regens....

Now .. im the games biggest supporter/advocate but I just have to get this off my chest really..

regens have been the one game breaker for me... as soon as they come in , they nullify the real life youngsters and make them pointless..

they are way, way to good..

here's just one example..

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/440/rickymoranoverviewattri.png/

now who on earth would want to develop the likes of robert hall, adam campbell etc who are all top prospects at the start, when 15 year olds like moran turn up looking like premiership class players already...

just tone down the ca's SI or sort out the stat spread... of course there should be a few superstars around but im finding 30+ regens of this quality even before the first season is over

Regens are a bit to overpowered, i myself signed a wonderkid. At the age of 16 he could be close to a starting position at City!

Not got the new version but from past experience I would agree regens are a bit too strong, at least at the start. It could possibly be redesigned a bit to be more about PA rather than amazing CA which could get even better!

Its probably best to play down the potential of some "next generation superstars" of the real world since they can often spoil the game a bit too, when in 10 game years the real players who are running the FM world would be nowhere to be seen in the real world. But it is annoying when you think you should develop some guys who you actually have seen play well and heard good reports of and would like to work with in the game, but theres little point when the younger regens are clearly miles better. Also annoying when you are aware of how **** the club's real-life intake of 14 and 15 year-olds is likely to be or has already proven to be, while FM is tossing world-beaters into your youth team!

PS is Fart the Danish word for speed?! Same spelling as well LOL.

I never have this luck with regens, even at a club with maxed out youth facilites and networking

Since FM 2007, I never had any good regen coming through my facility.

Maybe they figured it works better if the starting CAs for regens are set up a bit higher. Researchers work on different criteria than the regen algorithim, so it doesn't surprise me that the existing top prospects are a little bit attribute-poor by comparison. Personally my regens are as crap as they've always been but this is likely a function of starting in Norway's third tier.

Interesting point, hugo_rune. Has anyone checked whether there are more high-PA players in FM12 than in FM11? Or do they just start with better attributes and max out their potential earlier?

well it was the same for me in fm11 aswell.. the whole newgen issue has been a problem for years.. they just havent got it right imo...

I'm in 2015 and not sure whether its a good scouting set up or what (I'm Newcastle) but I'm being offered loads of top class regens, mostly from Germany and France. Some are even on frees and some have been scouted for other clubs but can be picked up for under £1m in most cases. They're just far too good and it makes the game very easy.

Regens are a bit to overpowered, i myself signed a wonderkid. At the age of 16 he could be close to a starting position at City!

Seems to me like that one needs to work on his "Fart"

*giggles*

Not getting these regens at all. I struggle to find 1 or 2 a year and usually the one I find then gets found by barcelona and real madrid and every other top team so there is huge competition for the players signature.

Seems to me like that one needs to work on his "Fart"

*giggles*

Laugh of the day, thanks man!

i had to say up to now on every fm game the best i get at Liverpool is good now i got 3 regens all quality.

Seems to me like that one needs to work on his "Fart"

*giggles*

Cant stop giggling like a little girl in work now

I didn't start a FM 12 save yet, but I wish I'll find a regen just as good as this on FM 12. This is from my long-term save on FM10. Probably the best 17 years old ever, got him when he was 15 and tutored by 3 world-class midfielders so far and still improving:

I think regens are just fine, potential talents should have a good CA, just like nowadays talents had good CA when they where youth players (Messi, C Ronaldo, Robben, Iniesta, Xavi, Torres, Aguero, etc).

I never have this luck with regens, even at a club with maxed out youth facilites and networking

I 2nd this, In 3 years with Barca I've had not one regen worth giving a shot in the 1st team. Been on quite a few scouting missions and sent my scouts out around the world but can't find any talent anywhere.

I think regens are just fine, potential talents should have a good CA, just like nowadays talents had good CA when they where youth players (Messi, C Ronaldo, Robben, Iniesta, Xavi, Torres, Aguero, etc).

I think people are just arguing the rate at which they appear. In my current save with Santos in the 2nd season, I've seen about 40 regens all worthy of playing in the first team already.

I think people are just arguing the rate at which they appear. In my current save with Santos in the 2nd season, I've seen about 40 regens all worthy of playing in the first team already.

Sorry my bad, however in my save managing Sheff Utd regens are nowhere 1st team quality. But that is just my case.

What i would like to see from the regens (and young players at the start of the game) is a LOT more players with high potential. But then the chance of the player reaching their potential being a LOT lower.

The way it work now you pretty much know when you get your youths of the season that you should keep one or two, and the rest you can safely scrap knowing they will never pan out to anything. In real life Real Madrid got rid of a 19 year old Samuel Eto'o, and a 19 year old Juan Mata. Adil Rami played amateur football until he was 22 and is now in a French International. The point is; it is nearly impossible to know for sure if a 16 year old is gonna become a superstar or a sunday league player.

Because of this there should be a lot of players that with the right attitude, right matching, right lack of injuries, right coaching and so on could be able to get to the top. The way up should still be very limited, and even though you look like Messi when your 16, you could end up as Gio Dos Santos 6 years later.

The most important thing would still be that my coaching staff don't predict the youngsters potential as perfect as they do today. Judging ability is an "easy" thing, and should be as today. The judging potential on the other hand should not be as easy.

Sorry my bad, however in my save managing Sheff Utd regens are nowhere 1st team quality. But that is just my case.

They are from season 3 onwards if you got the board to upgrade facilities.

Now .. im the games biggest supporter/advocate but I just have to get this off my chest really..

regens have been the one game breaker for me... as soon as they come in , they nullify the real life youngsters and make them pointless..

they are way, way to good..

whole-heartedly agree 3 seasons at arsenal ive had 7 players come through with pa over 170

I 2nd this, In 3 years with Barca I've had not one regen worth giving a shot in the 1st team. Been on quite a few scouting missions and sent my scouts out around the world but can't find any talent anywhere.

bare in mine your scouts will be comparing them to the players already at your club and the reputation of barcelona... this is make any prospect coming through look not so good.. where as if a scout from say.. tottenham/arsenal scouted them they'd be stars... when you get to a level like barcelona.. you need to start scaling down the star ratings... i.e 2-3 stars are going to be more than good enough for first team action and will be stars at any other club..

Only way to know for sure is to do a long holiday game and use FMRTE to check how many -21 yo players there are with a CA of +140 and a PA of +170. In the beginning of the game there are about 10 such players. You could check every two years how many of those players you find. If the number of players increases by a large enough amount over the years, which I don't think will happen, then at least you have proof that SI should tone down the quality of the regens.

I think the problem may not be so much that there are too many of these types of players, but that it's too easy to find them. With a good scouting network and too accurate information about a player's potential ability it's really easy to just scout all the regens when they appear and pick out the exceptional ones. Combine this with the fact that, unlike in real life, it's easier to follow a formulaic approach to developing them and you can end up with quality youngsters with little possibility of messing it up.

FM12 does seem to make it a little more difficult to sign some of the really quality players. As PSG I've identified quite a few youth prospects that could be stellar but I've struggled to sign them because teams ask for big transfer fees and more players seem more keen to stay at their original team ofr longer. In FM11 I used to be able to but 4-star rated regens from some teams for under £1m.

i have been picking up some very good regens so far. just bought 3 for a grand total of 165k. if u sign them from russia then you can often pay under 20k in compensation. well worth the risk when your a premier league club. there are many others about with 4 star potential for my villa team though i look at current attributes when im buying and wont look at any sort of editor for pa. i have also got 2 players with good futures who are being brought up through the club. my only answer to people is employ as many scouts as you can and send them everywhere. also dont forget to send them to international youth tournaments. my only complaint so far is most regens have bravery of like 6!

From what I see, there are people who are saying "I see to many quality regens" and there are people who say "I have too few quality regens", I'm one of the too few, I haven't seen a youngster yet with the amazing stats straight away. If you don't use FMRTE, for all you know you got a youngster with 130CA but a PA of 138, so he might not improve that much.

I guess it comes down to luck. I agree with what Soul_linneus and Mike J have said. You have to run the game quite a few years and then see the results. I don't know how SI set up the newgen process but I do know that in the past people complained of a serious lack of quality newgen when they played a long save. So even if I don't get a lot of newgens like some of you do, I expect this to even out as I progress even further and perhaps those who get a lot now will get only a few later on.

In other posts I said I did tests with newgen creation dates and how big of a difference it makes. One time you see 10 youngster with a PA of 160 and sometimes you see none. Since I don't want to cheat however, I always continue my first newgen creation date rather then the best reload.

If you don't use external tools, it's not that easy to find all the good newgens. I'm more than happy with the current set up actually. The problem always had been the newgens not being good enough in the past versions.

If you don't use external tools, it's not that easy to find all the good newgens. I'm more than happy with the current set up actually. The problem always had been the newgens not being good enough in the past versions.

Not true, my scouts find them very easy.

ive had no problem finding good regens i have to admit

this guy is probably the best of them though (he is nearly ready for first team football at the age of 16!)

I've noticed that no-one has brought up a point here which may want to be consider. Please note I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with any of the above, more playing devils advocate.

I think most people would agree that in the last 50 years, the level of ability of players at the top level has increased, along with the ability level of most footballers going down to fairly low levels. The game has become more skillful (I know there is a few exceptions eg. Pele/Maradona but I'm talking about players in general), players have become more athletic. So saying you holiday for 10/20/30 years and then comparing the number of quality players to those now and saying that there has been a marked increase isn't necessarily wrong. It could just mean the ability and athleticism of players has once more naturally improved.

Again, this isn't me defending SI for an issue (which I have no proof either way on if this is an issue) I just wanted people to consider that football isn't guaranteed to be the same in 30 years time, so FM doesn't actually NEED to stay in keeping with current day averages.

I've noticed that no-one has brought up a point here which may want to be consider. Please note I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with any of the above, more playing devils advocate.

I think most people would agree that in the last 50 years, the level of ability of players at the top level has increased, along with the ability level of most footballers going down to fairly low levels. The game has become more skillful (I know there is a few exceptions eg. Pele/Maradona but I'm talking about players in general), players have become more athletic. So saying you holiday for 10/20/30 years and then comparing the number of quality players to those now and saying that there has been a marked increase isn't necessarily wrong. It could just mean the ability and athleticism of players has once more naturally improved.

Again, this isn't me defending SI for an issue (which I have no proof either way on if this is an issue) I just wanted people to consider that football isn't guaranteed to be the same in 30 years time, so FM doesn't actually NEED to stay in keeping with current day averages.

Agreed as long as the difference is not significant and as long as the quality doesn't decrease.

I 2nd this, In 3 years with Barca I've had not one regen worth giving a shot in the 1st team. Been on quite a few scouting missions and sent my scouts out around the world but can't find any talent anywhere.

are you sure you cant find talent, due to barca having a world class team, a good regen is going to have 2.5-3 stars potential according to your scouts as when maxed they arent going to be much if any better than your current players

The problem is two-fold actually. Regens start off too good for teams on decent/good level. But those on the lowest levels are mostly absolute rubbish compared to the real players at the level. The majority of them have at least one huge flaw in their attributes that makes it impossible for them to ever be decent. Basically the game cannot balance low CA players so it overpowers some attributes at the cost of others. Instead of players that have, for example, 8's and 9's for the majority of their attributes, a regen will have 15 for pace but 1 for most other categories.

I like how more obscure countries produce world-class regens, i found a Macedonian player who is the next Gabriel Batistuta.

http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/1888/mkdwonderkid.png

Its probably best to play down the potential of some "next generation superstars" of the real world since they can often spoil the game a bit too, when in 10 game years the real players who are running the FM world would be nowhere to be seen in the real world. But it is annoying when you think you should develop some guys who you actually have seen play well and heard good reports of and would like to work with in the game, but theres little point when the younger regens are clearly miles better. Also annoying when you are aware of how **** the club's real-life intake of 14 and 15 year-olds is likely to be or has already proven to be, while FM is tossing world-beaters into your youth team!

This. Darryl Knights, Kyle Critchell, Ramon Calliste, Wes Baynes... where are they now? Exactly. Hell, even Danny Haynes hasn't lived up to his promise.

It also works slightly the opposite way too. 2 years ago, Neil Taylor was playing for my team, with meagre Conference stats. Moved to Swansea in time for FM11, and his stats were still little more than cannon fodder. But after an impressive season, and now a first team player and key full-back in the Wales set-up, on FM12 he's a beast. I just find things like that unusual; how a real life player will have pants stats one version, then superb ones the next. I remember when Jordan Rhodes had the physical and technical prowess of Solid Snake on Marlboros.