Football Manager 2014 - Full Game Feedback/Tilbakemelding 14.1.3

[RTHerringbone]

I'm not sure about penalties, but free kicks goal ratio is extremely poor. Andrea Pirlo is a specialist of free kicks, however in 2 seasons he scored 1 goal from a straight free kick in my save. In total, I witnessed 2 goals from straight free kicks so far.

This is a known issue, and you can expect to see improvements in due course.

[MeesterCat]

I think, probably like the Mods, that I'm now looking forward to the patch more for the fact this thread will close than for any ME updates.

[RTHerringbone]

I think, probably like the Mods, that I'm now looking forward to the patch more for the fact this thread will close than for any ME updates.

How dare you make such an assumption? (You're dead right!)

[Jimmious7]

Like wise. However my results were arguably better when I had 30+ shots from all over the place and fewer CCC's.

Will stick with the more realistic version though.

I'm sorry guys, but adjusting my tactics to make the results more "realistic" is not what I'm looking for

Btw who would change a tactic that creates like 30+ shots for his team in order to get less, irl?

The point is that 30+ shots from one team in a game should happen very very rarely, not just with specific tactic combinations

[Schotsmannetje]

I have a funny thing going on in my save: after half-time ( usually but not exclusively ) the game is like being played in highlight mode for a few in-game minutes. Goals are scored and i am not even aware until after checking the score bar. Recently i had a match where i was leading 2-0 in half time. After pressing the space bar, bam, i am instantly 50minute and the scoreline is 2-2

Has this kind of behavior been noticed by anyone else? Should i consider it a bug?

Not sure if anyone else has experienced this, but it sounds very wrong!

Please upload a .pkm from the affected game to the ME Bugs forum:

http://community.sigames.com/forumdisplay.php/365-Match-Engine-3D-and-Team-Talks

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/368795

I have reported a similar bug in the FMC Bugs thread. My thread is called Half Time Bug

[Cougar2010]

I'm sorry guys, but adjusting my tactics to make the results more "realistic" is not what I'm looking for

Btw who would change a tactic that creates like 30+ shots for his team in order to get less, irl?

The point is that 30+ shots from one team in a game should happen very very rarely, not just with specific tactic combinations

If many of those shots are from rubbish positions then its not a good tactic overall and a RL manager would concentrate on creating less but better quality chances.

[jc1]

I'm sorry guys, but adjusting my tactics to make the results more "realistic" is not what I'm looking for

Btw who would change a tactic that creates like 30+ shots for his team in order to get less, irl?

The point is that 30+ shots from one team in a game should happen very very rarely, not just with specific tactic combinations

Do you not adjust the tactics at any time to beat the ME, that's the point of the game. At the moment there are a few bugs with the ME and to beat it you have to adjust said tactics, so when the update comes out, tactics will have to be adjusted again.

[Cougar2010]

Do you not adjust the tactics at any time to beat the ME, that's the point of the game. At the moment there are a few bugs with the ME and to beat it you have to adjust said tactics, so when the update comes out, tactics will have to be adjusted again.

No the point of the game is to adjust your tactics to beat the opposition, not the ME!

[Dagenham_Dave]

It does actually happen quite often, what level of Highlights do you watch?

Extended, usually.

[Jimmious7]

If many of those shots are from rubbish positions then its not a good tactic overall and a RL manager would concentrate on creating less but better quality chances.

Yeah, anyway, the point is not that. The point is that this is something that can't happen irl. No team ever has achieved such numbers with "bad" tactics in football.

Bad tactics in real football will cause your team to not even be able to shoot for example, not do that 30 times...

I'll give it a rest, I know it's being worked on and is acknowledged as an issue, just makes me a bit annoyed that some people assume they've got "tactical superiority" over others because they get more realistic outcomes(not better) - which is of course not an indication of something like that

[jc1]

No the point of the game is to adjust your tactics to beat the opposition, not the ME!

obviously but you play to the strengths and weakness of the ME which includes the AI, if there are bugs it effects both teams, so you adjust accordingly.

Out of curiosity, do you all use the same tactics every year or do you adjust them or change them depending on how the ME is playing?

[Sanford&Son]

I have to say I for one cannot wait for the patch release only for 1 simple reason .... so I can stop being addicted to having to read this train wreck of a thread feeling empathy for the volunteer mods.....you guys do so a great job ....

.....and while I myself have only noticed 3 real things (FB's,short corners,odd gk distr) I would like to second Darth's comments ...and agree the game is fully playable and "not broken"...I am still in my original save since day 1 beta ....

[Jimmious7]

obviously but you play to the strengths and weakness of the ME which includes the AI, if there are bugs it effects both teams, so you adjust accordingly.

Out of curiosity, do you all use the same tactics every year or do you adjust them or change them depending on how the ME is playing?

You should know that many people, including me, try to play the game realistically without thinking about "the ME" or glitches to take advantage of etc

I want to see my players, choose the tactic that I feel is best for them and then apply it on the field, adjusting it on how they perform.

So when slowly slowly my changes make the team get more possession and shots I don't see a reason to change something just to make it realistic.

The game itself should limit some stuff in favor of realism!

*By the way, I got pretty good results in the one season I played. Finished 4th when expected to finish mid-table. My issue is only on the realism part of the game, not on the results. Seeing extremely huge numbers of shots just feels too unrealistic for me

[j4y_z]

obviously but you play to the strengths and weakness of the ME which includes the AI, if there are bugs it effects both teams, so you adjust accordingly.

Out of curiosity, do you all use the same tactics every year or do you adjust them or change them depending on how the ME is playing?

Neither. I adjust them to the players/strengths of my team. If I would have 2 good CD and 2 good FB in my team, for sure I'd go for a back 4. To hell with the FB bug!

Btw.: this is exactly what I did. 17 games in the second season with FC Utrecht, 40-20 goals, my FB at an average of 6.9, sitting on 2nd place atm. No need to adapt to the ME imo.

[Cougar2010]

obviously but you play to the strengths and weakness of the ME which includes the AI, if there are bugs it effects both teams, so you adjust accordingly.

Out of curiosity, do you all use the same tactics every year or do you adjust them or change them depending on how the ME is playing?

I adjust my formation & tactics depending on my team & the players available & the formations I come up against in the league/country I'm playing in.

Over the years I've used a lot of different formations but if I give you some examples:

In FM11 I moved to Serie A and initially set up a fairly basic 442 but with most of the clubs in the league playing narrow formations that packed the midfield everyone more or less had to follow suit including myself so 4312 (MC/MC/MC/AMC), 4132 (DM/MC/MC/MC), 4231 (MC/MC/AMC/AMC/AMC) were all popular with the fullbacks giving width. Eventually Inter broke the mould (Thanks to two world class STs) and they won back to back titles playing a deep 442 (ML/DM/DM/MR). Gradually other teams changed formation with more teams using wide wingers and not packing the centre of the pitch as much allowing me to change shape to be more expressive.

In a different save I mainly used a wingbacks system in Ireland while in Belgium I developed a 42211 (DM/DM/ML/MR/AMC). I still use 442 in leagues where 442 is common while I've took a liking to a 41221 (DM/MC/MC/AML/AMR) in several others although it needs a particular type of ST to work.

What I have never done when creating a formation is give any consideration to what weaknesses there are in the current ME.

[Dagenham_Dave]

obviously but you play to the strengths and weakness of the ME

That's your problem, right there. Stop thinking about the ME, start thinking about formations and roles that best suit your players. If you do that, have decent players for those roles, and adapt to what's happening in-game, then it'll make no difference what build the ME is.

Too many people are obsessed with the 'ME' in this game.

[DANNY1000000]

Until the game hits release, it's impossible to tell if it's "ready". Without those 30,000 people playing it every hour, it's a distinction that can't be made.

I don't entirely agree with this as a lot more of the issue should have been ironed out during the BETA testing.

[Cougar2010]

Yeah, anyway, the point is not that. The point is that this is something that can't happen irl. No team ever has achieved such numbers with "bad" tactics in football.

Bad tactics in real football will cause your team to not even be able to shoot for example, not do that 30 times...

Whilst we know that part of the problem with the shots is a bug with FM14 I would still disagree with your point.

Even the worst managers IRL using a bad tactic are still far better than some of the tactics we've seen used in FM over the years. I don't believe its the case that bad tactics always = no shots, I think you could find plenty of examples where bad tactics = too many shots or shooting too early in a move.

[P O\'D]

In fairness, no amount of putting players in roles and formations stop the AI or the player for that matter scoring with every second short corner. While the game is far from broken, that is not a tactical problem that can be fixed with the match engine in its current state. Same can be said for fullbacks. They are plain for everyone to see. They dont make the game unplayable by any means and their as much over reaction and dramatics as there is, people trying to pretend they're not there. Its still a very good game the second best in the series imho, but those are two niggles which keep it from being great.

I dont see why people are getting so wound up about people having a rant though... this is a feedback thread created by SI and the moaners are only giving there feedback albeit in a not very well thought out way.

My feedback is defending needs to be fixed up slightly, corners needs fixing and I still think theres too many goals and shots in general.

Also with regards the I had 40 shots the AI had 2. It seems this is how players with big teams lose alot of games. People come on defending it saying it happens irl. Indeed it does. but heres the point I think people are trying to make in a badly worded way.

If say Chelsea lose to opposition they should be beating easily 5 times in a season (say for example Stoke, Fulham, Sunderland, Palace and Hull). In football manager they would have 5 times the amount of shots, 3 or 4 times more shots on target and 4 or 5 CCC to the opps 1. This will happen every single time they lose to anyone bar the others in the Big 4 etc... So in all games they have at least 20 shots, 7-10 on target and 4-5 CCC, the team beating them would have around 3 shots, 2 on target, 1 CCC and 1 or 2 goals, one usually from a corner.

In real world football if they lost to those 5, that might happen against two of those sides, two of those games would probably be close on 50/50 stats wise and once they'd probably have a nightmare and be well beaten without creating at all.

Take Chelsea's defeat at Newcastle this season. Newcastle had 15 shots, Chelsea 13. In FM Newcastle would possibly win 2-0 with 4 shots, 2 on target, where as Chelsea would have about 17 with 4 or 5 on target.

[WormboY]

It does seem a TAD too tough, but not entirely unrealistic. I couldn't give away Maxwell for free, but I kind of accepted this because smaller clubs were either too low rep for him to accept the transfer, or wouldn't want to pay his relatively high wages. I managed to sell Van Der Wiel for €6m to West Brom which seemed a little bit low, but not completely absurd.

I see. Tks.

Are you trying to sell Andres?????

Of course... 30 years. ok he can play like more 2 years, but with is money i can buy 2/3 good players and make my squad better.

[jc1]

That's your problem, right there. Stop thinking about the ME, start thinking about formations and roles that best suit your players. If you do that, have decent players for those roles, and adapt to what's happening in-game, then it'll make no difference what build the ME is.

Too many people are obsessed with the 'ME' in this game.

You obviously don't get what I'm saying, the way the ME is right now you have to adjust tactics accordingly until the wee bugs are sorted, then when hopefully all is better, you can play the game the way it should be. Each year we have a different ME, little tweaks from previous years, the tactics you used last year won't work this year, so you adjust them to suit your team and the new AI in the game, right now the game is playable but bloody frustrating.

[Cougar2010]

You obviously don't get what I'm saying, the way the ME is right now you have to adjust tactics accordingly until the wee bugs are sorted, then when hopefully all is better, you can play the game the way it should be. Each year we have a different ME, little tweaks from previous years, the tactics you used last year won't work this year, so you adjust them to suit your team and the new AI in the game, right now the game is playable but bloody frustrating.

No, you don't get what we are saying.

What you are doing is looking for weaknesses in the coding and then exploiting them. You then change your tactics when SI patch that weakness to look for the next one.

As Dave has said instead of trying to beat the ME you should be trying to beat the opposition through good use of tactics. A good tactic works on any ME as it is built on solid football strategy and doesn't rely on mistakes that SI have made in the coding.

[saiyaman]

I would like to add one possible game breaking bug:

When you have a target chased by many clubs in the transfer market, you can offer ridiculous money to get his club to accept it and then offer a contract. When he decides to join you, you can just delay for a week or cancel it.

After that there is no sign of the player being chased at all. He just remains where he is. HUGE exploit which has to be fixed.

[someone21]

So what happened to some form of update? Or is that a prohibited question here now?

[MrPompey]

In Football Manager you have to adjust your tactics full stop if you want to get the best of of the game regardless of ME. Its what being a football manager is all about.

Whilst there are some issues, we know they have been mostly fixed and an update will be confirmed in due course.

Whilst levels of frustration vary right now from none to high I wonder how much of this is:

a) genuinely related to the current ME issues. Many people would not know of them until reading this forum

b) related to a limited understand of how to apply tactics

c) those expecting a super tactic to make their team almost invincible

d) those that ignore winning games where the opposition have all the chances yet score none and yet you have one shot and score and you are a tactical genuis......yet when the table is turned the blood pressure rises and the luck you had in the previous game may now be forgotten

In either case football management in real life is difficult. Man City have poor form away, Chelsea and Man Utd stuttering, and Southampton a surprise. I wonder if this was the same situation in FM and the in game FM managers managing those teams would be on here saying how the AI is flawed, the Southampton manager saying he has a super tactic which post xmas no longer works due an FM change.

I'm pretty sure the new ME change will appease many in most situations but its unlikely to be perfect.....I dont know of any simulations that are.

However when the ME is released FM managers will continue to struggle for all sorts of reasons just like real life

We need to remember that manageing in FM is a challenge, it would be boring of it wasn't. One thing is for sur ethat using the same tactic week in week out is not going to get the best out of your team. Its worth investing some time to help understand how tactics work and then perhaps your FM experience may improve

[jc1]

No, you don't get what we are saying.

What you are doing is looking for weaknesses in the coding and then exploiting them. You then change your tactics when SI patch that weakness to look for the next one.

As Dave has said instead of trying to beat the ME you should be trying to beat the opposition through good use of tactics. A good tactic works on any ME as it is built on solid football strategy and doesn't rely on mistakes that SI have made in the coding.

Maybe the term ME is wrong but what I'm trying to say is tactically you have to play what's in front of you and adjust them according to how the other team play etc FB's, Goalkeepers handling and corners is something I can do little about but by adjusting my tactics I've not found the game as bad as a lot of people on here are making it out to be.

[Ackter]

I don't entirely agree with this as a lot more of the issue should have been ironed out during the BETA testing.

You can not agree with it as much as you want, that's a simple fact of games development.

[Kriss]

So what happened to some form of update? Or is that a prohibited question here now?

It's a pointless question, as you'd know if you read around a bit before posting

[Kriss]

I would like to add one possible game breaking bug:

When you have a target chased by many clubs in the transfer market, you can offer ridiculous money to get his club to accept it and then offer a contract. When he decides to join you, you can just delay for a week or cancel it.

After that there is no sign of the player being chased at all. He just remains where he is. HUGE exploit which has to be fixed.

Nothing you don't have to do rates as huge imho, but would be grateful if you could post this and exactly how you achieve it in the bugs forum

[saiyaman]

Nothing you don't have to do rates as huge imho, but would be grateful if you could post this and exactly how you achieve it in the bugs forum

Just posted there.

Look at the potential: When one of your rivals tries to snatch your future player you can bid too high than your transfer budget and then cancel it later when it comes to the completion.

[someone21]

It's a pointless question, as you'd know if you read around a bit before posting

Well, if you intend to continue show user's questions as a headache and unnecessary, surely you have got the wrong priorities and judgement.

[canaryboxhead]

In fairness' date=' no amount of putting players in roles and formations stop the AI or the player for that matter scoring with every second short corner. While the game is far from broken, that is not a tactical problem that can be fixed with the match engine in its current state. Same can be said for fullbacks. They are plain for everyone to see. They dont make the game unplayable by any means and their as much over reaction and dramatics as there is, people trying to pretend they're not there. Its still a very good game the second best in the series imho, but those are two niggles which keep it from being great.

I dont see why people are getting so wound up about people having a rant though... this is a feedback thread created by SI and the moaners are only giving there feedback albeit in a not very well thought out way.

My feedback is defending needs to be fixed up slightly, corners needs fixing and I still think theres too many goals and shots in general.

Also with regards the I had 40 shots the AI had 2. It seems this is how players with big teams lose alot of games. People come on defending it saying it happens irl. Indeed it does. but heres the point I think people are trying to make in a badly worded way.

If say Chelsea lose to opposition they should be beating easily 5 times in a season (say for example Stoke, Fulham, Sunderland, Palace and Hull). In football manager they would have 5 times the amount of shots, 3 or 4 times more shots on target and 4 or 5 CCC to the opps 1. This will happen every single time they lose to anyone bar the others in the Big 4 etc... So in all games they have at least 20 shots, 7-10 on target and 4-5 CCC, the team beating them would have around 3 shots, 2 on target, 1 CCC and 1 or 2 goals, one usually from a corner.

In real world football if they lost to those 5, that might happen against two of those sides, two of those games would probably be close on 50/50 stats wise and once they'd probably have a nightmare and be well beaten without creating at all.

Take Chelsea's defeat at Newcastle this season. Newcastle had 15 shots, Chelsea 13. In FM Newcastle would possibly win 2-0 with 4 shots, 2 on target, where as Chelsea would have about 17 with 4 or 5 on target.[/quote']

This is a good post! Definitely agree and I feel we are on the same wavelength. There are some people who post over the top criticism, but most of us (maybe a more quiet minority playing the game) are in loving the game but would like to see some little niggling things changed. (which SI are doing by the way, and its nice to see Paul and Neil responding about that) Its a bit condescending to then be shot down when people make these posts.

Loving the game, and will love it even more after the update, can't wait!

[darthrodent]

You haven't noticed that the defense drops too deep too early and that closing down is being done at walking pace? That full backs leave their position to close down a winger and the rest of the defense remains around the penalty mark, and no midfielder helps him either? Come on! How can you not notice that every damn player on the pitch is positioned wrong during wide play?

Biggus, I have noticed those things you mention, mate. I think I mentioned in an earlier posting that I was in the middle of testing a few things before I declared it as a bug. The fact that your reality matches mine pretty closely is a good indicator that this is one of those objective—rather than subjective—bugs.

I have another question: When does your team's Defensive Line setting "kick in"? As of right now I'm finding it extremely difficult to discern any sort of difference between a "Much Higher" and "Much Lower" Defensive Line. I seem to remember you having a really good grasp on the match engine so I hope you can help. And while you're at it have you noticed a difference between setting your team to "Use Tighter Marking" and not setting your team to "Use Tighter Marking"? Again I'm not seeing too much of a difference between the two.

Nice one, fella.

[themadsheep2001]

Well, if you intend to continue show user's questions as a headache and unnecessary, surely you have got the wrong priorities and judgement.

he's not showing it as a headache at all. It's a pointless question because just two pages back there is a post from PaulC. Your question has already been answered as best as it can be there.

[Schotsmannetje]

someone21

To summarise: They are very busy with it. Apparently the ME part is finished, but they need to iron a few other issues out before they think they can release it. I don't think it's coming this week yet.

EDIT: But I don't work for SI so don't take my word for it.

[Nadessico]

Well, if you intend to continue show user's questions as a headache and unnecessary, surely you have got the wrong priorities and judgement.

Or you could try the search button at the top of the page

[sirgiorgio]

A lot of people complaining about the high amount of shots and low scores but TBH I've tweaked my tactics and this has disappeared, now getting 13-17 shots at goal, 6-8 on target, CCC's 2-3 which is more realistic, people need to look at tactics and stop complaining about not scoring etc.

In my experience (and after I read PaulC's posts) I can say that most bugs/issues are related to certain tactical setups. "Full Backs getting low ratings" is certainly one of them. As for the high amounts of shots, depending on your (OR THE AI'S) tactics you can have:

- Too many shots in general

- Too many shots on target

- Just the perfect amount of shots and goals

Also, another known issue: CCCs (and possibly half chances?) are not always recognized as such.

[walsh]

someone21

To summarise: They are very busy with it. Apparently the ME part is finished, but they need to iron a few other issues out before they think they can release it. I don't think it's coming this week yet.

EDIT: But I don't work for SI so don't take my word for it.

Well PaulC (I think) said he's hoping/it should be this week, why would you think otherwise?

[Nadessico]

Well PaulC (I think) said he's hoping/it should be this week, why would you think otherwise?

because Paul said it could be next week?

[themadsheep2001]

because Paul said it could be next week?

Actually he said its in the QA phase, and until its passed that he couldnt specific about which day or which week.

[CactusC]

Until the game hits release, it's impossible to tell if it's "ready". Without those 30,000 people playing it every hour, it's a distinction that can't be made.

Fair enough. Look, I am not a game developer so can't say how it could be made better. But I am a veteran gamer and this kind of problem only seems to happen to FM. So much so, that since the debacle of CM4 I have been doing like many others and waited until spring to buy the game to ensure I got the best product possible. This year though, I was really pumped and decided to get in from the start. But it was so frustrating I registered with the forum for the first time in 20 years to try to figure it out.

I have obviously played lots of buggy games in my life, but very rarely do I feel it ruins the experience. For some reason, I feel that with FM. I think this is because it is a simulation with so many real world points of reference, every weird flaw ruins the immersion. Or maybe I am just particularly sensitive to these things.

In the end of the day though, I will remain a FM fan and will continue to buy and play it. I just wish that I could be able to fully enjoy the game on release day rather than after a few patches.

[timbamania]

You can not agree with it as much as you want, that's a simple fact of games development.

What is a simple fact of games development? That you can not find all major bugs during the beta? Where you have a significant number of users testing your software?

You are making no sense at all.

And - even without a beta - it is very well possible to deliver high quality software with few bugs from day 1. That it rarely happens in todays gaming industry is purely a business decision, since, because of the complexity of games today, it is much cheaper to have your customer base find bugs. What makes the gaming industry special is mostly that gamers are much more loyal to a product/company (for obvious reasons).

[Cougar2010]

does this really happen? the AI teams start changing formations because of some trend in the league, can someone confirm it?

I don't know if its coded as a trend but formations do change over time, maybe partly down to the managers, maybe down to teams trying more defensive/attacking formations but in my experience when one team achieves success with a formation others follow.

Maybe I'm reading too much into it but I have seen it happen a number of times in different leagues/versions.

[andu1]

I don't know if its coded as a trend but formations do change over time, maybe partly down to the managers, maybe down to teams trying more defensive/attacking formations but in my experience when one team achieves success with a formation others follow.

Maybe I'm reading too much into it but I have seen it happen a number of times in different leagues/versions.

This is a new feature but there wasn't too much emphasis on it.

Maybe someone from SI could confirm how this works?

[Mr U Rosler]

I'm moving house tomorrow and will be without the internet for a week.

If they dont release the update by tomorrow i'm going to have to go to the nearest Costa with the 'Beige Beast' under one arm and a 27" monitor under the other just to use their wifi to download the update.

An ideal way to announce that a new 'weirdo' has just moved into the area.

[Kriss]

We''l be dishing out infractions for spamming if it doesn't stop.

[richards1982]

its frustratin that on monday paul c says the ME side is ready and should be out this week and they are ironing out another couple of issues and then a day later says its in Q&A and doesnt know what day or even week its out!!!

[Nadessico]

its frustratin that on monday paul c says the ME side is ready and should be out this week and they are ironing out another couple of issues and then a day later says its in Q&A and doesnt know what day or even week its out!!!

new issues come up, for everything they fix, they have a chance of breaking a different bit of code.

it's this reason they don't give release dates.

[Ackter]

Q&A = Questions and Answers.

It's definitely not in Q&A.

[batch]

its frustratin that on monday paul c says the ME side is ready and should be out this week and they are ironing out another couple of issues and then a day later says its in Q&A and doesnt know what day or even week its out!!!

IIRC they tend to do 3 or 4 days testing on the version that they release. So if any issues come up in those days of testing then they go back, fix those, and then start that 3 or 4 days testing from scratch.