Match Engine Update 13.2.1 - ME 1325 Constructive feedback here please

[MacZidane]

Here are 3 examples. I would upload more but even the upload feature is problematic and extremely cumbersome.

There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with the 2nd and 3rd videos.

The first one looks bad, but it could simply be a breakdown in communication. The ball movement probably isn't particularly realistic, but it's hardly major.

That second clip was a great goal! Attacker makes a great run across the box, and meets the cross perfectly.

And the third is a basic keeper error that you see every week. Like the previous poster, I've also been a keeper, and those kind of balls are a nightmare to defend. He should have done better, but do you want perfect, mistake free football? Because if you do, you can stop any claims that the game is unrealistic.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Quick update as I'm recharging the batteries over the holiday period:

- 13.1.3 was good in some respects but had about 8-10 too few shots per match. That bugged me if you will excuse the pun.

- 13.2 tried to address that by improving attacking AI as a priority. Unfortunately I messed up a change related to defending against dribblers and it sneaked into the release. 13.2.1 addressed that somewhat as well as unrealistic multiple closing down.

- 13.2.1 unfortunately had the knock on of increasing long shots especially at the top end. If possible I'll work on a hotfix for that in the next couple of weeks depending on if it looks like causes any more unwanted knock ons.

At the end of the day I made the call to release this ME in FM2013. We as a match team have sat and watched it side by side with FM2012's and we still absolutely believe its a step forward even allowing for the rough edges. I knew it would be a difficult release but I also underestimated the effects of some of our changes under the bonnet. As the main ME coder that's my responsibility no arguments.

Moving forward I think we can improve things a fair bit more for 13.3 etc but I also want to start work on the FM2014 ME in good time to apply the polish that will truly see it show its full potential.

I'd also like to thank Kriss for going beyond the call of duty with his defence of SI, the ME and myself. He knows how much we at SI care about our work and we'll pull out all the stops to get this as right as you and we all want it to be.

I hope all are enjoying the holiday period. Happy Chritmas and New Year.

Paul, your time and honesty much appreciated. I have tried out the new patch and these are my opinions, for what they are worth:

(tested by using Man City in FMC mode, untouched basic 442 tactic, no shouts, no nothing with the XI selected by the staff - no substitutions except for injuries)

1/ The ME looked actually good in key highlights mode, no gamebreaking issues obvious (long shots are poor, corner flag bothering mostly but the highlights show few of them)

2/ The stats for shots was clearly wrong (which longer highlights would have "highlighted" no doubt. Shots on goal 20 plus for all teams, shots on target averaging 5-7 of these 20 plus per team

3/ Near post corner bug/exploit seems to have re-appeared, may be a fluke in my experience and the keeper usually scrambles back although he follows the flight of the ball too much as the attacking near post man is clearly getting a free header, so only one goal from this but a number of off the line & woodwork strikes.

4/ Play seems centralised but AI teams mostly use 4231 which could explain this.

5/ Commentary a bit annoying. I was under the cosh for 10 mins (several shots on my goal) but I broke away and almost scoredthen the commentary said I was weathering a storm or some such. Seemed silly as I had just nearly scored.

To sum up, if I was not a match stat junkie I would say the ME is very playable in key highlights mode but I and Im sure most other Forum members, play the game because of the stat depth and this is too unbalenced to be taken seriously.

Also I know Steam is here to stay but as their servers couldnt cope with Xmas day (judging by the posts about this on 25th) I do think it is a poor show that needs to be commented upon (it stopped me patching for a while which was a minor annoyance).

May I suggest that FMC mode (which is great) is revamped somewhat, maybe an official SI thread requesting the top 5 or ten wishes of players in an order so some kind of preference so semi representative feedback can be assessed.

[churros]

I get the first video. That happens too often.

I don't understand what was wrong in the second.

In the third, the keeper was likely to be "blindsighted" (not sure if that is actually a word) by the striker running across. I know it seems dumb that he fumbles and spills the ball, but being a keeper, I can tell you, when someone is running across like that, very difficult to hold on to a ball.

Anyway, other than the hopeful long ball, I saw little wrong unless you'd like to elaborate as I may have completely missed some obvious bug.

I suspected someone will miss what's wrong when running at normal speed..

2nd video: 4 defenders moving towards ball. Proper reaction: jump and ****ing head it away. FM13 reaction: ???

3rd video: You are right about the keeper. It's impossible to know what to react to when the ball's coming on target and an opponent running across. But those 2 defenders had at least 3 chances in total, within the 2 seconds of that incident to clear the ball. Did they? Think about it. The striker had enough time to 1. strike the ball, 2. slow down from his run's inertia, 3. change direction towards the ball again, 4. strike the ball a second time.

4 actions while 2 defenders were prancing around the GK. I hope you see just how wrong that is. It's the smallest movements that you have to watch to realise how poorly micromanaged the AI is right now.

[MacZidane]

2nd video: 4 defenders moving towards ball. Proper reaction: jump and ****ing head it away. FM13 reaction: ???

Sorry, this has to be trolling. You simply cannot be serious with this. The striker outjumped the defenders, and caught it perfectly to power it into the net. Was this a goal scored against you by any chance?

[El Casa De Munson]

While I appreciate PaulC telling it how it is, I find it mildly irritating that the game was released in this state.

But what really grips my poo is that ever since CM4 it's been the same, FM on release date is ALWAYS broken and we have to go through this trauma every time. FM13 is different in that it's soon going to be January and it's still broken, normally we get a working game in late November.

Given each game has a 1 year life span, we've already lost 16% of our value for money with this one (2 months gone).

It seems like such an obvious suggestion to SI to just release the game in December or something to give more time to develop and test.

[MacZidane]

It's not 'broken' though, is it? Just needs a few tweaks here and there. It's very close to being spot on.

[Guest]

If I see the ball hit the back of a player who isn't looking one more time, I'm going to have an aneurysm.

[Kriss]

Got to admire PaulC coming out and being as honest as he is. So the hotfix might not come quickly, if at all but at least the guys held his hands up and admitted what the issues are - and by doing so making a great big hole in the arguments made my the 'defenders' who have tried to convince us all, the problems are in our heads.

I for one have never doubted SI's passion for their game and 13.1.3 was so close to good, that I'm sure that by 13.3 (or sooner fingers crossed) we'll have a really great ME.

What impresses me is that Paul's analysis of the current major issues ties in exactly with the views of those on here whose feedback I've come to respect as accurate and perceptive.

Now if the rest of you would kindly shut up.....

[Dicko99]

It's not 'broken' though, is it?

Its not exactly working though is it? Basicly no tactics work because any instruction i give my players is overidden by the match engine.

[edgar555]

What impresses me is that Paul's analysis of the current major issues ties in exactly with the views of those on here whose feedback I've come to respect as accurate and perceptive.

Now if the rest of you would kindly shut up.....

Well exactly. Despite all the white noise it was clear that there were issues and a number of people who were able to express these articulately and without the need to resort to hyperbole.

[jimmywils]

Ok, so i've managed to sneak in a couple of hours FM time since the latest ME update.

It all just seems a little 'random' at the moment. Im usually not too bad at the old tactics side of things and in the patch released on the 19th Dec I was getting a feel for the AI tactics/formations and how to deal with the AI mid game changes to a)hang on to a lead or b) Chase the game and force the AI into a defensive posture, making them drop deeper so I can push up and pressurize. My in game changes actually had an effect on the pitch and it gave me the feeling of actually 'managing' my team.

This latest ME update has, in some way, caused my changes mid game to have little to no effect. My form is very patchy, with wins against Man City, Liverpool and Man Utd but two weeks later getting beat by Blackpool, Scunthorpe and Watford.

Yes, it could be my tactics....or it could be a result of changes made to the ME. My full backs (Baines and Coleman) are scoring a lot (6 for Baines and 5 for Coleman) in 12 games. Before the latest patch Baines had 2 all season (1 penalty) and Coleman failed to score. I have not adjusted my tactics, apart from playing more direct away from home.

The game is still playable but I cant help feeling (especially in light of PaulC's comments) I should wait a week or two for the next ME update. I have every confidence that SI will get this right.

[treble_yell_:-)]

right, im 39yrs old and ive played CM/FM since the start. i regularly play network games against mates and despite being married with kids and holding down a fulltime job, i have racked up over 900 hours on FM2011 and over 900 hours on FM2O12. disgusting but true.

im a season ticket holder at bradford city and have been for years and i regularly watch football on TV. im also a subscriber to '442' magazine and 'world soccer' magazine which i read avidly.

in short, i would say im an expert when it comes to everything FM and football related. tactics and players.

but this versions ME is in my humble opinon awful. its nearly as bad as FM2009s. its definately NOT anything to do with tactics as ive just spent 4 hours testing my bayer leverkusen team at home againts mainz with numerous combinations and slider movements and virtually everytime they are proving with their (mainz's) very narrow 4-1-2-1-2 they are better. the best i can muster is a draw to their far superior shots on goal.

the the best leverkusen team i fielded was -

leno

scwaab albiol wollschied aogo

grosskreutz bender augusto schurrle

kweuke gameiro

(this was during september 2012 game time and after i had given each team in our network game £20m to spend and a lot of wheeling and dealing, and winning my last game!)

that was 442. i have tried 4231, diamond, sliders low, sliders high, etc. all dont work. aparantly the game figures that mainz facing me away is like bradford city facing barce. it didnt matter how i prepared in the week up to the match or what i said or tactics i used, i still got beat and the best i could muster was a score draw. ive tried kiessling, sidnei sam, even royston drenthe and sebastian blanco who i signed on frees.

i could understand if it was a top club with top players, but, with no disrespect, mainz? at home? with the players i have signed? after using every tactic??? after 4hrs?????? I HAVE NEVER KNOW A MORE WORSE VERSION!!!! plus i had a week to prepare.

i will also hasten to add the nightmare i had as managing real madrid in a network game recently where i was lucky to scrape third after RONALDO decided to shoot from range at every opportunity and hoof it into the corner of each stand! it was simply ridiculous to be honest.

its nothing to do with tactics, its a very poor MATCH ENGINE. simple as.

this is not a slag off at the makers. i LOVE the game. its just telling it straight from a very very experienced FM player and a very very experienced football fan. it has totally spoiled my enjoyment recently and im pulling my hair out!

Take this as you will , but I reckon I could pick just about any 2 teams in the game, and replaying the same fixture over a 4 hour period I would see a massive mixture of results. I absolutely know if I took your Leverkusen team and played Mainz repeatedly for 4 hours that I could beat them, likely more often than not.

I genuinely cannot see how you could lose repeatedly for 4 hours solid. I'd certainly be interested in seeing it if you uploaded the save to the FTP

Anyway, Season 3 with Spurs, team is finally playing well, and nearly like I would want. The single biggest annoyance is the amount of shots, long and short, more specifically the amount of off target shots from players with high finishing/long shots etc. However general play is good , the DLP and BWM are doing their jobs very well, the DLP specifically is controlling teh game from the middle.

Siggurdson and the youngster I signed are improving having changed them from AM/a to AP/a , specifically the youngster has the Killer ball PPM and tries to feed in the AML/R and Sriker when he can, Sigi is in the process of learning Killer balls PPM.

It seems to me that this version of the ME pays a lot of attention to player PPMs, for instance Douglas Costa has the shoots from distance PPM and there is literally nothing that can be done to stop him ending the match with 10+ shots blazed wild (long shots low, work ball into box shout , even tried lowering his CF to 0) However if I play another winger without the PPM he plays as you would expect.

The same goes for my AM's , like I said above, no mater what shouts or through ball instructions I give Sigi , he rarely if ever looks to play my front 3 in, but the lad with the killer ball PPm does, with no further promoting from shouts etc.

I accept it's not a solution, but it would pay people having issues to look at their players ppm's and only play/sign those that work into your system.

The ME does deserve some credit, I always felt in previous years that you could pretty much slip one good player put for another and the tactic would largely play the same, that's not the case this year and different players make huge differences to how yout team and tactics play out . This is a good thing and something that Paul and his team should be praised for.

[canaryboxhead]

jimmywils and PaulC couldnt have put it any better. Im finding exactly the same the things and 13.1.3 was such a good step. Hoping SI will either go back to the other ME or tweak this one so that I don't have a goal every game when someone runs 20 or 30 yards and scores (how often do we really see that)

[maarten-85]

Sorry, this has to be trolling. You simply cannot be serious with this. The striker outjumped the defenders, and caught it perfectly to power it into the net. Was this a goal scored against you by any chance?

You, my friend, are being ridiculous. The defenders obviously don't jump AT ALL. They are not getting outjumped. The see a high ball and don't react to it. Secondly the positioning of the defenders is horrific. There is four of them at the first post. Way too many.

I mean come on. Stop blindly defending the game. In fact your blind defending of the ME right now is just as detrimental to the improvement of the game as the pointless unconstructive rants by some people here.

If you want to help the game to go forward be constructive with your feedback and reactions to other posts.

[I_Missed_Penalty]

the match engine is really bad on key moments but since i switched it to extended highlights its more tolerable, currently top of seria a and in the quarters of the c.l, so the match engine isnt as bad as i first thought it to be.

LOL, typical poor judgement. Iam winning, so the ME is ok. When Iam losing, the ME is terrible.

[MAGiCK_FOOTBALL]

Through balls are lacking, but they are not that much higher in real life either, room for improvement, but need to be careful to not over do it.

I should rephrase what I said - players not playing through balls when an obvious opportunity arises.

[kazm]

Why is poor crossing more dangerous than good crossing right now? (i play 2nd div England) EVERY EVERY EVERY game i see ******** crosses either hitting the crossbar or almost scoring. WHY? In what way does that add something to the game and in what way is that realistic? Granted since the new patch i havent seen those stupid fluke-cross goals anymore but this just happens every game.

My left back just got hold of an opponents long pass. He was just standing there doing nothing for a few seconds. Enemy tackles, crosses, no one of my team to be seen near the goal because they were all waiting for the pass. They score.

Another thing that i have noticed is this: unless a player is within 2 meters of the ball, he doesnt notice it it seems. Ive seen it so often: pass gets headed away, winger just runs away from it. If that is part of my tactic (which i doubt) then that is complete BS. It seems to be a bug. Same thing happens with the fullbacks: ive seen it multiple times again, their wingers knocks it past my fullback (or tries to pass it against the fb to get a throwin??) but he isnt fast enough to get past the fullback. So the fb is between the ball and the winger. Instead of picking up the ball he runs past the ball, turns around and faces the winger again. Without ball. Moving more inside, giving the winger more space too.

Another thing: i like the focus on decisions/composure/agility etc but to me it seems like it could be toned down slightly. It seems like not having decisionmaking increases the chance of taking the wrong decision way too much. Players just seem to ALWAYS take the wrong option even if its really easy and obvious. My team has a problem scoring, same problem a lot of people seem to have, they shoot from distance too much. In those cases i WANT them to pass, dribble, drink coffee, have a ****, BUT NOT SHOOT FROM DISTANCE, which they inevitably do. Then when they are actually in the box they wait to long and get tackled (often by 2 defenders at the same time GJ on that, thats an insta-penalty all the time irl) or they pass it back O_o.

Now i know im a mediocre player at best. And i am trying to build my own tactics. It really sucks that i might be failing because of things that are not in my control.

I really dont understand how some people dont have these problems, could that be the randomness in the game or is it like Rashid says more of a challenge to them and do they play around it?

[Kriss]

[quote name=kazm;8417461

I really dont understand how some people dont have these problems' date=' could that be the randomness in the game or is it like Rashid says more of a challenge to them and do they play around it?[/quote]

Some of each really, but you're not imagining it all, "player awareness" does seem to be an issue in several situations.

[SaLaDiN]

Quick update as I'm recharging the batteries over the holiday period:

Moving forward I think we can improve things a fair bit more for 13.3 etc but I also want to start work on the FM2014 ME in good time to apply the polish that will truly see it show its full potential.

Why I dont see "THE POLISH" and "FULL POTENTIAL" in FM 2013? Nice honey potting. Shame, that someone was talking the same in youtube videos for FM 2013. Basically you are just saying if I want a fixed game I have to buy Football Manager the next one...Enjoy my money, you saw them last time.

[kazm]

Some of each really, but you're not imagining it all, "player awareness" does seem to be an issue in several situations.

Thanks.

I am not willing to waste time learning something useless/something that will be changed in the future and I am not good enough to play around that stuff even if i wanted to.

So now i have to wait for another patch and then relearn everything again.

Superdisappointed in SI for that. But yeah releasing broken games is normal these days unfortunately. Guess i should be happy with the 10% enjoyment i had so far.

[kazm]

Why I dont see "THE POLISH" and "FULL POTENTIAL" in FM 2013? Nice honey potting. Shame, that someone was talking the same in youtube videos for FM 2013. Basically you are just saying if I want a fixed game I have to buy Football Manager the next one...Enjoy my money, you saw them last time.

Totally agree, i cant believe he said that. Wow at least at Activision and EA they lie about it lol.

[SaLaDiN]

Sorry, this has to be trolling. You simply cannot be serious with this. The striker outjumped the defenders, and caught it perfectly to power it into the net. Was this a goal scored against you by any chance?

Pls, troll me too and explain me, how these goals are perfectly realistic and I do not understand football at all.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/339132-First-match-after-the-13.2-patch-and-I-am-almost-done-with-the-game...

[Kriss]

Let's not go ott lads, I've explained at length why we're where we are with this version, and I'm not doing all that bloody typing again:D so read back if you want to bother.

One thing SI don't do is deliberately deceive, they do get things wrong however but at least they put huge effort into then putting them right.

Don't assume PaulC's words mean this ME will be abandoned in favour of FM14, he hasn't finished with it yet by any means.

[Jarmel]

I actually think the root of the problem in this years ME is the AI code is poor at defensive decision making/ spacial awareness . Just throwing something out here, maybe they are perceiving pressure when the clearly isn't any ?? Is the ME composure setting adrift a little ??? Any defensive minded player does not seem to want to get the ball instead they tend to run away from it . Attacking players seem more likely to run after a lose ball.

To get around this they are tweaking other settings to compensate . I played a few games on fm10 and noticed that there seems to be alot more obvious through ball opportunities in fm13 than in fm10. If through balls were to be played 50% of the time when there is an obvious chance to do so the scoring would be insane in this ME.

I "think" there is a fundamental flaw in the ME that needs addressing in regards to any defensive type player . Fix that and the rest will flow on .

[Lawlore]

Why I dont see "THE POLISH" and "FULL POTENTIAL" in FM 2013? Nice honey potting. Shame, that someone was talking the same in youtube videos for FM 2013. Basically you are just saying if I want a fixed game I have to buy Football Manager the next one...Enjoy my money, you saw them last time.

Man, if only they'd put out some way of letting people try the game before buying it, some kind of demonstration to let you play for a while for free, and make your own mind up. Oh wait.

There are flaws in the ME, and it is an ongoing project- but accusing them of this kind of thing is ridiculous.

[Veg1ta]

never got crash dumps on fm13, played 4 seasons with spurs before this 13.2.1 and never got crash dumps, now i cant progress past 1st of july 2nd season without the game shuting down with a crash dump.

yeh i can go post in bug thread but i shouldnt have to! the game should just work and it doesnt.

[Clausdk]

Nice work with the patch SI it sorted out the problem I had with a high number of goals. thanks for the hard work and happy new year to all at SI

[I_Missed_Penalty]

Even though the game is unplayable for me at the moment (Enjoy my 25 pounds SI!) I have to say, that this could be quite a good strategy for SI to fight piracy. Since patches are rarely cracked and they can only be downloaded through steam, Si basically forces people to buy it because you cant play it much without patches. Imagine you would download the game through Pirate Bay and still play the original ME version, wuuf. But seriously, I feel let down by SI this year, it really is a huge failure, I paid to become a beta tester, ironic isnt it?

[Svenc]

Totally agree, i cant believe he said that. Wow at least at Activision and EA they lie about it lol.

It has been said repeatedly that the ME will always be work in progress, and this is no different to any other game series. Feedback that is taken onboard for one version help develop the next one, and the cycle continues. It also has been admitted that implementing the rehauled ME in this year's version was underestimated. The work required for balancing it all out, the knock-on effects that were to be had after balancing, etc. Maybe SI could have kept their mouth shut afterwards, and maybe Miles was going a bit overboard in hyping expectations prior. SI also could have continued with the FM11/12 ME, but for that they also would have certainly gotten their fair amount of flak. It is no secret that it also took a couple of patches and versions for the previous engine iteration to reach the point where it was in FM12. That is no secret, things will always be that way. It just wasn't as bluntly put onto the forums where you got to read it.

And yet it is also deemed that the implementation was the right way to go about it, and that it was ready. It is obvious to anyone carefully watching that bar the balancing issues in structure the reworked engine is in many ways a hefty improvement to what has gone before. At the end of the day decisions go both ways: The developers decide what is ready to go into the game and how. And you decide wether that is worth your time and money. With big demos not holding back on features any as well as money-back deals going for a further 7 days of full-game experience, you can hardly call that foul play, not this season anyways.

[kazm]

Let's not go ott lads, I've explained at length why we're where we are with this version, and I'm not doing all that bloody typing again:D so read back if you want to bother.

One thing SI don't do is deliberately deceive, they do get things wrong however but at least they put huge effort into then putting them right.

Don't assume PaulC's words mean this ME will be abandoned in favour of FM14, he hasn't finished with it yet by any means.

Well I am sorry but I dont think it is normal to release a game in a state like this and asking the regular full price. I dont care SI made a new engine and needed more time. If they needed more time they shouldve TAKEN more time. Dont release a game every year if you cant keep the quality at an acceptable level. SI turns this from THEIR problem into the customers problem and there are actually people defending it lol.

And yes this ME WILL be abandoned in favour of FM14: whatever happens to fm13, next year fm14 HAS to be ready. Thats a higher priority then FM13.

But hey, i waste money on CoD every year so who am i to complain..

[Kriss]

Well I am sorry but I dont think it is normal to release a game in a state like this and asking the regular full price. I dont care SI made a new engine and needed more time. If they needed more time they shouldve TAKEN more time. Dont release a game every year if you cant keep the quality at an acceptable level. SI turns this from THEIR problem into the customers problem and there are actually people defending it lol.

And yes this ME WILL be abandoned in favour of FM14: whatever happens to fm13, next year fm14 HAS to be ready. Thats a higher priority then FM13.

But hey, i waste money on CoD every year so who am i to complain..

So you didn't bother reading back, or you just don't want to understand

[kazm]

It has been said repeatedly that the ME will always be work in progress, and this is no different to any other game series. Feedback that is taken onboard for one version help develop the next one, and the cycle continues. It also has been admitted that implementing the rehauled ME in this year's version was underestimated. The work required for balancing it all out, the knock-on effects that were to be had after balancing, etc. Maybe SI could have kept their mouth shut afterwards, and maybe Miles was going a bit overboard in hyping expectations prior. SI also could have continued with the FM11/12 ME, but for that they also would have certainly gotten their fair amount of flak. It is no secret that it also took a couple of patches and versions for the previous engine iteration to reach the point where it was in FM12. That is no secret, things will always be that way. It just wasn't as bluntly put onto the forums where you got to read it.

At the end of the day decisions go both ways: The developers decide what is ready to go into the game and how. And you decide wether that is worth your time and money. With big demos not holding back on features any as well as money-back deals going for a further 7 days of full-game experience, you can hardly call that foul play, not this season anyways.[/quote

Admitting is is respectable.

-a new match engine is no valid excuse for a bad game, which quite frankly in this state it is

-i understand the ME will never be perfect, it can never totally copy real life. asking for a minimum standard seems okay though.

-every game nowadays gets hyped while Community Managers know about those games not being ready for release. BF3 is a great example as is MoH. No reason why SI should do it too.

-whats a demo worth when you know the final game (after numerous patches) will be totally different? I already knew I liked Football Manager games. In a demo/beta I expect stuff to be broken/unbalanced.

I know I overreact a bit sometimes, but I really dont agree with this trend in gaming.

[kazm]

So you didn't bother reading back, or you just don't want to understand

I didnt bother reading back, not gonna read 9 pages. Sorry if i missed something obvious.

[Kriss]

I didnt bother reading back, not gonna read 9 pages. Sorry if i missed something obvious.

You did but don't sweat it, just don't keep harping on, you've had your say and I respect your right to do so even if I totally disagree but the number of repeats in this thread is doing my head in

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

I didnt bother reading back, not gonna read 9 pages. Sorry if i missed something obvious.

Its only 9 pages because people dont read back.

[Arisilan]

Interesting.

Could you please expain how or could you upload your tactic in the tactics forum?

I basically just forced them to play more through balls with player instructions and shouts. Had to change some player roles in midfield to more supportive. Otherwise they stayed too much behind and played more passes back to defence. Made also some changes to give my players more space in final third. At the same time I brought down every available option for long shots.

Im playing with 4-2-3-1 - BMW(d) and DLP(s) in midfield, AM(s) upfront of them. IF(a) on both wings and lone poacher. So attack play looks quite strong. I have option to go trough to middle or to wide space for crossing. It works for me

Only really annoyable thing is how they sometimes play the ball forward. Its definitely a bug.

[OldSwanner]

Moving forward I think we can improve things a fair bit more for 13.3 etc but I also want to start work on the FM2014 ME in good time to apply the polish that will truly see it show its full potential.

Won't 13.3 be revised and honed until it effectively becomes 14?

[Kriss]

Won't 13.3 be revised and honed until it effectively becomes 14?

Yes but there'll be a cut off point for fixes to be introduced into FM13.

[chiek tiote is a legend]

getting fed up with teams looking to loan my players and then the deal falls through due to not having the funds.

[Mikke]

3rd video: You are right about the keeper. It's impossible to know what to react to when the ball's coming on target and an opponent running across. But those 2 defenders had at least 3 chances in total, within the 2 seconds of that incident to clear the ball. Did they? Think about it. The striker had enough time to 1. strike the ball, 2. slow down from his run's inertia, 3. change direction towards the ball again, 4. strike the ball a second time.

4 actions while 2 defenders were prancing around the GK. I hope you see just how wrong that is. It's the smallest movements that you have to watch to realise how poorly micromanaged the AI is right now.

It is wrong as in "players are stupid", but not wrong as "this is unrealistic". There is nothing unrealistic in this incident. This kind of thing happens all too often IRL, when the two defenders wait for the other defender to do something, which leads to neither defender doing anything. If you're trying to say that you haven't seen this happen IRL, you are probably lying.

[DAVE82]

I've been playing this game since CM2 and the match engine is so bad on FM13 that for this first time ever, i will be going back to a previous version and play FM12. It's extremely disappointing but it just is no fun at all when you get to the match. It feels like we have been sold a game that is 'work in progress' as it's full of bugs and plays so badly. I won't list them again cos i've just spent the last half hour reading through all the various replies to this thread and they have all been listed countless of times by others. I just hope FM14 can be the game i was expecting this one to be.

[Arisilan]

Here are 3 examples. I would upload more but even the upload feature is problematic and extremely cumbersome.

Let me guess. In first video you got commentary that your fullback played the ball forward. Its definitely a bug, because shot is too powerful and needs to be much weaker.

But I managed to get really funny goal this way. My fullback decided to play the ball forward. My poacher runs after the ball, but shot is clearly too strong. Poor guy won't have any chance. Fortunately ball physics and awful keeper decision saved the day

[video=youtube;hhoR4kBdYOc]

[OldSwanner]

Yes but there'll be a cut off point for fixes to be introduced into FM13.

It seems to me that the effect having such a cut off point will be to drastically reduce the number of testers for any following revisions, leading to a lower quality ME on release of FM2014, as happened this year. Why not make use of the vast army of willing testers by keeping offering updates (to those interested) through to the release of FM2014?

We'll all buy the new version for the improvements in the opposition AI (hint hint) and updated player rosters anyway, so having the latest match engine effectively in the public domain should have negligible impact on sales, but big benefits in recouping some of the goodwill lost in recent weeks.

[I_Missed_Penalty]

I restored my comp to 17.12. 2012 to get rid of the last two pathetic updates but my save files became corrupt, can anything be done about it?

[Pafeu]

I restored my comp to 17.12. 2012 to get rid of the last two pathetic updates but my save files became corrupt, can anything be done about it?

Installing patch again I guess. Long shot but may work.

[churros]

There is a clear scripting buff/debuff on the bottom/top teams in the leagues respectively. Currently in Npower League 1, beating the top 4 teams with over 60% possession and well averaging around 15 shots and half on target, and then losing out to bottom table teams with about 50% or less possession and max 8 shots per game, lucky to have 4 on target.

It feels like SI have coded a sort of "balancing" or handicap script. Top table teams perform crap making really lousy decisions and passing poorly, whereas relegation zone teams are controlling the games like Spain.

PLEASE remove handicap. There's absolutely no benefit to be gained from it, SI.

[gomes29]

SIGAMES:

I stopped playing because of this error:

FM 2013 v13.2.1.341620 (2012.12.28 16.44.32).dmp

[I_Missed_Penalty]

Installing patch again I guess. Long shot but may work.

Thanks for reply but I dont want to play with the last updates so I guess I am gonna dump it for good. Lol

[Sussex Hammer]

There is a clear scripting buff/debuff on the bottom/top teams in the leagues respectively. Currently in Npower League 1, beating the top 4 teams with over 60% possession and well averaging around 15 shots and half on target, and then losing out to bottom table teams with about 50% or less possession and max 8 shots per game, lucky to have 4 on target.

It feels like SI have coded a sort of "balancing" or handicap script. Top table teams perform crap making really lousy decisions and passing poorly, whereas relegation zone teams are controlling the games like Spain.

PLEASE remove handicap. There's absolutely no benefit to be gained from it, SI.

Must confess this is irritating me. I do wonder what effect if any confidence and morale have on AI teams. I beat Chelsea at home 1-0 and Everton 3-1 away and sandwiched between those were getting knocked out of the Cup by bottom of the table Southampton then scraped a 1-1 draw at 17th placed Wolves. The Wolves game was particularly bizarre with me going 1-0 up and having 8 shots on target to their 0 and 70% possession in the first 20 minutes and then the game just turned on it's head and they started playing like Brazil. I was lucky to survive with their shot ratio going through the roof. You would think going 1-0 down at home their heads would drop. Yet against Chelsea and Everton two far superior sides I limited them to one shot on goal each!!

[Leon_fogo]

The engine 3d fm 2012 was much higher than that fm ... I have noticed that players do not give opponents to combat, the game does not flow properly, with disputes in midfield, exchanging passes and thrown divided in the struggle for possession of the contest!

Not to mention that the so-called "key moves" are practically nothing, it has to improve, the 3D patches urgent need yet!