Christiano Ronaldo should be the best player in FM2009

[chopper99]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by VonBlade:

Off topic shurley? This isn't a GQ about FM, at best it's a data thing, at worst it's just some off-topic football guff.

Sheesh. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Surely it's a discussion about which players should have the highest CA/PA in the next installment of FM. As it's not an issue with any current data in the game then I feel this is definitely the correct forum for it.

[turn it upto 11]

i dont think ronaldo is a complete player, hes a complete attacking player, but the defensive side of his game isnt briliant. hes at his peak now IMO. onemore season at man u then hell move to madrid and go downhill from there.

[C(r)ouch]

I swear if I see his Penalty taking and composure over 16 I will walk into the Man Utd researcher's room and beat the living hell out of him

[gcormack]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

legend and absolutely correct. if this topic is all about who has performed the best this season and has been most effective for their team the big carlos 'the best centre back in scotland' cuellar will take it hands down.

however i feel Si will overllok this when handing out the ratings next season.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Ronaldo goes missing in the big games though!

Even in the champions league final he was no where near as effective as against an average prem team.

Surely the best player in the world can do it when it counts in the biggest games against the best players when the pressure is on? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

was this meant to be a good point. if so, are you trying to say rio ferdinand plays better against chelsea than derby? - no offense derby fans.

ronaldo is the best attacking player in the world.

[turn it upto 11]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

easy to be a good defender when your not playing in a top class league

[gcormack]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by turn it upto 11:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

easy to be a good defender when your not playing in a top class league </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

away with yer pash!

SPL is better the EPL anyday

[VonBlade]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by chopper99:

Surely it's a discussion about which players should have the highest CA/PA in the next installment of FM. As it's not an issue with any current data in the game then I feel this is definitely the correct forum for it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No this is a "I think C.Ronaldo is great"; "I disagree"; "Well you're wrong"; "No you are", type of discussion.

As it's not discussing any data within the current game it's not about Football Manager.

Discussion potential data should be done with the researchers. Discussing if a player in real-life has done enough to be counted amongst the greats, is just general off-topic stuff. Much like any discussions of the CL final are.

VB

[chopper99]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by VonBlade:

No this is a "I think C.Ronaldo is great"; "I disagree"; "Well you're wrong"; "No you are", type of discussion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fair point, but I still disagree that this is in the wrong forum. Particularly with this bit:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">As it's not discussing any data within the current game it's not about Football Manager. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There are plenty of discussions in here that are not about the current game but are discussions about football manager.

Anyway it matters not what you and I think, the mods can decide.

[Doyle]

Out of interest, regarding Carlos Cuellar, how is the decision made on his CA of 199, as in which factors gave him the highest rating, I must confess I havn't heard of him until I saw his name mentioned on this forum

[dragosani]

he's 6 foot three, has curly hair, his teeth are ucked but we dont care! carlos cuellar...rangers centre half!

long live King Carlos (well until he moves somewhere else)

[gcormack]

hes the next jean allan boumsong (but not in ability) an absolute beast of a player that rangers somehow managed to sign and will undoubtedly leave for some priemieship team who arent even getting european football

although this time cuellar has said he will stay. either way we have a great player or a tidy profit

[Ter]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by turn it upto 11:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

easy to be a good defender when your not playing in a top class league </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

He was class in the Champions League / UEFA Cup as well against teams like Barcelona, Lyon, Stuttgart, Fiorentina, Werder Bremen, Zenit etc

199 isn't good enough. 200 I say.

[postal postie]

considering in my current game (i'm liverpool ) ronaldo scored 30 in 32 games (he had a few injuries) in the first season and then in the second he has 17 in 25 not to mention countless assists then id say FM already as a pretty fair assessment of him.

[glamdring]

I think Claude Davis should be the best player in FM2009. His contribution to getting Derby so thoroughly relegated should not be under-estimated

[Nomis07]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

199 isn't good enough. 200 I say. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

199 for Cuellar and 200 for Steven Davis

-200 for Fernando Ricksen he was once labelled as "the one man chernobyl" in Northern Ireland's Saturday Night.

[postal postie]

are we saying that ronaldo can not improve any further?

if so then lets give him 200PA.

i'm pretty sure he can improve in some areas though. he's only young so iw ould give him about 190

[Stomalomalus]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Navie:

Ok let me put it in another way...who has been the best player in the world at any position, it has been Ronaldo because...for a midfielder he has scored 42 goals this season, has any midfielder EVER scored that many? He scores in different ways that is not normal for a midfielder, he is genius, people who don't get this need to open their eyes. Has any other midfielder scored that many? Has any scriker?...I don't think so. This is not about position! This is about football and what a player has done over the course of the season, he is the reason Man Utd have had success. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This post is the only reason I have replied here, because I hate this.

This season, Ronaldo was A FORWARD!

For the vast majority of games this season, SAF played a font 3 much like Barca do, or much like Utd. did with Best, Kidd and Law! A FRONT 3!

Yes, he played on the wing against scum, but that was because SAF wanted a tactical battle.

If anyones stats need changing, then Ronaldo needs to be made AMR/l FC and Tevez needs to drop his composure to 12.

[prome]

European Championship will be a good test for Ronaldo's skills. In there he won't play in the best team and will play against quality players.

[Bongo-Bongo]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stomalomalus:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Navie:

Ok let me put it in another way...who has been the best player in the world at any position, it has been Ronaldo because...for a midfielder he has scored 42 goals this season, has any midfielder EVER scored that many? He scores in different ways that is not normal for a midfielder, he is genius, people who don't get this need to open their eyes. Has any other midfielder scored that many? Has any scriker?...I don't think so. This is not about position! This is about football and what a player has done over the course of the season, he is the reason Man Utd have had success. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This post is the only reason I have replied here, because I hate this.

This season, Ronaldo was A FORWARD!

For the vast majority of games this season, SAF played a font 3 much like Barca do, or much like Utd. did with Best, Kidd and Law! A FRONT 3!

Yes, he played on the wing against scum, but that was because SAF wanted a tactical battle.

If anyones stats need changing, then Ronaldo needs to be made AMR/l FC and Tevez needs to drop his composure to 12. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was going to post exactly the same thing. All this crap that Ronaldo has scored 42 goals from midfield makes me laugh. He might not have played as an out and out striker, but he's certainly not played as a midfielder, he's been a forward in most games. I'm not trying to undermine his achievement of scoring 42 goals in a season, because it is a fantastic achievement, but all this 42 goals from midfield is simply untrue.

[azeri4life]

Hey fanboys, admit that the match engine and the CA system is a joke. Are you telling me that even though Elano's stats are a lot better than Ronaldo's, because Ronaldo is two-footed it makes him better?!

[Hershie]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

Hey fanboys, admit that the match engine and the CA system is a joke. Are you telling me that even though Elano's stats are a lot better than Ronaldo's, because Ronaldo is two-footed it makes him better?! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

1) What?

2) Who are these 'fanboys', and furthermore, what is one?

3) The CA system may need work, or atleast the way it is presented, but it's not actually CA/PA that are affecting it that much, it's just that to balance out the performance of players, so that some aren't unrealistically good, and perform so much better than someone with the same stats, stats are toned down by footedness and positioning.

Ronaldo, if you play the game at all, will evidently almost always out perform Elano, albeit not to the level of his real life performances in terms of goal scoring, due to the AI's choice of tactics.

I'm not entirely sure I've made sense; I don't sleep enough.

[Stomalomalus]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

Hey fanboys, admit that the match engine and the CA system is a joke. Are you telling me that even though Elano's stats are a lot better than Ronaldo's, because Ronaldo is two-footed it makes him better?! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ronaldos CA is better than Elanos.

His Physical stats are a total of 20 better than Elanos

And Ronaldos hidden atributes are higher by 14!

Plus, yes, his two footedness has a huge impact! If Elano gets the ball on his left - despite having finishing the same as Ronaldo - he will hit the back of the net far less often.

[aenariel]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm sorry Ter, but that statement only shows how "British-centered" FM is.

[Hershie]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by aenariel:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm sorry Ter, but that statement only shows how "British-centered" FM is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think you're missing the obvious tongue-in-cheekness of the statement.

[azeri4life]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stomalomalus:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

Hey fanboys, admit that the match engine and the CA system is a joke. Are you telling me that even though Elano's stats are a lot better than Ronaldo's, because Ronaldo is two-footed it makes him better?! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ronaldos CA is better than Elanos.

His Physical stats are a total of 20 better than Elanos

And Ronaldos hidden atributes are higher by 14!

Plus, yes, his two footedness has a huge impact! If Elano gets the ball on his left - despite having finishing the same as Ronaldo - he will hit the back of the net far less often. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So tell me why when you look at their stats, Ronaldo seems to have a far inferior appearance in terms of his attributes? His higher CA is certianly not illustrated to us apart from his two-footedness.

[Stomalomalus]

The most important stats are higher for Ronaldo. He is a much more rounded player. Elano cant head and cant jump and is 5'7" so wont score many headers over a season. Ronaldo on the other hand, can jump very well, and head very well, and will therefore score headers.

Also, ronaldo is faster than Elano, and stronger, and his two footedness means he can score from anywhere in the box.

As his hidden attributes are better, he will also react better to criticism, praise, pressure situations, etc. And the hidden attributes are the most important in the game.

Elano is a very good player. But his stats allow him to do only one thing. Ronaldo is a multi-faceted player in game and irl.

[ahmed.sg]

Ronaldo is supposedly a winger. 7 assists this season. Nuff said.

[Ched]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stomalomalus:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

Hey fanboys, admit that the match engine and the CA system is a joke. Are you telling me that even though Elano's stats are a lot better than Ronaldo's, because Ronaldo is two-footed it makes him better?! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ronaldos CA is better than Elanos.

His Physical stats are a total of 20 better than Elanos

And Ronaldos hidden atributes are higher by 14!

Plus, yes, his two footedness has a huge impact! If Elano gets the ball on his left - despite having finishing the same as Ronaldo - he will hit the back of the net far less often. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So tell me why when you look at their stats, Ronaldo seems to have a far inferior appearance in terms of his attributes? His higher CA is certianly not illustrated to us apart from his two-footedness. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

1/ You've started throwing around the word fanboy, so anyone with half a brain already thinks you're a moron - if you act politely you are much more likely to get a reasonable response.

2/ Compare results not stats. Elano performs fairly well, ronaldo regularly tears teams apart in FM - just because you don't think his stats are as good, doesn't mean he isn't a better player.

[x42bn6]

Other than the fact the two-footedness hurts his attributes in Football Manager, he's still easily very good in the game.

But in reality, there is very little difference in terms of ability between, say, Kaka, Messi and Ronaldo.

[CowRonaldo]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BARNESDON:

Ronaldo goes missing in the big games though!

Even in the champions league final he was no where near as effective as against an average prem team.

Surely the best player in the world can do it when it counts in the biggest games against the best players when the pressure is on? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

He has good in the CL final. Seems like you guys expect him to go on solo runs the whole time, but he did more than that against Chelsea. Great passes to Evra, great crosses in the middle, and most importantly he scored.

[PoopyPants]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

PA 200?

[kopsy101]

have you people seen ronaldos goal/shot ratio. ill be honest, its pretty terrible. much higher than the likes of tevez, rooney and torres. at the moment torres is the most clinical player but just doesnt play with the team ronaldo does. what i am saying the reason he has scored so much is largely because of the team around him. ive seen games where he misses sitters then will finally get a tap-in and then hes mister score-all again. same with rooney. commentators get hard-ons when they recieve the ball

hes not a midfielder for god sake. hes not a striker but a forward, a second striker. the reason rooney doesnt score as much is because he comes short then creating chances for ronaldo or other 1 in forward 3.

i think the best player in the world is messi then ronaldo then kaka. i have my reasons

[Jens Lehmann]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hershie:

'Best Player' is an over-used and misleading label. Ronaldo may be the best, arguably, in his position, but that does not neccessarily make him a better player than someone in a different role.

Why should an attacking player be a 'better player' than a defensive one? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Im so very glad that there is someone else out there! so many people say that a striker or attacking midfielder is the best, but take casillas for real madrid there is no way they would of won there back to back titles had he not been there, or terry for chelsea, rio for ...... but this does not undo the great work the attacking players do, i just wish some people would appreciate the work they do. my top 5..

messi

casillas

ronaldo

nesta

kaka

[azeri4life]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ched:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stomalomalus:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

Hey fanboys, admit that the match engine and the CA system is a joke. Are you telling me that even though Elano's stats are a lot better than Ronaldo's, because Ronaldo is two-footed it makes him better?! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ronaldos CA is better than Elanos.

His Physical stats are a total of 20 better than Elanos

And Ronaldos hidden atributes are higher by 14!

Plus, yes, his two footedness has a huge impact! If Elano gets the ball on his left - despite having finishing the same as Ronaldo - he will hit the back of the net far less often. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So tell me why when you look at their stats, Ronaldo seems to have a far inferior appearance in terms of his attributes? His higher CA is certianly not illustrated to us apart from his two-footedness. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

1/ You've started throwing around the word fanboy, so anyone with half a brain already thinks you're a moron - if you act politely you are much more likely to get a reasonable response.

2/ Compare results not stats. Elano performs fairly well, ronaldo regularly tears teams apart in FM - just because you don't think his stats are as good, doesn't mean he isn't a better player. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So you're calling me the moron when you're the one saying that we shouldn't look at stats to decide how good a player is? I think the real moron here is you; I'm, not quite sure how you play FM but usually a good way to decide how good a player is is to look at their stats...

[Doyle]

So Ter was joking, ey? I seriously thought Carlos Cuellar was going to have 199 PA in the next game

[Neji]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Doyle:

So Ter was joking, ey? I seriously thought Carlos Cuellar was going to have 199 PA in the next game </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah, he was.... I think

[Guest Danny--Boy]

Ronaldo is not better than Messi, Ronaldo doesn't perform against the bigger teams and cracks under pressure. United Vs Barca, Ronaldo was almost non existant, Messi tore into Uniteds defence. So now, he shouldn't be the best when he isn't the best.

[bod1035]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Danny--Boy:

Ronaldo is not better than Messi, Ronaldo doesn't perform against the bigger teams and cracks under pressure. United Vs Barca, Ronaldo was almost non existant, Messi tore into Uniteds defence. So now, he shouldn't be the best when he isn't the best. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I am no Ronaldo fan but you cant say whether a player is world class or not based on one match.

I am sure Messi has gone missing in certain Barca games this season.

They are both quality and that should be enough

[chopper99]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Danny--Boy:

Ronaldo is not better than Messi, Ronaldo doesn't perform against the bigger teams and cracks under pressure. United Vs Barca, Ronaldo was almost non existant, Messi tore into Uniteds defence. So now, he shouldn't be the best when he isn't the best. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Making such a general statement as 'Ronaldo doesn't perform in the big games' and then going on to make only one example of one game where Messi was better than Ronaldo is hardly convincing.

In the course of a season Messi and Ronald will have both played as many big and small teams as each other, yet Ronaldo had a much better season. It's not because he played against a lower quality of opposition or because he plays in a better team than Messi, he simply had an excellent season. Anyone who thinks otherwise, or who thinks Messi was better than Ronaldo this season is quite frankly an idiot. And I'm certainly not a Man Utd fan, tbh I don't even like Ronaldo that much. But anyone with half a brain can appreciate the fact that he's been outstanding this season.

[Serdar]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by turn it upto 11:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ter:

The highest CA in FM 2009 will be Carlos Cuellar with 199 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

easy to be a good defender when your not playing in a top class league </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

He was class in the Champions League / UEFA Cup as well against teams like Barcelona, Lyon, Stuttgart, Fiorentina, Werder Bremen, Zenit etc

199 isn't good enough. 200 I say. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would like to think it is a joke that Carlos will have 199. He is good, he could be considered very good but if you give him 199 due to couple of games in EuroCups then you cant stop people throwing examples of similar performances from other players and expecting thier favorite to be 199. Carlos needs to prove much more before he gets to such level.

For the case of Ronaldo; he may not be top-class in every department of the game(including penalty kicks ) but I think he proved that he is a kind of player who can not be stopped easily by any team. Just his final performance against Chelsea in CL final showed that he can dribble anyone including Essien. He made MU won both Premiership and CL, this should mean something. Also his value in real world seems to be over 100m€ which should be also considered in FM database. I guess if he shines in EuroCup as expected, it would be inevitable to avoid C.Ronaldo being number one.

[Stomalomalus]

Ronaldo should be better than Messi in FM09 in one attribute only - injury proneness. Messi can dribble better than Ronaldo because Ronaldo seems to slow everything down when he comes to a dribble attempt, allowing the other defenders a chance to get back. Messi on the other hand dribbles at full pace and causes massive problems.

They will both be similar in standard in FM09, but Messis stats will look better, as he will have some worse than Ronaldo. Ronaldo has proved he can do everything but tackle - and that only because we havnt seen him try!

Oh, and whoever said that Ronaldo misses more chances than Tevez is talcking out of their backside! How many chances did Ronaldo have in the CL? And how many did Tevez have? Tevez is a magnificent player, but his composure is poor.

[Neji]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> In the course of a season Messi and Ronald will have both played as many big and small teams as each other, yet Ronaldo had a much better season. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

He's not had a MUCH better season at all.

Messi has scored 16 times this season.

Ronaldo has scored 42 times this season.

Looks a mismatch BUT

Messi has 26 assists this season.

Ronaldo has 8.

PLUS - Ronaldo has played 11 games more.

They have both been massively important and have had great seasons for their teams but there isnt ALOT of difference. Personally, I think Messi is better because he does it on the big stage, Ronaldo doesnt.

You may say Ronaldo scored in the CL final but he went missing for more than half of the game and Essien was horrible in the first half. Ronaldo doesnt do it against the big teams. IMO Messi has better skill when on the ball.

Im sure people will disagree but this is my opinion.

[Nomis07]

Despite being a Man utd fan I think messi is a better all round player.

The thing I disagree with is the concept that he goes missing in the big games. He had a quiet second half in the CL final but was destroying a world class player in Essien in the first half, to say Essien had a bad game is in my opinion just an excuse as Ronaldo made him look bad rather than Essien playing badly. He also scored in the CL QF against Lyon and destroyed Roma last season, whilst these weren't finals they were definately big games and he did the business.

[aston_martin]

I find these argument's over Messi Vs Ronaldo stupid. They are both excellent players, and excel in some similar areas, but also some largely different areas. Why can't people accept that?

[DeathSpawn]

i can't stop laughing when poeple say CR doesn't perform well against big teams, those people need to see champs league final for sure, and some poeple also need to start watch football in a tactical way: sometimes PLAYERS don't perform so well because they have 2 or 3 players marking them so coaches uses that and sacrifice those players to leave other players without anyone marking them, that's called teamwork btw, and Ferguson uses that...

as for dribling i agree Messi is better but why do you care about dribling if then you can't score??? Messi is also injured a lot of times and when he recovers he's not so tired as other players, i would like to see Messi doing so many matches as any english league players lol... anyway Portugal is a small football force when compared to brasil/argentina and that makes a big difference in FM, in FIFA,in UEFA, etc etc...

as for european championship ofc he won't perform so good, Portugal play in a very different way of the english teams, if you think that doesn't matter that much then you should just quit FM

btw what has Messi done so special this season??? they didnt even won the spanish league lol.

[gcormack]

i cant believe people are actually taking this cuellar thing almost seriously lol

if enough people mention it can you implement it in the game please

[steph_wheeler]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stomalomalus:

This season, Ronaldo was A FORWARD!

For the vast majority of games this season, SAF played a font 3 much like Barca do, or much like Utd. did with Best, Kidd and Law! A FRONT 3!

Yes, he played on the wing against scum, but that was because SAF wanted a tactical battle.

If anyones stats need changing, then Ronaldo needs to be made AMR/l FC and Tevez needs to drop his composure to 12. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Amen!

May I add that he was free to roam anywhere he wanted on the pitch (like any forward should be allowed to really).

All season Ronaldo had little or nothing to do on the defensive end. He doesn't chase down a player when he loses the ball, is the last player to retreat when his team is defending. He does come short in his own half sometimes to start counter attacks for United but generally he is upfield, sometimes even challenging for long balls.

He has hardly ever played in a winger role this season, because a winger to me is the widest midfield player. I will repeat that a winger is a midfielder, and the modern midfielder has to be totally dynamic (unless your name is Diego, or Guti). Joe Cole, Jesus Navas, Nani, and Lennon are proper wingers, C. Ronaldo not anymore. Ribery and Schweinsteiger have played like wingers for Bayern with the only difference that they were not pinned down on their respective flanks, given the freedom to attack centrally as well. Look at how Gattuso plays for Milan, on the right wing but he has to close down immediately when his team lose possession or retreat when the opponents attack on the other flank. Seedorf and Ambrosini are expected to do the same. That's how most top midfield players are expected to play nowadays. When Ronaldo was one of them he already lacked defensive commitment. Now that he plays as a forward, I don't see that changing. But why should he when he is United's main attacking threat? Sir Alex figured that with the bags of talent and ability that his Portuguese player had, he just had to take advantage of it.

Beckham v. Bentley (Right Midfielder v. Right Winger)

There is no difference between a right midfielder and a right winger. In his prime Beckham was a right winger. With his influence groing for both United and England, he would come short to get the ball. Being the main set piece taker for both country and club, he would even end up on the left flank. Beckham's crossing ability was so impressive that it meant that he did not have to get to the byline to deliver a dangerous ball in the area. But make no mistake he was a winger and one of his instructions was to get to the byline whenever possible. With age he lost some of his pace but grew in experience and came to cross earlier and earlier. As a midfielder he also had defensive duties, though he wasn't noted for them. He had to come back and defend in his glory days and still does a bit of it for the LA Galaxy. The above descriptions are attributable to Bentley as well. Bentley attacks and defends. He generally plays on the right but his set piece duties mean that you will occasionally find him on the left as well. He gets to the byline whenever possible, but he is showing a bit of the genius of Beckham for crossing the ball early.

Messi is not a right winger. He is a wing forward like Ronaldo is now. As any forward he needs to give an option going forward, so he is not required to retreat as a winger/wide midfielder should. He will generally ask the ball on the flank, but being a forward, he will look to score, not cross, and the way to do that is to find the center.

[williamshankley]

He isn't a winger though really. He just has a free role in the final third. The only times this season when he has truely played as a winger have been against Barcelona and Chelsea in the Champions league.

[Ched]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ched:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stomalomalus:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by azeri4life:

Hey fanboys, admit that the match engine and the CA system is a joke. Are you telling me that even though Elano's stats are a lot better than Ronaldo's, because Ronaldo is two-footed it makes him better?! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ronaldos CA is better than Elanos.

His Physical stats are a total of 20 better than Elanos

And Ronaldos hidden atributes are higher by 14!

Plus, yes, his two footedness has a huge impact! If Elano gets the ball on his left - despite having finishing the same as Ronaldo - he will hit the back of the net far less often. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So tell me why when you look at their stats, Ronaldo seems to have a far inferior appearance in terms of his attributes? His higher CA is certianly not illustrated to us apart from his two-footedness. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

1/ You've started throwing around the word fanboy, so anyone with half a brain already thinks you're a moron - if you act politely you are much more likely to get a reasonable response.

2/ Compare results not stats. Elano performs fairly well, ronaldo regularly tears teams apart in FM - just because you don't think his stats are as good, doesn't mean he isn't a better player. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So you're calling me the moron when you're the one saying that we shouldn't look at stats to decide how good a player is? I think the real moron here is you; I'm, not quite sure how you play FM but usually a good way to decide how good a player is is to look at their stats... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm guessing the concept of hidden stats is vastly beyond your comprehension?

[tomtuck01]

I just like the way that Cristiano's name is spelt wrong in the title of the thread!