Quickfire Questions and Answers Thread (Tactic and Training Questions Only)

[LeedsUnitedForLife]

cause i want to know how they play

[vasilli07]

So you expect people to spoonfeed you again? If you really want to know how they play, go watch a few of their games. Set the roles and TIs and test it YOURSELF. If it's not working, then post for help again.

[RTHerringbone]

cause i want to know how they play

Why? I've seen you say you're going to use someone's 4-4-2 with Leyton Orient either today or yesterday?

You've posted in the Southampton Good Player and Team section asking how they play? Do you want to be Saints, do you want to play in the Southampton style as Leyton Orient? Do you want to play 4-4-2? There's simply no consistency to your thought processes. You need to stop flitting from one idea to another and actually stick you your guns because at the moment, you're not helping yourself.

[LeedsUnitedForLife]

no i want to start a save with southampton.

[Jambo98]

Then start it. Youve been warned a hundred times and given 100 bits of advice, but your persist with single line questions which are not relevant to this forum. Try posting more than 20 words in a single post and you might get better responses, and try keeping to the point of the thread that you post in - "anyone got a tactic for southampton" is not a "stupid questions (tactics and training only)" is it. Same with your 3 posts in a row in the 442 thread.

Its irritating for other posters. It probably cant make life easy for the hard working mods either. I will start using "report post" if you keep posting irrelevant nonsense, which just causes even more pain for the mods.

[RTHerringbone]

no i want to start a save with southampton.

OK. Well they have a good and versatile squad, and can play in any number of ways. If you want help, then you really need to start a new thread detailing the style of play you want to create and the steps you have taken to create that style (explicitly detail all Roles, Duties, TIs, PIs etc.). You don't need to know how Southampton play in real life to get them playing well in Football Manager.

At the moment, you are taking a scattergun approach to spamming the forums and there's no commitment to actually getting started and finding your feet with a save. Until you do that, there's not much anyone can do to help.

[LeedsUnitedForLife]

but i want to play with them like they do in real life u know how people recreate a style i like the way southampton are i dont want to invent

[RTHerringbone]

but i want to play with them like they do in real life u know how people recreate a style i like the way southampton are i dont want to invent

You don't though! You don't even know how they play so how on earth can you recreate their style?

[LeedsUnitedForLife]

thats what im asking how do they play. i know its possession but is there pressing or. thats why im asking in the stupid thread cause i am lol

[RTHerringbone]

thats what im asking how do they play. i know its possession but is there pressing or. thats why im asking in the stupid thread cause i am lol

The point is - how do you know you want to play as Saints and in their style, if you don't even know what it is?! It's like saying you want to be able to play tennis like Nadal, but don't know if he's a serve and volley player or more of a baseline guy.

[wkdsoul]

thats what im asking how do they play. i know its possession but is there pressing or. thats why im asking in the stupid thread cause i am lol

Here - > http://www.fm-base.co.uk/forum/share-download-fm-15-tactics/268889-pochettinos-4-2-3-1-press-ball-retention.html

[LeedsUnitedForLife]

The point is - how do you know you want to play as Saints and in their style, if you don't even know what it is?! It's like saying you want to be able to play tennis like Nadal, but don't know if he's a serve and volley player or more of a baseline guy.

but i know they play nice passing flowing football just dont know the exact TI to uses etc. dont know why thats so hard tog et lol

[HUNT3R]

thats what im asking how do they play. i know its possession but is there pressing or. thats why im asking in the stupid thread cause i am lol

My advice would be to not worry about how they play IRL. Just play the game. The way I see it, you have 2 options:

- Pick Southampton and pick any strategy you want to on your own.

- Watch YouTube clips, full matches and the Southampton team thread for clues and do it yourself. I can't imagine anyone sitting down and detailing exactly which players, roles, duties, TIs, PIs and Mentality you should use.

[RTHerringbone]

Here - > http://www.fm-base.co.uk/forum/share-download-fm-15-tactics/268889-pochettinos-4-2-3-1-press-ball-retention.html

Koeman plays in a different way though

[herne79]

Stop feeding the troll guys.

In the last few days he's gone from wanting: a physical, hard working, direct style; a passing possession tactic with Brisbane Roar; a pressing possession style; a 4-4-2 with Leyton Orient; and now something with Southampton.

To quote Cleon in one of Jambo's threads:

"I've told him over the same thing. If it happens again lads, ignore him and either hit the report function or send me a PM and I'll delete his posts so it doesn't ruin the discussion or clog up the thread."

[wkdsoul]

Koeman plays in a different way though

Like this guy would notice

It'll give him a base to build from, the style isnt that wholy different.

[Pav_Makarov]

I've been trying to play 4-2-3-1 with a pair of BBM and BWM in the CM strata, recently, but I came across the advice NOT to rely on BWM as on the last line of defence among your midfielders, as BWM does not hold position and that will create tons of pressure on your defenders. Can you clarify, how valid this advice is and what role should I assign to my CM, that i want on the defending duty?

(DLP is not an option)

[HUNT3R]

The advice is very valid and you'll easily see this (him leaving position to close down... everything) in a match. Any other Defend duty role would work. Your other options are only DLP/D and CM/D in the M strata.

[Chelski Shogun]

I've just started up a new save with Châteauroux in Ligue 2 and I noticed that their pitch surface is synthetic, so I was wondering if different surface types actually affect your tactics/ how the players play etc?

[RTHerringbone]

I've just started up a new save with Châteauroux in Ligue 2 and I noticed that their pitch surface is synthetic, so I was wondering if different surface types actually affect your tactics/ how the players play etc?

Theoretically it does, albeit more so in terms of how weather affects the pitch, rather than the type of pitch itself. A water logged pitch should be harder to play a short passing game on. I'm not sure how FM replicates heavy rain on a synthetic pitch, so you probably need to look at the conditions in particularly crap weather.

Having said that, I've never honestly changed my approach, regardless of the conditions.

[Jambo98]

I've been trying to play 4-2-3-1 with a pair of BBM and BWM in the CM strata, recently, but I came across the advice NOT to rely on BWM as on the last line of defence among your midfielders, as BWM does not hold position and that will create tons of pressure on your defenders. Can you clarify, how valid this advice is and what role should I assign to my CM, that i want on the defending duty?

(DLP is not an option)

Why is DLP not an option? Its amongst the best and most essential roles for that type of system i would say?

[Chelski Shogun]

Theoretically it does, albeit more so in terms of how weather affects the pitch, rather than the type of pitch itself. A water logged pitch should be harder to play a short passing game on. I'm not sure how FM replicates heavy rain on a synthetic pitch, so you probably need to look at the conditions in particularly crap weather.

Having said that, I've never honestly changed my approach, regardless of the conditions.

Thanks for clearing that up for me RTHerringbone.

[Pav_Makarov]

Why is DLP not an option? Its amongst the best and most essential roles for that type of system i would say?

I just don't have a player, capable of defending and leading the game, my best playmaker has 10 in tackling and will simply fail, defending. So I guess, I'll have to stick to CM (d) with an instruction to close down less.

Thanks!

[vcpinheiro14]

I'm confused about physical training and the intensity aspect of training, does it mean more time in the training field or more effort?

Does the game differ the categories of training regarding chances of injury?

Does the game differ the intensities of training regarding chances of injury?

Does the physical training category have a direct bearing on condition? Or it is only indirect (raising player's physical related attributes)

Does intensity on any area has a direct bearing on condition?

I'm planning my pre-season training and the official hints and tips informs:

Intense physical training is best carried out in pre-season, before the domestic season is under way.

Too much intense physical training during the season is likely to tire your players out faster and increase the risk of injuries. (what does the game means with "tire faster"?)

[all4everdragon]

Any comments on posts 6252 and 6254 ? Thanks

[JockoStrap]

I have a dumb question about training.

Re youth (under18) i have read that you can spend a few years training just one physical attribute from age 16, say i wanted to increase strength. Should i train that on heavy? i have read that this is the way to do it. However the player is constantly complaining about high team training workload, advice from coaches is to reduce the individual load.

So two questions, why does the game say TEAM training for the complaint, but INDIVIDUAL for the advice? Also if i just left it, would the players unhappiness harm his progress?

thanks in advance

JoS

[THOG]

Any comments on posts 6252 and 6254 ? Thanks

This isn't really the place for a discussion about AI managers' hidden attributes.

In any case, the AI is adaptive and uses different approaches for different situations, so if you want to know how the AI is playing at any given time, you have to keep an eye on what's going on in the ME.

[all4everdragon]

This isn't really the place for a discussion about AI managers' hidden attributes.

In any case, the AI is adaptive and uses different approaches for different situations, so if you want to know how the AI is playing at any given time, you have to keep an eye on what's going on in the ME.

Oh it wasn't really about how the AI is playing, nothing like that. Only if the assessment made in both posts were accurate when translated to tactics.

[ddrrbb]

I can't find which thread I read it in, but how does the number of attack duty players relate to mentality for the AI? I am playing a team that changes its duties and roles several times per game but seems to keep 2 or 3 attack duties. Does that mean they are playing counter or standard? They are extremely aggressive, so I think they are using an attacking mentality, but I thought I read that the AI uses more attack duties the higher the mentality and less on the lower mentalities.

[Jambo98]

I just don't have a player, capable of defending and leading the game, my best playmaker has 10 in tackling and will simply fail, defending. So I guess, I'll have to stick to CM (d) with an instruction to close down less.

Thanks!

Why would the same player succeed as a CM(d) but not as a DLP?? :confused:

That makes no sense. If his tackling is his weak point, then firstly why is he your chose player in that position? Secondly, if he has poor tackling, i assume he might have other strengths. So if those are things like passing and first touch, why not play to his strengths rather than worrying about his weakness. There is no reason that a player with 10 Tackling could not be a good DLP(d) in various systems.

[Cleon]

I can't find which thread I read it in, but how does the number of attack duty players relate to mentality for the AI? I am playing a team that changes its duties and roles several times per game but seems to keep 2 or 3 attack duties. Does that mean they are playing counter or standard? They are extremely aggressive, so I think they are using an attacking mentality, but I thought I read that the AI uses more attack duties the higher the mentality and less on the lower mentalities.

1 attack duty = contain/defensive/counter

2 attack duties = standard

3 attack duties = control

4 attack duties = attack

5 attack duties = overload

The AI doesn't tend to change roles during a game that frequent either, unless its a totally different shape. They tend to use shouts/mentality changes or formation changes rather than actual roles.

[Tom14]

How do you find out the number of attack duties being used?

[Cleon]

How do you find out the number of attack duties being used?

Some skins show them on the tactic overview.

[LeedsUnitedForLife]

ok i will try my own verson of rthe saints

[Pav_Makarov]

Why would the same player succeed as a CM(d) but not as a DLP??

At the moment I have CM who is extremely good at tackling, marking and he is quite aggressive, but his vision and decisions let him down at combination game and CM who, on the contrary, passes well, shoots well, sees the pitch, but fails defensively. I used to play them in another formation, but I want to add 4-2-3-1 and try to make things right. Hopefully net transfer window will get me a suitable guy

[Pav_Makarov]

So, while we are at it, there is one more stupid question, that I have.

Are there any usefull hints on how to use Poacher, TM(A) and CF(A) in the lone striker formation without AMC? I don't really want to limit myself to DLF and F9, when playing with 4-1-2-2-1.

Thanks

[all4everdragon]

So, while we are at it, there is one more stupid question, that I have.

Are there any usefull hints on how to use Poacher, TM(A) and CF(A) in the lone striker formation without AMC? I don't really want to limit myself to DLF and F9, when playing with 4-1-2-2-1.

Thanks

Use wingers to feed a more positional striker; use IFs or RMD if the striker creates spaces... it's this easy

[Pav_Makarov]

IFs or RMD if the striker creates spaces... it's this easy

But isn't RMD a selfish finisher himself? Also from what I learned IF's even on support duty are not that playmaking players, therefore while it is simple enough to utlize wingers to create chances for TM, it is still not clear how to bring poachers into game. Shouldn't they be fed from the deep while they have the necessary speed?

[Marabak]

I've just started a game as Excelsior in the Eredivisie, and I have conceded 4 penalties in my first 4 games (two in one of those games). I know I am a poor team in a reasonable league, and my players aren't the best in the world, but I don't understand why this is happening. I have altered between three variations of a 3 defender formation, depending on the opponent, but none of the three have anything remotely like "tackle harder" or "close down more". One player has conceded two of the penalties but the other two were other players, so I don't think it is down to a particularly player's mentality, although all three players are either CD or DM. The two in one game penalties were admittedly conceded against PSV in a 4-1 loss, so you could argue that I spent more time in my own defensive half, but one of the other two came in a 6-2 win for myself, and the fourth was the decider in a pretty even 1-0 loss. The only game I haven't conceded a penalty in was a close fought 1-0 win.

What else can be influencing this? How can I try and fix this before it ruins my season and gets me relegated?

[RTHerringbone]

But isn't RMD a selfish finisher himself? Also from what I learned IF's even on support duty are not that playmaking players, therefore while it is simple enough to utlize wingers to create chances for TM, it is still not clear how to bring poachers into game. Shouldn't they be fed from the deep while they have the necessary speed?

The best thing to do is not get bogged down by everything you have read. Try for yourself and see what works. Start a save in FMC where tactic familiarity is not a factor, and just experiment with things. Once something seems to broadly behave like you want, save the tactic and pull it through to your other save.

[Sussex Hammer]

Does anyone really get anything out of a playmaker? Reason I ask is that players like Song and Poyet spray passes around quite well as an anchor man but as soon as you put them in as a DLP in the same position they do not seem to do anything of note. It is very strange watching it,

[Cleon]

Does anyone really get anything out of a playmaker? Reason I ask is that players like Song and Poyet spray passes around quite well as an anchor man but as soon as you put them in as a DLP in the same position they do not seem to do anything of note. It is very strange watching it,

All the systems I've seen you post don't really have much use for a DLP so unless the systems are set up to make use of such a role, then its understandable why they don't really flourish in the same set ups. An anchorman can spray the ball around fine but when you then change the role to a DLP, you are basically telling the team to focus play through him (this goes for all playmaking roles) as much as possible. So in the anchorman role he won't have this kind of emphasis so the players will play their normal game. But when he becomes a playmaker then the players around him will act differently and the simple things they did before might not work now as they might be looking for the playmaker more, so it detracts from their game. This can also mean they aren't making the same kind of runs as before, they aren't using the pitch and space in the same ways and so on. It's why you should fully understand what you are creating and what the roles you use actually bring to the overall picture.

[Sussex Hammer]

All the systems I've seen you post don't really have much use for a DLP so unless the systems are set up to make use of such a role, then its understandable why they don't really flourish in the same set ups. An anchorman can spray the ball around fine but when you then change the role to a DLP, you are basically telling the team to focus play through him (this goes for all playmaking roles) as much as possible. So in the anchorman role he won't have this kind of emphasis so the players will play their normal game. But when he becomes a playmaker then the players around him will act differently and the simple things they did before might not work now as they might be looking for the playmaker more, so it detracts from their game. This can also mean they aren't making the same kind of runs as before, they aren't using the pitch and space in the same ways and so on. It's why you should fully understand what you are creating and what the roles you use actually bring to the overall picture.

Great answer Cleon. Just saw Poyet in particular have a couple of games where he was outstanding at AMan passing it about and thought how great it would be for him to dictae play more but as you say changing him to a DLP seemed to change the whole picture and he just didn't have a kick. I must confess I am not really a fan of channelling a lot through one player unless he really stands out from the rest but it was interesting to see how things changed just to that one role. Could it also be that I tend to play fluid? Do more rigid philosophies bring more out of an individual role?

I am starting a new thread later on an updated 4132 (41311) and would really appreciate your input.

[Cleon]

Great answer Cleon. Just saw Poyet in particular have a couple of games where he was outstanding at AMan passing it about and thought how great it would be for him to dictae play more but as you say changing him to a DLP seemed to change the whole picture and he just didn't have a kick. I must confess I am not really a fan of channelling a lot through one player unless he really stands out from the rest but it was interesting to see how things changed just to that one role. Could it also be that I tend to play fluid? Do more rigid philosophies bring more out of an individual role?

I am starting a new thread later on an updated 4132 (41311) and would really appreciate your input.

In rigid set ups the players creative freedom is relatively low and playmaker roles come into their own more, as they are the stand out creative players really. Compared to fluid systems where everyone is that bit more creative in their role. You can over force play by using playmakers as you are playing a specific way then and telling players to use them as much as possible, so it takes away from certain types of set ups. They can also be great though. Funnily enough I am currently writing about playmakers myself but wasn't sure if to make it a FM article or keep it a real life piece.

[LeedsUnitedForLife]

can a flat 4-4-2 play possession?

[Cleon]

can a flat 4-4-2 play possession?

Everything can to some extent. But when you face formations that have advantage in the midfield with an extra man, then you can struggle with a possession orientated 442. There are better suited formations for possession.

[Sussex Hammer]

Know it's not a contract thread but since the patch feedback thread closed I am not sure where to ask this. I have just started a new game of FMC and Winston Reid's agent at the start of the game insists he is leaving upon the end of his contract. That could possibly change as the season progresses I don't know but I am concerned that it was thought that he would leave by SI and the patch came out before he did a u turn and signed his new contract IRL? It seems a bit unfair to be unable to lose a player without even being able to offer him a contract when he did actually sign IRL.

Can someone from SI clarify if this is hard coded?

[Cleon]

Wrong place, ask in General section of the forum. Tactics or training related questions only in here ?

[RTHerringbone]

Nothing will be hard coded unless it is officially agreed contractually in real life. If Reid hasn't already signed elsewhere, then he hasn't done so in FM.

[Sussex Hammer]

Wrong place, ask in General section of the forum. Tactics or training related questions only in here

As in a new thread?