santy001 Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Or buy Fabregas this summer. Are you aware of who it was that did most of his nurturing as a youngster Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
evertonmarc Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 The CA/PA system also prevents Messi being MESSI MESSI MESSI. If they put Messi in the game as he is IRL, he would break the match engine. Messi....The Chuck Norris of Football Games Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burford Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 stop comlaining barca are not unbeatable irl so why should they be upped on fm messi is the best player in the world at the moment and he is also the best player on fm so why should he be made even better stupid post and stupid argument cant see why thid thread hasnt been deleted if they made barcelona any better they would be almost unbeatable which is ridiculous because in real life they do get beaten just like any other team Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kawee Posted May 6, 2011 Author Share Posted May 6, 2011 No one's asking them to be unbeatable. However, in FM, they're too beatable and their wins aren't all that impressive. Their possession stat is not high enough for a start. They are +70 GD in the league right now. Have you seen FM Barcelona go +70 GD? I haven't. Also, when you play against them as one of the better teams, they're not that great a challenge. IRL, Barcelona walk into any game as the favourites. In FM, I've seen them get dominated by Bayern, and even I, as Arsenal, dominate them. I'm talking exclusively about the first few seasons. Long-term game is irrelevant since there is too much variables. However, in the short-term, I would want Barcelona to be as big a challenge as they are IRL. Right now, they're good, but not that good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggusD Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 It is more difficult to face Ronaldo and Real Madrid than it is to face Barcelona and Messi, at least in my experience. I remember in FM10.3 with Kaka on one winger and Ronaldo on the other... pretty much unbeatable! Barcelona was a walkover once I had a similar-powered team with Southampton. I think that all the players in Barcelona should have "plays one-twos" and through balls. I also think that the reason Barca isn't dominating as much is because they are set to play 4-5-1 defensive tactics, and that defensive tactic is low-lying and counter-attacking as default. In RL, Barca may play 4-5-1 true enough, but they push high and move their midfield forwards to outplay their opponents completely while in possession. I think that the best thing to do is to give Guardiola a 4-2-3-1 tactic and use the 4-5-1 only as a defensive last-resort outlet. That would fix the problem. Also set his passing mentality to 1 (max passing) and tempo to 1 (max slow), width to 20 (max wide). I think I will do this and see if it helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ori Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 It's much more likely if you play in the champions league knock-out rounds. Hahahaha That is good (Never mind the tie was decided in Barcelona) BTW, Is that you Jose Mourinho? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AB-forever Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 But in real life is it Barcelona players or Guardiola that make the team. I don't know but in the game it's Guardiola and that's what matters... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exius Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 I agree that Barcelona is underpowered. Just watch IRL stats in their matches. http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/matches/season=2011/live/index.html?matchday=12&day=1&match=2007745 for example. 600-700 passes every game. It is almost impossible in FM. When I faced Barcelona in CL I lost both matches, but their game, their style disappointed me. It is nowhere near to real life Barcelona. But I think that problem is not with database or research. Players are not underestimated, it is just match engine. It cannot generate such football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avelives Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Personally I think they are overrated IRL, they are a magnificent attacking team no doubt and one of the best in the world at pressuring opponents into mistakes, but actually (similar to Arsenal) if you set up with a good plan against them and play a more physical and negative style you will quite often reap the rewards. I dont watch Spanish football so I cant comment on their domestic quality, but in the CL, honestly Ive never seen them overpower a truly good team, and often their wins against good teams are courtesy of dodgy referees and luck. Im a Chelsea fan and my wife supports Tottenham so as you can imagine im not Arsenals biggest fan by a long way but man for man in the two legs this year Arsenal were not outplayed and were unfortunate to lose (again dodgy referee imo) They are fantastic at demolishing and humiliating inferior teams, but against organisde quality players they often struggle and totally lack a Plan B. That said they do have some of the finest footballers on earth in their side so of course they are good, but the best ever, not in my opinion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champion Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 I think Barcelona players quality is fairly reflected in the game, but the real culprit is the formation AI Guardiola use which is 41221 Or 451 in FM terms. In my opinion this formation sucks in FM 11 match engine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
athos Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 I dont watch Spanish football so I cant comment on their domestic quality, but in the CL, honestly Ive never seen them overpower a truly good team, and often their wins against good teams are courtesy of dodgy referees and luck. Im a Chelsea fan and my wife supports Tottenham so as you can imagine im not Arsenals biggest fan by a long way but man for man in the two legs this year Arsenal were not outplayed and were unfortunate to lose (again dodgy referee imo) Arsenal had 0 shot. ZERO shot. Yes, there were referee mistakes, but it doesn't change the fact that Arsenal was outplayed in the 2nd leg because Wenger chickened out and played defensively. They are fantastic at demolishing and humiliating inferior teams, but against organisde quality players they often struggle and totally lack a Plan B. They do have a Plan B, it's called diving and refball. Amazingly SI also put it in the game for Barca to reflect real life. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
milnerpoint Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 I dont watch Spanish football so I cant comment on their domestic quality, but in the CL, honestly Ive never seen them overpower a truly good team, and often their wins against good teams are courtesy of dodgy referees and luck. Im a Chelsea fan and my wife supports Tottenham so as you can imagine im not Arsenals biggest fan by a long way but man for man in the two legs this year Arsenal were not outplayed and were unfortunate to lose (again dodgy referee imo) Rubbish, Arsenal were completely outplayed over the two leges, they had good moments at home but over in spain they were completely outclassed, even without the red card they would have lost that game, not one single shot on goal the entire match. People go on about these dodgy decisions but out with the yellow card for Van Persie, which was shocking, i dont really see the issue, Pepe deserved his red card a few weeks ago, it was a shocking challenge, yes Alves made the most of it, but its not like they are the only team that does that, Marcello and Ronaldo are equally as guilty of play acting. Barca are probably one of the best footballing teams ever at the moment, if you dont watch a lot of spanish football you wont appreciate how much they completely dominate games. Not only that but they are very good defensively as a unit, very few teams could get away with playing a centre midfielder at centre back, and a centre back at left back in one of the biggest games of the season, and not struggle to contain the opposition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avelives Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Arsenal had 0 shot. ZERO shot. Yes, there were referee mistakes, but it doesn't change the fact that Arsenal was outplayed in the 2nd leg because Wenger chickened out and played defensively. Rubbish, Arsenal were completely outplayed over the two leges, they had good moments at home but over in spain they were completely outclassed, even without the red card they would have lost that game, not one single shot on goal the entire match. People go on about these dodgy decisions but out with the yellow card for Van Persie, which was shocking, i dont really see the issue, Pepe deserved his red card a few weeks ago, it was a shocking challenge, yes Alves made the most of it, but its not like they are the only team that does that, Marcello and Ronaldo are equally as guilty of play acting. Barca are probably one of the best footballing teams ever at the moment, if you dont watch a lot of spanish football you wont appreciate how much they completely dominate games. Not only that but they are very good defensively as a unit, very few teams could get away with playing a centre midfielder at centre back, and a centre back at left back in one of the biggest games of the season, and not struggle to contain the opposition. To be fair they didnt need to have any shots, they had the lead it was down to Barca to score. Thats common sense why go and play open attacking football at the Nou Camp when there is no need. And if you think going down to ten men in the first half wasn't a MASSIVE factor you need your head testing. Dont get me wrong, im no fan of Arsenal, I hate them. They have zero winning mentality, they crumble in the face of the slightest challenge. But ignoring possession they were not outplayed at home, Barca spent most of the game aimlessly passing the ball around with almost zero effect, like they do against many non Spanish teams. Its like the Inter games last year, they had no reply to that style and deserved to lose. Arsenal had no chance in that second leg when they went down to 10 men, unlike Inter who had the mentality and players to defend with 10 men, and lets no pretend otherwise with the exception of Sneijder, Etoo and a few others that Inter team was nothing special. And my own team Chelsea outplayed them over the 2 legs and got totally robbed, one of the biggest injustices of league football ive ever seen. Also dont get me wrong im not saying Barca are alone in cheating, all players do it to some extent. Its the refs who are at fault. Its like Manure in the EPL, refs are so intimidated by Fergie (and previously Mourinho) that they facilitate many Manure wins with crappy decisions, not directly the Manure players faults but true nonetheless. And so it is with Barca, everyone has so bought into this 'Barca are living gods' rubbish thats its almost like when Messi does get tackled they assume it must be a foul if they havent quite seen the incident. Besides im not saying they are crap or anything, they are clearly amongst the top teams in the world, but I wouldnt say they are head and shoulders above the others at all. Just a tad... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnriqueZove Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Their power level is over 9000! In all seriousness though Barcelona struggle in the game against physical & direct sides more than they do against sides playing a passing game. If you go into a match with Barcelona trying to outplay them you'll look very silly. Inter Milan have shown how you can nullify a large portion of Barcelona's threat recently, Real Madrid were doing a good job of it until losing a man. Play two solid banks of 4 and let Barcelona pass it sideways & backwards all they want and they struggle to go anywhere. The tactic relies on either finding a tiny amount of space to work with, or hitting you on the counter. How Messi, Iniesta and co would stand up to the crunching tackles of the likes of Samba, Shawcross etc players they're unlikely to come up against would be interesting. I completely agree with it. Remember RM won 1st trophy this season. They aren't unbeatable, just the opposition manager should know how to nullify their possession advantage. IRL that may be a bit difficult but as the AI manager works on an algorithm so they can pick the weaknesses of opposing team very easily. The match engine doesn't allow Barca to play like IRL, they can't dominate possession as much in the game. The CA/PA system also prevents Messi being MESSI MESSI MESSI. If they put Messi in the game as he is IRL, he would break the match engine. Messi wins every world player of year & Ballon d'or till 30 and even furtherer if not injured in all 8 saves I have played. I don't remember any player IRL doing that be it Pele, Maradona or Cyruff. CA/PA system assigns highest PA to Messi. But still there is a problem. So Only way is to change whole game algorithm just to suit a player who never performs for the national team. BTW Barcelona IRL have won the Spanish League for the last two years only (yes I know they are going to win it again - but let's go with history here), prior to that Real won it two years in a row, Barcelona again for the two before that and then Real and Valencia alternated for the four years before that. So what I'm saying is whoever is strongest now isn't, in all likelihood, going to maintain it's superiority going forward (not saying that that's not possible, just that it's not likely) and it would be wrong of FM to set any side in any league up so that it was certain of maintianing it's dominant position over time as it's a simulation and life's not like that. Quite right Man. How have they been dominant in RL? They have only won the UCL twice since 2000 and 3 times overall. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 After their recent win...surely the argument is back and has more truth than ever. my game Barcelona have not reached one CL final Possession is never that good i really dont think 'well inter beat them once' is a good enough excuse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The-Perfect-Fm'er! Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 It's your tactics ...in the tactic forum, a Barcelona possesion tactic has been created quite well to the point likes of Xavi makes over 100 passes and have 65-70% possesion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mansleg Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Would you mind posting who HAS made the CL final in your save as well as who knocked out Barca each season? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special EFX Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Barcelona are not unbeatable and how is the game ment to reflect a great performance that occoured this past weekend? It's called form. It's the thing that EA Sports make a lot of money out of with Adidas Live Season, which is an absolute joke. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 @ The-perfect-fm'er i am not barcelona @ Specail efx come on mate you make yourself sound ignorant i am not saying they are unbeateable but in 6/7 years on my game they have not got to one final..unless for some reason the magic trio get broken up that isnt going to happen...i will bet it now with you..put money where my mouth is. neither have they ever got possession as low as in my game in the past 5 years...... not saying they should be unbeatable...but with stats to back it up whenever they get beat it is so very rarely that they lose the battle of possession which is contradicted in FM...so many factors go against the myth of them suddenly losing form Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 @ mansleg yep 2010/2011 knocked out in first round by OM losing possession 52 to 48 2011/2012 knocked out semis real madrid ..fair enough but aggregate was 7-1 major lose in possession 2012/2013 knocked out in first round by benfica...aggregate 5-2 lose in possession 56 to 44 2013/2014 knocked out in q.finals by man city (very strong by this point) won on possession 52 to 48.....understandable ..much later game factors and numbers involved make it compelty realistic ...not a prob...but at least the first 3 seasons should be more relative Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 and actually SPECIAL EFX in the last 6 years barcelona have been in the most finals only matched with united who lost twice to them out of those three....your point is in before ......invalid/mute ...nada Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bradley21 Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Barcelona are fairly poor on my save as well, in 16 seasons they have reached the final just 4 times and only won it once. Ususally they get knocked out by weak teams like benfice, marseille, leverkusen...etc, its pretty odd. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special EFX Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 and actually SPECIAL EFX in the last 6 years barcelona have been in the most finals only matched with united who lost twice to them out of those three....your point is in before ......invalid/mute ...nada Your logic is stupid because it has happened in real life it should happen in the game? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mansleg Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Maybe Barca are just so good that FM cannot simulate the beauty that is their style of play? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 yes im not criticizing fm in fact alot of the criticism of it i completely disagree with. and i understand the amount of maths and work that goes into the match engine and to produce something of a dominating force is hard due to them taking away the more robotic..on the rails" aspect of the game which is good 'a modernization of game's programming' and after 4 or 5 seasons i think it is more than likely they have no need to be so dominant ..i mean possibly man united rebuilding ...rethinking and re shaping..man c having now a straight faced manager (not a clown) will keep building....arsenal have always the threat to suddenly actually grow up and Chelsea will start to throw the fossils out not to mention the rest of europe....and it only take Iniesta to be bought....Xavi to be injured, or Messi, to break the magic trio up .......pero unless these injuries or purhcases explain that in the first 4 or 5 season i see no reason for these results to happen...im only responding por que i see no reason for people to object to the opening post when there is nothing backing up their point but mere opinion and fan boy-ism Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special EFX Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Man Utd won the PL this year yet Chelsea won it on my save. **** me the games bugged! Idiot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Special EFX you are using the logical fallacy of reductio ad absurdum. there are too many factors going into who wins the premier league it is acceptable and understandable....what i am saying is not in a blue moon would barcelona ever produce those possession stats in the next few years and to compare what you have said with man utd and chelsea to OM and barcelona is the exact definition of a reductio ad absurdum in actual point you have done it to the state in which the factos invovled in the two diffrent situations are so many that it is impossible for me to reply, you have just compared a season long league to a season long cup tournement and you say you are not proving your own ingorance, plus by calling me an idiot and relating it to an argument you are stepping on the lines of ad hominemus ...i never said the game is bugged im simply bringing up a point which infact im stating has many paths such as the; difficulty of making it such an independent processor of results yet making a dominant force in the game which is AI represented. I think it would also create more of a challenge to the player if barcelona was dominant in the first few seasons...remember matey i am also stating the possession issues as well there is no reason to be acerbic young man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 its in the manner they lose not the fact they do ..it would be a joy to read the stats of them losing to anyone and see that they have been out masterminded...but OM beating them at their own game uhhh no way. Logic can not be stupid because you produce an infinite circle of fallacy ..at least in informal logic your use of man utd and chelsea as an example is also a subterfuge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay96 Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 You are always going to score goals against Barca's defence, however I agree Pedro, Messi, Villa should be bagging more goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJJESSE Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 People say that fm doesn't portray the way messi and barca play in real life and the match engine is not good enough to do so.Which is kind of true but not in my case... The raped me. I'm chelsea and double winners, I knocked a very good Real Madrid side out of the quarter- final then drew barca and got beat on a total aggregate score of 5-1 and my tactics wernt that bad. Take a look: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lcDOH5pZnE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwgFb9c0mPA Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antmanbrooks Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 I beg to differ with the OP. With the right tactics Barecelona can be even better than the real life version and play just as attractive football. See here. SORRY, IGNORE THIS. I THOUGHT THE OP MEANT WHEN HE PLAYED AS THEM. My bad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
E.Gray Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 I would agree, but not in the sense of the short term game, but more in the long term, the abandonment of the "4-3-3" formation is quite annoying, along with the fact they go a bit mental in the transfer market and end up being more Madrid then Madrid, alongside the fact that in my game by 2050s, no Spanish team has managed to win a champions league title in nearly 20 years with Madrid not winning the Spanish league title for over 25 years! But in the short term Barcelona are perfectly powerful. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJJESSE Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 this simulates them kind of in real life... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOTSz74aeO0 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressers Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 very good posting guys i agree totally, i understand that with pre-game tactics adjustments it can be made 'perfect' but to others remember i am on about not controlling them so it is not up to me yes i agree with jays comment but no problem with goals against because i enjoy the work tht goes in to the Independent processer, and would rather that then a predetermined one, and hence their defence deserves goals against but midfield and striker stats................. and E.gray yes i agree...barcelona just bought JAMES MILNER but like i said so many factors go into it at that point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
champion_2 Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 I think Barcelona players quality is fairly reflected in the game, but the real culprit is the formation AI Guardiola use which is 41221 Or 451 in FM terms. In my opinion this formation sucks in FM 11 match engine. That's it unfortunatley Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shwan Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 You don't hear this word a lot in FM community, Thank God. However, I feel like Barcelona is no where near as good as they are IRL.They don't dominate the league as much as they do IRL. Their front three doesn't combine to get 100+ goals a season like IRL. And they're that too difficult to beat like they are in real life. I just beat them at the Camp Nou 3-1 as Arsenal in the first season! And it was a very even game! AI Bayern beat them 2-1 at the Camp Nou as well, while having 53% of the ball! It just doesn't feel as satisfying when I beat them because they're not that dominant. Yes they win the league, but not in the same fashion as they do IRL. I'm not sure how to go about improving them since they already have the best squad in the world. However, if they win the league and the UCL again this year, I sincerely hope that FM12 will be able to represent how dominant they are. P.S. I didn't have a player sent off against them either this is due that FM favor crossing game and give striker more advantage in crosses over defenders than they should IRL.. and Barca don't have good crosser and let alone tall good striker in air, this is why they can't be as good as IRL. IRL players like vidic prove that strikers don't have that big advantage over defenders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.