A Message On Football Manager 2012 Activation

[Guest]

I dont think there are any possible legal implications, they are not forcing you to now switch to steam for any of their products you currently own, they have made it perfectly clear if you want to play their new game you need to activate it through a free third party, if you dont want to use steam you dont buy their product.

I did say that I am not an expert on the relevant law & that I was only trying to convey what had already been posted as the pots I qouted didn't understand the point raised.

[Suzie MUFC]

It uses at most 200k of resources.

It uses 69mb on mine when minimized and no games running.

[edwingray]

My intial reaction was that I won't be buying the game, as I only seem to hear bad press about Steam.

But, I understand that I have to install the Steam client on my computer, but what exactly does this client do? What is running in the background? Does my Internet connection have to be running to be able to play the game, or can I switch my router off.

I'm not being paranoid, but I really do object to having to install further (unwanted) software, in order to play a game that I have legally purchased.

[daylight]

Really can not understand all the hate towards Steam.

I have been using Steam for over 5 years and had only 1 problem in that time,which sorted itself out in 2 days.

The Steam client takes mere seconds to download and after you register the game you never ever have to switch Steam on again...well until the next edition of FM that is

I have quite a few games on Steam and play on it regularly both single player games and multi player games...not sure why so many people are so paranoid over it.

[magicmastermind124]

Although I haven't had an answer yet, they mentioned that the above would apply to all disc versions. Any bought via digital download will most likely not need to be activated by Steam. So if you don't like Steam, buy it online. www.fmscout.com

[stevie_G_32201]

Although I haven't had an answer yet, they mentioned that the above would apply to all disc versions. Any bought via digital download will most likely not need to be activated by Steam. So if you don't like Steam, buy it online. www.fmscout.com

What about the people with limited monthly downloads?

[Dune297]

Although I haven't had an answer yet, they mentioned that the above would apply to all disc versions. Any bought via digital download will most likely not need to be activated by Steam. So if you don't like Steam, buy it online. www.fmscout.com

If it's Steamworks, it's Steamworks. If you purchased it on Green Man Gaming for instance, it would say under it "This game requires Steam™ in order to install and run and so cannot be traded or refunded."

[magicmastermind124]

What about the people with limited monthly downloads?

They can't have everything. They'd only need to download it the once anyway.

[milnerpoint]

Exactly! And I won't

You really are cutting off your nose to spite your face, you clearly enjoy FM, you wont win anything by taking your stance, the only person who will suffer is you, this is happening no matter what anyone on here says, either get with it or your going to miss out on a game many of you have enjoyed for the best part of 10 years. All because you dont really know much about a program you need to unlock the game. Your Xbox and PS3 will take more info from you than steam does, but no one cares that much, i have had steam for as long as its been around, never had my account hacked, never had any issues at all in anyway, i leave it signed in at all times and to unless you have the same password for your steam account and email account the chances of being hacked are slim to none. Its no more unsafe than any application anyone uses online.

[stevie_G_32201]

They can't have everything. They'd only need to download it the once anyway.

Irrelevant and not exactly. There is always the possibility of a corrupt download, There will be too many obstacles to overcome in this years version for some people in my opinion.

[jpwild]

Long-time lurker here, and I have loved CM and FM for many years.

Sega and Sports Interactive have, of course, every right to protect their software and if they want to link with Steam platform then that's fully within their rights.

However, I don't think this is just to prevent the issues of piracy. As others have stated that other software has been 'leaked' on to the internet in spite of it being linked to the Steam platform.

Is it also the case that by forcing it to activate via Steam you are also preventing use of the game before that date. So this could be a method to try and prevent that? Maybe some of your retail partners are not happy that other retailers sell the game early?

Could it also prevent the re-sale issue too? For example with Football Manager 2011 it was possible to link the game with Steam and then put the game on Ebay for sale with the caveat that it may not work with Steam, but was fine to play of the disc.

I have no problem with Steam, but I can fully understand as to why people may not want it on their computer.

I think I may skip this product if the Steam activation is going to be mandatory. It's just not my cup of tea.

Some good games coming out over the coming months. My money will be going to Uncharted 3.

[Wakers]

They can't have everything. They'd only need to download it the once anyway.

They'd just buy the dvd. They're not moving away from selling pyhsical copies.

[Lazaru5]

You really are cutting off your nose to spite your face, you clearly enjoy FM, you wont win anything by taking your stance, the only person who will suffer is you, this is happening no matter what anyone on here says, either get with it or your going to miss out on a game many of you have enjoyed for the best part of 10 years. All because you dont really know much about a program you need to unlock the game. Your Xbox and PS3 will take more info from you than steam does, but no one cares that much, i have had steam for as long as its been around, never had my account hacked, never had any issues at all in anyway, i leave it signed in at all times and to unless you have the same password for your steam account and email account the chances of being hacked are slim to none. Its no more unsafe than any application anyone uses online.

mp, I've played the game for nigh on 20 years, not 10, and I will gladly take the stance as I refuse to be forced by the coprporate giants to bend to their will, they can go KMA for all I care, there is nil chance of me installing Steam just to play the only game that I play. I'll just stick with FM11 until SI/Sega decide to stop forcing people to do things they have no desire to do...

[Wakers]

It would just be nice if someone gave us the real reasons and not the anti-piracy rhetoric. That's the problem with SEGA, they're not honest with their customers at all.

[Smurf]

My intial reaction was that I won't be buying the game, as I only seem to hear bad press about Steam.

But, I understand that I have to install the Steam client on my computer, but what exactly does this client do? What is running in the background? Does my Internet connection have to be running to be able to play the game, or can I switch my router off.

I'm not being paranoid, but I really do object to having to install further (unwanted) software, in order to play a game that I have legally purchased.

The Steam client acts as a buffer for registering the game, this is an attempt to cut-down on the piracy. The client will also, when online mode keep your acheivements up-to-date, with Steam offline your achievements aren't recorded, it will also, when online download any patches or updates for the game.

The internet connection only has to be on to install Steam. Once installed you can unplug your internet and swing it over it your head cowboy style and the game will still run but you have to have Steam running in the background.

If you don't have Steam running you can't play the game. But it just has to be in the system tray.

[David Kempshall]

Achievments do not enhance my gaming experience, I don't care to automatic downloads as I'm quite capable of doing this myself & using torrents has always given me good download speeds because I'm not a leech.

I'm sorry to say that unless I can be convinced that Steam has changed it will not be getting anywhere near my rig, I installed it when it was first used for FM activation & I removed it after 3 days because it was an intrusive, data mining annoyance that I had no trust or confidence in.

Obviously you cannot discuss numbers & I wouldn't expect you to do so but was there an identifiable reduction in retail volumes when you removed the need for Steam activation? I assume you've factored in the economic downturn & any changes in territories the game is sold in.

Basically I do not accept the arguement that is always made of 'we will sell more with this measure in place', I am however open to accept facts when they speak for themselves.

Edit: Time to research Steam & update my knowledge base.

Hi Barside - Appreciate your opinion, but as detialed in the post this decision was by absolutely no means taken lightly. Last year we couldn't find what we felt was an acceptable solution. This year we believe we have. Unfortunately I can't disclose any numbers on sales in this forum.

[stevie_G_32201]

mp, I've played the game for nigh on 20 years, not 10, and I will gladly take the stance as I refuse to be forced by the coprporate giants to bend to their will, they can go KMA for all I care, there is nil chance of me installing Steam just to play the only game that I play. I'll just stick with FM11 until SI/Sega decide to stop forcing people to do things they have no desire to do...

Looks like your not playing anymore new versions of FM then.

[Guest]

Although I haven't had an answer yet, they mentioned that the above would apply to all disc versions. Any bought via digital download will most likely not need to be activated by Steam. So if you don't like Steam, buy it online. www.fmscout.com

They mention Steam compatability so it looks like official digi downlands will have to be activated vai Steam.

[Keyzer Soze]

Altough i can understand the decision from SI/SEGA, i dont see this as a contribute to reduce piracy. IMO wont have any effect on the 25% piracy ratio.

For me, this is perhaps, the first step to end the disc version of FM, and perhaps FM2013 or FM2014 will be exclusive from steam!

[Some Guy!]

The great irony is that protection measures have in many cases lead to increases in piracy. In this case however I think we should accept SEGA and SI's decision and to be perfectly honest they have been fair in recent times, especially after the disaster of their last attempt.

[Lazaru5]

Looks like your not playing anymore new versions of FM then.

I'm afraid you may be right

It's a shame really cos FM12 looks like it's gonna be immense. *sighs*

[StevoWanderer]

i'm like jpwild in that im a long time lurker. I also hate the fact that steam has become mandatory. I tried it once and hated it. It is something that i categorically do not want on my pc. My pre-order has been cancelled and i was really looking forward to it having played the series since cm 97/98. Think i'll stick to FIFA this year.

[milnerpoint]

mp, I've played the game for nigh on 20 years, not 10, and I will gladly take the stance as I refuse to be forced by the coprporate giants to bend to their will, they can go KMA for all I care, there is nil chance of me installing Steam just to play the only game that I play. I'll just stick with FM11 until SI/Sega decide to stop forcing people to do things they have no desire to do...

But why, what is it about steam that would make you never want to play FM again?

[Wakers]

Altough i can understand the decision from SI/SEGA, i dont see this as a contribute to reduce piracy. IMO wont have any effect on the 25% piracy ratio.

For me, this is perhaps, the first step to end the disc version of FM, and perhaps FM2013 or FM2014 will be exclusive from steam!

Which would be an absolute farce, because Steam pricing is all over the place.

[Guest]

Hi Barside - Appreciate your opinion, but as detialed in the post this decision was by absolutely no means taken lightly. Last year we couldn't find what we felt was an acceptable solution. This year we believe we have. Unfortunately I can't disclose any numbers on sales in this forum.

David, I appreciate you posting & as I said I fully understand & didn't expect or want sales figures to be posted but surely you can honestly inform the community if there is hard data to support the supposition that Steam activation reduces piracy & increases retail unit volumes, I remember having this very same discussion with Matt a few years ago on another forum & the arguement never seemed to stack up.

[Wiggins Top Boys]

The people in the industry are so out of touch with the consumer when it comes to DRM...

shocking decision.

The consumer is always punished and blamed when big companies can't reach their targets (because that little less profit just wont do!)

[Neil Brock]

There's many advantages to using the Steam platform, but yes, certainly the copy-protection aspect heavily influenced the decision. Also the easiness of patching for the users is another major advantage of using the Steam platform. Obviously this is the first year we've gone down this avenue and we haven't made this decision lightly - rest assured we'll as always try and be thorough as possible on these forums in attempting to help any user encountering difficulties or simply has a question about Steam/FM prior to release.

Wakers no offence but I don't really know what else you expect Sega to say? Everyone is well aware piracy is a massive problem within PC/Mac gaming and sadly many games companies have gone bust or stopped releasing games (RIP EHM) due to battles with piracy which have unfortunately been lost.

[djvandyke]

You know this is not what your customers want yet press ahead regardless. Backwards thinking from a company still living in the 90's.

[Wakers]

David, I appreciate you posting & as I said I fully understand & didn't expect or want sales figures to be posted but surely you can honestly inform the community if there is hard data to support the supposition that Steam activation reduces piracy & increases retail unit volumes, I remember having this very same discussion with Matt a few years ago on another forum & the arguement never seemed to stack up.

It doesn't stack up. Piracy is not the reason for this, it's more to do with some other corporate issues that they don't want to comment on. Possibly future plans for the franchise, or disputes between retailers who ship out the game early and so on.

[Dune297]

You know this is not what your customers want yet press ahead regardless. Backwards thinking from a company still living in the 90's.

You can't speak for all the customers. I, for one, am very happy about this decision and hope all SI's future games are Steamworks.

[smgers]

Oh well that's the end of an era for me - been playing CM/FM for near enough sixteen years now.

Won't be buying the game whilst being made to install something I don't want.

[Wakers]

There's many advantages to using the Steam platform, but yes, certainly the copy-protection aspect heavily influenced the decision. Also the easiness of patching for the users is another major advantage of using the Steam platform. Obviously this is the first year we've gone down this avenue and we haven't made this decision lightly - rest assured we'll as always try and be thorough as possible on these forums in attempting to help any user encountering difficulties or simply has a question about Steam/FM prior to release.

Wakers no offence but I don't really know what else you expect Sega to say? Everyone is well aware piracy is a massive problem within PC/Mac gaming and sadly many games companies have gone bust or stopped releasing games (RIP EHM) due to battles with piracy which have unfortunately been lost.

I would appreciate it if everyone stopped hiding behind the piracy excuse.

I appreciate that Steam makes it incredibly easy to push out updates, and to keep graphics drivers up to date, but it does nothing against piracy - if anything it will drive a new section of potential or existing customers towards it. Steam has several advantages, but it also has a lot of disadvantages which are far too easily swept under the carpet.

That and forcing someone who's purchased the game to install third party software is not a good way to treat customers. It should be an option, it should not be mandatory.

Again, Steam does nothing against piracy, so I struggle to believe that is the actual reason for this decision.

[Rhazmuz]

Software like STEAM is the future, better get on the digital wagon.

Ive used STEAM for some years now, and I havent received bad/intrusive mails, phonecalls, knocks on my door late at night, nor suspicious PC behaviour.

STEAM is not the work of Satan, so please try it out eh?

[djvandyke]

You can't speak for all the customers. I, for one, am very happy about this decision and hope all SI's future games are Steamworks.

Fair enough, I should say a significant proportion of customers.

[Neil Brock]

I would appreciate it if everyone stopped hiding behind the piracy excuse.

I appreciate that Steam makes it incredibly easy to push out updates, and to keep graphics drivers up to date, but it does nothing against piracy - if anything it will drive a new section of potential or existing customers towards it. Steam has several advantages, but it also has a lot of disadvantages which are far too easily swept under the carpet.

That and forcing someone who's purchased the game to install third party software is not a good way to treat customers. It should be an option, it should not be mandatory.

Again, Steam does nothing against piracy, so I struggle to believe that is the actual reason for this decision.

We obviously cannot release specific facts and figures but we wouldn't be making this decision blindly if Steam did absolutely nothing against piracy.

[stevie_G_32201]

Software like STEAM is the future, better get on the digital wagon.

Ive used STEAM for some years now, and I havent received bad/intrusive mails, phonecalls, knocks on my door late at night, nor suspicious PC behaviour.

STEAM is not the work of Satan, so please try it out eh?

[insert random characters]

[Wakers]

Software like STEAM is the future, better get on the digital wagon.

Which is a scary thought, considering the lack of appropriate customer support and the ridiculous international pricing that they practice.

[Dune297]

Fair enough, I should say a significant proportion of customers.

Seems even right now.

[Neil Brock]

Fair enough, I should say a significant proportion of customers.

But djvandyke, you use Xbox Live right? Well damn Microsoft! They forced you to sign up to a service to use their online products. Surely they should burn in the fiery hells of Satan like Steam should right?

[milnerpoint]

Fair enough, I should say a significant proportion of customers.

Based on what? Stop thinking that you are the majority of customers, the only people really against this are stuck in the past, this is the way gaming is going, get on board or dont play PC games.

[Wakers]

We obviously cannot release specific facts and figures but we wouldn't be making this decision blindly if Steam did absolutely nothing against piracy.

Can we be a bit vague then? Is it based on the fact that a great deal of sales come from the first day of release, and that Steam often (not always, mind) delays the pirated versions availability for a day or two?

I'm not exactly sure why you can't release facts and figures? Transparency is a good thing.

[whilewolf]

Gruching so sorry if its been mentioned already but If we have to register on Steam doesn't that mean the game cant be resold with out giving away the details of your Steam account?

Or can I un-link it from my steam account?

[David Kempshall]

What about the people who buy the game and don't have the internet? I used to always buy back before i had the internet full time and i would be very annoyed if i bought it and couldnt play it and then couldnt return it because i "opened it"

If you can't access the internet at all then you can't play the game unfortunately. However, if you can go an internet cafe, or a friends house or find a temporary solution where you can access the internet for a short while to install Steam and active your game then you can play offline on your computer from then on.

[Guest]

Fair enough, I should say a significant proportion of customers.

I think you're over-estimating with the use of 'significant', as it stands I will not be getting FM12 becasue of this issue & it looks like a few others are of the same mindset but I doubt we will form what could be called a significant group.

[The Welsh Lad]

Altough i can understand the decision from SI/SEGA, i dont see this as a contribute to reduce piracy. IMO wont have any effect on the 25% piracy ratio.

For me, this is perhaps, the first step to end the disc version of FM, and perhaps FM2013 or FM2014 will be exclusive from steam!

I really hope not

[djvandyke]

But djvandyke, you use Xbox Live right? Well damn Microsoft! They forced you to sign up to a service to use their online products. Surely they should burn in the fiery hells of Satan like Steam should right?

I didn't know Steam was SEGA's online product?

[Neil Brock]

Gruching so sorry if its been mentioned already but If we have to register on Steam doesn't that mean the game cant be resold with out giving away the details of your Steam account?

Or can I un-link it from my steam account?

Good question, I'm not 100% sure but I am trying to find out. Thanks.

[IMT]

Whilst signing up to Steam is not an issue for me, it's hardly like you're being asked to pay for Steam first, it all seems really pointless to me, as I bet my last £ that it will be available on torrents as soon as it gets released anyway.

Sadly, you'll never beat the pirates, and all you will achieve is annoying genuine customers, as this thread has more than proven.

[Dune297]

Gruching so sorry if its been mentioned already but If we have to register on Steam doesn't that mean the game cant be resold with out giving away the details of your Steam account?

Or can I un-link it from my steam account?

You can't resell the game once it is registered on a Steam account. If you give away the details of your steam account, it will more then likely be banned.

[Bertie BG]

Can we be a bit vague then? Is it based on the fact that a great deal of sales come from the first day of release, and that Steam often (not always, mind) delays the pirated versions availability for a day or two?

I'm not exactly sure why you can't release facts and figures? Transparency is a good thing.

I wasn't part of the decision making on this so don't know what was weighed up but it would be a pretty safe bet that the decision would not have been made if they didn't think it would have a positive impact on combating piracy and therefore increasing the numbers buying our game legally.

There's a lot of people saying that Steam doesn't make any difference in combating piracy, have you got figures to prove that?