Football Manager 14 Feedback Thread - 14.1.4

[jc1]

Yeah, it does get quite warm and the internal fans are going full speed as well. Thanks for the tip.

I got mine from Tesco, lappy sit on top and you plug it into a port, fan comes on and hey presto, cost around £15.

[RTHerringbone]

The cheapest option may be to use 2 pencils/small lego bricks to lift the back of the laptop of the work surface its resting on. Try that and see if that makes any diffference first before investing in something more expensive

Mine is propped up on Duplo blocks - works a treat!

[jc1]

The options are to wait for the final update next year for FM 2014; or just get started now and enjoy the game.

DB change aside, the patches are save game compatible.

The update was compatible with saved game, so you should be able to carry on with any save you had and it'll mean you don't need to start again.

[jc1]

Mine is propped up on Duplo blocks - works a treat!

That's ok if sitting at a table but not when on your lap

[MrPompey]

I think you're right, but the ME can be very misleading and it does need sorting. For example, the amount of times I have had a deflection without it being acknowledged is very annoying. A clear deflection is totally different to a screamer from 30 yards, yet the commentary says 'struck from 30 yards!!' with no mention of the deflection at all. Why have the ME representing a deflection and then not recognise it? There are many more anomalies like this which are frustrating and have been in the game for years.

What's that they say about food? If it looks appealing you eat it, if it doesn't it can taste great but we're not going to touch it, or generally something like that. I guess that could translate to this, if it looked as it should then we'd be happy.

To carry that approach on - you may have a good meal in front of you but if you leave it too long to start eating because you are waiting for extra trimmings then its going to go cold. Get stuck in now

I would also like to have mentioned seagulls and trawlers but I think I would need some gaelic flair for that

[MrPompey]

The update was compatible with saved game, so you should be able to carry on with any save you had and it'll mean you don't need to start again.

Wasn't that what I just said

[MrPompey]

Mine is propped up on Duplo blocks - works a treat!

HAHA - the simplest approach is often the best

[Beestonite]

Mine is propped up on Duplo blocks - works a treat!

You really should put your other toys away before playing on FM!!

[jc1]

Wasn't that what I just said

probably haha

[CactusC]

Mine is propped up on Duplo blocks - works a treat!

Poor kids, I'm gonna go raiding their toy box tonight...

[Beestonite]

To carry that approach on - you may have a good meal in front of you but if you leave it too long to start eating because you are waiting for extra trimmings then its going to go cold. Get stuck in now

I would also like to have mentioned seagulls and trawlers but I think I would need some gaelic flair for that

I sort of agree with you, but I always time meals well for serving so wouldn't have to wait...

It's just annoying but I have got used to putting up with it. Nothing wrong with wanting perfection though.

[Mike Fordham]

My early reactions are that 14.1.4 is worse than 14.1.3. There are two main issues I am experiencing:

1. There is a big disconnect between the intention of the player instructions and what you see on the pitch. It doesn't appear to matter what you ask defenders to do, they will not do it. In fact the team instructions when it comes to defending seem completely useless - they seem to have no influence on the match engine whatsoever (at least, tangibly) rendering them a bit redundant. If I didn't know better I would suggest some of the fixes of previous issues have been made the to the detriment of other parts of the game, but maybe that is unfair of me.

2. Team morale is far too sensitive, and also far too influential on how a team performs. As a consequence it has too much of an impact on the game. A single loss and team morale can drop dramatically. Next game then becomes far too hard regardless of the quality of opponent. This needs to be sorted.

During some testing I tried the same tactic and teamtalk several times in one match and didn't experience the same performance / result once in 15 goes. It just appears a bit too random for me at the moment. I would expect to see the same sort of performance in most of the games, but maybe not result. It is a bit confusing.

Not sure if any of this has been brought up before but thought I would share.

[Dagenham_Dave]

During some testing I tried the same tactic and teamtalk several times in one match and didn't experience the same performance / result once in 15 goes.

I'd be more concerned if any of the 15 games were ever the same as another. The amount of variables that go into just one game are huge. Particularly if it's being played between two fairly similarly matched teams. The only way you could really test it - and even then you're at the mercy of game changing incidents - is to add yourself as manager of the other team as well, and set up both teams exactly the same each time, and make the same subs, change the same tactics each time. You might - might - get closer results.

That said, IMO, replaying the same game over and over again is something I've always thought of as, well, pointless.

[MrPompey]

I sort of agree with you, but I always time meals well for serving so wouldn't have to wait...

It's just annoying but I have got used to putting up with it. Nothing wrong with wanting perfection though.

Perfection - no I agree but each annual evolution of FM means its a step nearer. The problem is that as perfection gets nearer our expectations increase proportionately.

The first CM/FM I played was text only with out real life player names

[CactusC]

2. Team morale is far too sensitive, and also far too influential on how a team performs. As a consequence it has too much of an impact on the game. A single loss and team morale can drop dramatically. Next game then becomes far too hard regardless of the quality of opponent. This needs to be sorted.

I agree and this is something that must have been changed for FM14. Morale is much more difficult to maintain nowadays.

[Mike Fordham]

I'd be more concerned if any of the 15 games were ever the same as another. The amount of variables that go into just one game are huge. Particularly if it's being played between two fairly similarly matched teams. The only way you could really test it - and even then you're at the mercy of game changing incidents - is to add yourself as manager of the other team as well, and set up both teams exactly the same each time, and make the same subs, change the same tactics each time. You might - might - get closer results.

That said, IMO, replaying the same game over and over again is something I've always thought of as, well, pointless.

Point taken, but I suppose what I was looking to get a feel for was the following:

1. The extent to which tactical changes impact performance

2. The extent to which anything the user does impacts performance

3. The extent to which elements outside the users control (opposition tactics and behaviour) impacts performance

If indeed the amount of variables that impact a game (and thus result) are huge then it would be good understand how much a user can actually influence that - both through micro-management (not fun...) and from generally just playing the game and seeing what happens.

What I would never like the game to get to is where success can only come from watching a 3D match in some detail every time. My own view is that the game should be challenging enough to engage the player, but not so detailed that relative success can only come from multiple tactical changes every game. I guess I am one of those players who wants a more immersive experience than FM Classic provides, yet doesn't have the time (or inclination) to want to micro-manage. If there was a setting on the game relating to how hard it was that may be answer but I have no idea if that is viable or if it would go against the vision of what FM is supposed to be. Ultimately I play computer games for fun but if the route to get any gratification from them is quite hard then you tend to not bother - again, that might just be me though.

However, much of the above is independent of the issues I've experienced in the game relating to player instructions and the ME clearly either ignoring them or being incapable of incorporating them. It's frustrating because it isn't clear what works and does not work, which leaves you feeling a bit annoyed towards the game as it suggests a high level of configuration yet does not reflect that on the pitch. A disconnect.

[Magnakai Haaskivi]

Once again, I do think those people who think things have been dumbed down and the ME gone backwards could do with visiting the tactics forum. The discussion in there is stronger and richer than it has ever been.

I generally agree, but the problem is that this time out there seems to be a lot of adjusting tactics to the ME, whereas in the past it's been adjusting tactics because we didn't understand the sport. When I first started playing I visited there a lot (and I still hang out and read there from time to time, I like that forum) because I had misconceptions about how I should be setting up my team. This year, I feel like the rules I've learned from past years are out the window, and I'm setting up teams that are ME-approved but not sound football; this is emphasized by the nosedive my tactics took after the update, and the long bedding in process for new tactics (which I had to set up because of ME changes) hurts my team. It's not game-breaking, I've definitely played games that are more irritating than this and that are less polished. It IS, however, frustrating, and the "pulling back the wool" effect it had has dampened the experience some.

There's also an attitude of ME apologism in the tactics forum that can be a little bit tough to swallow from time to time. Agreed, a lot of people have crappy tactics (myself included)...but it isn't the ONLY problem they're running into. It's crappy tactics (that may have worked in years prior; some of my tactics from prior years I had to throw out this time around) plus an ME that's less forgiving, and when you ignore one part of that equation it makes it entirely the users fault. Nobody likes to hear that the reason that they can't enjoy something is strictly due to their own incompetence, especially when there are actual, acknowledged ME problems to point to as evidence they aren't totally crazy.

I don't want to sound like an "Anti-Tactics Forum" ranter, though, I really like that forum a lot and visit, and have gotten a lot of good info (a lot of it from your posts, in fact) from there, dating back to FM'09. It's just that fixing tactics doesn't happen in a vacuum, and I feel like I'm adapting tactics to an imperfect recreation of the sport at the moment.

TL;DR: If my tactic problem is only necessitated by the poor ME, and not by a fundamental misunderstanding of the sport, it kills some of the fun, and a game that require intense research to get any sort of positive result might want to consider a bit of retooling (which they've been doing, this isn't a knock on the SI staff).

[jujigatame]

I cannot imagine how anyone could claim 14.1.3 is better than 14.1.4. I find the update VASTLY improved the game. As PSG I have suffered a few league upsets and come back to dominate my next game, so I disagree that morale is overly strong. In fact I found underperformance far more common in 14.1.3 where opposing defenses would sit very deep, clog up the box, and frustrate the hell out of my more creative players.

[CactusC]

My own view is that the game should be challenging enough to engage the player, but not so detailed that relative success can only come from multiple tactical changes every game.

Very true. I never used to have to tweak tactics during games too much, but in FM14 I feel like I have to do it every other minute in order not to lose momentum in the match. And often these changes have an immediate impact, so much so that it feels like you are playing an good old paper-stone-scissors fighting game, where the formula "if the opponent does this, I do that" will take you to victory.

To be honest, I have not yet quite figured out what works and not, but I do know that sitting idly by watching the game will make you lose every time so better to try something random to change the game back in your favor.

[jimbob1000]

7 out of my last 15 league games played so far are practically identical to this at half time

If they were scoring early doors and shutting up shop it would be less annoying(though still crap) but i have 3 or 4 GOOD chances, miss, then the AI will have their first effort on goal(around 40-45mins) of the game and it will inevitably go in.

The one shown was actually an o.g. for them as their player actually missed(for a change) but my midfielder put it in for them instead.

Then we end up on a run in which we just cannot score under any circumstances(penalty misses, open goals missed etc etc)

I can accept it to a point, but when you have been by far the better team in 14 out of 15 games and you have somehow lost 5 games, its just pathetic!

And no "its your tactics" crap, its embarrassing.

Even the team talk at half time doesn't help, i'll get a great response from the players, but still cannot find the back of the net.

[MrPompey]

I cannot imagine how anyone could claim 14.1.3 is better than 14.1.4. I find the update VASTLY improved the game. As PSG I have suffered a few league upsets and come back to dominate my next game, so I disagree that morale is overly strong. In fact I found underperformance far more common in 14.1.3 where opposing defenses would sit very deep, clog up the box, and frustrate the hell out of my more creative players.

AI will be a lot more active in FM14 in deciding its tactics

[jujigatame]

I make almost zero in-game tactical changes (aside from subs) and as PSG I'm winning Ligue 1 by 13 points and won a CL group that had Bayern and Man City in it.

This is what I like about 14.1.4, it seems like if I acquire class creative players and give them a reasonable setup with roles/duties they are well suited for, they can win games without a lot of micromanagement.

[MrPompey]

Well thats another example of keep it simple. If people keep on changing tactics, team instructions and player instructions throughout a game then the FM players will not know what they are doing

Just like real life, FM managers forget they dont really have total control over what players do. real life managers get frustrated and angry so why should it be different for FM managers

[timbamania]

Then what happpens is people will start complaining again that defenders don't stop crosses, wingers are too overpowered etc etc.

I daresay this'll be why no other company even attempts a football management game of this depth, it must be next to impossible to get right.

Personally, I think wing play is generally fine just now. I do see perhaps too many occasions where two defenders immediately run towards the winger, which is then leaving another attacker more free in a dangerous position. The occasions when I've seen the winger pass back to the midfield rather than cross into the box seem to mostly be the right decision. Either he's no space to cross or everyone is marked in the box. Very occassionally is there a situation where a cross would be the better option, but I like the way it's not robotic enough that the cross automatically happens all the time if there's a man free, however frustrating it can be if it's your own team.

I watch nearly all games on 2D classic now, so perhaps I'm just not seeing the animation issues which can cloud judgement on the actual engine, but watching the games this way with this current build of the engine is a very rewarding experience right now.

You do have a point there, but in fact wingers should not be more effective (well, at lower levels they should, but more about that later). But they should be ineffective in a different way.

The classic winger who kisses the side line and tries to get to the goal line to get in a cross is basically dead in the modern game because he simply does not get the space to be effective. All top teams are very good at defending as a team and make it very hard for a winger to be effective. Even my beloved Ajax has not fielded a good winger in a decade or so.

Wingers have two problems:

- they need time and space to be able to get in a good cross, which they simply don't get often enough. The winger is often double teamed, where one defender is covering the back of the wingers direct opponent in case he dribbles past him.

- even if he manges to create space, he lacks time. The cross has to be played quick before the opponent can recover, and often while the winger is running at high speed (which is bad for accuracy of the cross). Because the central defenders know exactly when the cross is played, it is easier for them to position themselves.

Wingers can be very effective in the transition phase obviously, especially when the opponent is playing an attacking style. The transition is the most important phase in modern football since players are incredibly effective at exploiting space. That's why most top teams play with some sort of high pressing, counter attacking style. There are some exceptions, the most well known obviously the Ajax style ball control play which has been played so incredibly well by Guardiola's Barcelona.

However, in general inside forwards do a better job since they can act as wingers in the transition phase as well, and offer much more options against an organised defence.

To depict a winger realistically in the ME, he should:

- have many of his crosses blocked, or be inaccurate;

- not try to buy corners, unless he is forced into a position where he has little other options (most often when he is at high speed near the goal line). Normally he will either try a cross or just control the ball and pass it back instead;

- completed crosses should result in a variety of things: cleared, deflected by either defence or attack, fumbled by defence, missed by everyone, header (or shot) missed, weak header at target (mostly saved), good header saved or scored;

- play crosses over the ground as well;

- look for the pass to the 12/18 yard lines for a shot by an incoming player;

- never play back the ball if he has the chance to cross. I disagree with you on this point. Wingers irl do not decide not to cross when the attackers are marked. Instead they rely on their team mates movement.

At lower levels, the situation changes considerably. At a league like Skrill N/S you will see a very different game:

- many errors both in attack and defence. Especially things like badly or weakly hit shots and clearances, bad positioning, inaccurate play at high speed, bad positioning in general and positioning errors;

- passes in general are shorter (and that is something different from a short passing style), shots are weaker. Many players do not have the technique+power to hit the ball that far/hard;

- but not some of the errors you see in the ME, like: completely pointless punts upfield where no team mate is playing, not playing the very obvious passes (unless players try to dribble or shoot themselves), standing still (or running away) when the ball is very close, 'waiting' for the opponent when they have space.

- high tempo on or near the ball, but not from the whole team. Players simply do not have the stamina to run as much (and at such high speed) as at the top level.

- more chances, but also more bad misses;

In such a match wingers are much more effective, good wingers (and strong forwards) are pretty powerful at the lower leagues because the circumstances suit them.

As an example, here is a video from some highlights from a typical lower level match, Bishop's Stortford is playing Bath City (the actual match starts at 35 seconds). It is really instructive to watch and compare to how LLM matches on the ME look like.

[video=youtube;PCxIfmeIOLY]

I want to point out some highlights:

- at 0:40 there is a deep pass to the left flank for the winger. Look at the arc of the ball, it would hardly clear the goal line even when the first bounce is so close to it. The pass at 0:53 is an even clearer example.

In the match engine, this simply is not possible. The ball simply does not stop fast enough. As a result, much of what lower leagues (and football at any level) play like irl is not represented at all in the ME.

- the short corner at 1:06, is immediately crossed. Look at how no one gets to the ball because;

- the attack at 1:17 is great, good and fast build up to the cross, the defender is completely losing the striker because he only looks at the ball, and than a miss that is typical of this level;

- at 2:17, there's a horrible passing error. That what mistakes look like, not the completely unnecessary passes into no mans land.

- the goal, starting at 3:08. Messy defending, then the winger gets the ball. Look how he puts in a quick cross from a seemingly impossible spot. And look how the lone striker can beat 3 defenders who just stand still.

These are just some of the moments from the game. It is very instructive to watch this and then play a LLM yourself and compare. As it stands, the ME engine can not represent a LLM in a realistic fashion (and it is also limited for top level football).

By the way, I am not saying that this is easy to achieve, or that the ME is bad, or that you can not have fun with fiddling with tactics.

[Beestonite]

......

I want to point out some highlights:

- at 0:40 there is a deep pass to the left flank for the winger. Look at the arc of the ball, it would hardly clear the goal line even when the first bounce is so close to it. The pass at 0:53 is an even clearer example.

In the match engine, this simply is not possible. The ball simply does not stop fast enough. As a result, much of what lower leagues (and football at any level) play like irl is not represented at all in the ME.

- the short corner at 1:06, is immediately crossed. Look at how no one gets to the ball because;

- the attack at 1:17 is great, good and fast build up to the cross, the defender is completely losing the striker because he only looks at the ball, and than a miss that is typical of this level;

- at 2:17, there's a horrible passing error. That what mistakes look like, not the completely unnecessary passes into no mans land.

- the goal, starting at 3:08. Messy defending, then the winger gets the ball. Look how he puts in a quick cross from a seemingly impossible spot. And look how the lone striker can beat 3 defenders who just stand still.

These are just some of the moments from the game. It is very instructive to watch this and then play a LLM yourself and compare. As it stands, the ME engine can not represent a LLM in a realistic fashion (and it is also limited for top level football).

By the way, I am not saying that this is easy to achieve, or that the ME is bad, or that you can not have fun with fiddling with tactics.

Ball movement sounds familiar ...... http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/374752-Ball-Dynamics?highlight=ball+dynamics. The flight of it is very irregular in my opinion, secondary arcs aren't physically possible in the real world unless you're playing on a sheet of ice which somehow has the same behavior as a trampoline.

[CityAndColour]

As an example, here is a video from some highlights from a typical lower level match, Bishop's Stortford is playing Bath City (the actual match starts at 35 seconds). It is really instructive to watch and compare to how LLM matches on the ME look like.

I want to point out some highlights:

- at 0:40 there is a deep pass to the left flank for the winger. Look at the arc of the ball, it would hardly clear the goal line even when the first bounce is so close to it. The pass at 0:53 is an even clearer example.

In the match engine, this simply is not possible. The ball simply does not stop fast enough. As a result, much of what lower leagues (and football at any level) play like irl is not represented at all in the ME.

- the short corner at 1:06, is immediately crossed. Look at how no one gets to the ball because;

- the attack at 1:17 is great, good and fast build up to the cross, the defender is completely losing the striker because he only looks at the ball, and than a miss that is typical of this level;

- at 2:17, there's a horrible passing error. That what mistakes look like, not the completely unnecessary passes into no mans land.

- the goal, starting at 3:08. Messy defending, then the winger gets the ball. Look how he puts in a quick cross from a seemingly impossible spot. And look how the lone striker can beat 3 defenders who just stand still.

These are just some of the moments from the game. It is very instructive to watch this and then play a LLM yourself and compare. As it stands, the ME engine can not represent a LLM in a realistic fashion (and it is also limited for top level football).

By the way, I am not saying that this is easy to achieve, or that the ME is bad, or that you can not have fun with fiddling with tactics.

You forgot the video!

[video=youtube;PCxIfmeIOLY]

[Dagenham_Dave]

SI would have to code in hundreds more player errors if they ever wanted it to REALLY depict a realistic game of football. At any level.

[MrPompey]

SI would have to code in hundreds more player errors if they ever wanted it to REALLY depict a realistic game of football. At any level.

Yep, thats the point. There are many people complaining that the ME is not allowing the players to do EXACTLY what they are asked / instructed to do but does that actually happen in real life?

Clearly the ME needs some changes but in some respects the expectation of FM here is sometimes quite removed from the game its trying to simulate

[jimbo22]

I know its been spoke about and there's been sources posted but the red cards (that I'm seeing) weekly seem crazy for any level (League 2). I've played 4 weeks on the season (2014/15) Week 1 seen 4 red cards, week 2 seen 5, week 3 seen 2, week 4 seen 3.

[MrPompey]

I know its been spoke about and there's been sources posted but the red cards (that I'm seeing) weekly seem crazy for any level (League 2). I've played 4 weeks on the season (2014/15) Week 1 seen 4 red cards, week 2 seen 5, week 3 seen 2, week 4 seen 3.

I think IRL there have been about 37 red cards in league 2 so far so perhaps the stats you mention are actually LESS than real life ?

[Guest El Payaso]

Yep, thats the point. There are many people complaining that the ME is not allowing the players to do EXACTLY what they are asked / instructed to do but does that actually happen in real life?

Clearly the ME needs some changes but in some respects the expectation of FM here is sometimes quite removed from the game its trying to simulate

Well I remember someone from SI once saying (maybe in 2010) that they are trying to make the match engine look as much like real football as possible from the first kick to the end. So aren't people justified to expect that?

I don't think that the game should look exactly like real football because most of the games would be really boring to watch and manage as there really wouldn't be too many highlight or anything. What the game needs is more sensible things happening and better balance. It's pretty much too "random" at times what happens and really too much about that individual efforts and stupid errors instead of one of the sides being actually good.

[timbamania]

You forgot the video!

[video=youtube;PCxIfmeIOLY]

thx mate!

[timbamania]

SI would have to code in hundreds more player errors if they ever wanted it to REALLY depict a realistic game of football. At any level.

I think you are missing the point.

[MrPompey]

Well I remember someone from SI once saying (maybe in 2010) that they are trying to make the match engine look as much like real football as possible from the first kick to the end. So aren't people justified to expect that?

I don't think that the game should look exactly like real football because most of the games would be really boring to watch and manage as there really wouldn't be too many highlight or anything. What the game needs is more sensible things happening and better balance. It's pretty much too "random" at times what happens and really too much about that individual efforts and stupid errors instead of one of the sides being actually good.

You misunderstand my point. I'm saying if the ME DOES reflect real life football then as most people will know there is a limit on how much control a manager has on individual players and there is a large element of surprise.

I think one of the fascinating things about football in real life is that its difficult to always predict what will happen. If multiple people were managaing Man Utd on FM and found themselves in 9th position in the league looking at Southampton in the top 4 without seeing the real life Premiership table I bet they would be complaining that FM is broken and that some elements are random.

I think SI's goal of their ME reflecting real life football is a great target to aim for but I dont think anyone seriously believes that FM is going to achieve this in the very near future. However making progress toward it is something we FM'rs do believe in.

I think the other is that you and I can speak about our views and every FM player will have one that differs, even if slightly.

I do recall a saying.."when you can't please everyone, instead just try and please yourself"

[Guest El Payaso]

I think one of the fascinating things about football in real life is that its difficult to always predict what will happen. If multiple people were managaing Man Utd on FM and found themselves in 9th position in the league looking at Southampton in the top 4 without seeing the real life Premiership table I bet they would be complaining that FM is broken and that some elements are random.

Well there is a new manager in the club and Sir Alex was present for a long time, many people were expecting that there might be one gap year in success. And there still is a long way to go and anything can happen, usually in the long run better players are more steady and big teams are much less likely to frequently drop points and in may the situation often is the common one and we see "The Red may", not this year though unless Arsenal can keep their lead in the league.

And you must remember that the attributes system isn't the same in real life, performanses and form varies more and there really isn't a 1-20 table to see how good a player is currently. Rooney in a bad form IRL really isn't as good as his attributes show in the game they kind a take a short term dive in that kind of situations.

[MrPompey]

1. Are not FM'rs the new managers of what ever club they start to manage with?

2. Attributes - well raise it with the approriate data researcher to get the stats updated to reflect real life

3. Rooney scored 2 goals on the weekend didn't he?

4. Man City struggling away from home

5. Chelsea struggling

6. Pompey expected to win League 2, they are currently looking over their shoulder at relegation and are managerless (PS I've applied for the job)

Sometimes real life throws up things in a similar way that FM does only if FM does it first people think something is wrong

[dan_lcfc]

How do sell on percentages work?

I dont think IM that bad at maths, but surely they would have reveived £250 from 1k? Or are there other things factored in? Loyalty bonuses or something? Thanks

Is this a bug? or are other things involved in a transfer fee?

[The_Moose]

There's still a quite significant problem with the match engine that hasn't been fixed. I use man marking with my defenders and the AI lacks the intelligence to know when to mark their man and when to challenge the player with the ball. This has cost me many goals from counter attacks following a set piece when the last man has pushed up to mark his man leaving the opposing ball carrier to run towards the goal unopposed. This leaves me with the unenviable choice of either using zonal marking which is bound to produce more goal scoring chances against me or to hope that I can outscore the opposition. I've chosen the latter.

This is something that has been a problem in previous games too so I'd have expected it to have been avoided in this game.

[Viggo Vickers]

Noticing a lack of fitness coaches generating at low level.

Managing in New Zealand, club just turned professional and the players are upset because of the standard of fitness coaching. In 2016 and no former players have become fitness coaches, nor any regens, seems to be none in the region and no replies from the fitness coach advert for a few months now.

[timbamania]

You misunderstand my point. I'm saying if the ME DOES reflect real life football then as most people will know there is a limit on how much control a manager has on individual players and there is a large element of surprise.

I think one of the fascinating things about football in real life is that its difficult to always predict what will happen. If multiple people were managaing Man Utd on FM and found themselves in 9th position in the league looking at Southampton in the top 4 without seeing the real life Premiership table I bet they would be complaining that FM is broken and that some elements are random.

I think SI's goal of their ME reflecting real life football is a great target to aim for but I dont think anyone seriously believes that FM is going to achieve this in the very near future. However making progress toward it is something we FM'rs do believe in.

I think the other is that you and I can speak about our views and every FM player will have one that differs, even if slightly.

I do recall a saying.."when you can't please everyone, instead just try and please yourself"

Well said.

[themadsheep2001]

There's still a quite significant problem with the match engine that hasn't been fixed. I use man marking with my defenders and the AI lacks the intelligence to know when to mark their man and when to challenge the player with the ball. This has cost me many goals from counter attacks following a set piece when the last man has pushed up to mark his man leaving the opposing ball carrier to run towards the goal unopposed. This leaves me with the unenviable choice of either using zonal marking which is bound to produce more goal scoring chances against me or to hope that I can outscore the opposition. I've chosen the latter.

This is something that has been a problem in previous games too so I'd have expected it to have been avoided in this game.

Most marking these days is zonal (especially in the back line). Centre defenders don't follow their man all over the place, but pick them up when they enter their zone. What you are wanting in terms of "man marking" is actually your centre back getting tight to his man when he arrives, that's tight zonal marking, not man marking in the truest sense, even though the lines have been very much blurred in punditry and terminology. Its also certainly not true that zonal marking is bound to produce more goal scoring chances, contrary to the opinions of those on MOTD

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/372207-Things-you-may-or-may-not-know-about-marking..... definitely worth a read

[RTHerringbone]

There's still a quite significant problem with the match engine that hasn't been fixed. I use man marking with my defenders and the AI lacks the intelligence to know when to mark their man and when to challenge the player with the ball. This has cost me many goals from counter attacks following a set piece when the last man has pushed up to mark his man leaving the opposing ball carrier to run towards the goal unopposed. This leaves me with the unenviable choice of either using zonal marking which is bound to produce more goal scoring chances against me or to hope that I can outscore the opposition. I've chosen the latter.

This is something that has been a problem in previous games too so I'd have expected it to have been avoided in this game.

"Mark Specific Player" doesn't actually mean man mark - it is quite a misleading label in that respect.

It is intended as more of a hatchet man job more typically used to assign a DM to pick up a particularly dangerous AM.

To get a DC to shadow an opposition striker is dangerous, and risks dragging the defensive line completely out of place.

EDIT ^^ Beaten by themadsheep2001!

[jimbo22]

One thing that is annoying me is central defenders getting dragged all over the place, even with no instructions and a limited defender setup they get dragged out of position all the time?? how would this be avoided?

[Zacker]

I must say this new patch is worlds above the older ones. There are way less goals, stupid shots, and teams can now defend decently. It's also much more realistic, it really was an improvement.

But there still is much to improve, and some bugs still exist.

The worst, in my opinion, is that long throws ALWAYS (90%, that is) end up in danger. Either a great save, or just above the goal, or against the post. Seriously needs to be nerfed. I have Cédric Soares with 16 long throws attribute, and i'm getting almost always a goal per game (tall CBs getting too much goals).

Also, lob shots. Always. From any guy, doesn't even need to have the PPM.

Longthrows and lob shots need to be nerfed, guys! They really do.

If it has already been said, sorry for bugging you, but I can really confirm it's ovepowered.

And there are still too many goals, guys. Less than before this patch, but still too many goals. In FM, more realism is always more fun.

You can do it! And thanks for the updates.

gg, guys

[Federico]

I must say this new patch is worlds above the older ones. There are way less goals, stupid shots, and teams can now defend decently. It's also much more realistic, it really was an improvement.

Ok sell me your game! Because this is exactly the opposite of what I see on my save!

[huiop2]

Ok sell me your game! Because this is exactly the opposite of what I see on my save!

do you mean that on your save you are seeing way more goals?

[Gene]

I feel like Karl Pilkington whenever I play now... I just turn into the world's largest moaner.

It seems as if player instructions have little effect on how players perform on the pitch. I play with IFs want them to be more central, yet I notice no difference in the average position if tell them to sit narrow or not. They also tend to just run to the byline everytime before attempting a cross even if I tell them to cross from deep. Is this just me blowing my tactics or is this an issue for everyone.

[Federico]

do you mean that on your save you are seeing way more goals?

Well I was not referring to goals only, anyway I'm playing italian Serie A and I noticed the average of goals conceded by each team is higher than normal But I consider this straight related to defensive behaviour that, in my opinion, needs to be massively fixed.

[cynet]

Slight disappointment with regards to FA cup result Millwall beat Man UTD and Millwall struggled of 11th place in season 1, the AI never fails to amaze me

[The_Moose]

"Mark Specific Player" doesn't actually mean man mark - it is quite a misleading label in that respect.

It is intended as more of a hatchet man job more typically used to assign a DM to pick up a particularly dangerous AM.

To get a DC to shadow an opposition striker is dangerous, and risks dragging the defensive line completely out of place.

EDIT ^^ Beaten by themadsheep2001!

So you never instruct your defenders to mark a specific player then?