Brexit in FM21

[DC2525]

Its worth noting SI are aware of the issue with the editor and are currently working on it. Who knows how long it will take to fix.

 

 

[pedromexico]

Just a quick one....Does anyone know if its possible to use the no Brexit editor data from this thread and add other changes, like add coaching staff to teams? 

[Pantelas]

Could this topic be renamed slightly, like "brexit impact on the game" or feedback on brexit impact, so that it helps users post accordingly?

[Baodan]

19 minutes ago, Pantelas said:

Could this topic be renamed slightly, like "brexit impact on the game" or feedback on brexit impact, so that it helps users post accordingly?

At this point it should just be closed or moved to Editors Hideaway.

Edited November 25, 2020 by Baodan

[FrazT]

I will leave it open for a while to se if it remains relevant- if the discussion is about editing then it would be best in the Editor's Hideaway forum

[Pantelas]

2 minutes ago, Baodan said:

At this point it should just be closed or moved to Editors Hideaway.

Look at the OP. This topic is not about editing Brexit

[HowzatFM]

Anyone got any feedback on Brexit since full release? - Any changes of note since the Beta?

[Junkhead]

57 minutes ago, benhoward12 said:

Anyone got any feedback on Brexit since full release? - Any changes of note since the Beta?

Interested in this also. 

To the people who were finding issues with how it worked, what's the score in the full release version?

[Domathon]

2 hours ago, Pantelas said:

Thanks for your reply. I really don't mind about any brexit scenario, even if that means I'll only have to buy English players. But from what I had read the whole system was flawed, with teams not readjusting their visions, having appeals accepted after 6 months after no changes in player status, etc. I'd like to know whether those issues seem sorted now

In the beta I was signing loads of young without work permit the a week later allowed and accepted, havnt tested full release yet and they don’t show change list from beta to live 

[HowzatFM]

28 minutes ago, Domathon said:

In the beta I was signing loads of young without work permit the a week later allowed and accepted, havnt tested full release yet and they don’t show change list from beta to live 

I believe this was a bug and permit shouldn’t of been awarded, but happy to be corrected

[LolloViola]

Miles said on twitter that Brexit was going to be slightly modified for the full release but to don't expect any radical change, would be nice to know what's changed even if small.

[mhaffy]

Only just about to start long term career save in FM21 with Premier League team. Didnt try beta and unfamiliar with Brexit impact on 1/1/21. Was wondering if it was worth buying foreign wonderkids pre 1/1/21? better to go for EU wonderkids? Insight would be appreciated.

[Sud2002]

Just wondering, how will this impact lower league teams? e.g. playing in league1 and looking to sign EU players from the French league.

 

Thanks

[Gee_Simpson]

What's the exact issue here? Should it stop me from starting a long term save over the next few days? 

[CM]

2 hours ago, mhaffy said:

Only just about to start long term career save in FM21 with Premier League team. Didnt try beta and unfamiliar with Brexit impact on 1/1/21. Was wondering if it was worth buying foreign wonderkids pre 1/1/21? better to go for EU wonderkids? Insight would be appreciated.

Yes, that would be better thing to do. Getting as many South American wonderkids as possible until 2021 works fine.

Edited November 25, 2020 by CM

[JordanMilly]

3 hours ago, mhaffy said:

Only just about to start long term career save in FM21 with Premier League team. Didnt try beta and unfamiliar with Brexit impact on 1/1/21. Was wondering if it was worth buying foreign wonderkids pre 1/1/21? better to go for EU wonderkids? Insight would be appreciated.

If you grab them in the summer 2020 window, the original rules will apply, but then they'd need to be over 18, otherwise they won't move until they're 18, and then the rules at the time of the move actually taking place will apply.

[Christo]

9 hours ago, Junkhead said:

Interested in this also. 

To the people who were finding issues with how it worked, what's the score in the full release version?

I started a Portsmouth save in the Beta, all foreign signings I made never got a work permit on the first application.

But on the second go 120 days later they were all given a work permit, no matter if they just sat in the squad or if they went out on loan. But since the full release I haven't even been able to get a work permit for any new overseas signings even on the second application. So it seems as if the way it was in the Beta was slightly bugged.

It is really like playing with two hands tied behind your back. for instance, at the start of my fourth season I brought a Romanian Regen for 5.8m. He has played the last 5 international games for his country yet I still cant get him a work permit.

Edited November 25, 2020 by Christo

[JordanMilly]

1 minute ago, Christo said:

for instance I brought a Romanian Regen for 5.8m he has played the last 5 international games for his country yet I still cant get him a work permit.

Were those senior national team games, or u21/u20/u19? Only senior matches count, and the % of required matches do tend to be taken over 2 years.

[mhaffy]

57 minutes ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

If you grab them in the summer 2020 window, the original rules will apply, but then they'd need to be over 18, otherwise they won't move until they're 18, and then the rules at the time of the move actually taking place will apply.

Thanks for that advice,; no point snapping up Matias Arezo for circa £1.7m in 2020 window given his age then...

[Christo]

S

4 minutes ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

Were those senior national team games, or u21/u20/u19? Only senior matches count, and the % of required matches do tend to be taken over 2 years.

Senior games, it said in game when I reapplied for his permit that he has to of played 70% of international games in the last year. I  guess 5 was a couple short, a little frustrating but heyho.

Edited November 25, 2020 by Christo

[CM]

5 minutes ago, mhaffy said:

Thanks for that advice,; no point snapping up Matias Arezo for circa £1.7m in 2020 window given his age then...

I got him but don't know whether he will get a wp. But at the time I made an offer I was told he should get one upon appeal but again that was before Brexit, so difficult to tell. 

[Junkhead]

36 minutes ago, Christo said:

I started a Portsmouth save in the Beta, all foreign signings I made never got a work permit on the first application.

But on the second go 120 days later they were all given a work permit, no matter if they just sat in the squad or if they went out on loan. But since the full release I haven't even been able to get a work permit for any new overseas signings even on the second application. So it seems as if the way it was in the Beta was slightly bugged.

It is really like playing with two hands tied behind your back. for instance, at the start of my fourth season I brought a Romanian Regen for 5.8m. He has played the last 5 international games for his country yet I still cant get him a work permit

Thanks - sounds like a proper challenge that!

[JordanMilly]

44 minutes ago, Christo said:

S

Senior games, it said in game when I reapplied for his permit that he has to of played 70% of international games in the last year. I  guess 5 was a couple short, a little frustrating but heyho.

Ahh, yea, it'd be 1 year if it's his first year playing international football, 2 years after that.

[Ruskin]

Has the issue of Scouts recommending players that can not gain a work permit been fixed?

Will "player is eligible for a work permit" (or something similar) be added to the Scouting Assignments criteria?

For players that are not eligible for a work permit, will some indication of why they are not be added?

 

[Platinum]

16 hours ago, Ruskin said:

Has the issue of Scouts recommending players that can not gain a work permit been fixed?

Will "player is eligible for a work permit" (or something similar) be added to the Scouting Assignments criteria?

For players that are not eligible for a work permit, will some indication of why they are not be added?

 

In the bugs forum they said they are working on that issue so no it's not been solved yet.

[StevehFC]

Is it worth keeping my current save or wait until Brexit is fixed in the game. 

[Fethegest]

21 hours ago, Sud2002 said:

Just wondering, how will this impact lower league teams? e.g. playing in league1 and looking to sign EU players from the French league.

 

Thanks

Badly. In theory, it ought to be very hard for a L1 side to acquire an EU player that would qualify for a permit.

[Domathon]

i got the same hard ass brexit as my beta save basically cant sign any foreign players arghhh, english scout mode activated

[Rakiye]

This is unbelievable. SI's Russian roulette rules are causing people to be fearful of starting a new game in England because they don't want their save ruined by their best guess. Yet, we cant even edit it out due to a fault with the editor...

Talk about an absolute mess! Again, why include a hypothetical guess about politics in a football simulation game that's meant to be a form of escapism??

Nobody is arguing with Brexit happening and I for one voted for it. That is not the issue. The issue is the ridiculously stringent worst case game breaking scenarios that keeps being spewed out that quite frankly are unworkable, unforgiving and most certainly not going to happen. No decision has been made yet over this IRL and I sincerely doubt it will be to the detriment of English football.  

To be perfectly honest, Id rather that they included Covid19 over this in the game because at least that has already happened and we know where we stand before we start a new save...

All I have witnessed from SI is Anti-Brexit scenarios regarding people playing the game. Not once have I seen somebody say that Brexit benefitted their game and it has worked out better. That for me would suggest they are playing politics and they are trying to influence peoples feelings regarding the political situation by making their game more difficult to play with no found evidence to support it.

It was a nice advertisement gimmick two years ago SI, but lets get rid of it until its gospel.

Edited November 26, 2020 by Rakiye

[Guest]

It would be nice if they had allowed an alternative - no brexit.

Even if only by the pre-game editor, which seems broken.

Maybe they could provide an alternative database that has no brexit, instead of leaving customers (ha ha) to try to mend their mess.

Slightly dented my faith in SI this year.

[samdiatmh]

except you can edit it out... there's at least one such scenario on the steam workshop where this has been implemented?

 

and what are you doing about FM22 (where it's implemented regardless) - I suppose it'll still be unrealistic then?

[Guest]

Eh?  Who said anything about realistic/unrealistic?  Although the current rules are speculative - however well founded.

Not being able to easily edit the default database is the issue - for me. 

[Jonthedon26]

47 minutes ago, Rakiye said:

This is unbelievable. SI's Russian roulette rules are causing people to be fearful of starting a new game in England because they don't want their save ruined by their best guess. Yet, we cant even edit it out due to a fault with the editor...

Talk about an absolute mess! Again, why include a hypothetical guess about politics in a football simulation game that's meant to be a form of escapism??

Nobody is arguing with Brexit happening and I for one voted for it. That is not the issue. The issue is the ridiculously stringent worst case game breaking scenarios that keeps being spewed out that quite frankly are unworkable, unforgiving and most certainly not going to happen. No decision has been made yet over this IRL and I sincerely doubt it will be to the detriment of English football.  

To be perfectly honest, Id rather that they included Covid19 over this in the game because at least that has already happened and we know where we stand before we start a new save...

It was a nice advertisement gimmick two years ago SI, but lets get rid of it until its gospel. 

Whilst I am enjoying the challenge of Brexit in my save I agree with your part about the FM21 implementation being the harshest possible scenario. I would be absolutely astounded if the rules in real life were anywhere near as strict as they are in FM.

[Junkhead]

44 minutes ago, Rakiye said:

No decision has been made yet over this IRL and I sincerely doubt it will be to the detriment of English football.  

There will be a points based immigration system in place in the UK following the transition period. A decision has been made IRL. That is happening.

At this point there has been no confirmation of the Premier League/FA being granted any concessions. Therefore, as it stands, the points based system will be applicable to football the same as it is in any other industry.

It is highly likely that the volume of foreign players coming into the country is going to dramatically reduce over the next decade, regardless of any concessions agreed.

The overall standard of the league system in this country is likely to be impacted considerably.

If there are bugs around how it works then that is a different story, but once again in this thread people are massively confusing what they hope and want with the actual stark reality as things stand.

 

[Junkhead]

5 minutes ago, Jonthedon26 said:

Whilst I am enjoying the challenge of Brexit in my save I agree with your part about the FM21 implementation being the harshest possible scenario. I would be absolutely astounded if the rules in real life were anywhere near as strict as they are in FM.

It's quite likely there will be concessions. My personal guess is that it will be a staggered reduction in the foreign players coming in rather than very sudden as it currently is in the game.

However my speculation is just as useful as anyone elses. 

[Platinum]

19 minutes ago, bringbacklilnux said:

Eh?  Who said anything about realistic/unrealistic?  Although the current rules are speculative - however well founded.

Not being able to easily edit the default database is the issue - for me. 

The current fixes add an extra team to the Vanarama South which is a non starter for me. They do this because of the issues with the editor

[Platinum]

11 minutes ago, Junkhead said:

There will be a points based immigration system in place in the UK following the transition period. A decision has been made IRL. That is happening.

At this point there has been no confirmation of the Premier League/FA being granted any concessions. Therefore, as it stands, the points based system will be applicable to football the same as it is in any other industry.

It is highly likely that the volume of foreign players coming into the country is going to dramatically reduce over the next decade, regardless of any concessions agreed.

The overall standard of the league system in this country is likely to be impacted considerably.

If there are bugs around how it works then that is a different story, but once again in this thread people are massively confusing what they hope and want with the actual stark reality as things stand.

 

Completely agree with you that the main issue is the bug around the implementation. 

One thing i disagree with you though is that SI have gone a step further than just points based system, theyve given details into how points are gained, which at this stage is speculation. Thats why i sympathise with people that would like an option on how harsh Brexit is.

[Junkhead]

3 minutes ago, francis#17 said:

Completely agree with you that the main issue is the bug around the implementation. 

One thing i disagree with you though is that SI have gone a step further than just points based system, theyve given details into how points are gained, which at this stage is speculation. Thats why i sympathise with people that would like an option on how harsh Brexit is.

Think that is one of the arguments and is completely valid. However most of the info out there on how this will likely work is consistent. I posted a link before which isn't far different from how it works in the game as far as I understand it.

May well be wrong though 👍

 

 

[Jonthedon26]

1 hour ago, Junkhead said:

It's quite likely there will be concessions. My personal guess is that it will be a staggered reduction in the foreign players coming in rather than very sudden as it currently is in the game.

However my speculation is just as useful as anyone elses. 

I think you could be very right with that prediction actually, great shout!

[Gee_Simpson]

So based on the last few posts in this thread, there's nothing wrong with the potential brexit outcomes? 

[Junkhead]

4 hours ago, Gee_Simpson said:

So based on the last few posts in this thread, there's nothing wrong with the potential brexit outcomes? 

My understanding is that the points based system which is reflected in the game is the way things are currently set to be once we end the transition period.  The points based system will apply across all immigration into the UK as confirmed by the Home Office.

The Premier League/FA have provided a proposal to the Home Office whereby concessions are made to football.  No one knows exactly what that proposal contains as this has not been confirmed yet.  If the proposals are rejected, football will follow the same rules as every other industry in the UK.

Details about how the points based system will apply to football have not been fully confirmed, and the EPL/FA proposal muddies things up even further.  However a google search on this will bring you up a number of results from various sources wherein the information on how this will likely work is pretty consistent.  I assume that SI have the same unconfirmed yet very consistent information, upon which they have based their in-game Brexit outcome.

However, it appears there are a few issues at play which is causing a lot of confusion.  Firstly, I am not convinced that things are working as intended within the game.  I am not really playing the game at the moment due to work commitments, but I get the feeling things aren't working as intended.  Others might be able to confirm.

Secondly, there are a couple of schools of thought that things shouldn't be implemented at all at this point because there has been no official confirmation on how the points based system will be applied to football, and also because the EPL/FA proposals could change all that anyway if accepted.

Thirdly, there are some people who don't want brexit to be reflected at all because they would prefer to continue as they always have and are unhappy because changing it in the editor is difficult.  This is fair enough IMO and the editor needs sorting out clearly.

As well as this there are those who seem to think that football IRL will just carry on regardless and that SI are overdoing it.  This remains to be seen, however I think this is dead wrong.  Football is not the be all and end all in this and other, more profitable, industries will want concessions too if football is given too many.  Football in this country will, IMO, fundamentally change in respect of foreign players after the transition period and this will inevitably weaken the Premier League.  What level of flux actually happens is yet to be seen, but the idea that things will carry on as normal is pure fantasy, IMO.

[Domathon]

this thread wont go away, good

[SeaCarrot]

The be all end all is Brexit in FM is entirely 100% hypothetical made up nonsense that doesn’t exist in real life and shouldn’t have existed for the last 3 years in FM either.

it’s just SI grandstanding a political opinion to punish people who voted for it. 
 

Miles big shill this year is realism so we can’t even see the weather in the match UI anymore but it’s fine for them to make up brexit rules.

[Baodan]

But it did exist for the last 3 years of FM as well and you guys are still surprised which is simply incredible to see. It's also very much a real thing and should indeed be included in FM as closely to whatever outcome will happen in real life. Despite us not knowing for sure and despite the minor nuisance it might be for a small part of the playerbase.

You guys always find a way to get around Brexit anyway so don't worry so much.

[Viking]

So... Still only one Brexit outcome post beta? (It's a long thread and I have a small brain)

[themadsheep2001]

16 hours ago, Junkhead said:

Think that is one of the arguments and is completely valid. However most of the info out there on how this will likely work is consistent. I posted a link before which isn't far different from how it works in the game as far as I understand it.

May well be wrong though 👍

 

 

Should point out as well that the people Miles spoke to were close enough to the situation that he can't name them directly (talking FA and the likes). So they're not simply pulling it out the air as claimed by a few

[JordanMilly]

3 hours ago, SeaCarrot said:

Miles big shill this year is realism so we can’t even see the weather in the match UI anymore but it’s fine for them to make up brexit rules.

I'm seeing weather such as rain in my games. Have you tried tweaking your graphics settings?

Also, given that SI and Miles have been submitting data and engaging with the FA/EPL/Home Office regarding the impacts of Brexit on football via the millions of simulations of different Brexit rules from our saves (as noted in a number of news articles, one such example being this article here), I'd imagine, as @themadsheep2001mentions above, Miles and SI probably have a damn sight better idea of what the rules are likely going to be than any of us, and more than they're allowed to otherwise say.

[Junkhead]

4 hours ago, SeaCarrot said:

The be all end all is Brexit in FM is entirely 100% hypothetical made up nonsense that doesn’t exist in real life

It will exist in five weeks unless something dramatically changes, and fast. 

This has been being discussed for a week and nothing has changed in that time.

As for your other point about "punishment", why on earth would SI do that? 

[kiwityke]

19 hours ago, Rakiye said:

This is unbelievable. SI's Russian roulette rules are causing people to be fearful of starting a new game in England because they don't want their save ruined by their best guess. Yet, we cant even edit it out due to a fault with the editor...

Talk about an absolute mess! Again, why include a hypothetical guess about politics in a football simulation game that's meant to be a form of escapism??

Nobody is arguing with Brexit happening and I for one voted for it. That is not the issue. The issue is the ridiculously stringent worst case game breaking scenarios that keeps being spewed out that quite frankly are unworkable, unforgiving and most certainly not going to happen. No decision has been made yet over this IRL and I sincerely doubt it will be to the detriment of English football.  

To be perfectly honest, Id rather that they included Covid19 over this in the game because at least that has already happened and we know where we stand before we start a new save...

All I have witnessed from SI is Anti-Brexit scenarios regarding people playing the game. Not once have I seen somebody say that Brexit benefitted their game and it has worked out better. That for me would suggest they are playing politics and they are trying to influence peoples feelings regarding the political situation by making their game more difficult to play with no found evidence to support it.

It was a nice advertisement gimmick two years ago SI, but lets get rid of it until its gospel.

You do realize this is literally what you voted for right?

SI haven't guessed they've implemented the rules as agreed between the FA and the Premier league.

[kiwityke]

3 hours ago, Viking said:

So... Still only one Brexit outcome post beta? (It's a long thread and I have a small brain)

Yes.