Football Manager has gone overboard with features

[jlawlor91]

Although I was originally excited about the features before FM13 was announced, I played FM2009 the other day and realised how fun FM used to be. It was more of a game, you could get through seasons in a matter of hours and I used to be able to enjoy and get into saves easier because I didn't need to do 15 extra things such as backroom meetings, player meetings etc.

As well as this morale wasn't as important, tactics were kept fairly simple and it was more of a game than trying to replicate real life. I obviously can't play FM09 now because the database is out of date and I like to be able to judge players with real life instincts.

I'm not a fan of FMC either, I like to set up saves with more than 3 countries.

Thoughts? Anyone agree/disagree?

[Fruz]

Although I was originally excited about the features before FM13 was announced, I played FM2009 the other day and realised how fun FM used to be. It was more of a game, you could get through seasons in a matter of hours and I used to be able to enjoy and get into saves easier because I didn't need to do 15 extra things such as backroom meetings, player meetings etc.

As well as this morale wasn't as important, tactics were kept fairly simple and it was more of a game than trying to replicate real life. I obviously can't play FM09 now because the database is out of date and I like to be able to judge players with real life instincts.

I'm not a fan of FMC either, I like to set up saves with more than 3 countries.

Thoughts? Anyone agree/disagree?

Nope I disagree with you FM has evolved it's even become better game than it was in '09. It's evolved Miles and his rest of the SI team deserve a lot of credit. the way they've gone about improving the game.

[Thunder88]

I do agree on how it's changed a lot from older FM's,back then i too flew through games and had no problems with managing teams etc,this years i can't win anything and have been sacked afew times for the first time ever..

So it is certainly more difficult and much more time consuming,but for me it has become much more realistic as we now have to watch our players and interact with them as a real manager would do,any slip in morale from a key player and our whole season could collapse again just like in real life..

I am struggling badly to still come to terms with this game but i'm enjoying it as i am now learning how to manage players and tactics,no longer is it a pick your team and click play kind of game and i for one give the producers a lot of credit for this.

[fireychariot]

If you want to fly through seasons without all the fuss I do suggest other games like FIFA or simple simulation games online. The reason I like Football manager because it is much detailed and has more about it. All the extra features is what fans have been asking for year on year. Had they not eveolved with time and added extra features then people would be complaining it's too boring.

I really like how it has become as well as it's more of a challenge

[greco]

you can easely play the full game, ignore a lot of the features and have succes.

I´ve done maybe 5 team meetings or so in 10 seasons. I dismiss the majority when it comes to backroom advice. only subscribe to players on my shortlist and the nation im palying in. I holiday from game to game, up until the day before and if i want, i can then change match training. (not that i bother much with that, i do change it sometimes, but not very often though) Do almost all of the press conterences. Play my game and repeat the same procedure.

[MichaelBrown]

You don't have to attend press conferences, backroom meetings, player meetings et al. Those features are tiny compared to the other ones that have been incredibly beneficial for the game.

[Harima83]

Give me FM2008, the training system of CM4, the competition editor, no heavy bugs (especially the regens one) and I build a sculpture in honour of Sigames.

[Crispypaul]

I hated FM 2009. Absolutely fed up of sliders by that stage.

[soccer.joel]

I disagree. I went back to FM10 a few weeks ago and 13 is alot better and is a bit funner

[Richey2008]

I quite like the way you can sort of opt out of a lot of the features if you're not interested in, say press conferences for example. I can't say I've noticed any game breaking effects from not attending one...

I like that a season takes me a week or so. Call me sad, but i quite like thinking about upcoming fixtures on my drive to work, and thinking about transfers while in a traffic jam etc. Some people say it's too complex but i think fundamentally FM is as complex as you choose to make it.

[Ackter]

I went through 3 in-game months in just over an hour last night.

It all changes depending on how you want to play the game.

You could also give FMC a go in FM13, that's a much simpler, quicker game.

[MichaelBrown]

I went through 3 in-game months in just over an hour last night.

It all changes depending on how you want to play the game.

You could also give FMC a go in FM13, that's a much simpler, quicker game.

''I'm not a fan of FMC either, I like to set up saves with more than 3 countries.''

He stated that in the opening post.

[Herbert Fandel]

As MichaelBrown said, even on the full game you can delegate responsiblity for nearly everything in the 'staff responsibilities' page.

I really don't see how people can be complaining.

If you really are too stubborn to take advantage of the flexibility people have brought in, I have very little doubt there will be an updated FM09 database floating around the internet somewhere.

[MichaelBrown]

As MichaelBrown said, even on the full game you can delegate responsiblity for nearly everything in the 'staff responsibilities' page.

I really don't see how people can be complaining.

If you really are too stubborn to take advantage of the flexibility people have brought in, I have very little doubt there will be an updated FM09 database floating around the internet somewhere.

I think choice is the key here in allowing people to play the game as they wish. Personally I don't go to every backroom meeting, I don't do press conferences, some times I just skip between the games and then play the football because I don't have the time to click enter continually, I'd never progress in a game. Then again, I'm probably not the worst case as I play the full game.

Anyway, my point is that deconstructing the game and making it simpler might benefit those of us with hardly any time, yet it could make the game quite plain and boring for those who like to control everything. Choice and as you say, flexibility allows for people to choose which direction they want to take their game.

I imagine that this type of choice will be reinforced with next years edition when, hopefully, SI fine-tune some aspects of the game such as the Director of Football.

[fireychariot]

I think choice is the key here in allowing people to play the game as they wish. Personally I don't go to every backroom meeting, I don't do press conferences, some times I just skip between the games and then play the football because I don't have the time to click enter continually, I'd never progress in a game. Then again, I'm probably not the worst case as I play the full game.

Anyway, my point is that deconstructing the game and making it simpler might benefit those of us with hardly any time, yet it could make the game quite plain and boring for those who like to control everything. Choice and as you say, flexibility allows for people to choose which direction they want to take their game.

I imagine that this type of choice will be reinforced with next years edition when, hopefully, SI fine-tune some aspects of the game such as the Director of Football.

Game developers can not adhere to every individual's needs. They have to go with majority otherwise they would have to develop lots of different games instead of jhust one. Like a lot of people say in here you can delegate lots of the extra features to all the various staff, all you have to do simply is choose the tactics and play the game. Maybe they should develop a Football Head coach/or as a side to the main game where you're only duty is training, picking the tactics and the match. Everything else is done for you.

[Neil Brock]

Give me FM2008, the training system of CM4, the competition editor, no heavy bugs (especially the regens one) and I build a sculpture in honour of Sigames.

What 'Regen' one?

[Neil Brock]

I think choice is the key here in allowing people to play the game as they wish. Personally I don't go to every backroom meeting, I don't do press conferences, some times I just skip between the games and then play the football because I don't have the time to click enter continually, I'd never progress in a game. Then again, I'm probably not the worst case as I play the full game.Anyway, my point is that deconstructing the game and making it simpler might benefit those of us with hardly any time, yet it could make the game quite plain and boring for those who like to control everything. Choice and as you say, flexibility allows for people to choose which direction they want to take their game.I imagine that this type of choice will be reinforced with next years edition when, hopefully, SI fine-tune some aspects of the game such as the Director of Football.

Nearly all this is catered for in FMC, have you ever tried that? And for those who state you don't have enough choice in FMC with only three leagues - you can't expect the game to run quickly and get through it if your machine is having to process hundreds of fixtures.

[Herbert Fandel]

Maybe they should develop a Football Head coach/or as a side to the main game where you're only duty is training, picking the tactics and the match. Everything else is done for you.

They already have, its the main game + staff responsibility settings.

Neil, I've been taking MichaelBrown's comments to be in defense of the current flexibility offered, even though he may indeed benefit from FMC.

[fireychariot]

They already have, its the main game + staff responsibility settings.

Neil, I've been taking MichaelBrown's comments to be in defense of the current flexibility offered, even though he may indeed benefit from FMC.

Exactly. They can choose how many leagues they want. Delegate all the jobs out(even opposition instructions and team talks) and just choose the team and tactics. lol.

[sdeel]

Although I was originally excited about the features before FM13 was announced, I played FM2009 the other day and realised how fun FM used to be. It was more of a game, you could get through seasons in a matter of hours and I used to be able to enjoy and get into saves easier because I didn't need to do 15 extra things such as backroom meetings, player meetings etc.

As well as this morale wasn't as important, tactics were kept fairly simple and it was more of a game than trying to replicate real life. I obviously can't play FM09 now because the database is out of date and I like to be able to judge players with real life instincts.

I'm not a fan of FMC either, I like to set up saves with more than 3 countries.

Thoughts? Anyone agree/disagree?

I'm the biggest Criticiser on here , hense all most bard from site ! But this one I like and starting to get it more and more however I do get punished for my own forgetfulness ! I even started to jot down so I remember what to change before the next game ! This is my best one , like the training ! Well done si games and you've not had one off them off me in 30 years I've played

[Stefaan78]

I'm playing FM2012 again, loads of fun, didn't played the 2013-version anymore for months now...

I agree with the topic-opener, the game's too detailed now, lost all the fun playing it. Won't be buying newer versions anymore as I understand there's no way back and apparently the majority of customers (gamers) prefer the more detailed approach. No hard feelings but I have the freedom to say that for me it's over.

Anyway, thanks for more than a decade of fun, I keep on going with the 2012-version, and older-ones from time to time.

[KevMaaan]

So what some of you are saying is that you dont like taking part in the optional features, AND you dont want to delegate these tasks out to your backroom staff, so just remove them completely? Afraid not, you have been given the OPTION on what you want to do, dont complain because you are too ignorant to switch the responsibilities onto your ass man. I love the new features, especially the new way we do scout reports as opposed to fm 8 where you just got told their pitch size and one dangerman.

[Herbert Fandel]

I'm playing FM2012 again, loads of fun, didn't played the 2013-version anymore for months now...

I agree with the topic-opener, the game's too detailed now, lost all the fun playing it. Won't be buying newer versions anymore as I understand there's no way back and apparently the majority of customers (gamers) prefer the more detailed approach. No hard feelings but I have the freedom to say that for me it's over.

Anyway, thanks for more than a decade of fun, I keep on going with the 2012-version, and older-ones from time to time.

Whilst you have the absolute freedom to what whatever you want with your free time, it puzzles me how you can type such a comment despite all the staff responsiblity options and FMC that have been introduced, and you don't even know how much flexibility there will be going forward. Perhaps these aren't made clear enough to users in-game?

FM13 is possibly optionally less detailed than FM 12 due to all the delegating potential, but of course on FM12 it was easier to win...

[themadsheep2001]

Exactly. They can choose how many leagues they want. Delegate all the jobs out(even opposition instructions and team talks) and just choose the team and tactics. lol.

Agreed this is the bit I don't get. You don't have to deal with half the things if you don't wan't to. You can delegate your assistant manager and staff to do just about everything. No team talks/press conferences? assistant manager. No contracts? assistant manager/DOF. No training? assistant manager/coaches. You actually have more options to delegate than ever before...

I think a better point to be made if there can be improvements to the staff actions/decisons when delegating

[Harima83]

What 'Regen' one?

The one I (and I'm not the only one) talked about for months and unfortunately has not been fixed.

link

link 2

Old FMs had squads full of regens.

Teams that can have only U18 players.

FM2010: an high school team with over 20 members.

FM2013: same high school team, only 7 players.

Normal clubs, custom leagues.

FM2010: under 18 full of players.

FM2013: under 18 empty.

In my opinion a bug like this has an heavy effect on whole game experience. It must be absolutely fixed for FM2014.

[wwfan]

Agreed this is the bit I don't get. You don't have to deal with half the things if you don't wan't to. You can delegate your assistant manager and staff to do just about everything. No team talks/press conferences? assistant manager. No contracts? assistant manager/DOF. No training? assistant manager/coaches. You actually have more options to delegate than ever before...

I think a better point to be made if there can be improvements to the staff actions/decisons when delegating

I understand why. It's because many people have long thought games were decided by good and bad team talks. It's a myth perpetuated by those who build / download statistically dominant tactics. As these tactics always do well statistically, when they fail the user doesn't understand why, so blames the team talk. The reason for the loss is, of course, more down to the tactic being one dimensional and failing to be penetrating in the final third against teams sitting deep. However, such people pay cursory attention to the fine detail. For them, the only thing they have done differently is the team talk, so they blame that.

Although the "central" importance of team talks is a myth generated by a certain playing style and poor attention to detail, people believe it, so won't skip them whilst complaining they are annoying and shouldn't be in the game.

[kevster9966]

is there anyway to use the editor with fmc,rather that the full version? be nice to set a superleague on fmc rather than full version?

[Herbert Fandel]

is there anyway to use the editor with fmc,rather that the full version? be nice to set a superleague on fmc rather than full version?

not on FM 13, as I understand it.

[Lawlore]

is there anyway to use the editor with fmc,rather that the full version? be nice to set a superleague on fmc rather than full version?

Not officially, as it would defeat the purpose of some of the microtransactions.

I think really some are missing the obvious solution here, and one which I think is a likely development for FM14- the removal of the country limit for FMC. That side of the game was new for 13, though I understand it's also there in FMH where FMC effectively came from. FMC will develop, and it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if, as part of that, the country limit went to the wayside. It doesn't serve a huge purpose in FMC, unlike in FMH.

[Herbert Fandel]

I think is a likely development for FM14- the removal of the country limit for FMC.

I played FMC for about 1 minute before deciding it wasn't for me, but I agree with you that this may fix a number of people's problems.

Neil Brock's comment posted today about how having more countries would impinge on the speed seems to me to confirm that FM 14 will not have many, if any, more countries than FM 13 for FMC, but also seems to me to miss the point that peoples time spent doing things (or fearing that they aren't doing the right thing, and time spent waiting on game to load are not necessarily analagous.

But then going full circle again, on the full game you can delegate it all anyway....

[Jegpeg]

Nearly all this is catered for in FMC, have you ever tried that? And for those who state you don't have enough choice in FMC with only three leagues - you can't expect the game to run quickly and get through it if your machine is having to process hundreds of fixtures.

To a certain extent I am with the OP with rthis one. I have a reasonably high spec machine, though far from top end and prefer the simplicity of FMC. Processing fixtures is extremely fast (England, Scotland and Spain selected), even the end of season is sorted in about 5 seconds. It would be nice to have the option of more leagues / a larger database in FMC.

[MichaelBrown]

Game developers can not adhere to every individual's needs. They have to go with majority otherwise they would have to develop lots of different games instead of jhust one. Like a lot of people say in here you can delegate lots of the extra features to all the various staff, all you have to do simply is choose the tactics and play the game. Maybe they should develop a Football Head coach/or as a side to the main game where you're only duty is training, picking the tactics and the match. Everything else is done for you.

Nearly all this is catered for in FMC, have you ever tried that? And for those who state you don't have enough choice in FMC with only three leagues - you can't expect the game to run quickly and get through it if your machine is having to process hundreds of fixtures.

Fireychariot - I think you should take a step back and read my post again. I never said that game developers do or should ''adhere to every individual's needs.'' I specifically stated that ''choice is the key in allowing people to play the game as they wish.'' This means that even though I don't want to attend backroom meetings or press conferences (as they don't enhance the gaming experience) people should have the choice in doing so if they wish. You'll also note that in my second paragraph, I said simplifying the game could have the adverse effect in turning away those who wish to focus on every aspect of FM.

So I'll repeat: the flexibility and choice in deciding what you want/wish to do on FM is the key here, which is why I oppose the idea that FM has gone overboard with features as people have the ability to dictate the direction of their game.

Neil - I have the time to play the full game, but I simply don't want to go to press conferences/backroom meetings etc. I like the game as I play it, full game, but I do pre season, create tactics, squad build and try to get the academy to spurn youngsters.

Sorry if my post seemed like I was concerned with the features. On the contrary, I disagree with the idea that FM should be simpler. Maybe my writing isn't that clear now University is over

[JR866Gunner]

The only thing missing in fmc for me is reserves as wel as u18's to be able to go through. I prefer fullgame anyway as you can delegate what you don't want to do.

[fireychariot]

Sorry Michael think I missed read you.

I think bottom line is people who don't want the nitty gritty now can delegate it.

[Gramm0]

Fireychariot - I think you should take a step back and read my post again. I never said that game developers do or should ''adhere to every individual's needs.'' I specifically stated that ''choice is the key in allowing people to play the game as they wish.'' This means that even though I don't want to attend backroom meetings or press conferences (as they don't enhance the gaming experience) people should have the choice in doing so if they wish. You'll also note that in my second paragraph, I said simplifying the game could have the adverse effect in turning away those who wish to focus on every aspect of FM.

So I'll repeat: the flexibility and choice in deciding what you want/wish to do on FM is the key here, which is why I oppose the idea that FM has gone overboard with features as people have the ability to dictate the direction of their game.

Neil - I have the time to play the full game, but I simply don't want to go to press conferences/backroom meetings etc. I like the game as I play it, full game, but I do pre season, create tactics, squad build and try to get the academy to spurn youngsters.

As others have pointed out, you already have the option to delegate these. You also have the option to turn off a lot of the news items, which is why I have turned almost every news item off, except those concerning my own players. I think I go through a season in about 10 hours. Still more than in the old days, but I believe that is because games take up more time now.

[MichaelBrown]

As others have pointed out, you already have the option to delegate these. You also have the option to turn off a lot of the news items, which is why I have turned almost every news item off, except those concerning my own players. I think I go through a season in about 10 hours. Still more than in the old days, but I believe that is because games take up more time now.

For the final time, I wish that people would bother to read the posts that I have actually wrote. I'll make it clearer, I AM NOT COMPLAINING. Also, using bold on cherry-picked words to suit an argument really isn't the right way to go about it. Why didn't you continue to highlight where I said ''I oppose the idea that FM has gone overboard'' or the part where I said ''I like the game?''

[Smurf]

Nearly all this is catered for in FMC, have you ever tried that? And for those who state you don't have enough choice in FMC with only three leagues - you can't expect the game to run quickly and get through it if your machine is having to process hundreds of fixtures.

I am playing FMC at the moment and with 3 countries the UI is still slow, processing takes ages, just as long as the full game. I sent you on my system specs as requested to do about a week or two ago.

FM12 runs like a dream with about 10+ nations loaded, catering for 3 leagues in Argentina, Brazil, Portugal, Spain, France, Ireland, England, Germany, Italy, Holland, Greece, Turkey and more.

How FM12 works so great and FM13 is so slow on my machine is a mystery.

[Charco]

There is obviously loads of flexibility.

But morale is very important and team-talks and press conferences influence this and some may not want to give that control over to the AI AssMan. So should there be an option where if you delegate these responsibilities, morale isn't influenced by them? (and I mean in the full game for those who wish to run more than 3 countries)

[Overmars]

The game used to feel more streamlined and efficient. This year's version feels a bit bloated to me. I used to feel like I could stay on top of everything happening in this game, and now I feel more or less overwhelmed by it all.

[MichaelBrown]

They already have, its the main game + staff responsibility settings.

Neil, I've been taking MichaelBrown's comments to be in defense of the current flexibility offered, even though he may indeed benefit from FMC.

I don't think I would benefit from FMC as I currently run 28 leagues and my machine could handle a lot more. I don't like the idea of a streamlined game; I would rather play the full game and leave out the bits that won't enhance my experience, ie, press conferences.

At least you see that I was actually defending the system though, I was beginning to think that what I was writing was in fact suggesting the total opposite.

[Herbert Fandel]

I don't think I would benefit from FMC as I currently run 28 leagues and my machine could handle a lot more. I don't like the idea of a streamlined game; I would rather play the full game and leave out the bits that won't enhance my experience, ie, press conferences.

At least you see that I was actually defending the system though, I was beginning to think that what I was writing was in fact suggesting the total opposite.

Given how on top of everything else you seem to be, and that I too wondered why everyone thought you were ranting, I'll trust you to decide whether or not FMC is better for you! Doesn't sound like it, and personally I've played it for about 1 minute.

[Ackter]

I don't think I would benefit from FMC as I currently run 28 leagues and my machine could handle a lot more. I don't like the idea of a streamlined game; I would rather play the full game and leave out the bits that won't enhance my experience, ie, press conferences.

At least you see that I was actually defending the system though, I was beginning to think that what I was writing was in fact suggesting the total opposite.

I haven't done a press conference since they were first introduced.

[Herbert Fandel]

I haven't done a press conference since they were first introduced.

why does nobody understand him? He is saying that his what he does, not moaning that he can't do it!

[mbchuz]

I'm in about 2070 and could count the number of team meetings and press conferences I've attended on one hand. The few times I have tried them, I've laughed at how ridiculous they are. It's like an Asperger's Anonymous meeting, exclusively for those with severe social retardation and total incapacity for human interaction.

But the point is not whether or not I like them, it's whether or not I can choose to have them as part of my game. I can choose, and I choose to completely ignore their existence, and that's the best thing about most of these additions to FM- they're optional. I can enjoy an update every year with tweaking of the main core of the game, very rarely being forced to accept/incorporate some new feature into my management. There are literally so many aspects of my club's management that I ignore that many elitists here would permaban me given half a chance, so frankly your argument is moot. Team talks, shouts, training, friendlies, and many other things could all have disappeared from the game for all I know or care; and I even download tactics!

As long as they remain optional, it is impossible to ever go overboard with features. Give us all the features imagineable and we can be in charge of customising our FM experience the way we want it to be. I wish more games and developers were willing and able to offer the same flexibility.

[Svenc]

I think a better point to be made if there can be improvements to the staff actions/decisons when delegating

No assistant ever storms out of a press conference as AI managers occasionally do (depending on their personality and the result prior).

Likewise, I bet good money that people would be surprised how assistants on any league level perform when you're granting them freedom to do everything. The assistants are good enough to meet board expectations at the bare minimum in a lot of cases, they can turn Swansea into EURO Cup contenders with no additional staff or squad signings. Additionally, you will be given all the pats on the back for that, even if you holidayed all through the season from day #1.

The good performance of assistants is likely a combination of two factors: First, many "players" are not utilizing either the TC nor sliders as sound as the AI does, how limited its actions may still be. And secondly, the decision making of better managers (vs. "just" the assistants) is not being reflected by the way the AI routines are set up. After all, every AI manager is drawing from the same pool of TC options (strategies/team modifiers/shouts/philosophies/roles and duties) in perfectly logical, albeit to an extent very samey ways. The same goes for man mangement in the form of press conferences and personal/team talks; assistants are prone to making mistakes, but then so are AI managers of other teams.

There's room for improvement in the future. But at the same time, there's barely reason to be wary of your assistant managers in both past and present alike.

On the topic of "flexibility": I think that there needs to be some kind of target audience, without trying to please everyone. At the bare minimum, a game like FM should always make people pay who let their side push high up the pitch with defenders slow as molasses, and equally should severely punish anyone dropping off early and closing down all over the place, creating gaps everywhere. Not listened to your reliable scout's advice? After all, he pointed out that your transfer target's bones are as prone to break as they come, that the player is likely to get the odd additional sending off due to it's hot-bloodedness and tendency to argue with officials, and that in a lot of matches he likely won't really show up when it counts? Your fault. In short, it is a footie simulation, and it should reflct that. That often one dimensional and often times unrealistic plug'n'play download tactics which allowed you to breeze through a season without bothering much (or delegating tactics to your assistant full stop, a perfectly viable option, btw.) were more successfull in FM seasons past wasn't intent. But flaws in the match engine and limitations of the AI at their respective time of developement.

Up until FM 2012 for example, space was always there no matter what, as isolated strikers and wingers when off the ball repeateatedly rushed straight THROUGH their markers to receive a pass – "physically", the markers weren't there. To an extent, you can still have success in unbalanced setups, e.g those always channeling play through the middle with no width or movement creating space by dropping off or moving between the lines. That is, if the players are excellent and create space all by themselves, for example by frequently using excellent dribbling skills to go past their markers repeatedly, which is as it should be. Equally, you can do fine with but a single tactics never modified any if it is a balanced one. But there needs to be some cuts made, or else the resulting game won't be perfect bliss for everyone, but a major mess for anyone.

[themadsheep2001]

No assistant ever storms out of a press conference as AI managers occasionally do (depending on their personality and the result prior).

Likewise, I bet good money that people would be surprised how assistants on any league level perform when you're granting them freedom to do everything. The assistants are good enough to meet board expectations at the bare minimum in a lot of cases, they can turn Swansea into EURO Cup contenders with no additional staff or squad signings. Additionally, you will be given all the pats on the back for that, even if you holidayed all through the season from day #1.

The good performance of assistants is likely a combination of two factors: First, many "players" are not utilizing either the TC nor sliders as sound as the AI does, how limited its actions may still be. And secondly, the decision making of better managers (vs. "just" the assistants) is not being reflected by the way the AI routines are set up. After all, every AI manager is drawing from the same pool of TC options (strategies/team modifiers/shouts/philosophies/roles and duties) in perfectly logical, albeit to an extent very samey ways. The same goes for man mangement in the form of press conferences and personal/team talks; assistants are prone to making mistakes, but then so are AI managers of other teams.

There's room for improvement in the future. But at the same time, there's barely reason to be wary of your assistant managers in both past and present alike.

On the topic of "flexibility": I think that there needs to be some kind of target audience, without trying to please everyone. At the bare minimum, a game like FM should always make people pay who let their side push high up the pitch with defenders slow as molasses, and equally should severely punish anyone dropping off early and closing down all over the place, creating gaps everywhere. Not listened to your reliable scout's advice? After all, he pointed out that your transfer target's bones are as prone to break as they come, that the player is likely to get the odd additional sending off due to it's hot-bloodedness and tendency to argue with officials, and that in a lot of matches he likely won't really show up when it counts? Your fault. In short, it is a footie simulation, and it should reflct that. That often one dimensional and often times unrealistic plug'n'play download tactics which allowed you to breeze through a season without bothering much (or delegating tactics to your assistant full stop, a perfectly viable option, btw.) were more successfull in FM seasons past wasn't intent. But flaws in the match engine and limitations of the AI at their respective time of developement.

Up until FM 2012 for example, space was always there no matter what, as isolated strikers and wingers when off the ball repeateatedly rushed straight THROUGH their markers to receive a pass – "physically", the markers weren't there. To an extent, you can still have success in unbalanced setups, e.g those always channeling play through the middle with no width or movement creating space by dropping off or moving between the lines. That is, if the players are excellent and create space all by themselves, for example by frequently using excellent dribbling skills to go past their markers repeatedly, which is as it should be. Equally, you can do fine with but a single tactics never modified any if it is a balanced one. But there needs to be some cuts made, or else the resulting game won't be perfect bliss for everyone, but a major mess for anyone.

Well said

I do wonder if many FM player do enough "thinking". People seem to quick to adjust things, but do they stop to justify why?

I'd agree, FM should fall on the more difficult side of the balance, it should reward good thinking and coherent strategy, and punish haphazard approaches, much like football tends to do.

[Lucas]

They already have, its the main game + staff responsibility settings.

I'm sorry Herbert but this is a massive misconception. There are a lot of changes in FMC, not just "staff responsibility" wise. Competition Rules, Training, Tactics, Player Interaction/happiness, even Opposition Instructions/Team Talks removed in the Match Engine when playing FMC (there are more than this too). These are things that you can't automate in FM, and you'll only find them in FMC.

To those wanting more leagues and options for FMC - as Neil said you can't expect the game to be quick if there are lots of matches to process.

Those who feel that FM is taking too much time - try FMC, trying it "for 1 minute" is a little unfair to pass judgement.

[Harima83]

I'm sorry Herbert but this is a massive misconception. There are a lot of changes in FMC, not just "staff responsibility" wise. Competition Rules, Training, Tactics, Player Interaction/happiness, even Opposition Instructions/Team Talks removed in the Match Engine when playing FMC (there are more than this too). These are things that you can't automate in FM, and you'll only find them in FMC.

To those wanting more leagues and options for FMC - as Neil said you can't expect the game to be quick if there are lots of matches to process.

Those who feel that FM is taking too much time - try FMC, trying it "for 1 minute" is a little unfair to pass judgement.

Anyway it would be a choice of the player, wouldn't be?

I mean: I want a very quickly experience playing FMC, so 3 leagues are ok. But I can also like FMC and wishing at the same time more leagues. If a user wants a fast gaming experience, he chooses few leages, if we wants play FMC because he likes it but wants more leagues, it would be nice if he can have this option.

I like FMC but being not supported by the editor and not having the option to activate more leagues, I abandoned that game mode.

[Herbert Fandel]

I'm sorry Herbert but this is a massive misconception. There are a lot of changes in FMC, not just "staff responsibility" wise. Competition Rules, Training, Tactics, Player Interaction/happiness, even Opposition Instructions/Team Talks removed in the Match Engine when playing FMC (there are more than this too). These are things that you can't automate in FM, and you'll only find them in FMC.

To those wanting more leagues and options for FMC - as Neil said you can't expect the game to be quick if there are lots of matches to process.

Those who feel that FM is taking too much time - try FMC, trying it "for 1 minute" is a little unfair to pass judgement.

I fully agree with you that FMC is a step down in terms of responsibility from main game + staff responsiblity settings, and I don't see where I suggested otherwise.

I therefore think you have made a massive misconception in thinking I was writing off FMC (in this thread), possibly prejudiced by my criticism of your little baby elsewhere.

My suggestion of the main game + staff responsiblity settings was in response to firey chariot talking about an aside to THE MAIN GAME, which FMC categorically isn't, precisely as it removes all those things you list. What if people want to play like a 'real manager' with all the complexity of the main game and not dumbed down rules, but don't want to do team talks etc. This is what I was getting at and you missed it completely.

In your toeing to the party line about how some users so disrespectfully dare demand more than 3 leagues, you, like Neil, have completely failed to address that when people talk about the speed of the game, they don't solely mean processing time, but also time spent doing things, or more accurately, suffering or fearing suffering from not doing things. Therefore, a number of people might be entirely happy to play FMC at a slower pace in terms of processing, as at least they can relax knowing they aren't suffering from not doing any of the forum myths of micromanagement and tinkering. But yet it seems SI are still restricted in their considerations of processing time.

I get that you love FMC, and that I have been quite critical of it elsewhere (in terms of a choice on the user end, not an option made available by developers), but I fear you have let this and your desire to defend FMC to the hilt lead you to interject at a place where your comments don't quite fit what you are reacting to, and I therefore reject your insinuations. Feel free to defend FMC, just don't have an unfair dig at me, entirely based on your own massive misconceptions, whislt you do it.

[Herbert Fandel]

sorry I got a bit ratty, cooled down a bit now, so you can delete most of that, valid as some of is is. I seem to have lost the ability to edit/delete my own posts.

Perhaps I'm suffering from what they call empathy PMS