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Liverpool Thread 2011/12


Rafalution

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Early 1998 for me. Lost 3-2 to Southampton. David Hirst and Egil Ostenstad putting us to the sword :D

James, Jones, Babb, Harkness, Matteo, McManaman, Leonhardsen, Ince, Carragher, Owen, Fowler.

Babb. Harkness. Matteo. We finished 3rd that year. Ergo the Premier League was **** in the 90s.

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My first game was away at Nottingham Forest in 1999, we drew 2-2 but don't remember much about the game.

A quick google tells me the team was as follows;

James, Carragher, Matteo, Staunton, Song, Redknapp, McManaman (Riedle 64), Ince, Berger, Owen, Fowler (Gerrard 78)

With Redknapp and Owen the scorers.

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Ah Suarez with a timely reminder of what we've been missing- more sub-standard finishing.

We're really close to being a very good side. Defensively we're great (bye Carragher), the midfield is incredibly average bar Gerrard (and Lucas when he's fit) and the strikers are for the most part good. I can't help but feel an upgrade on Adam and Downing makes not only the midfield look x10 better but also the strikers.

Carroll is clearly growing as a player now and it's just a shame he won't get the service to supplement that progress. Stewart Downing is just absolutely atrocious. Dirk Kuyt did NOTHING but give the ball away for the first 45 minutes of the games today.

But we do an awful lot of things right. It's just really hard (and expensive) to move up a notch from very good to excellent. I don't have amazing faith in whoever is buying the players to bridge that gap but I don't think we're a million miles away. In 90% of games this season we've been much the better side. It's just really hard moving up a notch to a clinical side with a winning mentality.

i pretty much agree with all of this. add in a top class centre mid and winger and we'd have a damn decent first xi. i think though it needs to be mentioned that the quality of the tactics is just as much holding us back as the quality of our players, and it continues, every single match. you can't expect playesr to suddenly instantly get better or regain the form they've not had for over a year, but you should be able to expect a manger to not continue to use the same tactics when they clearly aren't working. 7 draws out of 9 at home and we still play don't-make-runs-into-the-box football, and still don't support our striker.

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My first game, think I might win the crap stakes. :D

Grobbelaar, Jones(sent off 70), Burrows(Walters 68), Nicol, Wright, Ruddock, Clough, Whelan, Molby, McManaman, Rush - Subs not used: Hooper, Hutchinson

September 1993, away to Coventry City playing 5-3-2. Lost 1-0 to a Phil Babb goal. Probably the reason why we bought him a year later. I was 8 :cool:

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Opta Sports @OptaJoe

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8.5% - Liverpool have the lowest chance conversion rate in the Premier League this season. Onychectomy

What does it count as chances? just shots we have had or like corners and crosses that have been cleared away as well?

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I remember the likes of Paul, Stewart, Nicky Tanner, Mike Marsh, Isvan Kozma, Mark Walters etc played. Liverpool finished 7th only about 10 points off relegation and out of the cups to Bristol rovers, Peterbrough not good times.

However with the money we have spent and players at his disposal we should be doing better. I don't think we are that far ahead points wise of Sunderland, Nowrich and Swansea while we trail Newcastle how much have these teams spent? Cup run is papering over the cracks, we are not adventurous enough too cautious.

I think our defence is good and we have cover Lucas is good enough when fit, spearing as back up and might be tempted to play Suarez right wing and buy a striker a left midfielder and central midfielder maybe. I think we need 4 strikers at the club for rotation so need to sign 2 or 3 ideally.

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I think our defence is good and we have cover Lucas is good enough when fit, spearing as back up and might be tempted to play Suarez right wing and buy a striker a left midfielder and central midfielder maybe. I think we need 4 strikers at the club for rotation so need to sign 2 or 3 ideally.

Yeah, we are going to need both a squad winger and a squad striker, with it likely Kuyt and Maxi will go. Think it's very much a pity we didn't look at bringing in those squad players in the jan window, even if top targets weren't available. Hard to tell what rumours are true, but if we were really interested in Texeria and Hoillett, signing them both wouldn't have cost too much, given us extra options, injected a bit of cutting edge, and given them a chance to settle before next season. Then again if we aren't willing to give Shelvey or Maxi much of a chance from the bench, maybe they wouldn't get one either.

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All our crosses were **** tbh, bar a few corners. Always hitting the 1st man. Would love to see Sterling given some game time as he for one seems to like running at defenders. Johnson didnt look confident going forward at all last night which is strange, missed Jose down the left. Big Martin was brilliant last night, some crucial tackles and got some important blocks in. Was his tackle on bale bad in the 2nd half? We all thought it was a great tackle . Just another example of us failing to break down a team who were happy to sit and defend for the draw. Adam doesn't offer anything tbh.

Carroll was brilliant again I thought, crowd finally getting behind him too as he is starting to put in a proper shift. Would have taken the point before the game tbh.

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He went in studs first and after winning the ball caught Bale on the lower leg. Give the speed of the tackle, I'd imagine Bale's missing a fair bit of skin. Think a yellow was fair, but at the same time it was still a good tackle, if that makes sense.

It's a real pity we leave it so late to start attacking in these draws. If we started playing that game like we were playing in the last 20mins I reckon we could have got more from it. It's like we're happy to pass it around launch rubbish balls in to the box until the 70th min and only then realise '**** we've not scored yet'

Just so fed up with Adam too. Would much rather see Henderson. Our 6 best midfielders/attackers atm are Spearing, Gerrard, Henderson, Bellamy, Suarez and Carroll. I look at that and think 4-1-2-1-2.

         Reina

Johnson Skrtel Agger Enrique

          Spearing
 Henderson         Bellamy
          Gerrard

        Suarez
               Carroll

Get Bellamy making runs forward as an all out winger, Henderson playing a bit tighter and supporting Spearing/the right flank when Johnson gets forward. Shelvey, Adam, Kuyt, Maxi and Downing can all drop into it fairly easily too.

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Bellers wasn't happy at all last night after the game. When we came down from the lounge, few players were making their way to their cars escorted by stewards. Agger and

Gerrard stopped and talked to a few of us but when we started talking to Craig, he kept the head down and bombed into his car.

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See what you've done there is equated our lack of chance conversion with our general competency as a team, as well as gone off on massive **** on the premise that just because we've spent a **** load of money it should automatically mean that we'll score a lot of goals. Real life simply doesn't work that way. So let's deconstruct your 'argument' there:

"We've signed utter garbage" - No we haven't. Enrique - not garbage. Henderson - not bad enough to be called garbage. Adam - crap but not garbage. Downing - crap tonight, about one more bad game away from being garbage, tbf. Carroll - not great but improving. Suarez - definitely not garbage. Your statement = garbage.

"We've drawn a ridiculous amount of games, at home" - Yes indeed we have. However this is nothing new for us. But some of the shambles of teams we've put together in the past would be fighting against relegation at the standard the league is in now.

"We actually missed Spearing ffs" - What does this actually mean? Spearings a good player, and still only what, 21? We do miss Lucas, but Spearing is a good understudy and doesn't deserve your derision.

In summary, you've gone off on one based on the fact we've just dominated and should have beat a team 3rd in the league that we lost 4-0 to earlier in the season. And that was with 9 men before you pick up on that.

In conclusion, **** off back in your box.

Your putting words in my mouth and making up lies to fit your own agenda. I basically said we've signed garbage players for a lot of money, who aren't good enough to play for Liverpool. I didn't say that us spending a lot of money should equate to us scoring a load of goals.

Now lets deconstruct your rant.

Enrique was possibly our best signing and he cost pennys, fair enough. Henderson isn't very good and is WAY over priced, and don't talk to me about the future as we need top four now, especially for that money. Adam is ****ing garbage, and not nearly good enough for us, and to suggest otherwise is just embarrasing. Downing is another over rated English player and is garbage, which I could have told you before we signed him for a ridiculous fee. Carrol is over rated and insanely over priced and not even nearly good enough to be in our team, especially for that amount of money. Suarez is a good player even if he is an idiot.

Thats one good player and a decent player out of six and we haven't signed utter crap for a lot of money? Deluded much? Ahh yeah, thats right, you're the guy who who thought there was going to be a goal fest at Anfield :D

Missing Spearing means we have fallen so far from grace that the guy is now actually a big part of our team. We actually miss him which is a ****ing travesty, or are you now in the Woy camp of mediocricy? How many top six teams (not even top four, top six) would he get into? He shouldn't be any where near our first team.

In summary I haven't just gone off on one, I've been saying we are utter **** for a while and that Kenny is not the man for the job. I couldn't give a **** how many games we dominate if we don't win, or big clubs we beat if we don't finish in the top four as all it does is paper over the cracks. I'm glad your happy that we dominated another team at home and got a 0-0 but I'll never be happy with that, or am I aiming to high?

I will admit to saying that we're the ******** Liverpool team ever was a bit daft, but we're still pretty **** and the majority of players we've signed are just not good enough.

In conclusion, you seem to be trying too hard, especially with the "get back in your box" bit.

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Too many players slow our attacks down

Tony spot on here. Pretty much the main reason we end up tossing hopeful balls into a packed penalty area is that the build-up play is so ****ing laboured.

e: First game at Anfield, Liverpool 1 - 1 Aston Villa (1989)

Grobbelaar, Hysen, Staunton, Ablett, Whelan, Mølby, Beardsley, Houghton, Rush, Barnes, McMahon

Don't remember much about it now other than Barnes being amazing.

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The money we spent was £35m net IIRC and about £20m of that can be considered overspend on Carroll.

The real investment in the team has not been as much as everyone would have us believe. It took Man City 3 years and £250m to establish themselves in the top 4 from a similar starting point than us, so let's not expect overnight miracles.

We have moved forward from where we were this year and we will move forward again. Let's get the Carling Cup under our belts and perhaps we can go in and win the FA Cup too as the 2 biggest hitters have gone. Then we will so what happens in the summer.

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Its only offset by the silly money we got for Torres tho, if you win the lottery and buy a Mars bar for a million pounds your still a fool.................

Its been done to death you look at the team and the positions you think yeah we need better players is the ones we've just bought oh well.

On the bright side that's the first time for awhile Spurs haven't out played us, and Carroll is starting to look like the 15 million pound player he is, still would like us to go 4-3-3 with him and Suarez plus one but hey.

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Wait, are you saying that's a terrible team? Kirkland had lot's of potential, Hyypia and Carragher were legendary, Hamann also a complete don, Alonso World Class, and Kewell pretty excellent too in his pomp.

Unfortunately Kewell wasn't anywhere near his 'pomp' when he played for Liverpool.

Terrible team? Don't make me bring up the Souness era :eek:

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My first game 19/12/1998 - Liverpool 2 - 0 Sheffield Wednesday

"And for Liverpoool..."

James, Babb, Bjornebye, Carragher, Staunton, Heggem (Kvarme 83), Redknapp, Berger, Ince, Owen (Riedle 88), Fowler

Goalscorers: Berger, Owen (The ****er)

Had no idea Carragher played in that match tbh, also, God \o/

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Yeah, we cant expect the squad to improve by £100m, when we really did actually spend that.

If we had Torres and Meireles still (who else did we sell?) arguably we would have been stronger and certainly had more option up front (especially during the 8 game ban).

We strengthened somewhat. But, and this where agree with the poor use of money, you don't become title contenders by spending £7m on Charlie Adam. We had to spread the cash further though as the squad had been decimated by sales without adequate replacements under G&H

As I have said before, we are going to have to cycle through some trash before we can evolve this squad into a genuine top 4 side. City had to do the same and they still have 1 or 2 players now that are probably below the quality of what is required (Im looking at Lescott ;))

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i think you missed a word or something out there. we can't expect the squad to improve by £100m if we only have a net of £35m, but we can expect an attack force to look like it's worth £100m, if that's what we spent on it. And it doesn't even look worth half of that

we spent £40m on 'chance creators' and give them **** all to pass to. in fact all this talk of formations and starting xi's and who we should sign, i love talking about that stuff, but frankly it all means sod all if we are going to play so negatively all the time, especially against defensive sides. until that changes everything else is worthless.

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ive been screaming for us in all these games to get shelvey on. hes a wildcard thats perfect for all these situations with his movement and attacking intent. im convinced his presence would have afforded us a few goals this season in the games where we've been up against 10 man defences. it is our negative tactics thats costing us!

for all the praise we gave our defence earlier on this season i think we may have gone too far, as up until recently our fullbacks have hardly got forward at all. i said awhile back about enrique not making forward runs for downing and always passing it to downings feet instead of to run onto which i believe has contributed to downings poor form, hes had no choice but to cut back most of the time. and with a makeshift right winger johnson didnt get forward much either. im not saying abandon this mindset in the main but we need to make more of our wingplay and really work on it cos its awful atm.

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ive been screaming for us in all these games to get shelvey on. hes a wildcard thats perfect for all these situations with his movement and attacking intent. im convinced his presence would have afforded us a few goals this season in the games where we've been up against 10 man defences. it is our negative tactics thats costing us!

for all the praise we gave our defence earlier on this season i think we may have gone too far, as up until recently our fullbacks have hardly got forward at all. i said awhile back about enrique not making forward runs for downing and always passing it to downings feet instead of to run onto which i believe has contributed to downings poor form, hes had no choice but to cut back most of the time. and with a makeshift right winger johnson didnt get forward much either. im not saying abandon this mindset in the main but we need to make more of our wingplay and really work on it cos its awful atm.

Quite embarrassing if your winger can not run with the ball or take players on.

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Quite embarrassing if your winger can not run with the ball or take players on.

While i've never been the guys biggest fan...... Beckham managed to do alright out of it.

Downing has always been more of a Beckham style player. It's unfair to expect him to do things that simply aren't part of his game. It's all about accentuating the positives.

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Your putting words in my mouth and making up lies to fit your own agenda. I basically said we've signed garbage players for a lot of money, who aren't good enough to play for Liverpool. I didn't say that us spending a lot of money should equate to us scoring a load of goals.

Now lets deconstruct your rant.

Enrique was possibly our best signing and he cost pennys, fair enough. Henderson isn't very good and is WAY over priced, and don't talk to me about the future as we need top four now, especially for that money. Adam is ****ing garbage, and not nearly good enough for us, and to suggest otherwise is just embarrasing. Downing is another over rated English player and is garbage, which I could have told you before we signed him for a ridiculous fee. Carrol is over rated and insanely over priced and not even nearly good enough to be in our team, especially for that amount of money. Suarez is a good player even if he is an idiot.

Thats one good player and a decent player out of six and we haven't signed utter crap for a lot of money? Deluded much? Ahh yeah, thats right, you're the guy who who thought there was going to be a goal fest at Anfield :D

Missing Spearing means we have fallen so far from grace that the guy is now actually a big part of our team. We actually miss him which is a ****ing travesty, or are you now in the Woy camp of mediocricy? How many top six teams (not even top four, top six) would he get into? He shouldn't be any where near our first team.

In summary I haven't just gone off on one, I've been saying we are utter **** for a while and that Kenny is not the man for the job. I couldn't give a **** how many games we dominate if we don't win, or big clubs we beat if we don't finish in the top four as all it does is paper over the cracks. I'm glad your happy that we dominated another team at home and got a 0-0 but I'll never be happy with that, or am I aiming to high?

I will admit to saying that we're the ******** Liverpool team ever was a bit daft, but we're still pretty **** and the majority of players we've signed are just not good enough.

In conclusion, you seem to be trying too hard, especially with the "get back in your box" bit.

I'm trying too hard am I? :D

It's pretty clear we disagree on what constitutes a garbage player, and I don't buy into the idea that the more we pay for a player the better he should be expected to be. How could you spend £35m on on a £15m player, or £20m on a £12m player and expect it to make him any better? The players we've bought were at the time reasonable buys for what we wanted to achieve imo, and certainly not garbage. I'm reasonably certain that Adam wasn't bought to start every week, but he's had to becuase we lost Lucas for the whole season, Gerrard was out for a significant period and Spearing's not been there due to injuries and suspension. Couple that with losing Suarez on suspension and Andy Carroll's ***** attitude and suddenly what would look on paper to be a promising squad has gone quite wrong.

I agree some of our signings have disappointed, what I'm saying is that when they did sign the expectation was that they would do better. This is true of Downing and Carroll, and to a lesser extent Adam.

My last point is that there's no way around the fact that we're on a rebuilding mission. Since our last sucessful season when we finished 2nd our squad has been looted of our best and most key players, and we're still suffering because we couldn't replace them due to the **** state of our finances at the time. I think we are aiming too high for a top 4 finish, there's nothing wrong with that being a target but it is out of our reach. Putting a top 4 squad together takes a while, so you might as well get used to it. But I will say that it's not as bad as you and some others make out, and there have definitely been some mitigating circumstances.

Edit: Oh and I fully disagree with your stance on Spearing. Aside from last night where he made some bad passes, I think he's been excellent.

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While i've never been the guys biggest fan...... Beckham managed to do alright out of it.

Downing has always been more of a Beckham style player. It's unfair to expect him to do things that simply aren't part of his game. It's all about accentuating the positives.

Maybe because Beckham had a brain and was good at crossing. A lot of crosses from deep. Thats what Downing should do.

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Mine was Blackburn 3 - 2 Liverpool on 15th October 1994:

Liverpool: James, Jones, Babb, Scales, Bjornebye (Redknapp 80), Ruddock, Barnes, Molby, McManaman, Rush, Fowler

Think it was Mark Atkins with two goals and Chris Sutton with one for Blackburn, and Fowler and Barnes (with a great overhead kick) for Liverpool.

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My first game was a 4-1 win over Nowrich. I can't remember the team but Don Hutchinson scored 2. I remember Souness was manager and James in goal.

Chuffed today as I got a cup final ticket not sure on the price but it's either £56 or £72.

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Anyone on here from Bristol? Watching the match on Saturday down there as I'm visiting a mate. There's a few of us going who would've gone to the match otherwise, is there anywhere anyone would recommend maybe where a few reds normally gather to watch the match?

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Anyone on here from Bristol? Watching the match on Saturday down there as I'm visiting a mate. There's a few of us going who would've gone to the match otherwise, is there anywhere anyone would recommend maybe where a few reds normally gather to watch the match?

Anywhere along Gloucester Road, in particular The Anchor I guess? That area is student central so I'm sure it'll be packed with glory hunting kids. Possibly.

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