Most overrated players in FM21

[busngabb]

1 - Anthony Martial. Showed promise as a young player, but in real life has never fulfilled his potential. He's far too lazy and inconsistent to ever become an elite player, despite being in or around the United first 11. In the game he has 15 for teamwork and 14 for work rate in the season I'm in. Utter nonsense, make them <5. In the game he's dynamite, he'll run 80m and smash it in the top corner, just an incredibly annoying player to be against. In real life the most he's ever scored is 17 a season, 7 this season I think, but in the game he's got 38, 31, 35 and 30 in his last four seasons. Just take his CA in the game and reduce it by 40 and divide all his mental stats by 3.

2 - Hector Bellerin. Another player who looked like he might be an elite player in real life, so I understand him being elite on previous versions. But he's never had the determination to get to that level in real life, seems far too concerned about off the field matters. He's no more than an average PL right back now and no threat to anyone, averaging an assist a season. Another who'll run 80m and rocket it in the top corner in the game. He's my cryptonite in the game, I don't think I've played against Arsenal without him having a worldie. A regular provider of 10+ assists per season in the game. Rein him in SI.

One who is criminally underrated is Thierry Small. Wanted by Bayern, Juve, United and Arsenal in real life and rated as the best young LB in the world. By 20 in the game he has about 4 techncial and mental stats above single figures in total.

[ShaunG95]

On 03/04/2021 at 14:46, busngabb said:

One who is criminally underrated is Thierry Small. Wanted by Bayern, Juve, United and Arsenal in real life and rated as the best young LB in the world. By 20 in the game he has about 4 techncial and mental stats above single figures in total.

Thierry Small has a buff on the two most recent updates, he is now potentially one of the best left-backs in the world depending on his potential ability roll on your save.

[DominicForza]

Lewis Cook's PA.   

[Reedy_1988]

On my current save I'm finding most forwards with the likes to beat offside trap combined with shoots with power ppm to be an absolute beast. Sam Surridge is a 30-50 goal a season striker for me.

[karanhsingh]

Martial was the first name that popped into my head when I saw this thread. He is top scorer in the EPL in my save. Crazy.

Pogba has been perpetually over-rated too. 

[karanhsingh]

8 hours ago, DominicForza said:

Lewis Cook's PA.   

Agreed, he is in the England 2026 WC squad in my save.

[TelcontarTargaryen]

While I agree that in real life his form is abysmal and he hasn't lived up to his potential, in FM21, for AI too, but especially for human players, or should I say managers, Anthony Martial is a ****ing beast. 

[busngabb]

On 04/04/2021 at 22:14, ShaunG95 said:

Thierry Small has a buff on the two most recent updates, he is now potentially one of the best left-backs in the world depending on his potential ability roll on your save.

Oh okay. I'm playing the second most recent I think, and he's not good on that. I might start a new career, been a while since Everton had anyone half decent in the youth team. Branthwaite is a future squad player on the version I'm on, but beyond that there's not much.

[ShaunG95]

10 hours ago, busngabb said:

Oh okay. I'm playing the second most recent I think, and he's not good on that. I might start a new career, been a while since Everton had anyone half decent in the youth team. Branthwaite is a future squad player on the version I'm on, but beyond that there's not much.

I'll be honest, he's improved a lot on my save and he is still doesn't look that good. I think because he has a lot of random attributes, it depends on what his attributes look like at the start of your save.

[Welshace]

14 hours ago, busngabb said:

Oh okay. I'm playing the second most recent I think, and he's not good on that. I might start a new career, been a while since Everton had anyone half decent in the youth team. Branthwaite is a future squad player on the version I'm on, but beyond that there's not much.

I'm hoping Astley comes good .. he's a local lad to me  so would be nice to see him do well

[alittletoojack]

On 03/04/2021 at 14:46, busngabb said:

2 - Hector Bellerin. Another player who looked like he might be an elite player in real life, so I understand him being elite on previous versions. But he's never had the determination to get to that level in real life, seems far too concerned about off the field matters.

slightly off topic but this is rubbish

i agree he hasn't pushed onto become the player he promised to be when he broke through, but the idea that its because he's into his clothes and displays a moral conscience off the pitch is the biggest load of 'yer da' nonsense.

Edited April 6, 2021 by alittletoojack

[ajw10]

2 hours ago, alittletoojack said:

slightly off topic but this is rubbish

i agree he hasn't pushed onto become the player he promised to be when he broke through, but the idea that its because he's into his clothes and displays a moral conscience off the pitch is the biggest load of 'yer da' nonsense.

He's just too vegan

[TheBigBoss]

Genuinely surprised no ones mentioned Callum WIlson unbelievably overrated on this will finish top scorer with Newcastle more times they get relegated and will continue to score a stupid amount of goals for his new club. 

 

[karanhsingh]

10 hours ago, TheBigBoss said:

Genuinely surprised no ones mentioned Callum WIlson unbelievably overrated on this will finish top scorer with Newcastle more times they get relegated and will continue to score a stupid amount of goals for his new club. 

 

True, along with Chris Wood.

[tomtuck01]

On 03/04/2021 at 14:46, busngabb said:

1 - Anthony Martial. Showed promise as a young player, but in real life has never fulfilled his potential. He's far too lazy and inconsistent to ever become an elite player, despite being in or around the United first 11. In the game he has 15 for teamwork and 14 for work rate in the season I'm in. Utter nonsense, make them <5. In the game he's dynamite, he'll run 80m and smash it in the top corner, just an incredibly annoying player to be against. In real life the most he's ever scored is 17 a season, 7 this season I think, but in the game he's got 38, 31, 35 and 30 in his last four seasons. Just take his CA in the game and reduce it by 40 and divide all his mental stats by 3.

 

Well that's just not true.

[TelcontarTargaryen]

28 minutes ago, tomtuck01 said:

Well that's just not true.

He counted only league goals, he scored 17 in the Premier League last season.

[tomtuck01]

1 hour ago, TelcontarTargaryen said:

He counted only league goals, he scored 17 in the Premier League last season.

Aye I'm aware of how many goals he got in the league. But the OP didn't say that...

[causticgrip]

On 05/04/2021 at 01:36, DominicForza said:

Lewis Cook's PA.   

 

On 05/04/2021 at 09:39, karanhsingh said:

Agreed, he is in the England 2026 WC squad in my save.

 

Hah he won the 2026 WC in my Bournemouth save. This is what he looks like in 2028, some attributes definitely too high to be realistic I feel:

Spoiler

 

[WillyBroadband]

On 05/04/2021 at 23:45, busngabb said:

Oh okay. I'm playing the second most recent I think, and he's not good on that. I might start a new career, been a while since Everton had anyone half decent in the youth team. Branthwaite is a future squad player on the version I'm on, but beyond that there's not much.

I'm on an Everton save atm and Small is

Spoiler

-85

 

[CaptCanuck]

Callum Wilson and N'golo Kante are the 1st two that pop into my head. Both excellent IRL at what they do - poach and protect - but no way are they the allrounders FM makes them out to be.

And DeGea they still have him on his form from what 6 or 7 years ago now. Some of the saves the 3d sim show him making, phew.

Edited April 9, 2021 by CaptCanuck

[Chapman7]

On 03/04/2021 at 14:46, busngabb said:

1 - Anthony Martial. Showed promise as a young player, but in real life has never fulfilled his potential. He's far too lazy and inconsistent to ever become an elite player, despite being in or around the United first 11. In the game he has 15 for teamwork and 14 for work rate in the season I'm in. Utter nonsense, make them <5. In the game he's dynamite, he'll run 80m and smash it in the top corner, just an incredibly annoying player to be against. In real life the most he's ever scored is 17 a season, 7 this season I think, but in the game he's got 38, 31, 35 and 30 in his last four seasons. Just take his CA in the game and reduce it by 40 and divide all his mental stats by 3.

2 - Hector Bellerin. Another player who looked like he might be an elite player in real life, so I understand him being elite on previous versions. But he's never had the determination to get to that level in real life, seems far too concerned about off the field matters. He's no more than an average PL right back now and no threat to anyone, averaging an assist a season. Another who'll run 80m and rocket it in the top corner in the game. He's my cryptonite in the game, I don't think I've played against Arsenal without him having a worldie. A regular provider of 10+ assists per season in the game. Rein him in SI.

Martial's team work and work rate aren't accurate granted. But making them <5 is stupid. Considering he had his best season last season. Then his form has to be better also granted but all strikers will have bad seasons in their careers. His work rate could do with work but team work is definitely not something I would agree with, he is quite an unselfish striker come to it hence why there has been so much debate over weather he has the killer instinct as a striker.

 

Bellerin - I would say it's more to do with his recent injuries in recent years that has put his development on hold more than determination lacking. 

 

9 hours ago, CaptCanuck said:

And DeGea they still have him on his form from what 6 or 7 years ago now. Some of the saves the 3d sim show him making, phew.

De Gea still is a world class keeper just doesn't have the form granted but it's down to the attributes not being of a recent season more of a 2-4 season behind the current season so won't be downgraded appropriately. But he is still capable of making massive saves that he is known for from the early Premier League days  

Also attributes are done from 2-4 seasons behind so you won't have the accurate attributes of this season for maybe 1 or 2 games in the future.

[TelcontarTargaryen]

Media is, and always was, very biased against United, Allison i Ederson also make some mistakes, noone bats an eye, DDG makes a mistake, the whole world melts. Easily one of the top 5 goalkeepers in the world, despite his flaws and drop in form.

[Welshace]

15 hours ago, TelcontarTargaryen said:

Media is, and always was, very biased against United, Allison i Ederson also make some mistakes, noone bats an eye, DDG makes a mistake, the whole world melts. Easily one of the top 5 goalkeepers in the world, despite his flaws and drop in form.

I'm not a fan of any of the teams you mentioned, but to say DDG has made 'a mistake' is misleading... he's had a fair few underwhelming seasons now, despite short bursts of form.. the other two you mentioned have been consistantly decent despite their few errors every now and then... it's comparing apples and pears...  

DDG has been a top 10 keeper in the world but he has arguably dropped out of the top 10 in recent times easily.

[Welshace]

On 09/04/2021 at 16:23, CaptCanuck said:

Callum Wilson and N'golo Kante are the 1st two that pop into my head. Both excellent IRL at what they do - poach and protect - but no way are they the allrounders FM makes them out to be.

And DeGea they still have him on his form from what 6 or 7 years ago now. Some of the saves the 3d sim show him making, phew.

Agree with Wilson .. don't agree with Kante...  he's not a one trick pony in the slightest..

[TelcontarTargaryen]

6 hours ago, Welshace said:

I'm not a fan of any of the teams you mentioned, but to say DDG has made 'a mistake' is misleading... he's had a fair few underwhelming seasons now, despite short bursts of form.. the other two you mentioned have been consistantly decent despite their few errors every now and then... it's comparing apples and pears...  

DDG has been a top 10 keeper in the world but he has arguably dropped out of the top 10 in recent times easily.

Well, we wll have to agree to disagree, since I am of the complete opposite opinion.
Yes he had unusualy high number of mistakes, at least for him since at one point he was at zero or close to it. But he's playing with a very shakey defence in front of him, and comparing the number of mistakes goalkeepers at top clubs had make in the last few seasons, while he probably is higher in numbers, it's not like he made 30 mistakes and others made two. 

As an example, from 2016 till early 2021 the number of goalkeeper mistakes leading to goals is, Alisson and Ederson at six, DDG at nine while Hugo Lloris made 11 ... Pickford had 15. stats only for Premier League games. Or you want stats for only 2020/2021 season? Mistakes leading to opposition goals... Alisson 3, DDG ... 0. Yet I don't see or hear media raving about how Alisson is past it, and should be sold. 

TLDR I defenietly agree that his form has dipped, and that he is not at his best, but, as is usual with United, media love to overhype it and make a much bigger show out of it, because it's United and it sells / gets clicks...

Anyway, that was my 0.02$, as I said, we can agree to disagree. 
 

[CapaJr]

On 05/04/2021 at 03:36, DominicForza said:

Lewis Cook's PA.   

I literally signed in just to quote this.. cant agree more mate.. havent checked it this year but last season he had an insane PA, something like 169 if i remember correctly.. and he never, ever performs good, never ever improves (and i had a very decent Bournemouth save)

[TelcontarTargaryen]

That is because the game begin implementing a new... way of thinking, let's say, where players PA doesn't change every now and then and drops but rather other factors, hidden attributes etc influence the player, so it never reaches its full potential under certain circumstances. There were some posts about it, somewhere on the forum...

[busngabb]

On 06/04/2021 at 15:16, alittletoojack said:

slightly off topic but this is rubbish

i agree he hasn't pushed onto become the player he promised to be when he broke through, but the idea that its because he's into his clothes and displays a moral conscience off the pitch is the biggest load of 'yer da' nonsense.

I wasn't necessarily talking negatively about his off the field stuff. But I see more about him on social media and in the news about his fashion brands, creative partnerships, photography and the marketing and media companies he's started than I do about his performances. Perhaps he needs a move from Arsenal or a change in manager to spark his form. He's way overrated in the game currently though.

[causeforconcern]

On 11/04/2021 at 06:01, TelcontarTargaryen said:

Media is, and always was, very biased against United, Allison i Ederson also make some mistakes, noone bats an eye, DDG makes a mistake, the whole world melts. Easily one of the top 5 goalkeepers in the world, despite his flaws and drop in form.

Yeah, what a load of tosh. Half the media are former United players. 

 

De Gea was the best shot stopper in the world for a good couple of seasons but once he lost form people picked up on the fact the rest of his game has always been lacking. His distribution has never been world class and he's not great at coming off his line. Is he still a good keeper? Absolutely, but he's not what he once was. 

[DominicForza]

On the De Gea topic,  think the game has him about right - elite shot blocking and poor (for "big clubs") mentals. 

 

When De Gea was more or less the consesus Best Keeper in Premier League (and one of the best in the world) he was a combination of two things - Consistently Brilliant and Brilliantly Consistent.   He was absolute top shot stopper and also made very few errors.  No, he was never a sweeper keeper or top ball skills and he was never a commanding physical presence in the box or in the air.  However, he also had become very good at arial balls with effective punches, albeit he was always on the conservative side coming off his line for balls.     

 

The last few years his errors, soft goals, flapping at crosses, etc seems CORRELATED (not nessarily caused by) Emilio Alvarez leaving Man Utd (he was also De Gea's GK coach at Atletico Madrid.  Whether Alvarez leaving is what impacted his drop in his Brilliant Consistency, or if Alvarez left because of some change in De Gea (which Alvarez has implied) I don't know.  

[TelcontarTargaryen]

Yeah I was also thinking it was related to him leaving the club. Apparently they had some sort of a disagreenment. Link

[V3ntricity]

Almost the entire Liverpool team is overrated.  I've been saying this for years. The reason they were so good was the ability and culture created by Klopp. Trent Arnold is by far the best right back in game, so is Robertson as a left back. Henderson is crazy (really 16 first touch? crazy natural fitness). Allison was never that good. Talents like Curtis Jones has never shown such potential.

 

Edited April 19, 2021 by V3ntricity

[Geordieboy52]

On 19/04/2021 at 16:43, V3ntricity said:

Almost the entire Liverpool team is overrated.  I've been saying this for years. The reason they were so good was the ability and culture created by Klopp. Trent Arnold is by far the best right back in game, so is Robertson as a left back. Henderson is crazy (really 16 first touch? crazy natural fitness). Allison was never that good. Talents like Curtis Jones has never shown such potential.

 

I'm in 2026 and Curtis Jones is the best player in the England team.

[causeforconcern]

On 20/04/2021 at 03:43, V3ntricity said:

Almost the entire Liverpool team is overrated.  I've been saying this for years. The reason they were so good was the ability and culture created by Klopp. Trent Arnold is by far the best right back in game, so is Robertson as a left back. Henderson is crazy (really 16 first touch? crazy natural fitness). Allison was never that good. Talents like Curtis Jones has never shown such potential.

 

Robertson is absolutely deserving of his stats and Henderson too (agree re natural fitness though). 

I will agree about Trent. He's an absurdly talented lad but he's not without weakness and I don't think that's reflected well in the game. 

[V3ntricity]

Man Utd are comfortably the second best team in PL in a very difficult season, requiring different and adaptable leadership than ever before. I hope to see this reflected next season in game. 

Liverpool have at times been awful. They were top until january, then collapsed. Alisson and co should have seriously lowered mental stats.

[causeforconcern]

On 10/05/2021 at 04:01, V3ntricity said:

Man Utd are comfortably the second best team in PL in a very difficult season, requiring different and adaptable leadership than ever before. I hope to see this reflected next season in game. 

Liverpool have at times been awful. They were top until january, then collapsed. Alisson and co should have seriously lowered mental stats.

We've been rubbish but much of that comes down to the fact our top three centre backs have been injured meaning we've had to either play youngsters nowhere near good enough or throw midfielders there messing up our entire balance. There's not a side on earth that would cope with losing their 3 top centre backs for the season. 

Alisson has been fine, the players that have truly struggled have been Firmino and Mane. The latter I'm sympathetic towards given he had Covid and has played a disgusting amount of football in the last few years but with Firmino, well I think he's just lost a step and, football manager wise, definitely will see some stat adjustment to reflect that. 

[Woolly]

On 05/04/2021 at 01:36, DominicForza said:

Lewis Cook's PA.   

He was overrated in last years game as well, I've had him in my Man Utd saves in both games and he just bosses the midfield in either a DM or CM slot. Infact he was my Capt well into his 30's last year.

[lomekian]

On 14/04/2021 at 00:21, busngabb said:

I wasn't necessarily talking negatively about his off the field stuff. But I see more about him on social media and in the news about his fashion brands, creative partnerships, photography and the marketing and media companies he's started than I do about his performances. Perhaps he needs a move from Arsenal or a change in manager to spark his form. He's way overrated in the game currently though.

His attributes are probably accurate, but the weighting of those attributes in game and how they impact on performance is inaccurate. the FM engine is slightly skewed in favour of the type of football that suits him. In the same way the engine simply can't replicate the amount of utter moron moments by Arsenal defenders/midfielders in recent seasons. Its literally impossible to create a Mustafi in FM (a player that should be good, for 90% of 75% of games looks quality, but the rest of the time is a disaster zone)

[lomekian]

On 09/05/2021 at 17:01, V3ntricity said:

Man Utd are comfortably the second best team in PL in a very difficult season, requiring different and adaptable leadership than ever before. I hope to see this reflected next season in game. 

Liverpool have at times been awful. They were top until january, then collapsed. Alisson and co should have seriously lowered mental stats.

United are an interesting case study as their domestic results have been very strong on the whole, but they are spectacularly reliant on a few individuals for a club of their size and a squad so laden with talent and so expensively assembled. United under Fergie were a machine, but one that also played breathtaking football at times and totally dominated games. This United team still play great football at times, but without the talent in the final third are bang average (though credit to Shaw for recovering from being Mourinho'd). I think I've genuinely been impressed by Utd about 5 times this season, And my team have been pony this season, but still won at OT largely untroubled and were the better team at home too. Comfortably second best team, but equally worst 2nd place team in years, as reflected by all analytics and points etc. That said, 3 or 4 judicious signings and they could get 20 more points next year.

[Geordieboy52]

2 hours ago, lomekian said:

His attributes are probably accurate, but the weighting of those attributes in game and how they impact on performance is inaccurate. the FM engine is slightly skewed in favour of the type of football that suits him. In the same way the engine simply can't replicate the amount of utter moron moments by Arsenal defenders/midfielders in recent seasons. Its literally impossible to create a Mustafi in FM (a player that should be good, for 90% of 75% of games looks quality, but the rest of the time is a disaster zone)

Yep - perhaps they should employ a new PPM 'has a mistake in him' 

[Geordieboy52]

On 09/05/2021 at 17:01, V3ntricity said:

Man Utd are comfortably the second best team in PL in a very difficult season, requiring different and adaptable leadership than ever before. I hope to see this reflected next season in game. 

Liverpool have at times been awful. They were top until january, then collapsed. Alisson and co should have seriously lowered mental stats.

Not sure you can suggest what has happened to Alisson is solely football or ability related.

[Gorando]

The entire PL is overrated

[Sophos]

On 20/05/2021 at 13:32, Gorando said:

The entire PL is overrated

There's three English teams in European finals this season, and two seasons ago all four European finalists were English teams. 

[zabyl]