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Stuart Warren

Football Manager 2014 - Update 14.2.2 - Feedback Thread

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Here ultimately lies the issue. When the computer do it, it's an outrage, a broken game, SI should be burnt to the ground etc etc, but when it's achieved by the player, it's a great feat of managing, solely down to the player, could never happen without them etc etc. Can't go both ways.

The other factor is simple probabilities. What are Cheivo's chances of winning the league? I dunno. Lets say 1 in 100,000 (in truth, the odds will almost certainly be better than this). Pretty darn remote, and it's not going to hapen in real life. But how many seasons of FM have been played by everyone who has the game? I'd be willing to bet that it's more than 100,000. Which means that you'd actually expect some - not many, but some - of those people to experience Chievo winning the league. If one of them is already kinda unhappy with something, then the next thing you know, the game is apparently "broken"...

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Depends on your point of view I guess. Sure it's possible that it'll be fixed, but I'm not gonna get my hopes up too high, put it like that..... Meanwhile, I'm back to watching Daniel Sturridge blast yet some more shots over the bar from 20 yds out - his Shoots from long range PPM really is a doozie

What a miserable outlook to have. Fair enough if you don't believe it'll happen, but to complain about something that hasn't happened yet, based on what you think will happen - nothing more than a guess by the way - is a bit ridiculous. But then I suppose it's the place for it.

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So the complete non-existence of goals from direct free-kicks and long shots will not be fixed?

I score from DFK's and long shots quite often? Weird that you're experiencing this.

My only complain so far in my long term save would be what appears to be an absolute minuscule amount of penalty calls. I finished 2 seasons now and I think each season I saw maybe 3-4 penalties called TOPS. This includes for me or against me. Most of the time it's against me. The AI seems to be able to slide tackle me in their box without abandon or consequence.

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I score from DFK's and long shots quite often? Weird that you're experiencing this.

Same here.

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My feedback:

Since this update, I have gone from playing the game a lot to barely being able to play a few games in a session. I am taking no pleasure from playing the game but simply frustration. There is no game out there for frustrating you quite like FM and, since this latest update, I have found the frustration levels making it unplayable for me. I am sure there is some pedant that will point out that the game is not unplayable, which of course it isn't, but I personally find the bugs and stupid situations that the ME chucks out so regularly to be so frustrating that I cannot play it.

I have one save that I spent a lot of time playing and I won't let this patch ruin that enjoyment by playing it any longer. I won't be starting a new save for two reasons: firstly, because I want to be able to play the one I was enjoying, and secondly, I can't be bothered to go through all the time and effort of a first pre-season just to watch the same old frustrating things over and over again.

I am sure someone will also be along to tell me that the ME problems affect the AI just as much as me. Fine, but that is not the point. The point is that it is me playing the game, I experience it and not the AI. When the bugs occur and the ME chucks out its ridiculous situations it drives me crazy as there is nothing I, as the player, can do about it. The fact that it can affect the AI equally is neither here nor there as, like most people, I don't play games in a totally removed and rational state of calm, I experience them as someone who wants to be able to affect the outcome and will experience frustration when I know that outcome is decided not by me but by a glitch or a bug.

How a game plays is very very important and when, as a player, you come up against the same annoying/ridiculous situations over and over again it ruins the experience of that game. For now, I have deleted the game and will try not to bother with it until the next update. I know that I probably won't be able to do so but there is one thing for certain, I will not be buying this game at full price at release again as it has been unplayable to me for a large percentage of the time that it has been out. I don't want to pay for something I don't enjoy.

I know it's not technical feedback, that has pretty much been done, but it should be important to know how people experience the game. So far, my experience of this game has not been good and overall I'd rather have the £25 I paid than the game, not something I can say about another FM.

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I hope we dont have to wait for March for the patch because with the corner bug the game is frustrating.

At least if we have to wait until then, we should be given the choise to return to previous version (14.2, or 14.1.4).

Lesson learned for me too for next year. March buy

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I hope we dont have to wait for March for the patch because with the corner bug the game is frustrating.

At least if we have to wait until then, we should be given the choise to return to previous version (14.2, or 14.1.4).

Lesson learned for me too for next year. March buy

You are 99.9% certain never to be given the choice to return to a previous version. There just isn't the facility to do that currently, nor is there ever likely to be.

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Guest xwzq@

Recent buyer here, from my point of view i find fm14 well done once again. Everything seems balanced in my save, where i currently am at 2026 after starting unemployed; managed Ipwsich for two seasons, then Newcastle for seven seasons, Sweeden for World Cup quals plus World Cup competition and now Tottenham.I intent to play fmc later this season as I did with fm13. But with this save i will play on for ten to twenty more seasons as i explained that it is balanced in depth and in all parts of it in my opinion. Furthermore i find the platform suitable and found ways to make things work in the teams i manage not with the first approach, and rather effectively.

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surely there must be ME update before the jan transfer update? last years jan transfer update was released end of feb!!! that's 6 or 7 weeks away :(

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Can I just ask a question about this quote on the advice thread in tactics because this is the first FM that I have tried using the TC. Sorry if it's not the place to ask this but I guess it's feedback of sorts regarding the game.

"Make sure you have one Attack duty in defence, generally but not absolutely necessarily combined with one Support Duty (note, this includes the deepest wide players in your formation if you are not using the Full Back positions), one Attack Duty and one Defend Duty in midfield, and one Support Duty (or TQ or F9) in attack. This type of structure encourages movement between the lines, which is absolutely vital for a dynamic tactic that creates multiple chance types. It also ensures a tight defensive system in which the team defends en bloc, rather than in disconnected lines."

Is this a strategy you need if you are going to make a successful tactic?

The reason I ask is because certainly the first sentence fascinates me. Is it really important to have one defender on an attack duty? What if you want your defence to just defend? It just suggests that this is the basic framework for something to work in the ME, or that's how I read it, so I find it a bit bizarre that no matter what roles your players play there seems to be a "particular" way your duties should be to make a tactic cohesive which just kind of suggests to me that you "have" to adhere to certain formulas to get it right??

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I can't believe my wonderful post was hijacked by another loony post, just five minutes later than mine. :D

This thread too often descends into nothing more than a slanging match. Such a shame. Keep pushing that water up the hills RTHerringbone. :thup:

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Can I just ask a question about this quote on the advice thread in tactics because this is the first FM that I have tried using the TC. Sorry if it's not the place to ask this but I guess it's feedback of sorts regarding the game.

"Make sure you have one Attack duty in defence, generally but not absolutely necessarily combined with one Support Duty (note, this includes the deepest wide players in your formation if you are not using the Full Back positions), one Attack Duty and one Defend Duty in midfield, and one Support Duty (or TQ or F9) in attack. This type of structure encourages movement between the lines, which is absolutely vital for a dynamic tactic that creates multiple chance types. It also ensures a tight defensive system in which the team defends en bloc, rather than in disconnected lines."

Is this a strategy you need if you are going to make a successful tactic?

The reason I ask is because certainly the first sentence fascinates me. Is it really important to have one defender on an attack duty? What if you want your defence to just defend? It just suggests that this is the basic framework for something to work in the ME, or that's how I read it, so I find it a bit bizarre that no matter what roles your players play there seems to be a "particular" way your duties should be to make a tactic cohesive which just kind of suggests to me that you "have" to adhere to certain formulas to get it right??

You could ask you defender to just defend, but then you have little offensive threat from him, and would need to account for that. Most of the best cohesive units in football generate good movement between the lines, to unsettle the opposition and generate angles of attack. Not many wide defenders just defend in real life, do they? Its a basic framework for movement between the lines that is applied from real life. You don't have to adhere to anything, its a guide.

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I can't believe my wonderful post was hijacked by another loony post, just five minutes later than mine. :D

This thread too often descends into nothing more than a slanging match. Such a shame. Keep pushing that water up the hills RTHerringbone. :thup:

We're gluttons for punishment apparently :)

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You could ask you defender to just defend, but then you have little offensive threat from him, and would need to account for that. Most of the best cohesive units in football generate good movement between the lines, to unsettle the opposition and generate angles of attack. Not many wide defenders just defend in real life, do they? Its a basic framework for movement between the lines that is applied from real life. You don't have to adhere to anything, its a guide.

Fair enough. In real life though I think it's like the defenders being on a rope. One full back moves forward, the other tucks in so a lot of the time there will always be a back three but different full backs attack. Pity the ME doesn't allow that as yet unless both on automatic can get close?

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The reason I ask is because certainly the first sentence fascinates me. Is it really important to have one defender on an attack duty? What if you want your defence to just defend? It just suggests that this is the basic framework for something to work in the ME, or that's how I read it, so I find it a bit bizarre that no matter what roles your players play there seems to be a "particular" way your duties should be to make a tactic cohesive which just kind of suggests to me that you "have" to adhere to certain formulas to get it right??

There are exceptions, but by picking the duties you often also determine off the ball movement. If you hover the mouse over the duty of the role it should tell you in which ways. If you've previously tweaked sliders yourself, a CM (S) has his runs from deep to "mixed", and a CM (A) to "often" whilst a CM (D), well, you might the the drift. Be aware that this isn't always the case. Obviously a deep lying playmaker is meant to sit deep, so will keep his position and not venture forward off the ball when the team is going forward regardless of duties available.

The entire advice is thus about movement in between the lines on the pitch, without such and every player keeping basic position the lines remain static and attacks are easier to defend. This is as true in real football as it is thus in the ME. It just happens to be implemented via roles and the duties you pick. Nothing to do with adhering to formulas. It's just a rough guideline anyway, as keeping both your backs "at bay" all the time for 90 minutes in every game can obviously be problematic. PPMs can also influence this, as there are those relating to off the ball forward movement as well ("gets forward whenever possible"). City's Kolarov comes with it and is prone to moving forward regardless the role and duty you give him.

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I completely agree, the game engine is shocking as it does a few things. for example, it create situations that are just ridiculous,, that you only seam to find in Sunday league football, I mean WATCH A PREM LEAGUE MATCH.

It also seams to deem player stats worthless most of the time, for example, Jan Class Huntelaar has finishing 20 and composure 18 or 19, but can he score if he's in my team?? No, although he had plentiful chances, he still cant shoot. Players pass the ball into the opposition to often, players try to but corners and kick the ball out of play to often, Gks don't claim crosses and corners very often, Gks when set on throw to defenders tend to throw it to the opposition, players set on 'shoot less often,' guess what? they shoot OFTEN.

I could go on and on, however, I have found this game largely disappointing and a total waste of money.

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I completely agree, the game engine is shocking as it does a few things. for example, it create situations that are just ridiculous,, that you only seam to find in Sunday league football, I mean WATCH A PREM LEAGUE MATCH.

It also seams to deem player stats worthless most of the time, for example, Jan Class Huntelaar has finishing 20 and composure 18 or 19, but can he score if he's in my team?? No, although he had plentiful chances, he still cant shoot. Players pass the ball into the opposition to often, players try to but corners and kick the ball out of play to often, Gks don't claim crosses and corners very often, Gks when set on throw to defenders tend to throw it to the opposition, players set on 'shoot less often,' guess what? they shoot OFTEN.

I could go on and on, however, I have found this game largely disappointing and a total waste of money.

every single match is either a corner, a free kick or an error from the GK :eek:

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This was posted on the 10th:

PLEASE FIX THE SET PIECES ISSUE, IT'S BECOMING REALLY BAD AND TOTALLY ABSURD, not possible to suffer 1/2 of this goals each match...

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every single match is either a corner, a free kick or an error from the GK :eek:

add the incredible horror related to CCC...of course only my team's CCC, since the AI CCC are converted at a reasonable rate...those of my team are Always the same...1v1 and shot straight on the GK...of course it's my tactic...anyway try to solve it, it's a really nonsense...

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add the incredible horror related to CCC...of course only my team's CCC, since the AI CCC are converted at a reasonable rate...those of my team are Always the same...1v1 and shot straight on the GK...of course it's my tactic...anyway try to solve it, it's a really nonsense...

Although I agree with several bugs reporting (since they are so obvious), mainly set pieces and stupid errors from the GK's and defenders, as for CCC I can't agree being some kind of bug, but instead something I posted at #3421 at this page... quoting I guess my deepest frustration regarding this year edition of FM is the step that was made regarding the new tactical system. SI have conditioned us all to play into their own logic of football, introducing a very rigid system that only facilitates success if you play by their logic... and it's a british game, so it's a british logic.. Of course this is still very... hum, can't find a kind word, let's just say disturbing, but not a bug just conditioned to a logic of football played on an island.

So, the CCC, this is a screenshot from a second league division, I simply throw away my ideas of playing a possession-based style and a team forecasted to be 19th is at end of 21matches firmly at 1th.

pf4i.png

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add the incredible horror related to CCC...of course only my team's CCC, since the AI CCC are converted at a reasonable rate...those of my team are Always the same...1v1 and shot straight on the GK...of course it's my tactic...anyway try to solve it, it's a really nonsense...

When you bring the old "AI is more efficient" line into your post, then you really are setting yourself up for a fall, I'm afraid.

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add the incredible horror related to CCC...of course only my team's CCC, since the AI CCC are converted at a reasonable rate...those of my team are Always the same...1v1 and shot straight on the GK...of course it's my tactic...anyway try to solve it, it's a really nonsense...

So, let's break it down shall we.

Your teams CCC conversion = poor

The AI teams' CCC conversion = reasonable.

What is your overall conclusion to the above?

It has to be one of the following.

1 - The game is broken

2 - The game is biased in favour of the AI

3 - It's your tactics.

So, let's look at those three.

1 - Game broken? Well, evidently not given the other teams are putting away those chances at an accepitable rate. If the game was broken, they wouldn't be scoring theirs either, so let's discard that one.

2 - Game biased in favour of the AI? - Unlikely, given the game is unable to distinguish between human and AI players. And fundamentally, why would a company who want to make money from sales of the game heavily weight the very core of the game towards the computer? If it were possible, surely that would be weighted in the player's favour? So, we can rule this one out too.

Which leaves...

Well, I'm sure I don't have to spell it out for you...

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SI have conditioned us all to play into their own logic of football, introducing a very rigid system that only facilitates successif you play by their logic... and it's a british game, so it's a british logic. Of course this is still very... hum, can't find a kind word, let's just say disturbing, but not a bug just conditioned to a logic of football played on an island

With all due respect, you have a tendency to make some bizarre observations and this is up at the top of the list!

Your posts in sections of the Tactics forum imply that your understanding of the games' interpretation of football is still in its infancy, so you perhaps aren't best placed to make an informed assessment of the way in which the ME works.

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With all due respect, you have a tendency to make some bizarre observations and this is up at the top of the list!

Your posts in sections of the Tactics forum imply that your understanding of the games' interpretation of football is still in its infancy, so you perhaps aren't best placed to make an informed assessment of the way in which the ME works.

Hum, where did you read from my comments that I made or that I pretend to made an informed assessment of the way the ME works ? Can you quote me on this ? I would like you so, and if you can't it would be better if you would avoid provocative and innocous observations because if you can't, well, maybe it's you that is still in your infancy... obviously, with all due respect!

If can you can't discern informed assessments of the feeling of clients that look at foottball as something that is not inside of a box of logic, that explains very well why so many people are complaining.... and also with all due respect!

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Hum, where did you read from my comments that I made or that I pretend to made an informed assessment of the way the ME works ? Can you quote me on this ? I would like you so

Yeah - it was the quote of yours from my last post.....

As a reminder:

SI have conditioned us all to play into their own logic of football, introducing a very rigid system that only facilitates success if you play by their logic... and it's a british game, so it's a british logic. Of course this is still very... hum, can't find a kind word, let's just say disturbing, but not a bug just conditioned to a logic of football played on an island.

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Do fans always have to be unhappy about something in the confidence updates? Currently they are unhappy about a 17 year old regen I signed for 100k. It was a poor piece of business, apparently. I have loaned the kid out for the season and got a fee of 90k for it.

Don't see the logic.

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Yeah - it was the quote of yours from my last post.....

As a reminder:

Oooohhhh and you say that is a well informed assessment.... hummm, right. Nice one RT, go for it chap. As I said, that explains a lot.

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Oooohhhh and you say that is a well informed assessment.... hummm, right. Nice one RT, go for it chap. As I said, that explains a lot.

Your xenophobic post stated that you have to play the game a certain way in order to succeed. That is nonsense.

Put your handbag away and stop being a prat.

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Your xenophobic post stated that you have to play the game a certain way in order to succeed. That is nonsense.

Put your handbag away and stop being a prat.

I don't think it's xenophobic to say that the game is too much focused around the EPL and the football played there. If anything,I find it it a valid point. Close to everything is overtuned in favor of the EPL. And tactics that generally work in real life by some managers are either not viable or not possible to happen.

How long have people been trying to replicate Barca's game plan? If the game was tuned in order to allow for different kinds of plans, then it would be possible to happen.

He has a point, the game does not allow for much flexibility, unless you overpower your opponent by a lot in terms of players. Heck, even the youth intake comes to the point where some years in, some positions become extinct. And that's a fact, there was a person who actually tested it last year.

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Your xenophobic post stated that you have to play the game a certain way in order to succeed. That is nonsense.

Put your handbag away and stop being a prat.

Now you are confusing me (or maybe it's you). Tell me, what's the xenophobic part ? that the game is british ? saying the obvious that UK is an island (it's simple geography) ? that the game is actualy built with a logic that facilitates success ? grow up.

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I don't think it's xenophobic to say that the game is too much focused around the EPL and the football played there. If anything,I find it it a valid point. Close to everything is overtuned in favor of the EPL. And tactics that generally work in real life by some managers are either not viable or not possible to happen.

How long have people been trying to replicate Barca's game plan? If the game was tuned in order to allow for different kinds of plans, then it would be possible to happen.

He has a point, the game does not allow for much flexibility, unless you overpower your opponent by a lot in terms of players. Heck, even the youth intake comes to the point where some years in, some positions become extinct. And that's a fact, there was a person who actually tested it last year.

You've been able to play Barca's game plan for a while.

And no, its not been tuned to the EPL. That's the whole crux of this argument. It's entirely incorrect. A good example right now is a someone playing catenaccio. Cleon did an entire thread on the Brazilian 4-2-2-2 as Santos. We have the Dutch system. 3 of the 5 philosophies in game are based on continental theories. In fact when people say its built on the EPL, it shows how little they do know about what it is built on. Hell,if people actually realised where a lot of concepts in game were drawn from they would know it could be entirely based on the EPL from the start.

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That's the spirit. Let's make sure we get these problems sorted, eh? :rolleyes:

I posted it in the bug reporting forum...what more do you want me to do? Go over to SI headquarters and fix it myself?

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What a miserable outlook to have. Fair enough if you don't believe it'll happen, but to complain about something that hasn't happened yet, based on what you think will happen - nothing more than a guess by the way - is a bit ridiculous. But then I suppose it's the place for it.

You're probably right, me being in a bad mood isn't helping this. But my experience of FM13 was, like many others, troubled during the first few months. Lots of bugs, fixes that fixed them but caused other issues. The same seems to be happening this time around: the newest patch has caused much more problems than it's fixed, at least from my experience. Right now, I don't see the point in playing, because of the ME issues.

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You're probably right, me being in a bad mood isn't helping this. But my experience of FM13 was, like many others, troubled during the first few months. Lots of bugs, fixes that fixed them but caused other issues. The same seems to be happening this time around: the newest patch has caused much more problems than it's fixed, at least from my experience. Right now, I don't see the point in playing, because of the ME issues.

Now you sound like a real football manager... :) But always flag something you think its wrong, and if you feel it hasn't been looked it, raise it again. If you could link the specific issue, i'll see what o can do for my part

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I score from DFK's and long shots quite often? Weird that you're experiencing this.

That is strange. I've got Keisuke Honda to take my free-kicks, who's got both the attributes and the PPMs to be good at it. Luis Suarez and Marco Verratti has also had some tries. Over a total of 5 seasons I got one goal direct from a free-kick - it was Honda in a preseason friendly against a team from deep down in the divisions, hence the goalie couldn't catch a worm in an empty jar...

As for long shots, I also think I've gotten one or two over these 5 seasons. The really annoying part of this though, is Daniel Sturridge who's got Shoots from long range PPM: he fires away from 20+ yards a good few times every match - I'm sure he doesn't even get them on target more than 1 out of 10 tops, and when he does it's an easy save. To me it just seems so meaningless and frustrating....and the worst part is he's not able to unlearn it :/

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Now you are confusing me (or maybe it's you). Tell me, what's the xenophobic part ? that the game is british ? saying the obvious that UK is an island (it's simple geography) ? that the game is actualy built with a logic that facilitates success ? grow up.

Just re. your screenshot, I'm assuming you are Boavista?

You mentioned abandoning a possession-based style. A general thought, I wonder how many players have been trying to adopt a possession-based style and failing in the game? I have to confess at times I've been guilty of this myself. Perhaps Barcelona and Spain have so inspired us that we naturally try to imitate them on FM? Problem is that whether you're playing FM, or managing a football team IRL, there's another team that wants the ball, or is at least hell bent on stopping your team having it.

One thing I've learned relatively recently re. FM14 (not IRL I knew these things already) is to just focus on what my players can do, and what they can't do. Then, build my formation and my instructions around those things.

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That is strange. I've got Keisuke Honda to take my free-kicks,

Honda scored four DFK's in the first half of a season for my Sunderland side in one save. He's been the most deadly player I've seen from those set pieces so far.

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Honda scored four DFK's in the first half of a season for my Sunderland side in one save. He's been the most deadly player I've seen from those set pieces so far.

Hey I'm impressed you're managing the mighty Sunderland ;)

I had Honda in my Man Utd save and, likewise, he's excellent at free-kicks, even during the earlier ME versions when people here noted that there was a lack of goals from DFK's he was scoring them for me.

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Hey I'm impressed you're managing the mighty Sunderland ;)

Not any more, I rage-deleted it after accumulating 8 points (whilst scoring just five goals) from my first 20 games in the second season after finishing 8th in the season before. Never in all my CM/FM career has something went so wrong, so badly. And there was no real reason for it. Apart from the fact I just couldn't score. Wasn't getting hammered, it was all 1-0s and 2-0s, with my side normally the better team. The last straw was when the board took away all my transfer funds in January and slashed the wage budget from 800k to 600k leaving me nearly 200k over. I knew then it was time to move on...

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Not any more, I rage-deleted it after accumulating 8 points (whilst scoring just five goals) from my first 20 games in the second season after finishing 8th in the season before. Never in all my CM/FM career has something went so wrong, so badly. And there was no real reason for it. Apart from the fact I just couldn't score. Wasn't getting hammered, it was all 1-0s and 2-0s, with my side normally the better team. The last straw was when the board took away all my transfer funds in January and slashed the wage budget from 800k to 600k leaving me nearly 200k over. I knew then it was time to move on...

Are you ever successful?

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Are you ever successful?

Nope.

Last trophy I won was the Scottish League Cup in CM01/02.

I have come close in this version, mind. Got to the Scottish Cup final with Hibs, before the gods conspired against me again, as I had a man sent off in the game against Celtic. Hard enough to beat them with 11 men. Lost 0-5. :(

Despite this, I still love the game. I've read and followed the advice in the tactics forum, but to no avail.

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Not any more, I rage-deleted it after accumulating 8 points (whilst scoring just five goals) from my first 20 games in the second season after finishing 8th in the season before. Never in all my CM/FM career has something went so wrong, so badly. And there was no real reason for it. Apart from the fact I just couldn't score. Wasn't getting hammered, it was all 1-0s and 2-0s, with my side normally the better team. The last straw was when the board took away all my transfer funds in January and slashed the wage budget from 800k to 600k leaving me nearly 200k over. I knew then it was time to move on...

Sounds like real life Sunderland to me ;)

I haven't managed us yet in FM14, I can't bear it! :(

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Is this a bug???

My Chairman signed Damien Comolli as a DOF which was pleasing because the Club couldn't afford him if I was trying the negotiations. Now on transfer deadline day I have hust read that we have signed Peter Schmeichel as a DOF... Two DOF's??? Turns out no. Comolli bizarrely has now moved to being a scout despite looking a far better DOF than Schmeichel.

Ok my Chairman is listed as hiring and firing but surely this is a little odd?!!!

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Is this a bug???

My Chairman signed Damien Comolli as a DOF which was pleasing because the Club couldn't afford him if I was trying the negotiations. Now on transfer deadline day I have hust read that we have signed Peter Schmeichel as a DOF... Two DOF's??? Turns out no. Comolli bizarrely has now moved to being a scout despite looking a far better DOF than Schmeichel.

Ok my Chairman is listed as hiring and firing but surely this is a little odd?!!!

I'd upload the save anyway, sounds dubious to me.

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