Football Manager 2024 Official Feedback Thread

[Preveza]

28 minutes ago, Litmanen 10 said:

Well, duh. History is history and I also once had the desire to do this but not anymore. 

I just wanted to point out to those still actively doing the same thing that it might be wise to just leave and get back to it when the bug reporters are treated with a little bit more respect. 

Even some of the mods, have been criticising SI for the lack of communication, so it is definitely an issue at the moment. 

Talking in the present, and not ancient history, im with you on this. We care what is being done now, in this moment, not historically when the devs were much much more transparent and open to critique and actively engaging with the loyal playerbase. Historically, the games bugs were rectified and the devs more engaged with the community in terms of getting them fixed. (Not saying they are not working as hard as they can), but 'historically' means nothing when we have been given what we have been given this year, and the year previous etc etc in terms of bugs, data issues, issues that have been reported constantly again and again and again, and simply have not been fixed. I won't engage in this topic as to not get this thread hijacked, but I needed to let this out of my chest.

[pw75]

2 hours ago, Preveza said:

Talking in the present, and not ancient history, im with you on this. We care what is being done now, in this moment, not historically when the devs were much much more transparent and open to critique and actively engaging with the loyal playerbase. Historically, the games bugs were rectified and the devs more engaged with the community in terms of getting them fixed. (Not saying they are not working as hard as they can), but 'historically' means nothing when we have been given what we have been given this year, and the year previous etc etc in terms of bugs, data issues, issues that have been reported constantly again and again and again, and simply have not been fixed. I won't engage in this topic as to not get this thread hijacked, but I needed to let this out of my chest.

I think this is a big issue and SI need to address it or start to lose some members of the community.  The bug reporting is something I gave up on a fair while ago, it might be they work on them but a lack of communication and their 'update system' being so unhelpful puts me off contributing.

In recent years there does seem to be a bit of a culture at SI that isn't quite what it was.  I think we have heard a lot from Miles relatively recently about acknowledging mistakes and what they plan to do to rectify them but their actions are what I base my opinions on and I think they obviously have issues whether that is from the top or a disconnect with people below senior management I don't know.

Like in most cases it is wise to also look at what they do and do well but I now view FM features a little bit like one of my other posts, dog s*** on dog s*** and the SI office walking around blindly saying 'what's that smell'!  I appreciate they have their own bosses (Sega) to please but if you continue to ram poorly designed and implementable features on a game it starts to erode the really good parts of it.  It is like having a finely polished and honed engine then chucking loads of oil on it saying 'well engines need oil right'!  They do but the right quality and the right amount!!!!!

Edited March 22 by pw75

[Cle]

When I start the game, I see 2500 coaches. 2 years later only 800 coaches. 8 Years later only 500 coaches. AI teams usually only have 0 or 1 coach ( very very rarely two coaches). So only 2 Assistant managers and Manager hold attack (technical, tactical), possession (technical, tactical) and defense (technical, tactical) training sessions. The quality of these training sessions are only max. 3 or 3,5 stars in the top teams. (Good teams: only 2-2,5 stars). AI players can't develop properly because of this. So AI teams will be weaker than human teams. What are your opinions?

[Zachary Whyte]

39 minutes ago, Cle said:

AI teams usually only have 0 or 1 coach ( very very rarely two coaches). So only 2 Assistant managers and Manager hold attack (technical, tactical), possession (technical, tactical) and defense (technical, tactical) training sessions. The quality of these training sessions are only max. 3 or 3,5 stars in the top teams. (Good teams: only 2-2,5 stars). AI players can't develop properly because of this. So AI teams will be weaker than human teams. What are your opinions?

This is expected behaviour for the AI.

Some big teams will not have many ''General'' coaches, but focus more of the specifics roles such as fitness, GK, Set Piece.

It will all depend on the AI manager, Club and the League.

[Cle]

5 minutes ago, Zachary Whyte said:

 

Some big teams will not have many ''General'' coaches, but focus more of the specifics roles such as fitness, GK, Set Piece.

 

But why? They would also have the opportunity to hire general coaches. They have 3-4 empty places. And currently saved Set Piece coach extinct (only 63 set pieces coaches in the world), especially so. If I have 12 places, I buy 2 GK coaches, 2 set pieces coaches, 2 fitness coaches, 2 assistant manager and 4 general coaches, so all training minimum 4 stars. I have an advantage over AI teams.

[wazzaflow10]

8 hours ago, RDF Tactics said:

I reported a schedule thing a couple of years back but it wasn't exactly this. It was how different teams had the same fixtures. So example, I play United, City, and Chelsea in a row and there will be other team(s) in the same league with the same fixtures lol 

I got that in my game this year in the Premier League in two different saves. I haven't completed a season yet to see if it was fixed after I reported it. I don't know if it's done to save compute time or if something actually broke.

[Zachary Whyte]

4 minutes ago, Cle said:

I have an advantage over AI teams.

Training & Development works different for AI/non-user clubs, there is no 'advantage' over AI teams in this regard.

[LeoFM]

It's now been 7 years ago we last upgraded our youth facilities and I've not been able to ask the board for another upgrade since then, meaning our facilities are "stuck" at this. (despite being the richest team in our league by far)
My feedback is: I should be able to at least ask for an upgrade. Even if the board turns it down they will tell me the reason for it.

I've been able to upgrade the other facilities just fine, and sometimes my board turned my request down. But I always got the option to ask again some time later, just like in previous FM versions. 
It feels demotivating not knowing if your going to be able to max out the youth facilities, as someone who likes using the academy.

[fc.cadoni]

3 hours ago, LeoFM said:

It's now been 7 years ago we last upgraded our youth facilities and I've not been able to ask the board for another upgrade since then, meaning our facilities are "stuck" at this. (despite being the richest team in our league by far)
My feedback is: I should be able to at least ask for an upgrade. Even if the board turns it down they will tell me the reason for it.

I've been able to upgrade the other facilities just fine, and sometimes my board turned my request down. But I always got the option to ask again some time later, just like in previous FM versions. 
It feels demotivating not knowing if your going to be able to max out the youth facilities, as someone who likes using the academy.

Low youth importance from the board. Also from manual:

Working with Youngsters

This reflects how successful a coach is at working with younger players – those aged 19 and under in particular. A non-player with a high rating here will improve the players they work with if given a youth team training assignment, while the quality of an annual youth intake is affected by the rating of the person responsible for bringing them through. It is also used to determine an individual’s interest in young footballers overall, such as the Chairperson when asking the Board for improved youth facilities.

[LeoFM]

16 minutes ago, fc.cadoni said:

Low youth importance from the board. Also from manual:

Working with Youngsters

This reflects how successful a coach is at working with younger players – those aged 19 and under in particular. A non-player with a high rating here will improve the players they work with if given a youth team training assignment, while the quality of an annual youth intake is affected by the rating of the person responsible for bringing them through. It is also used to determine an individual’s interest in young footballers overall, such as the Chairperson when asking the Board for improved youth facilities.

I don't have a problem with them turning my request down. It's just that I've not been able to ask for it. 
Also my board has a required philosophy of developing players through the youth system. Now, we do already have a decent youth system for our league but surely having the option to ask for upgraded facilities lines up with this philosophy. 

[Jamieac]

Ok this woodwork situation really needs to get sorted once and for all next time around 

No exaggeration I'm 8 games into the PL season and I have hit the woodwork at least once in every game  Most of those games it's been 2 or 3 times 

[RDF Tactics]

9 hours ago, Jamieac said:

Ok this woodwork situation really needs to get sorted once and for all next time around 

No exaggeration I'm 8 games into the PL season and I have hit the woodwork at least once in every game  Most of those games it's been 2 or 3 times 

Apparently it’s not an issue and I know someone is ready to claim “but West Ham hit the woodwork 4 times once”…but its not even comparable to the amount of times you can hit it and how often you’re hitting it multiples times in a game lol

I’ve given up on speaking on the woodwork for a while. To the point now I just have to ignore it and accept it. I hit it over and around 50 times a season if I manually count it. Not including when the shot is deflected/saved onto the woodwork.

a couple years of asking and wondering why there’s no simple ‘woodwork hit’ stat too. Don’t think there’s ever been a reply to that so just have to keep guessing.

i used to get told to lower my tempo by people. That made me give up speaking about it 

there are obviously reasons to why you can hit the woodwork so often. Maybe there’s only so many “off target” possibilities. No idea. But it can be annoying

Edited March 23 by RDF Tactics

[kiwityke1983]

Next season after I played Vasco 4 times in a row the very first round of the cup I can join it's happened again where I'm drawn against a side I'm playing in the league the very next match! Meaning this has happened 3 out of 5 seasons so far! There's obviously something in the code for cup draws that makes this happen because it happens way, way, way too often to be random chance!

Edited March 23 by kiwityke1983

[SHK-555]

The amount of late comeback goals is insane, no matter the adjustments they are inevitable it needs toning down

[chiupo67]

I think the asian club in game seldom sign foreign players which is not so realistic since most of the team in asia will use most of the foreign player limit.

[santy001]

31 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

Next season after I played Vasco 4 times in a row the very first round of the cup I can join it's happened again where I'm drawn against a side I'm playing in the league the very next match! Meaning this has happened 3 out of 5 seasons so far! There's obviously something in the code for cup draws that makes this happen because it happens way, way, way too often to be random chance!

If it was a 1 leg tie there would be 2 games between you playing Mineiro but it might be something worth keeping an eye on and having a save a couple of days before a cup draw and see if it does happen consistently. In 12 years on my save I've not had it once, less 2 leg ties in English competitions though.  I have seen it in the past but it feels like it stands out way more in my memory when you do see a dense run against the same team. 

[kiwityke1983]

47 minutes ago, santy001 said:

If it was a 1 leg tie there would be 2 games between you playing Mineiro but it might be something worth keeping an eye on and having a save a couple of days before a cup draw and see if it does happen consistently. In 12 years on my save I've not had it once, less 2 leg ties in English competitions though.  I have seen it in the past but it feels like it stands out way more in my memory when you do see a dense run against the same team. 

I had it happen constantly in England too. 

[RDF Tactics]

1 hour ago, kiwityke1983 said:

I had it happen constantly in England too. 

It happens all the time. Just took over Everton, first FA draw was against Man Utd. That now means i play Man Utd then Man Utd back to back   One in the cup and one in the league

i also play the top 4 in a row. But same to as Fulham, same 4 teams in a row 

[fc.cadoni]

18 hours ago, LeoFM said:

I don't have a problem with them turning my request down. It's just that I've not been able to ask for it. 
Also my board has a required philosophy of developing players through the youth system. Now, we do already have a decent youth system for our league but surely having the option to ask for upgraded facilities lines up with this philosophy. 

If the request is not there, that means low youth importance despite the "board culture". Seems not normal, but that's how it works (for now).

Edited March 23 by fc.cadoni

[SaintsCanada]

I know many people have already pointed it out since the early access came out, but, there are really too many goals, and goalkeepers really make too few saves. If I were allowed to play 11 outfield players I probably would at this point. Has to be fixed for FM25.

[ATV]

On 21/03/2024 at 10:54, LucasBR said:

It’s so funny to see mods here trying to defend SI and consequently the game so hard lol

 Nothing happens on their games, rdf can’t give very good feedback without being considered obsessed lmao

it's their employer, I imagine they're expected to be positive.

 

lets just look at the upvotes on these posts, that'll tell you the general consensus. 

[El Payaso]

15 minutes ago, ATV said:

it's their employer, I imagine they're expected to be positive.

 

lets just look at the upvotes on these posts, that'll tell you the general consensus. 

The mods are not SI employees. 

[janrzm]

On 23/03/2024 at 23:41, kiwityke1983 said:

I had it happen constantly in England too. 

Has there been any SI comment on this? 

[XaW]

1 hour ago, ATV said:

it's their employer, I imagine they're expected to be positive.

 

lets just look at the upvotes on these posts, that'll tell you the general consensus. 

We are not employed by SI, we do this on a volunteer basis and we are not paid by them.

And as I wrote above, we are free to criticize the game. As you can see from my previous posts in this thread. We are only asked to help keep the rules of the forum, nothing more.

[kiwityke1983]

6 hours ago, janrzm said:

Has there been any SI comment on this? 

Not that I've ever seen. I haven't ever reported it as an issue though it's always just been one of those things that I see a lot and mildly annoys me.

[RDF Tactics]

6 hours ago, kiwityke1983 said:

Not that I've ever seen. I haven't ever reported it as an issue though it's always just been one of those things that I see a lot and mildly annoys me.

13 hours ago, janrzm said:

Has there been any SI comment on this? 

I did report my repeated fixture thing in November 2021. @Michael Sant did reply, but not sure what I did after as I didn't reply after haha I think I got a little frustrated with the "send game file in" thing as it's something that can be replicated by just starting a new save lol it wasn't random and happens all the time. It's not something I think it takes someone to send in a file. Can start a new save and see it immediately. You can see from the images in my bug report, that EPL screenshots were from a different save than Serie A and La Liga. It is my bad not replying back. But, FM have testers who surely would've come across this too. 

We're now in FM24 and....Nearly half the teams in the EPL have to play Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal back to back (cases with the exact same order and with West Ham after Arsenal). The chances of that happening when fixtures are random? lol

A little bit of care with this stuff, for me, isn't too much to ask for. I first reported this in November 2021. So that's FM22. We're now in FM24 and it's still a thing. Two new editions and this hasn't been sorted out, with the bug report. No, I don't think what I reported should be fixed ASAP, but it's been two editions since It was reported and known and was in the editions before I reported it. This scheduling thing seems to have received little to no care which is a shame because of "immersion".

Maybe not high on their priority list, but again, it's been years. Not an ASAP fix is fine. Leaving it for years is a bit of an issue and starts to become a little annoying (for me).

Edited March 25 by RDF Tactics

[janrzm]

11 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

I did report my repeated fixture thing in November 2021. @Michael Sant did reply, but not sure what I did after as I didn't reply after haha I think I got a little frustrated with the "send game file in" thing as it's something that can be replicated by just starting a new save lol it wasn't random and happens all the time. It's not something I think it takes someone to send in a file. Can start a new save and see it immediately. You can see from the images in my bug report, that EPL screenshots were from a different save than Serie A and La Liga. It is my bad not replying back. But, FM have testers who surely would've come across this too. 

We're now in FM24 and....Nearly half the teams in the EPL have to play Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal back to back (cases with the exact same order and with West Ham after Arsenal). The chances of that happening when fixtures are random? lol

A little bit of care with this stuff, for me, isn't too much to ask for. I first reported this in November 2021. So that's FM22. We're now in FM24 and it's still a thing. Two new editions and this hasn't been sorted out, with the bug report. No, I don't think what I reported should be fixed ASAP, but it's been two editions since It was reported and known and was in the editions before I reported it. This scheduling thing seems to have received little to no care which is a shame because of "immersion".

Maybe not high on their priority list, but again, it's been years. Not an ASAP fix is fine. Leaving it for years is a bit of an issue and starts to become a little annoying (for me).

@kiwityke1983

Thanks both for the reply. I hear you, it's one of those that sits in the category of being so obvious you assume it's been reported multiple times and it's on the list to be looked at. 

It'd be nice to get some kind of acknowledgement all the same. I've probably reported more bugs this year than any previous year but with FM25 around the corner I'm thinking are bugs in FM24 relevant to the next version, is it new code with potentially new bugs. Who even knows.

[tezcatlipoca665]

1 hour ago, RDF Tactics said:

I did report my repeated fixture thing in November 2021. @Michael Sant did reply, but not sure what I did after as I didn't reply after haha I think I got a little frustrated with the "send game file in" thing as it's something that can be replicated by just starting a new save lol it wasn't random and happens all the time. It's not something I think it takes someone to send in a file. Can start a new save and see it immediately. You can see from the images in my bug report, that EPL screenshots were from a different save than Serie A and La Liga. It is my bad not replying back. But, FM have testers who surely would've come across this too. 

We're now in FM24 and....Nearly half the teams in the EPL have to play Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal back to back (cases with the exact same order and with West Ham after Arsenal). The chances of that happening when fixtures are random? lol

A little bit of care with this stuff, for me, isn't too much to ask for. I first reported this in November 2021. So that's FM22. We're now in FM24 and it's still a thing. Two new editions and this hasn't been sorted out, with the bug report. No, I don't think what I reported should be fixed ASAP, but it's been two editions since It was reported and known and was in the editions before I reported it. This scheduling thing seems to have received little to no care which is a shame because of "immersion".

Maybe not high on their priority list, but again, it's been years. Not an ASAP fix is fine. Leaving it for years is a bit of an issue and starts to become a little annoying (for me).

I checked this on my save just now and it's everywhere lmao. I never noticed before. Happens all over Serie A with Inter, Milan, Roma and Juventus too. I think this stuff does matter because you're essentially guaranteed to have a really tough period of fixtures every season, which affects confidence and potentially fitness depending on how you make your team play against more difficult sides (fielding your best 11 four-to-five games in a row can end up having a knock-on effect).

I'm still seeing patterns of playing the same team twice in a row due to domestic cup competitions. Milan played Atalanta in the Coppa Italia final just after a Serie A match with them. We (Chelsea) played Arsenal in the FA Cup final just after having a league match with them. Roma played Torino twice in a row. Salernitana played Bologna twice in a row. It just looks very odd and I can't unsee this stuff now.

EDIT: After checking somebody else's long-term save, it's definitely just a coincidence and seems to be happening to me a lot in my saves for some reason lol.

Edited March 25 by tezcatlipoca665

[Costav]

1 hour ago, RDF Tactics said:

We're now in FM24 and....Nearly half the teams in the EPL have to play Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal back to back (cases with the exact same order and with West Ham after Arsenal). The chances of that happening when fixtures are random?

See Rome, Atalanta and Napoli calendar in serie A this year....

[RDF Tactics]

12 minutes ago, tezcatlipoca665 said:

I checked this on my save just now and it's everywhere lmao. I never noticed before. Happens all over Serie A with Inter, Milan, Roma and Juventus too. I think this stuff does matter because you're essentially guaranteed to have a really tough period of fixtures every season, which affects confidence and potentially fitness depending on how you make your team play against more difficult sides (fielding your best 11 four-to-five games in a row can end up having a knock-on effect).

I'm still seeing patterns of playing the same team twice in a row due to domestic cup competitions. Milan played Atalanta in the Coppa Italia final just after a Serie A match with them. We (Chelsea) played Arsenal in the FA Cup final just after having a league match with them. Roma played Torino twice in a row. Salernitana played Bologna twice in a row. It just looks very odd and I can't unsee this stuff now.

I just checked another save and in Serie A, the Coppa Italia final is always scheduled between teams facing each other either in the league match before the final, or a league match after the final... Uh. Okay.

(first two screenshots are from another save of two seasons  - last screenshot from my current save which is only season)







I mentioned this happened to me in my FM23 Milan save a lot too. I didn't think to check other teams and put it down to a coincidence, but now I wonder if it really is one or if something is causing this to happen. Can somebody else check their save and see how the Coppa Italia finalists fixture schedules are and how often they seem to play the same team in succession?

I also see it. As much as I play the game, it's difficult not to. But again, it makes you wonder about the testers and the system behind it. Did testers bring this up and it got ignored or not a high priority? But then again, it's been 4/5/6 years off this. At some stage, it should become a priority. Always look to improve. These minor things start to become major in a player's experience.

For me, it's at the point where it's no longer relevant if this is on their priority list of things to fix or look at. It's been too long to be ignored.

[RDF Tactics]

10 minutes ago, Costav said:

See Rome, Atalanta and Napoli calendar in serie A this year....

And what am I supposed to be looking at? If you're trying to say the same thing, then it's not.

Napoli started against Frosinone and Sassuolo. Atalanta start with Sassuolo and Frosinone. Roma start is completely different not playing either of those sides nor do they play them back-to-back at any stage.

Napoli and Atalanta also play Genoa and Bologna back to back.

This is not the same as 10 teams in the same league having the same 4 to 5 fixtures back to back. And in the same save, 10 teams in EPL, Ligue 1, La Liga etc etc all going through the same thing.

Then, back-to-back league/cup draw.

At no stage do Roma, Napoli or Atalanta have the same team in a Coppa Italia game then a League game back-to-back.

I don't mind IRL examples in FM convos, but you have to recognise what people are saying and the complaint first. Because, in pointing out the fixture flaws, we are not saying two teams can NEVER have the same two teams back-to-back. Or saying in football it will NEVER happen you play the same team in the cup and league back to back. It's the fact it ALWAYS happens. I currently have 10 teams with the same back-to-back fixtures in EPL. If this happened occasionally, it could be pretty funny and story-building. It happening every time seems very odd. It happening for the past 4/5 editions is difficult to understand. They originally acknowledged it - if this was no problem then the reply back would've been that it's not a problem.

[RDF Tactics]

In Brazil. Fluminense and Athlético Paranaense. We both have AMG, GOI, FLA, ATM, GRE, CEC, INT, VDG, SEP and SPO

That's the same TEN teams back-to-back in the exact same order.

There's likely to be other teams with the same fixtures but I'm not spending any more time on this. I spoke about this stuff being time-consuming before. It's clearly an issue for years. Little to no point in spending any more time on this if there's no intention of doing anything.

It is what it is. Football Manager.

Edited March 25 by RDF Tactics

[XaW]

5 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

Just look. In Brazil. Fluminense and Athlético Paranaense. We both have AMG, GOI, FLA, ATM, GRE, CEC, INT, VDG, SEP and SPO

That's the same TEN teams back-to-back in the exact same order.

There's likely to be other teams with the same fixtures but I'm not spending any more time on this. I spoke about this stuff being time-consuming before. It's clearly an issue for years. No point in spending any more time on this if there's no intention of doing anything.

It is what it is. Football Manager.

If I'm not mistaken that's a setup in the pre-game editor.

Perhaps some leagues are set to "Straight" rather than "Random" or "Slightly random"...? I would expect this to mirror what is being done in real life, but I don't know how the various leagues schedule their leagues. So if this is wrong, I would report it as a bug with examples of it NOT happening in real life. Especially seeing as SI have asked for newer examples in your thread and the status is "need more info"...

[RDF Tactics]

10 minutes ago, XaW said:

If I'm not mistaken that's a setup in the pre-game editor.

Perhaps some leagues are set to "Straight" rather than "Random" or "Slightly random"...? I would expect this to mirror what is being done in real life, but I don't know how the various leagues schedule their leagues. So if this is wrong, I would report it as a bug with examples of it NOT happening in real life.

I've shown for EPL, Serie A, La Liga. And now Brazil. Other people are also in different leagues.

Me sending in the example of it NOT happening in real life is also, very time-consuming. And showing it NOT happening, shouldn't be my thing to do. That should be SI as it's their simulation. I'm showing examples of it in the game of it happening far too regularly. In different leagues.

I've pointed out there are repeated fixtures. Surely now it's their job to check if it adds up. And, or to clarify the league rules.

That's how the EPL get their fixtures. Mix them up randomly. My EPL fixtures seem far from random. As shown multiple times now.

I also can't find this rule/option in my pre-game editor. Where did ya find that? I probably will change if its set to straight. Where do I go from this page?

Edited March 25 by RDF Tactics

[XaW]

7 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

I've shown for EPL, Serie A, La Liga. And now Brazil. Other people are also in different leagues.

Me sending in the example of it NOT happening in real life is also, very time-consuming. And showing it NOT happening, shouldn't be my thing to do. That should be SI as it's their simulation. I'm showing examples of it in the game of it happening far too regularly. In different leagues.

I've pointed out there are repeated fixtures. Surely now it's their job to check if it adds up. And, or to clarify the league rules.

That's how the EPL get their fixtures. Mix them up randomly. My EPL fixtures seem far from random. As shown multiple times now.

I also can't find this rule/option in my pre-game editor. Where did ya find that? I probably will change if its set to straight.

I mean, I don't know if the Brazilian league plays it 1,2,3,1,2,3 or random? I would assume SI would follow what they do in real life. And no, it's not your job, but if SI have info that it's like it, then you need to prove your claim. I don't know what is right. But your screenshot there for PL would be enough to give them reason to change it. In the bug report you linked, SI said in November:

Quote

(...) Do you have any examples of this occurring since the minor update we released yesterday? If so then this is something I can look to move across to the live game and get QA to investigate further. Any save games - particularly from around the time in the summer before the fixture list is generated would be greatly appreciated.

And there are no further replies, even if you upvoted this comment. So a "yes, here is it" with the screenshot above and a save showing it would be plenty.

It's in the advanced editor section under Stages - <your stage> - League settings.

[Costav]

33 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

And what am I supposed to be looking at? If you're trying to say the same thing, then it's not.

Napoli started against Frosinone and Sassuolo. Atalanta start with Sassuolo and Frosinone. Roma start is completely different not playing either of those sides nor do they play them back-to-back at any stage.

Napoli and Atalanta also play Genoa and Bologna back to back.

This is not the same as 10 teams in the same league having the same 4 to 5 fixtures back to back. And in the same save, 10 teams in EPL, Ligue 1, La Liga etc etc all going through the same thing.

Then, back-to-back league/cup draw.

At no stage do Roma, Napoli or Atalanta have the same team in a Coppa Italia game then a League game back-to-back.

I don't mind IRL examples in FM convos, but you have to recognise what people are saying and the complaint first. Because, in pointing out the fixture flaws, we are not saying two teams can NEVER have the same two teams back-to-back. Or saying in football it will NEVER happen you play the same team in the cup and league back to back. It's the fact it ALWAYS happens. I currently have 10 teams with the same back-to-back fixtures in EPL. If this happened occasionally, it could be pretty funny and story-building. It happening every time seems very odd. It happening for the past 4/5 editions is difficult to understand. They originally acknowledged it - if this was no problem then the reply back would've been that it's not a problem.

No, I am sorry, I probably misunderstood your post or got confused with other remarks about the calendar.
I was not referring to the back to back matches, but to the amount of difficult games in a row. Atalanta had this year Milan, Inter, Bologna (which is a competitor for the UCL) and Juve in a row. Roma had something similar in December/January.

Regarding the back to back matches, this is a well-know method of calculation for calendars. It is the simplest method you can adopt (among the complex ones) and it has been used within other games too (I remember PES doing the same). Basically different teams have the same (or almost the same) order of matches. As XaW explained, you can change it in the editor. 

[RDF Tactics]

2 minutes ago, XaW said:

And there are no further replies, even if you upvoted this comment. So a "yes, here is it" with the screenshot above and a save showing it would be plenty.

I have addressed this. Yes, my bad I did not respond but given it's something you can literally replicate by starting a new save (as I have just done), I mean, that should be a big of a deal or a stumbling block for them.

I already showed in that post it was happening in multiple leagues. If I don't then respond, they should still look at it. What if I forgot to respond? lol, SI should not be resting and waiting for my response. Not being funny, but all it takes is 'start a new game'. and also, privately, I brought this up. Again, it's not something to just have a go for the sake of it. 

2 hours ago, RDF Tactics said:

@Michael Sant did reply, but not sure what I did after as I didn't reply after haha I think I got a little frustrated with the "send game file in" thing as it's something that can be replicated by just starting a new save lol it wasn't random and happens all the time. It's not something I think it takes someone to send in a file. Can start a new save and see it immediately. You can see from the images in my bug report, that EPL screenshots were from a different save than Serie A and La Liga. It is my bad not replying back. But, FM have testers who surely would've come across this too. 

I'm obvy not going to leak a conversation. But, here is me also reporting it directly to them in 2023. For FM23. So technically, yes. I did get back to them with this.

Again, two different leagues.

[kiwityke1983]

It happened again!

Same season as before the semi-final is against Bragantino who I play directly before the semi-final...this is now my 4th back to back cup match in 5 seasons and the 2nd this season alone!

Weirdly enough Atletico Goianiense are the team I'm scheduled to play in the league the week before the final is scheduled and they are in the other half of the semis so what's the betting we both make it for another back to back match up!

[XaW]

3 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

I have addressed this. Yes, my bad I did not respond but given it's something you can literally replicate by starting a new save (as I have just done), I mean, that should be a big of a deal or a stumbling block for them.

I already showed in that post it was happening in multiple leagues. If I don't then respond, they should still look at it. What if I forgot to respond? lol, SI should not be resting and waiting for my response. Not being funny, but all it takes is 'start a new game'. and also, privately, I brought this up. Again, it's not something to just have a go for the sake of it. 

Fair enough, but you linked it and that's what I know of it. I'm just saying the example you gave is still waiting for examples...

3 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

I'm obvy not going to leak a conversation. But, here is me also reporting it directly to them in 2023. For FM23. So technically, yes. I did get back to them with this.

Again, two different leagues.

I can't say much about what or who you have talked about it to, I can only say about what you have linked, and that is missing a display. And if you have other avenues to ask for this to change, then great, but talking about in the feedback thread means most won't know this.

[LucasBR]

Brazilian here

Serie A scheduling is completely random every season, it’s supposedly to change every season, one you start away from home and other season at home.

As to the Copa do Brasil is a bit more complex, there are some clubs that start at the third round if I’m not mistaken and they are seeded according to their position at the league in the previous year, also its regional championships have impact on the Copa Do Brasil, it’s been awhile since I played fm in the Brazilian league.

The Brazilian scheduling is a completely mess, it is hard to keep up with it lol

[kiwityke1983]

1 hour ago, LucasBR said:

Brazilian here

Serie A scheduling is completely random every season, it’s supposedly to change every season, one you start away from home and other season at home.

As to the Copa do Brasil is a bit more complex, there are some clubs that start at the third round if I’m not mistaken and they are seeded according to their position at the league in the previous year, also its regional championships have impact on the Copa Do Brasil, it’s been awhile since I played fm in the Brazilian league.

The Brazilian scheduling is a completely mess, it is hard to keep up with it lol

AFAIK the Copa Do Brasil IRL is insanely complicated and doesn't work as it should in FM because not all of the competitions required for it to do so are even simulated within the game.

I think IRL the Copa Libertadores teams plus the prior Brazilian winner of that comp and the Copa Suda Americana join at the third round plus as many teams required via league position (who qualified) to bring the total upto 10.

Team qualification by CBF ranking (10 teams)

Winning some state cups or Serie B (3 teams)

Then the 70 best state championship teams also qualify with each state having a varied number of qualifiers.

I'm actually really enjoying Brazil in FM there's a lot of instability in the league with big teams getting relegated basically every season.

Lots of great youth talent coming through and the state championships are bonkers where you either can be playing an amateur side or the Copa Libertadores champions and everything in-between.

Neymar returned to play for Botafogo and...they are probably getting relegated this season 😂 even though he always scores against me.

[RDF Tactics]

15 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

I’m actually really enjoying Brazil in FM there's a lot of instability in the league with big teams getting relegated basically every season.

Would recommend managing in Brazil on FM to anyone. It’s absolutely nuts! (In a good way).

difficult to advertise as you have to play like 7 million games a year  but they come thick and fast anyway.

Brazilian and Portuguese football in FM are really fun. And rarely goes stale in the future with the intriguing newgens that come through 

[wazzaflow10]

2 hours ago, XaW said:

Fair enough, but you linked it and that's what I know of it. I'm just saying the example you gave is still waiting for examples...

I can't say much about what or who you have talked about it to, I can only say about what you have linked, and that is missing a display. And if you have other avenues to ask for this to change, then great, but talking about in the feedback thread means most won't know this.

I already opened a bug report for this months ago. Have two saves that are affected (one a 23 port, another a fresh 24 save). Still tagged as "under review". I didn't have an issue for FM23 but when the schedule changed over for the first time in FM24 every team followed a set order. I won't say its a deal breaker for playing but it does kind of ruin the immersion a bit when you're just going 1,2,3 through the league along with everyone else. I didn't use any mods for the first save I submitted so this is entirely something that happens within the SI rules-set on schedule creation in 24. Most of the time when updates happen changes to leagues or league structures are only applied to new saves so it seems odd that the league would all of a sudden stop functioning as it had been.

[XaW]

10 minutes ago, wazzaflow10 said:

I already opened a bug report for this months ago. Have two saves that are affected (one a 23 port, another a fresh 24 save). Still tagged as "under review". I didn't have an issue for FM23 but when the schedule changed over for the first time in FM24 every team followed a set order. I won't say its a deal breaker for playing but it does kind of ruin the immersion a bit when you're just going 1,2,3 through the league along with everyone else. I didn't use any mods for the first save I submitted so this is entirely something that happens within the SI rules-set on schedule creation in 24. Most of the time when updates happen changes to leagues or league structures are only applied to new saves so it seems odd that the league would all of a sudden stop functioning as it had been.

Yeah, as I said, I have no idea if this is a bug or intentional, but thanks for reporting it! 

[NineCloudNine]

4 hours ago, RDF Tactics said:

That's how the EPL get their fixtures. Mix them up randomly. My EPL fixtures seem far from random. As shown multiple times now.

Just on this, if you mean by “random” that the schedule should not include clumps of similar blocks of fixtures or back-to-backs, then you’re falling into a common cognitive trap.

Did you know that ‘shuffle’ features on music players are not random? They used to be, but then people got three tracks in a row from the same artist, or two from one album, or repeats, and complained. So now shuffle doesn’t allow that sort of repetition, so it’s no longer random (because what comes up next is influenced by what came before and what is due to come after) but people think it is.

Getting what you seem to want a ‘random’ fixture list to look like actually takes a lot of planning - which is why all those fixture scheduling options exist in the editor. Deducing whether the output is in fact random (insofar as the fixture plan allows) is a pretty difficult task that needs a lot more than a handful of odd examples posted here, however obvious the problem might seem to our unreliable, pattern-seeking minds.

[Ein]

1 hour ago, NineCloudNine said:

Just on this, if you mean by “random” that the schedule should not include clumps of similar blocks of fixtures or back-to-backs, then you’re falling into a common cognitive trap.

Did you know that ‘shuffle’ features on music players are not random? They used to be, but then people got three tracks in a row from the same artist, or two from one album, or repeats, and complained. So now shuffle doesn’t allow that sort of repetition, so it’s no longer random (because what comes up next is influenced by what came before and what is due to come after) but people think it is.

Getting what you seem to want a ‘random’ fixture list to look like actually takes a lot of planning - which is why all those fixture scheduling options exist in the editor. Deducing whether the output is in fact random (insofar as the fixture plan allows) is a pretty difficult task that needs a lot more than a handful of odd examples posted here, however obvious the problem might seem to our unreliable, pattern-seeking minds.

This is not the issue. The issue is that Team X plays A, B, C, D, E, etc in that order whilst Team Y (typically the closest rival) plays Z, A, B, C, D, etc. In other words, Y always plays whoever X played one fixture earlier. This issue is easily reproducible and has been present at least since FM20.

[RDF Tactics]

2 hours ago, NineCloudNine said:

Just on this, if you mean by “random” that the schedule should not include clumps of similar blocks of fixtures or back-to-backs, then you’re falling into a common cognitive trap.

Did you know that ‘shuffle’ features on music players are not random? They used to be, but then people got three tracks in a row from the same artist, or two from one album, or repeats, and complained. So now shuffle doesn’t allow that sort of repetition, so it’s no longer random (because what comes up next is influenced by what came before and what is due to come after) but people think it is.

Getting what you seem to want a ‘random’ fixture list to look like actually takes a lot of planning - which is why all those fixture scheduling options exist in the editor. Deducing whether the output is in fact random (insofar as the fixture plan allows) is a pretty difficult task that needs a lot more than a handful of odd examples posted here, however obvious the problem might seem to our unreliable, pattern-seeking minds.

There's always some expectation for that to happen. As I noted in the Serie A, it happening with Napoli and Atalanta.

7 hours ago, RDF Tactics said:

we are not saying two teams can NEVER have the same two teams back-to-back. Or saying in football it will NEVER happen you play the same team in the cup and league back to back. It's the fact it ALWAYS happens. I currently have 10 teams with the same back-to-back fixtures in EPL. If this happened occasionally, it could be pretty funny and story-building. It happening every time seems very odd. It happening for the past 4/5 editions is difficult to understand. They originally acknowledged it - if this was no problem then the reply back would've been that it's not a problem.

10 teams having the same set of 4 fixtures back-to-back is a bit different, though. Like I was asked to point out to show examples of this not happening, there's no example of this happening in the EPL. So something, IMO, is off balance there - which is what I'm pointing out. Then to add you draw a team in the cup leading for you to have the same team back-to-back. Now, a lot of cup draws are out of a hat. But often, you get this coincidence.

6 hours ago, RDF Tactics said:

That's how the EPL get their fixtures. Mix them up randomly. My EPL fixtures seem far from random. As shown multiple times now.

This is just a simple statement. This is how EPL say they get their fixtures. In FM, because up to 10 teams can have the same set of fixtures, it doesn't seem right. Or "random". It feels more calculated.

Upon replying to this comment. I started a new save. Looked at fixtures and look at this. In no snarky way or anything, does this seem right?

Notice the team's fixtures I'm looking at here. Everton, Fulham, Bournemouth...these are the exact same teams I screenshotted earlier. In a totally different save. They have Liverpool, Chelsea, Tottenham and Man UFC back-toback and in the exact same order.

Given the want for files etc, I don't think it was the intention of SI for this to happen either.

Edited March 25 by RDF Tactics

[wazzaflow10]

10 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

Given the want for files etc, I don't think it was the intention of SI for this to happen either.

You know its almost like someone accidentally runs a sort based on something close to reputation or expected finish in the fixture maker part of the code.

Arsenal - MC - Liverpool - Chelsea - Spurs - Man Utd - Everton - Fulham - Wolves - Palace - Villa - Burnley - Forest - Brighton - Brentford - Luton  - West Ham - Bournemouth - Sheffield Utd

Newcastle seems to be a bit of a wildcard slotting in as needed.

[RDF Tactics]

1 minute ago, wazzaflow10 said:

You know its almost like someone accidentally runs a sort based on something close to reputation or expected finish in the fixture maker part of the code.

Arsenal - MC - Liverpool - Chelsea - Spurs - Man Utd - Everton - Fulham - Wolves - Palace - Villa - Burnley - Forest - Brighton - Brentford - Luton  - West Ham - Bournemouth - Sheffield Utd

Newcastle seems to be a bit of a wildcard slotting in as needed.

I see and think similar. Admittedly, I thought me mentioning that would come across a bit conspiracy theory'ish 

You do the same 10 teams having to facing the higher rep teams in the screenshots. But I just haven't looked at it as far as seeing if there is a mixture (like Arsenal - Brentford - Sheff Utd - Man City) pattern that appears.

[wazzaflow10]

5 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

I see and think similar. Admittedly, I thought me mentioning that would come across a bit conspiracy theory'ish 

You do the same 10 teams having to facing the higher rep teams in the screenshots. But I just haven't looked at it as far as seeing if there is a mixture (like Arsenal - Brentford - Sheff Utd - Man City) pattern that appears.

That would be one of the more mild conspiracy theories about this game lol. I'm currently playing 21 and I don't have this issue and I'm seven season in now. I've not come across it at all until 24.