A Message On Football Manager 2012 Activation

[pigfacemonkeyman]

i actually couldnt play my save for a few weeks because of an issue that was sorted with the Xmas patch but your right this place is going to be mental in the first few weeks of the release. No doubt pigface and laz will drop into every steam related thread telling us "i told you so" and then me and Eugeen will come in defending everything and kriss will warn everyone about using car analogies, it will be a happy time for all involved.

I would be most grateful if you would point me in the direction of what led you to say such a thing, as, no doubt, you wouldn't want to be seen as "just throwing a post out there" that includes a baseless assumption.

How can you defend against my choice not to buy a game that requires third party software to play? Why would I "drop into every steam related thread"? I have no interest in Steam. As for "i told you so", I wouldn't descend to a level that would even consider the possibility of saying something like this.

I would also suggest that it won't be such a happy time for anyone who can't play their game.

[Scab]

Steam is sort of built to keep you up to date. Fighting this tooth and nail will probably prove more painful than it's worth. The best you can do is set it to not auto-update from whichever version you get with the first install.

[milnerpoint]

Calm down min i was only having a joke, no need to get worked up about it all. Buy the game, dont buy the game, i really dont care

[Wael90]

Totally against this measure. I know Steam is reliable and all but seriously.. Not everyone has an Internet connection. I am also a lover of hardcopies as well. I want the game in its nice box, stored in my gaming shelve with the rest of my collection. I refuse to install Steam because it's of NO USE to me. I'm not going to install a 3rd Party program just to play one single game, I don't like this idea at all. You should at least give us the right to chose between Steam and offline activation though our machine. Last year you showed great commitment to the fanbase when you required no activation for FM2011. And many people appreciated this and did buy the game eventually. This time, you just show you're in it for the cash. It now is clear why there have been so many updates and blogs about the FM12, warming people up and then throwing the pipebomb. Good luck with that. I'm certainly not going for it if that's how you're going to treat your customers.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

For the patch thing. I don't even notice if a patch has been added. It rarely phases me. I've never had the inclination to revert to a different patch. I barely notice when one gets installed as it is.

Why does that not surprise me.

[Colorado]

Disappointed with decision to make the game Steam only. I've been playing FM for many years and am a long-term member of this forum but won't be purchasing FM12 - the first game I haven't bought since back in the CM days.

To be completely honest, none of the new features have really caught my eye and making the game Steam only, confirms my decision. It's not a protest stance, I just think the game is losing touch with the fans.

[Dune297]

Totally against this measure. I know Steam is reliable and all but seriously.. Not everyone has an Internet connection. I am also a lover of hardcopies as well. I want the game in its nice box, stored in my gaming shelve with the rest of my collection. I refuse to install Steam because it's of NO USE to me. I'm not going to install a 3rd Party program just to play one single game, I don't like this idea at all. You should at least give us the right to chose between Steam and offline activation though our machine. Last year you showed great commitment to the fanbase when you required no activation for FM2011. And many people appreciated this and did buy the game eventually. This time, you just show you're in it for the cash. It now is clear why there have been so many updates and blogs about the FM12, warming people up and then throwing the pipebomb. Good luck with that. I'm certainly not going for it if that's how you're going to treat your customers.

Steam can be ran in offline mode and installed in an internet cafe, library, or another place with an internet connection. Hardcopies can be bought at any video game store as usual, it just requires Steam to activate. Is keeping Steam away from your computer worth not having something you love?

[hl07]

I would have bought the game the same way i have bought it every other year. I will not buy the game this year, dont like steam.

[ArseFly]

Eventhough I dont personally use steam for anything, nor are relishing the prospect of using it, I can understand developers trying to guard their property. And hey, at least we get accomplishments. From SI's point of view, they cant really expect more than 100 people not buying the game because of this steam thing.. and are those extra 3-4 days (that it takes this system to get cracked) enough to make 100+ people buy the game who'd normally pirate it?

Those numbers (25% off pirated would double sales) sound way too high though. As every piracy related numbers that SI has ever announced. Ofc last year FM was available on russian sites for download even before it was released..

E: I have had some issues with steams offline mode in the past. If BSOD or such has happened, steam usually gets corrupt and does not allow playing offline before it is been run online and database repaired. (though experiences are from few years back, and they could've significantly improved this)

[Wael90]

Is keeping Steam away from your computer worth not having something you love?

Yes. It's a matter of principle. I don't like this way of treatment. Hackers and crackers are going to win in the end as they always do so why make it harder for us just for a few more bucks? It doesn't make sense. I'll most probably keep playing FM11.

[Colorado]

I think the issue is we shouldn't be forced to have to install Steam to play just one game.

[Wael90]

I think the issue is we shouldn't be forced to have to install Steam to play just one game.

Pretty much. Forcing us to do that is absurd. I'm the legal owner of my machine and I'm the one to chose what to and not to install on my HDD. Not Sega, not EA, not KONAMI or anyone. I don't want Steam, and if Sega wants to act like this, go ahead but my door will remain closed on such an idea. If 2 days of extra income for Sega worth more than customer loyalty and satisfaction, then I'm deeply disappointed as I thought that some of the guys in there were just like us faithful players and lovers of the series.

[ronaldo_1978]

People moaning about steam ( A program which is free ) Should look how bad EA are, I decided to buy a pre owned copy of fifa 11 from game shop earlier and only when I get home do I find out you have to buy a online pass just because the games second hand, Now that is a true meaning of bad treatment of customers, Thank god SI do listen to us on these forums and it's not like it's costing anyone anything extra to download steam.

[milnerpoint]

No one is forcing you to do anything, you have a choice, you want to play the game install steam, you dont want steam dont play the game.
Again with the loyalty card, your so loyal that at the first sign of something you dont like you turn your back.............

[Wael90]

No one is forcing you to do anything, you have a choice, you want to play the game install steam, you dont want steam dont play the game.
Again with the loyalty card, your so loyal that at the first sign of something you dont like you turn your back.............

Customer's always right mate. As I said it's a matter of principle, if they want to have it their way, I'm going to have it my way as well. Yea, I do want to play the game and that's where Sega are gambling their money on, the love of the players.

[milnerpoint]

Well to put it simply, enjoy your principals, ill be enjoying FM12. The only person who will suffer in this is yourself when you miss out, but it is your choice, and i one i dont understand personally, but i wont argue over it with you. SEGA wont miss out mate, you will.

[Wakers]

@Milnerpoint - I appreciate what you're saying, but you seem to have a fairly radical definition of "choice" in mind when you make your posts.

There's no getting away from the fact that Sega have gone down a route that will unnecessarily alienate a fair bunch of customers.

That's not good, no matter what sort of spin you want to put on it.

[themadsheep2001]

@Milnerpoint - I appreciate what you're saying, but you seem to have a fairly radical definition of "choice" in mind when you make your posts.

There's no getting away from the fact that Sega have gone down a route that will unnecessarily alienate a fair bunch of customers.

That's not good, no matter what sort of spin you want to put on it.

But the argument is that they (rightly or wrongly) feel it is necessary to go down this route. Time will tell if this is a good move or not.

[milnerpoint]

@Milnerpoint - I appreciate what you're saying, but you seem to have a fairly radical definition of "choice" in mind when you make your posts.

There's no getting away from the fact that Sega have gone down a route that will unnecessarily alienate a fair bunch of customers.

That's not good, no matter what sort of spin you want to put on it.

There is nothing radical about the choice, you play or you dont, i like playing half life 2, if i want to i have to use steam, if i didnt want steam installed i wouldnt be able to play, that would be my choice, the same now goes for FM. There is no forcing anyone to do anything they dont want, you have the choice as a customer to say no i dont want this, ill move onto something else. Your very much right when you say this will alienate people, but enough to make any mark on the sales figures? Remember SI are a company, not your mate that makes a game you enjoy, yes they are very much more involved with their community than most game dev's, but people shouldnt mistake them as something different to a normal games company when it comes to the botton line. What we also seem to be forgetting is how many fans this could generate for SI and FM, dont count out the size of Steam and its ability to reach people who would not normally had the chance to buy the game, or at least not as easily as they can now. Change always alienates one side of the argument, that is the nature of change, some dont agree with it, some dont agree with the direction and some are quite happy with the whole situation, time will tell if the change has been for the better, my gut instanct says it will, even if they get 1% more sales this year it will have been worth it.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

@Milnerpoint - I appreciate what you're saying, but you seem to have a fairly radical definition of "choice" in mind when you make your posts.

There's no getting away from the fact that Sega have gone down a route that will unnecessarily alienate a fair bunch of customers.

That's not good, no matter what sort of spin you want to put on it.

To put it bluntly, I suspect in private the SI bods are disturbed and upset about this, especially as a lot of the walkaway-sayers are loyal customers of many years standing. On the other hand I suspect Sega bods dont give a to$$ - its all about a few more ££'s to them and to be fair that is their business.

I always wondered when this alliance (SI/Sega) would be exposed for what it is - Corporate muscle awaiting to take over homespun ingenuity. So with the burning wreckage of BGS's Championship Manager disappearing in the rear view mirror the day we realised with FM that "thats not grandma, its a wolf in a dress", is here. A whole genre getting spoilt by greed & incompetence - shame.

[Marc Albrighton]

Wow so most people are getting penalised for people who pirate the game basically, you cant just buy the disc and play you have to download and install steam and run steam everytime you want to play? Would not be aproblem for me but i imagine it would be for a lot of people. Silly move imo the game will eventually get bypassed by someone who knows what they're doing anyway.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

I would be most grateful if you would point me in the direction of what led you to say such a thing, as, no doubt, you wouldn't want to be seen as "just throwing a post out there" that includes a baseless assumption.

How can you defend against my choice not to buy a game that requires third party software to play? Why would I "drop into every steam related thread"? I have no interest in Steam. As for "i told you so", I wouldn't descend to a level that would even consider the possibility of saying something like this.

I would also suggest that it won't be such a happy time for anyone who can't play their game.

Its funny how the English abstain from saying "I told you so" so much. If a Corporation makes a mistake after specifically being advised not to by their Customers (FM09 Activation) and then they make the same decision again a few years later (FM12) when again warned by their Customers not to, IF 21st October passes with a significantly greater than normally expected number of issues arrising from it then I think "I told you so" is a very valid & deserved response. Copy & paste it to where ever the lovestruck pro Steam blind and the deaf refused to see the problem in their ignorance - they should be educated if only for next time.

[Dune297]

To put it bluntly, I suspect in private the SI bods are disturbed and upset about this, especially as a lot of the walkaway-sayers are loyal customers of many years standing. On the other hand I suspect Sega bods dont give a to$$ - its all about a few more ££'s to them and to be fair that is their business.

Not purchasing because you aren't willing to install something that will take five minutes out of your day and will barely disturb you in the future hardly sounds like "loyalty" to me.

[Loversleaper]

I would like to point out that the advice about going to public internet places (like hot spots, McD, ect...) is false, I wish some of you would stop saying this as you are going to cause a lot of people problems (which is unfair). I have been doing some research and it suggests that this is one of the problems when dealing with Steam, I move around a lot - living in three different countries in Europe due to work. Due to my moving around I have to change the internet connection relatively often, this is where a lot of the problems occur - it is essential that the internet connectivety is not slow or poor, if it is then Steam will cause problems. I know a lot of you that don't have problems are basically on the net 24/7 (and of course have good connectivety), most of the problems with Steam is the "going to offline mode" as shown in this clip below:

http://youtu.be/qYACFjiuaSU

I know for a fact that a lot of public places simply don't allow you to visit these type of sites, so for the sake of the community - please be 100% sure before you post this type of advice...

@milnerpoint. I don't hate you so why do you even say something like that? To use a car analogy: just because I would never buy a Wartburg it doesn't mean I hate it...

[Kriss]

To use a car analogy: just because I would never buy a Wartburg it doesn't mean I hate it...

If it was the only car you could buy you'd have to, or walk

[milnerpoint]

@milnerpoint. I don't hate you so why do you even say something like that? To use a car analogy: just because I would never buy a Wartburg it doesn't mean I hate it...

It was just a joke mate, it just so happens i appear to be in the very lucky bracket, no steam issues, no issue using steam, never needing to go back to a previous patch, no BT issus, i have it all, like i said before i have a spare room in my land of happines, its open to any FMers who arent so lucky!! hahaha

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Not purchasing because you aren't willing to install something that will take five minutes out of your day and will barely disturb you in the future hardly sounds like "loyalty" to me.

I think you have played that "loyalty" card before in this debate, it didnt add much first time to be honest. Personally I have not reached the point where I will walkaway from FM12 ("loyal"?, I wouldnt brag that point), but a bad experience downloading the demo may tip the balance against it for me (see previous posts about this weekends disheartenenig"adventures" with Steam!).

If your girlfriend sleeps wth another man and you decide you cannot forgive and walkaway - is that disloyalty? - Not a direct comparison of course, but I think that proves loyalty can be a very subjective thing.

[milnerpoint]

If it was the only car you could buy you'd have to, or walk

Game. Set. Match.

*edit*

infact Tiger has just taken it to a new level, now steam is like dumping your cheating girlfriend, i dont think anyone can top that.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

If it was the only car you could buy you'd have to, or walk

..or carry on driving the car you bought last year - its a practical solution ;-)

[Loversleaper]

If it was the only car you could buy you'd have to, or walk

If this was the case, I would find out how to make my own wheels fast - you can be sure about that. I think the entire merc, bmw, audi driving population would kick up a crap storm, though, so the Wartburg forum mods will have got to take some crash courses asap...

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Game. Set. Match.

*edit*

infact Tiger has just taken it to a new level, now steam is like dumping your cheating girlfriend, i dont think anyone can top that.

Dont you believe it, Im just warming up! ;-) I wasnt actually comparing Steam to anything - I was assimilating "loyalty", but like the rest of the fiercely pro Steam brigade - dont let truth get in the way of a good (or indeed not so good) post!

[milnerpoint]

you've lost me with "assimilising"??
you are right tho, none of us should let the truth get in the way, but we at least need to find out what the truth is, so far that isnt possible.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

you've lost me with "assimilising"??
you are right tho, none of us should let the truth get in the way, but we at least need to find out what the truth is, so far that isnt possible.

assimilising was a dreadful piece of mis-typing - apologies for that! :-/

Agreed though the truth is hard to assess using the forum as a strawpoll of opinions, not representative perhaps, but on this very page it is stated that signing up to Steam takes 5 mins - took me 60 for the reasons stated previously. And that Steam is not intrusive. That is a Lie. Steam is intrusive, it affects my log off, it will affect my FM12 experience, I dont want it - it is intrusive...but as stated I will go with Steam this once, I have no choice. Pro Steamers are posting from the position of their experience which if good is great, we are all very pleased for them - but for some of us (many much worse than mine) there are problems.

[Kriss]

I've asked V Bulletin if there's a way to loop a thread so there's no start and no end

[Carmi88]

Is there no sign to the end of this recycled thread of the same old, same old, see I'm at it now sigh

closing the thread = another thing for people to moan about

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

I've asked V Bulletin if there's a way to loop a thread so there's no start and no end

I fear that will be unnecessary! Actually am getting irritated by my own posts now.

As someone much more famous than I once said:
"Where there is bias, let me bring perspective. "

[TimHardy]

Tbh, I have no real issue with Steam whatsoever, but I do think that SI forcing its client-base to use the service is really quite poor. Tempted not to buy the game, partially due to the lack of exciting new features in FM12 and this out-of-touch decision. Disappointed.

[oescus]

May I be allowed to voice my thoughts about the 'Steam' thing? I am against it for the following reason/s. I will be paying around £25 for the game. It then becomes my property. I should not have to install and run a third party piece of software before I can use my own property. You wouldn't buy a new car and sgree to buying only the sellers own petrol. My fear is that once the 'Steam' thing is fully operational and set up there will, at some future date, a 'nominal' charge made to enable you to use 'Steam'. For the first time in six years I shall be buying FIFA Manager 2012. I am very loathe to even have to consider not buying Football Manager 2012, as I have bought every one since the 'Domark' inception of the game. I hope that 'Sega' will have a rethink but I fear that it has already been decided and that the views of it's customers are of little significance to them.

[Almondo]

May I be allowed to voice my thoughts about the 'Steam' thing? I am against it for the following reason/s. I will be paying around £25 for the game. It then becomes my property. I should not have to install and run a third party piece of software before I can use my own property. You wouldn't buy a new car and sgree to buying only the sellers own petrol. [My fear is that once the 'Steam' thing is fully operational and set up there will, at some future date, a 'nominal' charge made to enable you to use 'Steam'. For the first time in six years I shall be buying FIFA Manager 2012. I am very loathe to even have to consider not buying Football Manager 2012, as I have bought every one since the 'Domark' inception of the game. I hope that 'Sega' will have a rethink but I fear that it has already been decided and that the views of it's customers are of little significance to them.

Just to ask a question why would Valve need to charge us customers for the Steam client? It has been up and running for about nine years now as it was created to distribute Half Life 2 originally. Valve makes a fortune on game sales through Steam and has a fairly successful game development thing going on. You just have to look at Portal 2 or even the Half Life series to see that. Not to mention they also charge developers/publishers to be able to distribute their games through the steam client.

[Carmi88]

everybody makes that silly assumption about things that are free, and that eventually they will cost money because it is profit going amiss, steam won't be charging anybody anytime soon, if they do then I'll eat my hat, or a hat shaped dinner

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

May I be allowed to voice my thoughts about the 'Steam' thing? I am against it for the following reason/s. I will be paying around £25 for the game. It then becomes my property. I should not have to install and run a third party piece of software before I can use my own property. You wouldn't buy a new car and sgree to buying only the sellers own petrol. My fear is that once the 'Steam' thing is fully operational and set up there will, at some future date, a 'nominal' charge made to enable you to use 'Steam'. For the first time in six years I shall be buying FIFA Manager 2012. I am very loathe to even have to consider not buying Football Manager 2012, as I have bought every one since the 'Domark' inception of the game. I hope that 'Sega' will have a rethink but I fear that it has already been decided and that the views of it's customers are of little significance to them.

Enforced DRM is just a hard nosed business decision. Using Steam only (no alternatives) is a shortsighted one. May I recommend that SI never write a "Hospital Manager" game, because
in such a game the comparable decision would be to let the most ill (and expensive to treat) patients just slip away.

[Kriss]

I have a rule of thumb that when a thread brings tears to my eyes I close it, jeesh!!!!!

What the hell next

[Kriss]

A Steam client update is now available. To apply the update, click the File menu inside of Steam and then select "Check for Steam Client Updates...". The specific changes include:

• fixed high CPU usage in game library view
  Fixed switching into offline mode
  Fixed server browser for games using the HL1 engine
  Fix favorite games showing in server browser that don't respond to pings
  Fixed defragmentation if depot file is compressed by NTFS
  Fixed retail installer setting correct game language

[Alesle]

I've never had any problems with steam. And if this can help the game in the long term, great .

[Boydy123]

I hope people will keep updateing fm2011 cos I wont be buying Fm2012 for the same reasons as most people on here i.e lack of new features and the steam issue.

[Dune297]

I hope people will keep updateing fm2011 cos I wont be buying Fm2012 for the same reasons as most people on here i.e lack of new features and the steam issue.

What issue do you have with Steam? Perhaps we can help.

[Boydy123]

I dont want it on my system and I just dont see the worth in spending what little money I have on a game which is basically an updated less buggy FM2011, yeah there is one new decent feature but thats it and untill the demo proves me wrong I aint going to buy the game, even if the game was really good I would not buy it cos I want to be in control of whats on my computer and not be forced to have software on there, now I know you will reassure me that Steam is great etc but it could be the best thing ever and I still will not want it on my computer, its a shame really Ive been a loyal customer of Football Manager since the first ever Championship Manager, I appreciate you trieing to help Dune.

[Crispypaul]

May I be allowed to voice my thoughts about the 'Steam' thing? I am against it for the following reason/s. I will be paying around £25 for the game. It then becomes my property..

Actually it doesn't. You have a licence to use the software but it isn't "your" software.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

I have a rule of thumb that when a thread brings tears to my eyes I close it, jeesh!!!!!

What the hell next

What the hell indeed - maybe an we'll have to update Steam to effectively fix the bugs! Only joking ;-)

Oh........! :-)

[Do you like dogs?]

It's statements like this that give no feedback to SI, Sega or Steam.

Tell us what you don't like about it. Or what you would prefer instead.

What makes it horrible for you?

I don't think I need to reiterate every point on here that has been beat to death, but I often go without Internet access for weeks, sometimes months at a time, which means I cannot access Steam. I am not looking forward to traveling around Montevideo just to find a coffee shop that has free wi-fi, or paying for wireless Internet at my temporary residences down south. That's all, really.

[Do you like dogs?]

Steam is horrible because it has over 30 million accounts and 3 million gamers online at any time of day. Makes sense!

Microsoft ring a bell? How many users and still not that great of a product?

Okay.

[ting2004]

Been away for a week or so and missed all this fun!

Approaching 4000 posts on this subject, many users posting multiple messages. Shall we say 2000 unhappy users who are thinking of not buying this years edition?

All due respect but 2000 missing sales isn't going to make a dent, especially if people are more reluctant/unable to pirate the game and make a purchase (time will tell)

I admire SI and SEGA for having the balls to try and combat a growing problem for pc games.

I

[Dune297]

Microsoft ring a bell? How many users and still not that great of a product?

Okay.

Windows? Much better than Apple's OS.

[Babos]

I knew that Steam was published by Valve, that was my point actually. To make a brilliant analogy : when I buy a car to Mercedes, I don't have to get my key at BMW to be able to drive that same Mercedes (and give them my name and all and thus receive ads constantly telling me to buy them a car next time). Valve is a publisher just like SEGA.

It was already -imho- a scandal for Civ5 (Konami)... and now SEGA with FM, sadly. EA does the same thing with BF3 and Origin yes, but it's an EA game, and Origin's an EA platform, that sells only EA games. Even if it's disturbing, it's at least more acceptable. The truth is Uniloc, Byteshield and any other DRM costs money unlike Steam who's even probably willing to pay SEGA (as gamers who activate their FM on Steam become instantly potential customers to them). Don't be so innocent.

Fighting piracy is one -good- thing, forcing FM players to create an account, give personal info and download a client from a third party company is quite another.

[Richjuk]

I knew that Steam was published by Valve, that was my point actually. To make a brilliant analogy : when I buy a car to Mercedes, I don't have to get my key at BMW to be able to drive that same Mercedes (and give them my name and all and thus receive ads constantly telling me to buy them a car next time). Valve is a publisher just like SEGA.

It was already -imho- a scandal for Civ5 (Konami)... and now SEGA with FM, sadly. EA does the same thing with BF3 and Origin yes, but it's an EA game, and Origin's an EA platform, that sells only EA games. Even if it's disturbing, it's at least more acceptable. The truth is Uniloc, Byteshield and any other DRM costs money unlike Steam who's even probably willing to pay SEGA (as gamers who activate their FM on Steam become instantly potential customers to them). Don't be so innocent.

Fighting piracy is one -good- thing, forcing FM players to create an account, give personal info and download a client from a third party company is quite another.

Steam can be setup with less personal info than it took to create an account on this forum, you don't constantly receive ads either if you don't want too.

[FestyF]

It seems I have to be content with the updated 11.3 version this year. Instead of pricing the game fairly, SI decides to do this ridiculous thing.

[SoGangstha]

Bad move in my opinion. This restricts people playing in other countries who do not have Internet Connections (which inturn leads to them maybe pirating it themselves when they wasn't going to do that in the first place).

Also, If this is an anti-piracy measure - there really is no point. Hackers always win... unfortunately.

I would reconsider that move.

Are you dumb? If they dont have internett they cant pirate the game. Simple. And trying to say people who have the hardware to play FM don't have internett is wrong. Limited sure, but they have some connection!

[Samamatara]

Whinge Whinge Whinge.

Decision has been made and it's obvious they are gonna stick to it.

By all means suggest a better method for FM2013 for Sega and Sigames to consider but they're not gonna change their decision for FM2012.

[Scab]

I knew that Steam was published by Valve, that was my point actually. To make a brilliant analogy : when I buy a car to Mercedes, I don't have to get my key at BMW to be able to drive that same Mercedes (and give them my name and all and thus receive ads constantly telling me to buy them a car next time). Valve is a publisher just like SEGA.

It was already -imho- a scandal for Civ5 (Konami)... and now SEGA with FM, sadly. EA does the same thing with BF3 and Origin yes, but it's an EA game, and Origin's an EA platform, that sells only EA games. Even if it's disturbing, it's at least more acceptable. The truth is Uniloc, Byteshield and any other DRM costs money unlike Steam who's even probably willing to pay SEGA (as gamers who activate their FM on Steam become instantly potential customers to them). Don't be so innocent.

Fighting piracy is one -good- thing, forcing FM players to create an account, give personal info and download a client from a third party company is quite another.

That DRM remark is actually not correct. Steam takes a cut. Publishers go there because it generates sales. You have this store attached to a platform that millions of users are logged in to at any given time - it's in your business interest to appear there.

As has been detailed earlier in the thread, discount popups can be disabled and the default tab changed from Store to something else if these are not to your liking.

I don't understand the third party issue to be perfectly frank. Does it matter if it's run by SEGA or someone else if it works? I mean we're not talking spammers or telemarketers or whathaveyou, it's a publishing partner that helps with distribution and exposure. If SEGA could do this themselves they probably would.

[Loversleaper]

A Steam client update is now available. To apply the update, click the File menu inside of Steam and then select "Check for Steam Client Updates...". The specific changes include:

• fixed high CPU usage in game library view
  Fixed switching into offline mode
  Fixed server browser for games using the HL1 engine
  Fix favorite games showing in server browser that don't respond to pings
  Fixed defragmentation if depot file is compressed by NTFS
  Fixed retail installer setting correct game language

So, I updated the client last night and just now wanted to see how it works:


By loversleaper at 2011-09-28


By loversleaper at 2011-09-28

Am I the only one experiencing this?...

[Kriss]

If SEGA could do this themselves they probably would.

Which begs the question, would we prefer all publishers to require their own distribution/authentication application (some already do) so you'd have several extra apps with equal number of possible problem sources? or is it better to have one which specialises and therefore in theory (practise too actually) does the job far more efficiently?

[Kriss]

So, I updated the client last night and just now wanted to see how it works:

I'd be wondering about the "your internet connection may not be correctly configured for Steam" is this a router problem or possibly ISP?
They have a section on that sort of issue, maybe something there that gives a clue.

[Scab]

Which begs the question, would we prefer all publishers to require their own distribution/authentication application (some already do) so you'd have several extra apps with equal number of possible problem sources? or is it better to have one which specialises and therefore in theory (practise too actually) does the job far more efficiently?

As someone who owns some 200 PC games on Steam and a book case worth of boxed copies, I probably don't need to answer that.

I suppose someone exclusively playing FM may see things differently though.

[Loversleaper]

I'd be wondering about the "your internet connection may not be correctly configured for Steam" is this a router problem or possibly ISP?
They have a section on that sort of issue, maybe something there that gives a clue.

I can go back online with no difficulties...

[Loversleaper]

Look, why don't you try this:

1: Turn off computer

2: Unplug internet connection/turn off wi-fi, routers, modems, ect...

3: Turn on computer

4: See for yourself....

[milnerpoint]

Look, why don't you try this:

1: Turn off computer

2: Unplug internet connection/turn off wi-fi, routers, modems, ect...

3: Turn on computer

4: See for yourself....

Not to rub it in, but i do that every day, my router gets turned off the night before, and my laptop is shut down every night. Have you contacted steam support at all?

[milnerpoint]

Which begs the question, would we prefer all publishers to require their own distribution/authentication application (some already do) so you'd have several extra apps with equal number of possible problem sources? or is it better to have one which specialises and therefore in theory (practise too actually) does the job far more efficiently?

Thats a good point really, if SEGA released their own 3rd party program you needed to play FM, would their be a huge outcry over it? Is it not better to use a company proven to be good at offering this service?

[MBarbaric]

Are you dumb? If they dont have internett they cant pirate the game. Simple. And trying to say people who have the hardware to play FM don't have internett is wrong. Limited sure, but they have some connection!

Utterly wrong. Even if you dont have internet you can play pirated FM12 as any of your friends can download it on USB and give it to you in one morning. Without any issues.

While if you want to buy the game legaly and dont have internet access, you dont have an option to play the game.

This is precisely what is wrong with this decision by SI. While you have no legal option to play this game offline, you do have an illegal one. guess which way will people without internet connection, or those with seam issue, go.

I think steam would be fine choice as long as it is not only one.

[Loversleaper]

Not to rub it in, but i do that every day, my router gets turned off the night before, and my laptop is shut down every night. Have you contacted steam support at all?

When you wake in the morning, you truely and honestly start up your computer without internet connection and when you hit the "Start Steam in offline mode" you have no problems?

I knew about the client update so with the fix list I thought it was best to wait...

[milnerpoint]

When you wake in the morning, you truely and honestly start up your computer without internet connection and when you hit the "Start Steam in offline mode" you have no problems?

I knew about the client update so with the fix list I thought it was best to wait...

I have my laptop right beside me at the moment, with FM running, and i cant connect to my works wi-fi as i am not allowed too. I'm not just saying it to back up my point its honestly the truth, the only time my laptop is connected to the net is if i turn my wi-fi on at home, my router stays off unless i want to use the net for either the laptop, the BT vision or my Xbox, i never have issues at like your having, thats why i would suggest contacting steam support, i think you have an issue we cannot help you resolve.

[Romanista.]

milnerpoint still defending SI after almost 4,000 posts

[milnerpoint]

milnerpoint still defending SI after almost 4,000 posts

we're talking about steam here not SI, keep moving

[Loversleaper]

I would like to request anyone not living in la-la land and that has Steam to please try the following:

1: Turn off computer

2: Make sure when you start up there is no internet connection so Steam throws up the "Retry connection" or "Start Steam in offline mode" option

3: Hit the "Start Steam in offline mode"

4: Report what happens

I would like to hear from a larger audience, because I can't imagine that I am all alone in this (as suggested)...

Many thanks

[Keyzer Soze]

milnerpoint still defending SI after almost 4,000 posts

Not here to defend milnerpoint, he really dont need that, but why the atitude towards him?

[milnerpoint]

Why am i living in la-la land? Because my steam works like its suppose too?

[Keyzer Soze]

I would like to request anyone not living in la-la land and that has Steam to please try the following:

1: Turn off computer

2: Make sure when you start up there is no internet connection so Steam throws up the "Retry connection" or "Start Steam in offline mode" option

3: Hit the "Start Steam in offline mode"

4: Report what happens

I would like to hear from a larger audience, because I can't imagine that I am all alone in this (as suggested)...

Many thanks

Loversleaper, dont take any offense, but dont you think there is a better forum to make this kind of questions? Like... let me think... Steam Forum?

If you have a problem with steam, deal with it, contact forum support, go to steam forum, google it, but... whats the sence to come here and complain about it, when... today... we dont need steam to play FM?

Or is just part of a big quest against SI/Steam?

[Loversleaper]

Loversleaper, dont take any offense, but dont you think there is a better forum to make this kind of questions? Like... let me think... Steam Forum?

If you have a problem with steam, deal with it, contact forum support, go to steam forum, google it, but... whats the sence to come here and complain about it, when... today... we dont need steam to play FM?

Or is just part of a big quest against SI/Steam?

I know that you don't see the problem here, but since we are all forced (from SI) to use Steam I think this is a valid discussion. We need to know how this works and think it is unfair that we are now in a situation where we have to contact other institutions due to someone simply purchasing a FM game...

We are playing "the blame game" here, now I ask you: do you think it's fair?

[Keyzer Soze]

I know that you don't see the problem here, but since we are all forced (from SI) to use Steam I think this is a valid discussion. We need to know how this works and think it is unfair that we are now in a situation where we have to contact other institutions due to someone simply purchasing a FM game...

We are playing "the blame game" here, now I ask you: do you think it's fair?

If i think it's fair? Of course i think it's fair! It's theres game, it's theres rules! If SI/Sega want to use steam to activate/play the game, who are you, or me, or anyone else, to say..."oh that's not fair!" Why?
If you dont like it:

a) dont play the game
b) earn alot of money, buy SI, and then make your own rules

But again, if you have a problem with steam, you should, for your own convenience, contact steam support! I mean, if i have a problem with my windows, or my graphic card drivers... and if thats the reason why i cant play the game... what should i do first? Come here and blame SI for it?

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

I can go back online with no difficulties...

Another day, another problem it seems. "What the hell next?" indeed!

[Loversleaper]

I'd be wondering about the "your internet connection may not be correctly configured for Steam" is this a router problem or possibly ISP?
They have a section on that sort of issue, maybe something there that gives a clue.

Just for the record:


By loversleaper at 2011-09-28

I surprised that no one has tried this themselves it seems...

[Scab]

I would like to request anyone not living in la-la land and that has Steam to please try the following:

1: Turn off computer

2: Make sure when you start up there is no internet connection so Steam throws up the "Retry connection" or "Start Steam in offline mode" option

3: Hit the "Start Steam in offline mode"

4: Report what happens

I would like to hear from a larger audience, because I can't imagine that I am all alone in this (as suggested)...

Many thanks

Offline mode requires valid Steam credentials to be saved locally on the computer. Make sure you ticked the "remember my password" checkbox the last time you logged in when online and it should work. If you haven't, you'll get the error messages you've been describing.

[Loversleaper]

Offline mode requires valid Steam credentials to be saved locally on the computer. Make sure you ticked the "remember my password" checkbox the last time you logged in when online and it should work. If you haven't, you'll get the error messages you've been describing.

You are kind of suggesting that I was born yesterday...

Please people, I know what I am doing in these matters because when I hit the Steam icon it automatically logs into my account, I don't know how to get this point accross anymore - if you don't believe me then what can I honestly say? Truely and honestly I have these issues and I wish that someone tries it for themselves...

[milnerpoint]

I have, but you dont seem to believe me. Last time, have you contacted steam support? If not, then why not? If so, then what have they advised?

[Scab]

I did try it. With the box checked - works. With it unchecked - get the exact same errors as you. The auto login probably wouldn't work if this was the case, but for the sake of checking everything, I don't suppose "Don't save account credentials on this computer" is checked under Settings > Account for you?

[Loversleaper]

I did try it. With the box checked - works. With it unchecked - get the exact same errors as you. The auto login probably wouldn't work if this was the case, but for the sake of checking everything, I don't suppose "Don't save account credentials on this computer" is checked under Settings > Account for you?

I have been through this dance and charade and funnily enough I just uploaded that screenshot (just in case you asked!)...


By loversleaper at 2011-09-28

P.S. Didn't include the date and time (due to powersaving)... hold on a sec, thanks...

[Keyzer Soze]

Loversleaper,

Have you try unistalling Steam, and make a new clean install?

[Scab]

Hm, my best guess would be that you maybe have some 3rd party application that clears out temporary files/similar and kills the saved credentials in the process? If not, I'm at a loss.

[Loversleaper]

By loversleaper at 2011-09-28

In realtime...

[Loversleaper]

Loversleaper,

Have you try unistalling Steam, and make a new clean install?

Of course, I have and I did update the client as Kriss suggested. Anyway, I just bought a new laptop today cause I am incredibly tired of this asus (got a dell now) so I will unistall it from this computer and reinstall it on the new one later on tonight. I know you guys are just trying to help me...

[Scab]

ClientRegistry.blob in the Steam folder is apparently the file holding account credentials. Is this intact after your offline reboot, still there and same-as-before-reboot when you try to use Offline Mode?

[Loversleaper]

Hm, my best guess would be that you maybe have some 3rd party application that clears out temporary files/similar and kills the saved credentials in the process? If not, I'm at a loss.

If that were the case then everytime I open the computer then it would ask for my password (which is not the case). I still cannot believe that I am the only one, I have been going through several forums on the internet where other users are having this same problem...

ClientRegistry.blob in the Steam folder is apparently the file holding account credentials. Is this intact after your offline reboot, still there and same-as-before-reboot when you try to use Offline Mode?

I went through this with Dune just a few pages back...

[Kriss]

Let's see if his new lapdog does the trick, poor guy needs a break.

[Loversleaper]

Let's see if his new lapdog does the trick, poor guy needs a break.

Please, Kriss, if anyone comes and says I need to clear caches, cookies and what not - do me the favor, huh? I'll see all you happy campers tonight...

[Scab]

Sorry if you feel like you're going around in circles, I must've missed those posts. Beats me, then. As long as the credentials are there it's supposed to play ball. Better luck with the new laptop I guess. :/

[Kriss]

Please, Kriss, if anyone comes and says I need to clear caches, cookies and what not - do me the favor, huh? I'll see all you happy campers tonight...

If I may just state the obvious only load apps you really need to before trying Steam, then if it works loading your other stuff might actually point us to something significant.

[ronaldo_1978]

Damn I just pop on and this thread is still going around in circles lol ... Don't actually see point in moaning anymore, Your gonna need steam and there's noway around this, It's just a simple case of buy it or don't, I have no quarrels with SI / Sega to be honest, I don't have to pay for steam so I honestly can't see the problem, I'm buying FM12 I know that for sure

[Wakers]

There is nothing radical about the choice, you play or you dont, i like playing half life 2, if i want to i have to use steam, if i didnt want steam installed i wouldnt be able to play, that would be my choice, the same now goes for FM. There is no forcing anyone to do anything they dont want, you have the choice as a customer to say no i dont want this, ill move onto something else. Your very much right when you say this will alienate people, but enough to make any mark on the sales figures? Remember SI are a company, not your mate that makes a game you enjoy, yes they are very much more involved with their community than most game dev's, but people shouldnt mistake them as something different to a normal games company when it comes to the botton line. What we also seem to be forgetting is how many fans this could generate for SI and FM, dont count out the size of Steam and its ability to reach people who would not normally had the chance to buy the game, or at least not as easily as they can now. Change always alienates one side of the argument, that is the nature of change, some dont agree with it, some dont agree with the direction and some are quite happy with the whole situation, time will tell if the change has been for the better, my gut instanct says it will, even if they get 1% more sales this year it will have been worth it.

This doesn't make any sense. FM has been available on Steam for almost 5 years now. Binding it solely to Steam will reduce numbers, not increase them.

[CMisBAD2010]

i dont see a problem with this move, its a good one and its moving forward.

[Kriss]

This doesn't make any sense. FM has been available on Steam for almost 5 years now. Binding it solely to Steam will reduce numbers, not increase them.

It might reduce the number of current buyers a bit but 50M people will see the ads, of course we won't know the actual effect of that for some time but you have to think it might be considerable.

I remember I didn't find FM through adverts, I spotted it on a shelf in Tesco and only picked it up because I'd already tried the two that were rivals at that time and found them wanting, if FM had been full price at that moment history would need rewriting (in my case)

[jjglvz]

i dont see a problem with this move, its a good one and its moving forward.

How is it moving forward, exactly?