how I've used players in both sense in that post I've corrected it. 

[wazzaflow10]

8 minutes ago, santy001 said:

I do mean the actual players within the ME. Given how I've used players in both sense in that post I've corrected it. 

Yeah i figured but did a double take reading like wait a minute. thanks.

[g1nh0]

43 minutes ago, wazzaflow10 said:

See I found last year's game completely unplayable with the CB's being fatigued by halftime and away teams being nerfed so badly it was almost futile expecting anything but a draw at best unless you were a top team and even then it was a struggle to score more than 1 goal. PL teams were regularly conceding fewer than 10 goals a season at home. That's happened maybe twice in the past 15 years.

I think positional play improved the match engine. Perhaps opened up a few exploits but its hard to argue that it isn't an improvement when players recognize where each other are in space and work together. This year at least what I envision what a tactic should be doing actually happens more often than not and there's fewer wtf moments. I do think defending, particularly positioning, can be improved - if not in mechanically at least visually. My moments of frustration often happen when my central midfield disappear from what they should be doing defensively. But attacking-wise there's a been a big improvement for me compared to 23.

I disagree somewhat that their focus is the online portion of the game considering they don't seem to police how the game is played there. I have to think they're aware of the match engine exploits that occur and either can't fix it without breaking the normal part of the game or have decided that it isn't worth the time and effort to rectify these issues individually. There's simply not enough time to try out every single formation and every single combination of role/duty and determine if the formation is breaking something and put a fix in to penalize you for using it.

That's what is most frustrating about this year's game - for me it was very close to being very good on the ME front with the implementation of positional play, and possibly the best.

A few tweaks to reduce the exploits and increasing the difficulty level, at this point of the game cycle (being the opportunity to tweak these aspects in the last couple of patches) would have made it a more balanced game both on the online front and more challenging on the solo front, which a number of players have called for.

But I think you're right in that, well I would like to think if SI felt they could have improved things on both these fronts, then they would have because both have been issues that have been identified very early and both which desperately needed looking into - and if rectified, would have left the final game in a very good state.

So either it is a case of they couldn't fix it and decided to leave it, or they just decided not to spend anytime on it as it wasn't a priority for them.

Whatever the case, just a shame that it appears nothing is changing, which would as a whole, will have improved the game and given this last edition before FM 25 a great send off.

But as you know, I will still be checking it out and make my own observations 

[themadsheep2001]

6 hours ago, tezcatlipoca665 said:

Fair. To be honest, I forgot this was even released since it was only about 3 weeks after the official release. Everything since this has been cosmetic. I just don't understand the 'it shouldn't have been a surprise' comment considering FM23 definitely did continue to update and tweak the ME. Did SI seriously make it clear in an announcement that they were finished updating and tweaking the ME?

Sorry missed the fact you had responded. I'll have to dig out the post itselt, but i would say the fact that i have to dig it out lends to the very problem, it should be signposted better. And i dont mean at the start, but throughout. And its something we've fed back directly to them. If something needs to be pushed back to a later release, so be it, but let people know. 

[Socerer 01]

7 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

This also wasnt the last update either. There was a march update. And they also did say they would finish updating this ME earlier at the start of FM24. It shouldn't have been a surprise 

May I know where this was specified? 

[kiwityke1983]

5 hours ago, g1nh0 said:

 

A few tweaks to reduce the exploits and increasing the difficulty level, at this point of the game cycle (being the opportunity to tweak these aspects in the last couple of patches) would have made it a more balanced game both on the online front and more challenging on the solo front, which a number of players have called for.

I said this early on in FM24's cycle when people brought this up, the more options I as an experienced FM player get given tactically the more my advantage over the AI grows and the more room for "exploits" there are if playing against another human or the AI and the easier it gets to win.

As awful as the sliders were back in the day they made the game way harder because there was some form of abstraction between my tactical ideas and implementing them.

Now especially with positional play I can absolutely destroy the AI because the abstraction has gone with the new tactical interface and so has a lot of the limitations on defensive and attacking shape plus rest defence.

Throw in the AI's struggles with squad building and transfers and I'm now lightyears ahead of it.

I think the need to give players ever more tactical control they demand and close the exploits this creates in the ME is basically an impossible circle to close for SI.

Not even touching on accessibility and keeping the game somewhat playable and fun for new players because you don't want people being put off by being absolutely destroyed every match they play straight off and or have to read 200 page tactical bibles just to win a game.

 

[thepandaken]

Switched from FM22 and the match engine is so much more realistic in 24. It reminds me of playing a PS2 game for the first time coming from the original PS1.

 

My only criticism so far is the nickname for Morecambe FC isn't right. They're not "the Shrimpers," they're "the Shrimps." (Upon some digging, I think the 20 league deep database is the source, not the official SI one) Which, by the way, how can I go about changing that in my save? Or will I need to make an edit to a file somewhere and restart the save?

Edited April 6 by thepandaken

[g1nh0]

3 hours ago, kiwityke1983 said:

Not even touching on accessibility and keeping the game somewhat playable and fun for new players because you don't want people being put off by being absolutely destroyed every match they play straight off and or have to read 200 page tactical bibles just to win a game.

 

On this particular aspect, that's why I think there is only one solution - two versions of the game. I wouldn't mind seeing FM Touch make a return for that purpose. It can bed new players into the game, and also be used by the more casual player that has less time to micromanage things - which you could do in the full version of the game. And when a player feels confident enough to move to the full game, then they can do so.

And so the level of difficulty can also be adjusted accordingly, meaning Touch can be a little bit easier, and the full version much more aiming to be realistic. This at least would make the single player version of the game cater for a much wider number of players, that being the game being enjoyed by more players as it can be aimed at both the more skilled and newer/casual players.

Edited April 6 by g1nh0

[kiwityke1983]

2 hours ago, g1nh0 said:

On this particular aspect, that's why I think there is only one solution - two versions of the game. I wouldn't mind seeing FM Touch make a return for that purpose. It can bed new players into the game, and also be used by the more casual player that has less time to micromanage things - which you could do in the full version of the game. And when a player feels confident enough to move to the full game, then they can do so.

And so the level of difficulty can also be adjusted accordingly, meaning Touch can be a little bit easier, and the full version much more aiming to be realistic. This at least would make the single player version of the game cater for a much wider number of players, that being the game being enjoyed by more players as it can be aimed at both the more skilled and newer/casual players.

The difficulty with this as I say in the first bit of my post is creating an AI capable of competing with a human tactically with all the options now at our disposal.

Until you can manage that which even though AI is supposed to make us all unemployed by next Thursday, is years off being even close to a reality, the idea of making the game harder naturally is a bit moot.

[Wolf_pd]

On 05/04/2024 at 08:54, SHK-555 said:

The one thing I don't get is if they knew they weren't touching the M.E because they were satisfied with it then why did they leave the bug tracker open and let people wast their time reporting bugs?

In general IT terms, while a certain release will be 'locked', users can always find bugs. So, while it won't be fixed in FM24, it might be helpfull unearthing bugs in the FM25 build (because FM24 code was re-used) and that helps us all. No waste of time in that case.

[DolphinSpain]

53 minutes ago, Wolf_pd said:

In general IT terms, while a certain release will be 'locked', users can always find bugs. So, while it won't be fixed in FM24, it might be helpfull unearthing bugs in the FM25 build (because FM24 code was re-used) and that helps us all. No waste of time in that case.

Definitely a waste of time if the person bought this product and invested time and energy into bug reports without the intention of buying FM25 with the hope that this product might be fixed. If you cannot see that then this is where it's glaringly obvious where SI don't really care about the consumer nor the the product they release yearly. Totally unacceptable behaviour. 

[SHK-555]

1 hour ago, Wolf_pd said:

In general IT terms, while a certain release will be 'locked', users can always find bugs. So, while it won't be fixed in FM24, it might be helpfull unearthing bugs in the FM25 build (because FM24 code was re-used) and that helps us all. No waste of time in that case.

that's all fine, but it's still misleading for people reporting with the belief there will be taken into account for a future patch for fm24. I give the benefit of the doubt that Maybe SI were still open to changing something in the M.E if something fundamentally was game breaking but still believe they could have communicated and given people the heads up about non changes a lot earlier and or closed the bugs forum

[XaW]

3 hours ago, DolphinSpain said:

Definitely a waste of time if the person bought this product and invested time and energy into bug reports without the intention of buying FM25 with the hope that this product might be fixed. If you cannot see that then this is where it's glaringly obvious where SI don't really care about the consumer nor the the product they release yearly. Totally unacceptable behaviour. 

Once again, we mods are not employed by SI, so what we say are only what we think as individuals. Don't take mods views or thoughts as SI's.

[XaW]

3 hours ago, SHK-555 said:

that's all fine, but it's still misleading for people reporting with the belief there will be taken into account for a future patch for fm24. I give the benefit of the doubt that Maybe SI were still open to changing something in the M.E if something fundamentally was game breaking but still believe they could have communicated and given people the heads up about non changes a lot earlier and or closed the bugs forum

I agree, if there where no planned ME updates, I also think that should have been communicated. That doesn't mean it's pointless to report bugs in it, as it can bring up issues that can be avoided to be transferred to future games, so I don't think it should have been closed, just communicated better.

That said, working in IT I know how volatile it can be in regards to what you fix when. There might have been plans for big ME changes, but when testing they found major issues that couldn't be resolved and in the end it was decided it would be better to remove those from updates since it would break more than it fixes. And I don't know any of this, but I have been part of this happening in my day job, where a major update turned out to be a miniscule update due to major issues in the parts of the software we had done big changes to. Still think that should have been communicated if that was the reason though.

[iAlwaysWin]

Dont know how any of yous can put up with set pieces in this game, there a absolute mess from setting them up, Ai constantly switching players when u make changes.

Please for the love of god improve this disaster of a new feature for FM25 cause at the moment its unberable.

Am totally gob smacked that so many people play this game and dont complain about how badly implemented Set Pieces are.

[Rodrigogc]

36 minutos atrás, iAlwaysWin disse:

Dont know how any of yous can put up with set pieces in this game, there a absolute mess from setting them up, Ai constantly switching players when u make changes.

Please for the love of god improve this disaster of a new feature for FM25 cause at the moment its unberable.

Am totally gob smacked that so many people play this game and dont complain about how badly implemented Set Pieces are.

Almost every new feature is badly implemented in FM, that has been the case for years. For FM25 they can say Set pieces and positional play will be improved, but new features will come that will be improved for FM26 and so on. 

In match Shouts, Data Hub, have been implemented for years and still don't work properly and need clear development. 

I am totally pro adding new features to the game as long as the existing ones get improved, but that hasn't been the case with FM in the last few years. No wonder the game has become bloated.

[Polando]

I don't remember an edition in which playing in the middle of the field would bring such excellent results. I would probably have to go back to the times of FM16/17, where the 4-3-3 tactic with three strikers was a hammer against every rival.

[NineCloudNine]

1 hour ago, Polando said:

I don't remember an edition in which playing in the middle of the field would bring such excellent results. I would probably have to go back to the times of FM16/17, where the 4-3-3 tactic with three strikers was a hammer against every rival.

Several other regular posters here have repeatedly claimed that wide play and crosses are overpowered. Maybe there’s more than one way to win after all!

[kiwityke1983]

11 hours ago, NineCloudNine said:

Several other regular posters here have repeatedly claimed that wide play and crosses are overpowered. Maybe there’s more than one way to win after all!

I've repeatedly said this is the most varied ME tactically we've ever had. I've used all sorts of setups from long ball to counter attacking to controlled possession and been somewhat successful with all of them.

[g1nh0]

4 hours ago, kiwityke1983 said:

I've repeatedly said this is the most varied ME tactically we've ever had. I've used all sorts of setups from long ball to counter attacking to controlled possession and been somewhat successful with all of them.

If you think 17 out of 20 people in an online save using the same identical 4231 w/same roles etc is varied, then my definition of varied most definitely differs to yours

Edited April 8 by g1nh0