FM2012 is too easy

[DuddBudda]

I did a season with Marseille in Fm2011

So then, both 2011 and 2012 are too easy?

in 19 years Marseille could well be better than Barca, or the rest of the Ligue 1 could be crap

jus trollin? probably

[Romanista.]

The problem is 99% of people have it engrained within them that being a big club = easy level, without actually thinking about the problem in any depth. They regurgitate the same old lines over and over again about don't manage so and so if you want a tougher game. Its probably one of the reasons why that part of the game never seems to be improved upon, its a cop-out that papers over the real problem most people are unaware of. This debate has been going on for at least two years now, the problem is the AI just can't put up a decent challenge no matter who you are, either tactically or team building-wise. It doesn't matter if someone manages Man Utd or Macclesfield Town, its only a matter of time before (human) player domination sets in because your club will be the only one that adapts to the gameworld and consistantly improves itself while the rest (all AI managed) stagnate or become progressively weaker.

So yes, the challenge should be there whoever you manage, big club, or minnow.

good post. you can take the worst team in the blue square and reach the premier league in 6-7 seasons. i haven't played 12, but on the previous versions it is so easy mainly because of the stupidity of the AI in the transfer market, such as letting their key players go for free and buying your crap players for twice their value( i managed to sell 34 year old abou trika to wolves for 1.2M and he didnt even play 1 game for them) you can pretty much turn a relegation side into a CL contender just by signing free players.

[chiek tiote is a legend]

just got daniel sturridge on loan for a season 50% wages to be paid,totally unchallenged?????????? surely this wouldnt happen

[Neo14]

I dont made 19 years at Marseille, before I was at Inter Milan then Monza.

I just did four seasons at Marseille.

I took over the club in 2025 or 2026 until 2029

[Morten Grejs]

i got adebayor on a season long loan with 50% wages and agreed price of 2 mill £ roughly, no one else wanted him. the stupid thing is i was willing to pay 12mill £ one month before, but they rejected.

[Neo14]

So then, both 2011 and 2012 are too easy?

in 19 years Marseille could well be better than Barca, or the rest of the Ligue 1 could be crap

jus trollin? probably

Default

I dont made 19 years at Marseille, before I was at Inter Milan then Monza.

I just did four seasons at Marseille.

I took over the club in 2025 or 2026 until 2029

[markyosullivan]

Hmm your arguabley the best team in france and you've won all your games how strange ??!!!

This. It's funny how people complain about how easy the game is when they use some of the best teams in the game.

[SeanNUFC]

This. It's funny how people complain about how easy the game is when they use some of the best teams in the game.

The point is not every top team(that you become) should be playing like Barcelona or Real Madrid.

Right, last time i'm going to make this point.

[Govnar1]

The problem is 99% of people have it engrained within them that being a big club = easy level, without actually thinking about the problem in any depth. They regurgitate the same old lines over and over again about don't manage so and so if you want a tougher game. Its probably one of the reasons why that part of the game never seems to be improved upon, its a cop-out that papers over the real problem most people are unaware of. This debate has been going on for at least two years now, the problem is the AI just can't put up a decent challenge no matter who you are, either tactically or team building-wise. It doesn't matter if someone manages Man Utd or Macclesfield Town, its only a matter of time before (human) player domination sets in because your club will be the only one that adapts to the gameworld and consistantly improves itself while the rest (all AI managed) stagnate or become progressively weaker.

So yes, the challenge should be there whoever you manage, big club, or minnow.

I completely agree

[Govnar1]

So then, both 2011 and 2012 are too easy?

unfortunately

[Govnar1]

I would really like to see what formation / tactics these people are using who can win every game they play by three goals.

I'm using my own tactics (specifically avoiding the corner exploit) and it really isn't easy. Especially taking over a club bottom of the league halfway through a season!

The fact that default corner routine is an exploit is tragicomic.

[DuddBudda]

corner exploit?

I have default corners out of laziness and we've scored one corner in a dozen or more games :/

[Coentrao]

The fact that default corner routine is an exploit is tragicomic.

True.

xxxx 10 chars.

[Neo14]

I'm never use the corner bug in FM 2011

In FM2012, I'm just win against Real 3-0 at Madrid

I'm not the only one to think the game is too easy.

SI must don't forget the experienced player

[Wakers]

Actually, the overpowered team talks do kill one thing that I absolutely hated for the last few versions - those sudden, random and catastrophic drops in morale that completely derail your season. When morale is low, you just have a team meeting and everything is golden again

[The Welsh Lad]

Difficulty level settings will never be introduced because for every different level, there has to be a new set of code which in turn will results in more chances for things to go wrong with the game. Then all the ones that wanted the difficulty levels will be complaining the game is broke etc.

Its how you decided to play then game, decides how hard or easy it is going to be, in real life there is not a readily available list of 10,000 players and staff at your disposal, in real life the manager sends out scouts to find players and places Job Adverts for staff.

If you use the player search screen to find players that haven't been scouted its going against realism to an extent, obviously well-known players don't need scouting i.e. Rooney, Ronaldo etc. because you know they are good.

Admittedly, there is to much importance on Team-talks and Moral.

People argue the game is to easy, when using tools that are not available in real-life. The players that don't use these are finding it slightly harder due to the standard of their staff.

There is nothing wrong in looking at another leagues stats to then scout top league goal scorers etc. (Picking up a paper or going online would be real-life examples).

Obviously, it is up to the player on how to play the game, just put into perspective before criticising the game. Until people with lower end computers catch up with the people with upper end computers it is hard for SI to improve the AI to levels that experienced players desire. Si is a business and has to weigh things up in what the best way is to make the game enjoyable to the majority not the minority, whilst improving revenue. If this link with Steam can show that the majority have upper end computers and they can afford to alienate the minority be making them needing to upgrade their systems in order to play. Then they can develop the AI to the levels that experienced players desire.

[fcunitedfan]

I think lower league football is going to be harder this year. The players you can sign as a lower league manager seem more realistic this year. I'm playing as FC United, and I've not found any League 2 or League 1 quality players who'll sign for my club yet. Last year, the higher league quality players were flocking to join my little BSN team. It'll take some getting used to, but I kind of like it.

[Bielsista]

Ive played my first official match in FM 2012.

Im playing with Anzhi and I won 10-1 over Lokomotiv. The prediction was a tie...well, faaaaar from that. Etoo scored 4, Montillo (I bought him) scored 4 and made 4 assists. I created 16 CCCs.

Ok, just ONE match, but the first one, against a decent team, with my tactic not gelled yet, etc.

[MrPompey]

The fact that default corner routine is an exploit is tragicomic.

This was an FM11 out of the box exploit fixed by a patch. I don't really know how this has become undone

[Ranger7168]

This is not a smart statement, why should managing man c or man u be easy?, if its not hard managing a top level team, i really dont see what could be. Its the LLM argument all over again. Try loosing a few matches if expectation is to win, or not meet board expectations;). Liverpool and Spurs medium!!, lol, well.

Why should Marseille be a walk in the park in france!, its not like that at all irl.

[SeanNUFC]

Why should Marseille be a walk in the park in france!, its not like that at all irl.

Exactly.

.

[wally13]

But this is't real life

[SeanNUFC]

But this is't real life

aahahahaha

FM prides itsself on realism as do the people who play it, now this argument comes up? Genius.

[bleventozturk]

To people who keep complaining the game is too easy:

It is your tactics

But seriously, it is true. All of you already are familiar with the ME because it is the same one from FM 2011. The ME is not perfectly balanced, and if you tweak your tactics enough, it is only a matter of time until you will find one that AI opponents won't be able to handle. No matter how much fun it is to keep tweaking your tactics, for the sake of realism and challange you are better off by using default ones that the AI managers use themselves. Only then the game is fair. Personally I try to find a tactic that produces reasonable results, and doesn't include any exploit, and move on. The game is more challenging that way.

Until SI will produce a better AI, that's what I will keep doing so that I can enjoy this otherwise great game.

[wally13]

aahahahaha

FM prides itsself on realism as do the people who play it, now this argument comes up? Genius.

Yes thats right but the fact remains its not real life it a sim which tries to mirror real life as much as it can

if you think it going to mirror real life 100% your deluded

[SeanNUFC]

Yes thats right but the fact remains its not real life it a sim which tries to mirror real life as much as it can

if you think it going to mirror real life 100% your deluded

Its not about mirroring it but its also not about going way way off the mark. I will find ways to get around this game being too easy in order to have fun at whatever clubs i wish(i hope anyway) but i shouldn't have to.

[wally13]

Its not about mirroring it but its also not about going way way off the mark. I will find ways to get around this game being too easy in order to have fun at whatever clubs i wish(i hope anyway) but i shouldn't have to.

Well im sure the SI team will evaluate all whats been said and if its found the game is too easy at present then im sure they will try to fix it, what sort of fix i dont know because theres probably as many finding it hard (like me ) as much is there is people finding it easy

[JCresswell]

Ive played my first official match in FM 2012.

Im playing with Anzhi and I won 10-1 over Lokomotiv. The prediction was a tie...well, faaaaar from that. Etoo scored 4, Montillo (I bought him) scored 4 and made 4 assists. I created 16 CCCs.

Ok, just ONE match, but the first one, against a decent team, with my tactic not gelled yet, etc.

This doesnt shock me look at the team anzhi have brought there just miles above the rest in the russian league by ratings

[JCresswell]

To people who keep complaining the game is too easy:

It is your tactics

But seriously, it is true. All of you already are familiar with the ME because it is the same one from FM 2011. The ME is not perfectly balanced, and if you tweak your tactics enough, it is only a matter of time until you will find one that AI opponents won't be able to handle. No matter how much fun it is to keep tweaking your tactics, for the sake of realism and challange you are better off by using default ones that the AI managers use themselves. Only then the game is fair. Personally I try to find a tactic that produces reasonable results, and doesn't include any exploit, and move on. The game is more challenging that way.

Until SI will produce a better AI, that's what I will keep doing so that I can enjoy this otherwise great game.

tbh people gotta remember when there bring in revelationary tactics into the game first season i was doing really well but when teams learned my tactics teams were doing better against me u gotta remember its ai there not that smart and tbh people being huge teams be lil teams ull soon find the game harder without millions to spend with an already brilliant squad

[Govnar1]

In my opinion the only way forward is to remove the player search and the visible attributes (except the few objectively measurable physical attributes such as speed, power, acceleration, endurance ... and some mental qualities such as professionalism). In this way the search for players would be reduced to research of statistics such as percentage of successful passes, crosses, tackles... Of course it is crucial that the AI managers use the same method of player search. This would help AI team building and hopefully it would prevent human players from easily retaining their best players (now AI doesn't recognize player performance only CA).

[legaldinho]

i'm heading for the quadruple with spurs, so obv it's not too easy

[Motherlover]

In my opinion the only way forward is to remove the player search and the visible attributes (except the few objectively measurable physical attributes such as speed, power, acceleration, endurance ... and some mental qualities such as professionalism). In this way the search for players would be reduced to research of statistics such as percentage of successful passes, crosses, tackles... Of course it is crucial that the AI managers use the same method of player search. This would help AI team building and hopefully it would prevent human players from easily retaining their best players (now AI doesn't recognize player performance only CA).

Agreed, although i'd like the removal of the player search to be an optional you can select at the start of the game, like masking player attributes.

[MAINBOY]

In my first game of the season I beat Celtic 5-1 at home. This surely is a bug lol

[SGartz]

Well if this is easy I'd hate to see it hard! Nice to see the researchers have messed up the Leeds Utd stats again, I am fighting against relegation despite doing nothing wrong managing in a common sense fashion. A tad annoying, looks like I am going to get the sack soon. Nice.

[Govnar1]

Agreed, although i'd like the removal of the player search to be an optional you can select at the start of the game, like masking player attributes.

I completely agree

[Loversleaper]

Here is an example of why some might think the game is easy, someone was talking about York so I took the challenge. I haven't touched training (at all) and left the team talks & press conferences to the assistant (motivating 2). I left the original squad, made one simple tactic where I only change the roles of the wide midfielder to wingers and played fluid/attacking (used same tactic all games with no shouts or changes throughout).

The tactic and squad:

By loversleaper at 2011-10-22

Transfers in & out:

By loversleaper at 2011-10-22

League table:

By loversleaper at 2011-10-22

Fixture List (missing 4-0 victory in the last game):

By loversleaper at 2011-10-22

[Loversleaper]

Goals from Corners (not bad for default settings):

By loversleaper at 2011-10-22

Number of Save games (to show no cheating was going on):

By loversleaper at 2011-10-22

This can be easiely done without any effort. Usually I would not play like this, normally I would make tactical changes to get the most out of the game - and, of course, do all the team talks to ensure my squad stays in good morale. I didn't have to do any of that at all to do fairly well in the league. Normally I would also find a few players to better my squad and use some time getting new coaches and making better training regimes (didn't even look at any of the pages).

Save game: http://www.mediafire.com/file/jnx66l6v8o7yq47/ForUploadYork.fm

[shirajzl]

At the same time, we have threads like this. It's funny, really.

[tommyb99]

Try being a team in the northern premier division,see if you find that easy,muppet

[shirajzl]

Lovesleaper, it could be interesting to try the same, but with a different tactic, something like 4231. Also, try rigid philosophy, for example.

For all we know you've managed to prove you should keep everything as simple as possible tactics-wise. Also, most tactics I've seen use fluid or very fluid. I've rarely seen people use rigid or very rigid systems (unless in lower leagues). Maybe it tells us fluid is the way to go unless you have absolutely poor players.

[Loversleaper]

Try being a team in the northern premier division,see if you find that easy,muppet

Uhhh, was that directed towards Me?

Why would you want to shoot the messenger?... :confused:

[Loversleaper]

Lovesleaper, it could be interesting to try the same, but with a different tactic, something like 4231. Also, try rigid philosophy, for example.

For all we know you've managed to prove you should keep everything as simple as possible tactics-wise. Also, most tactics I've seen use fluid or very fluid. I've rarely seen people use rigid or very rigid systems (unless in lower leagues). Maybe it tells us fluid is the way to go unless you have absolutely poor players.

I could, but it is kind of draining to play games. Plus, I think it might be best I don't since it looks like I am going to have to take abuse for it, it is not that important actually...

[shirajzl]

I could, but it is kind of draining to play games. Plus, I think it might be best I don't since it looks like I am going to have to take abuse for it, it is not that important actually...

Shame, really. I'd do it, but I've removed FM 12 demo a few days ago and don't have FM 12 yet. I'm curious about what I said, you might have found some significant details by accident.

[The Welsh Lad]

York have a Media prediction of 5th so you have only slightly over preformed, so I wouldn't say it easy.

[Loversleaper]

York have a Media prediction of 5th so you have only slightly over preformed, so I wouldn't say it easy.

Did all this with no micromanaging at all, I have also screenshots of Atalanta (media prediction 20th) where I lost only 1 game - Wolves (media prediction 17th) in 4th place, 3 points off second place and a few others. None of the games did I even look at training/coaches, played the same tactic all the way through all the games, not one signing, no team talks/press - in short, no micromanaging what so ever...

[SeanNUFC]

Did all this with no micromanaging at all, I have also screenshots of Atalanta (media prediction 20th) where I lost only 1 game - Wolves (media prediction 17th) in 4th place, 3 points off second place and a few others. None of the games did I even look at training/coaches, played the same tactic all the way through all the games, not one signing, no team talks/press - in short, no micromanaging what so ever...

Somethings broken imo. Thanks for providing some evidence btw.

I think im gonna stay away from 4-4-2,maybe its a super tactic now?

[The Welsh Lad]

But FM doesn't state to play the game you must micro-manage, if you don't micro-manage you Assistant do things. The Default training schedules are not bad but they are not ideal they do the job for someone that doesn't want to micro-manage.

If you team-talks are being done by you assistant then he is doing something right. If you Assistant is doing press conferences then he is doing something right. Signing don't make a team, the players already at the club can do a good job.

I don't know if the demo being on a small database had a say in things even thought people at SI will say it doesn't. But there are still people coming on here asking for help because they are struggling and finding it hard.

We know that there is to much importance on Moral and Motivation, if you have a decent assistant or you know how to keep these good you will have a slight advantage over players that don't know how to do these.

[alexedi]

I am having the same problem as NEO14...

The game is just TOO EASY!

I am playing friendly game against the league Champions of Wales, and two of the other best teams in wales (I am Real Madrid). I won all three games with over 6 goals, and I didn't play Ronaldo or Casillas!

[KUBI]

I am having the same problem as NEO14...

The game is just TOO EASY!

I am playing friendly game against the league Champions of Wales, and two of the other best teams in wales (I am Real Madrid). I won all three games with over 6 goals, and I didn't play Ronaldo or Casillas!

I guess that even Real C could win those games.

[MattSpurs94]

Personally, I find it absolutely fine. I don't win every match, mostly because of my error in playing the wrong kind of player, wrong teamtalk etc. The OP says he's experienced at FM, so he is probably more skilled than I am at these areas, so he will do better. Like in real life, the more experienced and cleverer manager will do extremely well