Heart felt plea to SI regarding the FM15 editor

The editor is an integral part of the whole game ethos for many of us, and I for one spent more hours on the editor in FM14 than actual playing time.

I think SI need to invest more money/staff towards the editor or drop it totally.

I appreciate that it is very frustrating for the Mods here too, due to negative threads etc but things have to change on the part of SI or they are going to lose long standing loyal customers,who purchase the product year in and year out.

I for one would have no problem having to purchase the editor as a stand alone product ala the in game editor as long as it was working as it should be, and have the relevant features required.

The sad thing is it is not far from being a great product:thup:, but it seems to be getting more buggy with each new version.

An example is several of us long standing members here reported a few bugs in the FM14 editor, one in particular was regarding a bug with continental squad rules.it was reported over a year ago, and still hasn't been resolved:(

so the common sense conclusion to be made is it either it has been ignored or the team are struggling to resolve it and therefore with the time scale involved so far the issue is unlikely to be resolved, which is a game breaker for many of us, and would have stopped a few users from purchasing the new version on its release.

I hope we get news soon,and positive action on this and the other bugs, as some including edited data going missing etc are making it pointless to use the editor in its current condition as we are finding you can spend time on a project only to find there are issues with the saved file when you access it at a later date, so it doesn't instill any confidence.

If other members are of the same opinion add your comments/feelings here and hopefully we can get some response from SI.

This is not a rant it is nor is the thread offensive etc

Hopefully this will be treated in a constructive way, and we get a response from SI:D

This is also a chance for users to get together to get some action on the editor there is no point in moaning and whinging this is a chance to for us to show we are unhappy the way things are being dealt with and for SI to treat us with some respect. Reporting bugs is all well and good but if the DEV team is under staffed etc then it is pointless.

Some of the issues this year is raising the question how thoroughly is the editor tested before release, as it beggars belief how some of these problems have gone unnoticed

many thanks

Kingrobbo

Good post, although I have removed the little snipe at the mods. Won't help your cause if that stays in there. For people posting- let's keep it constructive. You don't get anywhere by throwing your toys out of the pram. Keep raising issues you find in the bugs forum, they do get looked at and come the next round of patching hopefully some of these issues will have been fixed

cheers mate obviously you are aware we are reporting bugs and some are going back over a year so there must be concerns they cant/wont be dealt with

SI need to bite the bullet and throw some resources at it, no idea how many work on the editor, but they are getting flooded with so many issues now its frustrating for all concerned

I agree with most of what was said - although I haven't used the editor as much as some, it really is a fantastic tool for getting more out of the game. However, I take issue with the below...

I think SI need to invest more money/staff towards the editor or drop it totally.

Why is this always the argument with features? Just seems a bit "toys-out-the-pram" to me. There are bugs in the editor, of course there are, but why on Earth would they just remove it? It's mostly functional, and you can still do a lot of things with it.

I used to pre-order the game for release day, take a week off work and spend literally hundreds of hours on the editor before even playing the game. I created some World Leagues on FM10 and FM12 which were downloaded by thousands of FMers.

But due to the lack of development on the editor last year I didn't buy FM14 until March (when it was cheap) and don't think I'll even bother with FM15 since it sounds like the editor has actually taken a backwards step.

If SI can fix these bugs and allow me to create the files that were possible in recent versions, then I will be back and starting a new project, something which I'm sure will actually bring in more customers to the game (and that's not just me bragging, numerous people commented that they only bought the game for my World League).

In conclusion, I am fully behind this plea.

I bet it'd help if the editor had a beta release as the main games does when pre-ordered, that or early access to the editor and the ability to use files in the beta version of the game. (Ok, mainly I'm saying this because I want the editor to come out before the game and give me time to work on stuff pre-launch but it also couldn't hurt to open up the editor to more testing at an early stage, could it?)

I, of course, agree with most of what is said in this thread. Who wouldn't agree? I think most editor users would be willing to pay a couple of quid for the editor too (especially if we knew it was being reinvested in more and better people on the editor dev team) as it's actually more fun for some of us than the main game, tbh. :o

as it's actually more fun for some of us than the main game, tbh. :o

thats me.

just to be clear- i dont think they dont make good job here. as forameuss said in earlier posts-most of functions are ok and thats good. bad thing is that we have some 3-year old bugs year by year. worst thing is we dont have any news about that bugs(only "reviewed" word ).

simple news would be nice:

1. we cant fix it now

2. we are working on it

3. we will do it for next fm

4. anything... just we can know that our bugs repporting isnt for nothing. we try to help to ourselves and to you so you guys should respect this.

Conclusion: customer support about editor should be little better. this will be good for both sides.

Best regards,

Krlenjushka

I think it would be a masive help if we get a feedback thread that lists all the bugs currently being looked at and a report on what is happening with it. I know the threads in the bug section get a 'under review' tag but there isn't any feedback on what's happening with it at a later point in time. This might be a lot of work but it would clean up the forum massively, imo. Any thread rasing the same issue listed there again could be closed instantly. The not knowing is a greater irritation of mine than the fact bugs exist. If they exist and won't get fixed, we can look for ways around them. If bugs exists and are being fixed, we can all chant and be happy about SI again.

Anyways, this is my opinion and absolutely no negativism. As negativism tends to destroy my enjoyment of FM more than the actual bugs in the editor and the main game itself.

yeah, bugs list is great idea. that way anyone can know what bugs are repported and no need to open new thread with same issues

I like the idea of a known issues list. Can have a sticky in this forum with the issue and known workaround in (if one exists). There would also need to be a link to a thread in the bug forum, we don't want problems being posted in one place and not in the other, it's more work for the SI guys. You'd need to post in the bugs forum before you can let me know to add it to the known issues thread. If a bug is resolved then let me know and I'll remove it from the list.

I would voluntarily present myself as a tester if needed. My resume includes 10 years of testing experience. No charge, just for the good of the tool.

An excellent post, and an excellent thread. One of the truly sad things over the past few years with FM is watching both the editor and the community seemingly die a slow and painful death.

I will start with the positives. Full credit to SI for allowing proper access to the advanced rules, which allows many of the edits we have made possible. It is not well documented, but it is possible to work out how to do most things either through trial and error, or by looking at the rules of similar competitions. The introduction of more robust methods for testing an edit before using it in game (and seeing it crash and not knowing why) is also a good, meaningful addition. The 'Test Competitions' in particular can be extremely useful for checking competitions you have created without needing to run a file on FM proper.

As has been pointed out above, one of the real gripes we all have is there is just zero feedback on the bugs we report. I have reported two in this current edition; one a problem with adding teams to competition when that team is based in a different continent, and one with the columns in the teams tab of a competition. The former has been acknowledged, and latter not yet. But there is genuinely no additional feedback on the progress of fixing these bugs. I think the majority of us here are very understanding of how difficult it can be to give a deadline for fixing bugs in code as complicated as this. However, telling us something along the lines of 'This bug has been isolated, but it is not straightforward to fix' or 'This bug has been isolated but is not a priority' or 'This is fixed and will be patched in the forthcoming release' would placate many users. The frustration that leads to threads like this is that we feel like we are forgotten.

I think it could even be a good idea for SI to put together a team of beta testers from users who have a track record of using the editor and producing quality files, with the express intend of checking for such bugs so they can be properly and efficiently logged. I am not an expert in the world of game design, so someone else can probably tell me how feasible or otherwise this idea is. I, for one, would gladly volunteer my time to do this, if it would lead to a more stable and better performing editor.

Whatever happens, the one thing that we need to have is better dialogue with SI.

I am so glad many are seeing It for what It Is an attempt at dialogue with SI to work with us to get the product working the way It should be, and taking on board the requests of the users.

There are some great ideas coming out of you guys already just hope SI acknowledge this and get on board

just to clarify I think the editor is a fantastic product, but there are issues, some long standing that surely can be addressed with the right amount of resources lets hope this gets noticed

cheers guys

I like the idea of a known issues list. Can have a sticky in this forum with the issue and known workaround in (if one exists). There would also need to be a link to a thread in the bug forum, we don't want problems being posted in one place and not in the other, it's more work for the SI guys. You'd need to post in the bugs forum before you can let me know to add it to the known issues thread. If a bug is resolved then let me know and I'll remove it from the list.

Sounds fair to me. But how would you see this work out? We spot things and pm you,?

I know there's a lot of stress on the editor team, so if the community can step in, we'll do that. After all, it would benefit us.

Sounds fair to me. But how would you see this work out? We spot things and pm you,?

I know there's a lot of stress on the editor team, so if the community can step in, we'll do that. After all, it would benefit us.

yes the community need to help each other, and I'd like to think the editor community is fantastic at doing this we are so lucky on this forum there always seems to be someone who has the answer, or if not points you in the right direction, which is what it should be like:D

But I still reiterate SI need to sort a few things out including the manpower side of the editor team, and providing a detailed manual on how the editor works.

I am sure that if they address this in the right way most of the problems would be resolved quickly:thup:

There is also no issue with SI putting their hands up and stating that certain bugs are proving impossible to be resolved, I believe transparency would stop a lot of the bad feeling or the perceived ''throwing the toys out'' as I said in earlier posts if bugs going back 2 years are not getting fixed what conclusion does that lead you to??(lack of resources/ignored/ can't be resolved, I believe it is the first one not the later 2 )

As regards transparency I would like SI when they release new versions and or patches, obviously list the bugs addressed, but also list the bugs being worked on and those that they can't resolve. It would go a long way to show they value us customers, and influence some of us waiting for a certain issue to be addressed,(namely why buy a new product that hasn't fixed an issue you are waiting to use, it might be it will be addressed in a later patch and so some would purchase then, there is no point upgrading to a newer product if the same issue exists)the difficulty for us editors is you cant get to start a game if you want to edit/create certain things that are not functioning at this stage

Think FM15 and Editors have lost there Mojo

Think FM15 and Editors have lost there Mojo

think some superficial changes made were unnecessary and have caused more problems i.e. files being saved in fmf format(what was wrong with .xml etc) and the files being saved to the steam workshop direct, all seems a bit messy with files being all over the place and lots of them too:D

the sad thing is it is very close to being spot on, in its current form it is too buggy and you cant have faith in a product when changes being made are going missing etc

Sounds fair to me. But how would you see this work out? We spot things and pm you,?

I know there's a lot of stress on the editor team, so if the community can step in, we'll do that. After all, it would benefit us.

That'd be the idea I think, not sure how else we'd go about it. PM would need a description of the bug, any known workaround and a link to the relevant thread in the bugs forum. There's no point us complaining about bugs if they're not being raised in the proper place first

I would voluntarily present myself as a tester if needed. My resume includes 10 years of testing experience. No charge, just for the good of the tool.

more or less what I have said to my mrs on many occasions .....then she slaps me;)

it is really sad to see that most of editor updates in workshop are about remaking of famous players and/or enabling previously unplayable lower leagues. there is huge lack of any kind of complex custom databases... so there must be something wrong here.

To be fair, even if there were a few really good custom databases, they'd still be drowned out by the hundreds and hundreds of single files of tenuous use that bring back some older player. I know some others will find use for them, but would it not be easier to group all of those files into one instead of making it pretty much all you can see on the workshop?

That'd be the idea I think, not sure how else we'd go about it. PM would need a description of the bug, any known workaround and a link to the relevant thread in the bugs forum. There's no point us complaining about bugs if they're not being raised in the proper place first

Might it not be better to do this in the actual bugs forum? Otherwise I see this becoming fairly difficult to keep tabs on.

the bugs have to be reported on the bugs forum without doubt, but a list of reported known bugs I would suggest should be kept on bugs forum/and or here

that way we know what has/hasn't been reported

I would also like to see a status update on a bug with total transparency something like

Date bug reported- straight forward:)

Bug details- eg continental rules squad selection dates issue

Status- awaiting review/ has been reviewed fault replicated/ with DEV team for resolution/

Time scale- will be released with next patch/will be resolved in current game version/ unknown

this way there can be no confusion etc as has has happened previously and bugs haven't been resolved and carried into the new game release and treated as a seperate new bug:herman:

As I have stated previously there is nothing wrong with SI stating they can't resolve a problem,then at least we know where we stand and can move on not as it is now where we dont know if a bug will be resolved next patch or not at all

in its current form it is too buggy and you cant have faith in a product when changes being made are going missing etc

And this is where I stand on it at the moment- it just isn't worth devoting the time to trying to create any kind of edit if the editor itself is unreliable. I have no issue with putting time in and creating things, but not if it's the case that I'm simply repeating entering the same thing over and over again because there are corruption or save issues- that slows progress to a halt.

It's a shame, because I'm excited about the custom DB I was putting together- outside of actually using the editor, everything else is falling into place nicely in terms of getting graphics etc. made and working in-game.

And this is where I stand on it at the moment- it just isn't worth devoting the time to trying to create any kind of edit if the editor itself is unreliable. I have no issue with putting time in and creating things, but not if it's the case that I'm simply repeating entering the same thing over and over again because there are corruption or save issues- that slows progress to a halt.

It's a shame, because I'm excited about the custom DB I was putting together- outside of actually using the editor, everything else is falling into place nicely in terms of getting graphics etc. made and working in-game.

you and many more mate thats why we have to make a stand, and get some response from SI, so far its deafening:thdn:

it has been perceived by someone earlier that it is ''throwing your toys out'' to say in current state it is not worth having, that member is entitled to his opinion, but if someone believes a product is fine if when you use it to make changes then what you have saved goes missing/does not appear etc ....perhaps I am missing something, but I consider it broken in that example totally:confused:

the analogy I can give is say you buy a new Satellite TV box that allows you to record programs direct to a hard drive, however when you try it doesn't record any sports programs fully, bits are missing...and then you later find it is random if it records any programs at all...would you have faith in that product:confused: I think not, and I am sure we would all demand action from the manufacturer to resolve it!!!

some other issues are personal choices eg my biggest issue for a couple of years has been bugs in editing continental rules, does that make the game unplayable...no, but it delays many of us starting a game as we await a resolution

with the example you gave ...does it make the editor unusable , yes without doubt!

I dont want to pay anymore for the game but the only way i see SI will give the editor the resources required is to make it a stand alone purchase like the RTE

none of us are naive and realize the product is released every year as a money making exercise and good on SI, if there were no changes at all between each version most of us would still upgrade to the most recent one

this thread is all about getting the editor the recognition it deserves from SI , there are so many knowledgeable users here who if consulted would get the product we should have, and also getting more staff to address the growing bug issues and get them resolved

To be fair to formaeuss (for twas he), he openly said that he wasn't someone who used the editor as much as some of us, so he may not be quite as aware of the severity of the saving/corruption issues that currently exist. Likewise, I'm led to understand those problems aren't consistently affecting everyone, given that others are still continuing to edit.

So what he says about it being a powerful tool is a fair point- if it were as stable as it has been previously, you can do a lot with it. The problem is that, at the moment, while it's "mostly functional", the bit that isn't entirely functional is kinda essential to whatever you want to do.

yep thats the crux really

you and many more mate thats why we have to make a stand, and get some response from SI, so far its deafening:thdn:

it has been perceived by someone earlier that it is ''throwing your toys out'' to say in current state it is not worth having, that member is entitled to his opinion, but if someone believes a product is fine if when you use it to make changes then what you have saved goes missing/does not appear etc ....perhaps I am missing something, but I consider it broken in that example totally:confused:

the analogy I can give is say you buy a new Satellite TV box that allows you to record programs direct to a hard drive, however when you try it doesn't record any sports programs fully, bits are missing...and then you later find it is random if it records any programs at all...would you have faith in that product:confused: I think not, and I am sure we would all demand action from the manufacturer to resolve it!!!

some other issues are personal choices eg my biggest issue for a couple of years has been bugs in editing continental rules, does that make the game unplayable...no, but it delays many of us starting a game as we await a resolution

with the example you gave ...does it make the editor unusable , yes without doubt!

I dont want to pay anymore for the game but the only way i see SI will give the editor the resources required is to make it a stand alone purchase like the RTE

none of us are naive and realize the product is released every year as a money making exercise and good on SI, if there were no changes at all between each version most of us would still upgrade to the most recent one

this thread is all about getting the editor the recognition it deserves from SI , there are so many knowledgeable users here who if consulted would get the product we should have, and also getting more staff to address the growing bug issues and get them resolved

If the "throwing your toys out" was referring to my comment, I mean in the context of posting "OMG SI, y u no fix the editor! You're crap etc" and the like, which gets nowhere as opposed to constructive criticism.

it wasnt you and I am not doing so I think people use this phrase towards people who are having I rant, don't think I have had a rant in any way, as you say constructive criticism

To be fair to formaeuss (for twas he), he openly said that he wasn't someone who used the editor as much as some of us, so he may not be quite as aware of the severity of the saving/corruption issues that currently exist. Likewise, I'm led to understand those problems aren't consistently affecting everyone, given that others are still continuing to edit.

So what he says about it being a powerful tool is a fair point- if it were as stable as it has been previously, you can do a lot with it. The problem is that, at the moment, while it's "mostly functional", the bit that isn't entirely functional is kinda essential to whatever you want to do.

And I said exactly that. I'm not sure that the level I use the editor blocks me from having an opinion on whether or not the editor actually exists, which was the only point I took issue with. The OP said that they should either fix it or drop it. That's nonsense.

Think FM15 and Editors have lost there Mojo

Yeh, I am still working on my FM15 edit but in FM14, hoping to upload it when/if I buy the game next year.

Currently considering skipping FM15 and hoping 16 brings editor overhauls. Even if I have to recreate from scratch I will be happy with improvements.

As far as I know creating a fictional nation in Europe is not working as well as previous years, please correct me as I may still buy the game at Xmas if we can!

Yeh, I am still working on my FM15 edit but in FM14, hoping to upload it when/if I buy the game next year.

Currently considering skipping FM15 and hoping 16 brings editor overhauls. Even if I have to recreate from scratch I will be happy with improvements.

As far as I know creating a fictional nation in Europe is not working as well as previous years, please correct me as I may still buy the game at Xmas if we can!

It works as long as you move another European nation to another continent, for example Kazakhstan back to Asia.

formaeuss of course you are entitled to your opinion thats what these forums are about you state yourself you are not an avid user of the editor, but many of us are in fact it is more than an integral part of the game, we spend more time editing than playing:o

the idea of this thread was to get a response from SI to see we are passionate about the editor and want certain matters resolved, namely the bugs and the fact that some are going back well over a year with no feedback or time scale on when they may/may not be resolved, and the perceived lack of resources to deal with the growing bugs list for this editor.

now the game changer with this current editor is that some users are finding saving data changes isn't working so all the other bugs pale into insignificance as if this function does not work it renders the whole editor unusable, and pointless... if anyone thinks otherwise please can they explain this?:confused:

could you explain this a bit? i did whole overhaul of europe to make it as it was before the fall of communism (yugoslavia, ussr, easr and west germany, czechoslovakia) i had to redo all the international qualifications and main tournaments for senior and u19,21 teams and the european continental cups just to find out it is crashing when loading manager targets.

what would i need to move out of europe to make it happen? last years editor had no problems with this and i have managed to load last years file into fm15 and it does work so there has to be a way...

Basically I am creating a database which will see the Channel Islands of Jersey and Guernsey into the game overwriting Burma and Upper Volta and changing their continent to Europe, however to get it to work in game I have had to move two of the default European nations out of Europe and into Asia so have changed the continents of Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan to Asia which now sees them take part in Asian competitions and Jersey and Guernsey replace them in European competitions.

I think, possibly due to the League of Nations appearing in-game in 2018, that the number of European nations is now hardcoded.

I think, possibly due to the League of Nations appearing in-game in 2018, that the number of European nations is now hardcoded.

That's very interesting actually, I hadn't considered that that might be to "blame". I can completely see why they've done that though. I'm actually surprised that they included it this year tbh, it's only just been fully ratified (yesterday I think) so maybe giving it another year would let things bed in and hopefully build without having to hard-code. It's clearly causing massive issues.

i have only started editing files in last couple of releases so still a novice really

i reported a bug last year where adding the first few rounds of the FA Cup to the game so competition play out as in real life, you had Premier league teams playing in the Extra Preliminary Round in August

and i'm still waiting for a reply as to whether they could recreate bug in house and if so how to fix a year later so gave up

we now have the new game and thought i would try again, i have now successfully edited this years version so it all works okay and plays out as it should do

but did take 7 days for me to figure out why FA Trophy final was being played at home team stadium even though it was set to Wembley in all the right places or so i thought, only to find because i had added in the early qualifying rounds to make competition play out as in real life, that in the round dates sub menu in the advanced rules part of the editor it kept changing the stadium setting from national to home stadium, but finally sorted it so can run file and it play a long term save.

so now with it working properly thought i would share with rest of community but low and behold i now cant publish it to workshop have just tried again before typing this post, so have been using a file sharing site to provide a download link for forum users that want to play as a lower league manager in England as there are hundreds of people that use to do that in previous versions

so my gripe is and have raised it in bug forum, why include something in editor if it doesn't work properly, we spend our time creating these files to share with other users and a tool that would get it seen by thousands of people doesn't work as it should do.

as they made a song and dance about how editors could publish direct to workshop so more FM users could easily find tactics, skins and edited databases. but as it is you cant seem to get edited databases to publish to workshop so instead of getting it shared for the masses to use, the only people downloading so far through the file sharing site i am using is the people that have previously played as lower league managers and are looking for a working file in the forums as there aren't any in the workshop

the only feedback i've so far from sigames is what operating system i am using, and no follow up since supplying that info 2 weeks ago

so it would be nice to get a response as to whether they have been able to replicate in house or not, if not would have thought they would ask for db file to try and create this bug in house or if they have a is it a simple thing to correct and would be fixed in next update or 2

this would then get files we create to the masses rather the just the hard core users that go looking for it, because as in life you might not be looking for something but then you spot it in passing whilst looking for something else and think to yourself i was thinking of trying something different, i'll give that a go

this is not a rant but a genuine response to support the opening post, as i believe if you create something and allow others to use it then it should work properly or be as bug free as possible on release, if they need help as it seems they do with the actual game as its released as a beta 2 weeks early and we all try the game, we then spot and report bugs so they can be fixed for release date, if this is the case with the game why cant they do the same with the editor

but if they don't want the editor code out there before release date why not get long term forum members who use the editor all the time to become testers (even if they have to sign confidentially papers) access to a beta file of the editor to try and create the database they would create when game & editor was available for general release to see if any bugs could be found, reported and correct for release day

great post 4andy I think a lot of us are getting fed up with the game being released and needing constant patching

as you say there are some users here who/should be considered for testing etc before release

Having more time to ruminate on this, I have some new thoughts. There are essentially two problems in the editor; bugs, and lack of documentation.

Bugs

We are all irritated by some of the bugs in this yeas editor, which many of the edited files we normally make impossible or impractical to make, and at some of the lack of feedback we receive. I think it is probably now the time to come together as a community to support and work with SI to iron this out. There is no point just complaining and being irritated with the devs, since this is just going to widen any existing gaps. Instead, we should first be patient and wait to see what improvement come with the pre-Christmas patch (assuming we get out usual present). We can then pass judgement on what exactly should be done about this, in terms of trying to increase cooperation and feedback between SI and the community.

In the meantime, what we need to do as has been suggested is log the bugs. Carefully, trying to give as much information as possible. For example; exact instructions of how to replicate the bug, with associated screenshots or files; a explanation of what steps you have taken to try to resolve the issue and what effect it has had (e.g. it is better to say 'there is a problem with adding south american teams to my european based super league' than 'my superleague is not working'); details of any work-around you may have found. This is repeating much of what is said above, but if we can make a standard bug report submission template or something to make the editor bug reports the best on the forum we are going a long way to making ourself appear to be the helpful and motivated community we are.

Documentation.

I have seen many instances of this being bandied around the boards, but as yet none of us have undertaken the effort to document what everything in the editor actually does. I feel this is actually something that is key, and must be undertaken either by ourselves or by SI. I think it is therefore the time to stop wishing we had documentation, and to make some. This is almost certainly a job for more than one person, so we would have to have a collaborative effort from different members of the Hideaway to achieve this, and if there is support for the idea then the next stage would be to get together those interested and knowledgeable parties together to discuss the details.

For me, this documentation would fall into two parts; first it would be document and explain what every single editable attribute in the editor means and what the different values correspond to. This in itself is a mammoth undertaking. The second part would then be to document the different editable things you have whilst adding competitions; again detailing meaning and possible values where applicable. Initially this would have to be for the standard editor, because the advanced editor is another beast altogether. What would go well with this would be descriptions of how to do various common things - kinda like a wikihow. How do you add a new league? How do you add lower levels to existing leagues? How can I make a new continental cup? The basics, and then whatever else we can think of that would be useful to have written somewhere to show new users.

Then, of course, would come tackling the advanced editor. This could start by something as simple as teaching people how to remove or change sub/squad rules for current leagues, how to create leagues in the standard editor and do specific things to finish them off in the advanced editor (more complicated playoffs, additional stages etc). Then it would be a case of trying to document what the different parameters of the advanced editor are.

Anyway, this is my current view on it. If we have enough support for creating such a documentation, we should at some point organise a discussion somewhere to wort out exactly how and what we want to do.

Great post above, think that covers all bases really. I haven't forgotten about this for what it's worth, putting it on hold for the next few weeks as I'm snowed under at work and won't have time to coordinate it. It's definitely something I plan to do, just need to get some time spare to sort it out!

Great post above, think that covers all bases really. I haven't forgotten about this for what it's worth, putting it on hold for the next few weeks as I'm snowed under at work and won't have time to coordinate it. It's definitely something I plan to do, just need to get some time spare to sort it out!

This is the perennial problem with things you volunteer to do =P

Having more time to ruminate on this, I have some new thoughts. There are essentially two problems in the editor; bugs, and lack of documentation.

Bugs

We are all irritated by some of the bugs in this yeas editor, which many of the edited files we normally make impossible or impractical to make, and at some of the lack of feedback we receive. I think it is probably now the time to come together as a community to support and work with SI to iron this out. There is no point just complaining and being irritated with the devs, since this is just going to widen any existing gaps. Instead, we should first be patient and wait to see what improvement come with the pre-Christmas patch (assuming we get out usual present). We can then pass judgement on what exactly should be done about this, in terms of trying to increase cooperation and feedback between SI and the community.

In the meantime, what we need to do as has been suggested is log the bugs. Carefully, trying to give as much information as possible. For example; exact instructions of how to replicate the bug, with associated screenshots or files; a explanation of what steps you have taken to try to resolve the issue and what effect it has had (e.g. it is better to say 'there is a problem with adding south american teams to my european based super league' than 'my superleague is not working'); details of any work-around you may have found. This is repeating much of what is said above, but if we can make a standard bug report submission template or something to make the editor bug reports the best on the forum we are going a long way to making ourself appear to be the helpful and motivated community we are.

Documentation.

I have seen many instances of this being bandied around the boards, but as yet none of us have undertaken the effort to document what everything in the editor actually does. I feel this is actually something that is key, and must be undertaken either by ourselves or by SI. I think it is therefore the time to stop wishing we had documentation, and to make some. This is almost certainly a job for more than one person, so we would have to have a collaborative effort from different members of the Hideaway to achieve this, and if there is support for the idea then the next stage would be to get together those interested and knowledgeable parties together to discuss the details.

For me, this documentation would fall into two parts; first it would be document and explain what every single editable attribute in the editor means and what the different values correspond to. This in itself is a mammoth undertaking. The second part would then be to document the different editable things you have whilst adding competitions; again detailing meaning and possible values where applicable. Initially this would have to be for the standard editor, because the advanced editor is another beast altogether. What would go well with this would be descriptions of how to do various common things - kinda like a wikihow. How do you add a new league? How do you add lower levels to existing leagues? How can I make a new continental cup? The basics, and then whatever else we can think of that would be useful to have written somewhere to show new users.

Then, of course, would come tackling the advanced editor. This could start by something as simple as teaching people how to remove or change sub/squad rules for current leagues, how to create leagues in the standard editor and do specific things to finish them off in the advanced editor (more complicated playoffs, additional stages etc). Then it would be a case of trying to document what the different parameters of the advanced editor are.

Anyway, this is my current view on it. If we have enough support for creating such a documentation, we should at some point organise a discussion somewhere to wort out exactly how and what we want to do.

excellent post mate:thup: its what I have been saying for ages we all need to get together work with SI and be clear and transparent as it to what is being done/going to be done and a time scale, as I state again some bugs are going back over a year and with no feedback other than its logged that is unacceptable, if they can't resolve problems say it;)

the manual/guide has been on the back burner here for ages hopefully it will get done I was all for doing one but no motivation with editor in current state

the manual/guide has been on the back burner here for ages hopefully it will get done I was all for doing one but no motivation with editor in current state

I am going to start putting something together on this. Even if it is initially only something relatively small and narrow, in hope that I can kick-start others into joining a concerted effort.

good on you mate, hope it works out

MG can you close thread mate

Just to give my two cents worth. I not really into the editor but do use it for personal use for editing small stuff and like what have been said above is quite upset with all the bugs in this year editor. Really not user friendly.

1. The save to steam workshop function is good idea but totally broken. So many of files that I created for personal use or subscribed from workshop, don't appear in my game. Until someone in this forum pointed out that the workshop is broken and our files can be found via - Users/(Your user name)/AppData/local/Sports Interactive/FM2015/caches/ugc/(your file) .... but our files will be in folders with numbers like 347091582 and like me I have quite of those folders so I have to click on everyone of them to find the file that I want and than move them to the correct place.

And also it won't let you save as to your previous file you have created. In the end I have a few of the one file I have created.

It is really frustrating and truly time wasting. As I should be enjoying the game and not wasting time to find my file in order to play the game.

2. Things that are hardcoded in the game and can't be change in the editor would be nice to know. Like what others have said before a manual is really being needed. And I found it the hard way for this when trying to edit Australia rules only to find out after so many days and hours of trial and error that it is hard coded so no point in editing.

To all those who have suggested or wanting a guide, I direct you to this thread. This is something I am going to be actively working on, and am more than willing to accept help.

Closed upon request. I think what's needed to be said has been said, just need to drive the ideas forward now