Liverpool Thread 2011/12

[Emersonlfc]

Still pretty certain that Carragher is getting blamed too easily for both goals. The first Reina should definitely have come for, it was headed in from a yard away from where he was standing. The second RVP just beat the offside trap and again beat Reina too easily imo.

We may have other more pressing concerns atm, but I'm worried about Pepe. He needs to sort himself out a bit, he's been way off top form for the best part of 18 months.

Just don't understand why Carragher didn't just go attack the ball for the 1st goal. Maybe both at fault as maybe they both thought the other would deal with it but the old Jamie would have just cleared it regardless. 2nd goal he seemed to just loose track of RvP as he was jogging out.

[Rafalution]

Key word was today

if a manager only brings in rubbish players and doesn't fill the gaps, you can't excuse him from not having good players to play.

[Rafalution]

i'd rather have a mid 3 of spearing hendo and shelvey any day over picking adam.

i'd rather Downing start in the middle than pick Adam.

[CaptainPlanet]

I'd rather have Carragher in midfield than Adam.

[jep]

Adam was awful today and you could hear the crowd groaning each time one of his hollywood balls ended up going out for a throw in or when he delayed making a pass and got tackled. I think he is struggling with confidence now and Kenny really needs to take him out of the firing line and give Henderson a chance to show what he can do in the middle of the pitch. Alongside Spearing he would give us more energy and pace than Adam could.

Wish Kenny would also get Maxi back into the side as he can actually score goals, and agree with those wanting Coates in the side ahead of Carra who simply looks finished. His positional play and reactions for RVP's first goal were terrible, and he even had a go at pulling him down.

[Select_screen_name:]

5 points worse off than Benitez last season after 26 games as well. Benitez had 44.

[Emersonlfc]

Maxi would have slotted in nicely today with the way we were moving the ball about.

[Emersonlfc]

DP may have a point regarding Reina but you also have to remember that he made two top class saves today aswell.

[Bootador]

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1487279_judge-blasts-luis-suarez-after-handshake-bust-up-with-patrice-evra-prompts-manchester-united-fan-to-assault-wife-in-eccles

See what you're club is doing to society!

(Massive )

and the best hidden gem in the article is this "Manchester magistrates court had heard how dad-of-three Trelfa – of Trafford Road in Eccles - reacted furiously after watched footage of the 'handshake that wasn't' on the Ten O'Clock News."

[VamPook]

I bruised my thumb slamming the table when the 2nd goal went in.

Subs after 87 mins!

WTFFFFFFFFFFFFF

[Divinity]

Had a brief browse of the official forums. Laughable how blind people are being in refusing to acknowledge Kenny's failings.

[Kopite]

I don't know if he's good enough tbh. It's all relative. Obviously he's definitely good enough to play for Liverpool, and is one of our best players. But I don't know if he's good enough to keep in the knowledge that he's probably worth about £35m, scores no goals and tends to miss 8-10 games per season in ludicrous suspensions.

Sometimes I lean towards 'sell'. But I accept it may be a bad shout. Haven't come across too many who agree with me.

I actually completely agree with you. I lean towards selling him myself. He always seems a second away from doing something stupid which will end in another ban. He hasn't exactly been in impressive goal scoring form considering the chances we have been creating. He's also offside so much and breaks up a lot of our attacking play with one touch football that sometimes just isn't on.

Having said that he can do exceptional things. I think he just came to the club at the wrong time. If he had come into a settled side playing good football I think he could have been an exceptional player for us.

See it from a mile off.

The manager can **** off next year and can take his midfield with him. I don't care if Kenny is a club legend, you aren't serving that **** up to me next season.

You need to show a bit more respect. I think everybody was angry with that game and it was obvious that Kenny's substitutions or lack of them lost us that game but the man is beyond legendary status and what he has done for this club both on and off the field means nobody has the right to talk about him like that. Say he got it wrong, have a go at tactics whatever you want nobody is beyond criticism but show some respect. And when you say serving it up to you he's not, he's putting that side out there for everyone what makes you think it is just for you?

[VamPook]

[video=youtube_share;ZWRZmrhb5ME]

Funniest moment of the match

[CaptainPlanet]

Skysports player rating has become beyond comical:

http://www.skysports.com/football/user_ratings/0,19768,11065_3409111,00.html

[dking]

You need to show a bit more respect. I think everybody was angry with that game and it was obvious that Kenny's substitutions or lack of them lost us that game but the man is beyond legendary status and what he has done for this club both on and off the field means nobody has the right to talk about him like that. Say he got it wrong, have a go at tactics whatever you want nobody is beyond criticism but show some respect. And when you say serving it up to you he's not, he's putting that side out there for everyone what makes you think it is just for you?

Please can you leave now Kenny?

That okay for you? Respectful enough?

He's not good enough and Carling cup win or not, this season has been an epic failure after the amount of cash that has been *****ed away, but becasue it's Kenny we should be all fluffy about it? Na, not for me, cheers Kenny, thanks for the memories but just **** off.

[Kopite]

Please can you leave now Kenny?

That okay for you? Respectful enough?

He's not good enough and Carling cup win or not, this season has been an epic failure after the amount of cash that has been *****ed away but becasue it's Kenny, we should be all fluffy about it? Na, not for me, cheers Kenny, thanks for the memories but just **** off.

Suppose it is easy to have a big mouth behind a computer screen.

[dking]

Suppose it is easy to have a big mouth behind a computer screen.

I thought this was a forum where everybody gave opinions behind computer screens.

Really not quite sure what you're getting at here. Are you suggesting I wouldn't dare tell LFC fans what I posted to their faces?

[Divinity]

Kenny shouldn't be treated with anymore respect for this current season's league campaign than Hodgson was for last season's.

39 points from 26 games this season

38 points from 26 games last season.

What was done 12 years ago is an absolute irrelevance when it comes to a spectacular failure to improve upon last season's league finish. To put things into perspective, Souness finished 6th in his first full season. Dalglish needs a miracle to match that, let alone better it.

[Kopite]

Kenny shouldn't be treated with anymore respect for this current season's league campaign than Hodgson was for last season's.

39 points from 26 games this season

38 points from 26 games last season.

What was done 12 years ago is an absolute irrelevance when it comes to a spectacular failure to improve upon last season's league finish. To put things into perspective, Souness finished 6th in his first full season. Dalglish needs a miracle to match that, let alone better it.

Yes he should. What has Hodgson ever done for this club. So we should ignore the fact that Dalglish is one of out most decorated ever players and all the things he has done off the field too?

And yes I am suggesting that . I'd give you my Sunderland match ticket and place on a coach if I could get on and watch you say exactly what you wrote earlier and see what happens.

[CaptainPlanet]

I'm enjoying a retrospective look at last seasons thread where I got riducled by half the posters for saying that I thought Carroll would be about as good as Crouch.

Apparently I had no idea about football, clearly had never seen him play, and Carroll wasn't bought to be a substitute or a £35m battering ram because Kenny doesn't play that way and Commoli isn't that stupid.

[dking]

Yes he should. What has Hodgson ever done for this club. So we should ignore the fact that Dalglish is one of out most decorated ever players and all the things he has done off the field too?

And yes I am suggesting that . I'd give you my Sunderland match ticket and place on a coach if I could get on and watch you say exactly what you wrote earlier and see what happens.

You'd like to see people get beaten up because of their opinions, by a bunch of idiotic (I've dealt with the neanderthal Sunderland fans before) apes ?

I guess you'd like that to happen to me as well because Kenny needs to leave and I'm not treating him with kid gloves. Hell, anybody who has a different opinion should get beaten up by idiots, right?

Grow up, kid, and stop embarrasing yourself.

By the way, I completely agree with Div.

[benkeat]

Kenny shouldn't be treated with anymore respect for this current season's league campaign than Hodgson was for last season's.

39 points from 26 games this season

38 points from 26 games last season.

What was done 12 years ago is an absolute irrelevance when it comes to a spectacular failure to improve upon last season's league finish. To put things into perspective, Souness finished 6th in his first full season. Dalglish needs a miracle to match that, let alone better it.

Yeah but in life we don't just base our opinions on people on what they are doing right now do we? We take all sorts of other factors into account. Kenny Dalglish deserves an infinite amount more respect than Roy Hodgson. Even if we take this and last season in isolation, that's still the case. We attack more, the manager isn't some defeatist, negative **** who doesn't realise the size of the club he is managing, he won a trophy last week and we're generally a better side.

I'm not for one minute suggesting he's doing a great job. I just think he's a manager who's made some improvements, but can't take us to the next level. Rather than some negative old owl who muddled his way from day to day seeing who he could offend and dragging us backwards at an alarming rate.

I still maintain what I said a few weeks ago. A lot of good is in place here. We just need one or two players to take us up a notch. You see this exact scenario so much as sides grow. They solidify the defence, they start playing some lovely stuff, they just don't have that extra quality or ruthless streak that only a couple of really top signings can bridge.

I don't think Kenny is the right man to take us that step but Hodgson was never in the position where we we're just 'struggling to make the next step', he was dragging us backwards in every department. Defensive **** ups, toothless attack, dour, negative football and the entire expectation level of the club being systematically and deliberately lowered.

It's not even a comparison. To suggest they deserve similar levels of respect is absolutely diabolical.

[CaptainPlanet]

Next he'll be saying we aren't real fans because we weren't born within 10 feet of the stadium.

[benkeat]

So many points this season have been dropped because of an inability to finish teams off, despite clearly being the better side. That's not good enough, I agree.

But last season we were dropping points to Blackpool and the like and absolutely fully deserving to do so, as they were dominating the ball.

Neither are good enough but one sticks in the throat a whole lot more.

[LRJ]

Imagine if we had the old in-form Torres in this team, would be unreal.

[CaptainPlanet]

We'd still be rubbish at taking freekick, corners and penalties.

[LRJ]

We should sign somebody who's got a brilliant reputation for taking all 3 of those, oh wait

[Divinity]

Yes he should. What has Hodgson ever done for this club. So we should ignore the fact that Dalglish is one of out most decorated ever players and all the things he has done off the field too?

And yes I am suggesting that . I'd give you my Sunderland match ticket and place on a coach if I could get on and watch you say exactly what you wrote earlier and see what happens.

Ahahahaha, I love how you wrote the same thing you wrote under your last username. And again, what happened 12-25 years ago is a ****ing irrelevance to now. It's not making our team better because he won a few things before you can remember him playing.

[DeafParrot]

I'm enjoying a retrospective look at last seasons thread where I got riducled by half the posters for saying that I thought Carroll would be about as good as Crouch.

Apparently I had no idea about football, clearly had never seen him play, and Carroll wasn't bought to be a substitute or a £35m battering ram because Kenny doesn't play that way and Commoli isn't that stupid.

I ridiculed you for suggesting he'd ever be as good as Crouch iirc

Would have Big Pete back tomorrow.

[DeafParrot]

aw man, AVB sacked. Will be weird seeing Rafa in charge there. Don't think I can bare it.

Edit: Oh, Di Matteo in charge til the end of the season. THE DREAM IS STILL ALIVE.

[LRJ]

aw man, AVB sacked. Will be weird seeing Rafa in charge there. Don't think I can bare it.

Edit: Oh, Di Matteo in charge til the end of the season. THE DREAM IS STILL ALIVE.

Rafa clearly holding out til the end of the season to see if we'll have him before he decides

[why?]

Rafa already turned it down last week according to some sources. Chelsea that is.

[CaptainPlanet]

Rafa coming back is seeming more and more likely.

[bennybenji]

I actually completely agree with you. I lean towards selling him myself. He always seems a second away from doing something stupid which will end in another ban. He hasn't exactly been in impressive goal scoring form considering the chances we have been creating. He's also offside so much and breaks up a lot of our attacking play with one touch football that sometimes just isn't on.

Having said that he can do exceptional things. I think he just came to the club at the wrong time. If he had come into a settled side playing good football I think he could have been an exceptional player for us.

You need to show a bit more respect. I think everybody was angry with that game and it was obvious that Kenny's substitutions or lack of them lost us that game but the man is beyond legendary status and what he has done for this club both on and off the field means nobody has the right to talk about him like that. Say he got it wrong, have a go at tactics whatever you want nobody is beyond criticism but show some respect. And when you say serving it up to you he's not, he's putting that side out there for everyone what makes you think it is just for you?

This sort of thing is a concern to me. When he was caretaker manager last season Kenny alway said he would step down if the right man could be found. Will he do the same for the good of the club now that he has a contract? If not, how well will the owners sacking kenny go down with certain sections of the supporters?

[dan99]

If he goes back to how he was in the first few seasons, and not the complete and utter idiot he was with us in his last season & at Inter, I can see it working.

[benkeat]

This sort of thing is a concern to me. When he was caretaker manager last season Kenny alway said he would step down if the right man could be found. Will he do the same for the good of the club now that he has a contract? If not, how well will the owners sacking kenny go down with certain sections of the supporters?

It'll be fine. They'll have a chat and come to a lovely mutual agreement that it's not working. Nice friendly press conference when we thank him for the progress he has made and Kenny wishes the new man well saying he gave it his best shot and hopes he is handing the club over in better shape than he found it. Says he is always available to help the club in any way they see fit.

Really inevitable I think. Fans will accept it as he's clearly not the man for the job.

[CaptainPlanet]

It'll be fine. They'll have a chat and come to a lovely mutual agreement that it's not working. Nice friendly press conference when we thank him for the progress he has made and Kenny wishes the new man well saying he gave it his best shot and hopes he is handing the club over in better shape than he found it. Says he is always available to help the club in any way they see fit.

Really inevitable I think. Fans will accept it as he's clearly not the man for the job.

Indeed, there's really no reason Kenny can't leave the club with dignity having helped steady the ship after a transitional phase. He only had a two year contract anyway didn't he?

Unless we do a Chelsea and sack him before the season is finished and stick Sammy Lee in charge.

[DeafParrot]

I'm actually worried that we'll win the FA Cup aswell. Is there really any way Kenny can leave after winning a cup double?

[bennybenji]

It'll be fine. They'll have a chat and come to a lovely mutual agreement that it's not working. Nice friendly press conference when we thank him for the progress he has made and Kenny wishes the new man well saying he gave it his best shot and hopes he is handing the club over in better shape than he found it. Says he is always available to help the club in any way they see fit.

Really inevitable I think. Fans will accept it as he's clearly not the man for the job.

yeah i guess you are right. Just has the opportunity to cause immense problems if he doesnt want to leave but as he loves the club i'm sure he will go quietly if necessary. Definitely deserved his chance this season but unless there is some sort of massive turnaround it hasn't really worked out.

[benkeat]

I think that's a bit of a ridiculous attitude to have. Obviously want us to win the FA Cup as winning two cups in a season is pretty great?

If it comes down to it and he does keep his job i'm fairly sure lessons will be learnt from last summer's dealings. The net will have to be cast further afield than the North of England. We're only a couple of really good attackers away from being a side able to compete for the top 4. It's not like Kenny is putting a walking disaster of a team on the pitch every week and we're being continually turned over?

A top striker and one or two ins and outs in midfield and things look up.

[CaptainPlanet]

I'm actually worried that we'll win the FA Cup aswell. Is there really any way Kenny can leave after winning a cup double?

To be honest if we could finish 5th (Beating either Chelsea/Arsenal and a good Newcastle), be back in Europe and win two domestic cups. It would be hard to say that he shouldn't be given another year.

[benkeat]

Totally agree. Just wanting the club to fail for the sake of it that. Winning two cups would be a fantastic achievement. The league form hasn't been good enough but it's easy to forget that there used to be days when one season into a managers reign was seen as early days.

[DeafParrot]

I'm not saying I want us to fail. I just think short term success may end up hindering our long term goals, which is clearly to be back in the Champions League and challenging for the title.

You've just said yourself that you want Kenny to leave at the end of the season aswell. I just don't see a way that will happen if we win the FA Cup, even with our league form being beyond awful.

Can't see us finishing 5th at all btw. Beginning to look down the league at the likes of Norwich and Stoke closing on us.

[bennybenji]

I think the issue with the league position is how close we come to being fourth. If we finish 7th but have improved our points tally and are 3 points off the 4th spot (with the winning of the league cup and potentially an FA Cup) then fine - give him more time. At the moment we aren't even close to 4th, which is disappointing especially with how erratic both Arsenal and Chelsea have been this season

[benkeat]

As things currently stand it's hard to argue he's the man for us, but if the season ends and we've won 2 of the 3 domestic trophies you'd have to concede that he's doing more than a tad right and therefore deserves a chance to try and get us playing in the league like he did at the back end of last season, again.

As I say, find it hard to believe he'd be as bad in the market as he was last summer

[DeafParrot]

Watching the Fulham game and its amazing what they've done with a budget so much smaller than ours. Their front 5 are fantastic, they've just picked up Mohammadou Diarra on a free and their defence is solid. They really are a great team atm.

Makes our signings look even worse.

[benkeat]

It's easy to forget that we've also signed Enrique, Suarez, Bellamy and Coates to be fair. Leaning towards Henderson coming good too. Only really Carroll and Downing who have been total failures thus far.

Just so happens they cost £55m haha.

[CaptainPlanet]

Only really Carroll and Downing who have been total failures thus far.

Just so happens they cost £55m haha.

And Adam

[Select_screen_name:]

Jordan 'Mr. Safe' Henderson needs to improve as well. People can say he's been good until they're blue in the face, but he almost never produces anything for us towards winning a game of football.

Benitez is probably nailed on now. He knows he can have the job back if he wants it. Regardless if we do a double or not, because the league form is simply not good enough.

[benkeat]

I don't think we'd have Benitez back. The board have probably heard all sorts about what a demanding and prickly manager he was. Ideally they'd see that for what it is- a manager with unrelentingly high standards for his club. But the more likely outcome is they'll view him as a pain in the arse. Plus, he'd lost that dressing room and a lot of them are still there.

Maybe in a few years when more water has gone under the bridge.

Adam for £6.5m hasn't been a total disaster. Peanuts in the scheme of things and has probably turned in as many acceptable performances as not. Has suffered crazily from Lucas not being there to do his leg work.

Henderson looks good but I agree, he actually hides from the ball at times. Sandwiches himself between opposition players when he needs to be showing for the ball.