Super Bladesman's English National League System Update - Taking FM10 to Level 10

[richmeister]

Tghe folder should still be the same in My documents

You from addickted like scoham?

sorry mate, didnt realise, what an idiot.

And Scoham, yes level 10 does have to apply to get to level 9

[Ridcully]

Thanks for all the great work.

One small mistake I have found is Stratford Town are down as still playing at the Masons Road ground but they now have a new Ground and multi-pitch complex development at Knights Lane in Tiddington.

Link http://www.stratfordtownfc.co.uk/index.php/about-our-club

[DeadZone]

@Ridcully, you may wish to bring that up in the Data Issues forum as well as it is the same in the main database as well

[Kaje]

I'm having the 'squad numbers' issue with the initial version, if I download the new file - will I be able to continue my game with the squad numbers responding correctly - or will I have to lose the progress I've made thus far and start again?

[Kaje]

Ahh, just read that I do have to. Great.

[Reuben Agboola]

Ha'way Sunderland Ryhope Community Association!

Scotty, are you from Ryhope? I grew up there many moons ago. In fact, I used to play for RCA back in the day when they were Kennek.

[Scottybee]

Scotty, are you from Ryhope? I grew up there many moons ago. In fact, I used to play for RCA back in the day when they were Kennek.

I'm not mate, but am from Doxford Park area and Ryhope is the nearest team to me (manageable in the game)...I was tempted to go Washington as a lot of my family are from there but I do some volunteer work at Ryhope Community Centre so there is the link!

[Geordie6]

Hi, I just have to comment to congratulate Super Bladesman on such an impressive piece of work. I've started a game with Hebburn in Northern League Div 2 and this is going to be one hell of a challenge.

From a gameplay perspective, does anyone have any tips of getting players into their level 10 clubs?

I have no money and no players in my searches are available on loan.

Basically, is there a lower league management guide or something knocking about that can be adapted for dropping down a few levels?

[Scottybee]

on another note, my girlfriend used to play with your username's kids when she was little

[Geordie6]

Hi, I just have to comment to congratulate Super Bladesman on such an impressive piece of work. I've started a game with Hebburn in Northern League Div 2 and this is going to be one hell of a challenge.

From a gameplay perspective, does anyone have any tips of getting players into their level 10 clubs?

I have no money and no players in my searches are available on loan.

Basically, is there a lower league management guide or something knocking about that can be adapted for dropping down a few levels?

[DizzyIzzyB13]

With regards the finance issues, perhaps it would be worth looking into setting up "Other income" in the editor. Two of the options that can be set up in particular look useful - "Government/Council grants" and "Club membership". If these incomes could be set-up properly, it might be possible to ensure that club finances are much more stable without resorting to tinkering with TV revenue and such.

[calvg]

cheers nik i managed to copy on to bottom then had to interweave with your stuff so far working

[MackemDixon]

Scotty, are you from Ryhope? I grew up there many moons ago. In fact, I used to play for RCA back in the day when they were Kennek.

Off topic, that is the best username I have seen on this website!

Great to be able to play with these small north east clubs.

[glennuk]

Looks great, keep up the good work, i am waiting for a little bit until i get a bit mroe used to the game before i download this. But am looking forward to starting in the lower leagues and going as far up as possible!

[Scottybee]

Off topic, that is the best username I have seen on this website!

Great to be able to play with these small north east clubs.

christ Dixon you get everywhere

[MackemDixon]

christ Dixon you get everywhere

Do i know you mate? :confused:

[Scottybee]

Do i know you mate? :confused:

If you're Michael, then yes!

(Mark Scott)

[Reuben Agboola]

I'm not mate, but am from Doxford Park area and Ryhope is the nearest team to me (manageable in the game)...I was tempted to go Washington as a lot of my family are from there but I do some volunteer work at Ryhope Community Centre so there is the link!

Haha, that's weird, cos I live just next to Doxy, and I work opposite the community centre in Ryhope.

[MackemDixon]

If you're Michael, then yes!

(Mark Scott)

Alright mate, i thought there was only me geeky enough to post on the SI forums.

I'll stop ruining the thread anyway with our conversation. How are you finding it in on this database?

If you need a couple of players with real quality and have a few quid left in your wage budget, load all players from Reunion in your database to begin with and have a look there. Some quality for free, but you have to pay quite high wages, but they will come.

Patrick Vaz (AMLC)

Jean-Phillipe Javary (AMC)

are two that i can remember off the top of my head.

[Reuben Agboola]

on another note, my girlfriend used to play with your username's kids when she was little

Reuben Agboola >>>>>>>>> every other player on the planet

(He's on my friends list on Facebook, and I've spoken to the man himself several times on the chat thing on there. Absolute ledge )

[respo]

level 13

in level 13 not all subdivisions added

in level 11&12 clubs rules etc not added only subdivisions

http://letitbit.net/download/2676.2c2697c264069e1e10110510e/England_to_Level10_Super_Bladesman_Build_038_expanded_by_respo.xml.html

[Jester James]

Need some help.

Have downloaded Super Bladesman's update which is excellent but how do you remove some of the cup competitions and leagues if you don't want them to be active when i start a new game?

[Scottybee]

Reuben Agboola >>>>>>>>> every other player on the planet

(He's on my friends list on Facebook, and I've spoken to the man himself several times on the chat thing on there. Absolute ledge )

Haha aye he was slightly before my time, but have to love him just because of the name.

Small little world, I live just opposite Morrisons meself!

Alright mate, i thought there was only me geeky enough to post on the SI forums.

I'll stop ruining the thread anyway with our conversation. How are you finding it in on this database?

If you need a couple of players with real quality and have a few quid left in your wage budget, load all players from Reunion in your database to begin with and have a look there. Some quality for free, but you have to pay quite high wages, but they will come.

Patrick Vaz (AMLC)

Jean-Phillipe Javary (AMC)

are two that i can remember off the top of my head.

Too late unfortunately but I doubt I could get them on amateur contracts anyway...but here are my recommendations for Northern League D2

Colin Carr-Lawton (SC)

Paul Beavers (DC/ST)

Chris Tate (ST)

Daniel Szczukiewicz (DL)

Moussa Rattab (AMC/F)

Generally, any frees who have league experience will tend to do well!

[Reuben Agboola]

Small little world, I live just opposite Morrisons meself!

Even smaller, mate. So do I!

[Scottybee]

Even smaller, mate. So do I!

wouldn't be Chapelgarth would it?

[Reuben Agboola]

wouldn't be Chapelgarth would it?

No, a bit further up, mate. Just behind the Colonel Prior. Which is handy for staggering home after a night on the sauce.

[BJuarez]

Cheers mate, Castle Vale for the Prem in that case

Not so fast. I just started up a game in level 10, and only have the option of signing players to amateur contracts. Don't know how exactly the club can gain semi-pro status if the only contract option is amateur.

[cel1234]

Does the FA cup stary in the premilary rouunds ????

[Jorge Campos]

Sorry if this has been answered, but the thread has gotten quite long. If I use the lite version of this and add only the 7th and 8th levels, will they be accurate in terms of structure, match rules and the like? Will relegations and promotions involving levels 8 and 9 work correctly? Has the latest filed incorporated some of the geographic improvements like uncle don has used in his file?

[phillop33]

I noticed that some of the clubs in Division 2 upwards have a mistake in the Regional settings.

I dont know if it will ever really have an impact, but maybe Bristol Rovers could move down to Level 8 after a couple of decades.

Their level 8 league is specified as English Southern League First Division West, which doesnt actually exist.

This, I am certain is from the FM database and not Blades update.

[Heath Matthias]

Not so fast. I just started up a game in level 10, and only have the option of signing players to amateur contracts. Don't know how exactly the club can gain semi-pro status if the only contract option is amateur.

They will go to semi-pro if they promote far enough

[DeadZone]

Ive just had to do 10 restarts because of conflicts between my additional team xml and this file

And with 58 leagues loading, that aint fun I tell you

So much for this XML structure being easier to have multiple source updates lol

IDs of my team and ground were changed to prevent clashes, which is great, except it forgot to update anything else associated with the old ID, meaning players/staff were now with the team using the old ID, and the team had a different stadium lol

Suppose something to throw to SI to see if there is a way to prevent this?

My main concern is, even with being a direct conflict being in the same nation, this same issue WILL cause problems with having two different XMLs that add their own teams/stadiums/players/etc as IDs will get shifted around, but associated IDs (ie. contract holders/who plays which stadium) wont be updated to reflect the new IDs

Edit: And now another restart, forgot to update the rivalries gah

[Blanchflower1]

Super Bladesman, when all of the issues have been fixed for level 10 clubs, would you consider expanding the league structure to include level 11 clubs? Will level 11 clubs be included in future versions? Thanks!

[GMO]

With regards the finance issues, perhaps it would be worth looking into setting up "Other income" in the editor. Two of the options that can be set up in particular look useful - "Government/Council grants" and "Club membership". If these incomes could be set-up properly, it might be possible to ensure that club finances are much more stable without resorting to tinkering with TV revenue and such.

Lower level clubs added by the editor need more financing in FM10.

If more financing was added via the editor it would help a lot to keep a lower level club in the black instead of constantly losing lots of money.

[lionel messi]

Super Bladesman, when all of the issues have been fixed for level 10 clubs, would you consider expanding the league structure to include level 11 clubs? Will level 11 clubs be included in future versions? Thanks!

I hope so as my local team are in at this level, (Sutton Town) but i guess it would take alot of work has there is alot of teams at this level.

[BJuarez]

I think a lot of folks are forgetting the fact that loads and loads of clubs in the ELS are having all sorts of money problems. Making it so that all are in the black wouldn't exactly be realistic, would it?

[DeadZone]

I think a lot of folks are forgetting the fact that loads and loads of clubs in the ELS are having all sorts of money problems. Making it so that all are in the black wouldn't exactly be realistic, would it?

But they are staying afloat right?

Currently FM is modelling them going deep deep red

[BJuarez]

But they are staying afloat right?

Currently FM is modelling them going deep deep red

I agree that something needs to be done, DZ, but I'm just cautioning against going overboard.

[DeadZone]

Thats fair enough, I agree we shouldnt go overboard, just maybe ensure they income/expenses are equalling each other I would say

[Magpiestarnz]

Just wanted to put "on the record" so to speak, my thanks for this excellent league update. Obviously lots of work gone into it. It certainly has added to my FM 'experience', and is exactly what I was hoping someone would be able to do. Very much appreciated. KUTGW

[Super Bladesman]

My next plan to ease the financial burden is to make sure all the county cups have some form of prize money. This should be a relatively quick and easy 'fix' that will affect plenty of teams, though again, I won't want to overdo it. It's also a lot quicker than editing each club individually...

[Stephanie McMahon's Secret Lover]

They more or less all run at a loss in real life anyway. Then along comes another chairman to throw his money away.

[hluraven]

That is the point for me, all these teams will run an operating loss so FM is fairly accurate.

They stay afloat by occasional windfalls, one big cup run, government grants, new chairman or existing chairman donations. Also, many teams do go broke and either reform with a slightly different name (sticking AFC on the front of their previous name normally) or drop down divisions. AFAICT this is modelled ok at the moment with most teams in the red and only getting out of it by big cup runs or takeovers.

I wouldn't support big prize money for county cups, these actually cost more than they make for a number of teams, although can provide a decent gate for the smaller teams.

Making many of the level 9 sides amateur is also reasonable, it is only really level 8 and above that are predominantly semi-pro.

EDIT: On a different subject, how do you set where county cup finals are held? Different cups do this differently, the Kent Senior Cup has a coin toss of the two teams playing in the final, the London Senior Cup is normally decided before the competition starts so is more likely to be neutral, although both have varied over the years

[trainspotter]

Making many of the level 9 sides amateur is also reasonable, it is only really level 8 and above that are predominantly semi-pro.

I'm not sure about that. I can only speak from what I've seen but in the Midland Football Alliance (Level 9) there aren't any teams who don't pay at least expenses to their players - and even those who only pay "expenses" have history of paying more money but have cut back somewhat because of financial difficulties.

A good number of Level 10 teams are also semi-pro. My knowledge of the East Midlands Counties league (Level 10) is a bit limited but without doubt sides like Gresley, Barrow Town, Bardon Hill Sports etc are paying their players.

As has been mentioned a few times almost every team at this level relies on a chairman/investor to put in a couple of hundred pounds a week to keep the club ticking over. As has also been mentioned though it's not uncommon for teams to get heavily into debt (Gresley Rovers went into liquidation over the summer with reported debts of £400k before reforming as Gresley and promptly throwing money at players again...)

[hluraven]

That's why I said predominantly. Also, amateur contracts in FM can (I believe) have appearance fees which simulate expenses (I stand to be corrected, it is an option in the editor)

Many players at level 7 are expenses only or amateur with appearance fees, I struggle to believe that level 9 is mostly a genuine semi-pro level, if so they will definitely need to be deep in the red.

[Super Bladesman]

That is the point for me, all these teams will run an operating loss so FM is fairly accurate.

They stay afloat by occasional windfalls, one big cup run, government grants, new chairman or existing chairman donations. Also, many teams do go broke and either reform with a slightly different name (sticking AFC on the front of their previous name normally) or drop down divisions. AFAICT this is modelled ok at the moment with most teams in the red and only getting out of it by big cup runs or takeovers.

I wouldn't support big prize money for county cups, these actually cost more than they make for a number of teams, although can provide a decent gate for the smaller teams.

Making many of the level 9 sides amateur is also reasonable, it is only really level 8 and above that are predominantly semi-pro.

I'm not adding a crazy amount of money for cups, and it will still be performance-based. I'm looking to increase revenue from these to give clubs an extra £1k-£10k per season, depending on performance. This can then easily be removed should a better solution be found.

EDIT: On a different subject, how do you set where county cup finals are held? Different cups do this differently, the Kent Senior Cup has a coin toss of the two teams playing in the final, the London Senior Cup is normally decided before the competition starts so is more likely to be neutral, although both have varied over the years

We can only specify 'Home', 'National', or 'Neutral' just now. It would be nice to specify a particular stadium or to set stadium-choice criteria, but it's not possible yet. As a side note, it would also be nice to be able to set a split for gate receipts - my research showed that often the split is set in stone in the competition rules; this is also not yet possible in the editor.

[trainspotter]

That's why I said predominantly. Also, amateur contracts in FM can (I believe) have appearance fees which simulate expenses (I stand to be corrected, it is an option in the editor)

Many players at level 7 are expenses only or amateur with appearance fees, I struggle to believe that level 9 is mostly a genuine semi-pro level, if so they will definitely need to be deep in the red.

Amateur with appearance fees would certainly be the best for Level 9-10 if that is possible. I've not seen any players with such contracts though.

I suppose the distinction between Amateur with appearance fees and genuinely Semi-Pro would be "Have they got the majority of their players on contracts?" to which the answer for 99% of Level 9-10 teams would be "No". Using that definition would mean Level 9-10 teams should be made Amateur but it doesn't quite fit saying sides like Barwell, Stratford Town and Tipton Town are Amateur when they're paying out (allegedly) between £1000 and £2000 to players.

[Hendonboy]

One of the big things that needs to happen in the game that still hasn't happened is for part time/non contract players to only get money during the 38-40 weeks that competitive football's being played. The contract model feels like it's much better than it used to be, but it's a big burden when you're paying an extra 3.5 months wages that in reality aren't being paid out. With a 2k (for example) wage bill (including coaches), that's almost 30 grand a season extra.

[hluraven]

Amateur with appearance fees would certainly be the best for Level 9-10 if that is possible. I've not seen any players with such contracts though.

I suppose the distinction between Amateur with appearance fees and genuinely Semi-Pro would be "Have they got the majority of their players on contracts?" to which the answer for 99% of Level 9-10 teams would be "No". Using that definition would mean Level 9-10 teams should be made Amateur but it doesn't quite fit saying sides like Barwell, Stratford Town and Tipton Town are Amateur when they're paying out (allegedly) between £1000 and £2000 to players.

Completely agree with this, I know I was told to set players as amateur but with appearance fees at the research phase to simulate expenses, I haven't actually checked to see if this is in the game though. Would be a good solution if it is. If not, then a compromise is needed and the trouble with setting a team as semi-pro is that the game will make all its players semi-pro rather than just the top few, causing financial problems. The trouble with setting as amateur then would be that it couldn't accurately reflect signings at this level but would ease the financial issues.

Tough call for SB and I'm sure it will be tweaked along the way.

[Scoham]

My next plan to ease the financial burden is to make sure all the county cups have some form of prize money. This should be a relatively quick and easy 'fix' that will affect plenty of teams, though again, I won't want to overdo it. It's also a lot quicker than editing each club individually...

Makes sense, editing each club isn't the way to do it. If someone took them right up the leagues you don't want them having money coming in that was there just to keep them going in the county leagues. Plus it'll take you much longer to go through hundreds of clubs.