The Official England World Cup Thread

[themadsheep2001]

Sterling ticks all those boxes and others more unpredictability going forward. He can defend and be disciplined as he has shown when deployed as a wing back occasionally for Liverpool, he also has a embarrassing amount of pace. I'd lose no sleep if Welbeck were to miss the Italy game. The only players I'd be concerned about getting injured are any of the back 5.

Sterling has never done it on International or European stage though. Welbeck has. Nor is Sterling as good as tracking as Welbeck. I very much like Sterling, but it's still worrying not having your first option for jobs like this available. Welbeck showed how good he was when he snuffed out Xabi Alonso over two legs (and scored). Has it also not occured that sterling might play down the right anyway?

I'd be worried if Henderson was injured. Good chance De Rossi may play CB and Pirlo push further forwards. Henderson is the player I would want again him.

[Pukey]

It's a shame people don't rate Welbeck. A lot seem to think "he plays high up the pitch, therefore he must score etc." I think that side of his game needs improving, and his first touch at time is poor, but he's a very important player, especially for Hodgson's England.

[Nikos]

It's not a matter of not rating him, it's the fact we have a number of players who can play in his positions. I think using the reason of him being the only guy who can track Abate to justify picking him is strange.

[themadsheep2001]

It's not a matter of not rating him, it's the fact we have a number of players who can play in his positions. I think using the reason of him being the only guy who can track Abate to justify picking him is strange.

It's not just about tracking Abate, but also attacking Abate. If you watch Italy, its not strange but actually a very important way to hurt their attack. Pinning back Abate, and also tracking would give Baines the edge if they go 4-3-3, and almost free reign if they go 4-3-1-2, as he is the main attacking outlet from deep, as the left full back is usually a converted CB and doesnt attack anywhere near as much. It also closes down one of Pirlo's pressure relieving escape routes to the flank. We have a number of players, but very few who have actually demonstrated they can do so, and have the requisite ability. If we want to beat Italy its one of the things we need to do

[mlyons]

Why are there 25 players in that picture?

[adhikapp]

2 as back ups if anyone gets injured from the original 23, either Stones or Flanagan will immediately take their place, even if it was a striker that was injured.

[bell]

Make sense to make both of them right backs then..... NOT.

[Tony85]

Isn't Stones preferred position CB? Remember it was originally to cover Jones incase he didn't recover from his injury.

[bell]

It's probably just Roy secretly hoping for a Glen Johnson injury.

[Leppard]

Stones can play right-back or center-back. He's played CB for Everton this season.

[Nikos]

It's not just about tracking Abate, but also attacking Abate. If you watch Italy, its not strange but actually a very important way to hurt their attack. Pinning back Abate, and also tracking would give Baines the edge if they go 4-3-3, and almost free reign if they go 4-3-1-2, as he is the main attacking outlet from deep, as the left full back is usually a converted CB and doesnt attack anywhere near as much. It also closes down one of Pirlo's pressure relieving escape routes to the flank. We have a number of players, but very few who have actually demonstrated they can do so, and have the requisite ability. If we want to beat Italy its one of the things we need to do

And Lallana or Sterling can't do this because...?

[football_master_94]

They don't play for Utd.

[CaptainPlanet]

Italy aren't tactical idiots either, they'll have a plan for dealing with however we set up our young pacey attackers.

[mlyons]

Isn't Stones preferred position CB? Remember it was originally to cover Jones incase he didn't recover from his injury.

Stones supposedly prefers right back, but no one was keeping Seamus Coleman out of Everton's lineup this season.

[Baptista_8]

2 as back ups if anyone gets injured from the original 23, either Stones or Flanagan will immediately take their place, even if it was a striker that was injured.

I don't think that's true is it? Pretty sure we can call up anyone not just those two

[Michael F]

Can we change the thread title now?

Done Gills.

[CaptainPlanet]

Papers saying today that it looks like Lampard and Milner are set to start against Italy.

[Bliss Seeker]

Papers saying today that it looks like Lampard and Milner are set to start against Italy.

If Lampard starts against Italy, I will be furious.

[Baptista_8]

Me too!...

[pearcey_90]

If Lampard starts against Italy, I will be furious.

Whole nation will be (Bar Hoddle). Papers will be loving it though, creaming about the potential headlines they could produce to slaughter Roy and rightly so if it were to happen and result in a lathagic defeat.

[themadsheep2001]

And Lallana or Sterling can't do this because...?

Because Lallana isnt particularly quick, and Sterling is likely to play down the right...

[bell]

Surely not. After the way the midfield were left with their heads spinning by Pirlo last time. You need someone who can protect that back 4 a bit.

Henderson has to start, simply for his engine and ability to play box-to-box for 90 minutes. The days of Lampard and Gerrard doing that are long gone....

[themadsheep2001]

Italy aren't tactical idiots either, they'll have a plan for dealing with however we set up our young pacey attackers.

First one is playing Abate, then is likely case of going 4-3-3 to match up the flanks, or if they pack out the midfield and seek to control and play through the middle. Could play De Sciglio down the left, he can play there but is predominantly right footed. If that was the case, I would definitely want Sterling against him, think that would be quite an interesting match up.

And agree Bell. Playing Lampard in a game where its vital to disrupt Italy's midfield is shooting ourselves in the foot. Henderson has to start.

[ringwoodrob]

A bit of light relief from the tactics here,another song,nice bit towards the end lol

[video=youtube_share;Qe5EmkYUlDU]

[bell]

I suspect the tactic will be to throw Sterling on at 60 minutes whenever has wilted under the strain of the Brazilian summer.

[Hom3r]

[video=youtube;EmgVCdzaYzY]

Not a lot of things could put a downer on the World Cup for me at this stage, finding a way to start Lampard alongside Gerrard would be one of those things

[McMaster#28]

ITV Reporter: "How far are England away from a good team?"

Roy Hodgson: "About 4 hotels"

Roy > ITV

[darren1983]

ITV Reporter: "How far are England away from a good team?"

Roy Hodgson: "About 4 hotels"

Roy > ITV

Keep up - I posted that 4 days ago

[Nikos]

Because Lallana isnt particularly quick, and Sterling is likely to play down the right...

There's Milner too. Seriously, do you think Welbeck is the only option primarily because he can negate Abate because he's a bit quicker than Milner and Lallana? I'm bewildered.

[Nikos]

Stones supposedly prefers right back, but no one was keeping Seamus Coleman out of Everton's lineup this season.

He can prefer it all he likes, but he'll be a centre back for the next 15 years so he may as well start liking that. His one appearance at right back was a disaster.

[themadsheep2001]

There's Milner too. Seriously, do you think Welbeck is the only option primarily because he can negate Abate because he's a bit quicker than Milner and Lallana? I'm bewildered.

Seriously, you've never bothered to actually watch Abate? He's not just a bit quicker. Englands 2nd top scorer this qualifying campaign and equally able to both pin back Abate through his attacks (very good movement and link up, better n goal than given credit for) and defend against Abate. Wouldnt be adverse to Milner as he's actually pretty quick (quicker than Lallana) and is better on the ball than he is given credit for, as well as his noted defensive ability. Giving Baines free licence to overload the flank and find Sturridge in space would put us on front foot immensely, as would denying Pirlo passing options (assuming we do well in closing him down). It's relatively obvious why even now Hodgson talks about Welbeck importance and was fretting over his injury. Likes of Henderson and Welbeck to their job, it sets the platform for Sturridge and go to hopefully secure the win. Though I guess really not hard to be bewildered if you're intent on ignoring parts of what I wrote ( didnt even say primarily either), so I won't waste my any further time further.

[Astafjevs]

It's not just about tracking Abate, but also attacking Abate. If you watch Italy, its not strange but actually a very important way to hurt their attack. Pinning back Abate, and also tracking would give Baines the edge if they go 4-3-3, and almost free reign if they go 4-3-1-2, as he is the main attacking outlet from deep, as the left full back is usually a converted CB and doesnt attack anywhere near as much. It also closes down one of Pirlo's pressure relieving escape routes to the flank. We have a number of players, but very few who have actually demonstrated they can do so, and have the requisite ability. If we want to beat Italy its one of the things we need to do

What? The left-back is De Sciglio, who is a proper fullback and not a converted central defender. Though there's stories that he might be injured, so it will probably be Darmian instead, another full-back.

[CaptainPlanet]

Italians need to worry about tracking back the mighty runs of Glen Johnson tbh!

[themadsheep2001]

What? The left-back is De Sciglio, who is a proper fullback and not a converted central defender. Though there's stories that he might be injured, so it will probably be Darmian instead, another full-back.

It's usually a left footed CB, till Criscito was dropped after Spain. De Sciglio is a right footed player, as is Darmian. I already mentioned the first one, and that I would play Sterling against him, same with Darmian. Lallana played the right too narrow and attacks their strong foot, Sterling plays wider more easily and can attack inside or outside.

[Astafjevs]

No it isn't. Before Criscito it was Balzaretti, another fullback.

[themadsheep2001]

No it isn't. Before Criscito it was Balzaretti, another fullback.

I'm talking about recently, and they also used Ogbonna at left back.

[Astafjevs]

In a friendly, as a test to find a defender who can cover central defence and full-back, to allow Prandelli to take seven defenders. The same reason De Rossi was used as a central defender in a back four vs. Argentina.

Ogbonna isnt the actual left-back, and never has been. The left-back has always been a full-back - first Balzaretti, then Criscito, then De Sciglio.

[darren1983]

I like the team that Cannavaro picked

[themadsheep2001]

In a friendly, as a test to find a defender who can cover central defence and full-back, to allow Prandelli to take seven defenders. The same reason De Rossi was used as a central defender in a back four vs. Argentina.

Ogbonna isnt the actual left-back, and never has been. The left-back has always been a full-back - first Balzaretti, then Criscito, then De Sciglio.

Criscito is as much a centre back as he is a full back (though thats certainly where he's played this season), not quite the overly attacking player that Abate is.

CP, I'd forgotten about Johnson, I'm now extremely nervous.

[themadsheep2001]

De Sciglio out. Italy apparently deciding whether to go with Chiellini or move Abate over to the left. (Darmain to play RB?) Welbeck fit to play, Sterling may miss out (no idea if they mean starting line up or completely due to injury).

[Sheps.]

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/england-world-cup-excuses-generator-7264403

[Nikos]

Seriously, you've never bothered to actually watch Abate? He's not just a bit quicker. Englands 2nd top scorer this qualifying campaign and equally able to both pin back Abate through his attacks (very good movement and link up, better n goal than given credit for) and defend against Abate. Wouldnt be adverse to Milner as he's actually pretty quick (quicker than Lallana) and is better on the ball than he is given credit for, as well as his noted defensive ability. Giving Baines free licence to overload the flank and find Sturridge in space would put us on front foot immensely, as would denying Pirlo passing options (assuming we do well in closing him down). It's relatively obvious why even now Hodgson talks about Welbeck importance and was fretting over his injury. Likes of Henderson and Welbeck to their job, it sets the platform for Sturridge and go to hopefully secure the win. Though I guess really not hard to be bewildered if you're intent on ignoring parts of what I wrote ( didnt even say primarily either), so I won't waste my any further time further.

Wow. Just wow. Ignoring the fact that you misread my post (Welbeck's a bit quicker than Lallana (the player who ran the furthest and did the most sprints in Premier League last season) and Milner, not Abate) and went into a massive tizzy, Welbeck just hasn't done that for England. He either hugs the touchline, giving no room to overlap, or goes so far into the centre of the pitch that Baines has to stay in the back four in case England lose the ball. Using two braces at home to San Marino and Moldova as justification of his attacking ability doesn't really cut it either. Should we bring Crouch back?

But nice of you to agree with me that Welbeck is not a big loss, because Milner can fulfil the role.

[Paul Bacon]

Im fed up of hearing about the pitch on the news now. Its as if only England are playing on it

[themadsheep2001]

Im fed up of hearing about the pitch on the news now. Its as if only England are playing on it

Hodgson inspected it and said he was happy. So that should be the end of it.

[cms186]

Suarez not starting for Uruguay against Costa Rica, could just not want to risk him i guess, but hes the kind of player who wants to play in every game

[themadsheep2001]

Piece on Italy by Paolo Bandini

Italy uncertainty as defensive flaws keep starting spots up for grabs

World Cup-winning Italian side of 2006 was famed for frugality, but England’s first opponents are lacking in reliability at the back

Old stereotypes die hard in football. Armchair enthusiasts following the World Cup will be reminded many times over that German teams are ruthless, England passionate and Brazil a group of free-spirited entertainers. Italy, of course, are defensive masters – schooled in the “dark arts” of catenaccio. Never mind the fact that they have kept only a single clean sheet in their last eight games.

The best Italy teams of recent years have been founded on a strong defence. The 2006 World Cup winners gave up only two goals all tournament, while the Euro 2012 runners-up conceded three times prior to their catastrophic collapse against Spain in the final. Ever since, the Azzurri’s defending has seemed far less assured.

Although Italy cruised through World Cup qualifying – securing their place in Brazil with two games to spare – they also conceded nine goals along the way, more than any European group winner besides Germany, including two at home to Armenia, albeit in a dead rubber.

The Confederations Cup last summer offered confirmation of the trend. Italy shipped eight goals in three group-stage matches, including three in a helter-skelter win over Japan. The two sides also combined to hit the woodwork four times in the game, prompting La Repubblica to compare the whole experience to watching a giant game of pinball.

Excuses were made by Italy’s manager, Cesare Prandelli, who argued that his players were simply struggling with the hot and humid conditions at the end of an exhausting club campaign. By having this experience now, he asserted, they would know what to expect by the time the World Cup itself rolled round.

Twelve months later, it is not clear what lessons have been learned. On Sunday Italy conceded three goals in a tune-up game against the Brazilian club side Fluminense. Prandelli had fielded an experimental lineup – including his third-choice goalkeeper, Mattia Perin, and one defender, Andrea Ranocchia, who is not even in the 23-man squad. But among the Italian press corps, there was still significant alarm.

“Azzurri’s defence made to dance the samba,” yelped the front page of the newspaper Il Secolo XIX, while Il Giornale lamented the Azzurri’s “black holes” in defence. Inside, Riccardo Signori reached for a food-themed metaphor. “Italy’s back-up defence is like a gruyère,” he wrote. “But the starting one is made out of butter.”

The players themselves are aware that standards are slipping. “We have talked about it among ourselves,” said Giorgio Chiellini. “We have lost intensity in the defensive phase of the game as well as something in the distances we keep. During the first two years of Prandelli’s tenure we were more balanced. Now we have lost that thread and we must work to find it again.”

That might be easier said than done. There is no single cause for these diminished performances , and therefore no single solution.

The first and most obvious problem for Prandelli is the lack of reliable options at full-back. Leaving aside Chiellini, a player who does his best work in the centre of defence but can do a solid job on the left when required, Prandelli only has three players to fill two positions. Ignazio Abate and Mattia De Sciglio are both coming off disappointing seasons at Milan, where they alternated at right-back. The latter has been ruled out of the England game with a calf injury. Torino’s Matteo Darmian won his first international cap only last month.

A lack of experience does not necessarily indicate a lack of quality, and Prandelli says he and his staff have been blown away by Darmian’s efforts in training recently. Optimistic reporters have likened the player’s situation to that of another full-back, Antonio Cabrini, who made his international debut in Italy’s opening game at the 1978 World Cup, and went on to help his country to a fourth-placed finish.

For now, though, the uncertainty remains troubling. Prandelli has suggested that he may switch between a three- and four-man defence during the tournament, something that he did to great effect at Euro 2012. In either formation, his team seem likely to be most vulnerable down the flanks.

Which is not to say that Italy are in great shape at centre-back either. Chiellini’s preparations for this tournament have been disrupted by a minor but persistent back injury. Andrea Barzagli, Italy’s most consistent defender when healthy, has been limited for months by tendon pain.

Their Juventus team-mate Leonardo Bonucci is in better shape – although he did tweet a picture of himself being treated by a podiatrist last weekend, marking it with a hashtag that translates to “foot pain”. For him the greater issue is a tactical one. Used to working in a three-man back line with Juventus, Bonucci has often looked unsure of his role in a four.

Prandelli is aware of all these concerns, but also quick to dismiss them. In the wake of the Fluminense game he claimed not to be worried about his team’s defensive performance, since all three goals had, in his view, stemmed from individual errors. Italy had also still won the match 5-3. “If you must concede a goal,” he said, “then you just have to score one more than the opponent does.”

A simple enough philosophy to state. An altogether trickier one to live up to.

[Jason the Yank]

Buffon apparently suffered an ankle sprain in training today. Uncertain if he'll be ready for the match.

[themadsheep2001]

Buffon apparently suffered an ankle sprain in training today. Uncertain if he'll be ready for the match.

Aye, if he does play, I'd certainly try and test him with some early long range pot shots, test the ankle for any loss of leap/dive. They still have the very capable Sigiru anyway, but no Buffon would be a bonus. England aside it would be a shame for him to miss it.

[mlyons]

I suspect the tactic will be to throw Sterling on at 60 minutes whenever has wilted under the strain of the Brazilian summer.

It doesn't seem like a good idea to wait to throw Sterling on until December.

[Razzler]

We're gonna be so obsessed with Pirlo we'll ignore everyone else