FM 21 Season Update price

[Dennis_Ajax]

As far as I can tell from the newly announced 'features' I think we can come to the conclusion SI is not going to charge us the full price but, just like PES, will bring out a Season Update? Or do they really think people will buy the game for 55-60 euro's when they change "Assertive" to "Throw with a bottle" and presenting the same old features in a newly designed GUI?

 

Serious question. I think we should no longer be OK with companies like this and do something about it. It is an ongoing trend with many developers. We live in 2020. Bringing out almost the same game every year and charge the full price is ridiculous. 

[alian62]

Think i will wait and see what the demo throws up but im sure it will be the usual , game release , major patch for bug fix , another patch to rectify the bug fix , a small Xmas patch then a patch around March after everyone one complains that nothing gets fixed then its on to FM22

[Tom14]

28 minutes ago, Dennis_Ajax said:

Serious question. I think we should no longer be OK with companies like this and do something about it. It is an ongoing trend with many developers. We live in 2020. Bringing out almost the same game every year and charge the full price is ridiculous. 

You can do something about it. Don't buy the game if you think it isn't good value.

[gunner86]

47 minutes ago, Dennis_Ajax said:

As far as I can tell from the newly announced 'features' I think we can come to the conclusion SI is not going to charge us the full price but, just like PES, will bring out a Season Update? Or do they really think people will buy the game for 55-60 euro's when they change "Assertive" to "Throw with a bottle" and presenting the same old features in a newly designed GUI?

 

Serious question. I think we should no longer be OK with companies like this and do something about it. It is an ongoing trend with many developers. We live in 2020. Bringing out almost the same game every year and charge the full price is ridiculous. 

Also a serious question, what new features do you want added that would make it worth full price?

[Mars_Blackmon]

50 minutes ago, Dennis_Ajax said:

As far as I can tell from the newly announced 'features' I think we can come to the conclusion SI is not going to charge us the full price but, just like PES, will bring out a Season Update? Or do they really think people will buy the game for 55-60 euro's when they change "Assertive" to "Throw with a bottle" and presenting the same old features in a newly designed GUI?

 

Serious question. I think we should no longer be OK with companies like this and do something about it. It is an ongoing trend with many developers. We live in 2020. Bringing out almost the same game every year and charge the full price is ridiculous. 

Speak for yourself. I already bought the game. And to think that the new interaction is just renamed words is really short sighted.

[tyro]

Well, I got it for EUR 49.49.

I could go out for one dinner or delivery and pay about the same, or get this game (or maybe both :)) and in the worst case spend 50 hours on it, which makes it EUR 1 per hour.

What do I get for it?

So far:

• revamped interaction with players, looks promising so far and they have shown when they revamp something they do change how things work, not just the words (i.e. assertive to throw a bottle)
• revamped match experience, press conferences with possible repercussions with journalists/board, made several quality of life improvements
• added a new analysis tool (xG)
• updated animations and graphics in the match
• revamped the recruitment planning/spotting weak spots in the team
• give you some chance to celebrate your successes

There is more to come. They already mentioned they made improvements to the match engine and they usually do a lot of under the hood improvements.

There are differences also between stand-alone games and series. If you look at any series, I'd like to know what game you can provide as an example that shows so many changes from one year to the next that it is worth it for you?

There are 1.5 million players playing? I think I read it somewhere. I doubt all of them have the same idea of what needs to be improved because everyone plays this differently. Some like to play as a Director of Football (hands-off approach). Some love to go into details. Some focus on transfers. Some focus on training and development. Some do a bit of all. Some play 2D. Some play 3D. Will those people all agree on the same features to develop for the next year? I doubt it. Even if you take 20 people, they won't agree. So, they need to look through the ideas and get together and decide on a theme and improve the game that way. And that's what they do. Each year they have a focus. This year the focus is on the manager to improve how you manage, interact, and analyze your team. Some may like it, some may not. Everyone is free to decide if they want to spend their money on this. For me, as I mentioned, worst case, it is EUR 1 per hour. If I look at my chips or drink that I might eat while playing, they cost already more than that and are gone faster !

 

 

[deaks500]

If you don't want to pay full price, then don't buy it and download a transfer update if that's all you think it is! The game isn't out yet so no one can say weather the new features are worth it or not , but as someones mentioned, there will be a demo so play that then decide if you think full retail is worth it!!

Si arn't a huge company like Activision or EA, they need the revenue to keep operating and producing the games year in and year out,  i see the cost of the game as almost like a yearly subscription which i think most players get absolute value for money for £30-£40 per year!!

Plus they seem like a decent company that look after staff and care about the product, so companies like this should be supported.

 

So yeah im very muck 'OK' with companies like this (Si) bringing out an improved version every year and im very much OK to pay what their work is worth, even if its not revolutionary every time.

 

[Neotropolis]

I've bought the game every year since 2014 and in that time, the version with the least hours play time is still at 1318 hours so this is absolutely good value for the money. I can't think of another game (excluding free-to-play games) where I can get better value for my money.

To think that all they do every year is squad updates is extremely narrow sighted and ignores every bit of hard work that SI put into the games every year. 

[Harper]

Simple fact is that every sports game is mostly a season update with modest improvements on a year over year basis. Big tent overhauls and feature releases are three to five years apart. Especially when each module of the game impacts or is impacted by other modules. None of the modules of the game are siloed from each other so one change to the code can have far-reaching, unintended consequences if due diligence isn't given to testing.

Edited October 20, 2020 by Harper

[kevhamster]

7 hours ago, Dennis_Ajax said:

As far as I can tell from the newly announced 'features' I think we can come to the conclusion SI is not going to charge us the full price but, just like PES, will bring out a Season Update? Or do they really think people will buy the game for 55-60 euro's when they change "Assertive" to "Throw with a bottle" and presenting the same old features in a newly designed GUI?

 

Serious question. I think we should no longer be OK with companies like this and do something about it. It is an ongoing trend with many developers. We live in 2020. Bringing out almost the same game every year and charge the full price is ridiculous. 

People expect a new game each year.  Game development takes a long time.  I'm not sure what you expect over and above iterative changes each year. 

It's your choice to buy it or not. 

[Staf9]

bought every game since 1997. its a manager game, you buy sell the players and pick the tactics. not sure how much people expect a game to change year on year

[santy001]

I do wonder what qualifies as new features, of substance, for a game based on a sport. It's hardly like they can introduce two balls is it?

I genuinely wouldn't consider an improvement to the graphics in matches to be a new feature. It would just be another update to an existing system in the game. 

[Prej]

Hold up, let me check something.

As of today, 3213 hours played in FM20, with similar results every year.

Yeah, I guess I got my money's worth, and I already preordered the new one.

 

On 20/10/2020 at 13:27, Dennis_Ajax said:

Or do they really think people will buy the game for 55-60 euro's when they change "Assertive" to "Throw with a bottle" and presenting the same old features in a newly designed GUI?

Yeah, I think they do.

- "Same old features"

It's a management game. If you look back to ancient Championship Manager times, it's all the same old features being tweaked and expanded. I mean, every FPS game has "the same old features" of you looking down a gun and shooting, yet every year millions and millions of people are buying them like there's no tomorrow.

- "Newly designed UI"

It's a new feature.

Also, FM is pretty much the only football management game on the market worth any money. Every other game is: a) not licensed; b) a FM knockoff.

The other thing is, FM is a very good game, even considering the bugs and all the stuff people (me included) keep complaining about. It's a damn good game that offers you literally thousands of hours of fun and endless possibilities, all that for a few (insert currency here).

Come on.

[JordanMilly]

2 hours ago, santy001 said:

It's hardly like they can introduce two balls is it?

MULTIBALL! MULTIBALL! MULTIBALL!

[forameuss]

Is there anything really that revolutionary left to add to FM?  I mean, as long as we're not moving outwith the lines that SI have already stated they'll never go out of.  What role of a football manager is left to model?

[LolloViola]

1 ora fa, forameuss ha scritto:

Is there anything really that revolutionary left to add to FM?  I mean, as long as we're not moving outwith the lines that SI have already stated they'll never go out of.  What role of a football manager is left to model?

A smart and realistic ME would definitely be enough for me to buy just a seasonal update every year with no other improvements.

[-Jef-]

4 hours ago, LolloViola said:

A smart and realistic ME would definitely be enough for me to buy just a seasonal update every year with no other improvements.

Then why buy something every year if there is no improvement?

[brruh]

On 20/10/2020 at 15:35, tyro said:

Well, I got it for EUR 49.49.

I could go out for one dinner or delivery and pay about the same, or get this game (or maybe both :)) and in the worst case spend 50 hours on it, which makes it EUR 1 per hour.

What do I get for it?

So far:

• revamped interaction with players, looks promising so far and they have shown when they revamp something they do change how things work, not just the words (i.e. assertive to throw a bottle)
• revamped match experience, press conferences with possible repercussions with journalists/board, made several quality of life improvements
• added a new analysis tool (xG)
• updated animations and graphics in the match
• revamped the recruitment planning/spotting weak spots in the team
• give you some chance to celebrate your successes

There is more to come. They already mentioned they made improvements to the match engine and they usually do a lot of under the hood improvements.

There are differences also between stand-alone games and series. If you look at any series, I'd like to know what game you can provide as an example that shows so many changes from one year to the next that it is worth it for you?

There are 1.5 million players playing? I think I read it somewhere. I doubt all of them have the same idea of what needs to be improved because everyone plays this differently. Some like to play as a Director of Football (hands-off approach). Some love to go into details. Some focus on transfers. Some focus on training and development. Some do a bit of all. Some play 2D. Some play 3D. Will those people all agree on the same features to develop for the next year? I doubt it. Even if you take 20 people, they won't agree. So, they need to look through the ideas and get together and decide on a theme and improve the game that way. And that's what they do. Each year they have a focus. This year the focus is on the manager to improve how you manage, interact, and analyze your team. Some may like it, some may not. Everyone is free to decide if they want to spend their money on this. For me, as I mentioned, worst case, it is EUR 1 per hour. If I look at my chips or drink that I might eat while playing, they cost already more than that and are gone faster !

 

 

I agree the game doesn't cost much and I've already bought it too, but I don't feel like all the stuff they have announced is enough. I mean, I like the new features, but it's just interface changes.

player interaction: just changed ui+added more opportunities to talk to players

xg is good thing, but it will be useless if ME doesn't get serious improvements 

as for recruitment planning: its useless lol, u can see all info u need in the team report section(yes, it makes the process more convenient, but I don't think it could have taken a year to develop lol)

celebrating: these are just a few pictures and comments on them popping up at the end of the season(its a good innovation but it wouldn't take more than several hours(or even less lol) to make it)

There are a lot of things to add/fix, but for the second year in a row SI just changes some ui, It feels like coders work only 2 months a year, and the rest of the time they just don't do anything

All in all, unless SI has completely redone the ME it will be just fm19 with interface changes.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 24, 2020 by brruh

[DementedHammer]

To be fair to SI, outside of the match engine, two of the most common complaints on here are about frustrations with press conferences and player interactions, so I can see why they'd focus on them. 

Edited October 25, 2020 by DementedHammer

[Harper]

6 hours ago, brruh said:

player interaction: just changed ui+added more opportunities to talk to players

I disagree, depending on how it is implemented, further expanse of interactions can and should be more than interface changes. Particularly with players, this could help the process selling a player or setting expectations after a player is signed in the same position, preventing them from getting upset.  Instead of getting the news item indicating a player might be upset about their contract, be able to initiate the conversation yourself.

The agent interaction might help unsettle targets that previously have had no interest, turn a players head so that they force a transfer, possibly for a lower fee than you would currently get.

I put in a feature request about this in May 2019 so, and I hope it's implemented in a way that makes it useful for managing player egos or outlining expectations or gauging a player's happiness or willingness to explore/request transfer without rocking the boat too much and potentially upsetting the whole squad.

6 hours ago, brruh said:

as for recruitment planning: its useless lol, u can see all info u need in the team report section(yes, it makes the process more convenient, but I don't think it could have taken a year to develop lol)

Also disagree here, I feel an area SI can improve is the in-game UI around squad depth, transfer planning, and wage management. The the way the information database is visualized to us hasn't really changed for a decade (or more) and I'd like to see SI push the boat out a little and try to freshen things up. Maybe add different skins to obfuscate attributes. Maybe a radar only profile or show position/role ratings, but not the individual attributes (rely on report descriptions and statistics --ergo training data and game analysis should list sprint speeds, ball carry speeds, etc).

The squad depth screen as it currently exists is, in my opinion, a tremendous waste of screen real estate.

In its place should be a screen where we can select the available formations and drag and drop players into the available  positions and how we see the depth order rather than relying on the star rating system.

As a season progresses, the game then highlights instances where our first choice player isn't getting the game time he should. It doesn't change "Agreed Playing Time" that was negotiated with the player, but informs us where our perception doesn't match the use. 

Something like the below, possibly expanded with appearance and or contract expiration year. Underneath being an "unplaced" section where players that can't be placed remain, and basically better visualize and group the surplus to requirements, without actually having to set that and upset the player. The depth we set manually should inform the auto-pick rotated squad option, as well as how the reserve and youth squads are picked initially (though reserve and youth team managers will be able to override as performance overrides the preference). Add in some color coding that indicates when the backup is playing more than the first choice, or depth/unplaced option eclipses the backup.

Basically, I shouldn't have to use external programs to manually track my squad.

I think that the the wage commitment screen could be better visualized. It could be grouped by position and squad and highlight areas of concern: too many contracts at a certain position? Wage disproportionately spent at a certain position? Wage to age breakdown, is the squad balanced, too young, too old? Contract expiry groupings, is half the first team expiring in the same year which players do you renew/sell?

I think there could be better visualization of bonus tracking to show how much each individual player earns performance based bonuses.

I'd even suggest that there should be a screen to dictate a five year transfer plan to visualize incoming and outgoing transfers and direct the recruitment team priorities from scouting assignments to Director of Football signings. Right now, I don't delegate my transfer duties because the DoF are always signing for positions where I believe I have good depth, or youth I want to bring along. When you take over another club the immediate window might still be dictated to a degree by the previous manager's planned, the DoF, and the club's current direction, but you have more input to the subsequent years. There might be some recommendations/mandates (auto-populated similar to the club vision) from the board to sell a player before father time takes his toll, or sell players before they enter the last 12-18 months of their contract. 

Add a position or player to an incoming transfer window in the future and the tasks you delegate to the recruitment team are informed by what you set. The position will be scouted for and recommended, specific players and the competitions they play in prioritized. You might get an updated  like "Transfer target X for Summer 2022 summer is unhappy and demanded a transfer and is available for Summer 2021" or informed when rumors of another team's interest develops or progresses.

[tyro]

12 hours ago, brruh said:

I agree the game doesn't cost much and I've already bought it too, but I don't feel like all the stuff they have announced is enough. I mean, I like the new features, but it's just interface changes.

player interaction: just changed ui+added more opportunities to talk to players

xg is good thing, but it will be useless if ME doesn't get serious improvements 

as for recruitment planning: its useless lol, u can see all info u need in the team report section(yes, it makes the process more convenient, but I don't think it could have taken a year to develop lol)

celebrating: these are just a few pictures and comments on them popping up at the end of the season(its a good innovation but it wouldn't take more than several hours(or even less lol) to make it)

There are a lot of things to add/fix, but for the second year in a row SI just changes some ui, It feels like coders work only 2 months a year, and the rest of the time they just don't do anything

All in all, unless SI has completely redone the ME it will be just fm19 with interface changes.

 

 

 

 

I don't think it is just a UI change with more options. They put more thought into this but we will know for sure only once we get to play. 

The general theme is quality of life improvements, making things more accessible, reworking some things that haven't been touched in a while (interactions, press conferences etc.).

I recently started playing FM20 again and enjoying it. If I get some additional things and improvements, then I'm happy. 

There's really no point for people to complain about a game that is not out yet. 

In a couple of weeks you will see if it's worth it for you or not. 

 

[FedAt]

On 22/10/2020 at 10:34, santy001 said:

I do wonder what qualifies as new features, of substance, for a game based on a sport. It's hardly like they can introduce two balls is it?

I genuinely wouldn't consider an improvement to the graphics in matches to be a new feature. It would just be another update to an existing system in the game. 

as for me, I think improvements of training and set pieces systems would be nice update. It's not a new feature), but in the current state, imo it's very weak part of this game, so any significant improvement can count as a new feature)

[tarbanrael]

The one issue that annoys me year in year out is the fact that AI clubs do not rotate players (to the point they even play recovering players, unfit players in the CL final when they have really good subs), do not plan for their future (after a while some clubs look like a geriatric ward) and after a while they really are struggling to compete with the player's team.  

 

[Shenmue-X]

On 25/10/2020 at 06:28, Harper said:

 

 

Which program it comes from? First time I ever see concepts of backup of backup team, and reserve backup!

[Harper]

3 hours ago, Shenmue-X said:

Which program it comes from? First time I ever see concepts of backup of backup team, and reserve backup!

It’s just mocked up in Excel with cells filled to mimic FM color scheme.