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Quickfire Questions and Answers Thread (Tactic and Training Questions Only)

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Watch the clips back of where this has happened via the analysis tab and you'll see exactly what the issue is.

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Watch the clips back of where this has happened via the analysis tab and you'll see exactly what the issue is.

I have done that already before posting here. Sorry for not wording myself clearly enough. Most of the time it was a long ball to winger, who then made a run on the flank and put in a cross to a strong forward who beat my defender in the air. That simple. These were like 50% of the goals conceded. Others fall into different categories. How do you defend against these crosses? From what I've seen, these are really dangerous and it would be better to stop these crosses in the first place rather than deal with the headers in my box. Is a Wing Back/Support too vulnerable by default? Should I consider adding Tight Marking to him? Thanks.

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I have done that already before posting here. Sorry for not wording myself clearly enough. Most of the time it was a long ball to winger, who then made a run on the flank and put in a cross to a strong forward who beat my defender in the air. That simple. These were like 50% of the goals conceded. Others fall into different categories. How do you defend against these crosses? From what I've seen, these are really dangerous and it would be better to stop these crosses in the first place rather than deal with the headers in my box. Is a Wing Back/Support too vulnerable by default? Should I consider adding Tight Marking to him? Thanks.

I don't know who it's down to because only you have access to the games. Have you viewed the build up and the start of the move rather than the end of the move? As that's where the initial problem arises from, from before it actually happens. Have a look at who is out of position or how your players are positioned before the long ball and ask yourself if its a duty or role issue and who realistically should be covering this space or marking.

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I don't know who it's down to because only you have access to the games. Have you viewed the build up and the start of the move rather than the end of the move? As that's where the initial problem arises from, from before it actually happens. Have a look at who is out of position or how your players are positioned before the long ball and ask yourself if its a duty or role issue and who realistically should be covering this space or marking.

Thanks. That's clever. I need to focus more on where the initial problem arises from, from before it actually happens. If I have have any more specific questions I'll make the pertaining PKM's available.

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Anyone know how the AI manages to get it's wide players to swap positions? I note that Raheem Sterling and Jordan Ibe swap sides several times a half when playing Liverpool and it's very difficult to counter unless you pause the game every few seconds!!

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Anyone know how the AI manages to get it's wide players to swap positions? I note that Raheem Sterling and Jordan Ibe swap sides several times a half when playing Liverpool and it's very difficult to counter unless you pause the game every few seconds!!

The AI has the same tools you have, so it would be from the Player Instructions screen.

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The AI has the same tools you have, so it would be from the Player Instructions screen.

Ah, I never noticed that before because you can't do it through "edit" instructions. Many thanks..

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how to increase run from deep frequency from player? My side midfield got decent pace and poor dribling, but good at off the ball,passing,and crossing. He's not run from deep as often as expected.I would likehim to run from deep often,without ball,then cross as soon as possible.

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Will FM15 tactics be compatible with FM16?

I doubt it. SI may have changed some of the Roles to lock / unlock specific PIs. There may also have been changes to the way TIs work so it's unlikely that you can import FM15 tactics into FM16. As ever, if the tactic is logical, then its broader concept can be recreated in FM16.

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how to increase run from deep frequency from player? My side midfield got decent pace and poor dribling, but good at off the ball,passing,and crossing. He's not run from deep as often as expected.I would likehim to run from deep often,without ball,then cross as soon as possible.

What Roles / Duties have you tried? What Mentality and Team Shape?

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how to increase run from deep frequency from player? My side midfield got decent pace and poor dribling, but good at off the ball,passing,and crossing. He's not run from deep as often as expected.I would likehim to run from deep often,without ball,then cross as soon as possible.

I have a similar player and I use him as a Wide Midfielder - Attack. When he got the ball he pass it and runs

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FM15, How do you guys stop the likes of Balotelli, Aguero and Harry Kane?

4-2 up against Spurs in the Capital One Cup First Leg but I know that's not enough. Do I start on attack like I did in the First Leg or do I try and defend? I try and attack with a high line because Kane is slow and I can either catch him off side or my defenders will catch him because they are quicker. 15 minutes in I am two down with goals from Harry Kane, one a header and the other a near post cross is finished with the deftest of touches. I am annoyed because Balanta is up against him and his defensive stats match up to Kane's attacking stats but Kane always seems to come out on top.

I get one back from kick off and decide to go 4141 to man mark Eriksen at AM and stop Bernard who is supplying the crosses. Doesn't work, Eriksen scores after my keeper spills an easy shot and then Bernard crosses again for Kane to head home and then he gets another at a corner.

I go for broke attacking again and get one back but I am out of the Cup!!

So how do you stop these super strikers like Kane. Balotelli and Aguero? I can't man mark them, can't push up, can't drop deep and seemingly can't stop the supply and it's always away from home, never an issue at home. Maybe hard tackle them and try and injure them early?

Any ideas because even after a year of FM15 I still can't get a back four to defend!!!!!

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Stopping a player is impossible almost so what you do is stop the supply he gets. I never focus on a player and what he did to finish off the move because unless its a spectacular solo effort where the player has ran and ran at my side then it doesn't matter the finish or end bit of the move is irrelevant. The most important thing to focus on is what happened before the finish and how it got to that point. The answer will always lie within what happened before. Focus on that and stop these players getting the ball as often as they do. It's hard to give you specifics though as there are literally a million ways to achieve that.

I find it weird that you got a goal back though and then switched formation completely. Maybe you chopping and changing constantly is the issue here? You see someone do something and you ALWAYS react to it and maybe, just maybe sometimes you don't need to because its just one of those things and you can't play the perfect game and you can't cut every single mistake/issue out. Yet it seems you are trying to do this with your posts over the years. You've got a habit of being what I class as a very over reactive manager and you over analyse and over think things. Maybe after all these years it's time to strip back and forget everything you've learnt done so far and just go back to simple basics?

You sides seem to lack consistency due to all the changes, you change shape, settings, mentality, TI's etc constantly so never actually fully develop a system or create a proper playing style. There's nothing wrong with adapting but you don't need to constantly worry about the opposition. Instead focus on what your side does well and how you can improve that. This is your major downfall imo because you get hung up on every single detail of what the opposition is doing and somewhere amongst all this you lose your own attacking ideas and don't focus on them enough. I know this post will probably come across as me having a pop at you and I'm sorry if it does. It's just I get frustrated seeing you post about your issues all time, not because I don't want to help. In fact it's the opposite, I believe you create a lot of these issues yourself with your over eagerness or how you'll constantly change your game plan for the slightest of things. I really do want to see you do well out of anyone I've ever seen post because over the years we've had a lot of discussions back and forth on these forums. So it's like I'm always rooting for you to have a lightbulb moment or for everything suddenly to click :D

Honestly mate just strip back and don't make things more complicated than they need to be. And to answer your original question of ;

Do I start on attack like I did in the First Leg or do I try and defend?

How about starting like you normally do then make changes based on what you see? After the first goal did you look at why he scored and see the position of your players? he game can be won or lost in the opening 15 minutes of a goal. If I was going to make any changes if this was my own save I'd have done them during this period more than likely as it would set the tone for the game.

Again sorry if it seems critical, I do mean well I honestly do :)

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Not at all Cleon it's not an overcritical post and I do appreciate the help I do. In my defence I never change formation. It was just that game as I knew Bernard was flying down the wing and was becoming a problem I just tried not to concede as I knew the 4312 was too narrow against him but nothing I do defensively seems to work.

Funnily enough I played the game again as I had saved it just to see how I would have got on if I had just played my usual 4312 all the way through and got beat 6-4 with Kane again dominating in the goals. So what do you do?! That's two games, one reacting, one not reacting and exactly the same outcome. It's as if the likes of Spurs, Chelsea and Liverpool have this auto overload at home that is impossible to stop whatever you do. The Spurs and Liverpool formations especially have glaring weaknesses but still manage to get 11 men going forward and 11 men behind the ball when defending.

I have as you suggested stripped back and even played games with just a formation and mentality with no PI's and TI's and can go two or three up and get beat 4-3 and have to confess I see absolutely nothing different going on on the pitch with regard to mentalities, roles or duties!!! I can as I say go two up, see the opposition is dominating so say swap CWB A to a CWB S which IRL and in theory will make your defence more solid but it does the opposite it seems and you concede. Defending just seems impossible with players either standing around not putting tackles in and doing the very basics.

It probably is my tactics but it just gets extremely mind boggling when you can win 2-0, 3-0, 4-1, 3-0, 2-1 then lose 3-4, 0-2, 2-3, 1-3 in a row. To be fair that's when I start fiddling as I had that lightbulb moment then the lightbulb just faded as I went from unbeaten in 5 or 6 to can't win in 5 or 6.

Maybe it's a case of just accepting the games away at Spurs, Liverpool etc are unwinnable when they play certain players.

I mean is anything glaringly wrong with this set up bar the fact that obviously it is weak out wide, I play it most of the time but it is so inconsistent?

-------------------DLF S---------CF A-------------------

---------------------------AM A--------------------------

----------------BWM S---DLP D---BWM S--------------

CWB A/S------CD D---------------CD D--------CWB A/S

---------------------------SK A--------------------------

Attacking/Control - Fluid

TI's - Play out of defence (have experimented taking this off), stop GK dist, Stay on feet (sometimes)

PI's - Front three - Close Down Much More, Tackle harder (Rashidi's high block suggestion), Move Into Channels,

----------------------- BWM's and CWB's, play less risky passes

----------------------- GK distribute to full backs. Did experiment taking this off as thought maybe my full backs hadn't got good enough passing but to no avail.

As always do appreciate your help.

PS, That lightbulb moment was in patch two then with patch three the lightbulb blew!!!

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I mean you are playing quite an attacking formation and tactic against big sides. Can you really expect to win constantly that way? Have you tried going far more defensive and playing for a draw? Or pulling back your CWBs to fullback to stop them flying up the wing so often.

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I mean you are playing quite an attacking formation and tactic against big sides. Can you really expect to win constantly that way? Have you tried going far more defensive and playing for a draw? Or pulling back your CWBs to fullback to stop them flying up the wing so often.

Yes, tried playing counter, standard and defensive and same outcome. That's why I tend to stick to attacking cos if I am definitely going to concede I might as well try and score. Even defensively it's like I am playing the offside trap I can be so high it's weird. As for the CWB's have tried them as CWB S, FB S and the play exactly the same. Only difference I note is that as full backs they don't attack as often,. Defensively same old failings.

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Not at all Cleon it's not an overcritical post and I do appreciate the help I do. In my defence I never change formation. It was just that game as I knew Bernard was flying down the wing and was becoming a problem I just tried not to concede as I knew the 4312 was too narrow against him but nothing I do defensively seems to work.

Funnily enough I played the game again as I had saved it just to see how I would have got on if I had just played my usual 4312 all the way through and got beat 6-4 with Kane again dominating in the goals. So what do you do?! That's two games, one reacting, one not reacting and exactly the same outcome. It's as if the likes of Spurs, Chelsea and Liverpool have this auto overload at home that is impossible to stop whatever you do. The Spurs and Liverpool formations especially have glaring weaknesses but still manage to get 11 men going forward and 11 men behind the ball when defending.

I have as you suggested stripped back and even played games with just a formation and mentality with no PI's and TI's and can go two or three up and get beat 4-3 and have to confess I see absolutely nothing different going on on the pitch with regard to mentalities, roles or duties!!! I can as I say go two up, see the opposition is dominating so say swap CWB A to a CWB S which IRL and in theory will make your defence more solid but it does the opposite it seems and you concede. Defending just seems impossible with players either standing around not putting tackles in and doing the very basics.

It probably is my tactics but it just gets extremely mind boggling when you can win 2-0, 3-0, 4-1, 3-0, 2-1 then lose 3-4, 0-2, 2-3, 1-3 in a row. To be fair that's when I start fiddling as I had that lightbulb moment then the lightbulb just faded as I went from unbeaten in 5 or 6 to can't win in 5 or 6.

Maybe it's a case of just accepting the games away at Spurs, Liverpool etc are unwinnable when they play certain players.

I mean is anything glaringly wrong with this set up bar the fact that obviously it is weak out wide, I play it most of the time but it is so inconsistent?

-------------------DLF S---------CF A-------------------

---------------------------AM A--------------------------

----------------BWM S---DLP S---BWM S--------------

CWB A/S------CD D---------------CD D--------CWB A/S

---------------------------SK A--------------------------

Attacking/Control - Fluid

TI's - Play out of defence (have experimented taking this off), stop GK dist, Stay on feet (sometimes)

PI's - Front three - Close Down Much More, Tackle harder (Rashidi's high block suggestion), Move Into Channels,

----------------------- BWM's and CWB's, play less risky passes

----------------------- GK distribute to full backs. Did experiment taking this off as thought maybe my full backs hadn't got good enough passing but to no avail.

As always do appreciate your help.

PS, That lightbulb moment was in patch two then with patch three the lightbulb blew!!!

You're extremely aggressive in this set up and even if you change mentality the roles are still aggressive and in midfield you have no real protection for the back four. You use two BWM's who charge around like headless chickens and your DLP also wanders about. So it's no wonder away from home against good sides who have technically gifted midfielders that you get ripped open. Have you watched to see how the three central midfielders are positioned when you lose the ball and see what happens when one or both BWM's go to close down the ball. Have a look and tell me if the DLP is positioned correctly to be able to deal with that and secondly, realistically can he cover the space they leave without leaving you open? Unless he is super man or you have top players I don't see how he can cover for them both while still sticking to his own responsibilities.

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Sorry Cleon my mistake it's meant to be a DLP D in there I have edited the correction. However even with a DLP D that's still a good point you make. The BWM S DLP D BWM S idea was based on Rashidis tactic and with players like Song, Kranevitter and Romero I thought I had the players to get away with it. I find that first half the BWM's do fine covering the wings and closing down but second half obviously tiredness kicks in.

The DLP D I used because it seems the most defensive of any CM. Sometimes he drops in nicely like a half back but sometimes he is too far forward. Even the CM D seems higher up than the DLP D and if you add "close down less" to a CM D he does nothing. I have tried using BBM's and plain old CM S in this three and none seem solid. I just can't get them to screen the back four. Even using a DM rather than the CM then the CM two are far too narrow and leave the flanks wide open.

The other issue defensively seems to be my AM A loses possession far to quickly even with good passing options. He just seems to run into the opponents and loses it. That in turn means the opposition counters quickly. I tried changing the role to TQ or AP or even a SS and same old issues.

The other problems I have is that all goals tend to come from my CF A. Thirty odd a season which is great but the DLF hardly scores.

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Sorry Cleon my mistake it's meant to be a DLP D in there I have edited the correction. However even with a DLP D that's still a good point you make. The BWM S DLP D BWM S idea was based on Rashidis tactic and with players like Song, Kranevitter and Romero I thought I had the players to get away with it. I find that first half the BWM's do fine covering the wings and closing down but second half obviously tiredness kicks in.

This brings issues with itself. If they cover the wings then one central midfielder can't cover the whole of the central space on his own. Most teams will always have a 2v1 advantage if the other two central players have gone wide. I know you say the BWM's are doing what you want and that's good but is this added un needed pressure centrally and over working the DLP? I find it hard to believe that at some stages it wouldn't be a massive issue. One simple ball from the wing inside and they'd have the advantage and the DLP would always have an option to make. Is this why you struggle against sides like Spurs and Liverpool who will have Coutinho and Eriksen playing in the space between midfield and defence. Two very gifted individuals who your DLP is supposed to take care of yet he might have to cover for the BWM's.

The other issue defensively seems to be my AM A loses possession far to quickly even with good passing options. He just seems to run into the opponents and loses it. That in turn means the opposition counters quickly. I tried changing the role to TQ or AP or even a SS and same old issues.

If you encounter the same issues no matter the role used then this suggest their is something fundamentally wrong with your tactic and that's the reason this role doesn't function how you'd like. It could be a simple knock on effect from both BWM's though, when you have possession they may still be recovering position from when you didn't have the ball and aren't in the areas they're supposed to be. It might not be this but I think it could be one of a number of reasons. It's also why I prefer variety in a three man midfield. I like a playmaker, ball winner and a runner as this creates options and space.

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Sussex, just to relay on my midfield findings with my 4321 tactic, where my 3 centre mids are BBM - DLP(D) - BWM(S) or (D), along with a CWB(A) down that right flank where the BWM is.

The DLP(D) was indeed getting overworked regularly when using the BWM(S) next to him. You can see this not only during a match but also in analysis reports at the end of a match - my DLP(D) would make far more tackles and interceptions than the BWM(S). Have a look, see if you notice something similar.

Two things helped even the spread - 1) Using the PI "Hold Position" for the BWM(S) I found helped with his defensive duties. I only use the BWM(S) when I'm not overly concerned by the opposition. 2) Against sides with a decent winger and fullback combo, I change the BWM(S) to BWM(D). This strengthens the defensive screen at the expense of some attacking threat, but I found it's a trade off worth taking. I was also using Kranevitter.

On a side note, I usually start off with a Standard mentality and change up to control or down to counter as things develop, I never use attacking. However, all of this was down to the style of play I set myself right from the get go, so only small adjustments (if any) from match to match.

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I really enjoy reading your posts herne79 :)

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Cleon, Herne,

Do you mind if I start a thread on my tactic, even though it's for 2015, as I can then put some screenshots in and I don't want to take over the Tactical questions thread? I would appreciate your advice...

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Cleon, Herne,

Do you mind if I start a thread on my tactic, even though it's for 2015, as I can then put some screenshots in and I don't want to take over the Tactical questions thread? I would appreciate your advice...

Of course, go for it :)

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I really enjoy reading your posts herne79 :)

Awww thanks Mom :D

Cleon, Herne,

Do you mind if I start a thread on my tactic, even though it's for 2015, as I can then put some screenshots in and I don't want to take over the Tactical questions thread? I would appreciate your advice...

Go for it :thup:.

On a completely separate note, I am so pumped for the Libero role in FM16 beta. I am looking at my screen right now showing an attack where the Libero is up in the opposition's final third and my DLP(D) in central midfield has dropped back behind him to cover. I think I might explode.

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Awww thanks Mom :D

Go for it :thup:.

On a completely separate note, I am so pumped for the Libero role in FM16 beta. I am looking at my screen right now showing an attack where the Libero is up in the opposition's final third and my DLP(D) in central midfield has dropped back behind him to cover. I think I might explode.

You can get him to act like an AMC :cool:

I've got something exciting planned for the Libero this year that I'll be writing about.

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You can get him to act like an AMC :cool:

I've got something exciting planned for the Libero this year that I'll be writing about.

I just exploded.

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On a completely separate note, I am so pumped for the Libero role in FM16 beta. I am looking at my screen right now showing an attack where the Libero is up in the opposition's final third and my DLP(D) in central midfield has dropped back behind him to cover. I think I might explode.

I wasn't too bothered about starting up a 16 game before seeing this.

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Anyonwe had any luck with anything on FM16? Tried a few different tactics with various teams and nothing seems to work!

Lots of people have had luck on FM16. You haven't so that's the issue, not what other people are doing. Have a read of this: http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/327822-Asking-For-Help-PLEASE-READ-THIS

Detail your vision you tried to implement and the tactic that resulted. Also list the specific issues you have. :thup:

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How do you train someone to a new position in FM16? I have a few players who are training for a role in a position they're not natural in, but that doesn't seem to make much of a difference.

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I see the IWB role a bit better now. But, I'm stunned that I don't have the option for my CMs to "Cross from Deep"

Why stunned? CMs play centrally and you can't cross the ball from a central position.

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How do you train someone to a new position in FM16? I have a few players who are training for a role in a position they're not natural in, but that doesn't seem to make much of a difference.

Play them in the position you want them to learn then select train playing position. Remember though it's not a short term thing and will take time depending on the players adaptability and versatility.

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Is playing a false 9 with a winger who is used as an inside forward okay? I am conscious of the false 9 getting in the wingers way when he cuts inside.

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Is playing a false 9 with a winger who is used as an inside forward okay? I am conscious of the false 9 getting in the wingers way when he cuts inside.

He's either a winger or a inside forward can't be both. And why would he get in his way? Is the F9 not capable of moving and going to be in the exact same spot all the time? :D

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In FM15 I could assign the positional training attributes to a a player - i.e. Wingback support.

This player could also learn a new position, and a PPM .... All at the same time.

I'm struggling to see how to do this (apart from the PPM) in FM16 as the training seems to have merged the training role for a position and learning an actual new position into a single option.

Am I missing something ?

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In FM15 I could assign the positional training attributes to a a player - i.e. Wingback support.

This player could also learn a new position, and a PPM .... All at the same time.

I'm struggling to see how to do this (apart from the PPM) in FM16 as the training seems to have merged the training role for a position and learning an actual new position into a single option.

Am I missing something ?

Nothing it's been merged.

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Given that positional training and role training are now merged, I assume this will have a knock on effect to eating up small amount of a player's PA as he becomes more accomplished in the role?

One other point, unless I am missing something obvious (always possible!) we can no longer change the intensity of individual training?

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Given that positional training and role training are now merged, I assume this will have a knock on effect to eating up small amount of a player's PA as he becomes more accomplished in the role?

One other point, unless I am missing something obvious (always possible!) we can no longer change the intensity of individual training?

You can no longer set an intensity level. Instead, this is reflected under "Individual Training Workload" (can be seen on both Training > Individual and Development > Training). This will update as you add/remove further areas of training, eg. an additional focus or a PPM.

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He's either a winger or a inside forward can't be both. And why would he get in his way? Is the F9 not capable of moving and going to be in the exact same spot all the time? :D

Sorry I should have been more clear, the guy I play on the left flank is an inside forward. Cause the False 9 plays deeper than a conventional striker I was concerned that the he may get in the way of the inside forward. I was told a while ago to pay attention to space when creating a tactic and therefore try to avoid having players getting in the way of each other if you know what I mean? Sorry I didn't make it clearer.

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Sorry I should have been more clear, the guy I play on the left flank is an inside forward. Cause the False 9 plays deeper than a conventional striker I was concerned that the he may get in the way of the inside forward. I was told a while ago to pay attention to space when creating a tactic and therefore try to avoid having players getting in the way of each other if you know what I mean? Sorry I didn't make it clearer.

I thought as much :)

But why would they realistically get in each other way? The space between an inside forward and a deep striker is huge. It's bigger than two strikers playing next to each other and do two strikers get in each others way? The answer is no they wouldn't. You could play an inside forward, deep striker and an attacking midfield and they wouldn't get in each other way. Space they all use might be reduced when you add the oppositions players into the mix too. But they should all still work together and not get in each other way.

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Why stunned? CMs play centrally and you can't cross the ball from a central position.

Tell that to Paul Scholes or Xavi :D

I guess PPMs will need to be learned now..

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Tell that to Paul Scholes or Xavi :D

I guess PPMs will need to be learned now..

I still don't get you. Paul Scholes largely played exclusively in the middle vertical third of the pitch. He was renowned for exceptional long range passing to the flanks, but those are not crosses, they are passes into space in FM terms. Show me some regular footage of Scholes making a lung-busting run out wide and putting a cross in.

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I plan on starting a save with Blackburn when the full game is released & in the meantime I was looking through some players attributes and noticed Jordan Rhodes had a PPM that I had never known was in the game, a "Static Targetman".

Now I think I know what it may mean but some clarification would be greatful & I plan on using him as either an advanced forward or as a poacher. Would that PPM have any negative effect if i was to use him in either of those roles?

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Hey all.

Cleon, i remember reading some of your posts where you said that normally the first tactic that you try in any FM version is the W-M (i guess since FM 05?).

My question is, till now did you made it successefully in all the versions?

Thanks!

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What Roles / Duties have you tried? What Mentality and Team Shape?
I have a similar player and I use him as a Wide Midfielder - Attack. When he got the ball he pass it and runs

sorry for late reply. I would like my wide midfilder becoming like beckham,since he's not fast nor great at dribling,but good at crossing.

I tried winger-support, also wide midfilder attack or support, as right midfield. Most of my problem is when he's winger, he like to hold the ball then pass instead of cross it directly. sometimes he also sit narrow,so my fullback got space for crosses instead of him

I try to put him on fullback position,but he stay in deep position. What I triedis wing back, defend or support, and full back (attack). I always give him PI cross more often,from deep,and dribble less. I cant find PI run from deep often .

mentality of my team mostly control,ocasionally changed to counter,but mostly control. team shape always flexible,never changed.

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Hey all.

Cleon, i remember reading some of your posts where you said that normally the first tactic that you try in any FM version is the W-M (i guess since FM 05?).

My question is, till now did you made it successefully in all the versions?

Thanks!

Yups every single version until they removed FL/FR from game. I've not done it since because anything else isn't a true W-M now.

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