Cougar2010 Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 While I agree with you that it's not a particularly immediate concern while the lower-end spec users wouldn't have much use for it, and obviously there are far more pressing issues with the game, it's very short-termist to just dismiss the idea of improved graphics out of hand. I take it you must have missed that SI increased the number of animations in each version since 3d was released and also improved them. Thats before I mention the step forward this year in using motion capture for the animations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Geordie Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 I've played since CM 92/93 and I'm still enjoying it as much as ever. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
isignedupfornorealreason Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 No, the complaints over this game have been tame in comparison to FM14, and in particular FM13 which got a REAL hounding until the final update. There will always be complaints, some justified, some over the top nonsense because the player is unable to get to grips with it. But this year has been more positive than usual. This is true. 13 was ripped to shreds on here. On the other hand, 15 is being ripped to shreds on Steam and other places. - Can't compare with the other instalments as it seems SI have deleted FM09 through to 14 from Steam, curious that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Bear in mind, this is quite typical of the type of review you see on Steam... Loads of injuries, goalkeepers have pathetic reaction times, stupid own goals. ♥♥♥♥ this game. this is my first and last FM Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgik Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Me too, there are alot of wrong things that happen through the game that take away that flavour FM had, but mainly it's the match engine, which is more and more drifting towards that awful game named Fifa Manager, you see more and more crazy scores. On a save i lost 8-0 with Porto against PSG in a UCL Final, crazy scores everywhere, Real Madrid thrashing Barcelona 8-1 in the semifinals on another savegame. This kind of scores remind me of that awful game i mentioned earlier. Player interactions also made me quit several games, players going crazy i haven't signed a replacement for a useless player, even though i did so, and the player i signed joins the meeting about not signing a replacement =)) . I'm just hoping that the patch will fix all these errors, and will bring back the joy of a long-time save. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alian62 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Terrible example. Not only are they not even remotely comparable, you also show a baffling misunderstanding of how things work.Go and find me any example of a piece of software which doesn't have any bugs whatsoever in it. Then also go find a statement on the FM cover and/or website that is unequivocally false thanks to a bug. I'll wait. Are you serious ? Thats my point ? They say that this software does all this stuff and it dosnt ..... FM2105 ? Read the back and it states MATCHDAY EXPERIENCE !!! REALISM TO THE 3D MATCH ENGINE ??? CLOSEST SIMULATION OF A MATCH DAY EXPERIENCE AVAILABLE ? Well im sorry but this is false advertising in my book ... FIFA15 PES15 have far better realisim in Animations !!!!! .... So yeah maybe i misunderstand how things dont work ??? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameuss Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Are you serious ? Thats my point ? They say that this software does all this stuff and it dosnt ..... FM2105 ? Read the back and it states MATCHDAY EXPERIENCE !!! REALISM TO THE 3D MATCH ENGINE ??? CLOSEST SIMULATION OF A MATCH DAY EXPERIENCE AVAILABLE ? Well im sorry but this is false advertising in my book ... FIFA15 PES15 have far better realisim in Animations !!!!! .... So yeah maybe i misunderstand how things dont work ??? Deary me... Since you seem so upset, I'll outline it for you, maybe calm you down slightly. Below is the blurb on the Steam page for Football Manager 2015. Have a read through it, and tell me which parts are false advertising. Extra points if you can find the parts you've bellowed about in your post. Football Manager 2015, the latest in the award-winning and record-breaking series, is coming to PC, Macintosh and Linux computers in November 2014. Football Manager is the most realistic, in-depth and immersive simulation of football management available, putting you in the hot-seat of almost any club in more than 50 countries across the world, including all of Europe’s biggest leagues. Football Manager 2015 will allow you to live the life of a real football manager – you decide who plays and who sits on the bench, you're in total control of tactics, team-talks, substitutions and pitch-side instructions as you follow the match live with the acclaimed 3D match engine. Pre-order Football Manager 2015 now to enjoy access to a fully-playable ‘Beta’ version of the game roughly two weeks prior to the official release date. Features: Tracksuit Manager You can now define your managerial style like never before, using the new manager points system to focus on coaching, scouting, youth development, man-management... or maybe a little of everything? What type of manager are you? Matchday Experience More than 2,000 new motion captured animations; new lighting, improved player models and ball physics add extra depth and realism to the 3D Match Engine. Plus, improved AI, individual player shouts, touchline team talks and other additions make this the closest simulation of a football match available! New User Interface A new look and feel to the user interface with a left-hand navigation bar makes management easier and more intuitive Scouting Centre… The new Scouting Centre integrates all areas of player recruitment. Plus you can set scouting assignments to find specific levels of player whether it be a first teamer, youngster or a direct player replacement. More realistic player personalities… Player’s personalities and characters replicate today’s football world where player power rules. Players are more vocal in the press and quicker to issue ultimatums if they’re unhappy. Deeper media experience… A wider variety of journalists with tabloid and broadsheet reporters developing more varied stories and building up rivalries through the media, plus brand new tunnel interviews before and after matches. Classic Mode… Updates to Classic Mode allow you more freedom when selecting nations, leagues and players in your gameworld. Plus, you can now skip pre-season (in first season), take control of player training, make more board requests and there are new unlockables, such as; ‘Dodgy lasagne’, Unsuspend player’ & ‘Lifetime player’ And much more.. Including Twitch TV support, Manager Timelines and improvements to Finances, Training and hundreds of other features. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleaner475 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Deary me...Since you seem so upset, I'll outline it for you, maybe calm you down slightly. Below is the blurb on the Steam page for Football Manager 2015. Have a read through it, and tell me which parts are false advertising. Extra points if you can find the parts you've bellowed about in your post. I wouldn't bother with him forameuss, this is a guy who clearly doesn't know how FM works; mmm well i can honestly tell you neither i or my opponent ever scores from a corner ? IE corner kick to be headed or kicked in .. So when i play and theres a corner i know i wont score .And this is strange in both versions ? It would be great if someone could post a video showing me coz ive never seen it ? i dont think it matters what tactics you use because once you set your tactics the game determines the result . As i said i think the 3D game is window dressing for the results no matter when you ajust the tactics From his quite amazing thread http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/418280-Match-Results?p=10140446#post10140446 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edj Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The opposite. So much so that, even though I don't have time for it, I fired up an FMC save to play a season as Barca over the next two weeks to see if I can win the triple. I only see three glaring ME problems at this point. Teams are too aggressive in the final third against deep opponents; rather than probing and back passing, they force the attack and end up taking low percentage shots too often. Attacking tactics are a touch overpowered, to the point where it's often easier to play for 3-1 than it is to hold out for 1-0. And there's an issue where even non-aggressive CBs will get pulled out of position to close down an opponent, leaving acres of space for only their partner to cover. Honestly, if even 1 of those 3 problems get fixed in 15.3, I'll be a happy gamer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
limey150781 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I'd been playing since Amiga days, which I guess was what, 94/95ish? I had played every year including the old Italia versions they did back in the day and FM2014 was the first one I hadn't bought. That was purely down to my old laptop dying and having more work commitments and a young family meaning I didn't really have the time to miss it. At the time, I felt that the game was moving towards a place where i wasn't finding it as enjoyable but having come back this year, my love for the game has grown and grown. I have never been a "career" type but am in my 9th season in the current save and I really, really enjoy this game. Maybe it's the luxury of having smooth graphics, something I haven't really had since maybe the first 3D game came out, but it has added another level. Bar the odd horrible game, where I'll see a 7-6 or two 5-5's in the same week, I haven't noticed the scores being too crazy either. There are frustrations for sure, but I, personally, have had my love for the game reignited. Maybe that's the answer, skip a year. Although I'm sure SI would disagree!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Well, I'm up over 1000 hours now, and I can honestly say - ME wise at least - the only real frustrations are the poor defensive AI after a shot at goal leading to easy tap ins (both for and against), the crazy situations of keepers taking free kicks at corner flags and hitting it straight to opponents, and players standing miles offside at free kicks. Fix those three and for me, the ME would be as close to perfect as its been. Other than graphical animation issue, but given how basic the 3D is in comparison to bigger budget titles, I can forego this. It's never really been about 3D graphics for me anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
isignedupfornorealreason Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Bear in mind, this is quite typical of the type of review you see on Steam... Haha, yes. Though, funny thing that, I volunteered for a gaming review site and one of the guys there reviewed FM15 and they included a throwaway line to the effect of 'the typical problems with the match engine remain'. I honestly think we need a disclaimer on here that FM is the game 90% of people don't know how to play. Just having a look over at the Good Team guides for example, some epic formations that aren't balanced are being suggested by topic creators for the respective teams. Chelsea and Swansea in particular are two that come to mind immediately. Though I get tired of the modern gamer anyway, I rotate my stints on here by visiting the Bioware forums and it is amusing to see how people struggle with the easiest games ever made, and in particular how they are more content to be brainless dudebro fans. Don't get me wrong, good games, but easy as and people just can't do it. Why expect them to be half-decent at this game, which is much more difficult? -Lest we forget, those on Steam are usually the same ones who can't figure out how to reload their swords. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cro-cop Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 hi guys, I'm also slowly losing interest for FM, but only because it is to easy....in my Derby County save in first season i was promoted, in second season i qualified for europa league (6 points from CL)....on FM 14 it took me 5 seasons to do that.... On my other save i played with Feyenoord and in second season we had 34 games without losing and 19 games without conceding goal. We won Europa league, domestic league and we lost in cup finale......and i am just average FM player, always with same tactics, just rotating the players.....no cheats, no editing, no reloading.... Maybe you guy have the same reason why there's no interest for the game?? So i have one question, maybe it's little of topic (sorry for that), can you give me examples to make the game a little more challenging? Like buying only domestic players, or spending only 5 mil. per season, something like that.... Thanks! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
st1p Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Have been playing CM/FM for 16-17 years and the biggest problem for me is the AI. If you stay in one club for over 5 years you will succeed. Always. Because the AI never build great teams. Sure, Barca, Real M, City, Chelsea and so on are hard to beat when you first start up the game, but they will gradually worsen as seasons pass by. The AI seems uncapable of building strong squads/teams. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiitastic Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Massively long question in the post. I have my periods when I dont feel like playing FM much, other times I want to play it a fair bit otherwise I get bored! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleaner475 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Why expect them to be half-decent at this game, which is much more difficult? -Lest we forget, those on Steam are usually the same ones who can't figure out how to reload their swords. As you and Dave have pointed out, the level of intelligence of Steam users is shocking sometimes; http://steamcommunity.com/app/295270/discussions/0/618453594748990574/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
markyosullivan Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 I see each iteration of FM as a new challenge, a new game which I have to learn and eventually (hopefully!) master. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Have been playing CM/FM for 16-17 years and the biggest problem for me is the AI.If you stay in one club for over 5 years you will succeed. Always. Because the AI never build great teams. Sure, Barca, Real M, City, Chelsea and so on are hard to beat when you first start up the game, but they will gradually worsen as seasons pass by. The AI seems uncapable of building strong squads/teams. I'm nine seasons in on my save, and both Chelsea and Man City have incredible squads. And not just old known players either. My own team is nowhere close to theirs. Arsenal have a really good squad too. And both Liverpool and Man Utd have decent sides. It's a myth that the AI teams don't build good squads. It's certainly true that the human player has a big advantage in this area, but AI squadbuilding is miles better in this game than what it's been before. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsouthy Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 I have headed back to FM14. Got tired of the strikers walking through defence and then casually strolling past the GK to score whilst shaking his hand on the way past and the stupid asking prices for even just average young players. People will say its tactics.....but there is no reason for a GK just to watch a striker walk past him. I will give FM15 another go when the patch is released but for no I'm back on my favourite FM14 save. I won't be purchasing FM until after the winter transfer window again. In my opinion, SI try to do too much each year. I understand the need to develop, rewrite ME etc... but does it need to be each year? Surely it would be better for a fresh release every 2 years and in the 2nd year release a updates via subscription (I'd be happy to pay £15...) and then SI have more time to develop and fine tune ME's etc... Wonder if Miles could comment on this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawlore Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Releasing a new game every two years is a non-starter from a business model perspective, and considering the ME is constantly worked on anyway, there's no guarantee that not releasing would improve it at any quicker a rate than it currently is. They're not releasing then putting their feet up and saying they're done for another year- it's a constant WIP. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameuss Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 In my opinion, SI try to do too much each year. I understand the need to develop, rewrite ME etc... but does it need to be each year? Yes. Yes, it does. Surely it would be better for a fresh release every 2 years and in the 2nd year release a updates via subscription (I'd be happy to pay £15...) and then SI have more time to develop and fine tune ME's etc... No. No, it wouldn't. What would be better for them would be to keep going with their tried and trusted - and absolutely correct - development cycle they have now. You'd be happy to pay £15 for a database update? Really? Given that every single year there's the same offered for free by the community? How exactly would SI swing that with SEGA? "Oh, we're planning on releasing the game every two years from now on..." "...why?" "Some people on the forums think that double the time means double the product, and that there will be no bugs...and I mean, how can they be wrong?" "So you want us to halve our profits for the series going forward?" "Yes." ".....Yeah, we're not going to do that." This is, of course, not even touching on the fact that releasing every two years would probably yield the same product on release year as you'd get using the normal cycle. FM17 would still be roughly the same as it would have been had you released FM16 or not. That's best case - worst, and probably more likely, case is that it would be worse, because they haven't benefited from the customer feedback like they usually do. Wonder if Miles could comment on this? Don't hold your breath. Mods have said many times when this keeps getting brought up that the cycle is not going to change, and they're absolutely, unequivocally, 100% correct to say that. Miles would probably just see it, chuckle, and go back to more important things. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 A two year cycle would benefit the ME, there simply is no question about that. The jump from FM12 to FM13 was a result of exactly that. The side product was the enormous amount of bugs in FM13 but even then a lot of those could have been rectified with another year of development, except that wasn't financially or commercially viable. Once the current ME is stable enough they should leave it for a version and take another year to improve another set of fundamentals. Like introducing a physical aspect to the play, something that can't be done by simply tweaking the existing code. Improving the animations is enough to sell the game for another year (FM14 engine with FM15 animations would have been perfectly acceptable for a 'gap year' for example, given substantial improvements in other parts of the game). There won't be a bug free product as a result though. They also can't financially afford to skip a whole version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cro-cop Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 I'm nine seasons in on my save, and both Chelsea and Man City have incredible squads. And not just old known players either. My own team is nowhere close to theirs. Arsenal have a really good squad too. And both Liverpool and Man Utd have decent sides. It's a myth that the AI teams don't build good squads. It's certainly true that the human player has a big advantage in this area, but AI squadbuilding is miles better in this game than what it's been before. From my experience, from what i have seen so far this is not true....Top clubs stay on top, but the quality of the squad is not the same.. I don't see any improvements in AI and squad building, it's all the same...Maybe I'm wrong, but i just don't see that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameuss Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 A two year cycle would benefit the ME, there simply is no question about that. Sorry, but that's just not true. Whatever benefit they got from not releasing a version in the interim - which I'm not convinced of there actually being any - would be quickly negated by the fact that they haven't field tested it. Whether you agree with the "oh noes, I'm not a beta tester" crowd or not, there is absolutely no substitute for testing in this way, with the added bonus of actually making money at the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Sorry, but that's just not true. Whatever benefit they got from not releasing a version in the interim - which I'm not convinced of there actually being any - would be quickly negated by the fact that they haven't field tested it. Whether you agree with the "oh noes, I'm not a beta tester" crowd or not, there is absolutely no substitute for testing in this way, with the added bonus of actually making money at the time. Of course it is true and it's not even arguable. A longer development cycle means bigger strides forward. They will still make money. FM12 sold more than FM11. It just means the product at the end of that two year cycle will not be streamlined and will have even more bugs. But that's the price you pay for fundamental improvements. The collision detection couldn't have happened without a gap year because the one year cycle is essentially only enough for balancing work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameuss Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 The collision detection couldn't have happened without a gap year because the one year cycle is essentially only enough for balancing work. ...but it did happen. What a baffling statement. There is no longer development cycle. It's the same length of time developing as you would have with the current release cycle. At the moment it's probably roughly six months development, three months testing, three months support/development before moving onto the next game. You just have that twice with no release in the middle. Same length of development and same level of testing as you would have if you'd released two instead of 1. In fact, you'd need more testing, so would probably end up with less time. It's a non-starter of an idea from all stand-points. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 It's an irrelevant discussion, as it's not going to move to a two year cycle anyway. And actually a lot more than balancing work happens in a year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 It happened because they skipped a year! FM12 had identical ME to FM11 and they did no balancing work on it during the lifespan of that game, instead focusing on the rewrite of fundamentals for FM13. The rest of your post makes zero sense. Longer development time means longer development time. 18 months is better than 6, that's just a fact. The added time comes from not having to spend half a year on supporting a released product which is vastly different form in house beta testing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Of course it is true and it's not even arguable. A longer development cycle means bigger strides forward. They will still make money. FM12 sold more than FM11. It just means the product at the end of that two year cycle will not be streamlined and will have even more bugs. But that's the price you pay for fundamental improvements. The collision detection couldn't have happened without a gap year because the one year cycle is essentially only enough for balancing work. You're very much mistaken here. Are you saying that all that happened between 13 and 14 and again 14 and 15 was balancing? Because that's completely wrong. The ME is worked on quite a bit each year. Imo, the ME will progress faster with a yearly release (and subsequent updates) as it is now compared to every 2 years. It benefits from having millions of eyes on it and having some take the time to report various issues. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 It happened because they skipped a year! FM12 had identical ME to FM11 and they did no balancing work on it during the lifespan of that game, instead focusing on the rewrite of fundamentals for FM13.The rest of your post makes zero sense. Longer development time means longer development time. 18 months is better than 6, that's just a fact. The added time comes from not having to spend half a year on supporting a released product which is vastly different form in house beta testing. Actually they did do work on the ME in FM12. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 You're very much mistaken here.Are you saying that all that happened between 13 and 14 and again 14 and 15 was balancing? Because that's completely wrong. The ME is worked on quite a bit each year. Imo, the ME will progress faster with a yearly release (and subsequent updates) as it is now compared to every 2 years. It benefits from having millions of eyes on it and having some take the time to report various issues. It is basically balancing work. No fundamentals have been reworked from 13 to now. There is still no physical aspect which needs a bigger rewrite as well as a lot of other things. It shouldn't be a two year cycle but they need longer development periods at certain times for bigger strides which is what the jump from 12 to 13 proved. Why do you think they took that gap year if that wasn't the case? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Actually they did do balancing work on the ME in FM12. Minor improvements on a couple of bugs was all they did (the goal kick issue plus a couple of set piece tweaks). Plus animations. The changelists are still out there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 It is basically balancing work. No fundamentals have been reworked from 13 to now. There is still no physical aspect which needs a bigger rewrite as well as a lot of other things. It shouldn't be a two year cycle but they need longer development periods at certain times for bigger strides which is what the jump from 12 to 13 proved. Why do you think they took that gap year if that wasn't the case? The match engine reach its limit in FM13. Such rewrites will happen once maybe 3 or 4 years. But idea that 13 to 14 and 14 to 15 is simply "balancing work" is incorrect. No matter how vehemently you argue it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTHerringbone Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 It is basically balancing work. No fundamentals have been reworked from 13 to now. There is still no physical aspect which needs a bigger rewrite as well as a lot of other things. It shouldn't be a two year cycle but they need longer development periods at certain times for bigger strides which is what the jump from 12 to 13 proved. Why do you think they took that gap year if that wasn't the case? Just to add to the comments from HUNT3R and themadsheep2001, you are incorrect and the bold bit is especially wrong. I don't know how you feel qualified to state these things with such absolute certainty, but I can categorically state that you are incorrect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameuss Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 The rest of your post makes zero sense. Longer development time means longer development time. 18 months is better than 6, that's just a fact. The added time comes from not having to spend half a year on supporting a released product which is vastly different form in house beta testing. Spending double the time when you have to double the work still makes roughly the same time. Unlucky. Sure you wouldn't be supporting a live product, but you'd spend that time doing testing that would be inferior to the like you would get from actually releasing the product and getting millions of eyes on it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 The match engine reach its limit in FM13. Such rewrites will happen once maybe 3 or 4 years. But idea that 13 to 14 and 14 to 15 is simply "balancing work" is incorrect. No matter how vehemently you argue it. It will reach it limit again soon if it already hasn't, which is what I am saying. Once it's balanced then they need to take on another set of fundamentals. The balancing thing is just you arguing semantics. For me anything not involving newly introduced mechanics is balancing work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 It is basically balancing work. No fundamentals have been reworked from 13 to now. There is still no physical aspect which needs a bigger rewrite as well as a lot of other things. It shouldn't be a two year cycle but they need longer development periods at certain times for bigger strides which is what the jump from 12 to 13 proved. Why do you think they took that gap year if that wasn't the case? I'm not talking about the gap year. They needed that time as it was a massive rewrite. If they get to the point where they can introduce the physical aspect, then they will probably need a gap year again. Who knows, the other fundamental changes are possibly needed before that can be done. Don't think it's just balancing between versions. A lot of work went into the ME after 14.3 for FM15. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
boblardo Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 For Me, FM15 is the best version in recent years. I am not sure if its because my hand has been forced in terms of tactical learning and development or if it just feels better but I am 100% enjoying this version more than many of the previous ones. FM11 - Tactic downloaded, won everything FM12 - Tactic downloaded, won everything FM13 - Thought this was pretty poor, didn't even buy it FM14 - Bought it, didn't like it ended up playing FIFA 14 FM15 - Bought it, learnt to play, massive learning curve, stuck at it, now in my 20th season and still going strong Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Just to add to the comments from HUNT3R and themadsheep2001, you are incorrect and the bold bit is especially wrong.I don't know how you feel qualified to state these things with such absolute certainty, but I can categorically state that you are incorrect. So can you please qualify your statement. Which fundamentals have been reworked that wouldn't fall under balancing work? What new mechanics have been introduced? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Dave Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Love it as much as ever, although the spell of immersion is broken every now and then with 15 due to the occasional basketball score games, but most of all the daft comebacks. If I went 2-0 down in FM14 it was disaster, back to the tactics and make desperate changes. With 15 I might do a shout or two, but I usually just sit and wait for the ineviatble comeback, especially against worse teams. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 I'm not talking about the gap year. They needed that time as it was a massive rewrite. But according to forameuss they could have released the new ME into public in FM12 and it wouldn't have made a difference... That's the point, certain things take time. You can't introduce a large piece of new code into public prematurely because it won't be in a state where it meets the standards for something you can charge money for. This sets a limit on what you can do in a yearly cycle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTHerringbone Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 So can you please qualify your statement. Which fundamentals have been reworked that wouldn't fall under balancing work? What new mechanics have been introduced? Contractual documents preclude us from revealing specific information. However, a fundamental "thing" which impacts every single facet of the Match Engine changed last year. The fact that nobody noticed is a testament to the quality of the work undertaken. Just because you don't spot something, doesn't mean it didn't happen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Contractual documents preclude us from revealing specific information. However, a fundamental "thing" which impacts every single facet of the Match Engine changed last year. The fact that nobody noticed is a testament to the quality of the work undertaken. Just because you don't spot something, doesn't mean it didn't happen. Last year? As in FM14? The ball physics is the only fundamental that is visibly different but that was this year. In any case, if the improvement is subtle enough for SI not to allow testers to comment on it and nobody can notice then it hardly compares to something like the collision detection or the much needed actual collision model. Which is what a longer development cycle allows for and that is what I'm arguing. I don't understand how this is even controversial. A two year development cycle isn't the same as two years with a release inbetween in terms of time available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Last year? As in FM14? The ball physics is the only fundamental that is visibly different but that was this year. In any case, if the improvement is subtle enough for SI not to allow testers to comment on it and nobody can notice then it hardly compares to something like the collision detection or the much needed actual collision model. Which is what a longer development cycle allows for and that is what I'm arguing. I don't understand how this is even controversial. A two year development cycle isn't the same as two years with a release inbetween in terms of time available. Yeah, but you're assuming that all they need is a 2 year cycle and the physical aspect is done. Who's to say that other fundamental rewrites aren't necessary first for that to happen? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Yeah, but you're assuming that all they need is a 2 year cycle and the physical aspect is done. Who's to say that other fundamental rewrites aren't necessary first for that to happen? No, I'm not assuming that. I'm also not calling for a permanent two year cycle because I realise that there are drawbacks to that as well, namely the amount of bugs associated with bigger rewrites and the fact that any bigger rewrite itself needs to be balanced which is best achieved through public releases. I'm just arguing the notion that a one year cycle allows the same focus on the same work as a two year cycle because releasing something in public is the same as beta testing in house. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTHerringbone Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Last year? As in FM14? The ball physics is the only fundamental that is visibly different but that was this year. In any case, if the improvement is subtle enough for SI not to allow testers to comment on it and nobody can notice then it hardly compares to something like the collision detection or the much needed actual collision model. Consider the possibility that the work you were unable to detect, was a fundamental prerequisite in order to enable the Match Engine to incorporate things like collision models in future Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Äktsjon Männ Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Consider the possibility that the work you were unable to detect, was a fundamental prerequisite in order to enable the Match Engine to incorporate things like collision models in future Well I'll certainly consider that as a promise to give us a proper collision model in the very near future Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cometdude Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 I have played FMC exclusively since FM 13 and can say, without hesitation, that this is the best version to date. Just so there is no mistake I have been playing this series and CM since day zero and, CM 4 aside (which I still loved btw), every year has seen SI's product just get better and better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spaced33 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 This, for me, has been one of the most frustrating editions yet. This is not because of any fault on the part of the ME but rather due to my own tactical deficiencies. In the past I would read the excellent articles in the tactics forum and then try and replicate the tactics on there to achieve success in the game. This edition I started out doing that and met with very limited success. I then persevered and started putting together my own tactics. They are generally horribly flawed to begin with but after some logical thinking and making small changes I have managed to produce some excellent (in my opinion) tactics that resulted in some great seasons. This is an incredibly rewarding experience when it finally comes good. It is for this reason that this has been my best edition to date. There are aspects that need work and I am sure the development team will be addressing these issues as, despite the opinions of some, SI appear to be committed to producing a quality product. The growth of the title as a whole is surely testament to that. When you look at the progression that has been made from championship manager to the current football manager you have to appreciate the massive improvements that have been made to the game. There is no other game that has ever come close to providing any sort of competition to this game. Others have tried and failed miserably - generally due to cutting corners. As to those that complain about the game being bugged and wanting some sort of compensation should look at the software industry as a whole. Any software package that is released has bugs and updates to address issues are released regularly. SI are one of the more responsive companies that I have seen and their commitment to listening to their fanbase is commendable. At times it may appear as if they are not but this is because there is an element of irrational customers that are far too quick to declare broken game and become abusive rather than contructively criticize and aid the further development of the game. In conclusion - I love the game and will happily purchase the beta of the next invocation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabioke Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 For Me, FM15 is the best version in recent years. I am not sure if its because my hand has been forced in terms of tactical learning and development or if it just feels better but I am 100% enjoying this version more than many of the previous ones.FM11 - Tactic downloaded, won everything FM12 - Tactic downloaded, won everything FM13 - Thought this was pretty poor, didn't even buy it FM14 - Bought it, didn't like it ended up playing FIFA 14 FM15 - Bought it, learnt to play, massive learning curve, stuck at it, now in my 20th season and still going strong Despite that I wasn't downloading any tactics I kept winning in older FM’s. Even with horrible tactics and deliberately avoiding any known exploits. There was no reward for becoming good at the game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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