FWT Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 Just started a new Gladbach save recently, first match away to Stuttgart, and I'm 4-1 down at half time. Being absolutely destroyed. For FWT's benefit, this is how it finished... I guess the game just doesn't want the AI to win 93rd minute too - nice. ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinningForumVisitor Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 I guess the game just doesn't want the AI to win Something is definitely amiss here Dagenham Dave. After all, you've done badly in one or two other matches, so it defies belief you could do something good in this one. Losing at half time as well? We all know nobody ever draws matches in those circumstances. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbokav1971 Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 OOhh ooh ooh. I have an even better one. Hang on a minute. So it's the Semi of the Italian Cup and we are playing Napoli who are now comfortably the best Italian team, (and running Chelsea close for the best European team). We dominate the home leg but it finishes 0-0 so we have it all to do in the away leg. We concede just before the hour mark and with time ticking away we just can't seem to get the goal. Then like buses, 3 come along all at once. 88th min. 89th min. and then just to really rub it in my DM, (who never scores), pops up with a 94th minute 3rd. Get in! [Edit] Gloating and boasting? Moi? :o Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott MUFC Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 here is the situation I am in RED wage budget Backroom Advice comes along, and my DoF says: Alveraz Balanta (50k/w) Doria (44.5k/w) and regular first teamers... and Arjen Robben (195k/w)are on too much money for thier ability. Robben was my doing... however the person in charge of contracts is....... my DoF, who gave the first 2 players the improved contracts. can I stop having staff moaning about stuff like this. he is in charge of contracts, why is he moaning at me about contracts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki679 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Maybe i'm being stupid but if you're 4-0 at half time, dominating the opposition and restricting them to very few chances on goal why would you suddenly change tactics? I guess what I mean is, if it ain't broke why fix it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinningForumVisitor Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Maybe i'm being stupid but if you're 4-0 at half time, dominating the opposition and restricting them to very few chances on goal why would you suddenly change tactics? I guess what I mean is, if it ain't broke why fix it? I don't think you are being stupud, but I would say that... Firstly, you opposition may well change tactic themselves, so what you were doing might not work. Even if they don't your players might become complacent or overly relaxed, and what was working before might stop working. Lastly, even if neither of the above happen in an overt and obvious way, but you concede a first goal and the come-back begins, then its clear that something is changing and the momentum may have switched. You can then either gamble and keep doing the same thing, like Liverpool did at 2-1 yesterday, and try and get another goal, which they did. Upon it going 3-2 though, they absolutely decided what they were doing wasn't working, and changed their tactics to try and draw out the game, although they did a pretty bad job of it for a while. I definitely get what you are saying about why at 4-0 you might not want to change your tactics, and indeed I often don't initially, but once the come-back against you begins you have to act. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Yet another chance to top the table passes us by. This time I didn't switch, we were so far on top, of course this was Fulham's very 1st shot of the game, Ashley Barnes scores an "outstanding" lob(take a look at the player) we also managed to miss a penalty to win the game(AI have not missed in about 12 seasons). It feels like i'm just following a path that has already been set in stone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
llama3 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 It's normal to change things at 4-0 up - concerns like remaining tight at the back, conserving fitness should be worthwhile concerns of yours as a boss. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 FWT, did you pay any attention to my post further up or was I derailing your cheating rant too much? If you're going to go down that route again, start a new thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 This time I didn't switch, we were so far on top, of course this was Fulham's very 1st shot of the game, Ashley Barnes scores an "outstanding" lob(take a look at the player) we also managed to miss a penalty to win the game(AI have not missed in about 12 seasons).It feels like i'm just following a path that has already been set in stone. On Saturday, in real life, my team missed two penalties, two open goals, and had three other clear cut chances. The opposition had two chances on goal the entire game. Final score = 2-2. It's unrealistic to expect to win every single game you play, sometimes these things happen in football. Why would it be 'set in stone' that you couldn't win the league? Can you explain the rationale behind this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 FWT, did you pay any attention to my post further up or was I derailing your cheating rant too much?If you're going to go down that route again, start a new thread. I'm not using the C word as i'm not categorically saying that it exists, it may just be a glitch with the ME due to all the number crunching the game does. Did you mean a new thread in the "Tactics" section? if so, I already did, I have even asked wwfan about the tactics I used and he very kindly told me that they are solid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Okay, if you're going down the pre-determined/cheating/AI-bias (or whatever you want to call it) route again start a thread here in General Discussion. If you're looking for tactical advice about what to do when the AI team comes back into matches in the 2nd half, then the Tactic forum is the right place. Edit: Couldn't find where wwfan told you that, but I'll still ask: FWT, what is the aim of your Counter tactic? How is it different to your Normal tactic? I have to ask, how much of the game do you watch? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 So frustrating... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Okay, if you're going down the pre-determined/cheating/AI-bias (or whatever you want to call it) route again start a thread here in General Discussion.If you're looking for tactical advice about what to do when the AI team comes back into matches in the 2nd half, then the Tactic forum is the right place. Edit: Couldn't find where wwfan told you that, but I'll still ask: It was actually a PM and what he said was "I can't see anything wrong with it, apart from there being too many team instructions". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 He can't see anything wrong with your Control tactic? Because I'd believe that. I question the others, but you still haven't provided an answer even though I have asked twice now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwfan Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I'm not using the C word as i'm not categorically saying that it exists, it may just be a glitch with the ME due to all the number crunching the game does.Did you mean a new thread in the "Tactics" section? if so, I already did, I have even asked wwfan about the tactics I used and he very kindly told me that they are solid. They are solid, but you obviously aren't making good decisions. Could be man and/or media management related or could be tactical in terms of what you are doing to try and see out matches. I also told you that you need to tone down your TIs. You could well do with adding some PIs to some of your players to eke the most out of their ability. Impossible to know without having full knowledge of your team and nothing we can help with anyway as it would mean we were basically playing the game for you. HUNT3R is right in telling you to work out the aim of your tactical switches. If you can't express that, then your are changing things up randomly, which would explain your seemingly random results. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 He can't see anything wrong with your Control tactic? Because I'd believe that. I question the others, but you still haven't provided an answer even though I have asked twice now. I use the Control tactic when i'm clear favourite home and away. The "Standard" tactic is for tight odds games against similar teams and is also used when I have a good lead having used the Control tactic. The Counter tactic is used when i'm clear underdog, or usually to see out the last 5 or 10 minutes of a tight game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I use the Control tactic when i'm clear favourite home and away. The "Standard" tactic is for tight odds games against similar teams and is also used when I have a good lead having used the Control tactic. The Counter tactic is used when i'm clear underdog, or usually to see out the last 5 or 10 minutes of a tight game. I can't help but feel that your Counter tactic would be so much better without that BWM in the DM slot. If you're trying to see out games, that BWM will get pulled all over the place trying to close down midfield runners and he'll leave huge gaps in front of the defence, which in turn pulls them into all directions. You're making it worse with the "Hassle Opponents" instruction too. It might work for you as the underdog, but as a tactic to see out games, it is flawed. The tactical mods can say much more than I'm able to, but those two issues are clear to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I use the Control tactic when i'm clear favourite home and away. The "Standard" tactic is for tight odds games against similar teams and is also used when I have a good lead having used the Control tactic. The Counter tactic is used when i'm clear underdog, or usually to see out the last 5 or 10 minutes of a tight game. Simply changing the mentality won't always work. You have to think about how your players and their roles will adapt to those changes. Particularly if you use a lot of team or player instructions. Again, this is the problem with using a d/loaded tactic. You're more reluctant to actually change any specifics as you don't really understand how the tactic works fully. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I can't help but feel that your Counter tactic would be so much better without that BWM in the DM slot. If you're trying to see out games, that BWM will get pulled all over the place trying to close down midfield runners and he'll leave huge gaps in front of the defence, which in turn pulls them into all directions. You're making it worse with the "Hassle Opponents" instruction too.It might work for you as the underdog, but as a tactic to see out games, it is flawed. The tactical mods can say much more than I'm able to, but those two issues are clear to me. Cheers, i'll look into that, appreciate the advice. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Cheers, i'll look into that, appreciate the advice. I should add, that your tactic (the Counter) isn't bad in the defensive phase. It gets caught out in the defensive transition, especially if a pass is intercepted, but in general too. You'll get caught 3v3, 2v2 or worse, but now we're getting really tactical, which is why I pointed you to the Tactics forum Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I should add, that your tactic (the Counter) isn't bad in the defensive phase. It gets caught out in the defensive transition, especially if a pass is intercepted, but in general too. You'll get caught 3v3, 2v2 or worse, but now we're getting really tactical, which is why I pointed you to the Tactics forum I'll just share with you my most recent frustration. Here goes.............. Two days before a big away game away to Arsenal(its close to Christmas) I lose one of my two KEY strikers to a training ground injury. Me being me and because of what I keep witnessing, I think to myself I just bet my other top striker gets injured during the game. I know, paranoid right?.................wrong, he is taken out during the game and is injured for 3 months(my other injured striker is now on international duty for a month or so). That's all pretty frustrating bet hey ho such is life. The extra kicker is, I draw the game against Arsenal 2-2 having had a goal disallowed for a foul in which my player(the apparent culprit) was nowhere near the foulee, I complained after the game and the FA kept quiet, so more bad luck. Also, Arsenal scored with their only two shots on target which were both courtesy of unforced player errors. It get worse, I then play away to a struggling Everton side, we dominate the entire game but my 3rd choice striker fails to find the net(or the target for that matter) Screenshots from both games... It just seems strange that the only luck I get is bad Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 It has nothing to do with "luck". In the first screenshot, a draw is a fair result. In the second, you only had 1 (ONE!!!) shot ON target out of 14! I'm basing this on the stats, because it's all you've given us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 It has nothing to do with "luck". In the first screenshot, a draw is a fair result. In the second, you only had 1 (ONE!!!) shot ON target out of 14! I'm basing this on the stats, because it's all you've given us. Its 100% down to luck(or the other thing I mentioned). We had a goal disallowed that should have counted, Arsenal were handed their goals on a plate, I lost my two key strikers within a couple of days of each other and my 3rd striker struggled to convert some easy chances. That's a whole lot of bad luck right there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I can have my defenders play up front and not have 1 shot on target out of 14. Your backup strikers/wingers could (and should) do better than that. Edit: I just got hammered my Shakthtar and still I had 3 of my 5 shots on target. Scored one too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 FWT, you're either trolling us all to death, or you're having an absolute 'mare on this thread. Not quite decided which yet. It's entertaining stuff nonetheless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 FWT, you're either trolling us all to death, or you're having an absolute 'mare on this thread. Not quite decided which yet. It's entertaining stuff nonetheless. Trolling, isn't that what YOU do Dave??? I'm simply pointing out what I think are flaws in the game at the end of the day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbokav1971 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Can I just point out that after I posted the gloating boastful statement in post #2453 yesterday, I went on to lose 3 of my next 4 games, (after only having lost 1 of my previous 16). Never ever ever ever ever ever EVER boast and gloat. The FM Gods are always watching. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I'm simply pointing out what I think are flaws in the game at the end of the day. The irony being that what you're actually doing is displaying your own flaws. Good work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dooro23 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 What highlight mode are you watching the games? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWT Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 The irony being that what you're actually doing is displaying your own flaws. Good work. I'll admit to about 15-20% of it being my own fault, but the rest is all FM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I'll admit to about 15-20% of it being my own fault, but the rest is all FM. You're wrongly blaming the game here. Anyway, either continue in your thread in the tactics forum for tactical queries/advice etc. or start a thread here in GD to discuss the "bad luck" only you suffer. You've derailed this thread for long enough now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott MUFC Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 erm.... this can't be right 1. I'm at home 2. I won the cup last season 3. its the 3rd best team in spain. had this last season with Leverkusen away as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob4590 Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 I'll admit to about 15-20% of it being my own fault, but the rest is all FM. And with that attitude, nothing will ever change for you - until you take full responsibility for what happens and make logical changes based on the stats, you will continue to get the same results - nearly all of which are down to a tactic that does NOT give you good scoring chances (no matter how much YOU think it does - the stats over all the screenshots you have posted say otherwise (ie about 10-25% shots on target)) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Rob, FWT has opened his own thread now. Please keep it in there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki679 Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Closed and banned already. I'm gonna miss him and his happy-go-lucky attitude to life. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
penza Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 not sure why this feedback thread is still open.. its just pointless now - nothing will change Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest El Payaso Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 not sure why this feedback thread is still open.. its just pointless now - nothing will changeNo it isn't, this thread helps SI to improve things in the next version of Football Manager which is FM 2015. I went back to my long term save in FM 2013 and in terms of the ME time hasn't goldened memories: it's way better and balanced. Much harder to get chances at least with adequate players but if I put good amount of adequate players to defend I am able to limit even the big teams even though I still lose to them. I would say that there are generally about 2-3 times less good chances to score in games which makes it much more enjoyable for me. And my ball winning midfielder is actually winning the ball back to my team and then giving it to my playmaker: doing exactly what I want him to do. And I've never seen my 'decent' full-backs being dominated by decent or even good wingers and on the other hand my wingers aren't dominating either. Crossing is far less effective which is nice and generally the defending is far ahead of this year's version even though I've conceded 4 goals from set plays in three matches but I'm sure I can fix that with tactical changes. What I like compared to 2013's version in FM 2014 is the general interface of tactics where you decide the shouts. Then again sliders are much more interesting to me than just the roles and shouts but this current tactics system with sliders also available would be brilliant... Also like the ability to start tutoring from the player's development and training screen: made it so much easier to find the right tutor for certain player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Neil Brock Posted April 22, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted April 22, 2014 Yeah, what El Payaso said in regards to why the thread is open. But do please remember if you have something you'd consider a 'Bug' to please raise it on our bugs forum here - http://community.sigames.com/forumdisplay.php/359 Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbokav1971 Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 It also tends to keep all the eegits in one place rather than each opening separate threads. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furstinn Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 My biggest issue with FM 2014 is the high proportion of goals scored, and especially conceded, from set pieces and penalties. In my first season with Rayo Vallecano I became so frustrated that I started to note down how the goals were conceded. Of 66 goals conceded, 39 came from set pieces and penalties. That's 59% compared to the 25-30% that seems to be the norm in real world football. I'm now in fourth season and I don't bother to count anymore but the proportion of goals conceded from set pieces seems to be only slight less than in the first season. This is especially evident when playing bigger clubs like Real Madrid, Bayern or Man Utd. Then you know in advance that you're probably gonna have to score two or three goals just to cancel out their set pieces goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagenham_Dave Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 My biggest issue with FM 2014 is the high proportion of goals scored, and especially conceded, from set pieces and penalties. In my first season with Rayo Vallecano I became so frustrated that I started to note down how the goals were conceded. Of 66 goals conceded, 39 came from set pieces and penalties. That's 59% compared to the 25-30% that seems to be the norm in real world football. I'm now in fourth season and I don't bother to count anymore but the proportion of goals conceded from set pieces seems to be only slight less than in the first season. This is especially evident when playing bigger clubs like Real Madrid, Bayern or Man Utd. Then you know in advance that you're probably gonna have to score two or three goals just to cancel out their set pieces goals. I take it you understand that set pieces don't just 'happen'? If you're conceding more than normal from set pieces, it may be you're giving away too many silly fouls around the penalty box, or you're conceding too many corners, or it could be your players simply struggle to defend set pieces. Might be an idea to concentrate defending set pieces for a while alongside setting up some new routines via the set piece creator. Or you could just say the game is against you. Your choice I suppose. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jere_d Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Rubbish like this needs to be sorted players not in possition when a freekick outside the box is taken... Its really silly players not even set up the wall yet Its annoying coz there is always silly goals scored against me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbokav1971 Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 jere_d have you done anything differently to get the Just Giving and Sky Sports advertising hoardings? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNT3R Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Rubbish like this needs to be sorted players not in possition when a freekick outside the box is taken...Its really silly players not even set up the wall yet Its annoying coz there is always silly goals scored against me You can always report these silly bugs in the bugs forum as that's where they belong, not here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbokav1971 Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 They are part of the general hoarding set. I have never seen either one of them. I get.... WarChild One Game One Community Games Aid www.sigames.com @FootballManager #FM14 Sega Like Football Manager. Football Manager Handheld Every so often I get a new one, but it never seems to stay long. That't why they jumped out at me. Never seen any of the above one's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbokav1971 Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 I think that there is some logic to the hoardings that are displayed but I do not know what that system is other than some obvious boards that link to the country you're managing in, when I was managing Real Betis I would have La Marca crop up as one of them. Oh I see. That's interesting. So Just Giving, the darker one, (can't see it), and Sky Sports are all because he is playing in England. That makes sense. How come I don't I get any Italian one's then? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinningForumVisitor Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Rubbish like this needs to be sorted players not in possition when a freekick outside the box is taken...Its really silly players not even set up the wall yet Twice in this video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKc40emBx74 I could go on forever Its annoying coz there is always silly goals scored against me Over a sample of any reasonable size, it is literally impossible to say this and not be wrong, unless it is down to your tactical mistakes. Given you probably haven't done anything wrong in your defensive free kick set up, you are wrong that its always against you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jere_d Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Twice in this video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKc40emBx74 I could go on forever Over a sample of any reasonable size, it is literally impossible to say this and not be wrong, unless it is down to your tactical mistakes. Given you probably haven't done anything wrong in your defensive free kick set up, you are wrong that its always against you. There is a big difference in a free kick without the whistle and taking a freekick before the team is organised If you watch all of them you see the team get the chance to organise the wall and mark up My example show all my players bar 1 fussing about the wall whilst there are several unmarked players Hunt3r I assumed as this freekick before opposition are in possition happens so often that it was a feature of the game and not a bug. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinningForumVisitor Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 There is a big difference in a free kick without the whistle and taking a freekick before the team is organised Just because I didn't find a specific example in a 5 second search, you are being ridiculously delusional if you believe defending teams are always ready when the whistle actually does blow. It still could be a bug right enough, but your idea that it happens a lot is in my opinion wrong, and your idea that bad luck only happens against you is objectively wrong. EDIT - if it is a bug, then a the proper thing to do would be report it in a proper manner and offer to upload a file to help with it, not throw a little hissy fit calling it rubbish, given that it is not uncommon in real life. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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