Patch 8.0.1. Shots to Goal Ratio not fixed - SHOCKING!! SI Please answer - believe to be related to Closing down and Long shots bug

[George Graham]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Fred_the_Red:

I doubt anything is being done about this anyway. So everyone might as well ive with the 30 shots on target engine.

Ive started as a lower league club and still get the same problems so. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Something will be done. Its just the ME is very complex, and if SI are aiming for just 2 patches (as with 07) then they must be making sure that any fixes do not create any knock-on issues.

You really cannot underestimate just how complex this game is.

[dabest]

Takes the biscuit

[dabest]

Either Barnsley are goal scoring machines or its my tactic.... obviously

[Roberto Chen]

My players missed so many chance even I can score, one-to-one against a rubbish goalie, and open goals, which are much worse...

I play 4-3-1-2, the formation Inter Milan usesd. But my 3 DMs acts like underage girls, easily getting beaten up, runing around with any purpose(or keeping distance away from opponents,as if they are going to rape them), then always practising long shots during matchs...

Not able to save tactical settings so I have to set up over and over again before each single match.But players don't usually follow the setting,e.g.players taking FK randomly, or with some strange behaviors, e.g. ALWAYS playing concers to near post....

I get up.I cannot believe it but the game looks not enjoyable at all.

To be honest, I have to admit, it is very helpful to improve my patience and imnuity to frustration

Won't play until either 8.0.2 or FM2009...

[Offside]

For me it's not just strikers missing chances, it's super keepers. I've had double figures shots on target many times and some muppet with the stats of a pub player gets motm.

[kennec]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dabest:

Takes the biscuit </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

whut u do here is getting screens from the worst of the worst game. means nothing and besides if u wanna win all games improve your tactics

[kennec]

this post is about any bragging or anything.dont email about my tactic for these results either.

some ppl above and on previus pages complain alot they dont score enough and so on.they put in a screen where they have alot of missed chanses and then blame the game.

I got a big feeling they didnt do everything to win even if they say so. like rotate players,change tactics,getting in subs,putting yout anti 4-2-4 tactic to plan when computer change in last minutes of game to score another and so on.

there is alot to be done and we all know it. a thing many forget is the teamtalks. some bottuns are actually auto loose options. like for example i expect a win wich always fail for me and i looose against weak opposition insteed.

whut team talks and tactics i used on my screen i will post is not intresting.U all gotta find your own way to win the games.i am pretty sure there are many players that have succesfull tactics working on the patched game.

my lazio game.no cheats edits or replaying games have been used.all players aresame as in 8.01 database.

lost 18 games out 306 in 6 sesons.

http://img91.imageshack.us/my.php?image=managerresult230winsoh7.jpg

some games i was happy about and made to screens

http://img213.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fiorentinahomaca40vh8.jpg

http://img213.imageshack.us/my.php?image=inter32js1.jpg

http://img503.imageshack.us/my.php?image=juventushoma31cauh1.jpg

http://img503.imageshack.us/my.php?image=milan50hk9.jpg

http://img503.imageshack.us/my.php?image=milan61qm9.jpg

http://img139.imageshack.us/my.php?image=milanaway43caft5.jpg

and finaly my spank team roma. they spend and spend and spend in the game. they have way more money then me but win nothing but still earns loads of cash and still have superb rep to attract the best players.14 wins out of 16 for me

http://img528.imageshack.us/my.php?image=derbyresultsip8.jpg

oh i can give a hint about my tactic. i play with 1 gk and 7 defensive players with tackle 20+. the 3 offensive ones are pacy types.

flame on

[MatRempit]

i dominates the games. Have about 23 shots , about 12 on target. The opponent have like 8 shots, 3 on target and yet i draw the game 1-1. Have like 4 time " he should have scored, even his managers got his head in his hands". If this happens a few times its okay but this happen in almost every matches!!! 9 out of 10 games. I used liverpool and against birmingham i won 2 -0 and but goals were deflections!! I dominates possesion wise about 58% and 20+ shots and almost every highlights was about my team !. Most goals i score are deflections and some rebounds. My strikers are torres and goran pandev. Dont tell me its about tactics cause ive tried lots of tactics and its the same. One on ones cant score...even if i score its a rebound . SI this is totally unacceptable , now have to wait for another patch so that i can play the game again . im really keeping my cool in posting this . dont know what will happen if i lose my cool . Fix it .

[kennec]

just couse u win shots and chanses doesnt mean u deserve to win.

mayby try another tactic insteed of whining and waiting?

[nymanr]

It is not about wining or loosing games.

Problem is the not being able to score from open clean chances.

So far in my 4 season game with Man Utd i have lost 10 games total in the premier league. Have a 2.1 goal/game average and a 0.3 goals conceded average. Problem is that i get the team to play like i want and create the best kind of chances for them (Rooney, Tevez, Huntelaar, Aguero), but they just cant convert a open chance at goal better then at a 1/10 ratio. Only goals i score come from rebounds, corners and penalties. Score on average 1 DFK per season (FK taker is Silva) and CM players score 1/50 of Longshots.

No teams dear to attack against me(except Arsenal and Real Madrid) so don't get any counter attacks. So it gets a little frustrating when you manage to get those open chances and have to watch them go direct at the keeper most of the time.

[MatRempit]

I dont always complain and rarely post in the forums . i register to download patches. But this is really bad that i have to post . i know most people will say in real life even world class strikers miss easy chances. but not in almost every matches. i dont think its tactics or because of me because lots of people also complains about this .

I never even trash teams that i dominate completely .Not to mention the goddamn corners , when on the near post no angles at all and the striker miss its always " he should have scored , thats enough to destroy one self confidence". The match engine is ridicuolous . Im doing quite well in the game so this is a rant not because i cannot win , its because of the unrealistic match engine . i have never won more than a 2 goal margin and not score more than 3 goals . Missing about 90 % of one on ones.

[Guest sav112]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kennec:

mayby try another tactic insteed of whining and waiting? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not wishing to cause offence but some on here know the game inside and out and we know its not right, get over the “stop complaining cause your loosing†thing before we all fall asleep.

Old and trusted tactics are not producing what some would expect. Players are not performing as expected. It’s the feel you get more than just looking at the statistics of each match, it’s the many years of playing the game online really testing the game in my case.

To me the game is driven by the rule “it can happen in real life football matches so it will happen!†like the games you totally dominate have thirty shots on goal and they win 1-0 with there 3 shots. This does happen but it’s the lightly hood that seems off to me.

Somthings just need a tweak to get that feel back that all is well.

[ljdzsgffk]

League cup final

[Silverx]

People really not getting the point? People not complaining because they're losing, but simply because the match engine isn't acting realistically - for or against the human player.

[Scath]

I'll give a simple example of the problem, just to attempt to illustrate the problem -

In a recent game, my Barcelona team were playing a much weaker team (can't remember which right now). Bojan scored a few goals for me, but two of them really summed up what's annoying people.

In both cases, a through ball set him off, and he raced behind the defence. Now he's fast, strong, good finishing, good composure. I'm playing at a slow tempo. Both times, he shoots, keeper saves, and he gets the rebound.

Now why am I annoyed?

Firstly, keepers make saves. Not disputing that. And strikers score rebounds too. But... They also manage to score one-on-ones too. The idea that a one-on-one is not a viable scoring chance is a serious problem.

[jaaaws]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dimon:

I think I found a solution for those, who liked the beta patch match engine more (such as me). IMO it was way more realistic than the 8.0.1. I hope I'm not violating any rules by posting this...

I have no programming experence at all and I don't know anything about the FM file structure, so you can call it an experiment. Personally, I was really disappointed with the new match engine and wanted to return to the beta engine, but I also wanted all the other changes in the new patch to work. This means I couldn't just install the beta back and play on. So I took a look at the file structure and tried to find out if I could keep the match engine from the beta path while everithing else - from 8.0.1. After experimenting with files from both patches (I installed the first one and copied all the files I was interested in, than installed the second one) I think I found the solution.

There are two folders in the "data" directory - "tables" and "match events". Try installing the beta patch, copying these two folders to some place, then installing 8.0.1 and substituting the new folders in the "data" directory with the old ones you just copied. Let me say again that I'm not sure about anything, somebody can comment on this, even SI (doubt it, though), but give it a try if you want. I found out that the engine did change and works in a suspiciously similar, even identical way to the beta engine. Of course I can only judje from my own feelings. My conclusion - this experiment was successful. I know that the beta engine is not perfect in many ways, but it's my decision to return to it.

These conclusions may also be true: the match engine is a seperate thing in the game and can be patched constantly, on a monthly basis, for example. This means the SI don't have to wait until February to give an all new 8.0.2 patch with match engine fixes only to find out that nobody likes them. The SI may adress this problem now and provide a patch or two to improve the match engine quite soon.

Any comments? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Did anyone try this and had a similar experience?

[Mitja]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jaaaws:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dimon:

I think I found a solution for those, who liked the beta patch match engine more (such as me). IMO it was way more realistic than the 8.0.1. I hope I'm not violating any rules by posting this...

I have no programming experence at all and I don't know anything about the FM file structure, so you can call it an experiment. Personally, I was really disappointed with the new match engine and wanted to return to the beta engine, but I also wanted all the other changes in the new patch to work. This means I couldn't just install the beta back and play on. So I took a look at the file structure and tried to find out if I could keep the match engine from the beta path while everithing else - from 8.0.1. After experimenting with files from both patches (I installed the first one and copied all the files I was interested in, than installed the second one) I think I found the solution.

There are two folders in the "data" directory - "tables" and "match events". Try installing the beta patch, copying these two folders to some place, then installing 8.0.1 and substituting the new folders in the "data" directory with the old ones you just copied. Let me say again that I'm not sure about anything, somebody can comment on this, even SI (doubt it, though), but give it a try if you want. I found out that the engine did change and works in a suspiciously similar, even identical way to the beta engine. Of course I can only judje from my own feelings. My conclusion - this experiment was successful. I know that the beta engine is not perfect in many ways, but it's my decision to return to it.

These conclusions may also be true: the match engine is a seperate thing in the game and can be patched constantly, on a monthly basis, for example. This means the SI don't have to wait until February to give an all new 8.0.2 patch with match engine fixes only to find out that nobody likes them. The SI may adress this problem now and provide a patch or two to improve the match engine quite soon.

Any comments? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Did anyone try this and had a similar experience? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

if it realy works, that guy is geniuos!!!

[Silverx]

The match events folder is simply for commentary and sounds.

[Ackter]

The match engine itself is part of the exe, which can't be changed.

Just shows how subjective the match engine can be.

[Mitja]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ackter:

The match engine itself is part of the exe, which can't be changed.

Just shows how subjective the match engine can be. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

yeah, I thouht so.

[Guest nathan1712]

Have to agree with all posts about this ridiculous issue. I have played the cm/fm games for many incarnations and must say this is by far the most frustrating. I am playing with Forest and 3 games in a row failed to score with an average of 20+ shots on target! The AI's striker in two of these games also picked up the ball at half way, beat 4 players and scores in the top corner! Almost put fist thru monitor.

And by the way for those who say " IT IS JUST YOUR TACTIC" you are so full of shiit. The tactic creates the chances for your forwards to finish and we are all creating heaps.

Sort it out SI

[leeds_fan_1]

just my 2 cents here, although i do believe there is a big problem here, i think that there are a couple of things that can be done to help the issue

Team Talks

Confidence has been mentioned in a previous post i have read (sorry can't remember who by), but this seems to have a large effect on how the player does infront of goal. At half time, if i find a player is constantly missing easy opportunities I always turn their half time team talk to "no pressure". I have tried this the last two games, one resulting in a second half hattrick, and one with both strikers bagging two each in the second half. Just a suggestion that has worked for me so far

Tactics

I know people say its a load of rubbish saying its you're tactic that has the problem, which i completely agree with as IRL this is completely unimaginable and unrealistic, but i believe in this game a variety of different shapes are needed in order to produce different goalscoring opportunities in different places, to keep the opposition defenders on their feet. I am currently using Loversleapers tactics sets (all credit to him for the idea) and am on a 20 game unbeated run with many 4-1, 5-0 etc under my belt. This is using the idea of upgrading/downgrading mentalities, varying shapes and adjusting to the different situations on a match day

hope this helped

[Kill Rock Stars]

ten minutes to go in a vital cup game, and i'm trailing 1-0. a through ball finds my player in the clear, his shot is well saved, and the ball falls to my other striker, three yards out. he promptly shoots it about six yards wide of the goal

i could handle this happening at most once or twice a season, but it's happened six or seven times already this season in matches involving my team, and i'm only a third of the way through the season. a couple of them have been from ai-controlled teams too.

tactics, team talks, training etc - none of these things should have more than a miniscule effect on whether or not a striker can score into an empty net from three yards

[kennec]

rock stars.

i agree strikers miss alot. altough its very easy produce alot of chanseseven if u play with 7 defenders and 3 mid+strikers.

if strikers would score more it will be like prepatch with results as 8-7 and 5-4 alot.

i think patch is fine. cant belive ppl whine and cry so much. do teams in real life always win when they face weaker opposition???its a match engine and if u canr win just change tactic until u find the weak whole in the ai tactic.then just win win win.but to do so u gotta work some and watch the games to see whut your players are doing wrong and change to better.

[Kill Rock Stars]

eh?

surely the fact that there are too many chances is a problem with the game, thus a good reason for people to complain? i don't think you'll find a single person who's reason for wanting one on ones improved is that they want to see scorelines of 8-7

i don't want a game in which defensive tactics still create tons of chances, and i don't want to have to tinker with tactics until i find an unrealistic super tactic that the ai can't cope with

[kennec]

so whut do u want?

tennis scores or reduce number of shoots at goal?

[Kill Rock Stars]

fewer shots on goals (via better defensive ai) and better finishing from strikers

[Mitja]

that would be cool...

[kennec]

we all want that

[Jopo12]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kennec:

do teams in real life always win when they face weaker opposition??? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Teams in real life nearly always win when they face considerably weaker oppostion... which isn't the case in FM.

[Fred_the_Red]

I would like an update from SI if they are looking in to this and if they found any problems with the shots to goal ratio. Or is just "our tactics" ?

Is anything being done? An updated patch? Any results from the PMK's that has been posted?

[adonis]

An update will be nice at least then if it aint a bug then we can do summat about it..like revising our tactics.

[insai]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/report?id=230593&cc=3436

go there, look at the stats table on the right.

look at the possession, shots taken, shots on goal, and then look at who won the game.

then stop whining and learn2play.

[Kill Rock Stars]

for the millionth time, people aren't complaining about it happening occasionally, they're complaining about it happening all the time. so using the stats from one match proves precisely nothing.

[Fred_the_Red]

And liverpool did not have 20 shots on goal. Who ever did thos stats are blind or have a nervous twitch.

[heathxxx]

They did have a lot of "efforts" though Fred_the_Red...

Good result for our lads though - even if I have to watch the game with Spanish commentary over here

[Jopo12]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by insai:

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/report?id=230593&cc=3436

go there, look at the stats table on the right.

look at the possession, shots taken, shots on goal, and then look at who won the game.

then stop whining and learn2play. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Man Utd is happening to be one of the best teams in the world, hardly a 2nd division squad or full of "greys". A person that thinks a team like Man Utd scoring with their only shot or anything is weird or improbable lacks any idea of football... so why to post here?

[Storm14]

This issue have made me uninstall my fm08...i rather play 07...the game is great but this 30 shots no goal thing is too much to take especially when you arsenal and play wolves at home and draw...i had enough

[troublemaker]

I returned to beta patch but SI made this patch a giant flop to be honest......bring back beta1 match engine and work a bit on it.....for god sakes how hard is to do that?

[Tenji]

i agree with most of the posts here, its starting to get very frustrating,

- you shoot 30 shots , 20 at goal and superman saves them all

- you are winning 1-0 and AI goes cheat mode with that ridiculous 4-2-4 tactic and scores the draw at 94 mins, even if the AI team is the absolute crap and in real life would get obliterated if it ever used such a formation, oh and after you done the 30 shots mentioned above so its even more frustrating.

- AI keeps on making trough balls to the back of my CBs wich by some weird reason try to put the striker on offside allowing him to easy slide by and score ( nope i dont use offside trap )

- the amazing fast paced ( 10 in pace ) striker that runs like asafa powell and scores a missile even henry couldnt shoot in real life , all this with 12 in finishing.

- the fantastic 4-4-2 or 4-2-3-1 that the AI uses with excellent results ( against you of course ) but if you use it its crap

im starting to miss the fun of fm 07, i dont need a second job i need a relax, thats why i play games.

[Guest jamie1976]

I've read these forums for playing hints and tips for a while but never been moved to post before now. I think everyone in the know recognizes that FM has been the best football management game since year dot.

I am a huge fan of all that went before but I have to say that this version is really weak. It seems fairly apparent that it was bug ridden and rushed into release way too early. The long awaited patch did fix most of the little bugs but the match engine is now fundamentally flawed.

IRL, sure, you might have one or two games a season where you dominate possession and have 30 shots on target to the opposition's 3 and still come out on the losing side or perhaps draw but every other match?! It's just frustrating and disillusioning to the point that I've given up playing it (much to my girlfriend's approval).

The real problem is that it is too easy to dominate with a half decent tactic (much easier than in FM07 for example) so it seems like SI overcompensated by making it twice as hard to beat average keepers in order to stop silly scorelines.

I know I'm not saying anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times before on here but surely that in itself is a reflection of how bad the problem is. I don't see why people would want to rip into SI for no reason.

Ordinarily I would automatically spend £30 on any FM release without thinking twice - such has been the quality of the series to date. Now, I don't think I would buy it again after this unless I read on here that there was a massive return to form next year.

It's sad for fans of the game but it must be worrying for Sega and SI. The sheer weight of numbers complaining here and people like me who have never had reason to speak up before suggests that future sales are not going to be maintained on reputation alone for very long.

[Sad Git]

I actually went and signed one of those superkeepers, after he saved 20 shots in a game against me.

Needless to say, once he was in my team he couldn't catch a cold in the North Pole . . .

[Fred_the_Red]

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/7185/aaarb1.jpg

Life still stucks. Not only did I dominate and I still lost on pens. To top it off all my players were superb on moral and the opponents were poor to good.

[IbrahimAliMaher]

I'm wading into this discussion quite late as I've ignored these threads til now in order to make my own judgements on the game post patch. My team is not one of the best sides in league 2 but seem to play quite well most of the time and yet usually end up drawing. I put this down to the inability of my strikers to put the ball in the back of the net. I play a high tempo attacking direct game so get quite a few chances per game as you might expect, but I'm really struggling to score more than 1 a game. I've rotated strikers, sold some who go on to do well for other clubs (and in higher leagues) and brought some in with fantastic stats for this level, changed tactics and formation and yet nothing works. Consequently I'm not enjoying playing as all I seem to do is dominate teams and end up drawing 1-1 or losing. I'm rapidly reaching the point where I have no confidence in the match engine, and I would class this game as 'unplayable' as every version to date seems to have a serious fundamental flaw which prevents the game from playing properly. I'm really disappointed with SI as this game is not at the standard I expect having played previous versions and not really finding any issues that ruined the game completely for me.

[nymanr]

Well just saw the worst game of my life. Thankfully it evened out against the end. I dominated the game from start to finish but every time Arsenal touched the ball they scored. Again gutted at the moment but hey these things happen but why do the AI always score at a higher % then me? What is it i am missing? Have excepted that my players will not score more then 1/5 open shots but why is this not true for other top teams?

Worst game of my FM career

[nymanr]

Should read "i have accepted that my players will not score more than 1/5"

But i am expecting a change for this in the future of FM games/patches

[Jopo12]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jamie1976:

It's sad for fans of the game but it must be worrying for Sega and SI. The sheer weight of numbers complaining here and people like me who have never had reason to speak up before suggests that future sales are not going to be maintained on reputation alone for very long. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm afraid this isn't how it is going to be... There are always so much people who don't notice the bugs or don't care about them. And there are so many people here who keep opposing everyone discussing here about those bugs, they aren't going to quit playing or buying because they'd have done that already.

The problem is actually that there are too many people who don't mind. It is needless for SI or Sega to improve the game over the point where it sells well enough, even if it was full of bugs and unfinished. I don't say that SI wouldn't care anything else than money, but it's not up to them to decide I guess and charity has no room in business if it takes too much away from other stuff which you get the money from.

Then you could claim that nobody wants to put too much effort in games nowadays because of warez and piratism, but I still think the latters are consequences, not reasons. If somebody made proper games people would buy them more. Now nearly everybody (makers) just try to get away with minimal effort and maximum profit. Good for those mass people who play every now and then their mediocre console games, but not so good for anybody who wants and expects a bit more, because game makers don't want to risk too much and putting more money in games.

I don't know what are the reasons, but it seems to me that the common opinnion is that FM series is going more and more downhill with every release, and I can't help thinking that it has something (or everything) to do with making money and quickly. Or then someone tell me why so many people think this way if it's not because of being more profitable. Why it is then?

[Themistofelis]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> i dont need a second job i need a relax, thats why i play games. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Very well said

[Rickooko]

Sometimes i wonder why SI keep asking us to send them the match files so they can checking out the issue.

If the SI staffs do play the game i think they can spot this issue pretty easily right??

Or, in another case they actually dont have this scoring problem in their games at all??

[Rickooko]

ps: Or they think it is realistic and actually is not a problem.

(So bad i cant edit my post)