Official The Netherlands Thread ; Best team never to have won the WC.

Let's discuss here about who should Bert take with him to South Africa, or who not to take. Our performances of the friendlies and the actual WC.

Enjoy..

Info - The Netherlands

Nickname(s)		Oranje
		Holland
		The Flying Dutchmen
		Clockwork Orange
		La Maquina Naranja
Association		Koninklijke Nederlandse Voetbalbond — KNVB
Confederation		UEFA (Europe)
Head coach		Bert van Marwijk
Asst coach		Philip Cocu
		Frank de Boer
		Dick Voorn
Captain			Giovanni van Bronckhorst
Most caps		Edwin van der Sar (130)
Top scorer		Patrick Kluivert (40)
Home stadium		Amsterdam Arena
		De Kuip
		Philips Stadion
FIFA code		NED
FIFA ranking		3
Highest FIFA ranking	2 (November 1993, June 2009)
Lowest FIFA ranking	25 (May 1998)

How did we get there.

2010 World Cup qualification

Team 
	Pld	W	D	L	GF	GA	GD	Pts
Netherlands	8	8	0	0	17	2	+15	24 Q
Norway		8	2	4	2	9	7	+2	10
Scotland	8	3	1	4	6	11	−5	10
Macedonia	8	2	1	5	5	11	−6	7
Iceland	8	1	2	5	7	13	−6	5

Current Squad:

The following players have been called up for the friendly match against United States on 3 March 2010.
Caps and goals as of 3 March 2010

No.	Pos.	Player				DoB (Age)			Caps	Goals	 Club
1	GK	Maarten Stekelenburg		September 22, 1982 (age 27)	25	0	 Ajax
16	GK	Sander Boschker			October 20, 1970 (age 39)	0	0	 Twente
13	GK	Piet Velthuizen			November 3, 1986 (age 23)	1	0	 Vitesse Arnhem
5	DF	Giovanni van Bronckhorst 	February 5, 1975 (age 35)	97	5	 Feyenoord
20	DF	Ron Vlaar			February 16, 1985 (age 25)	3	0	 Feyenoord
2	DF	Gregory van der Wiel		February 3, 1988 (age 22)	8	0	 Ajax
12	DF	André Ooijer			July 11, 1974 (age 35)		53	3	 PSV
15	DF	Edson Braafheid			April 8, 1983 (age 27)		6	0	 Celtic (on loan from Bayern Munich)
3	DF	John Heitinga			November 15, 1983 (age 26)	51	6	 Everton
4	DF	Joris Mathijsen			April 5, 1980 (age 30)		53	3	 Hamburg
18	MF	Orlando Engelaar		August 24, 1979 (age 30)	13	0	 PSV
17	MF	Ibrahim Afellay			April 2, 1986 (age 24)		20	0	 PSV
22	MF	Stijn Schaars			January 11, 1984 (age 26)	11	0	 AZ
14	MF	Demy de Zeeuw			May 26, 1983 (age 26)		23	0	 Ajax
6	MF	Mark van Bommel			April 22, 1977 (age 32)		54	9	 Bayern Munich
8	MF	Nigel de Jong			November 30, 1984 (age 25)	40	1	 Manchester City
23	MF	Rafael van der Vaart		February 11, 1983 (age 27)	75	15	 Real Madrid
10	MF	Wesley Sneijder			June 9, 1984 (age 25)		59	12	 Internazionale
9	FW	Dirk Kuyt			July 22, 1980 (age 29)		60	14	 Liverpool
21	FW	Ryan Babel			December 19, 1986 (age 23)	38	5	 Liverpool
7	FW	Arjen Robben			January 23, 1984 (age 26)	46	11	 Bayern Munich
11	FW	Eljero Elia			February 13, 1987 (age 23)	5	2	 Hamburg
19	FW	Klaas-Jan Huntelaar		August 12, 1983 (age 26)	30	15	 Milan

Other contenders for the squad are/can be:

[code]
No.	Pos.	Player				DoB (Age)			Caps	Goals	 Club		Last call up
FW	Ruud van Nistelrooy		1 July 1976 (age 33)		64	33	 Hamburg	vs  Russia, 21 June 2008
FW	Robin van Persie		August 6, 1983 (age 26)		41	14	 Arsenal	vs  Italy, 14 November 2009
GK	Michel Vorm			October 20, 1983 (age 26)	3	0	 Utrecht	vs  Italy, 14 November 2009
DF	Khalid Boulahrouz		December 28, 1981 (age 28)	28	0	 Stuttgart	vs  Italy, 14 November 2009
DF	Glenn Loovens			October 22, 1983 (age 26)	1	0	 Celtic		vs  Australia, 10 October 2009
DF	Dirk Marcellis			August 13, 1988 (age 21)	2	0	 PSV		vs  Norway, 10 June 2009
MF	Wout Brama			August 21, 1986 (age 23)	1	0	 Twente		vs  Paraguay, 18 November 2009
MF	Otman Bakkal			February 27, 1985 (age 25)	1	0	 PSV		vs  Paraguay, 18 November 2009
MF	David Mendes da Silva		August 4, 1982 (age 27)		7	0	 AZ		vs  Australia, 10 October 2009
MF	Clarence Seedorf		1 April 1976 (age 34)		87	11	 Milan		vs  Slovenia, 28 March 2007
DF/MF	Urby Emanuelson			16 June 1986 (age 23)		11	0	 Ajax		?

Coming games

Date		Venue					Oponent		Competition
May 26, 2010	Dreisamstadion,  Germany	 	Mexico		Friendly	
June 1, 2010	De Kuip,  Netherlands	 		Ghana		Friendly
June 5, 2010	Amsterdam Arena,  Netherlands	 	Hungary		Friendly	
June 14, 2010	Soccer City,  South Africa	 	Denmark		WCF2010	- Groupstage
June 19, 2010	Moses Mabhida Stadium,  South Africa	Japan		WCF2010	- Groupstage
June 24, 2010	Cape Town Stadium,  South Africa	Cameroon	WCF2010	- Groupstage

World Cup record

Year	Round			Position	GP	W	D	L	GS	GA
1930	Did Not Enter		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1934	Round 1			9		1	0	0	1	2	3
1938	Round 1			14		1	0	0	1	0	3
1950	Did Not Enter		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1954	Did Not Enter		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1958	Did Not Qualify		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1962	Did Not Qualify		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1966	Did Not Qualify		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1970	Did Not Qualify		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1974	Final			2		7	5	1	1	15	3
1978	Final			2		7	3	2	2	15	10
1982	Did Not Qualify		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1986	Did Not Qualify		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
1990	Round of 16		15		4	0	3	1	3	4
1994	Quarter-finals		7		5	3	0	2	8	6
1998	Fourth place		4		7	3	3*	1	13	7
2002	Did Not Qualify		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
2006	Round of 16		11		4	2	1	1	3	2
2010	Qualified		-		-	-	-	-	-	-
Total	9/19			2 Finals	36	16	10	10	59	38

Individual all-time records

[b]Most matches played[/b]							[b]Most goals scored[/b]
#	Player				Career		Matches	Goals	#	Player			Career		Goals	Matches	Average
1.	Edwin van der Sar		1995–2008	130	0	1.	Patrick Kluivert	1994–2004	40	79	0.51
2.	Frank de Boer			1990–2004	112	13	2.	Dennis Bergkamp		1990–2000	37	79	0.47
3.	Phillip Cocu			1996–2006	101	10	3.	Faas Wilkes		1946–1961	35	38	0.92
4.	Giovanni van Bronckhorst	1996–present	97	5	4.	Abe Lenstra		1940–1959	33	47	0.70
5.	Clarence Seedorf		1994–2008	87	11	4.	Johan Cruyff		1966–1977	33	48	0.69
6.	Marc Overmars			1993–2004	86	17	4.	Ruud van Nistelrooy*	1998–2008	33	64	0.51
7.	Aron Winter			1987–2000	84	6	7.	Beb Bakhuys		1928–1937	28	23	1.22
8.	Ruud Krol			1969–1983	83	4	8.	Kick Smit		1935–1946	26	29	0.90
9.	Patrick Kluivert		1994–2004	79	40	9.	Marco van Basten	1983–1992	24	58	0.41
10.	Dennis Bergkamp			1990–2000	79	37	10.	Leen Vente		1933–1940	19	21	0.90

*) Ruud van Nistelrooy retired from international football after Euro 2008, but has recently mentioned he is available for call ups again.

Surprised that Huntelaar is the current top goalscorer.

Tied with VdV.

Bert from Sesame Street is now your manager? Things have changed! Anyway I hope Sneijder has an excellent WC, that guy is so

Get VDS back please Bert.

Holland \o/

So many players in the team I adore.

/gay

I still have a thing for VdV, ****ing go and buy him Martin!

Good effort on the OP

It's nice of you to mention Clarence Seedorf, but he doesn't really stand a chance I think.

As always, our defense looks shaky. Vlaar, Ooyer, maybe Boula or Marcellis. Brrrr, really shows our weakness in that line. But an attack with Robben, van Persie, Sneijder and/or van der Vaart, with RvN and/or KJH in front of them looks absoluty deadly

Oh well. We'll win the group, the first knock-out match, maybe also the second one and then crash out against equal opposition, if the usual pattern is followed. I really hope we can do away with that tradition. It's about fupping time we got a WC title, because we really are good enough.

Get VDS back please Bert.

Nope, VdS said he will not return to Oranje

Mon Heit

Good effort on the OP

Thanks

It's nice of you to mention Clarence Seedorf, but he doesn't really stand a chance I think.

My opinion as well, but I wouldn't mind he would go instead of Van Bommel, Schaars or other midfielder besides De Jong, VdV, Sneijder

Mon Heit

Wha? Never realized you're Frysian and that your dad is such a good footballer

Great opening post!

Amazing that Kluivert is still top scorer, by the looks of things it will remain that way too but Huntelaar has quite a good record for his country!

Wha? Never realized you're Frysian and that your dad is such a good footballer

Heit is Dutch for Dad?

I have no clue what DJ means, but he does mention Frysian, which is a dialect in the north of Holland (which not many people outside Friesland can understand),

I have no clue what DJ means, but he does mention Frysian, which is a dialect in the north of Holland (which not many people outside Friesland can understand),

Shush, Frysian is an officially EU-recognized language, not a dialect. Hope there's no Frysians around here, otherwise there's gonna be a riot in this thread.

Btw, I do think van Bommel needs to go, to compensate for all the lightweight nancy boys we have.

It is a language (not dialect!) spoken in Frysia and yes, heit means dad in Frysian.

Sorry :o .

Mon Holland. Loved the football played in the EURO's and I was instantly converted into a fan

I will be supporting the Dutch, I like a lot of their players, VdV, Sneijder, Huntelaar, Van Bronckhorst etc shame they knocked out Scotland though, but we were crap

I <3 Holland.

Always want them or Argentina to win if Italy go out.

I'm hoping Bruma and PvA get selected for pre-tournament camp like rumours suggested, even if they don't go to RSA the experience will be great.

Haven't heard/read those rumors. But would be a good thing for them both. Taking them (or only one) to the WC would be way to early (although, as DJ posted, we aren't very good in defense).

I honestly think this could be Holland's year.

I think this WC will be very open.

Here's hoping RvP gets a few good performances in before the season ends, Robben is looking amazing at the moment, will be a key player.

Bruma could well be in with a shout, even though van Marwijk isn't one for 'maverick choices' like van Basten was (calling up Maduro before he'd even made his debut for Ajax). Van Aanholt I definitely don't see happening though.

I honestly think this could be Holland's year.

I think this WC will be very open.

Like other years, their defence will let them down. Until they produce a back line capable of doing the job properly, they'll miss out on major tournaments.

For me, this is one of the better defences they have had in recent years. It's just missing a genuine, top-class centre-back to pull it together. If they had that person, I'd agree with you. As it is, I don't think they can win.

Great opening post!

Amazing that Kluivert is still top scorer, by the looks of things it will remain that way too but Huntelaar has quite a good record for his country!

Ruud's well within range

I fear you're right, Astafjevs.

Remember that Boulahrouz did surprisingly well in 2008 despite whole-year chants from DJ that Boulahrouz only kicked legs?

I'll say bring him to South Africa.

I'm an unapologetic Boularouz fan, myself. He definitely should come.

Heheh, I'm not so big a fan of Boula, even if I disregard the kick leg aspect. He's not anywhere near as good as he was when playing for HSV.

Didn't realise van Bronckhorst has so many caps. Fair play to him. Top pro.

When did Barcelona win the World Cup?

How's Orlando Engelaar been doing since the EURO's? I thought he looked a really good player then, but I can't say I've heard anything about him since

Didn't do well at Schalke 04, and when Rutten (his coach at Twente how brought him to S04) singed for PSV it was a matter of time before he also moved to Eindhoven. He is doing well, but not as good as in the 07/08 season.

Select van Nistelrooy please.

Have a soft spot for Netherlands, hope Van Persie does well

Being an Oranje fan for the longest time and they are the team I always support in World Cups or European Championships.

But despite a whirlwind style qualification, I have strong doubt whether this squad can outdo the top four finish by Bergkamp and co. back in 1998.

They truly captured everyone's imagination 2 years ago when they so effortlessly beat the likes of Italy and France in the Euro, so everyone should discount Netherlands at their own risk.

Robben and Sneijder are doing well of late, assisting their clubs to make it into the semis of the Champions League and will definitely wanna see them step in the world stage.

But the attack line up of Kuyt, Babel, an off form Huntelaar and a well cronked up van Persie might not spell much confidence, perhaps van Nistelrooy can do a swansong, signing off in style.

Will be eagerly anticipating van Marwijk's selection of 23 when time arises

Would like the Netherlands to do well but without VDS, I don't see them going far especially with a not-so-good defense. Of course, you could concede 4 every game but knock 6 in in reply with the attack you have. Hoping you line up like this (attack only):

van der Vaart - van Bommel - Sneijder

Robben - van Persie

van Nistelrooy/Huntelaar

so a 4-3-3 with van Nistelrooy at the head of the attack. Didn't you play something like this at the Euros?

Edit: Oh and I love Heitinga.

No, the team in the Euros was something like 4-2-3-1. The idea is to switch from defense to attack with lightning speed, which worked great against Italy and France.

As the game against the Russians showed, if the opponent manage to put us under pressure and make us struggle for possession, isolating the attackers, we're vulnarable because the defense can't get rid of the ball. I personally would like to see us try and dominate the midfield a bit more (4-1-4-1 or, why not, 4-4-2), but that would mainly make the likes of van Bommel redundant, which paps-in-law Bert won't allow :-/

I think it would make vd Vaart redundant, rather than Van Bommel.

vdV will be a sub anyway. He's got Sneijder in front of him. If we play with 4 midfielders we'll have two out of Robben/Elija/van Persie on the wings, Sneijder and van Bommel (should be de Zeeuw obviously but yeah...) in the middle.

If we play with three midfielders (and two def mids), van Bommel goes back a bit and gets de Zeeuw next to him. Still no room for vdV.

Of course we could try Elija-Sneijder-vdV-Robben with KJH and van Persie in front of them, but then we'll really have to score 5 per match because we'll concede loads.

Agree with robbert here, would cost VdV his spot.

Would like to see:

Steek

Wiel-Heit-Mathijsen-Bronckorst

De Zeeuw-De Jong

Robben-Sneijder-Eila/RvP

RvP/Huntelaar

AS for midfield maybe Engelaar instead of De Zeeuw, but probably it will be Van Bommel

I really don't get all the van Bommel hate. Yes, he's an annoying character, but as long as he's playing on our side, that's only a good thing.

We need a dirty bastard bossing midfield, and for all his attempts to turn into one, Nigel isn't there yet. Much too rash. And as much as I love him, I really don't think De Zeeuw is anywhere near van Bommel's level at the moment either.

Well, I think De Jong can be just of a similar player to Van Bommel (dirty, being a motor on the midfield etc) and De Zeeuw is a much better passer then Van Bommel and De Jong, while he doesn't mind if he has to defend as well and has to clean up dirty jobs.

I don't mind a hard player. I do mind a dirty player. van Bommel was always on the edge, but ever since he started the kick-o-rama against Portugal I am disgusted by him. And he's getting worse as the years go by. Tackles late, elbows flailing, bah!

Ruud should go.

So, no Ooijer, Engelaar, Schaars, De Zeeuw, Babel.

Can live with most of those, but I would only take Klaas or Ruud and instead of one of them I would take Demy De Zeeuw.

As backup GK, find Tim Krul to early, maybe Vermeer or Verldhuizen (agreed he is in bad form). Vermeer already experienced "big" tournaments (OS08, EC06/07 iirc).

Forgot about Lens, but think he should get a chance.

So this would be mine:

GOAL:

1. Maarten Stekelenburg

13. Michel Vorm

23. Kenneth Vermeer

DEFENSE;

2. Gregory van de Wiel

3. John Heitinga

4. Joris Mathijsen

5. Giovanni van Bronkhorst

12. Ron Vlaar

18. Khalid Boulahrouz

22. Edson Braafheid

MIDFIELD:

6. Nigel de Jong

8. Mark van Bommel

10. Wesley Sneijder

14. Rafael van der Vaart

15. Urby Emanuelson

16. Demy De Zeeuw

18. Clarence Seedorf

21. Ibrahim Afellay

ATTACK:

7. Robin van Persie

9. Klaas-Jan Huntelaar

11. Arjen Robben

17. Dirk Kuijt

19. Eljero Elia

20. Jeremain Lens

No Engelaar, but Seedorf instead.

On your 4-2-3-1 could you not have vdV on the left instead of Elia or whoever?

Or Kuijt - Sneijder - Robben?