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vangto

These injuries are just taking the mick now - some one help to understand this

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This is just crazy, another injury list building up.

If someone can help me to understand this and how to avoid it I would love it.
My training is on light with rest day before and after games.
I have full staff of physio's, sports scientists etc but continually get ravaged by injuries.

Look at the 2nd shot, I am highest in injury league with 10 players out vs 5 for 2nd placed team in injury league.

In all my years since CM01/02 I never had so many injury challenges as on FM17 so would love to know more about whatever logic is driving this.

 

Cheers to anyone who can help shed some light.

2016-11-15 (12).png

2016-11-15 (13).png

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If that's the first time you ever had ten players out (which happens every competition to multiple teams throughout the year PLUS), that just shows how few injuries in FM there usually are in general. Can be bad luck (and that plays a massively part). But you're also inhibiting a squad partly still of which LvG had to replace 15 of when going into the Europa League in his final season. Presumably he had top class staff and knew how to deal with his stuff mostly too.

There is nothing inherently much hugely crazy about this whatsoever by real life football standards. (Bit of a personal pet peeve of mine that often every time a crisis seems to be approached, it's immediately reported as some sort of buggy massacre. :D There must be a reason why SI deliberately tweak it to be a huge deal lower than in real football, which shows long-term and short-term in any injury table massively.) Just in two days in-game time in you will be down to seven, which is still higher than the average FM appears to produce, but nothing to actually much write home about.

Official FAQ: https://community.sigames.com/faq/football-manager-2017/85_gameplay/
Another neato article, though I'm hoping the introduction is slightly exaggerating for effect (real managers wish their job was like Football Manager). https://strikerless.com/2016/11/05/everything-you-wish-you-didnt-have-to-experience-but-really-ought-to-know-regarding-injuries/

Edited by Svenc

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Too little training is as bad as too much.

Training to a minimum of medium and get rid of your rest day before matches.

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Pogba is often down to 50% in matches but is the one seemingly impervious to injury...

Just wonder why all the injuries seem to come in short time span and for most of the season it ticks along with 2-3 short term injuries and maybe 1 long term.

Not saying it's a bug at any point but trying to understand it more to minimise future injuries.
Alot of these injuries happen during training session's or on the recent international break

I'll try tweaking the training and turning off the rest days (I actually added these to see if it would help reduce injuries after last season).
 

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For years in FM I've always edited my top players to 1 Injury proneness.  Yes, you may say that's cheating, but it's the only way to give your self a chance, because they still get injured. I lost Harry Kane for most of a season in my Spurs save, so even a bit of editing may not help.

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Also, how did the injuries occur? Wear n tear? Matches? training? 

2 hours ago, Cougar2010 said:

Too little training is as bad as too much.

Training to a minimum of medium and get rid of your rest day before matches.

:thup: This

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17 minutes ago, Hilly27 said:

For years in FM I've always edited my top players to 1 Injury proneness.  Yes, you may say that's cheating, but it's the only way to give your self a chance, because they still get injured. I lost Harry Kane for most of a season in my Spurs save, so even a bit of editing may not help.

Thats absolute rubbish.

I cope perfectly fine whether I have injury prone players or not.

Editing them to have 1 injury proneness is just papering over the cracks that cause the injuries.

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Whilst luck can play its part, you certainly influence how consistent and often players are injured.

for example very rarely do I have more then 1-2 first team players out injured, so much so this game i questioned if SI made it easier this year!

 

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3 hours ago, vangto said:

Pogba is often down to 50% in matches but is the one seemingly impervious to injury...

That's because you are looking at a player's condition, not their match fitness.

Players short of match fitness are more susceptible to injury.  Look at your squad screen, and see how their match fitness is.  The only way to improve match fitness is to play them in matches.  If they aren't involved in first team action, make them available for the reserves to maintain/improve fitness levels.  If someone is very low on match fitness, don't play them in the reserves for 90 mins - build their fitness up gradually.

@Hilly27 Your game to play in whatever way you like, just bear in mind there is much more to injuries than just the Injury Proneness attribute, and even if they have 1 for Injury Proneness it doesn't make them immune.

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5 hours ago, Hilly27 said:

Yes, you may say that's cheating, but it's the only way to give your self a chance, because they still get injured.

"Give yourself a chance" from what? Everyone (including the AI) is on the same footing as you are. If anything, the poor AI need to get edited to injury proneness 1 in my save.

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If you're editing their injury proneness down, you might as well skip that step and just edit their injuries away when they happen...

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2 hours ago, enigmatic said:

If you're editing their injury proneness down, you might as well skip that step and just edit their injuries away when they happen...

I think there are unavoidable imbalances in the game, which are bound to occur in such a complicated simulation as FM. I think, by SI incorporating an in game editor, they tacitly admit that's probably the case. Some of us who go right the way back to the beginning of CM/FM can recall some of the heated arguments over the years about the use of real time editors, of which they have been many, as to whether it's cheating or not etc.

There are players who never edit, some who edit a little, and some who edit a lot.  Which ever you choose to do, you are not wrong. How you play the game is entirely a matter for the individual. The fact I edit a little suits me. I accept injuries when they come along, and as herne79 quite rightly says, giving a player 1 injury proneness, doesn't make him immune.  It just acts as a bit of a comfort blanket for my best players, although as I said in an earlier post, I lost Harry Kane for most of a season, and carried on.

Despite all the arguments for and against, some players, me included, just have the feeling that there are far to many injuries. We may be right or wrong, and every save is different, but there is no harm in giving yourself a bit of a leg up if it helps your enjoyment of the game. After all that's why we buy it.

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6 minutes ago, Hilly27 said:

I think there are unavoidable imbalances in the game, which are bound to occur in such a complicated simulation as FM. I think, by SI incorporating an in game editor, they tacitly admit that's probably the case. Some of us who go right the way back to the beginning of CM/FM can recall some of the heated arguments over the years about the use of real time editors, of which they have been many, as to whether it's cheating or not etc.

There are players who never edit, some who edit a little, and some who edit a lot.  Which ever you choose to do, you are not wrong. How you play the game is entirely a matter for the individual. The fact I edit a little suits me. I accept injuries when they come along, and as herne79 quite rightly says, giving a player 1 injury proneness, doesn't make him immune.  It just acts as a bit of a comfort blanket for my best players, although as I said in an earlier post, I lost Harry Kane for most of a season, and carried on.

Despite all the arguments for and against, some players, me included, just have the feeling that there are far to many injuries. We may be right or wrong, and every save is different, but there is no harm in giving yourself a bit of a leg up if it helps your enjoyment of the game. After all that's why we buy it.

No they don't, please don't make things up.

There is an in game editor, because people liked being able to change things in game for whatever reason, and the 3rd party ones would corrupt saves, so they took it on themselves.

Injury rates are slightly less than 80% of real life. If anything, injuries need to go up.

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Just now, themadsheep2001 said:

No they don't, please don't make things up.

There is an in game editor, because people liked being able to change things in game for whatever reason, and the 3rd party ones would corrupt saves, so they took it on themselves.

Injury rates are slightly less than 80% of real life. If anything, injuries need to go up.

Easy does it, I'm not making anything up. It was my opinion, tacitly means that there is no open acknowledgement. I was astonished when SI provided the in-game editor, hence my opinion upon it. I 'm glad they did as it's a useful bit of kit. I'm happy to be wrong in my opinion, but I'm entitled to hold without being told I'm making it up. I prefaced my comment with "I think" hence an opinion.

As for injuries, I agree with the thrust of your remarks that they are not over the top, but as every game is different, a player can get the feeling that there are to many, especially if you get a few all at once. Personally, there are times when an injury is welcome, particularly if you've two good players going after one position, and one is complaining about lack of game time. A swift three weeks out for one, and you've a happy player.

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There's a difference between an opinion and an assumption, and I think you're confusing the two.

Edited by eriktous

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On 15/11/2016 at 21:25, vangto said:

Pogba is often down to 50% in matches but is the one seemingly impervious to injury...

You just cursed him. Out for 3 months with a torn hamstring in my current save :rolleyes:.

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8 hours ago, Hilly27 said:

Easy does it, I'm not making anything up. It was my opinion, tacitly means that there is no open acknowledgement. I was astonished when SI provided the in-game editor, hence my opinion upon it. I 'm glad they did as it's a useful bit of kit. I'm happy to be wrong in my opinion, but I'm entitled to hold without being told I'm making it up. I prefaced my comment with "I think" hence an opinion.

As for injuries, I agree with the thrust of your remarks that they are not over the top, but as every game is different, a player can get the feeling that there are to many, especially if you get a few all at once. Personally, there are times when an injury is welcome, particularly if you've two good players going after one position, and one is complaining about lack of game time. A swift three weeks out for one, and you've a happy player.

It's your opinion, but that doesn't make it correct. There isn't the slightest bit of evidence to base your opinion on, so all that's happening is you're spreading completely false information.

You might have a bit of an injury crisis for a couple of months and then not have one again for years (or at all). IRL there are often injury issues to deal with. I'm still waiting for even a normal amount of injuries in my squad and I've started many saves with many clubs during the Beta. 

Now, it's your game, so you're free to do as you please and edit whatever you like. The facts are what they are though and SI don't operate on feelings. SI does test this across multiple leagues for years and years. They don't look at a month or two at a time. The numbers from their test show that compared to real life, they're not even at 80%. It's far too low, IMO, but I can imagine how many complaints there will be if it was completely realistic. 

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I used to have injury crises for years, until I realised that I was over fitness-training my youth players. The changes I made have resulted in the number of injuries being a fraction of what they were before.

1. Natural Fitness is one of my priorities when acquiring or retaining players. A string of minor injuries means I won't renew an injury-prone player's contract.

2. If I do general fitness training I never put it above 'average'. Mostly I keep general training on either balanced or fitness and low, so that the main focus of training is on individual training.

Now the majority of my injuries occur in matches rather than on the training pitch or in the gym.

 

I got most if not all of these ideas off Cleon.

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Try managing Sunderland, we have Rodwell who gets injured by passing butterflies and Lee Cattermole who goes in for leg breaking tackles in the cafeteria let alone on the training pitch.

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On 16.11.2016 at 01:39, herne79 said:

 

@Hilly27 Your game to play in whatever way you like, just bear in mind there is much more to injuries than just the Injury Proneness attribute, and even if they have 1 for Injury Proneness it doesn't make them immune.


It isn't but injury proneness, but that sure has a big influence. I'm not happy with injuries myself, but for me it goes completely the other way around. Therefore I had tested this on numerous previous releases, this is a shot off this EPL, mid-october. For young players who don't have a track record, those attributes AFAIK are randomized at each start of a save. Still if he only edited his on squad, Kane out most of the time or no, that would be a massively advantage.

wRHUTaf.jpg

 

 

Well not that FM 2017 would regularly produce anything extreme, let alone actually football challenges here on average, where 3-5 first team player out would be totally the norm, quite the contrary.

7EwQRnz.jpg

 

http://www.whoout.com/

http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/epl_injury_table.php

 

Edited by Svenc

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