This Game is Scripted

I am well pissed off right now. My game was going really well. I am currently managing Arsenal and in my 2nd season ,,, i was on a great run of about 10 games in January and sitting joint top with Man Unt. It all really came from a win at old trafford that sent me onto the run and stop them from running away ,I went from there on good form and winning against a lot of hard games with teams in the top 6 or 7 to catch them up.

Then i save and close as I had to do a reboot.

When I log back in my save is corrupt and wont load,, DAM

So as I have it set on a 3 file rolling save i just click on the next one down in order. Was well suprised to see that the first game after is that big one against Man Unt.

This wasnt just the game that sent me on a run,, but at the time it also stopped Man Unt from opening up a massive gap,, and they also lost a couple after that so affected their morale.

But now going into this game from fresh with no games played previously (on this save) ,, I keep losing the game. I never normally reload,, but as this was a techy fault and I had already won it fair and square,, i felt cheated,,,,,,,,, i have now replayed it 5 or 6 times with almost the exact same score 2-0 EVERY time. I have tried changing tactics / players etc ,, No difference ,, its like the game has just decided that Man Unt are getting the 3 points and thats that. It feels so scripted,, its like Momentum in the game counts too,, I had a win with chelsea prior to the Man Unt game and went into it on a high,,, but if almost feels like the game dont recognise that as that was on another save,, i really feel like everytime you reload afresh circumstances in the game run slightly different and its costing me what could prove a crucial part of the season.

Its really spoilt it now,, my game feels tainted,,, and I was really enjoying this save too

That kind of thing has happened to me pal! If something happens and I lose some data, I replay the game with the same team/tactics/teamtalk and wonder why the match wasn't panning out in a similar way compared to the first time.

I'm assuming you're not making any changes before the match? Could simply be that everything set up as it is means you're very, very unlikely to win that match and you just happened to get a bit of luck on your very first go. You may need everything to go right to win that match, meaning you'll need to replay it a lot to get that sort of luck again.

The game is not scripted, I can 100% attest to that.

surely if it was scripted you would have actually got exactly the same results, not completely different ones. I can understand your fustrations, as I would be equally annoyed, but surely if anything this proves it isnt scripted , doesnt it?

This is a simulation remember... The game calculates the result of a game every time a half kicks off, the user makes a shout/sub/tactic change.

I assume in the first game you did the right thing at the right time and had the right players/formation against the players/formation needed for you to win.

i really feel like everytime you reload afresh circumstances in the game run slightly different

This is true, its not at reload, its in the processing time between the save and the match, that element of randomness is essential to replicate the unpredictable nature of sport.

I dont understand how you think the game is scripted when YOU GET A DIFFERENT RESULT?

more worryingly, I dont understand the use of ,,,,'s

He is right though, the game is scripted - just not in the way he is inferring. Although what he is inferring isn't being scripted, but some kind of AI out to get him almost as if through its own decision.

You input your variables and a match script is generated based on these variables. Soon as you put new variables in the script is changed accordingly. But, it is all planned out in advance until the next change requires it all to be planned out in advance again.

As far as I'm aware I don't think there has ever been a game where you could encounter something totally random because all games are scripted (even missingno on pokemon wasn't random it was something the script of the game allowed). Some may have a random number attached to certain scripts so if your in-game dice hits a 9 you get X but if it hits 10 you get Y, but those situations are already scripted.

There is only two suggestions here, that your version of FM has gained some kind of self-awareness and personal dislike for you, hence why you can't win this game now. Or the game has always been against you, but that one doesn't make any sense since you did actually win before.

I like the reference to pokemon as an example

more worryingly, I dont understand the use of ,,,,'s

Dramatic pause,, ,,,,

I remember once playing an Old Firm hot seat save. I had a 7 point lead when our game crashed. In the 3 games we had replay, instead of winning all, I lost 2 and drew 1. Bye bye 7 point lead.

i feel cheated when i go on an away match and a team i brushed aside with ease at home, and players turn into statues

There is only two suggestions here, that your version of FM has gained some kind of self-awareness and personal dislike for you, hence why you can't win this game now. Or the game has always been against you, but that one doesn't make any sense since you did actually win before.

I want to frame this.

Self-awareness and personal dislike. Just pure gold.

I think this has been mentioned before but some people believe saving a game does not actually save every single detail of that particular moment.

And yes the difficulty when playing away is quite ridiculous sometimes. It is harder to play away in real life, but a team coming last on the table isnt suddenly going to brush off the champions league quality team just because it's their home game.

I think this has been mentioned before but some people believe saving a game does not actually save every single detail of that particular moment. No way to prove it though

And yes the difficulty when playing away is quite ridiculous sometimes. It is harder to play away in real life, but a team coming last on the table isnt suddenly going to brush off the champions league quality team just because it's their home game.

I think this has been mentioned before but some people believe saving a game does not actually save every single detail of that particular moment. No way to prove it though

I agree with you, the OP problem also happened to me and same consequences too and what you say actually makes sense but i think it's kinda easy to show what you just said. try it like this:

save game -> play it ->save on another file -> close FM completely -> start FM -> reload the first game and play again and it will be totally different. however if you just reload game without closing FM the match you're replaying will be very similar.

I want to frame this.

Here you go

im playing the worlds smallest violin for you !

I dont know if its superstition or what, but I always felt like momentum is at work. I used to hate stopping the game on a run because when I came back to it it always seemed to end. I always tried to wait until my first bad result. Same with a losing streak, give up, sleep on it, come back the next day and the players have forgotten and its back to winning ways..

I also pause before every sub now which has so far completely eliminated the goal while you make a sub trick..

Superstition maybe, but its werid how it seems to work.

Maybe it's a bug and FM forgets to record the "Momentum" attribute when it saves? That's more likely than FM coming alive and acquiring sentience, probably.

There is only two suggestions here, that your version of FM has gained some kind of self-awareness and personal dislike for you, hence why you can't win this game now.

I believe this is the case, at least for my game. In the first half of the season when the game has yet to know me, I had a good run to 2nd spot with a team predicted to be relegated. After February, I had a string of ties because the opposite teams always score from set piece against me, either corner or free kick. My solution? I reloaded back to March, stopped using the match engine, and let my assistant manager take over while I holiday each match day. Now I've won the league. It's clear that FM match engine has grown to hate me but has no problem with my assistant manager.

Just save after every match played & you wont have a problem. I am just interested if you would be making such a fuss if it had been the opposite & you had originally went on a bad run when corrupting your save.

I just had the game crash when i was 3-0 at half time. I've played it again and im 4-0 at half time. the game likes me and hates you, simple.

I believe this is the case, at least for my game. In the first half of the season when the game has yet to know me, I had a good run to 2nd spot with a team predicted to be relegated. After February, I had a string of ties because the opposite teams always score from set piece against me, either corner or free kick. My solution? I reloaded back to March, stopped using the match engine, and let my assistant manager take over while I holiday each match day. Now I've won the league. It's clear that FM match engine has grown to hate me but has no problem with my assistant manager.

There is only one flaw to your theory. Its a game and is incapable of any emotion, especially developing a dislike for you.

Its amazing how many people will jump to this sort of deluded conspiracy before they ask themselves if its their tactics, team talks, or any of their other actions that could effect their teams performances.

It's just Apophenia

Nothing to worry about.

It is true that FM hears what you say and think, goes "oh yeah!?" and shows you who's boss. Sadly, reverse pshycology won't help, so now that you are convinced that you will lose and away games are too hard, you'll lose and away games will be too hard. If you thought or said that this will be easy and that you'll surely win just to trick it, you'll lose as well. Pretty smart AI! The only thing that helps is to train your brain to spontaneously utter beneficial self-delusions at opportune moments and I am a master at this so no wonder I am doing well!

Good luck with that

I was on a 10 game winning run after my previous post (I suspect my copy of FM knew I was onto it and decided to play nice) however, I began realising how good things were going and wanted to win an 11th in a row due to the fact I was coming up to 7 very hard fixtures (Arsenal, Chelsea, Man Utd, Tottenham, Liverpool, Man City and Fulham - who are a good side on my game lol) it started with injuries to both my keepers. Then I just knew what was happening. FM had gotten tired of playing nice. Adam Johnson quickly lost some morale for no real reason. In to the game against Everton and I'm sure somewhere amidst the noise of the game an Ivan Drago-esc "I must break you" was muttered by the game. Needless to say shortly after that Everton scored and won 1-0.

I always tend to save and quit after a loss, going to play something else for a while. So after that happened yesterday evening I've been giving FM the cold shoulder treatment.

There is only one flaw to your theory. Its a game and is incapable of any emotion, especially developing a dislike for you.

Its amazing how many people will jump to this sort of deluded conspiracy before they ask themselves if its their tactics, team talks, or any of their other actions that could effect their teams performances.

How do you know if SI didn't program FM to develop a dislike for the player? The more you win, the more likely you'll lose in the next round. It's the same thing as in a casino, so it's possible that SI programs the game similarly. The odds are so stacked against you after a strings of wins that your only choices are either lose or go home and come back the next day. FM is nothing more than a complicated slot machine.

How do you know if SI didn't program FM to develop a dislike for the player? The more you win, the more likely you'll lose in the next round. It's the same thing as in a casino, so it's possible that SI programs the game similarly. The odds are so stacked against you after a strings of wins that your only choices are either lose or go home and come back the next day. FM is nothing more than a complicated slot machine.

The ME doesn't know which team is human controlled and which is AI controlled. It simply takes all the variables and calculates what happens.

The ME doesn't know which team is human controlled and which is AI controlled. It simply takes all the variables and calculates what happens.

It doesn't know which team is human, but it is against the team that wins a lot in a row.

It doesn't know which team is human, but it is against the team that wins a lot in a row.

Got proof to back that up? I can disprove what you say easily by showing you my own game.

I think it is kinda cool people are so passionate about this game that they would believe something as crazy as the game hating them to be true. If that is the case I think the game loves me. I got through the group stages of the UCL with AC Milan and Barcelona in my group by beating Barcelona 2-0 and 3-0 away at the Nou Camp with Dortmund. Just when I thought my luck couldn't be any worse I drew Real Madrid and beat them 6-1 on aggregate.

However when I jumped ship to Villarreal we went on an incredible run even though morale was kinda low with me selling oft injured Nilmar but we can't buy a win in the last 7 games. Despite dominating possession (the team has passers second only to Barcelona in the game imo) we can't win. Extremely frustrating and fun. My computer has some crazy personality. It loves me then hates me.

Sure the game can be frustrating, but so were Arsenal fans throughout the whole month of January. Suck it up. Drop consistently under-performing stars if you need to, I always do it and they mostly come back after sitting out a few games at the very least better than they were playing.

Final point I would like to add is that sure the game is somewhat scripted. Kinda like real life. Read a few articles at ZonalMarking and you can see how a match is 'scripted' so to speak. Good teams should beat weaker teams, formations exploiting each other, players in space (afforded to them by the oppositions formation) are invariably more dangerous than other players; it is all in the script until managers attempt to rewrite it. So is the game to a small extent. But you have the power to change things much better than the cpu. An example would be to attempt to shut out the player causing you problems. This is how Real Madrid and Barcelona lose in the game. It is because when they play against other AI teams the other teams would mark the most dangerous players so tightly and that really goes a long way into helping those teams knock off Barca and Real. Usually when a behemoth team like them lose I would watch the match (I have the big four leagues in show all matches under detail) and I notice how the AI opposition tries to shut them down. Doesn't always work but sometimes a team gets lucky and is successful in shutting down those players and counterattacking.

At least try to during a match (think about how their formation and players matches up against yours. Something as simple as playing a higher d-line if their striker is skillful but slow, something I find a lot of people do not do especially the plugnplay tactic kind. To be clear I am not judging anyone. You can do as you please but I must implore you to make inmatch reactive and proactive changes, it really really works) and between matches. Warn players on transfer list if they are performing badly, drop players, tell them to train harder. call a team meeting etc..

So you are the main creative force behind this script. Whether win or lose you will be satisfied you just didn't sit back and hoped for the win. When you have outsmarted the AI then you will realize the AI doesn't cheat. And if you lose you will appreciate why you lost and not blame it on strange things. Most of the time when I lose it is because my trequartista (it is my philosophy/determination to have one and have attacks go through him) was marked out of the game and I couldn't find him a solution. Something I am working on. I was so successful with Dortmund because Gotze is a monster. He has such high decision and creativity and he is also fast which meant he could shrug off close attention.

can the moderator prove the game isnt scripted?

game does random things every game. i beat real madrid 6-1 at old trafford, doing hardly anything. i had a game where i went 5-0 up away from home, playing as i do at home. game crashed, reloaded 2-1 win to me with an injury and team struggled to play the free flowing stuff.

you do have that element in the game, but you can change it with substitutions, just watch the AI, you score, they suddenly change formation without you noticing (fix that...) score a goal, switch back (which you do notice) and the game goes back to as it was before with your dominance, that is the counter formation thing. substitutions change the script so to speak also. but the entire season is not scripted or pre-determined. as an example, save the game before a cup draw, then take the cup draw, reload the game, you get a differant set of cup matches.

game does random things every game. i beat real madrid 6-1 at old trafford, doing hardly anything. i had a game where i went 5-0 up away from home, playing as i do at home. game crashed, reloaded 2-1 win to me with an injury and team struggled to play the free flowing stuff.

you do have that element in the game, but you can change it with substitutions, just watch the AI, you score, they suddenly change formation without you noticing (fix that...) score a goal, switch back (which you do notice) and the game goes back to as it was before with your dominance, that is the counter formation thing. substitutions change the script so to speak also. but the entire season is not scripted or pre-determined. as an example, save the game before a cup draw, then take the cup draw, reload the game, you get a differant set of cup matches.

What bugs me about this is why the AI changes from a tactic that doesn't work to a tactic that does work, and when it has worked they change back to the one that doesn't work again? The AI needs to have tools to "see" what is going on in the match too.

Edit: even worse, what does this mean for us gameplayers - are we even playing a game?

although what he is inferring isn't being scripted, but some kind of ai out to get him almost as if through its own decision.

hahahhahaha

your version of FM has gained some kind of self-awareness

So basically he's saying that FM is....Skynet?

Hehe, on the very rare ocassion in the past that I ever had to replay a match in FM I don't remember any instance where the game ended with the same result actually!

I've seen some questionable AI behaviour in CM/FM over the years of course - Celtic's bottomless pit of money in CM 02/03 (XBox) and Bayern spending £70million+ in FM06, yet when human-controlled, neither team has anything near that in the bank - but the vast majority of instances I can explain away myself, usually with the knowing beauty of "that's football".

I understand the frustrations here though, but most of my frustrations with CM/FM's AI have been with trivial things like unusual transfers, an unstoppable side losing to a much lower team in the cup, or losing runs that seem to come out of nowhere. Overall over the years I think the game's been fairly solid, one or two 'hiccups' (won't name (g)names ) aside.

So basically he's saying that FM is....Skynet?

Upon the last meeting it was concluded that the human player must be terminated.

i do think they go to counter your formations pre match. suddenly had a struggle at home against teams i should be beating confortably.

trust me, being an unstoppable side to win 3-2 against wigan and 2-1 against the team in 20th and with the worst goal differance is belrgh, after beating villareal 3-0 away in the chamipns league with reserves not long before, and being robbed by a last minute offside goal at old trafford to draw after dominating play

People seem to be missing the point. He has reloaded his game several times, but keeps losing. If his tactics aren't stupid and if player morale is ok, then it shouldn't be taking an average of 20 to 25 reloads to score a victory.