chopper99 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 If I had my way you, and anyone else who posted in that manner, would get an infaction. Not necessary - discuss the topic, not the other users posting styles. Whether you're right or wrong, it's not relevant. Apoogies for making you my example. Fair enough, personal insults have no place on the forum I accept that. Sometimes frustration just gets the better of me I'm afraid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Wakeford Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 We don't ban criticism of the game if it constructive and coherent. Random rants get closed down because they offer nothing to the boards and give us nothing to work with. It also doesn't produce good discussion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Well i was banned for critisising the way the mods work, it just seems your only allowed one opinion, and that is that the games great, (i do love the game, not the flaws in it tho) anything else and the thread gets closed!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chopper99 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 You're completely wrong Brayley, some of us who have been here a long time have also been some of the harshest critics of the game in that time. I myself have never had a ban or infraction for criticising areas of the game that I feel could be improved. But as has been said, ranting with no evidence or even explaination of why you feel there is a problem is not welcome, as it adds nothing and helps no one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt ex SEGA Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 so its where i say it? Where am i supposed to bring up the issue of the mods banning things they dont like hearing? (namely that the game is flawed?) Im not looking to get banned again, just want to know? If you have issues with moderation, you should mail the general mods list for a review - mods at sigames dot com. Well i was banned for critisising the way the mods work, it just seems your only allowed one opinion, and that is that the games great, (i do love the game, not the flaws in it tho) anything else and the thread gets closed!!!!! Utter nonsense. There are numerous threads where the poster takes time to iterate their issues with the game and to help us solve them. If you write coherently and sensibly you'll get further support from the community which assists us in identifying problems. If you rant, you encourage further abuse from those who disagree with you - and to no constructive purpose. It doesn't help the game get better, and it doesn't help the community. Epic fail. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashOverride Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 If that was the case Brayley this thread would have been closed long ago. Opinions are welcomed by one and all as long as they are contstuctive. "I think the game is cheating" cause I lost loads of games isnt (im not saying you posted that). A paragraph or two explaining and justifying what you think is wrong with the game isnt likely to get closed as it opens up for discussion from other users. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 What about the people who DO agree with me? They dont get the chance to have their say because the thread is closed immediatly!!!! My 'rant' was that the people who dont agree with things in the game were not given the chance to have thier say!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Girondins Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 What about the people who DO agree with me? They dont get the chance to have their say because the thread is closed immediatly!!!! My 'rant' was that the people who dont agree with things in the game were not given the chance to have thier say!! Now you are just trolling. Are you even real or just an alt? If you want to discuss this, start a thread in the off topic forum - or are you worried you won't attract enough dissent there? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 what? Im just TRYING to have my say! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Girondins Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 what? Im just TRYING to have my say! You aren't saying anything. I actually agreed with you initially, but you protest too much mate. Numbers up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chopper99 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Again you're missing the point Brayley. Your rant is incorrect because plenty of people get the chance to have their say, the only threads closed are the pointless ones that do not generate a decent discussion or do not provide any kind of reasoning as to why the person thinks the game is good or bad. The same goes for pointless threads praising the game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashOverride Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Lets try the simple approach. Its not what you say, its the way that you say it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Wakeford Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 What about the people who DO agree with me? They dont get the chance to have their say because the thread is closed immediatly!!!! My 'rant' was that the people who dont agree with things in the game were not given the chance to have thier say!! But that's not true, so there's no point in having that thread open. Please stop going round in circles, everyone is allowed to say what they want about the game provided they do so sensibly. I don't think we need to tell you this again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 But your all missing my point, i was saying the way the FORUMS are run isnt right! Its the mods way or thats it, u agree or get banned!!! Which i can quite clearly see is going to happen to me any second now just to prove my point! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Wakeford Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 But your all missing my point, i was saying the way the FORUMS are run isnt right! Its the mods way or thats it, u agree or get banned!!! Which i can quite clearly see is going to happen to me any second now just to prove my point! It might happen to you because you won't accept what we're telling you and continuously pushing a viewpoint that has no ground in reality or fact. You don't have to agree with anything we say, but you do have to act in the correct manner. Now please, can we leave this particular incident alone now? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Girondins Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 But your all missing my point, i was saying the way the FORUMS are run isnt right! Its the mods way or thats it, u agree or get banned!!! Which i can quite clearly see is going to happen to me any second now just to prove my point! Which you have been blatantly trying to provoke for like 20 mins. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chopper99 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 But your all missing my point, i was saying the way the FORUMS are run isnt right! Its the mods way or thats it, u agree or get banned!!! Which i can quite clearly see is going to happen to me any second now just to prove my point! Again, if that were true half of the people in this thread would have been banned. Have you actually been following what we've been discussing? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbsoluteGenius Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Just think of the moderators like they are the police i.e. you do as you're told or you are removed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI Staff Ter Posted January 14, 2009 SI Staff Share Posted January 14, 2009 Nobody gets banned for criticising the game. Rants are not welcome and they serve no purpose and don't help to make the game better. Constructive criticism is always welcome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavnoble Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I'm not on here that often these days as I don't have the time anymore to spend reading repetitive threads but aside from the release weekend, things have been nowhere near as bad as with some previous games. Anyone who thinks this year is bad should have been on here in the days and weeks after CM4 came out - now that was a bad release! I agree with everyone in here who has said that two of the main issues are in the same bugs cropping in game in game out. Any big that has been in more than two consecutive versions of the game must be treated as a priority fix for FM 2010 just to finally get rid of it. I also agree that the communication between SI and the forum members is not what it was, but the way in which the forum has gone downhill over the past couple of years is perhaps the reason behind that? All games need hype in order to entice customers to buy them but sometimes SI have been guilty at overhyping certain features (not just in FM 2009 but in previous releases as well), which means that when the customer finally gets their hands on the product it will inevitably disappoint some sections of the community. Getting the right balance between honesty and hype is difficult but a little less hyperbole would go a long way to keeping expectations at a manageable level. For my money. despite its faults, FM 2009 has been a relatively enjoyable gaming experience. For its faults, the 3D match view has made playing the game more enjoyable for me, and I am prepared to overlook the glitches in it for the fun I have had with it so far. Yes, the game is not perfect and there are still large issues that spoil the game somewhat, but on the whole it depends on the individual as to whether you are prepared to overlook those until they can be sorted in favour of the game's good points - and there are many of these to be found. (I suppose it also depends on the country you are plaing in your game as well?) No matter what the absolute bottom line is that SI will continue to put out games every year because the seasonal nature of football demands it and despite their efforts there are people that will never be happy. As the saying goes you can't please all of the people of the time. I hope the beta testers chosen for this year's game do a good job and that the faults they pick up on will be fixed before release. People moaning about the patch being out on release date seem to forget that this has been pretty much the way of things with every SI release (with one or two exceptions) and I am sure that will continue in the future as well. My biggest beef with FM 2009 was the activation issue and I hope this will not be repeated in the future as it was totally unacceptable to not be able to play for the game for nearly 12 hours after buying it - and I was one of the lucky ones in this regard! As ever though, we as a customer have a choice about whether or not we buy the game. No one ever forces us to part with the money and for some years I have maintained that if SI want my cash they have to impress me with the demo. If that doesn't grab me then I don't buy the full game. If others did the same rather than just blindly handing over the cash then it would be a start. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonBlade Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 But your all missing my point, i was saying the way the FORUMS are run isnt right! Its the mods way or thats it The internet isn't a democracy. Get used to it now, or be prepared for a lifetime of disappointment. Can we get back on topic now? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewieGriffin Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I think the bottom line to the OP's question is you can't stop the negativity in the forum. More often than not if someone does not have a problem, they will not post. If someone does have a problem they will post multiple times, therefore the forum looks negative. It would be interesting to see how many users complain as a percentage of sales. I think it is probably in the region of about 10%. I may be mistaken, but the jist of this is that if you have a problem you complain, if you don't you generally say nothing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainPlanet Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Slight self pimp, but I've noticed a lot less repeated questions since the FAQ sticky has been there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Girondins Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Slight self pimp, but I've noticed a lot less repeated questions since the FAQ sticky has been there. Gonna take confusion .. down to zero .. :thup: Damn good idea mate. I've been meaning to put the manager profile pic issue/solution on there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Wakeford Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Slight self pimp, but I've noticed a lot less repeated questions since the FAQ sticky has been there. Yeah, thanks for doing that, it's been a useful help. Also noticed that the boards in general seem a bit quieter now that Christmas/New Year have gone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPompey Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Its too easy to sell players - They can be sold for inflated prices - I've bugged this some time ago Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Girondins Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Yeah, thanks for doing that, it's been a useful help.Also noticed that the boards in general seem a bit quieter now that Christmas/New Year have gone. Haven't seen a laptop thread in at least 20 minutes! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwfan Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I got a infraction for saying every time anyone posts something bad about the game on the forums the thread gets shut down, then 2 seconds later that thread got shut down!! so i made the point that i was clearly being proved right, that got closed and i was banned!!!!! You were banned because of the huge number of complaints other forum members made about your posts, which is clear in your infraction history. You refused to stop posting the same thing time and time again, despite my warning, so I had no option. You have the right to post your opinion, but if it upsets a significant number of members, as yours did, their opinion overrides yours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 So people complained that my opinion was NOT the same as theirs (and yours)? It just dosent seem right to me! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Wakeford Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 So people complained that my opinion was NOT the same as theirs (and yours)? It just dosent seem right to me! It sounds more like the complaints alerted mods to you, who then spoke to you and asked you to stop doing something. You then didn't obey this request, thereby forcing the mods to take action. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Girondins Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Does the old Yellow Card thing still work? That was great - you got a clear message about your conduct with no hard feelings and a reprieve attached. Not suggesting anything btw. Just popped into my head with all this talk of bans. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwfan Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 So people complained that my opinion was NOT the same as theirs (and yours)? It just dosent seem right to me! People complained that you were continuously cluttering up the forums with repetitive posts that they found incredibly irritating. It wasn't what you had to say, it was how you said it and how many times you repeated it, despite being asked to stop. Once again, you seem to be in the same pattern. I suggest you stop posting about this now. There is no reason to review your ban as it wasn't for the reasons you are suggesting and has no relevance at all to the discussion Nomis07 has initiated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Nobody spoke to me, my thread was closed, which obviously cracked me up! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 ok, no more posts here from me! lol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
djwilko6 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Nobody spoke to me, my thread was closed, which obviously cracked me up! Please stop before another decent, adult discussion is closed. You have been told over and over by regular users, mods and SI staff the reason why your threads were closed, and you arent accepting that, which ironicly is what you're accusing the mods of doing to you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
glamdring Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I was just thinking, the Radio 5 Live program '606' used to have (I haven't listened to it for some 4 or 5 years so I have no idea if it still does) a thing called the "rant line" where people could phone up and basically just leave a rant and then the best ones got selected to be aired. We should have a forum like that Mind you, I imagine moderators wouldn't be too pleased with having to moderate such a forum and it would be a mostly write-only forum apart from a few people who suddenly have the urge to go and read nothing but rants! As far as general moderation of this forum goes I've rarely had any problem with how it is done. It's slightly frustrating when a good thread gets closed just because it heads slightly off topic with some light-hearted discussion when 90+% of the rest of the forum is full of complaining threads, repeat threads or generally ill-constructed threads, but I can understand why that is. If threads are allowed to just wander off topic into a dialogue between two individuals it can get out of hand. I rarely come in here any more though so I guess I'm not too concerned by what state this forum gets into now - it's for other people to consider. It would be nice though to have something like the kind of discipline we have over in FMS here in GD though, but I guess it is a certain kind of poster who browses FMS because of its remit and apart from the few odd idiots whose threads get rapidly closed everyone respects each other enough to not clutter up people's threads. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Girondins Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I was just thinking, the Radio 5 Live program '606' used to have (I haven't listened to it for some 4 or 5 years so I have no idea if it still does) a thing called the "rant line" where people could phone up and basically just leave a rant and then the best ones got selected to be aired.We should have a forum like that I remember that .. produced some absolute crackers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daley Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Well I thought that I might take a stab at getting what started out as a very interesting OP which asked some decent questions and made a couple of very good points back on track. So, why have there been a number of threads which have said that FM09 is the worst version yet or is bug riddled etc? IMO it is down to a number of things, firstly I think that some players’ expectations are far too high. I think that there are issues with the ME, transfer system and the tactical importance of the game. However I also believe that none of the above make the game anywhere near unplayable, they make it frustrating at times and certainly harder than previous versions but not unplayable. The problem is that, as is quite rightly pointed out in the OP the hype surrounding the game (it's the same for every version) is taken (rightly or wrongly depends on your opinion) too literally by the fans and they expect a flawless game. Unfortunately it is not realistic to expect SI or SEGA not to hype things up as they are in business and need to sell games and no game is flawless, I feel that if we, as customers were a little more level-headed in our expectations then I think we would see that the claims made by SI & SEGA aren't too far wide of the mark. Ask yourself a couple of questions: Is the ME broken? I believe that most would say no but they would probably say something like: "3D doesn't really represent a flowing game". I agree with that but there are obvious reasons IMO, the reasons are that the 3D match only has a limited number of animations and that along with the fact that it has problems keeping up with the speed at which the game is being processed make it look jerky and result in apparently ridiculous scenario's such as a defender/keeper dwelling on the ball for an hour (slight exaggeration!) whilst the AI's player runs the length of the pitch, nicks the ball and scores! Frustrating yes but I bet if that had been experienced in commentary only we would have had no issue! 2nd, is the transfer system better? IMO yes, it's certainly not perfect but we can now at least haggle slightly and can sell some players. I think that the major issue from SI & SEGA's perspective was the registration problems, as far as I am aware both SI & SEGA have held their hands up to this and acknowledged the issues. I know a lot of people have an issue with DRM (I personally don't, but then I probably don't really understand it enough to make an informed decision!) so for now lets leave that to one side. The biggest issues have been expectations but I also believe that there could be much more communication from SI & SEGA to the forums. I understand that they are continually working either on this version or the next on but communication is the key to all good relationships no matter what type or level. Apologies for the long post! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig[EVE] Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I didn't really want to make a long post about this but i probably will end up doing. Now i know games companies aren't alike but SI could do well by taking a look at the way Blizzard deals with its customers, more specifically it's WoW customers. Now for those that don't know what WoW is, it's an MMO game played by millions of people. It has lots of patches, lots of content upgrades and lots of people complaining and moaning about how the game balence is wrong, it's programmed by idiots and A is better than B and that's so unfair. Within the last year, a poster has appeared on the forums called Ghostcrawler who is the lead designer for WoW. What has happened is now we know about what the designers are thinking and why certain changes are happening. This gives the community knowledge of where the game is going to. There are still the moaners and whiners but his appearence in a thread usually has something interesting about the game or answers a point raised by someone. He actually wrote this on the forums yesterday about Feedback on the forums: *wall of text imcoming* I am a game designer, and specifically I am the lead systems designer for WoW. Game designers are not artists or programmers, but we use the tools developed by the programmers and the assets created by the artists to get content into the game. Programmers make the game run, artists make it beautiful, but it is the designer's job to make it fun. I think a lot of players mistake me for a CM [community moderator] because I tend to post a lot more than most WoW designers. Mostly, I just don't sleep so it lets me play WoW, work on it during the day and still have time to post. Game balance is one of the most controversial aspects of any multiplayer game, and I benefit from being able to engage the community directly. Systems design specifically is everything that is not level, story, quest or encounter design. My team handles everything from classes to mechanics to items to trade skills to achievements to UI design, and that includes the game balance. I do want to stress that we are a team. We come to a consensus on every major change to the game. I put enormous faith in the team to make the right call and keep any of us individually from doing something stupid. Blizzard is in a position to be able to attract and retain the best talent available in this industry. Many of them are much better game designers than I will ever be. Mostly I try and stay out of their way. A great many of them read the forums. Everything you type is seen by silent blues [blizzard employees]. I see people reading the forums when I drop by their office. We talk about what they have read all the time. These guys care passionately about doing the right thing and making the game as good as they can. Your opinion is extremely important to them. Just keep that in mind every time you post He makes a good point worth remembering, i'm sure that people at SI want to make the best game possible and they're not just throwing out what they've got when the date comes around and there may be many SI employees reading each post but not replying to them. I'd like to see SI to have a version of this person. Someone who can come onto the forums and talk about the match engine, the transfer module, regens and the ideas behind why they work like they do, or where they're looking at taking them in the future. Read this recent article on it and make up your own minds whether SI could benefit from looking at this community model. http://www.wowinsider.com/2009/01/12/the-ghostcrawler-experiment/ I'm not saying it's perfect, but i think it's a lot better than what we have here where it feels half the time it's a constant battle between everyone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
djwilko6 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I agree with you to an extent Craig, and an MMO I play has a similar kind of thing, but its more than 1 developer that comes and posts (Lord of the Rings Online, Turbine's own forum, if you're interested). In my opinion tho there is one major difference, and that is the game genre, by default games like WoW and LotRO are constantly evolving and improving, things get added and taken away, so they HAVE to keep in touch with the community. LoTR for example have regular "free" updates throughout the year, aswell as a major expansion that has just come out, whereas companies like SI only have 1 release a year and patches in the months after the initial release. A better comparison in my opinion would be similar companies that release yearly, like EA or Konami, both who fail badly in the Customer Service department, only releasing info that they feel is important and very rarely interact with the community. As I mentioned earlier, I think maybe the community has become complacent to the amount of input we used to have from SI, but I think they are more careful in what threads they post in now, and as a result posts are up to the number they used to be, but they are still here. People like Ter, PaulC and around new releases Miles aswell as Matt from SEGA, which was a welcome surprise in itself I think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig[EVE] Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I agree with you to an extent Craig, and an MMO I play has a similar kind of thing, but its more than 1 developer that comes and posts (Lord of the Rings Online, Turbine's own forum, if you're interested).In my opinion tho there is one major difference, and that is the game genre, by default games like WoW and LotRO are constantly evolving and improving, things get added and taken away, so they HAVE to keep in touch with the community. A better comparison in my opinion would be similar companies that release yearly, like EA or Konami, both who fail badly in the Customer Service department, only releasing info that they feel is important and very rarely interact with the community. I agree they are different and that an MMO does constantly evolve, but i wouldn't compaire forum styles with Konami or EA as it depends what SI's overall aim with the forums is. Is it a home for people just to talk about the game with little or no interaction with the company (like a fan site)? A place to report bugs? Or a place where they can interact with the consumer base to fine tune the game to make it the best it can be? Marc Vaughan used to talk a lot about FM before the moved to the handheld version and as far as i knew he was a programmer, so when he spoke a lot of people listened as he was part of the coding team so it felt like his words carried more weight. Personally i just think the forums could do with some honest discussion on what's currently being thought about with the game and less reactionary if possible. For example the transfer module i've seen talked out in great lengths in terms of what's right with it and what's wrong. It would be nice to see some sort of pre-release thread commenting on what they're thinking and what's happening - rather than the wait and see that we sometimes think. Paul's a good example on this as his injury threads go along this line. From memory it was something like: I don't think the number of injuries is a problem but we'll continue to monitor this and please give us examples. Something similar for something as large as the transfer module would be nice. Example: In the patch 9.02 we adjusted transfers to make it harder for teams to sell off players for large sums of money easily in the first season. On further feedback we're still not happy with this and think it's now too hard to sell players and we're still seeing large world transfers for un-realistic players. In 9.03 we will be tuneing the players ability to sell to make it slightly easier and we will be tuneing down the high fees you're seeing at the moment. Contary to feedback we're happy with loans and they way they are functioning and won't change this for the next patch. I think describing things like this would reduce the amount of complaints (or at least focus them in one place) and allow players to know what to expect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
atonement Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 football manager deals in player invelopment its not like any other game i know of really, you invest a lot of time and a lot of effort in playing the game because theres nothing like that buzz of signing that perfect player for your team or getting a custom made tactic right so when youve been playing for a while and you realise your attendances are dropping even though you are performing better, the confidence of the fans doesnt reflect player performance, your strikers ratings are reflective of how theyre actually playing, wonderkids are undervalued by the AI which effectively makes success in long term games hollow... sure its playable, but the sort of game player football manager attracts, it just doesnt do to be waiting for months for a patch to make the game 'complete' i think most people love the game but the last few releases just havnt really been good enough pre-patch Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
djwilko6 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 ;2504897']I think describing things like this would reduce the amount of complaints (or at least focus them in one place) and allow players to know what to expect. I agree completely. What I ment with the comparison with EA or Konami wasnt what they wanted the forums to be, but a more level playing field in comparison of genre and annual releases. SI for example don't have to release patches for the little bugs, but they do, whereas EA/Konami only release a patch if it makes the game "unplayable". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxphere Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Well, I must say that I am no longer a teenager (and I don't regret that, btw) and am here for quite a while. I believe many of the points stated here are valid: it seems - to me - that this version, yes, have far more complaints than the others, that some things within the game are: a)dumb-easy or b) follow the chaos theory and cant be managed. Other than that, yes, I truly believe that this year, Sega/SI are far more arrogant in presenting the game as a "much better thing than ever". But it is not. So, that said, certainly the forum needs to be moderated. I had forums under my management myself and am completely aware of the existence of people with absolutely no life who are only dedicated to express their need of medical mental treatment in forums, bothering someone else. But many of the uneasy criticism I saw are quite valid. For example, as some others complain about the 3D view,it seems nice to me, but I have a VERY strong machine which allows it to work. Maybe in regular machines it is unbearable. However, the tactics system seems each time less manageable and training schwedules/coaches simply seem useless, as you cannot really interact. And the transfer system continues a problem. So, I hope Sega understands what SI needs which is treating differently this fanbase because these are not regular customers. We all feel something for the game as we feel it for our team. It allows you Sega/SI to have someone standing by you when needed but demands special attention. Yes, we are freaks (some more, some less) somehow...then, hopefully FM10 have a digital Mac version from day 1 and I can put a holding midfielder to work defensively without make him look like a cone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainPlanet Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 More information may seem better to the more mature members of the community, but can really open up a can of worms in general. If they say they are looking at improving one aspect of the game, you end up with lots of posts around that - given the community on here as it is, any bits of information that are given from official sources are often jumped upon and quoted to death. I don't know if this is a reason why it isn't done, if so I can see the point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxphere Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 More information may seem better to the more mature members of the community, but can really open up a can of worms in general.If they say they are looking at improving one aspect of the game, you end up with lots of posts around that - given the community on here as it is, any bits of information that are given from official sources are often jumped upon and quoted to death. I don't know if this is a reason why it isn't done, if so I can see the point. yes, I tend to believe the really useful threads end up with much much more feedback as this community, in general, plays a positive role. Anyway, I feel SI more distant than it was a few years ago. It is normal, as bigger companies take mor time. However, the peculiarities of this community - the good ones and the bad ones - plays a role in this development. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomHAVFC Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Tbh, all of you people having a crack at the mods, put yourselves in their shoes. They come home from work or whatever they do and all they get is people arguing, being abusive/offensive, criticising the game without any reason why and asking questions that have already been answered hundreds of times. You can see why they get annoyed and hand out warnings and infractions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
daylight Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Well to answer the OP question,it is a forum and not a fansite so there will always be 2 side's to alot of topic's. The thing that gets under my skin as the number of poster's that will jump on and start out negative,maybe they cant get there game registered etc but instead of searching or asking nicely they start a post with "this game sux,i want my money back"...the same person either gets a ban(rightly so if he carries it on)or gets the answer how to sort it....or indeed both A mods life for the most part is a thankless task,most mods are unpaid and have a fulltime job/family/whatever to contend with as well as keeping this forum as family friendly as possible...I can give links to at least 4 other game forums were the mods dont care and I kid you not there is so much drama going on you wish you had brought your popcorn. The mods do a good job here,maybe sometimes the "there is already a thread about this use search" is a bit abrupt for newer user's and maybe a link to the so called thread would be nice,then again maybe I am just searching for a fault so I dont come over all mod loving Not much can be down to improve this forum for next year or the year after...the mods do a good job and it is up to the poster's to back that up,unfortunatly there are always disruptive people on forums if there wasnt we wouldnt need mods now would we Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Wright\'s Champion Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 big overhauls and great new features are all well and good and are, every so often, vital in keeping the series alive as people would get bored if it became stagnant. However, what would really keep me happy is if for a year or two, no big changes were made but instead, what features are already on the game were tweaked so that they offer the maximum enjoyment. Things like the 3d engine and media interaction should be improved upon before trying to add any major new features imo. That would keep me very happy The other thing that would keep me happy would be for an FM game to come out and be relatively bug free. I realise it is impossible to make a fully bug free game of this sort, but sometimes there are huge bugs that you think must surely have been spotted at the testing stage (i remember the bug a couple of years back that meant if you left your club you never got another job, you could only get another job if you were still in employment). There have been numerous other bugs (even slightly smaller things like rooney always being suspended for england and the bug that meant if you overachieved in your first season you were never offered a contract extension). Things like this absolutely wreck the game for many people when it is released and it makes you feel a bit as if you are being used in the place of testers- reporting the faults so SI can get out a patch. I'm sure this isnt the case, but it would be brilliant to come on here after a release to read that, a few minor issues aside, the game works. As it is, i am really enjoying FM09 and am very pleased that SI continue to make this great game that has had me addicted for the best part of 15 years but this is the first year when i didnt buy it on the day of release- i waited until christmas because i thought "there isnt really much point getting it until the second patch comes out and it is playable". This tactic worked for me this year, but next year i hope i can buy it straight away again and play it straight out of the box as i can with other games that i love such as ISS/ Pro Evo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamianJMcGrath Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I'm just going to say 1 thing to this thread, and I havent read through the whole thing so apologies for my thoughts are repetitive, but my logic is this: If you ask people on this forum about CM01/02, they will say it's a great game and they loved playing it. I even saw a post in reference to a very old game called Tracksuit Manager and people saying they loved it. This is not nostalgia. This is people accepting a game's faults (for example, CM01/02 had no 3D pitch, and there was no media interaction etc), but loving it because it worked well. I really don't believe games like FM05/06, and maybe even FM09 will be looked back on with much affection, because I really don't believe it does work well. It might have a billion fancy bells and whistles but is it as playable and fun as CM01/02, and will it be held in as much affection as that game? For FM10 and beyond, I only ask SI one thing: Please, just play the game before releasing it. That's all I want. Imagine you're a fan of football, and a fan of computer games, and play it as if you bought it. Are you happy with it? If the answer is yes, by all means release it. But if you're not happy with any of it, or you're happy to accept some flaws and pass it off as product evolution, then you deserve to lose business. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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