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Stupid Questions Thread (Tactic and Training Questions Only)

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How much of a fitness boost does resting a player for a single day make?

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18 hours ago, wkdsoul said:

but nothing to effect the development of the tuttee, just the person clash? ok.

There is unsuccessful tutoring and then there is tutor and tutee falling out. Obviously the latter is worse than the former.

A bad tutoring experience can impact upon both players' morale and their preferred/disliked people.

Morale affects development, so it can indeed have an indirect adverse impact on a player's progression.

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Posted (edited)

Not worth making a thread about but, how have you guys found the effect of loans vs in-house development?

 

I have world class training facilities and youth facilities and great coaches but have found that players who are 17-23 seem to develop out on loan with regular game time as opposed to being tutored and influenced by my coaches.

I've seen one of my 17 yr old players improve a ridiculous amount at a Serie B team with Poor and Average training and youth facilities.

 

I take it I'm missing something here - but I guess gametime trumps your facilities and level of coaches? Which would make sense and is probably realistic. 

Edited by j_morrissey1990

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21 minutes ago, j_morrissey1990 said:

Not worth making a thread about but, how have you guys found the effect of loans vs in-house development?

 

I have world class training facilities and youth facilities and great coaches but have found that players who are 17-23 seem to develop out on loan with regular game time as opposed to being tutored and influenced by my coaches.

I've seen one of my 17 yr old players improve a ridiculous amount at a Serie B team with Poor and Average training and youth facilities.

 

I take it I'm missing something here - but I guess gametime trumps your facilities and level of coaches? Which would make sense and is probably realistic. 

Before the age of 18 matches have very little impact. It is all about training.

After the age of 18 matches take precedence. Training is still important of course but matches are the essential factor. These matches need to be at the highest level possible where the youngster can still perform. Too low a level and development will stall due to him lacking a challenge, too high a level and development will stall due to him finding the competition too tough. 

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14 hours ago, Seb Wassell said:

Before the age of 18 matches have very little impact. It is all about training.

After the age of 18 matches take precedence. Training is still important of course but matches are the essential factor. These matches need to be at the highest level possible where the youngster can still perform. Too low a level and development will stall due to him lacking a challenge, too high a level and development will stall due to him finding the competition too tough. 

By "competition too tough" are you mostly referring to (able to get good match scores)?  I just remember in FM16 exploding some kid through the ranks as a 17-20 year old because the team around him was amazing enough to carry him and he still put in good scores (was a striker and would often get goals on nice setups).

I imagine also that league rep feeds into youth league rep as well?  I (going from memory) think my U18 team in England had better success with growth once I was in Youth Category 1, but that might also simply be that my youth recruitment pool improved (also a function of improved club rep IIRC).

Is it arguable that this is an advantage of the "2nd teams" (i.e. Skeid 2) over say, England's U23 league?  Since Skeid 2 could hypothetically play in Norway Second Division it'd be akin to loaning my players to a tier 3 league team?

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10 hours ago, alanschu14 said:

By "competition too tough" are you mostly referring to (able to get good match scores)?  I just remember in FM16 exploding some kid through the ranks as a 17-20 year old because the team around him was amazing enough to carry him and he still put in good scores (was a striker and would often get goals on nice setups).

Yes, his average ratings will indicate how well suited the level if for him. Too low and his development will stall, too high and his development will stall. Look for the "godilocks zone" where his average ratings are just right. Practically speaking the player needs to play at the highest level he can before his average ratings dip too low.

 

10 hours ago, alanschu14 said:

Is it arguable that this is an advantage of the "2nd teams" (i.e. Skeid 2) over say, England's U23 league?  Since Skeid 2 could hypothetically play in Norway Second Division it'd be akin to loaning my players to a tier 3 league team?

Youth leagues have reputation as well. It is sometimes difficult to identify the exact reason that your youngsters are seeing changes in their development due to the large number of factors involved and the fact that some of these are very difficult to separate from one another, but you should certainly see a correlation.

10 hours ago, alanschu14 said:

Is it arguable that this is an advantage of the "2nd teams" (i.e. Skeid 2) over say, England's U23 league?  Since Skeid 2 could hypothetically play in Norway Second Division it'd be akin to loaning my players to a tier 3 league team?

Depending on the situation that would be fair yes. 

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Which formation / strategy is good against an aggressive, flat 3-4-3? When my team is winning the opposition often switches to a 3-4-3 which causes problems.

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Does the "clear ball to flanks" TI influence all build up play (meaning that my players will generally look to play the ball towards the wider areas), or does it only influence how the team clear the ball when in distress near our own penalty area?

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11 hours ago, Adzke said:

Does the "clear ball to flanks" TI influence all build up play (meaning that my players will generally look to play the ball towards the wider areas), or does it only influence how the team clear the ball when in distress near our own penalty area?

It sets how your defenders handle the ball in their own third- even without being in distress they will look to get the ball out to wide areas first time.

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Hi guys,

 

Would anyone have any advice on what roles best suit the two midfielders in a 41221 DM with narrow, attacking inside forwards and a DLP Support, False 9 or Treq?

I'm thinking probably about keeping and starting them with as CM Supports and seeing what happens but i'm worried that might cause the area in front of the oppositions defense to be crowded and restrict space for the two inside forwards and forward. I don't really read the ME that well so thought i'd ask here. 

Finally, if i want the DM to be a Ball Winning Defender, i assume at least one of my centre mids should be on defend?

Tactic will most likely be balanced/standard with no TI's to begin with. 

Thanks al

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On 7/31/2017 at 14:30, Seb Wassell said:

Before the age of 18 matches have very little impact. It is all about training.

After the age of 18 matches take precedence. Training is still important of course but matches are the essential factor. These matches need to be at the highest level possible where the youngster can still perform. Too low a level and development will stall due to him lacking a challenge, too high a level and development will stall due to him finding the competition too tough. 

I didn't know this and was always trying to get kids on the pitch as early as possible. 

 

Thanks for sharing Seb!

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I'm still learning the game. When I purchase or develop a player, I always make sure that he has a high teamwork attribute, since I dislike selfish players.

Without getting too deep into tactics, what are the advantages of a team that's described as "closely knit unit" because of high teamwork?

Also, is it correct to assume that a high teamwork player will follow instructions better on highly structured team shape? If so, how will teamwork benefit him on very fluid? 

Thanks for reading!

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9 hours ago, Nim-z said:

I'm still learning the game. When I purchase or develop a player, I always make sure that he has a high teamwork attribute, since I dislike selfish players.

Without getting too deep into tactics, what are the advantages of a team that's described as "closely knit unit" because of high teamwork?

Also, is it correct to assume that a high teamwork player will follow instructions better on highly structured team shape? If so, how will teamwork benefit him on very fluid? 

Thanks for reading!

I believe the "closely knit" bit you are referring to is actually team blend, an ME value that describes how well blended your team are with one another. Although without seeing where exactly you are referring to in the game there is a chance it is something else.

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1 hour ago, Ji-Sung Park said:

I'm trying to find some decent YT channels for FM tactical vids, do you guise have any recs here?

Have you check out bust the net?

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Just now, vasilli07 said:

Have you check out bust the net?

Yes. Also KYAN1TE (sp?), umaxit and FM Scout. Just wondering if there are any more. 

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Bust the net is definitely recommended

 

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What is the benefit of having an assistant coach? I currently have 1 'coach' and he gives me reports and trains my players. I was thinking about just hiring another coach for better training but don't understand the benefit of an assistant coach.

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18 hours ago, Isura said:

What is the benefit of having an assistant coach? I currently have 1 'coach' and he gives me reports and trains my players. I was thinking about just hiring another coach for better training but don't understand the benefit of an assistant coach.

The main benefit is the training quality- but also you can delegate tasks to him that you don't want to do like take press conferences, he can suggest lineups for you etc. There are a lot of things that role can do in the game, most of them are customizable to suit your needs. Since I like to do all my own managing tasks, the benefit to me is that he is a good coach in some area, and that he is good at evaluating players. 

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I know a lot of people have complained about it but has anyone found any solution to how wide wingers sit while defending? Is there any combination of ppms/PIs that can make the slightest bit of difference? Can a system of max pressing hide the issue somewhat? If not, is there any way to make CMs/STs/AMs drift wide regularly when attacking? I find when I play without wingers I have too little width offensively but obviously when I play with them I have too much width offensively

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On 31/07/2017 at 12:22, Seb Wassell said:

There is unsuccessful tutoring and then there is tutor and tutee falling out. Obviously the latter is worse than the former.

A bad tutoring experience can impact upon both players' morale and their preferred/disliked people.

Morale affects development, so it can indeed have an indirect adverse impact on a player's progression.

I think I know the answer to this, but can a positive tutoring experience with a poor-role model, have a negative effect on the tutee's attributes too? i.e. Determination / Big Games / Consistency / Professionalism dropping?

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25 minutes ago, ham_aka_stam said:

I think I know the answer to this, but can a positive tutoring experience with a poor-role model, have a negative effect on the tutee's attributes too? i.e. Determination / Big Games / Consistency / Professionalism dropping?

Yes, although tutoring only affects attributes which go towards a players' personality.  So not big games or consistency.

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It also does PPMs if you don't pick the "off the field" one too right?

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15 minutes ago, ham_aka_stam said:

It also does PPMs if you don't pick the "off the field" one too right?

Yup :thup:.

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16 minutes ago, ham_aka_stam said:

It also does PPMs if you don't pick the "off the field" one too right?

Yep one of the tutoring options has the chance to pass a/some PPMs from tutor to tutee.

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4 hours ago, Jedi5diah said:

how ineffective is playing AML winger on ML winger? i'm playing conservative old school 442

If they are good at playing Winger in AML position, they will probably do fine in ML Winger as well even without training in that position.  Getting them to Accomplished should go pretty quickly if you keep playing them there.

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14 hours ago, Jedi5diah said:

how ineffective is playing AML winger on ML winger? i'm playing conservative old school 442

I will firstly look at the attributes of the required role you want to them to play. Positioning of the player in ML or AML is secondary.

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If I want to set up in a medium block, what's more important - formation or d-line/mentality? For example, could I employ a medium block in a 4-3-3?

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late in the game and i'm chasing a goal -- how do i send my DCs and/or GK to join the attack/set pieces?

overload + very fluid?

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2 hours ago, Artin said:

late in the game and i'm chasing a goal -- how do i send my DCs and/or GK to join the attack/set pieces?

overload + very fluid?

Set pieces instructions, Drag the GK, DC to the opposition box.

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, MHovel said:

Set pieces instructions, Drag the GK, DC to the opposition box.

what if it's just a normal attack (meaning not a set piece) late in the game? how can i make my DCs/GK join the attack? would overload + very fluid be enough?

Edited by Artin

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Artin said:

what if it's just a normal attack (meaning not a set piece) late in the game? how can i make my DCs/GK join the attack? would overload + very fluid be enough?

Set pieces routines is the only way to influence who joins the attacks in set pieces, mentality and shape has nothing to do with that.

Edited by MHovel

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1 hour ago, craiigman said:

Which attributes, visual or hidden effect this as a negative?

 

GSAypT9.png

If I recall rightly, you get that when one or both of  decisions and anticipation are below the league standard- does that jibe with what you are seeing?

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, craiigman said:

Which attributes, visual or hidden effect this as a negative?

 

GSAypT9.png

If I understood your question, I think it's vary between players.

If you post the player profile or name it might be easy to say which mental attribute is the cause, I might call this for vision since anticipation has it's own "icon".

Edited by MHovel

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, MHovel said:

Set pieces routines is the only way to influence who joins the attacks in set pieces, mentality and shape has nothing to do with that.

yes i understand that part. if i want my GK/DC to be involved in attacking set pieces, i move them forward in the set piece instruction. my second question however is NOT regarding set pieces.

late in the game (say 88 mins on), down by 1 goal. i want my GK and/or DCs to join the attack... how do i do this (preferably by using only the team instructions)? i'm thinking overload + very fluid should do it but are there any other TIs i should tick (like "take more risks" for example)?

Edited by Artin

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Artin said:

yes i understand that part. if i want my GK/DC to be involved in attacking set pieces, i move them forward in the set piece instruction. my second question however is NOT regarding set pieces.

late in the game (say 88 mins on), down by 1 goal. i want my GK and/or DCs to join the attack... how do i do this? i'm thinking overload + very fluid should do it but are there any other TIs i should tick (like "take more risks" or "pump ball into box" for example)?

I undestand what you are saying, I don't think it's possible with team shape and mentality only.

Atleast in my experience and I played a lot with overload and very fluid shape, I never saw my GK going forward late in matches when we were 1 goal down.

Edited by MHovel

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, MHovel said:

I undestand what you are saying, I don't think it's possible with team shape and mentality only.

Atleast in my experience and I played a lot with overload and very fluid shape, I never saw my GK going forward late in matches when we were 1 goal down.

ahh that's a shame. so the GK doesn't go forward... what about the DCs? same thing?

Edited by Artin

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15 minutes ago, MHovel said:

If I understood your question, I think it's vary between players.

If you post the player profile or name it might be easy to say which mental attribute is the cause, I might call this for vision since anticipation has it's own "icon".

You're right, anticipation has its own icon, and so do decisions. Vision has one too- 'player can't pick out a pass' or something like that.  I remember seeing 'lack of game intelligence' a few times and it has seemed to be a result of a combination of attributes , else it was not really explainable.

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10 minutes ago, Dr. Hook said:

You're right, anticipation has its own icon, and so do decisions. Vision has one too- 'player can't pick out a pass' or something like that.  I remember seeing 'lack of game intelligence' a few times and it has seemed to be a result of a combination of attributes , else it was not really explainable.

Oh yes you are right, there is an icon for vision.

I think you might be correct, the cause of the icon @craiigman upload might be a combination of mental attributes.

I might say the combination of Anticipation, Vision and Decisions might be lower and they are the cause of the icon to show up in the player cons. 

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On 08/14/2017 at 02:53, 71834 said:

I know a lot of people have complained about it but has anyone found any solution to how wide wingers sit while defending? Is there any combination of ppms/PIs that can make the slightest bit of difference? Can a system of max pressing hide the issue somewhat? If not, is there any way to make CMs/STs/AMs drift wide regularly when attacking? I find when I play without wingers I have too little width offensively but obviously when I play with them I have too much width offensively

Anyone?

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15 minutes ago, 71834 said:

Anyone?

Some have complained.  Others don't see it as an issue and quite happily play with wingers.

Either way, there are plenty of threads about this already.  Start with rashidi's Gloucester 442 thread or nabskebabs' ranieri replication.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, herne79 said:

Some have complained.  Others don't see it as an issue and quite happily play with wingers.

Either way, there are plenty of threads about this already.  Start with rashidi's Gloucester 442 thread or nabskebabs' ranieri replication.

I have read many threads like that but have still had no luck. Hence why I came here. Surely there's a way to have a less dysfunctional midfield 4 than in the screenshot below, no? Ideally I'd like something like the other screenshot but I appreciate that's probably not possible. I've tried playing with WMs instead of wingers, telling them to sit narrower, reducing team width (I'm aware the last 2 are only meant to make a difference offensively), using 'always close down' on central midfielders in OI to try to tempt the wide players inside and playing with wing backs instead of full backs but i just can't seem to get the hang of it. No thread I've read about talks about the other part of my question, which was about making narrow players drift wide so I hope you understand why I posted it here. It seems the 'run wide with ball' PI has been removed on narrow players unless I am mistaken

20170816224118_1.jpg

atletico-pressing-midfield.png

Edited by 71834

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I need help with my Youth intake please ?

I struggle to weed out / let go of these youngsters, I feel they`re only young, give them time and keep giving them new contracts.

Should I release all `casual` personalities / low mental stats on a 17 y o ?, just keep only Professional with good determination ?? - one problem is with 3 intakes, Coaches are stretched.

Is there a guide / help on how to identify the wheat from the chaff ?

Thanks in advance

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Posted (edited)

(Excuse me if this has been asked before, but the search function doesn't work yet)

So, the rule is "at least 90 days of a specific 'General Training-Main Focus' for it to have an effect on attributes", right?
My first question is, do these "90 days" have to be cumulative or just "a total of 90 days throughout the year" will do?
Say I choose "Ball Control" for 1 month, then "Balanced" for the next month and then return to "Ball Control" for the next 2 months. Or even a different "General Training-Main Focus" each week but a total of 13 weeks throughout the year for each Main Focus.
Is this approach right or wrong?

My second question, is there a rule for "Additional Focus"? How many days to stick to a specific additional focus?
I think @Cleon said 2-3 months (correct me if I'm mistaken), but how do you come to this conclusion? Do you check the attribute you want to train, and for example, if it's 10.6 (or 10.8, I don't know) you switch to a different one? Assuming that it takes 2-3 months for a 10.0 attribute to become 10.6 or 10.8?

Edited by ilkork

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1 - Well 90 consecutive days for it to have any real bearing. You have to remember training is long-term not short term. Switching every week/months means you've never training it long enough to have a real impact.

2 - Individual focus on attributes is a short term option it gives an initial boost to that attribute. So using it long term isn't really beneficial especially once you see a change. That's why people normally rotate them after 1-2 months. You also have to remember that attributes rise differently for everyone, there is no set speed. It might rise quicker on one player than the next.

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On 8/17/2017 at 02:13, nextqprmanager said:

Is there a guide / help on how to identify the wheat from the chaff ?

I will tell you what I do, which I guess is very close to "right" (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

First of all, don't care about a youngster's personality, because you can always tutor him and change that. What you should care about though, is his current set of attributes and his potential ability.
If you look at a player's report, there's his Potential Ability (the star rating), and if the coach has good "Judging Player Potential" you can estimate in your head, how much better a youngster can become.

What I have created is a basic spreadsheet, with the "Current Attributes" and the "Potential Attributes":
default_capa.png

As you can see, it's pretty obvious. I enter the basic info for a player (Name, Age, Position) and then I head over to my coach report and enter the CA and PA.
Then I enter the player's current attributes, and then my "estimation". Here's an example:
capa_example.png

Panagiotis Retsos is a Central Defender. My coach says his CA is 2.5 stars and his PA is 4 stars and 1 black star. He's my best prospect.
He has the potential to become a very good Ball-Playing Defender (at least for my side) and that's my aim. From now on, his training will be "Position/Role: Ball-Playing Defender". What I will try to improve in the coming years with an "Additional Focus", are his:
Marking-Tackling
First Touch-Passing-Technique
Positioning-Composure
Strength-Balance

His other attributes will improve naturally.

I know that I am not very far off from what's going to happen (realistically). Sure, I am not 100% right, because nobody can predict the exact attributes for a player after some years, but having played FM for some years now, I am confident that my estimation is very close to reality.
Now, if his PA was, let's say, 3 stars and 1 black star, I would have added +1 for each value. At least +1. Maybe +2 in some attributes.

Hope this helps.

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13 minutes ago, Cleon said:

1 - Well 90 consecutive days for it to have any real bearing. You have to remember training is long-term not short term. Switching every week/months means you've never training it long enough to have a real impact.

2 - Individual focus on attributes is a short term option it gives an initial boost to that attribute. So using it long term isn't really beneficial especially once you see a change. That's why people normally rotate them after 1-2 months. You also have to remember that attributes rise differently for everyone, there is no set speed. It might rise quicker on one player than the next.

Thank you very much, I wasn't expecting that quick reply!

Do you personally have a rule for this? For example, if an attribute sees an increase by +0.4, do you change additional focus or do you wait for it to become +0.6?

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