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  1. Apologies, I recently underwent surgery and was unable to respond. Will post more questions later but for now just wanted to express my thanks to @Experienced Defender and everyone else who has helped in this thread.
  2. Apologies for the late response got tied up with work stuff. And what are your thoughts about it in defend duty when he is told to hold his position? Just generally not only in a 4-2-3-1 I mean. I player who mainly performs a defensive function but isn't holding his position, so a BWM or a BBM that's told to focus more on defending. Running and dribbling. Yes please on the examples. Also, you're suggesting I choose a role for Ndombele's partner based on Ndombele's role, but surely it should be the other way round if Ndombele is the constant? What I mean is he is guaranteed to start both for being the best midfielder but also being the most versatile role-wise, so actually its *his* role that depends on what his partner is doing since he can do anything but his partner usually can do only one thing or two at best? What happens when you use two PMs close to each other? I know the game has a hidden instruction to focus play through the playmaker if you have one, but I am not sure what happens if you have two or more. My instinct is to avoid it but I have seen pre-set tactics created by the game itself that employ it, for example the tiki-taka 4-1-2-3 has a DLP, RPM and AP all very much close to each other so I assume it doesn't break the game somehow? Thank you for this, it's really helpful. I am not going to use it 100% as is but it gives me an idea of a base to build on and tinker with.
  3. Thank you again for responding to me. Again, non-quoted parts are ones I understood and have no follow up questions about but I did read them. Mostly attributes as his tackling and marking aren't amazing, as well as a third factor which is even if he *could* play it he would be underused as he can do other things *better* though. I understand however that I should not put too much stock in this role suitability circle and that it is not a very good marker of things. Kane for example has only a half circle for Complete Forward but can of course actually do it very well. And Ndombele I reckon would have a full circle for BBM if it weren't for his bad finishing and long shots, but if I just individually instruct him to shoot less often then he would play as a BBM perfectly. What is the closest central midfield role to a defensive midfielder? Player who protects the backline when we don't have the ball as his main priority and wins it back when we lose it as the secondary priority? Follow-up question: is BWM a defensive position but the issue is that it's too aggressive for a two-man midfield/top heavy formation or is it not a defensive position at all? My understanding of central midfielders (in real life, not sure how well that translates into FM) is there are two scales: runner vs holder and defensive vs creator, and that a team needs to have all four, but obviously a player can do more than one, so you can have two midfielders or three. If using two midfielders you can have a defensive runner and a holding creator OR a creative runner and a holding defensive player. If for example I play a CM on defend and a DPL on support I have a defensive holder and a creative holder, but no runners, therefore no one to actually move the ball up. Is this accurate or flawed? And how can I translate it in FM terms? I care about having an overall good tactic but its not my number 1 priority. Both playing like Pochettino and using certain players (of which Dele is one) and getting them to perform are more important to me even if it means some tactical flaws (as long as it's not leading to us performing terribly and is not something super tactically unrealistic). Hence for me even though a formation change would solve several issues it is not something I am willing to do. I am however hoping to eventually get to a point where I change formation in the space of one match several times to adapt to my opponent's tactics and changes (but still *starting* with a 4-2-3-1) but I recognise that my abilities and understanding are not yet at a level that allows for this. Fair enough. Can you list some situations and the corresponding best roles to deal with them? When would you elect to use a MEZ over other roles? When is a BBM more effective? a DPL? Spurs are really good in the game to a point that if I just use the most balanced effective 4-1-2-3 for example I would win everything and get bored, and it would not be due to my own skills either. This is why I impose other rules on myself (including non-tactical ones that are not mentioned in the thread) because I can also just never get myself to play as another team. I don't want to make wholesale changes to my tactic but I was hoping to find maybe changes to Dele's role/instructions or maybe some changes to one or two players around him that would get him to contribute more. I am now considering using him as an AP on support (the only realistic -so not counting roles that don't make sense in the context of my overall tactic- role I didn't try him in) purely on a trial and error basis but I am worried about using two playmakers. What are the downsides to having two playmakers (deep and advanced) in the same side? Perfect, how would you set up tactically in a way that uses that style? And out of personal interest how would you characterise Pochettino's playing style? Thanks for responding Hootieleece. As mentioned above might give AP a try. I always thought an AP on support would be a bit static/hesitant to join attacks because the role description says he will "stay in the hole" but maybe this is not very accurate if you're getting decent goals from yours? Dele has go further forward, dribble more, and move into channels so maybe this will counteract some of the role's stationary-ness? I am also interested in BWM defend and how it differs from a CM on defend as well as how it differs from BWM on support.
  4. Thanks again for such a detailed response, really appreciate it. I won't quote the parts of your post that I understood and have no further questions regarding, in the interest of not cluttering the thread with "got it" and "yes" etc. type responses. The examples you give for natural overlaps don't include any true winger role but I am limited for now because both my main and backup right wingers (Lucas Moura and Jack Clarke) are out and out wide players, don't really have the option of playing them as play makers/inside forwards/inverted wingers. On the left side I can potentially do it but like you said I have not noticed any defensive issues on my left flank (especially now in my second season in which I bought Chillwell) so while your theory is sound and you obviously understand this much better than I do, I am a bit of "if it ain't broke don't fix it" in these situations. If I notice defensive frailties as the season progresses I will look into removing the overlaps. As a general point I don't mind some defensive weaknesses (I am not looking for the perfect tactic, will explain in detail lower down) so long as that weakness brings an attacking strength with it. But if I am sacrificing my defence for no reason then of course would like to fix. Ah I am less going for Klopp tbh and more for the Bielsa school and specifically Pochettino during his peak with Tottenham (so not the last 1-2 years) for my style. There are also other considerations like the board wanting all three of attacking football, entertaining football, and possession football. I lean more towards the aggressive defending/pressing over possession but they want both. Last season I focused too much on possession and they were delighted but only "satisfied" in the attacking category but after some changes this season they are now "pleased" with the attacking whilst still delighted with possession and entertainment. I am very much wedded to playing 4-2-3-1. I have a 4-1-2-3 and a 5-2-2-1 (Wingbacks) as my second and third tactics but I rarely use the second one and never the third tbh. I have them on different mentalities (balanced and attacking) just so that my players gain familiarity in case I need to take things down or up a notch with the 4-2-3-1 mid game. If I am really worried about getting thrashed sometimes I play the 4-1-2-3 with a halfback, DPL, and Mezala (rest of the team the same) but honestly a lot of the times also if I feel like there's no way I am winning a game I just go **** it and play my style anyway. It's stubborn and dumb I know but I can't help myself thinking well if we're getting destroyed we won't compromise our principles whilst going down. Haha wish I knew that before buying Chaudry and alienating Dier. Problem is the upcoming midfielder in that slot is Skipp, also a BWM. So I am screwed now. This opens up the very interesting possibility of starting my two favourite midfielders in the side Winks and Ndombele, I was thinking of them both as DLP support and thus one as backup for the other/can't play them both but if I switch Ndombele to BBM or MEZ I can. Especially as Winks unlike Ndombele can also play DLP defend not just support. I have read the role descriptions carefully but must admit that especially with the midfield ones I am a bit lost. I am not sure what a MEZ actually does, no idea what a CAR does, and am confused about BWM which I think of as defensive but seems is actually closer to a BBM. Also, what do you think about BWM in defend duty, I feel like that specific role/duty combo never gets brought up, why? So when it comes to the wingers I am flexible on what I want. I am good with option 1 of Son as my secondary goalscoring threat and Moura as one of the main sources of assists, but I am also happy with option 2 which is they both perform more mixed roles with Son scoring a bit less but assisting a bit more and Lucas assisting less to score more. I don't mind as long as they're contributing positively basically, though I have a very slight bias towards option 1. I don't want either to be the primary goal scoring threat, however. That has to remain Kane. I need him to break all Spurs records. So from what I understand the alongside creativity to do whatever they want, a CF also has most of the individual instructions for both the advanced and deep forward role. If I make Kane into a DLF, would I see a drop in scoring at the expense of him trying to assist/hold up the ball/bring others into play? Also what about keeping him as CF but switching the duty to support from attack, would that help Dele? And would it affect Kane's scoring? He's on 15 in 16 this season. Scored 38 in 44 last season. I think I will stick to IF for Son because that's how he plays in real life. Behind him is a wingback support in the FB slot and on the opposite flank a winger on support. The right back switches between defend and support wingback depending on what duty I give one of my central midfielders, though having played a few games with a wingback defend now I actually like how the players (Aarons who I just bought and KWP who was my main man last season) perform in it. They are much better defensively but contribute much more to the attack than I thought they would. Might make this permanent and keep the two midfielders on support. The last bit is exactly my dilemma. Because he (Ndombele) can do a bit of everything I don't know what to do with him; what his best role would be. If I go with sentiment I would start him and Winks, but Winks would have to be the DLP as he's not much of anything else, however I currently have Ndombele on DLP support but he's actually moving the ball forward, dribbling and assisting, I suspect because of his PPMs, and I am worried about losing that. Honestly as I have already admitted, I am not sure what the MEZ does even after reading role guides on the forum and the game's description. Box to box feels like I would be wasting his talents but maybe I am wrong. If I am going to go back to using a CMde then Dier reclaims his starting role. These are my midfielders: Ndombele (can do MEZ support, BBM, and DLP support) Winks (can do DLP defend and DLP support) Dier (can do CM defend, BWM defend, and BWM support) Choudhry (can do BWM support, BWM defend, BBM) Skipp (can do BWM support and BWM defend, maybe not too late to train him as BBM) Lo Celso (mostly plays further up but can be a central mid if I need, can do DLP support and AP support) What combo would you recommend? My tactic works well for me in terms of results and overall performance but there are some small issues I want to iron out. However the main problem is for sure Dele. He can't even score a rating of over 6.5 anymore. And when I start Lo Celso instead he performs much better. So it's mainly him. Ideally what I want is: Left wingback and right winger providing my team's width and assists. Harry Kane as the point man and main goal threat. Son as secondary source of goals. One midfielder who moves the ball up the pitch, a ball carrier One midfielder who shields my defence and allows everyone else to be more creative, but also he has help regain the ball quickly when we lose it Dele as a hybrid scorer/assist maker or at least terrorising defences with slick moves. Right now he is the main problem and adds NOTHING to the team. Obviously I can just drop him, but I really don't want to. Not patient possession but undecided between progressive possession or fast attacking. What exactly do you mean by progressive possession? I am assuming patient possession is lots of keeping the ball above all else tikki-taka style and fast attacking is more like Geggenpress/Klop style? I could be wrong. Once again thank you so much I really appreciate your time and thoughts.
  5. Thank you so much for getting back to me. I will answer some of your points to explain why I made the choices I did. I also have some more questions if that is okay. Yes I make sure it is always either a wingback or a central midfielder, unless I misunderstood your instructions in that thread. Have there been significant changes since FM18 that make some of the points in it not as valid? Yes I was just listing the changes I made from the "default" control possession template, but I don't pay too much attention to it otherwise. How can I do that? Also, currently my fullbacks are both performing very well, especially the left wingback who is getting decent assists. Do I risk seeing less of that by cancelling the overlaps? I *do* want to play fast and gung-ho attacking style *whilst also* maintaining possession. What other instructions do I have that contradict playing with a higher tempo? Is it the shorter passing? What would you suggest instead? I also sometimes play with a CMd but in combination with a DLP (on either duty) I have found that it means the two midfielders both sit deep and no one carries the ball forward as much. I am not wedded at all to having three attack duties up front, it was just a way for me try to get some goals out of Dele. In fact my original idea had the AMC on AM support, it is only recently that I switched him to attack. Haven't seen much difference though. Out of curiosity why is the left side on support and the right side on attack? I am using Son and Lucas so it makes sense to me that Lucas is a Winger support (to assist) and Son is the IF attack (to score) but you think I should switch their roles? What would be the effect? Would Son still score as much from a supporting position for example? Also, why switch the CF to DLF? Kane is a goal machine on CF for me, but that might just be because he is Harry Kane. Still, I am worried about changing the thing in my tactic that works the best. What is the desired effect of switching his role? Is is that he would bring Dele into play more often? Would that come at the expense of his own scoring? Also, how do I pick between IF and IW? Especially if I have a player who can seemingly do both? What factors should go into that choice? What do you mean by "progressive"? And which role do I switch out for Mezzala or BBM? The BWM or the DLP? And how do I pick between BBM and Mezzala? I have Ndombele who can play both as well as DLP support, which is what I have him on now and he's assisting very well. Got it. So other than the tactic being aggressive defensively and the issues with tempo, what exactly am I doing wrong that is specifically impacting Dele's performance? And why is it not really affecting any of the other players negatively? How so? And how would you suggest fixing it? Thank you so much. Yeah examples would be really great, I would very much appreciate it. And thanks so much for answering my thread in the first place.
  6. Hello! I am playing with Spurs on FM 20 with a modified Control Possession 4-2-3-1. The changes I have made to the base template as you can see below are as follows: Mentality changed to Positive from Balanced Team shape is usually flexible not fluid Ensure at least three defensive duties (as per Experienced Defender's helpful thread) Overlaps on both flanks Higher tempo instead of lower Use offside trap Played around with roles In the screenshot I have one of the wingbacks on defend and both central midfielders on support but depending on personnel I sometimes have the wingback on support and one of the midfielders on defend. I try to stick to the holder/runner double pivot (BWMsupport runner, DLP holder) but sometimes I play two holders (CM on defend/DLP on support). For the most part this tactic works well for me. It's not game breaking but I perform to the level I expect my team to (came fourth in the first season having not made any transfers for the first team, for example). The one really annoying thing is I can't get my AMC, specifically Dele, to perform. I've tried him on AMC support, AMC attack, and Shadow Striker but I can't get him scoring. I have a feeling if I put him on Advanced Playmaker he might at least assist more but that's not what I am looking for from him and I also don't like using two playmakers. I tried adding the individual instructions dribble more, move into channels, and get further forward, especially when I have him on AMC support, but it doesn't help much. He already has those as PPMs so not sure if that means no need to ask him as he will already do it or what? My goal for him is to be a scoring/assisting hybrid. Any help is appreciated and feel free to critique the overall tactic as well. Last season the AMR on support got 15 assists which I am happy with but the AML also disappointed, however I am chalking that down to me changing the role a lot because I wasn't sure what I wanted (cycled between IW support, IW attack and IF attack) so this season I am sticking with IF attack to see if Son actually scores enough goals before deciding there's a problem here too.
  7. Just a forums rules question: I have the same issue basically. Is it better to create a separate thread so as not to hijack OPs (since our tactics are obviously not identical so the solutions suggested might be different) or is that considered spam because a similar topic is already available and I should just post a screenshot of my tactic here? Thanks all in advance.
  8. Really average first season, not pleased but not devastated. Time for a rebuild. Came fourth (barely), got knocked out the CL first knockout round by RB Leipzig, lost the FA Cup quarter final to Brighton, and can't remember who knocked me out of the League Cup or when because I was trying to lose. Played a 4-2-3-1 throughout. Kane performed very well with 37 goals in 44 games, KWP and Sessegnon performed well as regular starters at full back. I should have played Winks and Lo Celso more as they both performed very well when played but I stuck with Ndombele and Dele out of stubbornness despite them both being average. Played Sanchez more than either Belgians to get ready for life after them. Started the game with first window shut (I prefer it for realism) then in the January window I sold Eriksen (whom I barely started) for 65 million pounds to PSG and Wanyama to a Chinese team for 20 million. Bought Eze for 23 million as backup for Son and made the Lo Celso transfer permanent. Sent Lamella out for loan with an option to buy for 21 million to Leicester and brought back Jack Clarke from loan instead of him as backup for Moura but he ended up being a beast actually. Promoted Parrot to the first team as backup for Kane but sent Skipp out on loan (wasn't going to be able to play him enough) and finally sold Rose for 15 million (ugh) but needed to get rid. Summer 2020 window just ended and I've undertaken an actual rebuild. Sold Aurier, Davies, Sissoko, Lamella (permanently), sent Vertonghen on loan (with a view of his contract running out as I can't get money for him) as well as Carter-Vickers and Foyth (but I plan to later incorporate at least one of them in my first team I just wanted them both to have regular game time) whilst buying Chillwell, Aarons (sad because KWP and Sessegnon actually performed well and this will cut their time) as well as Godfrey (wanted Dias but Chelsea beat me to it). I plan to return Dier to centre back so I also bought Chaudhry in midfield. Promoted Skipp and Whiteman (Vorm retired) to the squad. So far I am trying to mostly buy English players and supplement them with our own youth. Parrot, Clarke, Eze, Skipp, and Whiteman all in the first team squad for now but I feel like they aren't getting enough game time by January 2021 I might loan some of them out. Chillwell and Aarons were really expensive and I kinda feel like I betrayed KWP and Sessegnon after they actually did their best but we'll see, maybe I can somehow give everyone enough game time. Plan is to sell Toby next year and incorporate whichever one of Foyth/CCV impresses me most into the squad. Long term once Lloris starts declining I have an eye on Pickford. I also want Sancho and Bailey in for Son and Moura but this is much further down the line.
  9. He is 100% trying to push the tactic to flexible, in my experience. Whether that is advantageous or not, I don't know, though.
  10. Red: sold Green: bought Yellow: asking if should buy Bold: promoted youth player Blue: out on loan Have completed my first season with Spurs and am halfway through the second. The squad is quite strong, I have found. I turned off the first transfer window and bought only one player (a left back) in January and still managed to win the league and the FA cup double. Lost the EFL cup during the semi-final to Chelsea (like real life) and exited the Champion's League during the semi-final to Man Utd. In both semi-final exits I won the first match 1-0 only to lose 2-0 in the return leg. Harry Kane scored 40 goals, including 32 in the league to get the PL golden boot. I mostly played the game's default 4-2-3-1 Gegenpress tactic with some tweaks to player roles and duties (and one player instruction) but not to team instructions. I use a 4-4-2 Narrow Diamond frequently as well, mostly in cup games or when injuries force me. Less frequently I sometimes go 3-4-3 with either two strikers and a man behind or one striker and two men behind. In January 2019 I bought Kieran Tierney from Celtic for 46 million pounds and sold Ben Davies to Man Utd for 40 million to almost break even on that. Furthermore sold Dembele to Monaco for 10 million, Jansen for 15 million to Newcastle, and GKN to Spartak Moscow for 7 million that could rise to 8.5 million. I decided to stick to a youth policy stronger than Poch's and so other than promoting Luke Amos and Oliver Skipp to the first team from day one, and playing often, I also handed cup debuts to a few others. During the second (current) season, Josh Onomah, Marcus Edwards, Cameron Carter-Vickers, Alfie Whitman, Kazaiah Sterling, and Troy Parrott were all promoted to the first team squad, with a couple (CCV, Onomah) going out on loan to premiership sides that promised to play them as first teamers in January 2020 as that's more game time than I could have provided. Vorm left on a free and Llorente retired in June 2019, hence the promotion of Whitman, Parrot, and Sterling. I sold Sissoko for 30 million in January 2020 with some regret as he's been playing amazingly, but I decided to cash in because of his age as he had turned 30. My director of football bought me Matthijs de Ligt for 29 million all on his own (I didn't even ask) during the summer of 2019. We also added Ryan Sessegnon for 15.25 million that window and sent Serge Aurier out on loan with an option to buy for 35 million to Inter Milan. Juan Foyth went on loan to HSV who promised to play him as a regular and lied to me, and was promptly recalled in January when CCV was sent out. Sessegnon was also sent out on loan in January but I might regret it as Danny Rose wants to leave to seek a new challenge. I replaced Sissoko with Tanguy Ndombele for 47.5 million which I personally find expensive but I have a director of football and don't personally negotiate transfers. Not sure I should have done that as not replacing him would have meant more games for the promoted youth players and Amos specifically will start complaining soon. David Brooks is coming in next summer on 29 million as he is currently on loan to Fiorentina and so couldn't come in January despite us concluding the deal. Again bit of a luxury buy that I am already regretting because I didn't really need him but he was available. I've tried and failed to buy some others, most notably James Madison who Leicester simply won't let go of. It's currently Jan. 25, 2020 and I'm second in the league and still in the CL and both cups. Finally, my DOF has concluded a couple of deals on his own that I am unsure whether or not to accept. The first deal is for Wílmar Barrios. I have enough midfielders already but I was thinking of approving the deal and selling Wanyama (28) who is a couple of years older, on more money, and wants a new contract. Wanyama has better stats has better stats, however. Barrios is 26 so he's not that young. Wanyama is on 65,000 a week and wants to be on 82,000. Barrios would come in on 50,000 a week. What to people think? The second deal is 22 million pounds for Xadas who plays as a number 10 naturally but can also play across the attacking midfield line, in central midfield, and striker. If I sanction this transfer I'd have to let go of my James Madison dream, though. Thoughts?
  11. I have a couple of questions that are somewhat related so I thought I'd make one thread instead of two. 1. What is the best way to replicate Poch's Spurs on the game. I know I should press hard, have a higher line, and play narrower, but what else would you recommend in terms of instructions/set up/formation/roles? 2. Inspired by the real life DESK, how do I get the three attackers behind the striker in a 4-2-3-1 to all swap positions? The swap function only allows two players to swap. In real life Son might start on the left, Eriksen in the middle, Dele on the right only for Son to go onto the right for example but instead of Dele just swapping with him he'd go into the middle with Eriksen taking up the left spot. How do I replicate that?
  12. Apologies if this has been answered elsewhere but how does training roles work now? Is it like training a new position where you select the role in individual training and play the player in that role consistently and he gets better at it over time? And how do duties factor into it? Say I have a player who's a natural DL and his natural role is Wing Back Support, if I were to train him as Complete Wing Back (support) and keep playing him as such, would his half full kind of yellow circle grow over time to become almost full green or totally full bright green? And would he automatically be able to do it in attack duty as well or do I have to separately train for that? Thank you.
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