Quackje Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 You can also buy smoke spray paint so you can just slightly darken your monitor screen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheriffpatgarrett Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 >> 1. Why is the continue button all the way in the top right so far away from the back/forward buttons? << Yup, especially when using a 22" WS 1680x1050 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 You can. The gap is now slightly smaller, but the game resizes the images so they fit in. Just copy them from their FM09 location to the FM10 location. Great! Thanks for the information. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aiston Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I like the new skin a lot! Much better then previous default skins in my opinion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1977beyond Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I hear all this about usability problems with the previous skin but I, nor anyone else had any such problems with how it was designed before. Are the people who conduct the usability tests just random testers? If so then herein lies the problem, it's better to gauge the advice off people acustomed to playing management games than just joe bloggs who won't be FM again after he's conducted his usability. Best skin with the game for me was FM2007, the others havent been too good but Ter has done a great job in making it possible to edit all the individual elements to give fans the ability to change it as they wish. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI Staff Ter Posted October 16, 2009 SI Staff Share Posted October 16, 2009 I hear all this about usability problems with the previous skin but I, nor anyone else had any such problems with how it was designed before. Are the people who conduct the usability tests just random testers? If so then herein lies the problem, it's better to gauge the advice off people acustomed to playing management games than just joe bloggs who won't be FM again after he's conducted his usability.Best skin with the game for me was FM2007, the others havent been too good but Ter has done a great job in making it possible to edit all the individual elements to give fans the ability to change it as they wish. The users who take part in usability studies range from people who have never played FM before to experienced users. I have fond memories of the Flexion skin too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themavsman Posted October 16, 2009 Author Share Posted October 16, 2009 The users who take part in usability studies range from people who have never played FM before to experienced users.I have fond memories of the Flexion skin too. Seriously mate, i appreciate the hard work and it does look pretty (dark skin) but the extra mouse clicks to get anywhere, clustering everything into a set of buttons or moving the continue button so far away from the back/forward button i will never understand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
schuey100 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 It's the same every time something is changed. You get the "OMG it's different" knee-jerk reaction before people have given it a chance and got used to doing things a bit differently.I'm not saying it's perfect but the complaints have been minimal compared to previous UI changes which is good. Oh, and if you don't like the white skin then you can change to the dark skin. And if you activate through Steam then you will be able to download the FM 2009 skin so everyone should be catered for. No,m I think he has a point, in terms of design, that is graphical impact it looks excellent. It really does, could have been put together by Apple The problem comes with usability, it's really bad, placement of buttons etc. Really terrible, artistically it's great though just a shame about usability. Problem is I'm no expert in this, I work in a related field so I see what the UI guys do and a lot of what's in FM is very far removed from what would be classed as professional today. Just a shame I can't explain more because I would love to give the feedback, just don't have all the required knowledge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who's Winnin Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 love the look on my widescreen monitor, well done guys. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members+ JAndersson Posted October 16, 2009 Members+ Share Posted October 16, 2009 Problem is I'm no expert in this, I work in a related field so I see what the UI guys do and a lot of what's in FM is very far removed from what would be classed as professional today. Just a shame I can't explain more because I would love to give the feedback, just don't have all the required knowledge That's a pretty harsh comment considering you haven't had any insight into the design process of the project. Those of us who were involved in designing the interface has plenty of experience and passion for UI design, and what you're seeing now has evolved through several rounds of user testing as well as feedback from user interface professionals outside of the company. Pretty much every part of the interface has a justification for being where it is and looking how it does. It's not perfect yet, but it's definitely put us in a better position for the future. If you feel like trying to explain a bit more I'd be more than happy to explain and debate our design decisions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I miss the continue button in the bottom right I would also love a medium skin, about halfway between the light and dark skins. Took me all of 5 seconds to get used to the new UI. It's incredibly easy and everything is in the obvious place. Excellent work imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
schuey100 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 It's the same every time something is changed. You get the "OMG it's different" knee-jerk reaction before people have given it a chance and got used to doing things a bit differently.I'm not saying it's perfect but the complaints have been minimal compared to previous UI changes which is good. Oh, and if you don't like the white skin then you can change to the dark skin. And if you activate through Steam then you will be able to download the FM 2009 skin so everyone should be catered for. That's a pretty harsh comment considering you haven't had any insight into the design process of the project. Those of us who were involved in designing the interface has plenty of experience and passion for UI design, and what you're seeing now has evolved through several rounds of user testing as well as feedback from user interface professionals outside of the company. Pretty much every part of the interface has a justification for being where it is and looking how it does. It's not perfect yet, but it's definitely put us in a better position for the future.If you feel like trying to explain a bit more I'd be more than happy to explain and debate our design decisions. I wasn't trying to be harsh, just honestly offering an opinion. The problem is partly that this isn't an area of expertise for me so it's difficult to explain technically what I mean, I'm sure others would be better placed but I think it's rather obvious that it's not all that intuitive. Menus upon menus upon menus, different hierarchies with components placed badly (continue button for example), the number of clicks required for simple things that are used regularly. It's just very complicated and could be made to flow a little more easily. But as I say, artistically it's the best yet! I just had a look at the squad screen for example. A player is injured. Great, so I need to buy a new one. Where do I go? First I look at the main menu, not there, then the one underneath not there, so I click on home screen and bingo, the search tab is there. I get why it's there but it's doubly confusing because you have the same option under the manager name tab, as a drop down. Of course it's a case of getting used to it but I feel like it's a bit like XP vs OSX. One is simple and constructed nicely the other is a myriad of menus which you can get lost in for weeks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOYNEGRO Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Interface is ok for me. I was little worried with all the negative comments before playing the demo. But now i must say that the interface is cool and not really complicated for me. Its my opinion anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Aye, with the exception of the continue button removed from the bottom right, it's almost as if this interface was designed for me - everything is exactly where I'd expected it to be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodyear Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Does anybody know how to change Font size in the UI? I am using 1920x1200 resolution and the font is too small for me. Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiltonArmy Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I love the new interface and prefer the light skin. The only thing I'd change is the colour of the players atributes. I 2nd that the colour in the attributes are too alike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rougess Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 My main gripe with the location of the forward and back buttons is that it would've been logical to have the fwd / bkwd buttons where the calendar fwd / bkwd buttons are. Swapping them would mean the calendar buttons are still close to the calendar and the others are right next to "Continue", which makes sense. I know the sizes of the buttons would have to change for the worse but I still think it would be better that way... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Worcester City Researcher Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Aye, with the exception of the continue button removed from the bottom right, it's almost as if this interface was designed for me - everything is exactly where I'd expected it to be. This. I'm finding stuff easier to find and much more intuitive to get the stuff done quickly and easily. One small wish I would have (which should be easy enough to do myself with teh relevant XML) is to readd the club logos to the top bar during a match - and make these logos display bigger in-game Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recury Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Why should the forward and backward buttons be next to continue? Fwd/bk flip between pages in your browsing history, continue advances the time of the game. It makes much more sense to have continue next to the calendar fwd/bk buttons (ie forward and back in game time), like it is now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impi Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Does anybody know how to change Font size in the UI? I am using 1920x1200 resolution and the font is too small for me. Thanks. Same problem here. In the tactics screen the player names are very hard to read. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I usually let my Assistant pick the team, why did SI add clear team and a clear subs option. I want to clear the team quickly not navigate another tree menu. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DietSpam Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I love it to bits. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Dean Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Pro Tip: instead of moving the mouse upto continue, press the spacebar Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
data6930 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 One thing I have noticed with the 'Dark Skin' is that when you substitute a player it is almost impossible to see the names of the subs because the text and background colours are almost identical. Anyone had problems...or should I go to Specsavers. Have to agree with you, the colour combination in that screen is dreadful and makes it difficult to read, I do like the dark skin but amendments are needed, the white or light skin is dreadful!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Those complaining about the location of things like the continue button should learn to use the shortcut keys. For example pressing the spacebar to continue - so much easier Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonPaulWild Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Of course people have to get use to this skin. However, my main gripe is the positioning of the continue button. Why has it been chosen to place it in the position it is in? I love the tabs and the skin over all, however, it does need touching up, and I mean in a future patch for FM10. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Definitely aggree with number 3 on your list. Because usability is atrocious. 1. Why is the continue button all the way in the top right so far away from the back/forward buttons? 2. When you click on league table tab, it doesn't actually take you to the league table but just to the league page. Whats the point of saying league table? Just make one league page button while you're at it. 3. You can't check player statistics or form without pressing two extra buttons now. May be small things to some but when you're someone like me who constantly checks these things its annoying. 4. Whats the point of managing subscriptions when it doesn't even go into your inbox. I was getting excited for this feature because i thought i would no longer miss out on important news in my inbox. But ala it doesn't even show up and you would still miss out on it if you don't check manually. 5. When will they learn that white skin is bad on the eye when most players are staring at it for 2-3 hours a day. 6. Icon placements - why the hell is it all at the top? Side bars are not in anymore? Now i have 3 rows of things on top of another row on the button can it get anymore confusing? Hopefully someone designs a skin thats actually usable soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members+ JAndersson Posted October 16, 2009 Members+ Share Posted October 16, 2009 I wasn't trying to be harsh, just honestly offering an opinion. The problem is partly that this isn't an area of expertise for me so it's difficult to explain technically what I mean, I'm sure others would be better placed but I think it's rather obvious that it's not all that intuitive. Menus upon menus upon menus, different hierarchies with components placed badly (continue button for example), the number of clicks required for simple things that are used regularly. It's just very complicated and could be made to flow a little more easily. But as I say, artistically it's the best yet! I just had a look at the squad screen for example. A player is injured. Great, so I need to buy a new one. Where do I go? First I look at the main menu, not there, then the one underneath not there, so I click on home screen and bingo, the search tab is there. I get why it's there but it's doubly confusing because you have the same option under the manager name tab, as a drop down. Of course it's a case of getting used to it but I feel like it's a bit like XP vs OSX. One is simple and constructed nicely the other is a myriad of menus which you can get lost in for weeks. That's fair enough, it's just not very useful to be told that we are "removed from what would be classed as professional". I'm all for criticism, but it helps if it's constructive. You don't have to be able to get technical about it, just explaining what feels wrong and we'll be able to reply and/or take it into consideration The intuitiveness of the interface has proven to be a big improvement over the old interface in the testing we have done so I wouldn't agree that's it's not intuitive at all. The continue button is one thing that has been confusing for new users in the past, by putting it in the top right and tying it in with the calendar bar it proved to be much clearer. The downside to this is the extra mouse movement, but personally I think it's countered by fitts law (objects closer to the edge of the screen are easier to hit) and the size of the button. I don't think it will be uncomfortable to use once you're used to it, and we do offer the spacebar shortcut for power users. The challenge we face with FM is that it's essentially a sandbox game. Your example of the injured player is spot on, but it's not entirely easy to solve. We can try to predict what the user wants to do next, but most of the time it's just impossible to know and putting everything that the user may want to do to on the same screen is a recipe for a cluttered disaster. I agree there's room for improvement in this area though. There's definitely a learning curve with the new interface, but that's inevitable for a game that packs as much information as FM does. We have to try to balance what's easy to understand for new users and still make it fast to jump around for more experienced users. Just out of interest, are you comparing the new interface with FM09, or just what you think it could be? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHINNERY Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 There is a bit too much info on the screen for my liking too. Sure ill get used to it though. But ...can someone explain the news section to me please? You sign up for news , but about 4/5 stories show up. The rest are in a list - are these in chronological order? Im confused.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
arsenal_2111 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 There is a bit too much info on the screen for my liking too. Sure ill get used to it though. But ...can someone explain the news section to me please?You sign up for news , but about 4/5 stories show up. The rest are in a list - are these in chronological order? Im confused.... Yeah, they are. Newest at the top. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo_pin1 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Do most realise that hitting Space Bar continues? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
given1legend Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I Love the new interface! I think the interface and skin are both the best yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanGLiverpool Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I usually let my Assistant pick the team, why did SI add clear team and a clear subs option.I want to clear the team quickly not navigate another tree menu. Some people will want to clear out their subs, so instead of either clearing out their whole team and sorting it all out again, or clearing out each sub 1 by 1, there is a button to clear it in 1 go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Aja Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 It's the same every time something is changed. You get the "OMG it's different" knee-jerk reaction before people have given it a chance and got used to doing things a bit differently.I'm not saying it's perfect but the complaints have been minimal compared to previous UI changes which is good. Oh, and if you don't like the white skin then you can change to the dark skin. And if you activate through Steam then you will be able to download the FM 2009 skin so everyone should be catered for. Did he hurt your feelings mate? fwiw I love the new layout. LOVE IT. FM needed changed like this or it was in danger of becoming as boring as steamed parsnips seeing as I'm praising your work so highly, you better give me a free copy next time you're over here Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowSimao Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Isn't it obvious SI did it on purpose? Nobody puts a League Table button that doesn't actually go to a League Table unless they're doing it for laughs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonky Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 There are some minor issues, but overall it's a huge improvement from FM09, imo. And white is good. I love high contrast designs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norville Rodgers Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 I think it's a fantastic interface. Takes roughly 2 minutes to get used to where things have moved to, and the whole thing feels very (get ready for words that have been used lots in this thread already) sleek, polished, classy and new. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members+ JAndersson Posted October 17, 2009 Members+ Share Posted October 17, 2009 Isn't it obvious SI did it on purpose? Nobody puts a League Table button that doesn't actually go to a League Table unless they're doing it for laughs. Where is this league table button that doesn't go to the league table? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastema Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Do most realise that hitting Space Bar continues? Yes. Do most realise that if you have two UI options for doing the same thing they should be equally convenient? I won't go as far as to say that the new look is unprofessional (it does look great), but I will say that for the way I'm playing FM it is disastrous. I stopped playing the demo and will wait for a new skin to come out. My biggest gripe is with the back/forward buttons (the buttons I use most in this game): who thought it was a good idea to put them all the way in the corner and directly above the quick-flick buttons who just happen to look like they are the back/forward buttons? Unintuitive and misplaced to say the least. Of course this is my opinion. If others like it, fine with me. I don't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bag Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 This is the first skin I have liked since about FM07 ! It find it so much easier and quicker to actually get to where I want to go with less clicking around. Everything just seems to intuitive and where you would expect it to be, I could never find what I wanted on FM09 despite having played the series for many years. I could imagine the back/forward thing being a little annoying if you didn't use your side mouse buttons though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dz47 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 i must say i'm not sold on the new interface. Maybe i'm too used to the 'old' way, and the new one will grow on me. Like someone said above, i spent ages the other night looking for the player search button! I've still been playing 09 though and i have the klasa skin. Now that to me is the ultimate in usability. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkson01 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 The white colour skin works for different types of user. scientifically, numbers statistics and codes work better on a light interface, while graphics and animations work better on better on dark interfaces, hence why most likly si have given the game a light and dark interface with it. It'll take some time getting used to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eple Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Where is this league table button that doesn't go to the league table? If it's what I think they mean it happens when games are about to be played or have just been played. I.e. on a sunday at 12:00 clicking league table took me to the league table, but at 13:30 it took me to latest results because a game started at that time. From the top down menu choose your division and 'league table' - whenever I do this when a game is about to be played in the division the latest results screen pop up. It also happens if you click to your squad and then press the "Xth in [whatever divison]". With the old interface you went straight to the league table. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JR866Gunner Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Does anyone have a SS of the white and dark to compare?? I havnt seen FM10 yet Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbnrbn Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 The UI is poor. For example, where the hell is the option for the "full time teamtalk". Unless im mistaken, its nowhere to be seen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themavsman Posted October 17, 2009 Author Share Posted October 17, 2009 Where is this league table button that doesn't go to the league table? Sometimes it does sometimes it doesn't. For example, if i was just checking the player statistics from the league page and i go back to my squad then proceed to press the league tab and press league table on the drop down, it goes straight to the player statistics page where i has been previously. What is the point of having a league table then? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmobande Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 when the full game comes out steam will provide FM 09 skin and be able to put in FM 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmobande Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 when the full game comes out steam will provide FM 09 skin and be able to put in FM 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegorTtenneb Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 I absolutely love the new interface, personally.It's a vast step forward, especially for those of us with widescreen monitors, and makes the game look much more modern. WHS Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ldktalin Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 The interface in 10 is a nightmare really (which is a shame, given that it looks like a best FM ever) - in fact, the interface has been bad for a long time, and I'd say it wasn't great even back in the old CM days (although there was much less information and content there). And I'm not talking about the skin. There's a reason people complain about interface changes every time - it's because it only seems to be getting worse each time. If you can't make something really usable, simple and intuitive, then at least don't change it for the sake of changing it. I'll just go into the main screen roughly - The "Calendar" on the very top of the page. It only shows like 5 days (which is too short a span for anything you'd want to see or plan). You can't even see any events without an extra click on each of them. On most days there aren't even any events at all. Even on matchdays you only see a generic club crest, so it's not even useful as some sort of a short term weekly fixture list. I see the "idea" of linking it with the Continue button, but not the need to do to it. The non-existant usability of that bar means it shoudn't exist at all, much less at the top of the page. While we're at the Continue button, the idea to put it on top is counter-intuitive as well. Players first check the content on the screen, surfing through various pages, and when they are done reading what they wanted to read and playing out their "turn", then they want to progress the game by pressing the Continue button - so one would expect to find it at the bottom. It's just like Previous/Next buttons on installers aren't on top. End Turn buttons in most turn-based strategies are in the lower right corner too. There's a reason for that. That doesn't have to mean it has to blend so much in the bar that it's hard to spot (as it was on FM08/09) though. The bar just under the calendar has basically everything in it. Which is actually good - except the shortcut icons should've been added by default, and it should pretty much be the only bar we see on the main screen. Oh yes, and the main game menu hidden behind the little "FM" button thrown in the middle of nowhere is nothing short of sadistic. On the bottom of that pile of bars is the largest manager bar with tabs - some of those tabs (which are largest of all active interface items) are almost never used during regular gameplay - Jobs, Profile, History, and I doubt many people use Notebook so much. Even Player Search is used sparingly when compared to day-to-day club running features, such as squad selection, fixture list, competitions and tactics screen. This bar draws the most attention, I would expect to be able to reach the most important features of the game by clicking one of the tabs. Again, I get the idea of having a manager-related bar, but again there's no real need for such a category. You're running a club, not yourself - focus should be on club-related information, and relevant features should never be difficult to spot or more than a single click away. Also, the "link" bar on the very bottom of the screen looks as if somebody tried to hide it, yet not quite remove it, on purpose. It's tiny and almost entirely blends in the background. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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