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The 2012-2013 Manchester United Thread: Thank you, Sir Alex


ddidiodion

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Giggs should not be in the starting 11 again and Kagawa needs to earn his place. Looking half decent when we raise our game against a tiring Spurs does not hide a useless 1st half effort.

Anderson and Cleverley need to be played more often till their performances say otherwise.

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Sad to see a Giggs that is quite possibly past it though. Such a legend. But these days I make a silent sigh when I see him. Can still do stuff on the offensive, but does F all going back so is a liability overall. Hurts to say that but is probably true by now.

Really disappointing. Other results went against us too. That Chelsea team looks so bloody good now.

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Thought Rooney did pretty well actually. Tough to shine when you have a guy or two up your ass all the time. He very nearly scored on the end with that nice shimmy and shot as well. Blew it over, but did well to get that space and chance.

Really bad weekend so think I'll drown my sorrows in Mr Beer :(

(and have an even worse day tomorrow ofc)

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Nani was brilliant today yet one off target shot and people explode with rage. I wouldn't mind but the broad are haying for a shot and when someone finally has a pop there's people shouting 'sell him!' :D

every minute thing he does wrong he gets lambasted for. some of the people around me really clueless when it comes to supporting a player.

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I was referring to the crowd at the game.

Nani was basically the bright point of the first half and then started tearing it up in the second half. Idiots behind me calling for Valencia all game. Then the couple of stray passes and an off target shot means he's an abortion and should be sold. He's our best winger by some distance but he's going to end up leaving because the crowd are against him now despite him doing nothing wrong.

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Only goal you could level any blame at Lindegaard would be Bale's and that was placed well. Come off it.

Not just about the goals though, is it? De Gea's distribution ***** all over Anders', that's hugely important imo. Can guarantee he wouldn't have overhit that last ball of the game. Not that it would have made a blind bit of difference in all likelyhood.

Still should be playing BSD in every game with a few exceptions for Anders

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I was referring to the crowd at the game.

Nani was basically the bright point of the first half and then started tearing it up in the second half. Idiots behind me calling for Valencia all game. Then the couple of stray passes and an off target shot means he's an abortion and should be sold. He's our best winger by some distance but he's going to end up leaving because the crowd are against him now despite him doing nothing wrong.

Would agree with this whole heartedly. Alot of the fans around me today aswell were a joke.

On another note, first half all in all was an utter shambles. If we'd have got anything from that game it wouldn't hav been deserved. Spurs attacked well and were stoic in defence. And as much as we all love him, there is time and a place for Giggs, and today really wasn't it.

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So who wins the ball for Kagawa and Cleverley to go dancing about? Who protects our back line against the pace of Bale, Lennon, Walker, Sandro, Vertonghen & Dembele.

We start with Carrick, Scholes, Cleverley as a central 3 with Rooney & Nani wide left and right and RVP up top. When Scholes starts to tire we bring on the legs of Ando and then Welbeck for Rooney/RVP if we need a goal.

Again, Cleverley does more than his fair share of ball winning. Starting with Scholes and Carrick in a midfield 3 will inevitably lead to the Carrick/Scholes halfway house merry-go-round that does nobody any favours. Carrick - Cleverley is the answer.

We cant complain about penalties, we have had enough "gifts" from the refs from the last 2 seasons to last us 5 years.

Nah, we've been under the cosh for a few years now; 08-09 was when it started getting really bad iirc. Two separate independent studies had us on 95 points going into the final day last season based on games adjusted for 'refereeing errors'.

Like I say, he's covering Giggs' defensive duties. It's too much to expect him to do that and be the closest player to RVP.

Ahh, the old Rooney dilemma. Not seen anything of the match today but if we were expecting Kagawa to do Rooney's 'play up front until Giggs wants to wander into the middle, then you'll have to do his running for him' then there's no hope really.

What are you on about Coldberg? Who wants him sold? :D

Iceman ;)

I was referring to the crowd at the game.

Nani was basically the bright point of the first half and then started tearing it up in the second half. Idiots behind me calling for Valencia all game. Then the couple of stray passes and an off target shot means he's an abortion and should be sold. He's our best winger by some distance but he's going to end up leaving because the crowd are against him now despite him doing nothing wrong.

Tbf, if he has tonked Davide without justification (and bloody hell you'd have to have something serious to go up against Nani) then he should be off. Not seen anything reported beyond the Mail (and the Metro, who have the same publisher) mind.

As I say, not seen anything from today; writing was on the wall with that line-up though. Only ever an either/or for Giggs and Scholes in the starting 11. Even if Fergie thinks he needs Scholes today, we need to be having a proper look at Cleverley and/or Anderson alongside Carrick for tomorrow, with Scholes as the insurance policy if we need it later on. Sounded like Giggs needs to be made aware of how long he has left on his contract.

That said, was pretty nailed on we'd lose today after winning at Anfield!

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If he'd punched Petrucci he wouldn't have been playing today, I think we can safely put that rumour to bed.

This. If he'd punched Petrucci he'd probably never be seen anywhere near OT again. Unless there's a ridiculously good reason :p now let's see if Petrucci is involved in the next u21 game and then start speculating again :D

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He wasn't solely to blame, Carrick and Rio didn't exactly cover themselves in glory. Not blaming Nani at all is even more ridiculous.

The post I'm guessing you are referring to was much more a little dig at the discussion about the tracking back of our wingers, something he completely failed to do with the first goal

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Nani was one of the few players who actually did cause a bother. He was totally right taking the shot late on as well. Okay, so it flew over again, but he was right to give it a shot at that distance.

Very disappointing to lose, mind, we need to start playing matches in the first half. If we keep putting off playing until the 2nd half, we're not going to win any titles.

(I'm drunk beyond measure right now, but this weekend has been crap and a half)

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I think some fans on here just like the ones at the ground have picked Nani as a scapegoat. I bet if HE was the one that dragged a shot (when through on goal & on his favourite foot) wide, it would be the only thing being discussed here.

Evra & Giggs were having a "who can make the most mistakes" competition. I actually don't blame Rio for the Bale goal but he was at fault alongside Carrick for goal 1 & let Defoe wriggle away in the build up to goal 3.

Carrick has been covered already while Scholes did his best in the circumstances. Kagawa was wearing a cloaking device all game and bar the goal (scoring did not save Nani from criticism) and some decent passes when Spurs retreated into their shell he was terrible.

RVP was ineffective and missed a golden chance at 3-2 while Rooney looked good for about 10 mins and then reverted to type. Rafael & Evans were solid if not spectacular while DIG needs to stop taking kicking lessons from PIGs trainer.

When playing a strong team we should be going DeGea, Rafa, Rio, Evans, Evra, Carrick, Cleverley and Anderson (Scholes might come in for any of the 3 depending on form, opponent & pitch size) with Rooney wide left, Nani wide right and RVP up top.

Kagawa can come off the bench to pick holes in a tiring back line when we ramp up the pressure. While we can use Giggs for the final 10 mins in those pesky games away from home (against lower sides) with the match in the balance and we need a calm but wily head to make a chance.

Once everyone is fit, we need to go back to our 4-4-2 type formation even if it means Kagawa gets left out.

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Yeah, would be game for a side like that. Maybe Welbeck in for one of Cleverley or Anderson for some matches and move Rooney inside. Or Cleverley wide left and Rooney off RvP. Maybe explore the narrow, wingback focused tactics used against Newcastle a bit too.

Kagawa obviously oozes quality but it seems as though games can pass him by too easily. Which is fine - it's easy to forget he's only 23 and was rather cheap by contemporary standards, so to be a player who's only effective against 70% of the league is completely acceptable.

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I don't like Lindegaard playing. I don't know what it is but there's just something about him which doesn't instil any confidence in me. DdG has his flaws but the only way they are going to get ironed out is if he plays & learns from his mistakes. Lindegaard has done nothing since joining the club to make me think he's anything other than average back up material. People will point to his run of clean sheets in his first run in the side but at the time I pointed out it was against weak teams who had very few shots & he had very little to do in those games. Last season we struggled early on when Ferguson rotated the GK position & look what's happening again this season. Rotating the goalie & we're shipping goals. The third goal yesterday was mainly Ferdinands fault for letting Defoe turn back inside but the parry from the Bale shot should've gone anywhere but straight out to the edge of the area.

It's not simply a case of keeper rotation though. Obviously the back four isn't settled & hasn't been for a while now. This makes us more shaky than normal which is why the keeper needs to stay the same to give at least some semblance of stability. The defence is just as big an issue as midfield in my eyes. We've got Evra/Rio who are past their peaks. Vidic is an unknown now with his 8 month injury followed by this two months out after another operation. He's at an age where he's going to start declining soon too. Then you've got Evans who is basically the most reliable CB we have at the moment yet is still quite young & relatively inexperienced. Then there's obviously Smalling/Jones/Rafael who are all young & learning. We don't have a defender who can be relied on twice a week who is nearing or at the peak of their game. Evans did well enough last season but it was a sink or swim experience for him & luckily bar the odd game he didn't let himself down.

Doesn't help that the main screen for our defence has been out for 10 months with illness & also cannot be relied on to stay fit/healthy. Fletcher gives cover & we've been missing it which also leads to leaking goals.

So it's a combination of reasons more than it being a simple 'player x/y/z' isn't good enough. But Ferguson isn't helping matters by constantly messing about with the team.

Oh yeah, Giggs shouldn't be starting any game where the result matters anymore. He doesn't have the strength or legs to justify his inclusion.

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