Germany squad is out #DieMannschaft

[Coulthard's Jaw]

 

[The Amazing Dale Watkins]

4 hours ago, Freakiie said:

He's been playing this "3-4-3" that's more of a 2-4-4-0 the entire year, of course he will play it again.

Admittedly, with the way Havertz was instructed to play against Portugal, at least he seems to have understood that having someone that acts like a striker is useful to have around. Only took him... when did Klose retire? 2014? So 7 years, amazing.

He played the first three world cup qualifiers in a 4-3-3 formation. And to be fair, Germany hasn't had a world-class 9 since Klose retired.

[Freakiie]

6 minutes ago, The Amazing Dale Watkins said:

He played the first three world cup qualifiers in a 4-3-3 formation. And to be fair, Germany hasn't had a world-class 9 since Klose retired.

On paper, but all 3 games he already was shoehorning in 3 CDs.

And yes, Germany hasn't had a world class 9 since Klose, but they don't need a world class 9 with the quality the squad has. But instead of playing with a "good enough" 9, Löw has been trying to force a whole bunch of other players that are not strikers into the striker role and it just never properly worked. Look who played the single striker role over the years, Götze, Müller, Werner, Gnabry, all good players, but not a single one that suits the 9 role the way Germany needs them to.

Only exception was when Gómez played for a while, which got us to the semis in 2016, but that never lasted long as Löw constantly kept changing back to a more false nine like role and it never works.

In my opinion you boot out one of the CDs (I mean, Ginter is playing more like an AM than a CD anyway, so he doesn't do anything anyway), shove Volland in there, tell him to just sit on the shoulders of the defenders and let the rest of the team do the work, quality enough. Instead we just see strikers dropping as deep as possible to participate in play and then when the final pass/cross into the box should be played teams realize their striker is nowhere near the box so there's nobody to cross to. Most extreme example is most likely Kane, it's no wonder he doesn't score when he's basically playing like a DLP.

[The Amazing Dale Watkins]

1 hour ago, Freakiie said:

On paper, but all 3 games he already was shoehorning in 3 CDs.

And yes, Germany hasn't had a world class 9 since Klose, but they don't need a world class 9 with the quality the squad has. But instead of playing with a "good enough" 9, Löw has been trying to force a whole bunch of other players that are not strikers into the striker role and it just never properly worked. Look who played the single striker role over the years, Götze, Müller, Werner, Gnabry, all good players, but not a single one that suits the 9 role the way Germany needs them to.

Only exception was when Gómez played for a while, which got us to the semis in 2016, but that never lasted long as Löw constantly kept changing back to a more false nine like role and it never works.

In my opinion you boot out one of the CDs (I mean, Ginter is playing more like an AM than a CD anyway, so he doesn't do anything anyway), shove Volland in there, tell him to just sit on the shoulders of the defenders and let the rest of the team do the work, quality enough. Instead we just see strikers dropping as deep as possible to participate in play and then when the final pass/cross into the box should be played teams realize their striker is nowhere near the box so there's nobody to cross to. Most extreme example is most likely Kane, it's no wonder he doesn't score when he's basically playing like a DLP.

God help us if we have to rely on Volland at the international elite level. Say what you want about the system, but it showed that it works against quality opposition like France and Portugal. Unlike the 4-3-3 where Spain battered us 6-0. Against quality opposition there's no way you can play Hummels as one of two central defenders. We saw what happened when he accidentally had to cover 1 on 1 against Mbappe the other day. Hummels as the middle CB with two pacy defenders on his side however has worked very well and he's contributed plenty of key passes through the middle while challenging the opposing midfielders high up the pitch so defensively this is pretty stable. Up front I'd also pick Gnabry over Volland any day of the week and twice on Sunday. Doesn't matter that it's not his best position. He still scored 16 goals in 24 caps.

 

[Carambau]

Gnabry >>>>>>>>>> Volland

I´d have included Petersen instead of Volland in the squad but who listens to me? 

[The Amazing Dale Watkins]

6 hours ago, Carambau said:

Gnabry >>>>>>>>>> Volland

I´d have included Petersen instead of Volland in the squad but who listens to me? 

I would have taken Waldschmidt, but in Jogi's defense Volland scored 16 goals for Monaco over Waldschmidt's 7 for Benfica.

[Guest]

Bittersweet moment today but damn he overstayed his welcome by far too long. His in game management was again appalling and I have said this before but his record against top tier to mid tier teams since Flick left his setup has been appalling.

He has left me with some amazing fond memories too and it's sad he won't get the send off he probably deserved.

[DJ]

Today I think Löw could not have done much more. It worked reasonably well. 

But yeah, after 2014 things could only go downhill but did so in a spectacular way.

Thanks for the memories

The title of this thread finally holds true by the way ^^

[Pompeyboyz]

Can we get this thread renamed to Germany is Out 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Pompeyboyz said:

Can we get this thread renamed to Germany is Out 

Comedy gold right there.

[Goldy]

I think a better title would be "all time Löw"

That was terrible, start of a new era for Germany now though.

[Darius1998]

Easily my favourite international team to watch from 2010-2014. Bit disappointing it ends this way for Low but no one will take the World Cup win away from him.

Hopefully Flick works out the way I think it will.

[Astafjevs]

Lots of these players will look better under Flick. It's not like it's a bunch of 30+ guys, I just think Low used some players that probably should have been on the bench and produced a team over the last few years that just wasn't able to play the way you need to have success. Too many low energy slower players in the team. It's why their record against other top nations over the last few years is so bad. Loads of draws and losses. 

They weren't really a front foot team in this competition unless the other team sat back like Portugal. Flick will change that if his Germany is anything like the Bayern team we've seen. Will probably jettison some of the players that can't play that style too.

[skybluedave]

Had to lose to us eventually 

[The Amazing Dale Watkins]

Really should have gone out in the group stage already. Simply not good enough for a big tournament. Wasn't a matter of bad luck or in-form opponents either. Just no real plan going forward and, like I've said after the first match, no hope of ever keeping a clean sheet. England is playing like the Germany of yesteryear, with a rock solid defense. That's how you win tournaments.

[scott MUFC]

Mannschafted

[The Amazing Dale Watkins]

Müller taking an especially brutal kind of revenge on Löw.

[Heartwork]

15 hours ago, The Amazing Dale Watkins said:

Really should have gone out in the group stage already. Simply not good enough for a big tournament. Wasn't a matter of bad luck or in-form opponents either. Just no real plan going forward and, like I've said after the first match, no hope of ever keeping a clean sheet. England is playing like the Germany of yesteryear, with a rock solid defense. That's how you win tournaments.

Attack wins games, defence wins tournaments.

[TM]

a couple of tournaments too late it seems for Low

probably should have left after failing in the group stages in Russia, although if he had the hindsight, you'd have left after 2014 because the only way was down after that

[Orzelek]

So glad that he's gone. Which in a historical context is bizarre - his tenure as Bundestrainer has given me the most fond memories as a football fan. Das Sommermärchen (know that he was only the assistant there, but still), a great EURO 08, the 4-1 over England and the genesis of the "golden generation", the World Cup win in 2014 (hands down the best day of my life!) etc. But I've never seen a manager stay so much longer than desired before. 

 

I can understand the "step down after a World Cup victory"-thing, but that's not where it went wrong. EURO 2016 was still a fine tournament and he won the Confederation Cup aswell. And my theory is that it was there that all went to pieces - winning that tournament with a B/C-squad must've made him think he was the biggest tactical genius of all time. After that - a total disaster. So many mistkes when it comes to tactics, squad selection etc., that he more or less lost all credability he had (which was a lot, as he was a national hero more or less).

 

But I'm really looking forward to Flick taking over, as I think he's the perfect manager to turn things around